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Mary the wife of Cleophas

Gentorev
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12/22/2014 3:57:12 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Mary was the mother of the biblical Jesus, and the grand-daughter of "The sonless Yehoshua," who had three daughters, Joanna and Elizabeth (The two aunties of Mary) and the youngest daughter, Anna/Hanna (The mother of Mary.) Knowing that his Zadokian lineage would become extinct unless his daughters were placed with future husbands according to the Torah, Yehoshua married off his daughters to the elite of Israel.

Hanna/Anna, was betrothed to Alexander Helios (Heli) who I believe is the son of Mark Antony and Cleopatra, whose twin sister, also called Cleopatra, was married to Herod the Great and was the mother of Philip of Bethsaida.

Heli was of the tribe of Levi, being a descendant of Nathan the priest, the adopted son of king David, and Nathan was the biological son of Bathsheba and Uriah the Hittite, who became a member of the tribe of Levi by his marriage to Bathsheba the daughter of Ammiel, the son of Oded-edom, who was a descendant of Moses from the house of Levi, by his second wife Jepunniah, the widow of a member of the tribe of Judah and the mother of Caleb the adopted son of Moses, and Jepunniah was the daughter of Hobab the Kennite, one of the two fathers-in-law to Moses, see Judges 4: 11.

The Talmud states, "Whoever brings up an orphan in his home is regarded...as though the child had been born to him." (Sanhedrin 119b)." In other words, the adopted child is to be treated as a child born to the father of that house.

Which means, that Heli and his children, who were all descendants of Nathan the Levite and adopted son of David, and were legitimate heirs to the throne of David because of Neri a descendant of Nathan who sired two sons to Tamah who was of the seed of Solomon. Heli, who died in 13 BC, by order of Herod the Great, had previously sired a son, who we know by the name "Joseph the Levite from Cyprus," and Heli was to later sire the child Mary to Hanna the daughter of the high priest Yehoshua III.

It is said that after the death of her father (Heli) "a father of renown," the seven year old Mary was taken north into the land of Galilee where she was raised under the protection of the Jewish zealots whose aim it was, to throw off the yoke of Roman rule and establish a descendant of King David, back on the throne of Israel.

After the birth of Jesus, who was the biological son of Joseph ben Heli, Mary"s union to Joseph ben Jacob, was consummated and she later gave birth to Joseph the half brother to Jesus of who we know so little, as it would appear that he was brought up by his father in the town of Arimathea after Joseph ben Jacob had issued Mary with a bill of divorce. It is for this reason, that James the younger of Mary"s three biological sons is always placed before Joseph her second son, who was raised by his father Joseph the son of Jacob.

It is this Joseph of Arimithea, the half brother of Jesus, who laid him in his "OWN FAMILY TOMB THAT HAD NEVER BEEN USED" which would suggest that the father of Joseph was still alive at that time.

While Jesus was still a small boy, Mary remarried a man named Cleophas who is also called Alpheaus. "Cleophas" is the Greek for, "Of a renowned father" while "Alpheaus" is the Aramaic of the same meaning, "Of a renowned father" Alpheaus who had two sons "Simeon and Jude" to a previous marriage was the biological father of James the younger of Mary's three biological sons, who Paul states is the brother of Jesus; (born of the same womb)

Matthew 13: 55; In reference to Jesus. Isn"t he the carpenter"s son? Isn"t Mary his Mother, and aren"t James, Joseph, Simeon and Jude, his brothers?"

Jude is also called Didymus, which is the Greek for "TWIN",and Jude the son of Alpheaus/Cleophas is also called Thomas=Tau"ma, the Aramiac for "TWIN". Thomas Didymus Jude, the half brother of Jesus is the son of the carpenter Alpheaus/Cleophas the second Husband Of Mary the mother of Jesus.

Knowing that in ART, Thomas Didymus Jude, the son of Alpheaus/Cleophas, is depicted with a carpenters rule and square, we must ask the question, "Who is the Carpenter to whom Mary was married at that time, when her family consisted of Jesus, James, Joseph, Simon and Judas? Was it Joseph the son of Jacob from the tribe of Judah, who was her first husband, or was it Alpheaus/Cleophas the second husband of Mary and the Father of James the biological son of Mary and the youngest boy in the family, plus Simon and Jude, who is also called Judas Thomas, meaning twin?

In "The Acts of Thomas, sometime called by its full name, "The Acts of Judas Thomas," 2nd-3rd century CE, "The Apostles cast lots as to where they should go, and to Thomas, Judas, brother to Jesus fell India. Thomas was taken to King Goddophares the ruler of Indo-Pathian Kingdom as an architect and carpenter by Habban."

Considering that we are still awaiting the first resurrection as recorded in the book of Revelation 20: 4-6, when they who will sit upon the thrones that have been prepared for them will be raised to life and rule with Christ (who is their heavenly compilation) for the Sabbath of one thousand years, which is "The Day of the Lord." The question is asked here, who were they who came out of their Graves that were opened on the day that Jesus was crucified and he cried out, "My God, my God, why have you abandoned me," as his indwelling spirit Enoch, who had duplicated himself in the man Jesus, then released the spirit of the the good people who had fallen asleep in righteousness after paying the blood price for their inherited sin, and who were judged and separated from the unrighteous dead and gathered to the living evolving spirit of Enoch, within the bosom of Abraham, and it was those spirits of the body of Jesus, who entered the city Three Days later and showed themselves to many people?

Matthew 27: 52, And the graves were opened: and many bodies of the saints that slept arose. Verse 53, And came out of the graves and three days later after the resurrection, they went into the Holy city and appeared to many.

One would expect the risen body to appear to the family of Jesus first, and this is exactly what we see.

The first to see one of they, who were of body of the risen Christ, the 365 day old unblemished Lamb of God, reborn on earth as Jesus who was offered up for our sake, (Jesus himself didn't die with the death of his body) were his Mother, Mary the wife of Cleophas and her "Adelphe" Mary Magdalene, who, although looking straight at him, thought that he was the gardener, until he spoke her name.

The next to who one of the risen body of Christ appeared, were Cleophas who is also called Alpheas, who is the biological father of James the youngest of Mary's three biological sons, and James, as we know, was the first to sit on the Episcopal throne of the church of the circumcision, and Cleophas was the husband of Mary, who was walking to Emmaus with his son Simon, 'to another marriage,' who was to inherit the Episcopal throne of the church of the circumcision after his half brother, 'James the righteous,' was killed at the instigation of the same Sadducee sect that had his full brother Jesus killed.

Although Cleophas and Simon walked and talked with one of the risen body of Christ for some kilometres, they did not recognise him for who he was, until Simon saw the manner in which he broke the bread, Cleophas then returned to Jerusalem, where eleven of the disciples, which included Simon Peter and Simon the Patriot, who were cowering in a darkened room, the only one absent that evening when Jesus appeared in that dimly lit room in the form that they recognised as Jesus, was Thomas Jude another half brother of Jesus, who was called the Twin, although nowhere does the bible say that he was an actual twin or whether he just held a striking resemblance to someone else. But back to Cleophas, who said to the eleven, "He has risen, he appeared to Simon," who was of course Simon the brother of Jesus.
Gentorev
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12/22/2014 4:04:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Simeon the half brother to Jesus, was the one who succeeded "James the younger" as the head of the church founded by Jesus.

Then there were the seven disciples who were fishing on Lake Galilee having no success at all, when someone on the bank told them to throw their net on the right side of the boat in which they caught 153 fishes, sitting down to eat with the person who had a fire prepared with fish on it and some bread, not one of the seven disciples of Jesus who had walked and talked with him, dared to ask who he was, but they understood that he was of the risen body of Christ. Even when he ascended up into heaven as a cloud, some of the 11 disciples doubted that it was he.

Perhaps Jude the son of Alpheaus/Cleophas was called the twin because he held such a striking resemblance to one with whom he shared a common father! As there are other instances in the New Testament, where an individual has three names, one in Hebrew, one in Greek, and one in Aramaic, Perhaps Cleophas "GREEK" and Alphaeus "ARAMAIC", are one and the same as Joseph "HEBREW" the son of Alexander Helios, "A FATHER OF RENOWN?" Perhaps this is why Jude the son of the carpenter and brother of Jesus, was called, "THE TWIN."

The religious authorities of those days who had access to all the bills of divorce which were filed away in the temple in Jerusalem, were always looking for ways that they might trap Jesus according to his own teaching and then accuse him to the people, and it was after Jesus had been preaching that if a divorced person remarried while their original spouse was still alive, they were committing adultery. It was then that the hypocritical priests thought that they had the means whereby they could make Jesus appear to the people to have one law for himself and another for everyone else.

Bringing forward his mother, who was among the crowd who were listening to the great teacher who was setting Israel on fire, they said to Jesus in their most patronising voice, Teacher, this woman has been caught in the very act of adultery. (This was according to the new teaching of Jesus) In our law Moses commanded that such a woman must be stoned to death. Now, what do you say? They said this in order to trap Jesus and accuse him to the people.

Jesus knew what those hypocrites were up to, those hypocrites who thought nothing of stoning the innocent Stephen to death, were bound by the law of Moses to stone this woman to death if she had indeed been caught in the very act of sexual intercourse with a man other than He to who she was legally married at that time.

Jesus then turned the tables on them by saying, "He who is without sin may cast the first stone."

Then he bent down and wrote something in the dust, Perhaps he may have written, "As ye judge, so shall ye be judged." Most men in those days who had been given by Moses the right to issue their wives with a bill of divorce, had done so and according to the new teaching of Jesus would have been as guilty as the woman that they were accusing, and the hypocrites knowing full well that the woman had not broken the Law of Moses and was innocent of any crime according to their own teachings, they were forced to walk away with their tails between their legs, thereby admitting to the people that they were not without sin.

Jesus then turned to his mother and asked, "Is there no one left to condemn you?" No one Lord she answered. "Well then," said Jesus, "I do not condemn you either. Go, but don"t sin again," and it was for this reason that the mother of Jesus chose to remain separate from her husband Cleophas and his children, and the reason why, on the cross, Jesus entrusted his mother, "Mary the wife of Cleophas," into the care of his beloved disciple John.

Although we know near to nothing about Joseph the half brother to Jesus, there is more that a greater probability that he was Joseph from Arimathea, who laid Jesus in his own FAMILY tomb that had never been uses, suggesting that His Father, the first husband of Mary, was still alive. It seem strange that in a book which is so condensed, one would bother to add the little bit of trivia, that the tomb in which Jesus was laid, was the FAMILY tomb of Joseph which had never been used, when saying, He was buried in a tomb close by, would have sufficed.

young John who was surnamed "MARK" which name means "Hammer, or The Hammerer," has been identified with young John the beloved disciple who was entrusted with the care of Mary the mother of Jesus who had surnamed him "Son of Thunder."

After the death of Jesus, Joseph the Levite from Cyprus, took his half sister Mary and young John who was surnamed "MARK" up into the land of Pamphilia, where in the town of Ephesus, the grave sites of Mary and John, can still be visited to this day.
Gentorev
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12/22/2014 6:42:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Genesis 5: 23; Enoch was 365 and had spent his life in fellowship with God when he disappeared because God had Taken him.

Hebrews 11: 5; "By faith Enoch was Translated (To change from one form to another) so that he should not experience death; and he was not found, because God had Translated him.

365, is the number of days in a calendar year. The Lamb of God who takes on the sins of the world is to be a one year old unblemished Lamb. Enoch is the unblemished Lamb of God.

Sandalphon is an archangel in Jewish and Christian writings. Sandalphon figures prominently in the mystical literary traditions of Rabbinic Judaism and early Christianity, notably in the Midrash, Talmud, and Kabbalah.

Some of the earliest sources on Sandalphon refer to him as the prophet Elijah transfigured and elevated to angelic status. Other sources (mainly from the midrashic period) describe him as the "twin brother" of Metatron, whose human origin as Enoch was similar to the human origin of Sandalphon.[2]

Sandalphron and Metatron are post human angels, Metatron is the name that was given to Enoch after he had been translated from a body of corruptible matter into a glorious body of incorruptible light, and Sandalphron, who is erroneously thought by some to be Metatron"s twin, is in fact Elijah"s angelic name after he was carried up to stand before Enoch and was also transfigured.

Metatron is also mentioned in the Pseudepigrapha, most prominently in the Hebrew Book of Enoch (also called Third Enoch), in which his grand title, "the lesser YHVH" resurfaces. According to Johann Eisenmenger, Metatron transmits the daily orders of God to the angels Gabriel and Sammael. Metatron is often identified as being the twin brother to Sandalphon, who is said to have been the prophet Elijah.

On the evening when the Passover lamb is eaten, the Jewish people would send the youngest and most innocent member of the family, to open the door and let Elijah their savior into their house.

Jesus said to Nicodemus: "And no man has ascended to heaven except (Except who?) except He who came down (mentally) even the "Son of Man" who "IS" in heaven."

Who descended from the very heights of time? The only man to have ascended to heaven, where he was placed before the throne of the Most High in the creation, which was surrounded by glorious creatures who served the Lord.

From "The Book of the Secrets of Enoch" 22: 8; "And I fell prone and bowed down to the Lord, and the Lord with his lips said to me: "Have courage, Enoch, do not fear, arise and stand before my face into eternity."

And the archistratiege Michael lifted me up, and led me before the Lord"s face.

And the Most High, (who held the ransom blood of righteous Abel, which could save but one man,) said to his servants tempting them: "Let Enoch stand before my face into eternity," and the glorious creatures (Not humans) bowed down to the Lord of creatures, and said: "Let Enoch go according to Thy word."

And the Lord said to Michael: "Go take Enoch from out his earthly garments, and anoint him with my sweet ointment, and put him into the garments of my glory."

And Michael did thus as the Lord told him. He anointed me, and dressed me, and the appearance of that ointment is more than the great light, and his ointment is like sweet dew, and its smell mild, shining like the sun"s rays, and I looked at myself, and was like one of his glorious ones.

There you have the anointed one, who filled the man Jesus, with his spirit that descended upon him in the form of a dove as the heavenly voice was heard to say, "You are my beloved in whom I am pleased, "This Day" I have begotten thee," who spoke not one word on his own authority, but only that which he was commanded to say by our indwelling evolving ancestral Father spirit, Enoch the chosen successor to the throne of the MOST HIGH in the creation.

When the pre-flood androgynous body of mankind, of which body, Adam was the indwelling spiritual Father and Godhead, was submerged in the baptismal waters of the earth, It was the spiritual Enoch, in the body of the eight in the ark of salvation. who came up from those baptismal waters.

Noah, his wife, their three sons and their three wives, are all direct descendants of Enoch"s six sons, Methusulah, Rigam, Riman, Urchan, Cherminion and Giadad, and now, within all the descendants of Noah, behind the veil of the flesh, within the inner most sanctuary of his earthly tabernacle, the living spirit of our ancestral Father, evolves to the ends of time.

Jubilees chapter 4: And he (Adam) lacked seventy years of one thousand years; for one thousand years are as one day in the testimony of the heavens and therefore was it written concerning the tree of knowledge: "On the day that ye eat thereof ye shall die." For this reason he did not complete the years of this day; for he died during it.

The only man to have been reborn so far, is Enoch, who was in the valley of man for three days (Three thousand years,) before he was reborn as the man Jesus over whom death had no power.

The next to be reborn, will be Elijah, who also, has now been in the valley of man for three days, but his chosen earthly host body will be quickened by his living presence and be translated to an immortal body of glorious light.

After that, all those whose graves were open 2,000 years ago when Jesus gave up his spirit, and cried out, My God, my God why have you abandoned me, will be reborn on earth in their chosen earthly host bodies, as was Enoch in his chosen heir "The man Jesus", when those of the first resurrection, who are of the indwelling spiritual enclosure within the body of Jesus, the duplication of the anointed one, will then take the thrones that have been prepared for them and rule as kings for one thousands years: the seventh Day, the Great Sabbath, the "DAY OF THE LORD."

The bodies of the chosen kings, in who the spirits of our Lord are reborn on earth, are not translated to glorious incorruptible bodies of blinding light until the sound of the last trumpet at the close of the seventh day, when they, whose graves were opened some two thousand years ago, will have been in the valley of man for three days.
Gentorev
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12/23/2014 11:04:15 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
There are only two women by the name Mary, who were at the death, burial and empty tomb of Jesus, and they are Mary Magdalene, and Mary the wife of Cleophas, who was the biological mother of Jesus, Joseph and James the younger of the three, plus two stepsons who had been sired by Alpheaus, who is one and the same person who is known as Cleophas.
Gentorev
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12/26/2014 12:20:25 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/23/2014 11:04:15 PM, Gentorev wrote:
There are only two women by the name Mary, who were at the death, burial and empty tomb of Jesus, and they are Mary Magdalene, and Mary the wife of Cleophas, who was the biological mother of Jesus, Joseph and James the younger of the three, plus two stepsons who had been sired by Alpheaus, who is one and the same person who is known as Cleophas.

".Luke does not name the women who had followed Jesus from Galilee, who were at the cross and burial of Jesus, but he does state, that at the empty tomb, were Mary Magdalene, Joanna (The wife of Herod"s treasurer} and Mary the Mother of James, (Who was sired by Alphaeus/Cleophas, and was a brother of Jesus, who was born of the same womb, and the first to sit on the Episcopal Throne of the church of the circumcision in Jerusalem.)

Mark 15: 40; reveals that at the cross of Jesus, was Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James the younger, (of Mary"s three biological sons) and Joseph, (the other biological brother of Jesus.) and Salome.

In verse 47; Mark also has Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joseph, (the half brother of Jesus) at the burial of Jesus, and at the empty tomb, he has Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James the younger, (the brother of Jesus,) and Salome also.

Matthew 27: 55; states that among the women at the cross, were Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James and Joseph, (Who were both born of the same womb as Jesus. The other two brothers of Jesus who are recorded in Matt 13: 55; are Simeon, and Jude, the two step-brothers of Jesus, as they were the sons of Alphaeus/Cleophas from another woman) Matthew says that the wife of Zebedee was there also

Then in 27: 61; Matthew says that at the burial of Jesus, was Mary Magdalene and the other Mary, who is obviously Mary the mother of the two brothers born of the same womb as Jesus, James the younger and Joseph.

In Matthew 28: 1; he again says, that at the empty tomb, was Mary Magdalene and the OTHER Mary, not the other women by the name Mary, but the only other woman by the name Mary, who was at the cross, burial, and empty tomb of Jesus.

And John reveals that the two women by the name "MARY" at the cross, are his mother, Mary the wife of Cleophas, who is also called Alphaeus and is the father of James the younger of the three brothers that were born of the womb of Mary, and her relative, Mary Magdalene, who is believed to have been the wife of Rabbi Jesus, as all Rabbi's in those days were expected to be married.

After his resurrection, he first revealed himself to the women at the empty tomb, which included Mary Magdalene and Mary his mother. The very next people to see him, were Cleophas his mother's Husband, and Simon the son of Cleophas, who succeeded to the Episcopal Throne of James the Righteous, who was murdered by the same Sadducee sect that had his womb- brother Jesus killed.
Gentorev
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12/26/2014 8:12:26 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
The religious authorities in the days of Jesus, who had access to all the bills of divorce which were filed away in the temple in Jerusalem, were always looking for ways that they might trap Jesus according to his own teaching and then accuse him to the people, and it was after Jesus had been preaching that if a divorced person remarried while their original spouse was still alive, they were committing adultery. It was then that the hypocritical priests thought that they had the means whereby they could make Jesus appear to the people to have one law for himself and another for everyone else.

Bringing forward his mother, who was among the crowd who were listening to the great teacher who was setting Israel on fire, they said to Jesus in their most patronising voice, Teacher, this woman has been caught in the very act of adultery. (This was according to the new teaching of Jesus) In our law Moses commanded that such a woman must be stoned to death. Now, what do you say? They said this in order to trap Jesus and accuse him to the people.

Jesus knew what those hypocrites were up to, those hypocrites who thought nothing of stoning the innocent Stephen to death, and who were bound by the law of Moses to stone this woman to death if she had indeed been caught in the very act of sexual intercourse with a man other than He to who she was legally married at that time.

Jesus then turned the tables on them by saying, "He who is without sin may cast the first stone."

Then he bent down and wrote something in the dust, Perhaps he may have written, "As ye judge, so shall ye be judged." Most men in those days who had been given by Moses the right to issue their wives with a bill of divorce, had done so and according to the new teaching of Jesus would have been as guilty as the woman that they were accusing, and the hypocrites knowing full well that the woman had not broken the Law of Moses and was innocent of any crime according to their own teachings, they were forced to walk away with their tails between their legs, thereby admitting to the people that they were not without sin.

Jesus then turned to his mother and asked, "Is there no one left to condemn you?" No one Lord she answered. "Well then," said Jesus, "I do not condemn you either. Go, but don"t sin again," and it was for this reason that the mother of Jesus chose to remain separate from her husband Cleophas and his children, and the reason why, on the cross, Jesus entrusted his mother, "Mary the wife of Cleophas," into the care of his beloved disciple John.

Although we know near to nothing about Joseph the half brother to Jesus, there is more that a greater probability that he was Joseph from Arimathea, who laid Jesus in his own "FAMILY TOMB THAT HAD NEVER BEEN USED," suggesting that His Father, the first husband of Mary, was still alive. It seem strange that in a book which is so condensed, one would bother to add the little bit of trivia, that the tomb in which Jesus was laid, was the FAMILY tomb of Joseph which had never been used, when saying, He was buried in a tomb close by, would have sufficed.

young John who was surnamed "MARK" which name means "Hammer, or The Hammerer," has been identified with young John the beloved disciple who was entrusted with the care of Mary the mother of Jesus who had surnamed him "Son of Thunder."

It is written in Acts, that it was the custom of the apostles, after the death of Jesus to meet at the house of his mother Mary to worship together. then after Peter had been miraculously released from prison, he ran straight to the house where he knew the believers would be gathered in prayer for his safety: Straight to the house of Mary the mother of John, who was surnamed "MARK".

Jesus was the biological son of Mary and her half brother, Joseph the son of Alexander Helios/HELI, and this Joseph is not to be confused with Joseph the son of Jacob, whose genealogy is recorded in Matthew.

After the death of Jesus, Joseph the Levite from Cyprus, took his half sister Mary and young John who was surnamed "MARK" up into the land of Pamphilia, where in the town of Ephesus, the grave sites of Mary and John, can still be visited to this day.

If you wish to know more about the life of Mary the obedient hand maid to her indwelling ancestral spirit, who chose for her, the biological father of Jesus, in who were the genetic qualities of all the spirits of good people who had fallen asleep in righteousness after paying the blood price for their inherited sin, who were judged in the flesh as all are judged and were separated from the unrighteous dead and were gathered to the living evolving spirit of our ancestral Father Enoch, within the bosom of Abraham, over which spirits, death had no more power, then please feel free to ask.
Skyangel
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12/27/2014 1:30:10 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/23/2014 11:04:15 PM, Gentorev wrote:
There are only two women by the name Mary, who were at the death, burial and empty tomb of Jesus, and they are Mary Magdalene, and Mary the wife of Cleophas, who was the biological mother of Jesus, Joseph and James the younger of the three, plus two stepsons who had been sired by Alpheaus, who is one and the same person who is known as Cleophas.

Mary, the wife of Cleophas was NOT the biological mother of Jesus.
Mary, the wife of Joseph was the mother of Jesus in the story.

Obviously you are very a very confused man.

Mary wife of Clephas is apparently the sister in law of Mary the wife of Joseph.

http://www.ewtn.com...
Gentorev
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12/27/2014 1:48:04 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/27/2014 1:30:10 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 12/23/2014 11:04:15 PM, Gentorev wrote:
There are only two women by the name Mary, who were at the death, burial and empty tomb of Jesus, and they are Mary Magdalene, and Mary the wife of Cleophas, who was the biological mother of Jesus, Joseph and James the younger of the three, plus two stepsons who had been sired by Alpheaus, who is one and the same person who is known as Cleophas.

Mary, the wife of Cleophas was NOT the biological mother of Jesus.
Mary, the wife of Joseph was the mother of Jesus in the story.

Obviously you are very a very confused man.

Mary wife of Clephas is apparently the sister in law of Mary the wife of Joseph.

http://www.ewtn.com...

No dear woman it is you who are confused. Paul states that James the younger is the Brother of Jesus (Born of the same womb) and the Father of James is Alpheaus who is also called Cleophas.

As James, the brother born of the same womb as Jesus, was a young man when Jesus began his ministry, Mary had to have been married to Cleophas when Jesus was a young boy. but all this has already been explained in the previous post if you had bothered to read them.

There are only two women by the name Mary, who were at the death, burial and empty tomb of Jesus, and they are Mary Magdalene, and Mary the wife of Cleophas, who was the biological mother of Jesus, Joseph and James the younger of her three biological sons, plus two stepsons who had been previously sired by Alpheaus, who is one and the same person who is known as Cleophas.

".Luke does not name the women who had followed Jesus from Galilee, who were at the cross and burial of Jesus, but he does state, that at the empty tomb, were Mary Magdalene, Joanna (The wife of Herod"s treasurer} and Mary the Mother of James, (Who was sired by Alphaeus/Cleophas, and was a brother of Jesus, who was born of the same womb, and the first to sit on the Episcopal Throne of the church of the circumcision in Jerusalem.)

Mark 15: 40; reveals that at the cross of Jesus, was Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James the younger, (of Mary"s three biological sons) and Joseph, (the other biological brother of Jesus.) and Salome.

In verse 47; Mark also has Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joseph, (the half brother of Jesus) at the burial of Jesus, and at the empty tomb, he has Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James the younger, (the brother of Jesus,) and Salome also.

Matthew 27: 55; states that among the women at the cross, were Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James and Joseph, (Who were both born of the same womb as Jesus. The other two brothers of Jesus who are recorded in Matt 13: 55; are Simeon, and Jude, the two step-brothers of Jesus, as they were the sons of Alphaeus/Cleophas from another woman) Matthew says that the wife of Zebedee was there also

Then in 27: 61; Matthew says that at the burial of Jesus, was Mary Magdalene and the other Mary, who is obviously Mary the mother of the two brothers born of the same womb as Jesus, James the younger and Joseph.

In Matthew 28: 1; he again says, that at the empty tomb, was Mary Magdalene and the OTHER Mary, not the other women by the name Mary, but the only other woman by the name Mary, who was at the cross, burial, and empty tomb of Jesus.

And John reveals that the two women by the name "MARY" at the cross, are his mother, Mary the wife of Cleophas, who is also called Alphaeus and is the father of James the younger of the three brothers that were born of the womb of Mary, and her relative, Mary Magdalene, who is believed to have been the wife of Rabbi Jesus, as all Rabbi's in those days were expected to be married.
Skyangel
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12/27/2014 1:57:33 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/27/2014 1:48:04 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/27/2014 1:30:10 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 12/23/2014 11:04:15 PM, Gentorev wrote:
There are only two women by the name Mary, who were at the death, burial and empty tomb of Jesus, and they are Mary Magdalene, and Mary the wife of Cleophas, who was the biological mother of Jesus, Joseph and James the younger of the three, plus two stepsons who had been sired by Alpheaus, who is one and the same person who is known as Cleophas.

Mary, the wife of Cleophas was NOT the biological mother of Jesus.
Mary, the wife of Joseph was the mother of Jesus in the story.

Obviously you are very a very confused man.

Mary wife of Clephas is apparently the sister in law of Mary the wife of Joseph.

http://www.ewtn.com...

No dear woman it is you who are confused. Paul states that James the younger is the Brother of Jesus (Born of the same womb) and the Father of James is Alpheaus who is also called Cleophas.

As James, the brother born of the same womb as Jesus, was a young man when Jesus began his ministry, Mary had to have been married to Cleophas when Jesus was a young boy. but all this has already been explained in the previous post if you had bothered to read them.

There are only two women by the name Mary, who were at the death, burial and empty tomb of Jesus, and they are Mary Magdalene, and Mary the wife of Cleophas, who was the biological mother of Jesus, Joseph and James the younger of her three biological sons, plus two stepsons who had been previously sired by Alpheaus, who is one and the same person who is known as Cleophas.

".Luke does not name the women who had followed Jesus from Galilee, who were at the cross and burial of Jesus, but he does state, that at the empty tomb, were Mary Magdalene, Joanna (The wife of Herod"s treasurer} and Mary the Mother of James, (Who was sired by Alphaeus/Cleophas, and was a brother of Jesus, who was born of the same womb, and the first to sit on the Episcopal Throne of the church of the circumcision in Jerusalem.)

Mark 15: 40; reveals that at the cross of Jesus, was Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James the younger, (of Mary"s three biological sons) and Joseph, (the other biological brother of Jesus.) and Salome.

In verse 47; Mark also has Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joseph, (the half brother of Jesus) at the burial of Jesus, and at the empty tomb, he has Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James the younger, (the brother of Jesus,) and Salome also.

Matthew 27: 55; states that among the women at the cross, were Mary Magdalene, Mary the mother of James and Joseph, (Who were both born of the same womb as Jesus. The other two brothers of Jesus who are recorded in Matt 13: 55; are Simeon, and Jude, the two step-brothers of Jesus, as they were the sons of Alphaeus/Cleophas from another woman) Matthew says that the wife of Zebedee was there also

Then in 27: 61; Matthew says that at the burial of Jesus, was Mary Magdalene and the other Mary, who is obviously Mary the mother of the two brothers born of the same womb as Jesus, James the younger and Joseph.

In Matthew 28: 1; he again says, that at the empty tomb, was Mary Magdalene and the OTHER Mary, not the other women by the name Mary, but the only other woman by the name Mary, who was at the cross, burial, and empty tomb of Jesus.

And John reveals that the two women by the name "MARY" at the cross, are his mother, Mary the wife of Cleophas, who is also called Alphaeus and is the father of James the younger of the three brothers that were born of the womb of Mary, and her relative, Mary Magdalene, who is believed to have been the wife of Rabbi Jesus, as all Rabbi's in those days were expected to be married.

Are you saying Joseph, Alpheaus and Cleophas are all the same person? If so where is your proof that Joseph is just another name for Cleophas? Where is Joseph also called Alpheaus and Cleophas?
Gentorev
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12/27/2014 2:46:11 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Skyangel wrote............Are you saying Joseph, Alpheaus and Cleophas are all the same person? If so where is your proof that Joseph is just another name for Cleophas? Where is Joseph also called Alpheaus and Cleophas?

I believe that the bible points to the fact that Joseph the son of Jacob, who has no genetic connection to Jesus the grandson of Alexander Helios=Heli, who is the father of both Mary and her half brother Joseph the son of Heli, divorced Mary after she had bore to him a son who was named Joseph after his father.

In the Subject Guide of Young's Analytical Concordance, Cleophas and Alpheaus are said to be the same person. It was not uncommon, for a man in those days to have three names, a Hebrew name, a Greek name and an Aramaic name.

Joseph the half brother to Mary was the son of Alexander Helios,who was the son of Cleopatra and Mark Anthony, who was adopted out with his twin sister, when their parents committed suicide, Heli was a father of renowned, Cleophas is the Greek for: "Father of renowned, while Alpheaus is the Aramaic for: "A Father of renown.

The religious authorities in the days of Jesus, who had access to all the bills of divorce which were filed away in the temple in Jerusalem, were always looking for ways that they might trap Jesus according to his own teaching and then accuse him to the people, and it was after Jesus had been preaching that if a divorced person remarried while their original spouse was still alive, they were committing adultery. It was then that the hypocritical priests thought that they had the means whereby they could make Jesus appear to the people to have one law for himself and another for everyone else.

Bringing forward his mother, who was among the crowd who were listening to the great teacher who was setting Israel on fire, they said to Jesus in their most patronising voice, Teacher, this woman has been caught in the very act of adultery. (This was according to the new teaching of Jesus) In our law Moses commanded that such a woman must be stoned to death. Now, what do you say? They said this in order to trap Jesus and accuse him to the people.

Jesus knew what those hypocrites were up to, those hypocrites who thought nothing of stoning the innocent Stephen to death, and who were bound by the law of Moses to stone this woman to death if she had indeed been caught in the very act of sexual intercourse with a man other than He to who she was legally married at that time.

Jesus then turned the tables on them by saying, "He who is without sin may cast the first stone."

Then he bent down and wrote something in the dust, Perhaps he may have written, "As ye judge, so shall ye be judged." Most men in those days who had been given by Moses the right to issue their wives with a bill of divorce, had done so and according to the new teaching of Jesus would have been as guilty as the woman that they were accusing, and the hypocrites knowing full well that the woman had not broken the Law of Moses and was innocent of any crime according to their own teachings, they were forced to walk away with their tails between their legs, thereby admitting to the people that they were not without sin.

Jesus then turned to his mother and asked, "Is there no one left to condemn you?" No one Lord she answered. "Well then," said Jesus, "I do not condemn you either. Go, but don"t sin again," and it was for this reason that the mother of Jesus chose to remain separate from her husband Cleophas and his children, James the younger, Simeon and Jude, and the reason why, on the cross, Jesus entrusted his mother, "Mary the wife of Cleophas," into the care of his beloved disciple John.

Although we know near to nothing about Joseph the half brother to Jesus, there is more that a greater probability that he was Joseph from Arimathea, who laid Jesus in his own "FAMILY TOMB THAT HAD NEVER BEEN USED," suggesting that His Father, the first husband of Mary, was still alive. It seem strange that in a book which is so condensed, one would bother to add the little piece of trivia, that the tomb in which Jesus was laid, was the FAMILY TOMB OF JOSEPH WHICH HAD NEVER BEEN USED,, when saying, He was buried in a tomb close by, would have sufficed.

young John who was surnamed "MARK" which name means "Hammer, or The Hammerer," has been identified with young John the beloved disciple who was entrusted with the care of Mary the mother of Jesus who had surnamed him "Son of Thunder."

It is written in Acts, that it was the custom of the apostles, after the death of Jesus to meet at the house of his mother Mary to worship together. then after Peter had been miraculously released from prison, he ran straight to the house where he knew the believers would be gathered in prayer for his safety: Straight to the house of Mary the mother of John, who was surnamed "MARK".

Jesus was the biological son of Mary and her half brother, Joseph the son of Alexander Helios/HELI, and this Joseph is not to be confused with Joseph the son of Jacob, whose genealogy is recorded in Matthew.

After the death of Jesus, Joseph the Levite from Cyprus, took his half sister Mary and young John who was surnamed "MARK" up into the land of Pamphilia, where in the town of Ephesus, the grave sites of Mary and John, can still be visited to this day.

If you wish to know more about the life of Mary the obedient hand maid to her indwelling ancestral spirit, who chose for her, the biological father of Jesus, in who were the genetic qualities of all the spirits of good people who had fallen asleep in righteousness after paying the blood price for their inherited sin, who were judged in the flesh as all are judged and were separated from the unrighteous dead and were gathered to the living evolving spirit of our ancestral Father Enoch, within the bosom of Abraham, over which spirits, death had no more power, then please feel free to ask.
Gentorev
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12/27/2014 3:24:06 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Simeon, one of the brothers of Jesus, who succeeded James the brother of the Lord to the Episcopal throne of the church of the circumcision in Jerusalem, was the son of Cleophas to a previous marriage, as was Judas the son of Alpheaus, another brother of Jesus. Cleophas and Alpheaus, which both names mean, "Of a renown father," are one and the same person. Cleophas the male abbreviation of the female Cleopatra, a Macedonian name, is the Greek, for "Of a renown father," and Alpheaus, the biological father of James the younger of Mary"s three sons and the brother of the Lord, is the Aramaic of the same meaning, "Of a renown father."

As we see a number of people in the New Testament, are given three names, Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic, it would not surprise me to discover that Alpheaus (Aramaic) and Cleophas (Greek) could also be Joseph (Hebrew) the son of Alexander Helios, a man of renown as he was the son of Mark Anthony and Cleopatra.

Judas, (Hebrew), the son of Alpheaus/Cleophas, who was called, Thomas=Tau"ma, the Aramiac for twin, and is also called Didymus, which is the Greek for twin, he is Thomas Didymus Jude, the brother of Jesus and the son of the carpenter Alpheaus/Cleophas the second Husband Of Mary the mother of Jesus.

Was he an actual twin, or did he just hold a striking resemblance to another of his father's sons?

Matthew 13" 55; "Isn"t he the carpenters son? Isn"t Mary his mother, and aren"t James, Joseph, Simeon and Jude his brothers.

Knowing that in ART, Thomas Didymus Jude, the son of Alpheaus/Cleophas, is depicted with a carpenters rule and square, we must ask the question, "Who is the Carpenter to whom Mary was married at that time, when her family consisted of James, Joseph, Simon and Judas? Was it Joseph the son of Jacob from the tribe of Judah, who was her first husband, or was it Alpheaus/Cleophas the second husband of Mary and the Father of James the biological son of Mary and the youngest boy in the family, plus Simon and Jude, who is also called "Didymus"the Greek for twin and Thomas-Tau'ma, the Aramaic meaning twin?

In "The Acts of Thomas, sometime called by its full name, "The Acts of Judas Thomas," 2nd-3rd century CE, "The Apostles cast lots as to where they should go, and to Thomas, Judas, brother to Jesus fell India.Thomas was taken to King Goddophares the ruler of Indo-Pathian Kingdom as an architect and carpenter by Habban."
Skyangel
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12/27/2014 3:49:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
http://www.ewtn.com...

Christopher, who wrote the above essay, does not agree with you. He makes far more sense than you do and is nowhere near as complicated with his explanations.

Why should anyone believe you and not him?

Mary was a very common name and still is today. You are obviously confusing all the Mary's in the bible stories and trying to convince yourself there were only two not three. You obviously need to convince yourself that you are correct and don't want to consider anyone elses opinions let alone consider the fact that you could be wrong.

However, all self deceived people like to believe they are right and everyone else is wrong so carry on. Your self deception is perfectly understandable.

In the end no one really cares who was related to who in the bible stories.
Besides that, Jesus said anyone who did the will of God was considered to be his brother and sister and mother. ( Matt 12:50, Mark 3:35 )
Therefore Jesus would have more than one "mother" and all his sisters and brothers are spiritual ones.
The "church" which is many members could be the "mother" of Jesus. ( Rev 12 )
Any relationships of bible characters cannot be taken literally at all.
The characters are not even historical characters. No one in their right mind would believe all humanity came from one man who was magically created from literal dust and a woman who was literally created from his rib.
The whole story is an allegory. It is only fools who take it literally.
Gentorev
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12/27/2014 7:17:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/27/2014 3:49:25 PM, Skyangel wrote:
http://www.ewtn.com...

Christopher, who wrote the above essay, does not agree with you. He makes far more sense than you do and is nowhere near as complicated with his explanations.

Why should anyone believe you and not him?

Mary was a very common name and still is today. You are obviously confusing all the Mary's in the bible stories and trying to convince yourself there were only two not three. You obviously need to convince yourself that you are correct and don't want to consider anyone elses opinions let alone consider the fact that you could be wrong.

However, all self deceived people like to believe they are right and everyone else is wrong so carry on. Your self deception is perfectly understandable.

In the end no one really cares who was related to who in the bible stories.
Besides that, Jesus said anyone who did the will of God was considered to be his brother and sister and mother. ( Matt 12:50, Mark 3:35 )
Therefore Jesus would have more than one "mother" and all his sisters and brothers are spiritual ones.
The "church" which is many members could be the "mother" of Jesus. ( Rev 12 )
Any relationships of bible characters cannot be taken literally at all.
The characters are not even historical characters. No one in their right mind would believe all humanity came from one man who was magically created from literal dust and a woman who was literally created from his rib.
The whole story is an allegory. It is only fools who take it literally.

Skyangel wrote......... Why should anyone believe you and not him?

Gentorev responds........Believe me??? No, but they should believe the word of God, which reveals that there were only two women by the name Mary at the cross, the burial and the empty tomb of Jesus.

Whether you believe the book to be fact or fiction is irrelevant, it is what the story in that book reveals, that we are interested in.

I have never said that there are only two women by the name Mary who are recorded in the bible: NO! What I said, was that there are only two women by the name Mary, who were at the death, burial and empty tomb of Jesus, and they are Mary Magdalene, and Mary the wife of Cleophas, who was the biological mother of Jesus, Joseph and James the younger of her three biological sons, plus two stepsons who had been previously sired by Alpheaus, who is one and the same person who is known as Cleophas.

".Luke does not name the women who had followed Jesus from Galilee, who were at the cross and burial of Jesus, but he does state, that at the empty tomb, were Mary Magdalene, Joanna (The wife of Herod"s treasurer} and Mary the Mother of James, (Who was sired by Alphaeus/Cleophas, and was a brother of Jesus, who was born of the same womb, and the first to sit on the Episcopal Throne of the church of the circumcision in Jerusalem.)

Mark 15: 40; reveals that at the cross of Jesus, was Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James the younger, of Mary"s three biological sons and Joseph, the other biological brother of Jesus. and Salome was there also.

In verse 47; Mark also has Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joseph, (the half brother of Jesus) at the burial of Jesus, and at the empty tomb, he has Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James the younger, (the brother of Jesus,) and Salome also.

Matthew 27: 55; states that among the women at the cross, were Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James and Joseph, (Who were both born of the same womb as Jesus. The other two brothers of Jesus who are recorded in Matt 13: 55; are Simeon, and Jude, the two step-brothers of Jesus, as they were the sons of Alphaeus/Cleophas from another woman) Matthew says that the wife of Zebedee was there also

Then in 27: 61; Matthew says that at the burial of Jesus, was Mary Magdalene and the "OTHER" Mary, (Notice that? not one of the other women by the name Mary, but the only OTHER Mary who was present at the burial, with Mary Magdalene) and that "OTHER" Mary is obviously Mary the mother of the two brothers born of the same womb as Jesus, who are James the younger and Joseph, who Matthew has already revealed to us, was at the cross..

In Matthew 28: 1; he again says, that at the empty tomb, was Mary Magdalene and the "OTHER" Mary, not one of the other women by the name Mary, but the only OTHER woman by the name Mary, who was at the cross, burial, and empty tomb of Jesus.

And John reveals that the two women by the name "MARY" at the cross, are his mother, Mary the wife of Cleophas, who is also called Alphaeus and is the father of James the younger of the three brothers that were born of the womb of Mary, and her(adelphe) relative, Mary Magdalene, who is believed to have been the wife of Rabbi Jesus, as all Rabbi's in those days were expected to be married.

The Evangelists wrote in Greek rather than in Hebrew...at that time only the capital letters of the Greek alphabet were used in writing, without diacritics, punctuation, or separation between words. Lower case letters appeared only in the ninth century, together with spacing between words. Punctuation marks were introduced only with the invention of the printing press in the 15th century. The present separations of chapters was introduced by Cardinal Hugo in the 13th century.

"WOMANWITHOUTHERMANISNOTHING." Doesn"t make much sense, does it? Let us now separate the words. "Woman without her man is nothing," that seems better doesn"t it? But without punctuation, what is being said here? "Woman without her man, is nothing;" or "Woman, without her, man is nothing."

John 19: 25; "Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother and his mothers sister (adelphe), Mary the wife of Cleophas (The father of James the younger of Mary's three biological sons) and Mary Magdalene

Standing by the gate was my brother and my brother's son, Jonathan and Peter. What is the name of my brother? And what is the name of his son?
Skyangel
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12/27/2014 9:24:05 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/27/2014 7:17:44 PM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/27/2014 3:49:25 PM, Skyangel wrote:
Why should anyone believe you and not him?

Gentorev responds........Believe me??? No, but they should believe the word of God, which reveals that there were only two women by the name Mary at the cross, the burial and the empty tomb of Jesus.

Not the way I read it. I see three in this verse.
John 19: 25 Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother, and his mother's sister, Mary the wife of Cleophas, and Mary Magdalene.
1. His mother, whose name was Mary who is the wife of Joseph.
2. His mothers sister who is either unnamed or her name is Mary the wife of Cleophas.
3. Mary Magdalene.

Therefore you have at least three Marys at the cross and if "his mothers sister" is not Mary the wife of Cleophas then she is just a fourth unnamed female at the cross.

Whether you believe the book to be fact or fiction is irrelevant, it is what the story in that book reveals, that we are interested in.

I have never said that there are only two women by the name Mary who are recorded in the bible: NO! What I said, was that there are only two women by the name Mary, who were at the death, burial and empty tomb of Jesus, and they are Mary Magdalene, and Mary the wife of Cleophas, who was the biological mother of Jesus, Joseph and James the younger of her three biological sons, plus two stepsons who had been previously sired by Alpheaus, who is one and the same person who is known as Cleophas.


Twist it any way you like but Mary the wife of Joseph ( Mat 1:16-24) is not Mary the wife of Cleophas and the way I read John 19:25, there are definitely three Marys at the cross and could have been four different females mentioned if Marys sister was not the wife of Cleophas.

Why are you so hung up on how many Marys were at the death and resurrection of Jesus when the story is allegorical?
Why does it matter to you how many Marys were at the cross? There could have been dozens of them and it would make no difference to the moral of the story. If every female watching the crucifixion was named Mary, it still would make no difference to the moral of the story.
Therefore what point are you making by trying to convince readers there were only two Marys at the cross?
It seems to me you are only proving your own lack of comprehension.

".Luke does not name the women who had followed Jesus from Galilee, who were at the cross and burial of Jesus, but he does state, that at the empty tomb, were Mary Magdalene, Joanna (The wife of Herod"s treasurer} and Mary the Mother of James, (Who was sired by Alphaeus/Cleophas, and was a brother of Jesus, who was born of the same womb, and the first to sit on the Episcopal Throne of the church of the circumcision in Jerusalem.)

Mark 15: 40; reveals that at the cross of Jesus, was Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James the younger, of Mary"s three biological sons and Joseph, the other biological brother of Jesus. and Salome was there also.

In verse 47; Mark also has Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of Joseph, (the half brother of Jesus) at the burial of Jesus, and at the empty tomb, he has Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James the younger, (the brother of Jesus,) and Salome also.

Matthew 27: 55; states that among the women at the cross, were Mary Magdalene and Mary the mother of James and Joseph, (Who were both born of the same womb as Jesus. The other two brothers of Jesus who are recorded in Matt 13: 55; are Simeon, and Jude, the two step-brothers of Jesus, as they were the sons of Alphaeus/Cleophas from another woman) Matthew says that the wife of Zebedee was there also

Then in 27: 61; Matthew says that at the burial of Jesus, was Mary Magdalene and the "OTHER" Mary, (Notice that? not one of the other women by the name Mary, but the only OTHER Mary who was present at the burial, with Mary Magdalene) and that "OTHER" Mary is obviously Mary the mother of the two brothers born of the same womb as Jesus, who are James the younger and Joseph, who Matthew has already revealed to us, was at the cross..

In Matthew 28: 1; he again says, that at the empty tomb, was Mary Magdalene and the "OTHER" Mary, not one of the other women by the name Mary, but the only OTHER woman by the name Mary, who was at the cross, burial, and empty tomb of Jesus.

And John reveals that the two women by the name "MARY" at the cross, are his mother, Mary the wife of Cleophas, who is also called Alphaeus and is the father of James the younger of the three brothers that were born of the womb of Mary, and her(adelphe) relative, Mary Magdalene, who is believed to have been the wife of Rabbi Jesus, as all Rabbi's in those days were expected to be married.

The Evangelists wrote in Greek rather than in Hebrew...at that time only the capital letters of the Greek alphabet were used in writing, without diacritics, punctuation, or separation between words. Lower case letters appeared only in the ninth century, together with spacing between words. Punctuation marks were introduced only with the invention of the printing press in the 15th century. The present separations of chapters was introduced by Cardinal Hugo in the 13th century.


And your point is?
What exactly is it in the story in that all these Marys have revealed to you?
What are you trying to show people?
Whatever it is, you have not made it clear at all.
You just ramble on an on about different relationships and end up getting yourself and readers more twisted and tangled up than its worth. That's why hardly anyone responds to your rambles.

"WOMANWITHOUTHERMANISNOTHING." Doesn"t make much sense, does it? Let us now separate the words. "Woman without her man is nothing," that seems better doesn"t it? But without punctuation, what is being said here? "Woman without her man, is nothing;" or "Woman, without her, man is nothing."

Obviously it depends on how you want to interpret it. The bible is the same. It can be interpreted in many different ways.

John 19: 25; "Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother and his mothers sister (adelphe), Mary the wife of Cleophas (The father of James the younger of Mary's three biological sons) and Mary Magdalene

Standing by the gate was my brother and my brother's son, Jonathan and Peter. What is the name of my brother? And what is the name of his son?

What you fail to acknowledge is the comma after "his mother", and the comma after Mary the wife of Cleopas...
Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother ( person 1) , and his mother's sister ( person 2) , Mary the wife of Cleophas ( person 3), and Mary Magdalene ( person 4) .

Standing by the gate was my brother, and my brother's son, Jonathan, and Peter. How many are standing by the gate now?

Two or four people?

It all depends on interpretation, doesn't it?
Ultimately it makes no difference how many were at the crucifixion or what their names were. You are being led astray by irrelevant trivia. The moral of the story does not change depending on how many spectators there were or what their names were. It makes absolutely no difference at all.
Gentorev
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12/27/2014 10:04:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Skyangel wrote........ What you fail to acknowledge is the comma after "his mother", and the comma after Mary the wife of Cleopas...
Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother ( person 1) , and his mother's sister ( person 2) , Mary the wife of Cleophas ( person 3), and Mary Magdalene ( person 4)

Gentorev................Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother ( person 1) , and his mother's sister ( person 2) , (Who are) Mary the wife of Cleophas ( person1), and Mary Magdalene ( person 2)

Skyangel wrote in answer to my question which was............ "Standing by the gate was my brother, and my brother's son, Jonathan, and Peter. How many are standing by the gate now?"

Skyangel's answer..............: Two or four people? It all depends on interpretation, doesn't it?

Gentorev.........NO it does not. Only one who cannot comprehend the written word would believe for one moment that four people are being referred to in that instance

Skyamgel wrote...........Ultimately it makes no difference how many were at the crucifixion or what their names were. You are being led astray by irrelevant trivia. The moral of the story does not change depending on how many spectators there were or what their names were. It makes absolutely no difference at all.

Gentorev.............Ultimately nothing recorded in the Holy Scriptures makes any difference to those who have abandoned their God, and now must close their eyes to the truth that they know deep in their heart has been revealed to them.

How the war within you must be raging as you try to keep your blindfold in place so that you do not have to admit that you have abandoned your God because you were unable to comprehend his words of Salvation.

You deny that the book, 'fact or fiction,' reveals that James the younger is the son of Alpheaus, who is also called Cleophas and that James the son of Cleophas is the brother of Jesus.

Why do you suppose, that the first men to whom the risen Jesus chose to reveal himself, were Cleophas the husband of Mary and his son Simon, who was to succeed to the episcopal throne of the church of the circumcision after his brother James the son of Cleophas/Alpheaus, was killed by the same mob who had their brother Jesus killed?

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.
Skyangel
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12/28/2014 1:50:11 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/27/2014 10:04:44 PM, Gentorev wrote:
Skyangel wrote........ What you fail to acknowledge is the comma after "his mother", and the comma after Mary the wife of Cleopas...
Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother ( person 1) , and his mother's sister ( person 2) , Mary the wife of Cleophas ( person 3), and Mary Magdalene ( person 4)

Gentorev................Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother ( person 1) , and his mother's sister ( person 2) , (Who are) Mary the wife of Cleophas ( person1), and Mary Magdalene ( person 2)

Skyangel wrote in answer to my question which was............ "Standing by the gate was my brother, and my brother's son, Jonathan, and Peter. How many are standing by the gate now?"

Skyangel's answer..............: Two or four people? It all depends on interpretation, doesn't it?

Gentorev.........NO it does not. Only one who cannot comprehend the written word would believe for one moment that four people are being referred to in that instance

Skyamgel wrote...........Ultimately it makes no difference how many were at the crucifixion or what their names were. You are being led astray by irrelevant trivia. The moral of the story does not change depending on how many spectators there were or what their names were. It makes absolutely no difference at all.

Gentorev.............Ultimately nothing recorded in the Holy Scriptures makes any difference to those who have abandoned their God, and now must close their eyes to the truth that they know deep in their heart has been revealed to them.

How the war within you must be raging as you try to keep your blindfold in place so that you do not have to admit that you have abandoned your God because you were unable to comprehend his words of Salvation.

You deny that the book, 'fact or fiction,' reveals that James the younger is the son of Alpheaus, who is also called Cleophas and that James the son of Cleophas is the brother of Jesus.

Why do you suppose, that the first men to whom the risen Jesus chose to reveal himself, were Cleophas the husband of Mary and his son Simon, who was to succeed to the episcopal throne of the church of the circumcision after his brother James the son of Cleophas/Alpheaus, was killed by the same mob who had their brother Jesus killed?

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Correct and you obviously can't see your own blindness. It makes no difference who is related to whom in the stories because ultimately we are all brothers and sisters of our forefathers for all eternity. All humans come from humans not from anything else.

I already told you I have not abandoned my God. I cannot abandon that which is part of who and what I AM. Obviously you can't see that or you simply refuse to believe it because my perception of God is different to yours.
Gentorev
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12/28/2014 3:35:47 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 1:50:11 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 12/27/2014 10:04:44 PM, Gentorev wrote:
Skyangel wrote........ What you fail to acknowledge is the comma after "his mother", and the comma after Mary the wife of Cleopas...
Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother ( person 1) , and his mother's sister ( person 2) , Mary the wife of Cleophas ( person 3), and Mary Magdalene ( person 4)

Gentorev................Now there stood by the cross of Jesus his mother ( person 1) , and his mother's sister ( person 2) , (Who are) Mary the wife of Cleophas ( person1), and Mary Magdalene ( person 2)

Skyangel wrote in answer to my question which was............ "Standing by the gate was my brother, and my brother's son, Jonathan, and Peter. How many are standing by the gate now?"

Skyangel's answer..............: Two or four people? It all depends on interpretation, doesn't it?

Gentorev.........NO it does not. Only one who cannot comprehend the written word would believe for one moment that four people are being referred to in that instance

Skyamgel wrote...........Ultimately it makes no difference how many were at the crucifixion or what their names were. You are being led astray by irrelevant trivia. The moral of the story does not change depending on how many spectators there were or what their names were. It makes absolutely no difference at all.

Gentorev.............Ultimately nothing recorded in the Holy Scriptures makes any difference to those who have abandoned their God, and now must close their eyes to the truth that they know deep in their heart has been revealed to them.

How the war within you must be raging as you try to keep your blindfold in place so that you do not have to admit that you have abandoned your God because you were unable to comprehend his words of Salvation.

You deny that the book, 'fact or fiction,' reveals that James the younger is the son of Alpheaus, who is also called Cleophas and that James the son of Cleophas is the brother of Jesus.

Why do you suppose, that the first men to whom the risen Jesus chose to reveal himself, were Cleophas the husband of Mary and his son Simon, who was to succeed to the episcopal throne of the church of the circumcision after his brother James the son of Cleophas/Alpheaus, was killed by the same mob who had their brother Jesus killed?

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Correct and you obviously can't see your own blindness. It makes no difference who is related to whom in the stories because ultimately we are all brothers and sisters of our forefathers for all eternity. All humans come from humans not from anything else.

I already told you I have not abandoned my God. I cannot abandon that which is part of who and what I AM. Obviously you can't see that or you simply refuse to believe it because my perception of God is different to yours.

Skyangel wrote.............Correct and you obviously can't see your own blindness.

Gentorev.........I am blind to naught my dear woman, I see clearly by the light of God"s word which illuminates all before me.

Skyangel wrote...............It makes no difference who is related to whom in the stories

Gentorev........ It does to all who would understand the Lord and what he has in store for us.

Skyangel wrote.........because ultimately we are all brothers and sisters of our forefathers for all eternity. All humans come from humans not from anything else.

Gentorev......... So you believe that mankind was divinely created, and was not created through the process of evolution, and therefore you don't believe that the first humans had to break away from the animal ancestral parentage that dwelt within their inner most sanctuary, and rather than follow their inner animal instinct, they had to learn to decide for themselves that which was good from that which was bad, rather than running around sniffing each others bum.

Skyangel wrote..........I already told you I have not abandoned my God. I cannot abandon that which is part of who and what I AM. Obviously you can't see that or you simply refuse to believe it because my perception of God is different to yours.

Gentorev....... No! What you have said, and I believe that I can find a post in which you state that when you were young you did believe in the biblical God. And so It becomes obvious that you have now abandoned that belief and have created your own god, who is more to your liking. Now that's all OK, just stop lying to me.
Skyangel
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12/28/2014 7:00:22 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 3:35:47 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/28/2014 1:50:11 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 12/27/2014 10:04:44 PM, Gentorev wrote:

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Correct and you obviously can't see your own blindness. It makes no difference who is related to whom in the stories because ultimately we are all brothers and sisters of our forefathers for all eternity. All humans come from humans not from anything else.

I already told you I have not abandoned my God. I cannot abandon that which is part of who and what I AM. Obviously you can't see that or you simply refuse to believe it because my perception of God is different to yours.

Skyangel wrote.............Correct and you obviously can't see your own blindness.

Gentorev.........I am blind to naught my dear woman, I see clearly by the light of God"s word which illuminates all before me.

As I correctly said, you obviously cannot see your own blindness.

Skyangel wrote...............It makes no difference who is related to whom in the stories

Gentorev........ It does to all who would understand the Lord and what he has in store for us.

Obviously you find something of importance in it. Carry on with your fictional family tree. Don't let anyone stop you from pursuing your addiction.

Skyangel wrote.........because ultimately we are all brothers and sisters of our forefathers for all eternity. All humans come from humans not from anything else.

Gentorev......... So you believe that mankind was divinely created, and was not created through the process of evolution, and therefore you don't believe that the first humans had to break away from the animal ancestral parentage that dwelt within their inner most sanctuary, and rather than follow their inner animal instinct, they had to learn to decide for themselves that which was good from that which was bad, rather than running around sniffing each others bum.

Humans coming from humans is not a divine creation unless you believe humans are divine beings. I do not believe in the evolution of humans from a single cell over billions of years. The evolution of a single cell into a human does not take billions of years. It takes approx nine months in the correct environment of a human womb. I don't believe in any "first humans". I believe in the paradox of life which basically implies there is no beginning but life is an eternal cycle in which no beginning can ever be found in reality. Any beginning and end is all an illusion. That which exists simply recycles itself. Good and bad are taught to us by our parents who were taught by their parents who were taught by theirs etc etc etc.
Humans still go around sniffing whatever they can get their nose into. Then they complain when it smells bad.

Skyangel wrote..........I already told you I have not abandoned my God. I cannot abandon that which is part of who and what I AM. Obviously you can't see that or you simply refuse to believe it because my perception of God is different to yours.

Gentorev....... No! What you have said, and I believe that I can find a post in which you state that when you were young you did believe in the biblical God. And so It becomes obvious that you have now abandoned that belief and have created your own god, who is more to your liking. Now that's all OK, just stop lying to me.

I once perceived God to be an invisible Father figure in the sky. I realized that perception was a childish way to view God. It was as childish as perceiving Santa to be a magic man at the North Pole. I matured in my perception of God the same way as I matured in my perception of Santa and realized I am Santa, We are Santa, in the sense of being part of the body which promotes the whole concept of giving anonymously. The concept exists and humans promote it to make money from the concept.
These days I see God as an anthropomorphism of life in general of which I am an intricate part and it is an intricate part of me. Reality is truth which is also an intricate part of me. I am that I am. I realize we as a body of living things are God the same as we as a body of living things are also Santa. We humans are the personification of our own thoughts, ideas, concepts, etc. We create our own reality. We promote our own concepts. We are creators who are perfectly capable of creating mankind in our own image. We can create whatever we imagine we can create. We can make our own dreams come true if we work together to make them come true. Humans as a corporate body have a lot of power when working in unity. As a divided body of people, we are powerless.
Now what exactly is it that you think I am lying about?
Gentorev
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1/17/2015 7:37:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 7:00:22 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 12/28/2014 3:35:47 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/28/2014 1:50:11 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 12/27/2014 10:04:44 PM, Gentorev wrote:

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Correct and you obviously can't see your own blindness. It makes no difference who is related to whom in the stories because ultimately we are all brothers and sisters of our forefathers for all eternity. All humans come from humans not from anything else.

I already told you I have not abandoned my God. I cannot abandon that which is part of who and what I AM. Obviously you can't see that or you simply refuse to believe it because my perception of God is different to yours.

Skyangel wrote.............Correct and you obviously can't see your own blindness.

Gentorev.........I am blind to naught my dear woman, I see clearly by the light of God"s word which illuminates all before me.

As I correctly said, you obviously cannot see your own blindness.

Skyangel wrote...............It makes no difference who is related to whom in the stories

Gentorev........ It does to all who would understand the Lord and what he has in store for us.

Obviously you find something of importance in it. Carry on with your fictional family tree. Don't let anyone stop you from pursuing your addiction.

Skyangel wrote.........because ultimately we are all brothers and sisters of our forefathers for all eternity. All humans come from humans not from anything else.

Gentorev......... So you believe that mankind was divinely created, and was not created through the process of evolution, and therefore you don't believe that the first humans had to break away from the animal ancestral parentage that dwelt within their inner most sanctuary, and rather than follow their inner animal instinct, they had to learn to decide for themselves that which was good from that which was bad, rather than running around sniffing each others bum.

Humans coming from humans is not a divine creation unless you believe humans are divine beings. I do not believe in the evolution of humans from a single cell over billions of years. The evolution of a single cell into a human does not take billions of years. It takes approx nine months in the correct environment of a human womb. I don't believe in any "first humans". I believe in the paradox of life which basically implies there is no beginning but life is an eternal cycle in which no beginning can ever be found in reality. Any beginning and end is all an illusion. That which exists simply recycles itself. Good and bad are taught to us by our parents who were taught by their parents who were taught by theirs etc etc etc.
Humans still go around sniffing whatever they can get their nose into. Then they complain when it smells bad.


Skyangel wrote..........I already told you I have not abandoned my God. I cannot abandon that which is part of who and what I AM. Obviously you can't see that or you simply refuse to believe it because my perception of God is different to yours.

Gentorev....... No! What you have said, and I believe that I can find a post in which you state that when you were young you did believe in the biblical God. And so It becomes obvious that you have now abandoned that belief and have created your own god, who is more to your liking. Now that's all OK, just stop lying to me.

I once perceived God to be an invisible Father figure in the sky. I realized that perception was a childish way to view God. It was as childish as perceiving Santa to be a magic man at the North Pole. I matured in my perception of God the same way as I matured in my perception of Santa and realized I am Santa, We are Santa, in the sense of being part of the body which promotes the whole concept of giving anonymously. The concept exists and humans promote it to make money from the concept.
These days I see God as an anthropomorphism of life in general of which I am an intricate part and it is an intricate part of me. Reality is truth which is also an intricate part of me. I am that I am. I realize we as a body of living things are God the same as we as a body of living things are also Santa. We humans are the personification of our own thoughts, ideas, concepts, etc. We create our own reality. We promote our own concepts. We are creators who are perfectly capable of creating mankind in our own image. We can create whatever we imagine we can create. We can make our own dreams come true if we work together to make them come true. Humans as a corporate body have a lot of power when working in unity. As a divided body of people, we are powerless.
Now what exactly is it that you think I am lying about?

Here you admit that the god you once believed in, you have now abandoned. Why you chose to abandoned the god that you had believed in, is totally irrelevant.

Now you say that you did not abandon the god who you saw as the biblical god, this then is a lie on your part.
Skyangel
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1/18/2015 2:29:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/17/2015 7:37:36 PM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/28/2014 7:00:22 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 12/28/2014 3:35:47 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/28/2014 1:50:11 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 12/27/2014 10:04:44 PM, Gentorev wrote:

There are none so blind as those who refuse to see.

Correct and you obviously can't see your own blindness. It makes no difference who is related to whom in the stories because ultimately we are all brothers and sisters of our forefathers for all eternity. All humans come from humans not from anything else.

I already told you I have not abandoned my God. I cannot abandon that which is part of who and what I AM. Obviously you can't see that or you simply refuse to believe it because my perception of God is different to yours.

Skyangel wrote.............Correct and you obviously can't see your own blindness.

Gentorev.........I am blind to naught my dear woman, I see clearly by the light of God"s word which illuminates all before me.

As I correctly said, you obviously cannot see your own blindness.

Skyangel wrote...............It makes no difference who is related to whom in the stories

Gentorev........ It does to all who would understand the Lord and what he has in store for us.

Obviously you find something of importance in it. Carry on with your fictional family tree. Don't let anyone stop you from pursuing your addiction.

Skyangel wrote.........because ultimately we are all brothers and sisters of our forefathers for all eternity. All humans come from humans not from anything else.

Gentorev......... So you believe that mankind was divinely created, and was not created through the process of evolution, and therefore you don't believe that the first humans had to break away from the animal ancestral parentage that dwelt within their inner most sanctuary, and rather than follow their inner animal instinct, they had to learn to decide for themselves that which was good from that which was bad, rather than running around sniffing each others bum.

Humans coming from humans is not a divine creation unless you believe humans are divine beings. I do not believe in the evolution of humans from a single cell over billions of years. The evolution of a single cell into a human does not take billions of years. It takes approx nine months in the correct environment of a human womb. I don't believe in any "first humans". I believe in the paradox of life which basically implies there is no beginning but life is an eternal cycle in which no beginning can ever be found in reality. Any beginning and end is all an illusion. That which exists simply recycles itself. Good and bad are taught to us by our parents who were taught by their parents who were taught by theirs etc etc etc.
Humans still go around sniffing whatever they can get their nose into. Then they complain when it smells bad.


Skyangel wrote..........I already told you I have not abandoned my God. I cannot abandon that which is part of who and what I AM. Obviously you can't see that or you simply refuse to believe it because my perception of God is different to yours.

Gentorev....... No! What you have said, and I believe that I can find a post in which you state that when you were young you did believe in the biblical God. And so It becomes obvious that you have now abandoned that belief and have created your own god, who is more to your liking. Now that's all OK, just stop lying to me.

I once perceived God to be an invisible Father figure in the sky. I realized that perception was a childish way to view God. It was as childish as perceiving Santa to be a magic man at the North Pole. I matured in my perception of God the same way as I matured in my perception of Santa and realized I am Santa, We are Santa, in the sense of being part of the body which promotes the whole concept of giving anonymously. The concept exists and humans promote it to make money from the concept.
These days I see God as an anthropomorphism of life in general of which I am an intricate part and it is an intricate part of me. Reality is truth which is also an intricate part of me. I am that I am. I realize we as a body of living things are God the same as we as a body of living things are also Santa. We humans are the personification of our own thoughts, ideas, concepts, etc. We create our own reality. We promote our own concepts. We are creators who are perfectly capable of creating mankind in our own image. We can create whatever we imagine we can create. We can make our own dreams come true if we work together to make them come true. Humans as a corporate body have a lot of power when working in unity. As a divided body of people, we are powerless.
Now what exactly is it that you think I am lying about?

Here you admit that the god you once believed in, you have now abandoned. Why you chose to abandoned the god that you had believed in, is totally irrelevant.

Now you say that you did not abandon the god who you saw as the biblical god, this then is a lie on your part.

No its not. It's a simple misunderstanding on your part.
If I said I once believed that Santa was a supernatural character but I grew up and abandoned that concept in favor of humans being Santa, does that mean I abandoned the concept of Santa?
What you fail to understand is that there is a childish concept of God which is the fantasy concept of the invisible man in the sky...
then there is an adult concept of God which is not an invisible man in the sky but is LIFE itself which is very real and visible.
I grew out of the childish concept and adopted the adult concept.
Kyle_the_Heretic
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1/18/2015 3:14:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Sorry, but that post was just too long to read the whole thing. But scanning through it was enough to see that it isn't any more than opinion and personal interpretation.

One question:

If Joseph, the husband of Mary, is also Cleophas, then why does John take her into his own home at the bequest of Jesus (John 19:27), when Cleophas, is alive and well? (Luke 24:18)
Thinking is extremely taxing on the gullible, and it takes hours to clear the smoke.
Gentorev
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1/20/2015 3:08:21 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/18/2015 3:14:52 PM, Kyle_the_Heretic wrote:
Sorry, but that post was just too long to read the whole thing. But scanning through it was enough to see that it isn't any more than opinion and personal interpretation.

One question:

If Joseph, the husband of Mary, is also Cleophas, then why does John take her into his own home at the bequest of Jesus (John 19:27), when Cleophas, is alive and well? (Luke 24:18)

The religious authorities in the days of Jesus, who had access to all the bills of divorce which were filed away in the temple in Jerusalem, were always looking for ways that they might trap Jesus according to his own teaching and then accuse him to the people, and it was after Jesus had been preaching that if a divorced person remarried while their original spouse was still alive, they were committing adultery. It was then that the hypocritical priests thought that they had the means whereby they could make Jesus appear to the people to have one law for himself and another for everyone else.

See John 8: 1 to 11.

Bringing forward his mother, who was among the crowd who were listening to the
great teacher who was setting Israel on fire, they said to Jesus in their most patronising voice, Teacher, this woman has been caught in the very act of adultery. (This was according to the new teaching of Jesus) In our law Moses commanded that such a woman must be stoned to death. Now, what do you say? They said this in order to trap Jesus and accuse him to the people.

Jesus knew what those hypocrites were up to, those hypocrites who thought nothing of stoning the innocent Stephen to death, and who were bound by the law of Moses to stone this woman to death if she had indeed been caught in the very act of sexual intercourse with a man other than He to who she was legally married at that time.

Jesus then turned the tables on them by saying, "He who is without sin may cast the first stone."

Then he bent down and wrote something in the dust, Perhaps he may have written, "As ye judge, so shall ye be judged." Most men in those days who had been given by Moses the right to issue their wives with a bill of divorce, had done so and according to the new teaching of Jesus would have been as guilty as the woman that they were accusing, and the hypocrites knowing full well that the woman had not broken the Law of Moses and was innocent of any crime according to their own teachings, they were forced to walk away with their tails between their legs, thereby admitting to the people that they were not without sin.

Jesus then turned to his mother and asked, "Is there no one left to condemn you?" No one Lord she answered. "Well then," said Jesus, "I do not condemn you either. Go, but don"t sin again," and it was for this reason that the mother of Jesus chose to remain separate from her husband Cleophas and his children, James the younger, Simeon and Jude, and the reason why, on the cross, Jesus entrusted his mother, "Mary the wife of Cleophas," into the care of his beloved disciple John.

Although we know near to nothing about Joseph the half brother to Jesus, there is more that a greater probability that he was Joseph from Arimathea, who laid Jesus in his own "FAMILY TOMB THAT HAD NEVER BEEN USED," suggesting that His Father, the first husband of Mary, was still alive. It seem strange that in a book which is so condensed, one would bother to add the little piece of trivia, that the tomb in which Jesus was laid, was the FAMILY TOMB OF JOSEPH WHICH HAD NEVER BEEN USED,, when saying, He was buried in a tomb close by, would have sufficed.

Young John who was surnamed "MARK" which name means "Hammer, or The Hammerer," has been identified with young John the beloved disciple who was entrusted with the care of Mary the mother of Jesus, who had surnamed him "Son of Thunder."

It is written in Acts, that it was the custom of the apostles, after the death of Jesus to meet at the house of his mother Mary to worship together. then after Peter had been miraculously released from prison, he ran straight to the house where he knew the believers would be gathered in prayer for his safety: Straight to the house of Mary the mother of John, who was surnamed "MARK".

Jesus was the biological son of Mary and her half brother, Joseph the son of Alexander Helios/HELI, and this Joseph is not to be confused with Joseph the son of Jacob, whose genealogy is recorded in Matthew.

The Greek [anepsios] appears only once in the New Testament. In Young"s Literal Translation its meaning is "Nephew," Salute you doth Aristarchus, my fellow-captive, and Marcus, the nephew of Barnabas. In the King James Version, it is translated "Sister"son." Marcus, sister" son to Barnabus.

After the death of Jesus, Joseph the Levite (Son of Heli) from Cyprus, surnamed "Barnanas" by the disciples, took his half sister Mary and young John who was surnamed "MARK" up into the land of Pamphilia, where in the town of Ephesus, the grave sites of Mary and John, can still be visited to this day.

If you wish to know more about the life of Mary the obedient hand maid to her indwelling ancestral spirit, who chose for her, the biological father of Jesus, in who were the genetic qualities of all the spirits of good people who had fallen asleep in righteousness after paying the blood price for their inherited sin, who were judged in the flesh as all are judged and were separated from the unrighteous dead and were gathered to the living evolving spirit of our ancestral Father Enoch, within the bosom of Abraham, over which spirits, death had no more power, then please feel free to ask.
Kyle_the_Heretic
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1/20/2015 3:35:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/20/2015 3:08:21 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 1/18/2015 3:14:52 PM, Kyle_the_Heretic wrote:
Sorry, but that post was just too long to read the whole thing. But scanning through it was enough to see that it isn't any more than opinion and personal interpretation.

One question:

If Joseph, the husband of Mary, is also Cleophas, then why does John take her into his own home at the bequest of Jesus (John 19:27), when Cleophas, is alive and well? (Luke 24:18)

The religious authorities in the days of Jesus, who had access to all the bills of divorce which were filed away in the temple in Jerusalem, were always looking for ways that they might trap Jesus according to his own teaching and then accuse him to the people, and it was after Jesus had been preaching that if a divorced person remarried while their original spouse was still alive, they were committing adultery. It was then that the hypocritical priests thought that they had the means whereby they could make Jesus appear to the people to have one law for himself and another for everyone else.

See John 8: 1 to 11.

Bringing forward his mother, who was among the crowd who were listening to the
great teacher who was setting Israel on fire, they said to Jesus in their most patronising voice, Teacher, this woman has been caught in the very act of adultery. (This was according to the new teaching of Jesus) In our law Moses commanded that such a woman must be stoned to death. Now, what do you say? They said this in order to trap Jesus and accuse him to the people.

Jesus knew what those hypocrites were up to, those hypocrites who thought nothing of stoning the innocent Stephen to death, and who were bound by the law of Moses to stone this woman to death if she had indeed been caught in the very act of sexual intercourse with a man other than He to who she was legally married at that time.

Jesus then turned the tables on them by saying, "He who is without sin may cast the first stone."

Then he bent down and wrote something in the dust, Perhaps he may have written, "As ye judge, so shall ye be judged." Most men in those days who had been given by Moses the right to issue their wives with a bill of divorce, had done so and according to the new teaching of Jesus would have been as guilty as the woman that they were accusing, and the hypocrites knowing full well that the woman had not broken the Law of Moses and was innocent of any crime according to their own teachings, they were forced to walk away with their tails between their legs, thereby admitting to the people that they were not without sin.

Jesus then turned to his mother and asked, "Is there no one left to condemn you?" No one Lord she answered. "Well then," said Jesus, "I do not condemn you either. Go, but don"t sin again," and it was for this reason that the mother of Jesus chose to remain separate from her husband Cleophas and his children, James the younger, Simeon and Jude, and the reason why, on the cross, Jesus entrusted his mother, "Mary the wife of Cleophas," into the care of his beloved disciple John.

Although we know near to nothing about Joseph the half brother to Jesus, there is more that a greater probability that he was Joseph from Arimathea, who laid Jesus in his own "FAMILY TOMB THAT HAD NEVER BEEN USED," suggesting that His Father, the first husband of Mary, was still alive. It seem strange that in a book which is so condensed, one would bother to add the little piece of trivia, that the tomb in which Jesus was laid, was the FAMILY TOMB OF JOSEPH WHICH HAD NEVER BEEN USED,, when saying, He was buried in a tomb close by, would have sufficed.

Young John who was surnamed "MARK" which name means "Hammer, or The Hammerer," has been identified with young John the beloved disciple who was entrusted with the care of Mary the mother of Jesus, who had surnamed him "Son of Thunder."

It is written in Acts, that it was the custom of the apostles, after the death of Jesus to meet at the house of his mother Mary to worship together. then after Peter had been miraculously released from prison, he ran straight to the house where he knew the believers would be gathered in prayer for his safety: Straight to the house of Mary the mother of John, who was surnamed "MARK".

Jesus was the biological son of Mary and her half brother, Joseph the son of Alexander Helios/HELI, and this Joseph is not to be confused with Joseph the son of Jacob, whose genealogy is recorded in Matthew.

The Greek [anepsios] appears only once in the New Testament. In Young"s Literal Translation its meaning is "Nephew," Salute you doth Aristarchus, my fellow-captive, and Marcus, the nephew of Barnabas. In the King James Version, it is translated "Sister"son." Marcus, sister" son to Barnabus.

After the death of Jesus, Joseph the Levite (Son of Heli) from Cyprus, surnamed "Barnanas" by the disciples, took his half sister Mary and young John who was surnamed "MARK" up into the land of Pamphilia, where in the town of Ephesus, the grave sites of Mary and John, can still be visited to this day.

If you wish to know more about the life of Mary the obedient hand maid to her indwelling ancestral spirit, who chose for her, the biological father of Jesus, in who were the genetic qualities of all the spirits of good people who had fallen asleep in righteousness after paying the blood price for their inherited sin, who were judged in the flesh as all are judged and were separated from the unrighteous dead and were gathered to the living evolving spirit of our ancestral Father Enoch, within the bosom of Abraham, over which spirits, death had no more power, then please feel free to ask.

I'm sorry, but you're taking a whole lot of liberty with events in the Bible, with absolutely nothing substantial to back it up. I am unable to agree with you.
Thinking is extremely taxing on the gullible, and it takes hours to clear the smoke.
Gentorev
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1/20/2015 4:14:24 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/20/2015 3:35:05 AM, Kyle_the_Heretic wrote:
At 1/20/2015 3:08:21 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 1/18/2015 3:14:52 PM, Kyle_the_Heretic wrote:
Sorry, but that post was just too long to read the whole thing. But scanning through it was enough to see that it isn't any more than opinion and personal interpretation.

One question:

If Joseph, the husband of Mary, is also Cleophas, then why does John take her into his own home at the bequest of Jesus (John 19:27), when Cleophas, is alive and well? (Luke 24:18)

The religious authorities in the days of Jesus, who had access to all the bills of divorce which were filed away in the temple in Jerusalem, were always looking for ways that they might trap Jesus according to his own teaching and then accuse him to the people, and it was after Jesus had been preaching that if a divorced person remarried while their original spouse was still alive, they were committing adultery. It was then that the hypocritical priests thought that they had the means whereby they could make Jesus appear to the people to have one law for himself and another for everyone else.

See John 8: 1 to 11.

Bringing forward his mother, who was among the crowd who were listening to the
great teacher who was setting Israel on fire, they said to Jesus in their most patronising voice, Teacher, this woman has been caught in the very act of adultery. (This was according to the new teaching of Jesus) In our law Moses commanded that such a woman must be stoned to death. Now, what do you say? They said this in order to trap Jesus and accuse him to the people.

Jesus knew what those hypocrites were up to, those hypocrites who thought nothing of stoning the innocent Stephen to death, and who were bound by the law of Moses to stone this woman to death if she had indeed been caught in the very act of sexual intercourse with a man other than He to who she was legally married at that time.

Jesus then turned the tables on them by saying, "He who is without sin may cast the first stone."

Then he bent down and wrote something in the dust, Perhaps he may have written, "As ye judge, so shall ye be judged." Most men in those days who had been given by Moses the right to issue their wives with a bill of divorce, had done so and according to the new teaching of Jesus would have been as guilty as the woman that they were accusing, and the hypocrites knowing full well that the woman had not broken the Law of Moses and was innocent of any crime according to their own teachings, they were forced to walk away with their tails between their legs, thereby admitting to the people that they were not without sin.

Jesus then turned to his mother and asked, "Is there no one left to condemn you?" No one Lord she answered. "Well then," said Jesus, "I do not condemn you either. Go, but don"t sin again," and it was for this reason that the mother of Jesus chose to remain separate from her husband Cleophas and his children, James the younger, Simeon and Jude, and the reason why, on the cross, Jesus entrusted his mother, "Mary the wife of Cleophas," into the care of his beloved disciple John.

Although we know near to nothing about Joseph the half brother to Jesus, there is more that a greater probability that he was Joseph from Arimathea, who laid Jesus in his own "FAMILY TOMB THAT HAD NEVER BEEN USED," suggesting that His Father, the first husband of Mary, was still alive. It seem strange that in a book which is so condensed, one would bother to add the little piece of trivia, that the tomb in which Jesus was laid, was the FAMILY TOMB OF JOSEPH WHICH HAD NEVER BEEN USED,, when saying, He was buried in a tomb close by, would have sufficed.

Young John who was surnamed "MARK" which name means "Hammer, or The Hammerer," has been identified with young John the beloved disciple who was entrusted with the care of Mary the mother of Jesus, who had surnamed him "Son of Thunder."

It is written in Acts, that it was the custom of the apostles, after the death of Jesus to meet at the house of his mother Mary to worship together. then after Peter had been miraculously released from prison, he ran straight to the house where he knew the believers would be gathered in prayer for his safety: Straight to the house of Mary the mother of John, who was surnamed "MARK".

Jesus was the biological son of Mary and her half brother, Joseph the son of Alexander Helios/HELI, and this Joseph is not to be confused with Joseph the son of Jacob, whose genealogy is recorded in Matthew.

The Greek [anepsios] appears only once in the New Testament. In Young"s Literal Translation its meaning is "Nephew," Salute you doth Aristarchus, my fellow-captive, and Marcus, the nephew of Barnabas. In the King James Version, it is translated "Sister"son." Marcus, sister" son to Barnabus.

After the death of Jesus, Joseph the Levite (Son of Heli) from Cyprus, surnamed "Barnanas" by the disciples, took his half sister Mary and young John who was surnamed "MARK" up into the land of Pamphilia, where in the town of Ephesus, the grave sites of Mary and John, can still be visited to this day.

If you wish to know more about the life of Mary the obedient hand maid to her indwelling ancestral spirit, who chose for her, the biological father of Jesus, in who were the genetic qualities of all the spirits of good people who had fallen asleep in righteousness after paying the blood price for their inherited sin, who were judged in the flesh as all are judged and were separated from the unrighteous dead and were gathered to the living evolving spirit of our ancestral Father Enoch, within the bosom of Abraham, over which spirits, death had no more power, then please feel free to ask.

I'm sorry, but you're taking a whole lot of liberty with events in the Bible, with absolutely nothing substantial to back it up. I am unable to agree with you.

Do you honestly believe, that if that woman was actually caught having intercourse with a man other than her legal husband, that the Jewish authorities would not have been forced to have her stoned to death?

And what other excuse can you give for Jesus to place his mother into the care of his beloved disciple John, when she had a husband, "Cleophas" two living biological sons plus two step-sons and daughters?

Why do we know next to nothing of her second son, who was named after his biological father, "Joseph the son of Jacob?

Why would a man by the name "Joseph' bury Jesus in his own family tomb that had never been used? If it was his own family tomb, and it had never been used, does this not suggest that the father of this Joseph was still alive at that time?

If this Joseph, who buried Jesus in his own family tomb that had never been used, was the brother of Jesus, does this not suggest that Mary the wife of Cleophas, who sired James the brother of the Lord, had remarried while her original husband was still alive?

What do you deduce from all this circumstantial evidence?
Kyle_the_Heretic
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1/20/2015 8:26:11 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/20/2015 4:14:24 AM, Gentorev wrote:

I'm sorry, but you're taking a whole lot of liberty with events in the Bible, with absolutely nothing substantial to back it up. I am unable to agree with you.

Do you honestly believe, that if that woman was actually caught having intercourse with a man other than her legal husband, that the Jewish authorities would not have been forced to have her stoned to death?

And what other excuse can you give for Jesus to place his mother into the care of his beloved disciple John, when she had a husband, "Cleophas" two living biological sons plus two step-sons and daughters?

Why do we know next to nothing of her second son, who was named after his biological father, "Joseph the son of Jacob?

Why would a man by the name "Joseph' bury Jesus in his own family tomb that had never been used? If it was his own family tomb, and it had never been used, does this not suggest that the father of this Joseph was still alive at that time?

If this Joseph, who buried Jesus in his own family tomb that had never been used, was the brother of Jesus, does this not suggest that Mary the wife of Cleophas, who sired James the brother of the Lord, had remarried while her original husband was still alive?

What do you deduce from all this circumstantial evidence?

Circumstantial, no. Purely interpretive, yes.
Thinking is extremely taxing on the gullible, and it takes hours to clear the smoke.