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Question for theists (not deists)

SNP1
Posts: 2,406
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12/24/2014 1:23:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Humans have been around for 2.2 million years (recognizable), we homo sapiens have been around for 250,000 years.

As we can tell by looking at our recorded history, we are a superstitious species.

How old do you think religion is? The idea of there being gods? 100,000? 1million?

The oldest religion that is still around today is Hinduism, and it is not even 10,000 years old.

For thousands upon thousands, maybe even millions of years, people have had this idea of there being a god.

Why do you think that the god you believe in, which is from the past few thousand years, is the real god? Why do you think that your god would wait over 200,000 years before coming in contact with a species that might be able to understand it's message? What makes you so sure?
#TheApatheticNihilistPartyofAmerica
#WarOnDDO
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,684
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12/24/2014 1:31:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 1:23:19 PM, SNP1 wrote:
Humans have been around for 2.2 million years (recognizable), we homo sapiens have been around for 250,000 years.

As we can tell by looking at our recorded history, we are a superstitious species.

How old do you think religion is? The idea of there being gods? 100,000? 1million?

The oldest religion that is still around today is Hinduism, and it is not even 10,000 years old.

For thousands upon thousands, maybe even millions of years, people have had this idea of there being a god.

Why do you think that the god you believe in, which is from the past few thousand years, is the real god? Why do you think that your god would wait over 200,000 years before coming in contact with a species that might be able to understand it's message? What makes you so sure?

Islam is connected to the other Abrhamic faiths, the bible has made mention of the prophet Muhammad's coming.A phenomena that only Islam can explain. Many pieces of Archaeological evidence prove many claims of Quranic events (if you want to debate on this then be my guest). Islam is the middle path in my opinion. It reasonably balances faith and proof, proof inspires faith and I have faith in the proof. Scientific evidence is only one part of the picture. One can prove Islam using logical and historical arguments by showing how it is logically sound for God (or Allah) to exist and showing how Quranic events are compatible with historical and Archaeological evidence.
If an argument I do not understand shows up then I have faith, but it is not blind because I have proof that inspires said.

Well that's my reason at least. I could elaborate more if you want.
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
YassineB
Posts: 1,003
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12/24/2014 2:50:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 1:23:19 PM, SNP1 wrote:
Humans have been around for 2.2 million years (recognizable), we homo sapiens have been around for 250,000 years.

As we can tell by looking at our recorded history, we are a superstitious species.

How old do you think religion is? The idea of there being gods? 100,000? 1million?

The oldest religion that is still around today is Hinduism, and it is not even 10,000 years old.

For thousands upon thousands, maybe even millions of years, people have had this idea of there being a god.

Why do you think that the god you believe in, which is from the past few thousand years, is the real god? Why do you think that your god would wait over 200,000 years before coming in contact with a species that might be able to understand it's message? What makes you so sure?

- According to the Islamic Tradition, there has been 124,000 Prophets that visited every nation from Adam to Muhammad.

> "And We certainly sent into every nation a messenger, [saying]: "Worship Allah and avoid false gods." (16:36)

> "And there was no nation but that there had passed within it a warner (a messenger)". (35:34)

> "Muhammad is no more than a messenger: many Were the messenger that passed away before him." (3:144)

> "Christ the son of Mary was no more than a messenger; many were the messengers that passed away before him. His mother was a woman of truth." (5:75)

> Muhammad said: " [Prophets] are a hundred and twenty four thousands, among them three hundred and fifteen Messengers"

==>> Don't you think 124,000 Prophets are rather quite enough.!
Current Debates In Voting Period:

- The Qur'an We Have Today is Not What Muhammad Dictated Verbatim. Vs. @Envisage:
http://www.debate.org...

- Drawing Contest. Vs. @purpleduck:
http://www.debate.org...

"It is perfectly permissible to vote on sources without reading them" bluesteel.
ChristianPunk
Posts: 1,710
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12/24/2014 2:56:45 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 1:23:19 PM, SNP1 wrote:
Humans have been around for 2.2 million years (recognizable), we homo sapiens have been around for 250,000 years.

As we can tell by looking at our recorded history, we are a superstitious species.

How old do you think religion is? The idea of there being gods? 100,000? 1million?

The oldest religion that is still around today is Hinduism, and it is not even 10,000 years old.

For thousands upon thousands, maybe even millions of years, people have had this idea of there being a god.

Why do you think that the god you believe in, which is from the past few thousand years, is the real god? Why do you think that your god would wait over 200,000 years before coming in contact with a species that might be able to understand it's message? What makes you so sure?

I believe that my God left himself able to be seen, but it would take a being of rational logic or just a way to interpret, to come in. It's like learning morse code before understanding the message in morse.

Problem is, a language can be distorted in context and other sections. So if the God or Gods do or not exist, then that's it. We can only say we tried by coming with our conclusions and methods.
Fatihah
Posts: 7,762
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12/24/2014 3:25:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 1:23:19 PM, SNP1 wrote:
Humans have been around for 2.2 million years (recognizable), we homo sapiens have been around for 250,000 years.

As we can tell by looking at our recorded history, we are a superstitious species.

How old do you think religion is? The idea of there being gods? 100,000? 1million?

The oldest religion that is still around today is Hinduism, and it is not even 10,000 years old.

For thousands upon thousands, maybe even millions of years, people have had this idea of there being a god.

Why do you think that the god you believe in, which is from the past few thousand years, is the real god? Why do you think that your god would wait over 200,000 years before coming in contact with a species that might be able to understand it's message? What makes you so sure?

Response: The oldest and first religion is Islam. For Islam by definition means submission to the will of Allah (God). Therefore, since all of creation, including the first human, was created under the authority of Allah, then by definition, all of creation was born into Islam. Even you, was born into Islam. Thus Islam is the original and first religion.
However, a Muslim is one who submits to Allah's will. So while you were born into Islam, you reject Allah as God. Therefore, you are not a Muslim and your religion is not Islam. The same applies to anyone who rejects the teachings of Islam.

As for evidence that Allah exist and Islam is the true religion, the evidence is provided in the Qur'an challenge.
tabularasa
Posts: 200
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12/24/2014 3:46:49 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 1:23:19 PM, SNP1 wrote:
Humans have been around for 2.2 million years (recognizable), we homo sapiens have been around for 250,000 years.

As we can tell by looking at our recorded history, we are a superstitious species.

How old do you think religion is? The idea of there being gods? 100,000? 1million?

The oldest religion that is still around today is Hinduism, and it is not even 10,000 years old.

For thousands upon thousands, maybe even millions of years, people have had this idea of there being a god.

Why do you think that the god you believe in, which is from the past few thousand years, is the real god? Why do you think that your god would wait over 200,000 years before coming in contact with a species that might be able to understand it's message? What makes you so sure?

I do not know how old religion is.

Define "superstition."

I do not know why God would wait for so long to contact humans. Perhaps he did not wait that long. Perhaps he has been in contact with humans before in some way. I do not know.

I think that all people who are seeking some form of God are generally seeking the same God. I believe--I do not know with 100% absolute certainty--that for some reason God chose to become man. I am not perfect and infallible, and cannot claim monopoly on the truth. I say this with humility. I believe there may be a God and I choose to love God and subject myself to His will through faith. If my religion is a chinese fire drill, then this is the chance that I take. I have faith that God does exist and that he loves all of us, no matter who we are, what we have done, or what we believe.
1. I already googled it.

2. Give me an argument. Spell it out. "You're wrong," is not an argument.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,641
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12/24/2014 4:50:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 1:31:09 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Many pieces of Archaeological evidence prove many claims of Quranic events (if you want to debate on this then be my guest).

There's no debate, that is simply not true.

Islam is the middle path in my opinion. It reasonably balances faith and proof, proof inspires faith and I have faith in the proof. Scientific evidence is only one part of the picture. One can prove Islam using logical and historical arguments by showing how it is logically sound for God (or Allah) to exist and showing how Quranic events are compatible with historical and Archaeological evidence.
If an argument I do not understand shows up then I have faith, but it is not blind because I have proof that inspires said.

Well that's my reason at least. I could elaborate more if you want.

You've said nothing at all, other than to make some ridiculous claims without a shred of evidence. Yes, you have nothing but blind faith.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,684
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12/24/2014 4:53:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 4:50:17 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/24/2014 1:31:09 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Many pieces of Archaeological evidence prove many claims of Quranic events (if you want to debate on this then be my guest).

There's no debate, that is simply not true.

Islam is the middle path in my opinion. It reasonably balances faith and proof, proof inspires faith and I have faith in the proof. Scientific evidence is only one part of the picture. One can prove Islam using logical and historical arguments by showing how it is logically sound for God (or Allah) to exist and showing how Quranic events are compatible with historical and Archaeological evidence.
If an argument I do not understand shows up then I have faith, but it is not blind because I have proof that inspires said.

Well that's my reason at least. I could elaborate more if you want.

You've said nothing at all, other than to make some ridiculous claims without a shred of evidence. Yes, you have nothing but blind faith.

I mentioned my evidence (archaeological evidence) and then mentioned that if you want me to elaborate then be my guest. Not all faith is blind faith, Faith is required to believe or disbelieve in anything. If you still say I had no evidence then simply are not paying attention.
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,684
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12/24/2014 4:54:26 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 4:53:17 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
At 12/24/2014 4:50:17 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/24/2014 1:31:09 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Many pieces of Archaeological evidence prove many claims of Quranic events (if you want to debate on this then be my guest).

There's no debate, that is simply not true.

Islam is the middle path in my opinion. It reasonably balances faith and proof, proof inspires faith and I have faith in the proof. Scientific evidence is only one part of the picture. One can prove Islam using logical and historical arguments by showing how it is logically sound for God (or Allah) to exist and showing how Quranic events are compatible with historical and Archaeological evidence.
If an argument I do not understand shows up then I have faith, but it is not blind because I have proof that inspires said.

Well that's my reason at least. I could elaborate more if you want.

You've said nothing at all, other than to make some ridiculous claims without a shred of evidence. Yes, you have nothing but blind faith.

I mentioned my evidence (archaeological evidence) and then mentioned that if you want me to elaborate then be my guest. Not all faith is blind faith, Faith is required to believe or disbelieve in anything. If you still say I had no evidence then simply are not paying attention.

typo: "If you still say I had no evidence then you simply are not paying attention."
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,641
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12/24/2014 5:02:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 4:53:17 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
At 12/24/2014 4:50:17 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/24/2014 1:31:09 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Many pieces of Archaeological evidence prove many claims of Quranic events (if you want to debate on this then be my guest).

There's no debate, that is simply not true.

Islam is the middle path in my opinion. It reasonably balances faith and proof, proof inspires faith and I have faith in the proof. Scientific evidence is only one part of the picture. One can prove Islam using logical and historical arguments by showing how it is logically sound for God (or Allah) to exist and showing how Quranic events are compatible with historical and Archaeological evidence.
If an argument I do not understand shows up then I have faith, but it is not blind because I have proof that inspires said.

Well that's my reason at least. I could elaborate more if you want.

You've said nothing at all, other than to make some ridiculous claims without a shred of evidence. Yes, you have nothing but blind faith.

I mentioned my evidence (archaeological evidence) and then mentioned that if you want me to elaborate then be my guest. Not all faith is blind faith, Faith is required to believe or disbelieve in anything. If you still say I had no evidence then simply are not paying attention.

It is true, you have no evidence to substantiate your claims. Sorry.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,684
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12/24/2014 5:05:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 5:02:44 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/24/2014 4:53:17 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
At 12/24/2014 4:50:17 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/24/2014 1:31:09 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:
Many pieces of Archaeological evidence prove many claims of Quranic events (if you want to debate on this then be my guest).

There's no debate, that is simply not true.

Islam is the middle path in my opinion. It reasonably balances faith and proof, proof inspires faith and I have faith in the proof. Scientific evidence is only one part of the picture. One can prove Islam using logical and historical arguments by showing how it is logically sound for God (or Allah) to exist and showing how Quranic events are compatible with historical and Archaeological evidence.
If an argument I do not understand shows up then I have faith, but it is not blind because I have proof that inspires said.

Well that's my reason at least. I could elaborate more if you want.

You've said nothing at all, other than to make some ridiculous claims without a shred of evidence. Yes, you have nothing but blind faith.

I mentioned my evidence (archaeological evidence) and then mentioned that if you want me to elaborate then be my guest. Not all faith is blind faith, Faith is required to believe or disbelieve in anything. If you still say I had no evidence then simply are not paying attention.

It is true, you have no evidence to substantiate your claims. Sorry.

Like I said before evidence was shown, you just block your ears in denial, if you want to debate on this than be my guest rather then wasting your time on starting a pointless flame war
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,641
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12/24/2014 7:50:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 5:05:03 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:

Like I said before evidence was shown, you just block your ears in denial, if you want to debate on this than be my guest rather then wasting your time on starting a pointless flame war

I can only conclude that you are blatantly lying, you have produced no evidence whatsoever.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
UtherPenguin
Posts: 3,684
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12/24/2014 8:40:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 7:50:42 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/24/2014 5:05:03 PM, UtherPenguin wrote:

Like I said before evidence was shown, you just block your ears in denial, if you want to debate on this than be my guest rather then wasting your time on starting a pointless flame war

I can only conclude that you are blatantly lying, you have produced no evidence whatsoever.

You still persist on arguing? This forum isn't the place to debate its in the actual debate and opinion section. But here is an argument I've made in a debate just recently:

. Once more the three Abrahamic faiths all acknowledge Noah as a prophet of God. However each of the faiths contrasts in their views on how the flood occurred.
Since the Christian story of Noah"s Ark was written in the Old Testament the Jewish and Christian views on Noah"s Ark are very, very similar. However the part of the story that matters to this argument the Jewish views and Christian views SHARE the identically.
According to the Christian/ Jewish views of Noah"s Ark Noah was a prophet who preached to the people of earth for 500 years. In that 500 years he makes little progress to the people as they still remain corrupt and fail to repent. It is then that God tells Noah to build and Ark over a period of 150 years. It is in this period of 150 that is humanity"s last chance to repent. However in those 150 years few actually repent. It is then that God releases a Deluge on the Earth that flooded every mountain. After the flood subsided the Ark landed in Mount Ararat in the Armenian Highlands.
This story contradicts with many forms of Archeological research. For one archeological evidence shows that it was scientifically impossible for a worldwide flood to have occurred when Noah was alive. As well as the fact that Mount Ararat is a very young geological formation and given the biblical timeline it is incompatible with the formation of Mount Ararat.
Contrast that with the Muslim perspective of the story of Noah"s Ark. The Quran states that the flood was at only a local scale, affecting only the region of "Thamud" which Noah was preaching to. And this does seem more logical if one thinks of it: Why would God flood the entire world and destroy the habitat of hundreds of thousands of innocent animals for the corrupt actions of one region of the earth?
The Quran states that Noah"s ark instead landed in Mount Judi in modern day Turkey. Once more archeological evidence shows remnants of a structure with the same dimensions as described in the Quran (also known as the "Durupinar site"). However similar efforts to find evidence of the Ark in Mount Ararat had been tried and all of those attempts failed find full evidence of such a site.

sources:
1. http://christianity.about.com......
2. https://www.youtube.com......
3. https://www.youtube.com......
4. https://www.youtube.com......
5. http://en.wikipedia.org......
"Praise Allah."
~YYW
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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12/24/2014 8:42:45 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/24/2014 1:23:19 PM, SNP1 wrote:
Humans have been around for 2.2 million years (recognizable), we homo sapiens have been around for 250,000 years.

As we can tell by looking at our recorded history, we are a superstitious species.

How old do you think religion is? The idea of there being gods? 100,000? 1million?

The oldest religion that is still around today is Hinduism, and it is not even 10,000 years old.

For thousands upon thousands, maybe even millions of years, people have had this idea of there being a god.

Why do you think that the god you believe in, which is from the past few thousand years, is the real god? Why do you think that your god would wait over 200,000 years before coming in contact with a species that might be able to understand it's message? What makes you so sure?

Whoever told you that man has been around for 2.2 million years has no idea who the Truth is.