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FriarHavok
Posts: 3
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12/28/2014 4:33:43 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
To tell the truth I've been debating with dad on this, he says that Jihad is a mainstream idea were a person commits an act of murder and is allowed to go to heaven. And now he is blatantly stereotyping Muslims and that gets me upset because my friend Amnah is muslim, I need to find a loophole in this argument to shove in my dads face because, i cant seem to find any.
dee-em
Posts: 6,444
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12/28/2014 5:11:27 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 4:33:43 AM, FriarHavok wrote:
To tell the truth I've been debating with dad on this, he says that Jihad is a mainstream idea were a person commits an act of murder and is allowed to go to heaven. And now he is blatantly stereotyping Muslims and that gets me upset because my friend Amnah is muslim, I need to find a loophole in this argument to shove in my dads face because, i cant seem to find any.

It's definitely not about commiting murder. You can disabuse your father of that notion.

The meaning of Jihad is straight-forward, struggle or resisting, but the interpretation can vary greatly. It's a complicated subject. Maybe you can point him to the Wikipedia article:

http://en.wikipedia.org...

If your friend is a Muslim, why not (delicately) ask him to explain it to you?

Alternatively you can wait for one of the Muslim posters here to give you some advice.
YassineB
Posts: 1,003
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12/28/2014 7:50:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 4:33:43 AM, FriarHavok wrote:
To tell the truth I've been debating with dad on this, he says that Jihad is a mainstream idea were a person commits an act of murder and is allowed to go to heaven. And now he is blatantly stereotyping Muslims and that gets me upset because my friend Amnah is muslim, I need to find a loophole in this argument to shove in my dads face because, i cant seem to find any.

- Jihad is one of the ~25 Branches of Jurisprudence in Islamic Law (Shari'a Law), & it's a very vast & expanded concept.
==>> Jihad means generally Struggle in all aspects of Life. It is to Strive for Good or against Evil in the cause of Allah:
* "And those who strive [do Jihad] in Our (cause),- We will certainly guide them to our Paths: For verily Allah is with those who do right." (29:69)
* "So obey not the disbelievers, but strive [do Jihad] against them (by preaching) with the utmost endeavour, with it (the Quran)." (25:52)
* "Invite (all) to the Way of your Lord with wisdom and beautiful preaching; and argue with them in ways that are best and most gracious" (16:125)
* A man said to the Prophet, "Shall I participate in Jihad?" The Prophet said, "Are your parents living?" The man said, "Yes." the Prophet said, "Do Jihad for their benefit (i.e. in looking after them and being at their service.)." [^Bukhari #5372]
* The Prophet said: "The one who looks after a widow or a poor person is like a Mujahid who fights for Allah's Cause, or like him who performs prayers all the night and fasts all the day." [^Bukhari #5353]
* The Prophet said: "The Mujahid is one who strives against his own soul."" [^at-Tarmithi #1621]
* He also said: "Whoever goes out seeking knowledge, then he is in Allah's cause until he returns." [^at-Tarmidhi #2647]

==>> Here is a chart of how Jihad is seen according to the Islamic Tradition.
----Greater Jihad: (al-Jihad al-Akbar)
------------Struggle with the Self (Jihad an-Nafs).
--------------------Struggle for Knowledge (Jihad al-'Ilm): endeavour to seek Knowledge.
--------------------Struggle through Action (Jihad al-'Amal): endeavour to Act upon Knowledge.
--------------------Struggle to Preach (Jihad ad-Da'wah): endeavour to Preach & Teach Knowledge
--------------------Struggle for Patience (Jihad as-Sabr): endeavour to have Patience.
------------Struggle against the Self (Jihad ash-Shaytan)
--------------------Struggle against Doubts (Jihad al-Shubha): struggle against Doubts in Belief & Intellect.
--------------------Struggle against Desires (Jihad ash-Shahwa): struggle against dispraised & unlawful Desires.
----Lesser Jihad (al-Jihad al-Asghar):
------------With the Heart (Bil-Qalb) [ Recognising Oppression & Evil in the Heart <<< An Obligation onto every muslim ]
------------With the Tongue (Bil-Lisan) [ Fighting Oppression & Evil with Knowledge (Intellect) <<< Only an Obligation onto the People of Knowledge ]
------------With Possession (Bil-Mal) [ Supporting those that fight Oppression & Evil <<< Only an Obligation onto those with means ]
------------With Force (Bil-Yad was-Sayf): [ Fighting with Force Oppression & Evil <<< Only an Obligation onto the People of Authority ]
--------------------Jihad by the Hand (Bil-Yad) [ Fighting injustice, oppression & Evil with law enforcement <<< by the Government ]
--------------------Jihad by the Sword (Military Jihad) (Bil-Sayf) [ Military campaigns <<< can only be sanctioned by a Legitimate Caliphate or the Head of State ]
----------------------------Oppression & Unlawful Warfare (Jihad al-Baghy) [ Fighting bandits, gangs, militias. . . ]
----------------------------Defensive Jihad (Jihad ad-Daf')
------------------------------------Emergency Defence (an-Nafir al-'Am) [ during an occupation or under attack. ]
------------------------------------Emergency Support (Jihad an-Nusra) [ for neighbouring muslims who are occupied or under attack. ]
----------------------------Offensive Jihad (Jihad at-Talab)
------------------------------------Conquest (Jihad al-Fath) [ Only Legitimate when the adversary country is not under any treaty with muslims (meaning the two are in a state of War), & does not allow for Freedom of Religion (meaning it does not allow for the basics of Islam to be practiced or taught, or does not allow freedom of Religion in general) ]
------------------------------------Military Support (to Muslims) (Jihad an-Nusra) [ Only Legitimate when the adversary country is not under any treat with muslims, while it oppresses its muslim citizens & does not allow them to immigrate; Or while it gives asylum to Spies (against muslims) & refuses to hand them to muslims, Or while it holds muslim War prisoners & refuses to exchange them or ransom them. ]
------------------------------------Coming to Aid (Jihad al-'Awn) [ It's when people of the book (or any people as some Jurists have stated) are oppressed by a foreign government not under any treaty with muslims, then it is the obligation on muslims to come to aid & save these people from their oppressors. ]

- Jihad is also associated with Martyrdom, so whoever dies while doing Jihad (in Struggle), dies a Martyr.

* The Prophet said: "Whoever is killed protecting his property, he is a martyr. Whoever is killed protecting his family, he is a martyr. Whoever is killed protecting his religion, he is a martyr. Whoever is killed protecting himself, he is a martyr.'" [^an-Nisai #4095]
* He also said: "Whoever is killed defending himself against injustice, he is a martyr." [^an-Nisai #4096]
* He also said: "Dying in a strange land is martyrdom." [^Ibn Majah #1681]
* He also said: "Whoever dies from a sickness dies as a martyr." [^Ibn Majah #1683]
* A man asked the Prophet, when he had put his leg in the stirrup: "Which kind of Jihad is best?'" He said: "a word of truth spoken before an unjust ruler." [^an-Nisai #4209]
* He also said: "He who supplicates Allah sincerely for martyrdom, Allah will elevate him to the station of the martyrs, even if he dies on his bed." [^Muslim #1321]
* He also said: "The one who is killed in the cause of Allah is a martyr; the one who drowns in the cause of Allah is a martyr, the one who dies of an abdominal complaint in the cause of Allah is a martyr; the one who dies of the plague in the cause of Allah is a martyr; and the woman who dies in childbirth in the cause of Allah is a martyr." [^an-Nisai # 3163]
* He also said: "Being killed in the cause of Allah is martyrdom, dying of an abdominal complaint is martyrdom, being burned to death is martyrdom, drowning is martyrdom, being crushed beneath a falling wall is martyrdom, dying of pleurisy is martyrdom, and the woman who dies along with her fetus is a martyr." [^an-Nisai #3194]
(. . .etc)
Current Debates In Voting Period:

- The Qur'an We Have Today is Not What Muhammad Dictated Verbatim. Vs. @Envisage:
http://www.debate.org...

- Drawing Contest. Vs. @purpleduck:
http://www.debate.org...

"It is perfectly permissible to vote on sources without reading them" bluesteel.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,560
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12/28/2014 8:18:42 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 7:50:05 AM, YassineB wrote:
Whoever is killed protecting his religion, he is a martyr.
* He also said: "The one who is killed in the cause of Allah is a martyr
* He also said: "Being killed in the cause of Allah is martyrdom\

Those are extremely dangerous to mankind, one will find all kinds of atrocities connected to it based on interpretation.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Fatihah
Posts: 7,714
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12/28/2014 9:16:31 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 4:33:43 AM, FriarHavok wrote:
To tell the truth I've been debating with dad on this, he says that Jihad is a mainstream idea were a person commits an act of murder and is allowed to go to heaven. And now he is blatantly stereotyping Muslims and that gets me upset because my friend Amnah is muslim, I need to find a loophole in this argument to shove in my dads face because, i cant seem to find any.

Response: Jihad literally means "to struggle and strive". So since you are discussion what is jihad, then ask him what does it mean. Then you turn and show from your own research and confirm that the word actually means "to struggle and strive". Therefore, jihad does not mean murder.

You also challenge him to quote anything from the Qur'an or Sunnah that refers to killing or fighting to quote where it says to "attack first" or "kill an innocent" He will not find it. Instead, you provide verse 8:61 and verse 2:256 that forbids killings the innocent and starting a war. Thus proving that every verse relating to fighting refers to self-defense.
DanneJeRusse
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12/28/2014 9:46:58 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 9:16:31 AM, Fatihah wrote:
Thus proving that every verse relating to fighting refers to self-defense.

And, that is why Islam is so dangerous to mankind, Muslims are taught to fight to solve their problems.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
uncung
Posts: 3,431
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12/28/2014 9:49:22 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
And, that is why Islam is so dangerous to mankind, Muslims are taught to fight to solve their problems.

but we muslims are safe with islam. How could it can be very dangerous?
maybe because you are infidels. aren't you? if so then it is your fault.
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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12/28/2014 9:51:57 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 9:49:22 AM, uncung wrote:
And, that is why Islam is so dangerous to mankind, Muslims are taught to fight to solve their problems.

but we muslims are safe with islam. How could it can be very dangerous?
maybe because you are infidels. aren't you? if so then it is your fault.

hahahahahaha.
How good is that pseudo logic?
hahahahahaha
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,560
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12/28/2014 10:02:06 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 9:49:22 AM, uncung wrote:
And, that is why Islam is so dangerous to mankind, Muslims are taught to fight to solve their problems.

but we muslims are safe with islam. How could it can be very dangerous?

You are not safe, you are killing each other over your beliefs. The rest of the world is not safe from your beliefs because you fight to solve problems, that is what your religion teaches you.

maybe because you are infidels. aren't you? if so then it is your fault.

Yes, that is exactly the kind of dangerous beliefs I was referring. Keep em' comin',
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
uncung
Posts: 3,431
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12/28/2014 10:08:27 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
You are not safe, you are killing each other over your beliefs. The rest of the world is not safe from your beliefs because you fight to solve problems, that is what your religion teaches you.

Yes, that is exactly the kind of dangerous beliefs I was referring. Keep em' comin',

we kill those who oppose islamic teaching.
Fatihah
Posts: 7,714
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12/28/2014 10:16:28 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 9:46:58 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/28/2014 9:16:31 AM, Fatihah wrote:
Thus proving that every verse relating to fighting refers to self-defense.

And, that is why Islam is so dangerous to mankind, Muslims are taught to fight to solve their problems.

Response: In other words, instead of defending yourself or family from attack, you would stand there and get beat up and watch your daughter be raped. Wow. No wonder why atheism is viewed as backwards and deluded, while Islam continues to strive and flourish.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,560
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12/28/2014 10:44:13 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 10:16:28 AM, Fatihah wrote:
At 12/28/2014 9:46:58 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/28/2014 9:16:31 AM, Fatihah wrote:
Thus proving that every verse relating to fighting refers to self-defense.

And, that is why Islam is so dangerous to mankind, Muslims are taught to fight to solve their problems.

Response: In other words, instead of defending yourself or family from attack, you would stand there and get beat up and watch your daughter be raped. Wow.

Oh I see, so you live in a world in which attacks on your family and your daughter being raped is an everyday event, hence you need to refer to your holy book that tells you to fight and kill those who attack you daily.

I guess perhaps we should consider there are laws and police for such things, but for Muslims, they would rather handle things with violence instead.

This is why your religion is so dangerous to mankind.

No wonder why atheism is viewed as backwards and deluded

Sorry, but many of us don't settle our problems with violence like you do. And, you call that backwards and deluded. You are obviously a very violent person if that's what you believe.

while Islam continues to strive and flourish.

LOL. Lying doesn't help your argument.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Fatihah
Posts: 7,714
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12/28/2014 11:48:39 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 10:44:13 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:

Oh I see, so you live in a world in which attacks on your family and your daughter being raped is an everyday event, hence you need to refer to your holy book that tells you to fight and kill those who attack you daily.

I guess perhaps we should consider there are laws and police for such things, but for Muslims, they would rather handle things with violence instead.

This is why your religion is so dangerous to mankind.

Response: in other words, when you see your daughter being raped and attacked, you say "go on, because I don't believe in using violence to stop it". Once again showing just how sickly perverted and disgraceful atheists are. Fortunately, we have the religion of Islam that cares for humanity and will fight any person who does not to save our children.

Sorry, but many of us don't settle our problems with violence like you do. And, you call that backwards and deluded. You are obviously a very violent person if that's what you believe.

while Islam continues to strive and flourish.

LOL. Lying doesn't help your argument.

Response: Exactly. When your daughter is being raped, you don't use violence to stop them. You say "keep going". Got it. We hear your disgraceful ideology loud and clear.

Another example of the delusion and perversion of atheism.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,560
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12/28/2014 11:58:53 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 11:48:39 AM, Fatihah wrote:

Response: in other words, when you see your daughter being raped and attacked, you say "go on, because I don't believe in using violence to stop it". Once again showing just how sickly perverted and disgraceful atheists are.

If you live in a world where your daughter is continuously getting raped, you should contact the police. Violence won't solve that problem.

But, I understand why you would use violence to solve your problems, that is because your religion teaches you not to rise above the violence, but instead to stoop yourself down to it, that is what is perverted and disgraceful.

Fortunately, we have the religion of Islam that cares for humanity and will fight any person who does not to save our children.

Yes, all you know how to do is fight, that is why Islam is so dangerous to mankind, you prove that with your words of agreement to violence.


Response: Exactly. When your daughter is being raped, you don't use violence to stop them. You say "keep going". Got it. We hear your disgraceful ideology loud and clear.

You keep using the ridiculous example of rape, showing just how desperate you are to use violence. That is why your society is so violent and barbaric.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Fatihah
Posts: 7,714
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12/28/2014 12:19:49 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 11:58:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/28/2014 11:48:39 AM, Fatihah wrote:

Response: in other words, when you see your daughter being raped and attacked, you say "go on, because I don't believe in using violence to stop it". Once again showing just how sickly perverted and disgraceful atheists are.

If you live in a world where your daughter is continuously getting raped, you should contact the police. Violence won't solve that problem.

But, I understand why you would use violence to solve your problems, that is because your religion teaches you not to rise above the violence, but instead to stoop yourself down to it, that is what is perverted and disgraceful.

Response: And the police carry guns and clubs, not hugs and kisses. So they will use violence to prevent rape. Yet you would not call the police because you do not like violence, so you would sit and watch the rape of your daughter.

That's why we are thankful for Islam, unlike the perverted ways of some atheists.

Fortunately, we have the religion of Islam that cares for humanity and will fight any person who does not to save our children.

Yes, all you know how to do is fight, that is why Islam is so dangerous to mankind, you prove that with your words of agreement to violence.

Response: In other words, you are too scared to fight the attacker who rapes your daughter and will pull up a chair and cheer them on. So you prove just how backwards and disgusting atheism can be.

You keep using the ridiculous example of rape, showing just how desperate you are to use violence. That is why your society is so violent and barbaric.

Response: Rather, you keep showing us that when your daughter is raped, you would pull up a chair. That is why no one pays attention to your perverted ideology.
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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12/28/2014 12:24:49 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 9:51:57 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 12/28/2014 9:49:22 AM, uncung wrote:
And, that is why Islam is so dangerous to mankind, Muslims are taught to fight to solve their problems.

but we muslims are safe with islam. How could it can be very dangerous?
maybe because you are infidels. aren't you? if so then it is your fault.

hahahahahaha.
How good is that pseudo logic?
hahahahahaha

Please post in an intelligent way that doesn't rely on insults or attacks.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,560
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12/28/2014 12:34:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:19:49 PM, Fatihah wrote:
At 12/28/2014 11:58:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 12/28/2014 11:48:39 AM, Fatihah wrote:

Response: in other words, when you see your daughter being raped and attacked, you say "go on, because I don't believe in using violence to stop it". Once again showing just how sickly perverted and disgraceful atheists are.

If you live in a world where your daughter is continuously getting raped, you should contact the police. Violence won't solve that problem.

But, I understand why you would use violence to solve your problems, that is because your religion teaches you not to rise above the violence, but instead to stoop yourself down to it, that is what is perverted and disgraceful.

Response: And the police carry guns and clubs, not hugs and kisses. So they will use violence to prevent rape. Yet you would not call the police because you do not like violence, so you would sit and watch the rape of your daughter.

That's why we are thankful for Islam, unlike the perverted ways of some atheists.

Fortunately, we have the religion of Islam that cares for humanity and will fight any person who does not to save our children.

Yes, all you know how to do is fight, that is why Islam is so dangerous to mankind, you prove that with your words of agreement to violence.

Response: In other words, you are too scared to fight the attacker who rapes your daughter and will pull up a chair and cheer them on. So you prove just how backwards and disgusting atheism can be.

You keep using the ridiculous example of rape, showing just how desperate you are to use violence. That is why your society is so violent and barbaric.

Response: Rather, you keep showing us that when your daughter is raped, you would pull up a chair. That is why no one pays attention to your perverted ideology.

The dishonest Muslim here continues to use the fallacious argument of rape and lies to support Islam. They condone vigilantism, which is also against the law, for which this particular Muslim has no respect or acknowledgment.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Fatihah
Posts: 7,714
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12/28/2014 12:42:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:34:58 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:

The dishonest Muslim here continues to use the fallacious argument of rape and lies to support Islam. They condone vigilantism, which is also against the law, for which this particular Muslim has no respect or acknowledgment.

Response: In other words, whenever this atheist is caught out, such as supporting the idea of watching one's daughter be raped instead of fighting the rapist, he cries about what a Muslim does, instead of checking his own perverted and trifling ways.

Another example of the delusion of atheism.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,560
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12/28/2014 1:01:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 12:42:51 PM, Fatihah wrote:
At 12/28/2014 12:34:58 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:

The dishonest Muslim here continues to use the fallacious argument of rape and lies to support Islam. They condone vigilantism, which is also against the law, for which this particular Muslim has no respect or acknowledgment.

Response: In other words, whenever this atheist is caught out, such as supporting the idea of watching one's daughter be raped instead of fighting the rapist, he cries about what a Muslim does, instead of checking his own perverted and trifling ways.

Another example of the delusion of atheism.

Very well, you leave me no choice but to expose your silly argument.

Here's another conclusion: I make love to the first woman I see and then crap my pants. This is obviously something I would normally never do in my entire lifetime, like anyone else. However, I just received news an asteroid the size of a bus was headed directly at my location and I had nowhere to go. I might then consider that conclusion, amongst others.

The point to that ridiculous story is that the asteroid is a very rare event, not likely to happen. The same goes for your ridiculous story of having to watch ones daughter being raped, an extremely rare event not likely to happen to the vast majority of people on the planet. The same also goes for the ridiculous conclusion I provided above, it is as ridiculous as getting guidance from Islam regarding the raping of daughters.

So, if and when my daughter is being raped in front of my eyes, I may indeed turn to Islam for guidance. But, since that event is most likely never going to happen, then one need not turn to Islam for guidance.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
YassineB
Posts: 1,003
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12/28/2014 3:01:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 8:18:42 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
Those are extremely dangerous to mankind, one will find all kinds of atrocities connected to it based on interpretation.

- For this once, I don't disagree with you. People definitely have been & will be using such Hadiths to justify unlawful things while thinking they are doing good.
- However, that's exactly why there is a Legal System that prevents such people from doing whatever they see fit in their distorted world view, although, such Legal System can only do so much. There will always be outlaws & terrorists that are incited by Religion, such as those we see today.
- Also, this is the case of all Religions & all Ideologies & all Laws. Believing oneself utterly right, & the other utterly wrong, is a Human Condition (Ego) independent from any Religion or Law.
Current Debates In Voting Period:

- The Qur'an We Have Today is Not What Muhammad Dictated Verbatim. Vs. @Envisage:
http://www.debate.org...

- Drawing Contest. Vs. @purpleduck:
http://www.debate.org...

"It is perfectly permissible to vote on sources without reading them" bluesteel.
Fatihah
Posts: 7,714
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12/28/2014 3:37:12 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 1:01:07 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:

Very well, you leave me no choice but to expose your silly argument.

Here's another conclusion: I make love to the first woman I see and then crap my pants. This is obviously something I would normally never do in my entire lifetime, like anyone else. However, I just received news an asteroid the size of a bus was headed directly at my location and I had nowhere to go. I might then consider that conclusion, amongst others.

The point to that ridiculous story is that the asteroid is a very rare event, not likely to happen. The same goes for your ridiculous story of having to watch ones daughter being raped, an extremely rare event not likely to happen to the vast majority of people on the planet. The same also goes for the ridiculous conclusion I provided above, it is as ridiculous as getting guidance from Islam regarding the raping of daughters.

So, if and when my daughter is being raped in front of my eyes, I may indeed turn to Islam for guidance. But, since that event is most likely never going to happen, then one need not turn to Islam for guidance.

Response: In other words, Islam has the solution to prevent your daughter from being raped. Not you. Thanks for the clarification.
DanneJeRusse
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12/28/2014 3:38:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 3:37:12 PM, Fatihah wrote:
At 12/28/2014 1:01:07 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:

Very well, you leave me no choice but to expose your silly argument.

Here's another conclusion: I make love to the first woman I see and then crap my pants. This is obviously something I would normally never do in my entire lifetime, like anyone else. However, I just received news an asteroid the size of a bus was headed directly at my location and I had nowhere to go. I might then consider that conclusion, amongst others.

The point to that ridiculous story is that the asteroid is a very rare event, not likely to happen. The same goes for your ridiculous story of having to watch ones daughter being raped, an extremely rare event not likely to happen to the vast majority of people on the planet. The same also goes for the ridiculous conclusion I provided above, it is as ridiculous as getting guidance from Islam regarding the raping of daughters.

So, if and when my daughter is being raped in front of my eyes, I may indeed turn to Islam for guidance. But, since that event is most likely never going to happen, then one need not turn to Islam for guidance.

Response: In other words, Islam has the solution to prevent your daughter from being raped. Not you. Thanks for the clarification.

Sorry, but Islam does not prevent rape, that is a lie.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Fatihah
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12/28/2014 3:46:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 3:38:09 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:

Sorry, but Islam does not prevent rape, that is a lie.

Response: Yet your own admission that you would turn to Islam to prevent your daughter from rape says otherwise. So the lie is founded in your own words.
DanneJeRusse
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12/28/2014 4:19:15 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 3:46:46 PM, Fatihah wrote:
At 12/28/2014 3:38:09 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:

Sorry, but Islam does not prevent rape, that is a lie.

Response: Yet your own admission that you would turn to Islam to prevent your daughter from rape says otherwise. So the lie is founded in your own words.

I never said Islam would prevent anything. Please stop lying.l
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Fatihah
Posts: 7,714
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12/28/2014 4:25:16 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 4:19:15 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:

I never said Islam would prevent anything. Please stop lying.l

Response: And yet we read otherwise. Start telling the truth.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,560
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12/28/2014 4:28:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 12/28/2014 4:25:16 PM, Fatihah wrote:
At 12/28/2014 4:19:15 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:

I never said Islam would prevent anything. Please stop lying.l

Response: And yet we read otherwise. Start telling the truth.

You can show me where I said that Islam prevents rape, but you and I both know you're lying.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth