Total Posts:14|Showing Posts:1-14
Jump to topic:

Why Is "God being good" such an issue?

RoderickSpode
Posts: 2,386
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/14/2015 11:15:19 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
I doubt that there's anyone here who never made an unequivocal based statement "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person". Sometimes it's someone outside of their sphere of human interaction (a celebrity, politician, various humanitarians), but many times it's someone they are socially related to. Someone who they've personally interacted with. Someone who influenced them.

Outside of a religious/philosophical discussion on morality and what is/define what is good, there may be a hesitancy to state that "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person", but when the discussion is over, more than likely at some point it will be back to Grandma Jones was/is a good person.

The claim of goodness seems to be instinctively placed on someone else. There seems to be an instinctive idea that any good a person may claim to be should be credited to someone else who somehow instilled goodness, or even morality into them.

If someone like myself says "God is good", why should that be any different than stating any given human is good? Why should the idea that God influences goodness be any more of an issue than, say, a parent influencing a child in the area of become a good person?
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/14/2015 11:18:00 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/14/2015 11:15:19 AM, RoderickSpode wrote:
I doubt that there's anyone here who never made an unequivocal based statement "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person". Sometimes it's someone outside of their sphere of human interaction (a celebrity, politician, various humanitarians), but many times it's someone they are socially related to. Someone who they've personally interacted with. Someone who influenced them.

Outside of a religious/philosophical discussion on morality and what is/define what is good, there may be a hesitancy to state that "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person", but when the discussion is over, more than likely at some point it will be back to Grandma Jones was/is a good person.

The claim of goodness seems to be instinctively placed on someone else. There seems to be an instinctive idea that any good a person may claim to be should be credited to someone else who somehow instilled goodness, or even morality into them.

If someone like myself says "God is good", why should that be any different than stating any given human is good? Why should the idea that God influences goodness be any more of an issue than, say, a parent influencing a child in the area of become a good person?

It depends on your definition of good. The deeds attributed to deity in the Bible, are not what most people would describe as good.
RoderickSpode
Posts: 2,386
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/14/2015 11:20:53 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/14/2015 11:18:00 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 1/14/2015 11:15:19 AM, RoderickSpode wrote:
I doubt that there's anyone here who never made an unequivocal based statement "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person". Sometimes it's someone outside of their sphere of human interaction (a celebrity, politician, various humanitarians), but many times it's someone they are socially related to. Someone who they've personally interacted with. Someone who influenced them.

Outside of a religious/philosophical discussion on morality and what is/define what is good, there may be a hesitancy to state that "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person", but when the discussion is over, more than likely at some point it will be back to Grandma Jones was/is a good person.

The claim of goodness seems to be instinctively placed on someone else. There seems to be an instinctive idea that any good a person may claim to be should be credited to someone else who somehow instilled goodness, or even morality into them.

If someone like myself says "God is good", why should that be any different than stating any given human is good? Why should the idea that God influences goodness be any more of an issue than, say, a parent influencing a child in the area of become a good person?

It depends on your definition of good. The deeds attributed to deity in the Bible, are not what most people would describe as good.
Have you ever claimed anyone was good?

As far as deeds in the Bible, was the act of healing infirmities not good?
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/14/2015 11:24:30 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/14/2015 11:20:53 AM, RoderickSpode wrote:
At 1/14/2015 11:18:00 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 1/14/2015 11:15:19 AM, RoderickSpode wrote:
I doubt that there's anyone here who never made an unequivocal based statement "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person". Sometimes it's someone outside of their sphere of human interaction (a celebrity, politician, various humanitarians), but many times it's someone they are socially related to. Someone who they've personally interacted with. Someone who influenced them.

Outside of a religious/philosophical discussion on morality and what is/define what is good, there may be a hesitancy to state that "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person", but when the discussion is over, more than likely at some point it will be back to Grandma Jones was/is a good person.

The claim of goodness seems to be instinctively placed on someone else. There seems to be an instinctive idea that any good a person may claim to be should be credited to someone else who somehow instilled goodness, or even morality into them.

If someone like myself says "God is good", why should that be any different than stating any given human is good? Why should the idea that God influences goodness be any more of an issue than, say, a parent influencing a child in the area of become a good person?

It depends on your definition of good. The deeds attributed to deity in the Bible, are not what most people would describe as good.
Have you ever claimed anyone was good?

As far as deeds in the Bible, was the act of healing infirmities not good?

That wasn't the deity, it was that guy Jesus who was supposed to have 'healed' people!
Burzmali
Posts: 1,310
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/14/2015 11:27:49 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Are there people who make an issue out of that idea, in and of itself? Personally, I've only ever contested it when someone claims their god-inspired/authored book is a reliable source of moral guidance and should be used by everyone. I don't care if someone thinks their god, or anyone else, is good except when they're trying to use that as a basis for telling others how to live their lives.
RoderickSpode
Posts: 2,386
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/14/2015 11:27:58 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/14/2015 11:24:30 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 1/14/2015 11:20:53 AM, RoderickSpode wrote:
At 1/14/2015 11:18:00 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 1/14/2015 11:15:19 AM, RoderickSpode wrote:
I doubt that there's anyone here who never made an unequivocal based statement "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person". Sometimes it's someone outside of their sphere of human interaction (a celebrity, politician, various humanitarians), but many times it's someone they are socially related to. Someone who they've personally interacted with. Someone who influenced them.

Outside of a religious/philosophical discussion on morality and what is/define what is good, there may be a hesitancy to state that "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person", but when the discussion is over, more than likely at some point it will be back to Grandma Jones was/is a good person.

The claim of goodness seems to be instinctively placed on someone else. There seems to be an instinctive idea that any good a person may claim to be should be credited to someone else who somehow instilled goodness, or even morality into them.

If someone like myself says "God is good", why should that be any different than stating any given human is good? Why should the idea that God influences goodness be any more of an issue than, say, a parent influencing a child in the area of become a good person?

It depends on your definition of good. The deeds attributed to deity in the Bible, are not what most people would describe as good.
Have you ever claimed anyone was good?

As far as deeds in the Bible, was the act of healing infirmities not good?

That wasn't the deity, it was that guy Jesus who was supposed to have 'healed' people!
God healed in the Old Testament healed infirmities as well. If if one doesn't believe Jesus indicated that He is God, He clearly maintained that He healed infirmities as an instrument of God.

Have you ever stated that someone else was a good person?
RoderickSpode
Posts: 2,386
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/14/2015 11:30:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/14/2015 11:27:49 AM, Burzmali wrote:
Are there people who make an issue out of that idea, in and of itself? Personally, I've only ever contested it when someone claims their god-inspired/authored book is a reliable source of moral guidance and should be used by everyone. I don't care if someone thinks their god, or anyone else, is good except when they're trying to use that as a basis for telling others how to live their lives.

We're told constantly by society how to live our lives.
Burzmali
Posts: 1,310
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/14/2015 1:39:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/14/2015 11:30:05 AM, RoderickSpode wrote:
At 1/14/2015 11:27:49 AM, Burzmali wrote:
Are there people who make an issue out of that idea, in and of itself? Personally, I've only ever contested it when someone claims their god-inspired/authored book is a reliable source of moral guidance and should be used by everyone. I don't care if someone thinks their god, or anyone else, is good except when they're trying to use that as a basis for telling others how to live their lives.

We're told constantly by society how to live our lives.

Okay. Was there a point to that comment?
drpiek
Posts: 589
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2015 3:27:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
If you ask me if I thought that god as described in the bible was good, I would say that it seems like he is trying to be good but keeps slipping up. He is surely not Ultimate Good, as I would define it. I think it is that ultimate good that people have an issue with.

I have never suggested that another person is ultimate good.
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2015 3:50:33 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Because so many people point to God as the author of objective morality. If such a thing existed and the source was not good, how could anyone accept that morality.
LifeMeansGodIsGood
Posts: 2,744
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2015 8:12:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/14/2015 11:15:19 AM, RoderickSpode wrote:
I doubt that there's anyone here who never made an unequivocal based statement "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person". Sometimes it's someone outside of their sphere of human interaction (a celebrity, politician, various humanitarians), but many times it's someone they are socially related to. Someone who they've personally interacted with. Someone who influenced them.

Outside of a religious/philosophical discussion on morality and what is/define what is good, there may be a hesitancy to state that "(fill in the blank) was/is a good person", but when the discussion is over, more than likely at some point it will be back to Grandma Jones was/is a good person.

The claim of goodness seems to be instinctively placed on someone else. There seems to be an instinctive idea that any good a person may claim to be should be credited to someone else who somehow instilled goodness, or even morality into them.

If someone like myself says "God is good", why should that be any different than stating any given human is good? Why should the idea that God influences goodness be any more of an issue than, say, a parent influencing a child in the area of become a good person?

Because people generally hate God and blame Him for their problems and all of the problems in the world. To make their argument against God easier and simpler, many of them say "There is no God" or "You cannot know if God is there or not". Both of these statement are self-assuring and do not allow for any possibility of being wrong. If you can get them to explain their reasons for saying God is not there, they usually will tell you that if He was there He would not allow evil things and He would give them whatever they want and fix all of their problems now.

It's pride, plain and simple. People think they are as good or better than God, they hate Him with their envy and desire to replace God with themselves. I have heard many atheists say they would be better at being God than God is.

The basic argument against God always boils down to accusing Him of not being good.
He won't put up with such accusations against Him forever. He has to justify your existence somehow, and how can He do that if you are turned against Him who gave you life? He has to recuse Himself from ruling over His creation or He has to justify the existence of creatures who have turned against Him. It's good to know God will not step down from rulling His creation simply because a lot of people hate Him. God is good all the time. All the time, God is good. Life means God is good.
LifeMeansGodIsGood
Posts: 2,744
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2015 8:22:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/14/2015 11:27:49 AM, Burzmali wrote:
Are there people who make an issue out of that idea, in and of itself? Personally, I've only ever contested it when someone claims their god-inspired/authored book is a reliable source of moral guidance and should be used by everyone. I don't care if someone thinks their god, or anyone else, is good except when they're trying to use that as a basis for telling others how to live their lives.

Yes, nobody should tell you that it is wrong to steal, have multiple sex partners including animals if you feel like it, kill people whenever you feel like it,.....nobody should ever tell you how to live your life. If you feel like stealing something, and you think you won't go to jail, why not do it? If you feel like destroying your body with drugs and alcohol, why not do it? If you feel like playing in traffic, why not do it? nobody should ever tell you how to live your life, especially your paretnts. Your parents should only feed you and let you do whatever you feel like doing whenever you feel like doing it, and they should applaud you for your bravery. Nobody should tell you to preserve your body for marraige as the surest way to avoid STD's and have a good marriage untill death. It is so wrong for anybody to try to tell you how to life your life. Anybody who tries to tell you anything about behaving good for your own best interests should be crucified....oh yeah, He already was. So go on and do whatever you feel like doing and don't let anybody tell you anything about how to live your life.
Burzmali
Posts: 1,310
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/15/2015 10:18:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/15/2015 8:22:06 PM, LifeMeansGodIsGood wrote:
At 1/14/2015 11:27:49 AM, Burzmali wrote:
Are there people who make an issue out of that idea, in and of itself? Personally, I've only ever contested it when someone claims their god-inspired/authored book is a reliable source of moral guidance and should be used by everyone. I don't care if someone thinks their god, or anyone else, is good except when they're trying to use that as a basis for telling others how to live their lives.

Yes, nobody should tell you that it is wrong to steal, have multiple sex partners including animals if you feel like it, kill people whenever you feel like it,.....nobody should ever tell you how to live your life. If you feel like stealing something, and you think you won't go to jail, why not do it? If you feel like destroying your body with drugs and alcohol, why not do it? If you feel like playing in traffic, why not do it? nobody should ever tell you how to live your life, especially your paretnts. Your parents should only feed you and let you do whatever you feel like doing whenever you feel like doing it, and they should applaud you for your bravery. Nobody should tell you to preserve your body for marraige as the surest way to avoid STD's and have a good marriage untill death. It is so wrong for anybody to try to tell you how to life your life. Anybody who tries to tell you anything about behaving good for your own best interests should be crucified....oh yeah, He already was. So go on and do whatever you feel like doing and don't let anybody tell you anything about how to live your life.

I can tell by your response that you did not comprehend mine. At no point did I even intimate that no one should ever tell anyone else how to live.