Total Posts:152|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

God's plan

MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.

Working with that son they then created, a universe and a planet earth, though at that point the earth was still "formless and waste".

He set a protective barrier of water, evidently in vapour form, around the earth, to give it a reasonably equal climate all round, greenhouse like. And when he had created vegetation and animals he then made a beautiful garden in the earth, created a man, Adam, and eventually a woman in that Garden, and gave them the task of populating the earth with humans with the same prospect of perfect human life in perfect health and perfect peace as was placed in front of them. They were intended to live eternally as long as they remained obedient to one simple law.

However before they got as far as having Children Adam sinned and lost himself and his progeny the chances he had been given.

Immediately God pronounced, to the serpent, Satan in disguise, that a "seed" would arrive that would do him fatal damage.

The next 4,000 years are covered in scripture by the record of the development of a family for that seed, towards the end identified as "The Messiah" or "The Christ"

Since God had set a time limit, the faith was allowed to die out by the end of the first century to await the time when Christ was allowed to take up his throne, just before which the enemy, Satan was finally barred from Heaven ad cast down to the earth to cause chaos down here, whilst God"s son, now the Christ, sorted out things ready for the time to come when, having gathered in a small group of followers who he taught to carry on the work he had left unfinished, as had the Apostles,, and gather as many as possible to his side before the "Great Day of God the Almighty" also known as Armageddon.

That war, for war between Satan"s hordes and those of God"s son, will result in the complete cleansing of the earth from all Satan"s works.

Then follows the resurrection of the dead, into brand new bodies with all the prospects that were before Adam and Eve, their training, a long period of practicing living God"s way without the interference of Satan, and then the final test.

The rest of God"s plan is detailed in the last three chapters of Revelation, and the end result is the earth returned to what it was intended to be, and mankind returned to what was intended for them.

Then God"s original plan for a Paradise earth populated by perfect humans will be back on course. That will include perfect peace, absolute peace such as it is impossible to know in this system, not just with each other, but with the animals also.

Fancy a part of that? I know I do.
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 10:50:22 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.

Working with that son they then created, a universe and a planet earth, though at that point the earth was still "formless and waste".

He set a protective barrier of water, evidently in vapour form, around the earth, to give it a reasonably equal climate all round, greenhouse like. And when he had created vegetation and animals he then made a beautiful garden in the earth, created a man, Adam, and eventually a woman in that Garden, and gave them the task of populating the earth with humans with the same prospect of perfect human life in perfect health and perfect peace as was placed in front of them. They were intended to live eternally as long as they remained obedient to one simple law.

However before they got as far as having Children Adam sinned and lost himself and his progeny the chances he had been given.

Immediately God pronounced, to the serpent, Satan in disguise, that a "seed" would arrive that would do him fatal damage.

The next 4,000 years are covered in scripture by the record of the development of a family for that seed, towards the end identified as "The Messiah" or "The Christ"

Since God had set a time limit, the faith was allowed to die out by the end of the first century to await the time when Christ was allowed to take up his throne, just before which the enemy, Satan was finally barred from Heaven ad cast down to the earth to cause chaos down here, whilst God"s son, now the Christ, sorted out things ready for the time to come when, having gathered in a small group of followers who he taught to carry on the work he had left unfinished, as had the Apostles,, and gather as many as possible to his side before the "Great Day of God the Almighty" also known as Armageddon.

That war, for war between Satan"s hordes and those of God"s son, will result in the complete cleansing of the earth from all Satan"s works.

Then follows the resurrection of the dead, into brand new bodies with all the prospects that were before Adam and Eve, their training, a long period of practicing living God"s way without the interference of Satan, and then the final test.

The rest of God"s plan is detailed in the last three chapters of Revelation, and the end result is the earth returned to what it was intended to be, and mankind returned to what was intended for them.

Then God"s original plan for a Paradise earth populated by perfect humans will be back on course. That will include perfect peace, absolute peace such as it is impossible to know in this system, not just with each other, but with the animals also.

Fancy a part of that? I know I do.

Mildly interesting religious fiction, no factual information to back it up. I don't fancy anything so obviously false from the outset.
v3nesl
Posts: 4,465
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 10:58:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.


You don't create a son. Sons are born. So if you're going to do this kind of literalism, you'll have to have a heavenly Mother. Maybe you'd like being a Mormon better.

You JWs have it backwards, a basic logic flaw: God doesn't describe himself as father and son because he's like humans. Rather, when God created humans, he created them in his image. Humans are based on God, not the other way around. And obviously mortal man is not the exact representation of God in every respect. The fact that Adam had a beginning does not mean God had a beginning, right? Likewise, the fact that Jesus is called the Son does not mean HE had a beginning.

"You are greatly in error, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God". I trust you know who said that.
This space for rent.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 11:04:20 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 10:58:29 AM, v3nesl wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.


You don't create a son. Sons are born. So if you're going to do this kind of literalism, you'll have to have a heavenly Mother. Maybe you'd like being a Mormon better.

You JWs have it backwards, a basic logic flaw: God doesn't describe himself as father and son because he's like humans. Rather, when God created humans, he created them in his image. Humans are based on God, not the other way around. And obviously mortal man is not the exact representation of God in every respect. The fact that Adam had a beginning does not mean God had a beginning, right? Likewise, the fact that Jesus is called the Son does not mean HE had a beginning.

"You are greatly in error, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God". I trust you know who said that.

To humans, yes, but God created all his sons, but only created one of tehm on his own.

Job 1:6
ASV(i) 6 Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan also came among them.

All bar one created by God and his son. Only the son was his solo creation, literally the beginning of his creation.

.Revelation 3:14
ASV(i) 14 And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God:
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 11:05:22 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 10:50:22 AM, dhardage wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.

Working with that son they then created, a universe and a planet earth, though at that point the earth was still "formless and waste".

He set a protective barrier of water, evidently in vapour form, around the earth, to give it a reasonably equal climate all round, greenhouse like. And when he had created vegetation and animals he then made a beautiful garden in the earth, created a man, Adam, and eventually a woman in that Garden, and gave them the task of populating the earth with humans with the same prospect of perfect human life in perfect health and perfect peace as was placed in front of them. They were intended to live eternally as long as they remained obedient to one simple law.

However before they got as far as having Children Adam sinned and lost himself and his progeny the chances he had been given.

Immediately God pronounced, to the serpent, Satan in disguise, that a "seed" would arrive that would do him fatal damage.

The next 4,000 years are covered in scripture by the record of the development of a family for that seed, towards the end identified as "The Messiah" or "The Christ"

Since God had set a time limit, the faith was allowed to die out by the end of the first century to await the time when Christ was allowed to take up his throne, just before which the enemy, Satan was finally barred from Heaven ad cast down to the earth to cause chaos down here, whilst God"s son, now the Christ, sorted out things ready for the time to come when, having gathered in a small group of followers who he taught to carry on the work he had left unfinished, as had the Apostles,, and gather as many as possible to his side before the "Great Day of God the Almighty" also known as Armageddon.

That war, for war between Satan"s hordes and those of God"s son, will result in the complete cleansing of the earth from all Satan"s works.

Then follows the resurrection of the dead, into brand new bodies with all the prospects that were before Adam and Eve, their training, a long period of practicing living God"s way without the interference of Satan, and then the final test.

The rest of God"s plan is detailed in the last three chapters of Revelation, and the end result is the earth returned to what it was intended to be, and mankind returned to what was intended for them.

Then God"s original plan for a Paradise earth populated by perfect humans will be back on course. That will include perfect peace, absolute peace such as it is impossible to know in this system, not just with each other, but with the animals also.

Fancy a part of that? I know I do.

Mildly interesting religious fiction, no factual information to back it up. I don't fancy anything so obviously false from the outset.

Apart from teh accuracy of scripture, no, but it is the story scripture tells.

You either believe the bible or you don;t, the choice is yours.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 11:15:00 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Please explain all the other failed Jehovah's prophesies.

1982 "The Bible not only foretold these things, but indicated that they would occur on a worldwide scale. Also, the Bible said that all these things would happen upon the generation that was alive in 1914. Yet what were prominent world leaders foretelling just before 1914? They were saying that conditions promising world peace were never more favorable. Yet the terrible troubles the Bible foretold began right on time, in 1914! In fact, world leaders now say that 1914 was a turning point in history. After drawing attention to the many things that have marked the period from 1914 onward, Jesus said: 'This generation will by no means pass away until all these things [including the end of this system] occur.' (Matthew 24:34, 14) Which generation did Jesus mean? He meant the generation of people who were living in 1914. Those persons yet remaining of that generation are now very old. However, some of them will still be alive to see the end of this wicked system. So of this we can be certain: Shortly now there will be a sudden end to all wickedness and wicked people at Armageddon." (You Can Live Forever In Paradise On Earth, p 154, 1982)

1984 Some of that "generation (of 1914)" could survive until the end of the century. But there are many indications that "the end" is much closer than that! (The Watchtower, March 1, 1984 pp. 18-19)

1984 "These definitions embrace both those born around the time of a historic event and all those alive at that time. If Jesus used 'generation' in that sense and we apply it to 1914, then the babies of that generation are now 70 years old or older. And others alive in 1914 are in their 80's or 90's, a few even having reached a hundred. There are still many millions of that generation alive. Some of them 'will by no means pass away until all things occur." (Watchtower, 15 May, 1984, p. 5)

1986 As far back as 1876, Jehovah' s Witnesses realized that Bible prophecy marked the year 1914 C.E. as a time when major events would take place that would have far-reaching effects on human affairs. They gave the reason for this fact wide publicity. (True Peace And Security; 1986; p. 70)

1986 Prophetic information in the Bible about our day detail the following: ... (4) The survival of at least some of the generation that saw the beginning of "the conclusion of the system of things." (True Peace And Security; 1986; p. 70)

1989 "The apostle Paul was spearheading the Christian missionary activity. He was also laying a foundation for a work that would be completed in our 20th century." (Watchtower, Jan. 1, 1989, p. 12 [bound volume changed "20th century" to "day"])

1989 In the early part of our 20th century prior to 1919, the Bible Students, as Jehovah's Witnesses were then known, had to be released from a form of spiritual captivity to the ideas and practices of false religion. Although having rejected such false teachings as the Trinity and immortal soul, they were still tainted by Babylonish practices. Many had developed a self-righteous attitude in character development. Some were exalting creatures, indulging in a personality cult that focused on Charles T. Russell, the first president of the Watch Tower Bible and Tract Society. Without any Biblical basis, they were observing birthdays and Christmas. the cross was still prominent in their thinking. Some even wore a cross-and-crown lapel emblem, while others sought the respectability accorded Christendom. (The Watchtower; May 1, 1989; p. 3)

1989 "Back in 1904, the book The New Creation called attention to this new organization that came into existence in the first century C.E. (Studies In The Scriptures, Series VI, Study V, entitled "The Organization of the New Creation") Owing to its view of what the end of the Gentile Times would mean, that book did not envision the remarkable organizational work that was due to take place after the crippling effects of the first world war of human history." (The Watchtower; Sept. 1, 1989; p. 12-13)

1989 "Some Roman Catholics have claimed that Jesus Christ's thousand Year Reign ended in 1799 when French armies captured Rome and deposed the pope as its ruler, so that he was deported as a prisoner to France, where he died." (Watchtower; Sept. 1, 1989; p. 12 [Jw's did too! See two 1927 Creation, quotes, p. 293 & p. 294. Another of the "pot calling the kettle black" quotes])

1989 The preservation of the remnant of spiritual new creation to the end of World War 1 in 1918 and their being kept alive in the flesh in the postwar year of 1919 came as a wondrous surprise. (The Watchtower; Sept. 1, 1989; p. 13)

1989 They have a modern Governing Body of older Christian men from various parts of the earth who give needed oversight to the worldwide activities of God's people. these men, like the apostles and older men in Jerusalem in the first century, are anointed members of the faithful and discreet slave class designated by Jesus to care for all of his Kingdom interests here upon earth. History has proved that they can be trusted to follow the direction of the holy spirit and that they do not rely on human wisdom in teaching the flock of God the ways of genuine peace. (The Watchtower; Dec. 15, 1989; p. 6)

1990 Adult Christians too can be disappointed, and this has in some cases led to spiritual disaster. Some set their hope on a date when they were sure Armageddon would come. When nothing happened on that day, they felt let down. (The Watchtower; 4/15/1990; p. 27)

1992 "Today, a small percentage of mankind can still recall the dramatic events of 1914. Will that elderly generation pass away before God saves the earth from ruin? Not according to Bible prophecy. 'When you see all these things,' Jesus PROMISED, 'know that he is near at the doors. Truly I say to you that THIS generation will by no means pass away until all these things occur.' - Matthew 24:33, 34." (Watchtower May 1, 1992 page 3: The Year That Shocked The World)

1993 (The society's latest 'History' book - "Jehovah's Witnesses, Proclaimers of God's Kingdom", 1993) [Note: At the end of this book there is a chronological section called 'Notable Dates'. The predictions for 1925 and 1975 don't even get a mention! Talk about rewriting history to gullible young converts!]

1993 "Further, the widely circulated booklet Millions Now Living Will Never Die presented the view that in 1925, God's purposes regarding the restoring of the earth to Paradise and the resurrecting of the faithful ones of old would begin to be fulfilled. ... The year 1925 came to its conclusion, but the end was not yet! Ever since the 1870's, Bible Students had been serving with a date in mind - first 1914, then 1925. Now they realized that they must serve for as long as Jehovah wishes." (Watchtower; Nov. 1, 1993; p. 12)

1995 [Discussing the generation of Mt 24] "apparently refers to the peoples of earth (now) who see the sign of Christ presence but fail to mend their ways." (Watchtower November 1, 1995 p.12)

1995 Bible Students, known since 1931 as Jehovah's Witnesses, also expected that the year 1925 would see the fulfillment of marvelous Bible prophecies. ... More recently, many Witnesses conjectured that events associated with the beginning of Christ's Millennial Reign might start to take place in 1975. Their anticipation was based on the understanding that the seventh millennium of human history would begin then. (Awake, June 22, 1995 p. 9)

1995 "Why Awake is Published" [before Nov 8th 1995] Most important, this magazine builds confidence in the Creator's promise of a peaceful and secure new world before the generation that saw the events of 1914 passes away." [After Nov. 8 1995 reference to '1914 generation' deleted] "Most important, this magazine builds confidence in the Creator's promise of a peaceful and secure world that is about to replace the present wicked, lawless system of things."
v3nesl
Posts: 4,465
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 11:33:53 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 11:04:20 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:58:29 AM, v3nesl wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.


You don't create a son. Sons are born. So if you're going to do this kind of literalism, you'll have to have a heavenly Mother. Maybe you'd like being a Mormon better.

You JWs have it backwards, a basic logic flaw: God doesn't describe himself as father and son because he's like humans. Rather, when God created humans, he created them in his image. Humans are based on God, not the other way around. And obviously mortal man is not the exact representation of God in every respect. The fact that Adam had a beginning does not mean God had a beginning, right? Likewise, the fact that Jesus is called the Son does not mean HE had a beginning.

"You are greatly in error, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God". I trust you know who said that.

To humans, yes, but God created all his sons, but only created one of tehm on his own.

Job 1:6
ASV(i) 6 Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan also came among them.

All bar one created by God and his son. Only the son was his solo creation, literally the beginning of his creation.


Clever, but I think you're misreading the text. What 'the beginning of his creation' means is made clear elsewhere:

- First, from Romans 11:36: For from him and through him and for him are all things.
This passage credits the creation of all things to God.

then, in Colossians: He is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of all creation. For by Him all things were created, both in the heavens and on earth, visible and invisible, whether thrones or dominions or rulers or authorities-- all things have been created through Him and for Him. He is before all things, and in Him all things hold together." This passage goes to lengths to make clear that the Son created ALL things. So first of all, this makes clear that the Son is God, since we already learned that God created all things. Secondly, there is again simple logic: If the Son created everything that has been created, clearly he himself was not created.

.Revelation 3:14
ASV(i) 14 And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God:

So, the scriptures explain what scripture means - Jesus being the beginning of the creation means he is the source, the author of all creation. It's like pointing out who wrote a Beatles song - the Beatles as a whole are said to have written a song, but we'll find that perhaps one member wrote the lyrics, another the melody, for instance.

Elsewhere in Revelation Jesus describes himself as the alpha and omega, the beginning and the end. God is the source of all things, and also the goal of all reality.

This doctrine of yours is a despicable one, actually. The difference between God himself paying the penalty of our sins and sending somebody else to do it is immeasurable.
This space for rent.
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 11:47:32 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 11:05:22 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:50:22 AM, dhardage wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.

Working with that son they then created, a universe and a planet earth, though at that point the earth was still "formless and waste".

He set a protective barrier of water, evidently in vapour form, around the earth, to give it a reasonably equal climate all round, greenhouse like. And when he had created vegetation and animals he then made a beautiful garden in the earth, created a man, Adam, and eventually a woman in that Garden, and gave them the task of populating the earth with humans with the same prospect of perfect human life in perfect health and perfect peace as was placed in front of them. They were intended to live eternally as long as they remained obedient to one simple law.

However before they got as far as having Children Adam sinned and lost himself and his progeny the chances he had been given.

Immediately God pronounced, to the serpent, Satan in disguise, that a "seed" would arrive that would do him fatal damage.

The next 4,000 years are covered in scripture by the record of the development of a family for that seed, towards the end identified as "The Messiah" or "The Christ"

Since God had set a time limit, the faith was allowed to die out by the end of the first century to await the time when Christ was allowed to take up his throne, just before which the enemy, Satan was finally barred from Heaven ad cast down to the earth to cause chaos down here, whilst God"s son, now the Christ, sorted out things ready for the time to come when, having gathered in a small group of followers who he taught to carry on the work he had left unfinished, as had the Apostles,, and gather as many as possible to his side before the "Great Day of God the Almighty" also known as Armageddon.

That war, for war between Satan"s hordes and those of God"s son, will result in the complete cleansing of the earth from all Satan"s works.

Then follows the resurrection of the dead, into brand new bodies with all the prospects that were before Adam and Eve, their training, a long period of practicing living God"s way without the interference of Satan, and then the final test.

The rest of God"s plan is detailed in the last three chapters of Revelation, and the end result is the earth returned to what it was intended to be, and mankind returned to what was intended for them.

Then God"s original plan for a Paradise earth populated by perfect humans will be back on course. That will include perfect peace, absolute peace such as it is impossible to know in this system, not just with each other, but with the animals also.

Fancy a part of that? I know I do.

Mildly interesting religious fiction, no factual information to back it up. I don't fancy anything so obviously false from the outset.

Apart from teh accuracy of scripture, no, but it is the story scripture tells.

You either believe the bible or you don;t, the choice is yours.

Of course, and since it has been proven wrong on so many different occasions, I make the reasoned choice not to believe it.
annanicole
Posts: 19,784
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 11:55:26 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 11:04:20 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:58:29 AM, v3nesl wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.


You don't create a son. Sons are born. So if you're going to do this kind of literalism, you'll have to have a heavenly Mother. Maybe you'd like being a Mormon better.

You JWs have it backwards, a basic logic flaw: God doesn't describe himself as father and son because he's like humans. Rather, when God created humans, he created them in his image. Humans are based on God, not the other way around. And obviously mortal man is not the exact representation of God in every respect. The fact that Adam had a beginning does not mean God had a beginning, right? Likewise, the fact that Jesus is called the Son does not mean HE had a beginning.

"You are greatly in error, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God". I trust you know who said that.

To humans, yes, but God created all his sons, but only created one of tehm on his own.

Job 1:6
ASV(i) 6 Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan also came among them.

All bar one created by God and his son. Only the son was his solo creation, literally the beginning of his creation.

.Revelation 3:14
ASV(i) 14 And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God:

Oh, it's the same old BS in which you ultimately claim that God had/has more than one begotten Son in flat contradiction of John 3: 16.

Adam was a son of God by creation.
Jesus was the Son of God by begetting.
We are sons of God by faith.

How many sons of God does/did God have by creation? Just ONE - Adam. Procreation took care of the rest.

How many sons of God does/did God have by begetting? Just ONE - Jesus.

Mark it: you'll ultimately deny that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God. You have to. And in order not to do so, you have to assign non-existent meanings to the words.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,093
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 12:54:11 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 11:55:26 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:04:20 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:58:29 AM, v3nesl wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.


You don't create a son. Sons are born. So if you're going to do this kind of literalism, you'll have to have a heavenly Mother. Maybe you'd like being a Mormon better.

You JWs have it backwards, a basic logic flaw: God doesn't describe himself as father and son because he's like humans. Rather, when God created humans, he created them in his image. Humans are based on God, not the other way around. And obviously mortal man is not the exact representation of God in every respect. The fact that Adam had a beginning does not mean God had a beginning, right? Likewise, the fact that Jesus is called the Son does not mean HE had a beginning.

"You are greatly in error, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God". I trust you know who said that.

To humans, yes, but God created all his sons, but only created one of tehm on his own.

Job 1:6
ASV(i) 6 Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan also came among them.

All bar one created by God and his son. Only the son was his solo creation, literally the beginning of his creation.

.Revelation 3:14
ASV(i) 14 And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God:

Oh, it's the same old BS in which you ultimately claim that God had/has more than one begotten Son in flat contradiction of John 3: 16.

Adam was a son of God by creation.
Jesus was the Son of God by begetting.
We are sons of God by faith.

How many sons of God does/did God have by creation? Just ONE - Adam. Procreation took care of the rest.

How many sons of God does/did God have by begetting? Just ONE - Jesus.

Mark it: you'll ultimately deny that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God. You have to. And in order not to do so, you have to assign non-existent meanings to the words.

Glad to see your back, Anna!
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
annanicole
Posts: 19,784
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 1:03:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 12:54:11 PM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:55:26 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:04:20 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:58:29 AM, v3nesl wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.


You don't create a son. Sons are born. So if you're going to do this kind of literalism, you'll have to have a heavenly Mother. Maybe you'd like being a Mormon better.

You JWs have it backwards, a basic logic flaw: God doesn't describe himself as father and son because he's like humans. Rather, when God created humans, he created them in his image. Humans are based on God, not the other way around. And obviously mortal man is not the exact representation of God in every respect. The fact that Adam had a beginning does not mean God had a beginning, right? Likewise, the fact that Jesus is called the Son does not mean HE had a beginning.

"You are greatly in error, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God". I trust you know who said that.

To humans, yes, but God created all his sons, but only created one of tehm on his own.

Job 1:6
ASV(i) 6 Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan also came among them.

All bar one created by God and his son. Only the son was his solo creation, literally the beginning of his creation.

.Revelation 3:14
ASV(i) 14 And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God:

Oh, it's the same old BS in which you ultimately claim that God had/has more than one begotten Son in flat contradiction of John 3: 16.

Adam was a son of God by creation.
Jesus was the Son of God by begetting.
We are sons of God by faith.

How many sons of God does/did God have by creation? Just ONE - Adam. Procreation took care of the rest.

How many sons of God does/did God have by begetting? Just ONE - Jesus.

Mark it: you'll ultimately deny that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God. You have to. And in order not to do so, you have to assign non-existent meanings to the words.

Glad to see your back, Anna!

Thanks. I was out of town for about 3 wks.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 2:22:10 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 11:55:26 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:04:20 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:58:29 AM, v3nesl wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.


You don't create a son. Sons are born. So if you're going to do this kind of literalism, you'll have to have a heavenly Mother. Maybe you'd like being a Mormon better.

You JWs have it backwards, a basic logic flaw: God doesn't describe himself as father and son because he's like humans. Rather, when God created humans, he created them in his image. Humans are based on God, not the other way around. And obviously mortal man is not the exact representation of God in every respect. The fact that Adam had a beginning does not mean God had a beginning, right? Likewise, the fact that Jesus is called the Son does not mean HE had a beginning.

"You are greatly in error, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God". I trust you know who said that.

To humans, yes, but God created all his sons, but only created one of tehm on his own.

Job 1:6
ASV(i) 6 Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan also came among them.

All bar one created by God and his son. Only the son was his solo creation, literally the beginning of his creation.

.Revelation 3:14
ASV(i) 14 And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God:

Oh, it's the same old BS in which you ultimately claim that God had/has more than one begotten Son in flat contradiction of John 3: 16.

Adam was a son of God by creation.
Jesus was the Son of God by begetting.
We are sons of God by faith.

How many sons of God does/did God have by creation? Just ONE - Adam. Procreation took care of the rest.

How many sons of God does/did God have by begetting? Just ONE - Jesus. :
Mark it: you'll ultimately deny that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God. You have to. And in order not to do so, you have to assign non-existent meanings to the words.

OK Who was the Word John 1:1
ASV(i) 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
I"ll even use your favourite, provably deliberately altered translation, lol.
So the word was there from the beginning.
Who became Flesh Anna? John 1:14
ASV(i) 14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth.

OK it was the word who "became flesh, who took on the specially prepared body of Christ.

Actually begetting is used in scripture for both impregnation through intercourse and for creation, and since the Word is called God"s only begotten son in John 1:14, and was present with God in the beginning,

Jesus obviously only became God"s only begotten son, being born to a mother who was impregnated by holy spirit, not by God, Matthew 1:18
ASV(i) 18 Now the birth of Jesus Christ was on this wise: When his mother Mary had been betrothed to Joseph, before they came together she was found with child of the Holy Spirit.

As always with you I have used your favourite scripture to completely destroy your idiotic beliefs which you cannot hols to without denying either John 1:1 or John 1:14, and also Matthew 1:18.

So which scriptures are you going to deny this time to support your beliefs Anna. You can't hold to your beliefs withuot denying what they say.

Unlike you I beleive all scripture.

And if you call God a liar in one scripture that is all you need to do to become Apostate and a child of Satan.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 2:23:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 11:47:32 AM, dhardage wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:05:22 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:50:22 AM, dhardage wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.

Working with that son they then created, a universe and a planet earth, though at that point the earth was still "formless and waste".

He set a protective barrier of water, evidently in vapour form, around the earth, to give it a reasonably equal climate all round, greenhouse like. And when he had created vegetation and animals he then made a beautiful garden in the earth, created a man, Adam, and eventually a woman in that Garden, and gave them the task of populating the earth with humans with the same prospect of perfect human life in perfect health and perfect peace as was placed in front of them. They were intended to live eternally as long as they remained obedient to one simple law.

However before they got as far as having Children Adam sinned and lost himself and his progeny the chances he had been given.

Immediately God pronounced, to the serpent, Satan in disguise, that a "seed" would arrive that would do him fatal damage.

The next 4,000 years are covered in scripture by the record of the development of a family for that seed, towards the end identified as "The Messiah" or "The Christ"

Since God had set a time limit, the faith was allowed to die out by the end of the first century to await the time when Christ was allowed to take up his throne, just before which the enemy, Satan was finally barred from Heaven ad cast down to the earth to cause chaos down here, whilst God"s son, now the Christ, sorted out things ready for the time to come when, having gathered in a small group of followers who he taught to carry on the work he had left unfinished, as had the Apostles,, and gather as many as possible to his side before the "Great Day of God the Almighty" also known as Armageddon.

That war, for war between Satan"s hordes and those of God"s son, will result in the complete cleansing of the earth from all Satan"s works.

Then follows the resurrection of the dead, into brand new bodies with all the prospects that were before Adam and Eve, their training, a long period of practicing living God"s way without the interference of Satan, and then the final test.

The rest of God"s plan is detailed in the last three chapters of Revelation, and the end result is the earth returned to what it was intended to be, and mankind returned to what was intended for them.

Then God"s original plan for a Paradise earth populated by perfect humans will be back on course. That will include perfect peace, absolute peace such as it is impossible to know in this system, not just with each other, but with the animals also.

Fancy a part of that? I know I do.

Mildly interesting religious fiction, no factual information to back it up. I don't fancy anything so obviously false from the outset.

Apart from teh accuracy of scripture, no, but it is the story scripture tells.

You either believe the bible or you don;t, the choice is yours.

Of course, and since it has been proven wrong on so many different occasions, I make the reasoned choice not to believe it.

Scripture has never been proven wrong. so your decision is based on a faulty premise.
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 2:29:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 2:23:25 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:47:32 AM, dhardage wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:05:22 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:50:22 AM, dhardage wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.

Working with that son they then created, a universe and a planet earth, though at that point the earth was still "formless and waste".

He set a protective barrier of water, evidently in vapour form, around the earth, to give it a reasonably equal climate all round, greenhouse like. And when he had created vegetation and animals he then made a beautiful garden in the earth, created a man, Adam, and eventually a woman in that Garden, and gave them the task of populating the earth with humans with the same prospect of perfect human life in perfect health and perfect peace as was placed in front of them. They were intended to live eternally as long as they remained obedient to one simple law.

However before they got as far as having Children Adam sinned and lost himself and his progeny the chances he had been given.

Immediately God pronounced, to the serpent, Satan in disguise, that a "seed" would arrive that would do him fatal damage.

The next 4,000 years are covered in scripture by the record of the development of a family for that seed, towards the end identified as "The Messiah" or "The Christ"

Since God had set a time limit, the faith was allowed to die out by the end of the first century to await the time when Christ was allowed to take up his throne, just before which the enemy, Satan was finally barred from Heaven ad cast down to the earth to cause chaos down here, whilst God"s son, now the Christ, sorted out things ready for the time to come when, having gathered in a small group of followers who he taught to carry on the work he had left unfinished, as had the Apostles,, and gather as many as possible to his side before the "Great Day of God the Almighty" also known as Armageddon.

That war, for war between Satan"s hordes and those of God"s son, will result in the complete cleansing of the earth from all Satan"s works.

Then follows the resurrection of the dead, into brand new bodies with all the prospects that were before Adam and Eve, their training, a long period of practicing living God"s way without the interference of Satan, and then the final test.

The rest of God"s plan is detailed in the last three chapters of Revelation, and the end result is the earth returned to what it was intended to be, and mankind returned to what was intended for them.

Then God"s original plan for a Paradise earth populated by perfect humans will be back on course. That will include perfect peace, absolute peace such as it is impossible to know in this system, not just with each other, but with the animals also.

Fancy a part of that? I know I do.

Mildly interesting religious fiction, no factual information to back it up. I don't fancy anything so obviously false from the outset.

Apart from teh accuracy of scripture, no, but it is the story scripture tells.

You either believe the bible or you don;t, the choice is yours.

Of course, and since it has been proven wrong on so many different occasions, I make the reasoned choice not to believe it.

Scripture has never been proven wrong. so your decision is based on a faulty premise.

And you're full of it. It's got more holes than a ton of Swiss cheese, you just refuse to admit it. Anytime someone points out a fault you either make some kind of ad hoc translation or claim that the evidence is the work of Satan. You live in a tower of Invincible Ignorance, valiantly guarding your mythology from any inconvenient fact that can dispute it. There's nothing waiting at the end of this life but an end.
annanicole
Posts: 19,784
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 5:05:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 2:22:10 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:55:26 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:04:20 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:58:29 AM, v3nesl wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.


You don't create a son. Sons are born. So if you're going to do this kind of literalism, you'll have to have a heavenly Mother. Maybe you'd like being a Mormon better.

You JWs have it backwards, a basic logic flaw: God doesn't describe himself as father and son because he's like humans. Rather, when God created humans, he created them in his image. Humans are based on God, not the other way around. And obviously mortal man is not the exact representation of God in every respect. The fact that Adam had a beginning does not mean God had a beginning, right? Likewise, the fact that Jesus is called the Son does not mean HE had a beginning.

"You are greatly in error, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God". I trust you know who said that.

To humans, yes, but God created all his sons, but only created one of tehm on his own.

Job 1:6
ASV(i) 6 Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan also came among them.

All bar one created by God and his son. Only the son was his solo creation, literally the beginning of his creation.

.Revelation 3:14
ASV(i) 14 And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God:

Oh, it's the same old BS in which you ultimately claim that God had/has more than one begotten Son in flat contradiction of John 3: 16.

Adam was a son of God by creation.
Jesus was the Son of God by begetting.
We are sons of God by faith.

How many sons of God does/did God have by creation? Just ONE - Adam. Procreation took care of the rest.

How many sons of God does/did God have by begetting? Just ONE - Jesus. :
Mark it: you'll ultimately deny that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God. You have to. And in order not to do so, you have to assign non-existent meanings to the words.

OK Who was the Word John 1:1
ASV(i) 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
I"ll even use your favourite, provably deliberately altered translation, lol.
So the word was there from the beginning.
Who became Flesh Anna? John 1:14
ASV(i) 14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth.

OK it was the word who "became flesh, who took on the specially prepared body of Christ.

Actually begetting is used in scripture for both impregnation through intercourse and for creation, and since the Word is called God"s only begotten son in John 1:14, and was present with God in the beginning,

And what did I say?

"And in order not to do so, you have to assign non-existent meanings to the words."


As always with you I have used your favourite scripture to completely destroy your idiotic beliefs which you cannot hols to without denying either John 1:1 or John 1:14, and also Matthew 1:18.

" ... and the Word was God." Heck, you don't believe that. You flat-out deny it. 'Tis comical how you think you "use" scripture to destroy teachings, when the very scriptures you cite destroy your own notions.

Certainly the Word became flesh. Everyone knows that, because Jesus of Nazareth was God's only begotten Son.

By the way, when little Jesus was born, who was His biological father? Eh?
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 5:33:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 5:05:06 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 1/29/2015 2:22:10 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:55:26 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:04:20 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:58:29 AM, v3nesl wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.


You don't create a son. Sons are born. So if you're going to do this kind of literalism, you'll have to have a heavenly Mother. Maybe you'd like being a Mormon better.

You JWs have it backwards, a basic logic flaw: God doesn't describe himself as father and son because he's like humans. Rather, when God created humans, he created them in his image. Humans are based on God, not the other way around. And obviously mortal man is not the exact representation of God in every respect. The fact that Adam had a beginning does not mean God had a beginning, right? Likewise, the fact that Jesus is called the Son does not mean HE had a beginning.

"You are greatly in error, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God". I trust you know who said that.

To humans, yes, but God created all his sons, but only created one of tehm on his own.

Job 1:6
ASV(i) 6 Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan also came among them.

All bar one created by God and his son. Only the son was his solo creation, literally the beginning of his creation.

.Revelation 3:14
ASV(i) 14 And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God:

Oh, it's the same old BS in which you ultimately claim that God had/has more than one begotten Son in flat contradiction of John 3: 16.

Adam was a son of God by creation.
Jesus was the Son of God by begetting.
We are sons of God by faith.

How many sons of God does/did God have by creation? Just ONE - Adam. Procreation took care of the rest.

How many sons of God does/did God have by begetting? Just ONE - Jesus. :
Mark it: you'll ultimately deny that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God. You have to. And in order not to do so, you have to assign non-existent meanings to the words.

OK Who was the Word John 1:1
ASV(i) 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
I"ll even use your favourite, provably deliberately altered translation, lol.
So the word was there from the beginning.
Who became Flesh Anna? John 1:14
ASV(i) 14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth.

OK it was the word who "became flesh, who took on the specially prepared body of Christ.

Actually begetting is used in scripture for both impregnation through intercourse and for creation, and since the Word is called God"s only begotten son in John 1:14, and was present with God in the beginning,

And what did I say?

"And in order not to do so, you have to assign non-existent meanings to the words."



As always with you I have used your favourite scripture to completely destroy your idiotic beliefs which you cannot hols to without denying either John 1:1 or John 1:14, and also Matthew 1:18.

" ... and the Word was God." Heck, you don't believe that. You flat-out deny it. 'Tis comical how you think you "use" scripture to destroy teachings, when the very scriptures you cite destroy your own notions.

Certainly the Word became flesh. Everyone knows that, because Jesus of Nazareth was God's only begotten Son.

How does that work when it was as you admit the word that became flesh and the word existed untold millennia before Jesus?

Sorry Anna it is not me who has to invent meanings for words, it is you whop has to deny dictionarty fdefinitions. I inv ent nothing.


By the way, when little Jesus was born, who was His biological father? Eh?

He didn't have a biological father.

He was a new creation in his mother's womb. How else could an Adam like body be acheived? And he was thye second Adam, the exact equivalent of the first, a like for like, eye for eye sacrifice to Jehovah.

No Anna you weither turn round and accept what I have shown you to be teh truth from God's word or you do not.

The choice is yours..

You stick with your Apostate guides. I will stick with God Christ and holy spirit thanks.
Sterling.Dragon
Posts: 115
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 5:35:11 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.

Working with that son they then created, a universe and a planet earth, though at that point the earth was still "formless and waste".

He set a protective barrier of water, evidently in vapour form, around the earth, to give it a reasonably equal climate all round, greenhouse like. And when he had created vegetation and animals he then made a beautiful garden in the earth, created a man, Adam, and eventually a woman in that Garden, and gave them the task of populating the earth with humans with the same prospect of perfect human life in perfect health and perfect peace as was placed in front of them. They were intended to live eternally as long as they remained obedient to one simple law.

However before they got as far as having Children Adam sinned and lost himself and his progeny the chances he had been given.

Immediately God pronounced, to the serpent, Satan in disguise, that a "seed" would arrive that would do him fatal damage.

The next 4,000 years are covered in scripture by the record of the development of a family for that seed, towards the end identified as "The Messiah" or "The Christ"

Since God had set a time limit, the faith was allowed to die out by the end of the first century to await the time when Christ was allowed to take up his throne, just before which the enemy, Satan was finally barred from Heaven ad cast down to the earth to cause chaos down here, whilst God"s son, now the Christ, sorted out things ready for the time to come when, having gathered in a small group of followers who he taught to carry on the work he had left unfinished, as had the Apostles,, and gather as many as possible to his side before the "Great Day of God the Almighty" also known as Armageddon.

That war, for war between Satan"s hordes and those of God"s son, will result in the complete cleansing of the earth from all Satan"s works.

Then follows the resurrection of the dead, into brand new bodies with all the prospects that were before Adam and Eve, their training, a long period of practicing living God"s way without the interference of Satan, and then the final test.

The rest of God"s plan is detailed in the last three chapters of Revelation, and the end result is the earth returned to what it was intended to be, and mankind returned to what was intended for them.

Then God"s original plan for a Paradise earth populated by perfect humans will be back on course. That will include perfect peace, absolute peace such as it is impossible to know in this system, not just with each other, but with the animals also.

Fancy a part of that? I know I do.

And every single pretentious word of the preceding is hinged on the FAITH of the bible being the inerrant word of the god whose plan you just "outlined," as though you have KNOWLEDGE of its veracity.

The bible is pure, unadulterated, human garbage.
annanicole
Posts: 19,784
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 6:18:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 5:33:25 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 5:05:06 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 1/29/2015 2:22:10 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:55:26 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:04:20 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:58:29 AM, v3nesl wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.


You don't create a son. Sons are born. So if you're going to do this kind of literalism, you'll have to have a heavenly Mother. Maybe you'd like being a Mormon better.

You JWs have it backwards, a basic logic flaw: God doesn't describe himself as father and son because he's like humans. Rather, when God created humans, he created them in his image. Humans are based on God, not the other way around. And obviously mortal man is not the exact representation of God in every respect. The fact that Adam had a beginning does not mean God had a beginning, right? Likewise, the fact that Jesus is called the Son does not mean HE had a beginning.

"You are greatly in error, not knowing the scriptures or the power of God". I trust you know who said that.

To humans, yes, but God created all his sons, but only created one of tehm on his own.

Job 1:6
ASV(i) 6 Now it came to pass on the day when the sons of God came to present themselves before Jehovah, that Satan also came among them.

All bar one created by God and his son. Only the son was his solo creation, literally the beginning of his creation.

.Revelation 3:14
ASV(i) 14 And to the angel of the church in Laodicea write: These things saith the Amen, the faithful and true witness, the beginning of the creation of God:

Oh, it's the same old BS in which you ultimately claim that God had/has more than one begotten Son in flat contradiction of John 3: 16.

Adam was a son of God by creation.
Jesus was the Son of God by begetting.
We are sons of God by faith.

How many sons of God does/did God have by creation? Just ONE - Adam. Procreation took care of the rest.

How many sons of God does/did God have by begetting? Just ONE - Jesus. :
Mark it: you'll ultimately deny that Jesus Christ is the only begotten Son of God. You have to. And in order not to do so, you have to assign non-existent meanings to the words.

OK Who was the Word John 1:1
ASV(i) 1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God.
I"ll even use your favourite, provably deliberately altered translation, lol.
So the word was there from the beginning.
Who became Flesh Anna? John 1:14
ASV(i) 14 And the Word became flesh, and dwelt among us (and we beheld his glory, glory as of the only begotten from the Father), full of grace and truth.

OK it was the word who "became flesh, who took on the specially prepared body of Christ.

Actually begetting is used in scripture for both impregnation through intercourse and for creation, and since the Word is called God"s only begotten son in John 1:14, and was present with God in the beginning,

And what did I say?

"And in order not to do so, you have to assign non-existent meanings to the words."



As always with you I have used your favourite scripture to completely destroy your idiotic beliefs which you cannot hols to without denying either John 1:1 or John 1:14, and also Matthew 1:18.

" ... and the Word was God." Heck, you don't believe that. You flat-out deny it. 'Tis comical how you think you "use" scripture to destroy teachings, when the very scriptures you cite destroy your own notions.

Certainly the Word became flesh. Everyone knows that, because Jesus of Nazareth was God's only begotten Son.

How does that work when it was as you admit the word that became flesh and the word existed untold millennia before Jesus?

Sorry Anna it is not me who has to invent meanings for words, it is you whop has to deny dictionarty fdefinitions. I inv ent nothing.



By the way, when little Jesus was born, who was His biological father? Eh?

He didn't have a biological father.

He was a new creation in his mother's womb. How else could an Adam like body be acheived? And he was thye second Adam, the exact equivalent of the first, a like for like, eye for eye sacrifice to Jehovah.

LMAO @ "He didn't have a biological father".

Well, we'll go one further: who was His biological mother? This oughta be good.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
uncung
Posts: 3,433
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 7:03:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Scripture has never been proven wrong. so your decision is based on a faulty premise.

What about these?:
NU 25:9 24,000 died in the plague.
1CO 10:8 23,000 died in the plague.

1SA 17:50 David killed Goliath with a slingshot.
1SA 17:51 David killed Goliath (again?) with a sword.

1SA 31:4-6 Saul killed himself by falling on his sword.
2SA 1:2-10 Saul, at his own request, was slain by an Amalekite.
2SA 21:12 Saul was killed by the Philistines on Gilboa.
1CH 10:13-14 Saul was slain by God.

2SA 24:1 The Lord inspired David to take the census.
1CH 21:1 Satan inspired the census.

1KI 5:16 Solomon had 3,300 supervisors.
2CH 2:2 He had 3,600 supervisors.

1KI 9:28 420 talents of gold were brought back from Ophir.
2CH 8:18 450 talents of gold were brought back from Ophir.

1KI 16:6-8 Baasha died in the 26th year of King Asa's reign.
2CH 16:1 Baasha built a city in the 36th year of King Asa's reign.

2KI 24:17 Jehoiachin (Jehoaikim) was succeeded by his uncle.
2CH 36:10 He was succeeded by his brother.

and the list goes on.
SamStevens
Posts: 3,819
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 7:47:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 2:23:25 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:47:32 AM, dhardage wrote:
At 1/29/2015 11:05:22 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:50:22 AM, dhardage wrote:
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.

Working with that son they then created, a universe and a planet earth, though at that point the earth was still "formless and waste".

He set a protective barrier of water, evidently in vapour form, around the earth, to give it a reasonably equal climate all round, greenhouse like. And when he had created vegetation and animals he then made a beautiful garden in the earth, created a man, Adam, and eventually a woman in that Garden, and gave them the task of populating the earth with humans with the same prospect of perfect human life in perfect health and perfect peace as was placed in front of them. They were intended to live eternally as long as they remained obedient to one simple law.

However before they got as far as having Children Adam sinned and lost himself and his progeny the chances he had been given.

Immediately God pronounced, to the serpent, Satan in disguise, that a "seed" would arrive that would do him fatal damage.

The next 4,000 years are covered in scripture by the record of the development of a family for that seed, towards the end identified as "The Messiah" or "The Christ"

Since God had set a time limit, the faith was allowed to die out by the end of the first century to await the time when Christ was allowed to take up his throne, just before which the enemy, Satan was finally barred from Heaven ad cast down to the earth to cause chaos down here, whilst God"s son, now the Christ, sorted out things ready for the time to come when, having gathered in a small group of followers who he taught to carry on the work he had left unfinished, as had the Apostles,, and gather as many as possible to his side before the "Great Day of God the Almighty" also known as Armageddon.

That war, for war between Satan"s hordes and those of God"s son, will result in the complete cleansing of the earth from all Satan"s works.

Then follows the resurrection of the dead, into brand new bodies with all the prospects that were before Adam and Eve, their training, a long period of practicing living God"s way without the interference of Satan, and then the final test.

The rest of God"s plan is detailed in the last three chapters of Revelation, and the end result is the earth returned to what it was intended to be, and mankind returned to what was intended for them.

Then God"s original plan for a Paradise earth populated by perfect humans will be back on course. That will include perfect peace, absolute peace such as it is impossible to know in this system, not just with each other, but with the animals also.

Fancy a part of that? I know I do.

Mildly interesting religious fiction, no factual information to back it up. I don't fancy anything so obviously false from the outset.

Apart from teh accuracy of scripture, no, but it is the story scripture tells.

You either believe the bible or you don;t, the choice is yours.

Of course, and since it has been proven wrong on so many different occasions, I make the reasoned choice not to believe it.

Scripture has never been proven wrong. so your decision is based on a faulty premise.

The origin of creation in Genesis 1 is incorrect. The Earth did not form before the Sun, or other stars in the universe.

http://christiananswers.net...
http://www.nhm.ac.uk...
"This is the true horror of religion. It allows perfectly decent and sane people to believe by the billions, what only lunatics could believe on their own." Sam Harris
Life asked Death "Why do people love me but hate you?"
Death responded: "Because you are a beautiful lie, and I am the painful truth."
NoMagic
Posts: 507
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 7:52:10 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.

Working with that son they then created, a universe and a planet earth, though at that point the earth was still "formless and waste".

He set a protective barrier of water, evidently in vapour form, around the earth, to give it a reasonably equal climate all round, greenhouse like. And when he had created vegetation and animals he then made a beautiful garden in the earth, created a man, Adam, and eventually a woman in that Garden, and gave them the task of populating the earth with humans with the same prospect of perfect human life in perfect health and perfect peace as was placed in front of them. They were intended to live eternally as long as they remained obedient to one simple law.

However before they got as far as having Children Adam sinned and lost himself and his progeny the chances he had been given.

Immediately God pronounced, to the serpent, Satan in disguise, that a "seed" would arrive that would do him fatal damage.

The next 4,000 years are covered in scripture by the record of the development of a family for that seed, towards the end identified as "The Messiah" or "The Christ"

Since God had set a time limit, the faith was allowed to die out by the end of the first century to await the time when Christ was allowed to take up his throne, just before which the enemy, Satan was finally barred from Heaven ad cast down to the earth to cause chaos down here, whilst God"s son, now the Christ, sorted out things ready for the time to come when, having gathered in a small group of followers who he taught to carry on the work he had left unfinished, as had the Apostles,, and gather as many as possible to his side before the "Great Day of God the Almighty" also known as Armageddon.

That war, for war between Satan"s hordes and those of God"s son, will result in the complete cleansing of the earth from all Satan"s works.

Then follows the resurrection of the dead, into brand new bodies with all the prospects that were before Adam and Eve, their training, a long period of practicing living God"s way without the interference of Satan, and then the final test.

The rest of God"s plan is detailed in the last three chapters of Revelation, and the end result is the earth returned to what it was intended to be, and mankind returned to what was intended for them.

Then God"s original plan for a Paradise earth populated by perfect humans will be back on course. That will include perfect peace, absolute peace such as it is impossible to know in this system, not just with each other, but with the animals also.

Fancy a part of that? I know I do.
Let me ask your opinion here. It seems to me that according to scripture god did have a plan. To create a "perfect" world. Yet that plan clearly failed. All he has to do, is not plant the tree. He didn't want Adam or Eve to eat from it anyway. So why plant it? It also seems to me, if god is what he is described to be, then he would know that they would eat from the tree. So why plant it? It doesn't make sense to me for god to plant the tree. What do you think?
Composer
Posts: 5,858
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 9:38:50 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Even the Botchtower itself doesn't believe MCB and they evicted him!

MCB keeps referring to a Satan supernatural naughty being, but despite my challenge to MCB according to his own claims, using the YLT & E.D. he ran for cover instead!

The fruits of MCB's ideology also proves he is a suicidal prone fraud, whose salvation ultimately rests entirely on his DOGS!

So IF you want to be a suicidal prone religious fraud & jebus' reject, whose salvation ultimately rests with Dog(s) then MCB's ideology is your best choice!
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/29/2015 9:55:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/29/2015 10:45:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Yes, God has a plan, and it involves his son to a great extent, though that is not revealed for some time.

The first two chapters of Genesis outline the plan.

Jehovah, for such turned out to be his name, at least in its English version, created a son.

Working with that son they then created, a universe and a planet earth, though at that point the earth was still "formless and waste".

He set a protective barrier of water, evidently in vapour form, around the earth, to give it a reasonably equal climate all round, greenhouse like. And when he had created vegetation and animals he then made a beautiful garden in the earth, created a man, Adam, and eventually a woman in that Garden, and gave them the task of populating the earth with humans with the same prospect of perfect human life in perfect health and perfect peace as was placed in front of them. They were intended to live eternally as long as they remained obedient to one simple law.

However before they got as far as having Children Adam sinned and lost himself and his progeny the chances he had been given.

Immediately God pronounced, to the serpent, Satan in disguise, that a "seed" would arrive that would do him fatal damage.

The next 4,000 years are covered in scripture by the record of the development of a family for that seed, towards the end identified as "The Messiah" or "The Christ"

Since God had set a time limit, the faith was allowed to die out by the end of the first century to await the time when Christ was allowed to take up his throne, just before which the enemy, Satan was finally barred from Heaven ad cast down to the earth to cause chaos down here, whilst God"s son, now the Christ, sorted out things ready for the time to come when, having gathered in a small group of followers who he taught to carry on the work he had left unfinished, as had the Apostles,, and gather as many as possible to his side before the "Great Day of God the Almighty" also known as Armageddon.

That war, for war between Satan"s hordes and those of God"s son, will result in the complete cleansing of the earth from all Satan"s works.

Then follows the resurrection of the dead, into brand new bodies with all the prospects that were before Adam and Eve, their training, a long period of practicing living God"s way without the interference of Satan, and then the final test.

The rest of God"s plan is detailed in the last three chapters of Revelation, and the end result is the earth returned to what it was intended to be, and mankind returned to what was intended for them.

Then God"s original plan for a Paradise earth populated by perfect humans will be back on course. That will include perfect peace, absolute peace such as it is impossible to know in this system, not just with each other, but with the animals also.

Fancy a part of that? I know I do.

You know nothing except a few things written in the Bible that you have interpreted without the authority of our Creator who had us saints and prophets testify for Him. It's impossible for you heathens to understand the prophecies and teach them to God's chosen believers who listen to us saints speak to them.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/30/2015 1:24:24 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
God's plan is this;

This first age was put together by our Creator to teach us who we are in Him before He destroys this world. He used His prophets and us saints to testify to His knowledge to learn who we are and how He created us.

The second age was planned and created for His creation to experience an eternity full of visions and dreams.

There is no purpose to God creating everything other than He can. Wouldn't you create a universe if you could do it?
Beginner
Posts: 4,292
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/30/2015 1:29:17 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/30/2015 1:24:24 AM, bornofgod wrote:
God's plan is this;

This first age was put together by our Creator to teach us who we are in Him before He destroys this world. He used His prophets and us saints to testify to His knowledge to learn who we are and how He created us.

The second age was planned and created for His creation to experience an eternity full of visions and dreams.

There is no purpose to God creating everything other than He can. Wouldn't you create a universe if you could do it?

Honest question: Do you take narcotics or drugs?
Senpai has noticed you.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/30/2015 1:32:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/30/2015 1:29:17 AM, Beginner wrote:
At 1/30/2015 1:24:24 AM, bornofgod wrote:
God's plan is this;

This first age was put together by our Creator to teach us who we are in Him before He destroys this world. He used His prophets and us saints to testify to His knowledge to learn who we are and how He created us.

The second age was planned and created for His creation to experience an eternity full of visions and dreams.

There is no purpose to God creating everything other than He can. Wouldn't you create a universe if you could do it?

Honest question: Do you take narcotics or drugs?

Why would I take narcotics or drugs after God removed my desire to drink alcohol and do drugs 35 years ago?
Beginner
Posts: 4,292
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/30/2015 1:40:59 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/30/2015 1:32:14 AM, bornofgod wrote:
At 1/30/2015 1:29:17 AM, Beginner wrote:
At 1/30/2015 1:24:24 AM, bornofgod wrote:
God's plan is this;

This first age was put together by our Creator to teach us who we are in Him before He destroys this world. He used His prophets and us saints to testify to His knowledge to learn who we are and how He created us.

The second age was planned and created for His creation to experience an eternity full of visions and dreams.

There is no purpose to God creating everything other than He can. Wouldn't you create a universe if you could do it?

Honest question: Do you take narcotics or drugs?

Why would I take narcotics or drugs after God removed my desire to drink alcohol and do drugs 35 years ago?

Mayhaps you seek pleasure or physical/psychological gratification? Narcotics and drugs do both.
Do you have any known doctoral diagnosis on your health that you could share?
Senpai has noticed you.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/30/2015 1:42:48 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/30/2015 1:40:59 AM, Beginner wrote:
At 1/30/2015 1:32:14 AM, bornofgod wrote:
At 1/30/2015 1:29:17 AM, Beginner wrote:
At 1/30/2015 1:24:24 AM, bornofgod wrote:
God's plan is this;

This first age was put together by our Creator to teach us who we are in Him before He destroys this world. He used His prophets and us saints to testify to His knowledge to learn who we are and how He created us.

The second age was planned and created for His creation to experience an eternity full of visions and dreams.

There is no purpose to God creating everything other than He can. Wouldn't you create a universe if you could do it?

Honest question: Do you take narcotics or drugs?

Why would I take narcotics or drugs after God removed my desire to drink alcohol and do drugs 35 years ago?

Mayhaps you seek pleasure or physical/psychological gratification? Narcotics and drugs do both.
Do you have any known doctoral diagnosis on your health that you could share?

No, but I possess the knowledge of God. If you want to learn about the future, then start listening to His voice that I testify to;

End of Age
http://www.debate.org...

Life after death video;
http://www.debate.org...

The future;
http://www.debate.org...

What is a sinner;
http://www.debate.org...

The gospel of Brad;
http://www.debate.org...

Gospel, Voice of the Lord and Word of the Lord
http://www.debate.org...
Beginner
Posts: 4,292
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
1/30/2015 1:52:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/30/2015 1:42:48 AM, bornofgod wrote:
At 1/30/2015 1:40:59 AM, Beginner wrote:
At 1/30/2015 1:32:14 AM, bornofgod wrote:
At 1/30/2015 1:29:17 AM, Beginner wrote:
At 1/30/2015 1:24:24 AM, bornofgod wrote:
God's plan is this;

This first age was put together by our Creator to teach us who we are in Him before He destroys this world. He used His prophets and us saints to testify to His knowledge to learn who we are and how He created us.

The second age was planned and created for His creation to experience an eternity full of visions and dreams.

There is no purpose to God creating everything other than He can. Wouldn't you create a universe if you could do it?

Honest question: Do you take narcotics or drugs?

Why would I take narcotics or drugs after God removed my desire to drink alcohol and do drugs 35 years ago?

Mayhaps you seek pleasure or physical/psychological gratification? Narcotics and drugs do both.
Do you have any known doctoral diagnosis on your health that you could share?

You must've been quite handsome when you were younger. :)
Senpai has noticed you.