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The Soul

AIyssa
Posts: 63
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1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.
wsmunit7
Posts: 1,318
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1/31/2015 7:14:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Or, statistically speaking, just a unique combination of atoms amongst the trillions of possibilities that make up the physical you.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,597
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1/31/2015 7:22:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Not really, it just shows you have a brain and so does everyone else.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
NoMagic
Posts: 507
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1/31/2015 7:26:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.
Consciousness is defined by being self aware. You know you exist. If I made a robot that was self aware, the robot still wouldn't have a soul. Just because you know you exist, that doesn't grant you a soul. You can still be a bag of flesh that knows it exists. And that is most likely exactly what you are.
Gentorev
Posts: 2,891
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1/31/2015 7:32:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

The root to the word "BRAHMAN" originally meant "SPEECH", much the same as the "LOGOS" is said to mean "WORD," but both are in fact, the gathered genetic information of every universal body throughout all eternity. Both Brahman and Logos, should be seen as the essential divine reality of the universe the eternal spirit from which all being originates, and to which all must return.

You are body, soul and spirit. Your body is made up from the universal elements, and it is activated by the universal soul, which is the animating principle that pervades the entire universal body, activating everything within the universe, from the wave particles to the subatomic particles that make up the atoms which are the building blocks of the molecules from which the universal body is created. It is to the universal soul=LIFE-FORCE that all information = SPIRIT is gathered.

"YOU" the mind, are spirit. The body in which you, [The mind] are developing as the supreme head and controller of that body, is made up of the universal elements, which is activated by the soul [Animating life force] to which all the spirit [gathered information] of all your ancestors, human and prehuman, has been gathered in the evolution of whatever was in the beginning to become who you are, and that parental spirit dwells behind the veil to the inner most sanctuary of its earthly tabernacle=tent, which is your body.

If that body in which your parental spirit dwells, were born without the sense of sight, hearing, smell, taste, touch, etc, then no information whatsoever could be taken into the brain, and "YOU" who are spirit [Gathered information] in this particular life cycle, could never have begun to develop and the living body, in which the parental spirit dwells, would soon die, never having developed a personality = "CONTROLLING GODHEAD" to that body.

There was a door to which I found no key
There was the veil through which I might not see
Some little talk awhile of Me and Thee
There was---and then no more of Thee and Me

And Earth could not answer; nor the seas that mourn
In flowing purple, of their Lord forlorn;
Nor rolling heaven, with all his signs revealed
And hidden by the sleeves of Night and Morn

Then of the Thee in Me who works behind
The veil, I lifted up my hands to find
A lamp amid the Darkness; and I heard,
As from Without__ "The Me within Thee is blind.".... By Omar Khayyam.

When the body in which you [the mind] are being formed, dies, [This is the first death] and your body: "skin, flesh, muscle, blood, bone, brain matter etc, etc," has returned to the universal elements from which it was created, all that remains, is a shadow or rather, a facsimile of YOU = the mind=spirit, that has been imprinted into the universal life force=soul, from which it will be resurrected in the next cycle of universal activity. Unless of course, the information=spirit that is "YOU" is divided from the universal life-force, which is the second death. For the spirit=information that is you, can be divided from the universal soul----------"For the word of God is alive and active, sharper than any two edged sword. It cuts all the way through to the division of the soul and spirit."

The term, "THE WORD OF GOD," pertains to the sense that is identical to the term "LOGOS" or the mold. The mold by which the whole sense of a thing is given. In other words, the very plan from the outset. In Sanskrit the similar meaning is given in the use of the word 'vach.' Vach means word. But in Sanskrit teachings of the Sanatana Dharma, vach has many levels. Including where the word is first considered as being in the mind as a thought, not as the spoken word or speech.
AIyssa
Posts: 63
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1/31/2015 9:52:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:14:06 PM, wsmunit7 wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Or, statistically speaking, just a unique combination of atoms amongst the trillions of possibilities that make up the physical you.

You're right, I am a unique combination of trillions of possibilities, but why this specific combination? Why do I inhabit and control this body instead of any other body? Why do I see out of these eyes? Maybe my having a soul might have to do with why I control this bag of conscious flesh and not any other bag of conscious flesh. See what I mean?
AIyssa
Posts: 63
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1/31/2015 9:55:43 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:22:17 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Not really, it just shows you have a brain and so does everyone else.

Exactly! But why do I have conscious control of this brain and not any other brain? Why do I live in this specific brain? I'm not saying I don't have a brain or anything. I've just been wondering why this brain and not other brains? Why do I inhabit and live through this body and not other bodies?
AIyssa
Posts: 63
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1/31/2015 9:58:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:26:52 PM, NoMagic wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.
Consciousness is defined by being self aware. You know you exist. If I made a robot that was self aware, the robot still wouldn't have a soul. Just because you know you exist, that doesn't grant you a soul. You can still be a bag of flesh that knows it exists. And that is most likely exactly what you are.

I don't think that's it. I know I exist, but I verify my existence and the existence of everything else from this bag of flesh specifically. That's what I find curious. Why this one? Why do I see from these eyes, feel from this body and not other bodies? Randomly I am placed in control of this body of all bodies. See what I mean?
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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1/31/2015 10:01:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

I think consciousness is an illusion. It helps us keep our sanity but in reality, we're all philosophical zombies.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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1/31/2015 10:01:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Yes, we all came from the thoughts of God ( consciousness ) but the characters ( men and beasts ) that He created within His thoughts are separate characters. Each character ( soul ) gets processed information ( God's thoughts as wavelengths of energy ) to experience an observable world. As we connect and tell each other what we observe, smell, taste, touch, hear and feel emotionally, the world becomes bigger and bigger.

Think of each person as getting a world of information to experience. As we share these worlds of information to each other, the world grows and now we have a huge universe of experiences today because of us sharing with each other. Can you imagine how small our worlds would be if we couldn't communicate our world of experiences to each other.
AIyssa
Posts: 63
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1/31/2015 10:03:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 10:01:01 PM, Wylted wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

I think consciousness is an illusion. It helps us keep our sanity but in reality, we're all philosophical zombies.

I don't know what being a philosophical zombie really means but consciousness is definitely real insofar as I control and see things from my perspective. At least I have a soul?
AIyssa
Posts: 63
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1/31/2015 10:09:16 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 10:01:58 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Yes, we all came from the thoughts of God ( consciousness ) but the characters ( men and beasts ) that He created within His thoughts are separate characters. Each character ( soul ) gets processed information ( God's thoughts as wavelengths of energy ) to experience an observable world. As we connect and tell each other what we observe, smell, taste, touch, hear and feel emotionally, the world becomes bigger and bigger.

Think of each person as getting a world of information to experience. As we share these worlds of information to each other, the world grows and now we have a huge universe of experiences today because of us sharing with each other. Can you imagine how small our worlds would be if we couldn't communicate our world of experiences to each other.

We'd have a lot less knowledge that's for sure.
AIyssa
Posts: 63
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1/31/2015 10:12:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 10:01:58 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Yes, we all came from the thoughts of God ( consciousness ) but the characters ( men and beasts ) that He created within His thoughts are separate characters. Each character ( soul ) gets processed information ( God's thoughts as wavelengths of energy ) to experience an observable world. As we connect and tell each other what we observe, smell, taste, touch, hear and feel emotionally, the world becomes bigger and bigger.

Think of each person as getting a world of information to experience. As we share these worlds of information to each other, the world grows and now we have a huge universe of experiences today because of us sharing with each other. Can you imagine how small our worlds would be if we couldn't communicate our world of experiences to each other.

How do you know that God is responsible? What about other religions with lots of Gods? Like Buddhism. Everyone human being might have been a God of some kind, but we've fallen to Earth where it's our last chance to attain enlightenment!
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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1/31/2015 10:14:59 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 10:03:54 PM, AIyssa wrote:
At 1/31/2015 10:01:01 PM, Wylted wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

I think consciousness is an illusion. It helps us keep our sanity but in reality, we're all philosophical zombies.

I don't know what being a philosophical zombie really means but consciousness is definitely real insofar as I control and see things from my perspective. At least I have a soul?

It certainly feels that way
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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1/31/2015 10:16:47 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 10:12:09 PM, AIyssa wrote:
At 1/31/2015 10:01:58 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Yes, we all came from the thoughts of God ( consciousness ) but the characters ( men and beasts ) that He created within His thoughts are separate characters. Each character ( soul ) gets processed information ( God's thoughts as wavelengths of energy ) to experience an observable world. As we connect and tell each other what we observe, smell, taste, touch, hear and feel emotionally, the world becomes bigger and bigger.

Think of each person as getting a world of information to experience. As we share these worlds of information to each other, the world grows and now we have a huge universe of experiences today because of us sharing with each other. Can you imagine how small our worlds would be if we couldn't communicate our world of experiences to each other.

How do you know that God is responsible? What about other religions with lots of Gods? Like Buddhism. Everyone human being might have been a God of some kind, but we've fallen to Earth where it's our last chance to attain enlightenment!

I've known our Creator who is invisible to us since December 7th, 1979. Since then, He has directly taught me everything He wanted me to know before I'm killed. Now I know we're all living in a dream ( virtual reality ) created by our Creator whom we may never get to see unless He can take a picture of Himself and show us in the New Heaven and Earth that we'll be living in after this world is destroyed.
Beastt
Posts: 5,135
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2/1/2015 12:23:09 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

I think you'd be more correct to say that you WANT the conscious mind to be an indication of the existence of the soul. The point to be had here is that it's nothing of the sort. Consciousness arises from the ability of multiple processes sing centers in the brain, being able to cross-monitor. This allows you to monitor your own thought processes, and that's what self-awareness is. If you had the ability to see through the eyes of another, or hear through their ears, then perhaps you could try to make an argument for the soul. The fact that you can't do that is evidence that your body, your person, and your consciousness are all physical manifestations, and offer no non-physical aspects. Your brain is physically connected to your eyes, and not to anyone elses eyes. That physical connection is required or you won't see anything. If that connection is severed, interrupted chemically, or suspended due to trauma, you'll lose the ability to see through even your own eyes. And that's because all of your senses, including your sense of self, are purely physical phenomena.
"If we believe absurdities we shall commit atrocities." -- Voltaire
Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,280
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2/1/2015 12:41:59 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:26:52 PM, NoMagic wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.
Consciousness is defined by being self aware. You know you exist. If I made a robot that was self aware, the robot still wouldn't have a soul. Just because you know you exist, that doesn't grant you a soul. You can still be a bag of flesh that knows it exists. And that is most likely exactly what you are.

This discussion always reminds me of one of my favorite Isaac Asimov quotes.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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2/1/2015 10:14:20 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
I believe the 'soul' is just another name for consciousness, it needs a mind and body to support it!
NoMagic
Posts: 507
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2/1/2015 11:04:40 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 9:58:34 PM, AIyssa wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:26:52 PM, NoMagic wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.
Consciousness is defined by being self aware. You know you exist. If I made a robot that was self aware, the robot still wouldn't have a soul. Just because you know you exist, that doesn't grant you a soul. You can still be a bag of flesh that knows it exists. And that is most likely exactly what you are.

I don't think that's it. I know I exist, but I verify my existence and the existence of everything else from this bag of flesh specifically. That's what I find curious. Why this one? Why do I see from these eyes, feel from this body and not other bodies? Randomly I am placed in control of this body of all bodies. See what I mean?
For one, you've made an unwarranted assumption. "Randomly I am placed in control of this body of all bodies." Why do you think you where placed in your body? Instead of the more simple option, your are your body, you are your genes, the sum of all your physical parts is you. These are the eyes you see the world through.
Gentorev
Posts: 2,891
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2/1/2015 9:54:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/1/2015 11:04:40 AM, NoMagic wrote:
At 1/31/2015 9:58:34 PM, AIyssa wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:26:52 PM, NoMagic wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.
Consciousness is defined by being self aware. You know you exist. If I made a robot that was self aware, the robot still wouldn't have a soul. Just because you know you exist, that doesn't grant you a soul. You can still be a bag of flesh that knows it exists. And that is most likely exactly what you are.

I don't think that's it. I know I exist, but I verify my existence and the existence of everything else from this bag of flesh specifically. That's what I find curious. Why this one? Why do I see from these eyes, feel from this body and not other bodies? Randomly I am placed in control of this body of all bodies. See what I mean?
For one, you've made an unwarranted assumption. "Randomly I am placed in control of this body of all bodies." Why do you think you where placed in your body? Instead of the more simple option, your are your body, you are your genes, the sum of all your physical parts is you. These are the eyes you see the world through.

The body was born, in which all your ancestral spirits dwell within the innermost sanctuary of that body (The Matrix cells) and "YOU" the mind grew into that body from the information that was taken into the brain through the physical receptors of that body, such as eyes, nostrils, ears, tongue, nerves ends, etc.

Without those physical receptors, no information could be taken into the brain and 'YOU" the invisible mind, could never have begun to develop as the controlling godhead to that body, and that body alone.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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2/1/2015 10:20:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/1/2015 12:23:09 AM, Beastt wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

I think you'd be more correct to say that you WANT the conscious mind to be an indication of the existence of the soul. The point to be had here is that it's nothing of the sort. Consciousness arises from the ability of multiple processes sing centers in the brain, being able to cross-monitor. This allows you to monitor your own thought processes, and that's what self-awareness is. If you had the ability to see through the eyes of another, or hear through their ears, then perhaps you could try to make an argument for the soul. The fact that you can't do that is evidence that your body, your person, and your consciousness are all physical manifestations, and offer no non-physical aspects. Your brain is physically connected to your eyes, and not to anyone elses eyes. That physical connection is required or you won't see anything. If that connection is severed, interrupted chemically, or suspended due to trauma, you'll lose the ability to see through even your own eyes. And that's because all of your senses, including your sense of self, are purely physical phenomena.

I understand that you have no knowledge of quantum physics or relative theory. You believe what you observe is our reality.
Gentorev
Posts: 2,891
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2/2/2015 3:50:01 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/1/2015 10:20:36 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 2/1/2015 12:23:09 AM, Beastt wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

I think you'd be more correct to say that you WANT the conscious mind to be an indication of the existence of the soul. The point to be had here is that it's nothing of the sort. Consciousness arises from the ability of multiple processes sing centers in the brain, being able to cross-monitor. This allows you to monitor your own thought processes, and that's what self-awareness is. If you had the ability to see through the eyes of another, or hear through their ears, then perhaps you could try to make an argument for the soul. The fact that you can't do that is evidence that your body, your person, and your consciousness are all physical manifestations, and offer no non-physical aspects. Your brain is physically connected to your eyes, and not to anyone elses eyes. That physical connection is required or you won't see anything. If that connection is severed, interrupted chemically, or suspended due to trauma, you'll lose the ability to see through even your own eyes. And that's because all of your senses, including your sense of self, are purely physical phenomena.

I understand that you have no knowledge of quantum physics or relative theory. You believe what you observe is our reality.

"There has been extensive research on the presence of mind in our bodies, that suggests that the neuropeptides, chemical substances that form the communication network of our emotions, are present not just in the brain, but everywhere in the body. As Dr. Cadence Pert, chief of brain biochemistry at the National Institute of Mental Health in the US writes, "These findings go beyond the often mentioned concept of power of mind over body. Indeed, the more we know about neuropeptides, the harder it is to think in the traditional terms of a mind and a body. It makes more and more sense of a single integrated entity, a body-mind.
jodybirdy
Posts: 2,089
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2/2/2015 4:45:49 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Alyssa is gone. Oh well. I'll answer this anyway.

If you look at the world around you and note the complexity of even the tiniest and insignificant things that you see, then you will notice something amazing. Sugar ants have tiny little hairs on their backs. Bees have complex antennae. An acorn contains everything that is needed to create a majestic oak tree out of soil, sun, and water. Even though two ants are similar they are different, because they simply are their own organisms. Consider the genetic code inside of a regular little honey bee. When you really think about this it becomes easier to fathom that you are individually unique. Your flesh, bones, and even your thoughts, are a part of the functioning organism that is you. You are incredibly beautiful, precious, and unique even without a soul. Don't worry too much about existence, worry about making your days worthwhile.
A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral."
Gentorev
Posts: 2,891
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2/2/2015 6:22:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/2/2015 4:45:49 AM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Alyssa is gone. Oh well. I'll answer this anyway.

If you look at the world around you and note the complexity of even the tiniest and insignificant things that you see, then you will notice something amazing. Sugar ants have tiny little hairs on their backs. Bees have complex antennae. An acorn contains everything that is needed to create a majestic oak tree out of soil, sun, and water. Even though two ants are similar they are different, because they simply are their own organisms. Consider the genetic code inside of a regular little honey bee. When you really think about this it becomes easier to fathom that you are individually unique. Your flesh, bones, and even your thoughts, are a part of the functioning organism that is you. You are incredibly beautiful, precious, and unique even without a soul. Don't worry too much about existence, worry about making your days worthwhile.

Yea! It makes you wonder dont it Jody? Go back a million years or so, and you will not find an Oak tree, its ancestor will be there, but you will not be able to recognise it it.

Its ancestor will gather information which will be imprinted into its seed, which, when grown, will gather more information which will be imprinted in its seed, etc, etc, until in a million years or so we finally have an oak tree, which is still in the process of evolution. gathering information, which is imprinted into its seed, etc, etc.

Do you believe that mankind closes the process of evolution, or could there possibly be A "SON OF MAN?"

THE ONLY CONSTANT

I never cease to wonder "mid the lightening and the thunder
How a million tons of water can just hang there in the sky
And snowflakes, have you seen "em? Such diversity between "em
Never two of them the same, I wonder why?

Nature poses many questions and though the scientists may test them
And discover many secrets that she hides
I"ll bet if they could live forever with all their studies and endeavours
In the end they"d be like us, still mystified

For the world is ever changing, interacting, rearranging
The only constant that you"ll find is constant change
Take a plant as one example and the evidence is ample
You"ll never find a pair that are the same

Or view it from a different slant take a photo of a plant
And each successive------generation as it grows
Then in a million years or so compare the last and first photo
Or better still run all the film out, in one long row

Then you"ll see the gradual change no two plants can be the same
Old evolution definitely holds her sway
For each seed must hold within it all the experience of its parent
In the end result each plant will have a say...........By Gentorev.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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2/2/2015 10:36:03 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/2/2015 3:50:01 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 2/1/2015 10:20:36 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 2/1/2015 12:23:09 AM, Beastt wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

I think you'd be more correct to say that you WANT the conscious mind to be an indication of the existence of the soul. The point to be had here is that it's nothing of the sort. Consciousness arises from the ability of multiple processes sing centers in the brain, being able to cross-monitor. This allows you to monitor your own thought processes, and that's what self-awareness is. If you had the ability to see through the eyes of another, or hear through their ears, then perhaps you could try to make an argument for the soul. The fact that you can't do that is evidence that your body, your person, and your consciousness are all physical manifestations, and offer no non-physical aspects. Your brain is physically connected to your eyes, and not to anyone elses eyes. That physical connection is required or you won't see anything. If that connection is severed, interrupted chemically, or suspended due to trauma, you'll lose the ability to see through even your own eyes. And that's because all of your senses, including your sense of self, are purely physical phenomena.

I understand that you have no knowledge of quantum physics or relative theory. You believe what you observe is our reality.

"There has been extensive research on the presence of mind in our bodies, that suggests that the neuropeptides, chemical substances that form the communication network of our emotions, are present not just in the brain, but everywhere in the body. As Dr. Cadence Pert, chief of brain biochemistry at the National Institute of Mental Health in the US writes, "These findings go beyond the often mentioned concept of power of mind over body. Indeed, the more we know about neuropeptides, the harder it is to think in the traditional terms of a mind and a body. It makes more and more sense of a single integrated entity, a body-mind.

It's nice to have Google search, isn't it my dear lost child.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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2/2/2015 10:37:41 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/2/2015 6:22:29 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 2/2/2015 4:45:49 AM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Alyssa is gone. Oh well. I'll answer this anyway.

If you look at the world around you and note the complexity of even the tiniest and insignificant things that you see, then you will notice something amazing. Sugar ants have tiny little hairs on their backs. Bees have complex antennae. An acorn contains everything that is needed to create a majestic oak tree out of soil, sun, and water. Even though two ants are similar they are different, because they simply are their own organisms. Consider the genetic code inside of a regular little honey bee. When you really think about this it becomes easier to fathom that you are individually unique. Your flesh, bones, and even your thoughts, are a part of the functioning organism that is you. You are incredibly beautiful, precious, and unique even without a soul. Don't worry too much about existence, worry about making your days worthwhile.

Yea! It makes you wonder dont it Jody? Go back a million years or so, and you will not find an Oak tree, its ancestor will be there, but you will not be able to recognise it it.

Its ancestor will gather information which will be imprinted into its seed, which, when grown, will gather more information which will be imprinted in its seed, etc, etc, until in a million years or so we finally have an oak tree, which is still in the process of evolution. gathering information, which is imprinted into its seed, etc, etc.

Do you believe that mankind closes the process of evolution, or could there possibly be A "SON OF MAN?"

THE ONLY CONSTANT

I never cease to wonder "mid the lightening and the thunder
How a million tons of water can just hang there in the sky
And snowflakes, have you seen "em? Such diversity between "em
Never two of them the same, I wonder why?

Nature poses many questions and though the scientists may test them
And discover many secrets that she hides
I"ll bet if they could live forever with all their studies and endeavours
In the end they"d be like us, still mystified

For the world is ever changing, interacting, rearranging
The only constant that you"ll find is constant change
Take a plant as one example and the evidence is ample
You"ll never find a pair that are the same

Or view it from a different slant take a photo of a plant
And each successive------generation as it grows
Then in a million years or so compare the last and first photo
Or better still run all the film out, in one long row

Then you"ll see the gradual change no two plants can be the same
Old evolution definitely holds her sway
For each seed must hold within it all the experience of its parent
In the end result each plant will have a say...........By Gentorev.

What came first, the seed or the plant?

Man has no knowledge of God to understand how God created everything.
jodybirdy
Posts: 2,089
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2/2/2015 2:45:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/2/2015 6:22:29 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 2/2/2015 4:45:49 AM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

Alyssa is gone. Oh well. I'll answer this anyway.

If you look at the world around you and note the complexity of even the tiniest and insignificant things that you see, then you will notice something amazing. Sugar ants have tiny little hairs on their backs. Bees have complex antennae. An acorn contains everything that is needed to create a majestic oak tree out of soil, sun, and water. Even though two ants are similar they are different, because they simply are their own organisms. Consider the genetic code inside of a regular little honey bee. When you really think about this it becomes easier to fathom that you are individually unique. Your flesh, bones, and even your thoughts, are a part of the functioning organism that is you. You are incredibly beautiful, precious, and unique even without a soul. Don't worry too much about existence, worry about making your days worthwhile.

Yea! It makes you wonder dont it Jody? Go back a million years or so, and you will not find an Oak tree, its ancestor will be there, but you will not be able to recognise it it.

Its ancestor will gather information which will be imprinted into its seed, which, when grown, will gather more information which will be imprinted in its seed, etc, etc, until in a million years or so we finally have an oak tree, which is still in the process of evolution. gathering information, which is imprinted into its seed, etc, etc.

Do you believe that mankind closes the process of evolution, or could there possibly be A "SON OF MAN?"

THE ONLY CONSTANT

We're all the sons and daughters of man. We're the decedents of life's longing to sustain itself. We are a precious commodity in the grand scheme of things. We have 65 to 95 years to live and appreciate this amazing planet. That's so beautiful and lucky in and of itself. But we want more than life. We want eternity. We're selfish that way. Or perhaps that amazing will to survive even death is why our ancestors had the ability to continue and eventually give birth to our generation.

I never cease to wonder "mid the lightening and the thunder
How a million tons of water can just hang there in the sky
And snowflakes, have you seen "em? Such diversity between "em
Never two of them the same, I wondor er why?

Even the small and insignificant snowflake has its own original impression.

Nature poses many questions and though the scientists may test them
And discover many secrets that she hides
I"ll bet if they could live forever with all their studies and endeavours
In the end they"d be like us, still mystified

When we are no longer mystified and when we no longer strive to understand then we will cease to adapt and eventually we will be gone.

For the world is ever changing, interacting, rearranging
The only constant that you"ll find is constant change
Take a plant as one example and the evidence is ample
You"ll never find a pair that are the same

Or view it from a different slant take a photo of a plant
And each successive------generation as it grows
Then in a million years or so compare the last and first photo
Or better still run all the film out, in one long row

Then you"ll see the gradual change no two plants can be the same
Old evolution definitely holds her sway
For each seed must hold within it all the experience of its parent
In the end result each plant will have a say...........By Gentorev.

Exactly.

-----

Everything makes its own small impression and eventually everything decays. Even you and me. Life is a precious gift and the stronger your impression, the longer your memory lives. That's the closest thing we get to a soul, but even the most profound impressions decay. At some point the Grand Canyon and Mount Everest will cease to be. It's sad, but if you focus on living and loving then life will not be in vain. That's a real promise. There is a sad beauty in it, but if you look at it in the right light it can be a happy thing. Life goes on even without us. Make a worthwhile impression.

And in the end, when the last atom has decayed into lonely little quarks, when all interaction ceases to be... if there really is a God, then dare I say that a worthwhile impression would be all he would ask of us. Worship is never a requirement, living a worthwhile life even with no further promises is the epitome of thank you for a rare and precious event such as life. No strings attached. The pinnacle of love for the greater and higher cause (or power if you wish to give it attributes) is accepting that this is all we have and giving our all to make it worthwhile. Loving for sake of love and living for the sake of sustaining life. Pushing all mythology and fairytales aside it's simple and is the closest thing to divine that I can see in the natural evidence around us.

Understand me or don't... it is your choice whether or not to accept me for the simpleton I am. :)
A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral."
Pase66
Posts: 775
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2/2/2015 3:50:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 1/31/2015 7:04:20 PM, AIyssa wrote:
I find it curious that I see things through my perspective and not through yours or anyone else's. Scientifically speaking, we're just a bunch of nerves and muscles and stuff with algorithms for surviving and conserving and getting energy. We're pretty much flesh-robots. How does that explain my consciousness and that I see things through the eyes of this particular robot instead of any other robot? How does that explain other people's maybe seeing things through their conscious minds the way I see mine.

I think the existence of the conscious mind in specific bodies might be an indication of the soul's existence.

I don't know, but in the end, we all will find out...
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Gentorev
Posts: 2,891
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2/2/2015 5:40:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
THE ONLY CONSTANT

Jodybirdy wrote.........We're all the sons and daughters of man. We're the decedents of life's longing to sustain itself.

Gentorev.............You read a bit of Kahil Gibran do you? "THE PROPHET."

Jodybirdy wrote.........We are a precious commodity in the grand scheme of things.

Gentorev.............And what is the grand scheme of things according to you Jody? Decay into the nothingness from which we supposedly originated? And if the end is nothingness so will be the new beginning.

Jodybirdy wrote.........We have 65 to 95 years to live and appreciate this amazing planet. That's so beautiful and lucky in and of itself. But we want more than life. We want eternity. We're selfish that way. Or perhaps that amazing will to survive even death is why our ancestors had the ability to continue and eventually give birth to our generation.

Gentorev.............Your ancestors may be dead Jody, but my ancestors all live within the inner most sanctuary of their temple which is this body in which I, who am but an extension of "WHO I AM," are being formed. And "WHO I AM," can trace his existence along an unbroken golden thread of life that reaches back to the very beginnings of Time and Space. And I, who am one with and an extension to "WHO I AM," in his evolution to the ends of this cycle of universal activity, will be a living one in "WHO WE WILL BE"

I longed to hear someone express the words I couldn't speak
Reveal to me the mysteries of life that all men seek
So I sought the men of science, who say God's body --- has no mind
Oh they say that it's evolving, but will die one day in time
So then the men of piousness, with them I sat me down
But they say God's mind is bodiless, those men in flowing gowns
Then finally in silent dream, just me and "Who I Am"
We floated on life's living stream, with a pen held in my hand
T'was then the veil began to tear, in this Temple that is me
And here, within this sanctuary, I saw the one that we will be....... By Gentorev.


I never cease to wonder 'mid the lightening and the thunder
How a million tons of water can just hang there in the sky
And snowflakes, have you seen 'em? Such diversity between 'em
Never two of them the same, I wonder why?


Jodybirdy wrote.........Even the small and insignificant snowflake has its own original impression.

Gentorev.............I Have just told you that Jodybirdy. Perhaps your name should be Jody-parrot.

Nature poses many questions and though the scientists may test them
And discover many secrets that she hides
I'll bet if they could live forever with all their studies and endeavours
In the end they'd be like us, still mystified


Jodybirdy wrote.........When we are no longer mystified and when we no longer strive to understand then we will cease to adapt and eventually we will be gone.

Gentorev.............When we are no longer mystified and when we no longer strive to understand then we will cease to adapt, and we will revert to the animal from which we have evolved. But I will forever be mystified as I wander through this eternal and boundless Cosmos, visiting worlds that no longer exist in your one directional linear time.

Come travel with me on a journey through time
Not in some capsule, but in our minds
To the Inner Most Sanctuary will we descend
To that single cell from which your body began
In the Holy of Holies where all is one
Where all of space and time is joined
We'll mingle there with other minds
From other lands, in other times
Minds of the past, who seem dead and gone
And minds of the future who are yet unborn
For they in their time, whether here on this world
Or some distant planet to which they've been lured
Will enter their inner most sanctuary too
And there perhaps they'll merge with you
Ah! To travel through space in the wink of an eye
One with your child on some world way on high
And if this is but madness, then madness it be
But come my mad brothers, come follow me.....By Gentorev.


For the world is ever changing, interacting, rearranging
The only constant that you'll find is constant change
Take a plant as one example and the evidence is ample
You'll never find a pair that are the same

Or view it from a different slant take a photo of a plant
And each successive------generation as it grows
Then in a million years or so compare the last and first photo
Or better still run all the film out, in one long row

Then you'll see the gradual change no two plants can be the same
Old evolution definitely holds her sway
For each seed must hold within it all the experience of its parent
In the end result each plant will have a say...........By Gentorev.

Jodybirdy wrote.........Exactly---------- Understand me or don't... it is your choice whether or not to accept me for the simpleton I am.

Gentorev.........You might be a child who wallows in the shallows of the Great Ocean of Wisdom, to afraid to venture out and sink into its fathomless depths, but you are no simpleton girly

Drinking from God's pool of Wisdom
That vast and endless sea
I felt a strange sensation
As someone else there drank of me". By Gentorev.

.
jodybirdy
Posts: 2,089
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2/2/2015 8:35:48 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/2/2015 5:40:37 PM, Gentorev wrote:
THE ONLY CONSTANT

Jodybirdy wrote.........We're all the sons and daughters of man. We're the decedents of life's longing to sustain itself.

Gentorev.............You read a bit of Kahil Gibran do you? "THE PROPHET."

Jodybirdy wrote.........We are a precious commodity in the grand scheme of things.

Gentorev.............And what is the grand scheme of things according to you Jody? Decay into the nothingness from which we supposedly originated? And if the end is nothingness so will be the new beginning.

Jodybirdy wrote.........We have 65 to 95 years to live and appreciate this amazing planet. That's so beautiful and lucky in and of itself. But we want more than life. We want eternity. We're selfish that way. Or perhaps that amazing will to survive even death is why our ancestors had the ability to continue and eventually give birth to our generation.

Gentorev.............Your ancestors may be dead Jody, but my ancestors all live within the inner most sanctuary of their temple which is this body in which I, who am but an extension of "WHO I AM," are being formed. And "WHO I AM," can trace his existence along an unbroken golden thread of life that reaches back to the very beginnings of Time and Space. And I, who am one with and an extension to "WHO I AM," in his evolution to the ends of this cycle of universal activity, will be a living one in "WHO WE WILL BE"

I longed to hear someone express the words I couldn't speak
Reveal to me the mysteries of life that all men seek
So I sought the men of science, who say God's body --- has no mind
Oh they say that it's evolving, but will die one day in time
So then the men of piousness, with them I sat me down
But they say God's mind is bodiless, those men in flowing gowns
Then finally in silent dream, just me and "Who I Am"
We floated on life's living stream, with a pen held in my hand
T'was then the veil began to tear, in this Temple that is me
And here, within this sanctuary, I saw the one that we will be....... By Gentorev.


I never cease to wonder 'mid the lightening and the thunder
How a million tons of water can just hang there in the sky
And snowflakes, have you seen 'em? Such diversity between 'em
Never two of them the same, I wonder why?


Jodybirdy wrote.........Even the small and insignificant snowflake has its own original impression.

Gentorev.............I Have just told you that Jodybirdy. Perhaps your name should be Jody-parrot.

Haha! I've been accused of that before. Never been called parrot though. How should I take this? :) Throw me a cracker and we'll see if it's true.

Nature poses many questions and though the scientists may test them
And discover many secrets that she hides
I'll bet if they could live forever with all their studies and endeavours
In the end they'd be like us, still mystified


Jodybirdy wrote.........When we are no longer mystified and when we no longer strive to understand then we will cease to adapt and eventually we will be gone.

Gentorev.............When we are no longer mystified and when we no longer strive to understand then we will cease to adapt, and we will revert to the animal from which we have evolved. But I will forever be mystified as I wander through this eternal and boundless Cosmos, visiting worlds that no longer exist in your one directional linear time.

Come travel with me on a journey through time
Not in some capsule, but in our minds
To the Inner Most Sanctuary will we descend
To that single cell from which your body began
In the Holy of Holies where all is one
Where all of space and time is joined
We'll mingle there with other minds
From other lands, in other times
Minds of the past, who seem dead and gone
And minds of the future who are yet unborn
For they in their time, whether here on this world
Or some distant planet to which they've been lured
Will enter their inner most sanctuary too
And there perhaps they'll merge with you
Ah! To travel through space in the wink of an eye
One with your child on some world way on high
And if this is but madness, then madness it be
But come my mad brothers, come follow me.....By Gentorev.


For the world is ever changing, interacting, rearranging
The only constant that you'll find is constant change
Take a plant as one example and the evidence is ample
You'll never find a pair that are the same

Or view it from a different slant take a photo of a plant
And each successive------generation as it grows
Then in a million years or so compare the last and first photo
Or better still run all the film out, in one long row

Then you'll see the gradual change no two plants can be the same
Old evolution definitely holds her sway
For each seed must hold within it all the experience of its parent
In the end result each plant will have a say...........By Gentorev.

Jodybirdy wrote.........Exactly---------- Understand me or don't... it is your choice whether or not to accept me for the simpleton I am.

Gentorev.........You might be a child who wallows in the shallows of the Great Ocean of Wisdom, to afraid to venture out and sink into its fathomless depths, but you are no simpleton girly

I'm not afraid, just resigned that wisdom is acquired through personal experience.

Drinking from God's pool of Wisdom
That vast and endless sea
I felt a strange sensation
As someone else there drank of me". By Gentorev.

.

I still see beauty in just being and accepting death for whatever it might be. I think that it is sleep without dreams. I'm sure that when I'm dead I'll know, or maybe I won't. I'm happy with either outcome because I'm fortunate just to experience life, love, and the people I discover along the way who write things like this:

Drinking from God's pool of Wisdom
That vast and endless sea
I felt a strange sensation
As someone else there drank of me". By Gentorev.
A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral."