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Jesus won't save you.

BlackSunApocalypse
Posts: 6
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2/11/2015 6:17:51 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Every (almost all) christians have the general idea that Jesus will save them. I stand against such an erroneous belief. The Jesus that died on a cross 2000 years ago will not save anyone. There is no historical record of Jesus ever being alive except for references in the bible. When people start to understand that their fate lies in their own hands, the Judeo-christian concept of a saviour atoning and saving us from sin will perish.
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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2/11/2015 6:20:54 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/11/2015 6:17:51 AM, BlackSunApocalypse wrote:
Every (almost all) christians have the general idea that Jesus will save them. I stand against such an erroneous belief. The Jesus that died on a cross 2000 years ago will not save anyone. There is no historical record of Jesus ever being alive except for references in the bible. When people start to understand that their fate lies in their own hands, the Judeo-christian concept of a saviour atoning and saving us from sin will perish.

I suspect a guy called Jesus did exist, and could have had a charismatic personality, but I very much doubt that what the gospel writers claimed about him had any credibility. I suspect we would never have heard of him at all if the chap Paul hadn't had literary diarrhoea!
Gentorev
Posts: 2,924
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2/11/2015 6:48:37 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/11/2015 6:17:51 AM, BlackSunApocalypse wrote:
Every (almost all) christians have the general idea that Jesus will save them. I stand against such an erroneous belief. The Jesus that died on a cross 2000 years ago will not save anyone. There is no historical record of Jesus ever being alive except for references in the bible. When people start to understand that their fate lies in their own hands, the Judeo-christian concept of a saviour atoning and saving us from sin will perish.

Jesus does not save you, nor did he ever make that claim. But through Jesus many people have and will come to know God who is able to save them.
BlackSunApocalypse
Posts: 6
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2/11/2015 7:21:18 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/11/2015 6:48:37 AM, Gentorev wrote:
Jesus does not save you, nor did he ever make that claim. But through Jesus many people have and will come to know God who is able to save them.

You're correct about Jesus not saving anyone, but remember that Jesus means Savior, and he is regarded as Saviour in the bible. God the Father (as the bible states) does not save anyone either. Remember the bible says Jesus and his Father are One. Doesn't that mean people can be saved through Jesus too? If you have any experience with this 'God' you're mentioning, please substantiate.
BlackSunApocalypse
Posts: 6
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2/11/2015 7:41:32 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Most of it had no credibility at all, the bible is written in code (most people unfortunately don't know this). I feel I was wrong to challenge his existence, whether he did or did exist at this point doesn't matter, what matters is that many people are under the misconception that their sins are already covered and therefore continue sinning. They maintain this "Jesus will save me if I confess with my tongue and believe with heart" (That's what the bible says). Most have taken this literally and the churches (who themselves are ignorant) either cannot see this or keep it hidden.
BlackSunApocalypse
Posts: 6
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2/11/2015 7:45:23 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/11/2015 6:20:54 AM, JJ50 wrote:

I suspect a guy called Jesus did exist, and could have had a charismatic personality, but I very much doubt that what the gospel writers claimed about him had any credibility. I suspect we would never have heard of him at all if the chap Paul hadn't had literary diarrhoea!

My last message was directed @ you.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,008
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2/11/2015 7:45:31 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/11/2015 6:48:37 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 2/11/2015 6:17:51 AM, BlackSunApocalypse wrote:
Every (almost all) christians have the general idea that Jesus will save them. I stand against such an erroneous belief. The Jesus that died on a cross 2000 years ago will not save anyone. There is no historical record of Jesus ever being alive except for references in the bible. When people start to understand that their fate lies in their own hands, the Judeo-christian concept of a saviour atoning and saving us from sin will perish.

Jesus does not save you, nor did he ever make that claim. But through Jesus many people have and will come to know God who is able to save them.

What Jesus led himself and his believers to was a wooden cross. The cross is the symbol of a deluded carpenters futility in believing his messianic ambitions were divinely inspired.
BlackSunApocalypse
Posts: 6
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2/11/2015 8:01:18 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/11/2015 7:45:31 AM, Harikrish wrote:
At 2/11/2015 6:48:37 AM, Gentorev wrote:

What Jesus led himself and his believers to was a wooden cross. The cross is the symbol of a deluded carpenters futility in believing his messianic ambitions were divinely inspired.

The basic shape of a cross, has since prehistoric times
been employed in almost every culture throughout the
world and all the roughly similar shapes of cross
symbols have wildly different meanings.
the cross variously symbolised health, fertility, life,
immortality, the union of heaven and earth, spirit and
matter, the sun, the stars... it is seen a world centre and
a cosmic axis, the cross represents the human form,
with its four cardinal points it can be mapped to fourfold
systems: the four directions: north, south, east, and west;
the 4 seasons; the four elements; the four winds.
bulproof
Posts: 25,247
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2/11/2015 8:01:27 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/11/2015 6:48:37 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 2/11/2015 6:17:51 AM, BlackSunApocalypse wrote:
Every (almost all) christians have the general idea that Jesus will save them. I stand against such an erroneous belief. The Jesus that died on a cross 2000 years ago will not save anyone. There is no historical record of Jesus ever being alive except for references in the bible. When people start to understand that their fate lies in their own hands, the Judeo-christian concept of a saviour atoning and saving us from sin will perish.

Jesus does not save you, nor did he ever make that claim. But through Jesus many people have and will come to know God who is able to save them.

What do you mean?
Save them from god?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
uncung
Posts: 3,452
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2/11/2015 8:37:36 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Jesus does not save you, nor did he ever make that claim. But through Jesus many people have and will come to know God who is able to save them.

save from what?
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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2/11/2015 8:58:35 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/11/2015 6:17:51 AM, BlackSunApocalypse wrote:
Every (almost all) christians have the general idea that Jesus will save them. I stand against such an erroneous belief. The Jesus that died on a cross 2000 years ago will not save anyone. There is no historical record of Jesus ever being alive except for references in the bible. When people start to understand that their fate lies in their own hands, the Judeo-christian concept of a saviour atoning and saving us from sin will perish.

God planned the salvation of ALL His people from their flesh of this world. We saints are only here to testify to His knowledge and tell His chosen believers who listen to us about His salvation plan for us all. Here's a prophecy about us "men" coming to tell about His salvation plan.

Psalm 22:
25: From thee comes my praise in the great congregation; my vows I will pay before those who fear him.
26: The afflicted shall eat and be satisfied; those who seek him shall praise the LORD! May your hearts live for ever!
27: All the ends of the earth shall remember and turn to the LORD; and all the families of the nations shall worship before him.
28: For dominion belongs to the LORD, and he rules over the nations.
29: Yea, to him shall all the proud of the earth bow down; before him shall bow all who go down to the dust, and he who cannot keep himself alive.
30: Posterity shall serve him; men shall tell of the Lord to the coming generation,
31: and proclaim his deliverance to a people yet unborn, that he has wrought it
.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,008
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2/11/2015 9:08:09 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/11/2015 8:58:35 AM, bornofgod wrote:
At 2/11/2015 6:17:51 AM, BlackSunApocalypse wrote:
Every (almost all) christians have the general idea that Jesus will save them. I stand against such an erroneous belief. The Jesus that died on a cross 2000 years ago will not save anyone. There is no historical record of Jesus ever being alive except for references in the bible. When people start to understand that their fate lies in their own hands, the Judeo-christian concept of a saviour atoning and saving us from sin will perish.

God planned the salvation of ALL His people from their flesh of this world. We saints are only here to testify to His knowledge and tell His chosen believers who listen to us about His salvation plan for us all. Here's a prophecy about us "men" coming to tell about His salvation plan.

Psalm 22:
25: From thee comes my praise in the great congregation; my vows I will pay before those who fear him.
26: The afflicted shall eat and be satisfied; those who seek him shall praise the LORD! May your hearts live for ever!
27: All the ends of the earth shall remember and turn to the LORD; and all the families of the nations shall worship before him.
28: For dominion belongs to the LORD, and he rules over the nations.
29: Yea, to him shall all the proud of the earth bow down; before him shall bow all who go down to the dust, and he who cannot keep himself alive.
30: Posterity shall serve him; men shall tell of the Lord to the coming generation,
31: and proclaim his deliverance to a people yet unborn, that he has wrought it
.


By your own admission you confess God does not talk to sinners or saints. You are both a sinner and saint and God talks to neither. So whatever you preach is not from God. You are speaking for God and by whose authority? And what is your source if God isn't speaking to you? You are a recovering alcoholic with satanic hangovers.

You wrote:"No one outside his chosen people will ever hear from God directly. So you're a liar and not only doesn't he speak to sinners, he doesn't speak to his saints. We speak for him."
BlackSunApocalypse
Posts: 6
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2/11/2015 9:18:38 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 2/11/2015 8:58:35 AM, bornofgod wrote:

God planned the salvation of ALL His people from their flesh of this world. We saints are only here to testify to His knowledge and tell His chosen believers who listen to us about His salvation plan for us all. Here's a prophecy about us "men" coming to tell about His salvation plan.

Psalm 22:
25: From thee comes my praise in the great congregation; my vows I will pay before those who fear him.
26: The afflicted shall eat and be satisfied; those who seek him shall praise the LORD! May your hearts live for ever!
27: All the ends of the earth shall remember and turn to the LORD; and all the families of the nations shall worship before him.
28: For dominion belongs to the LORD, and he rules over the nations.
29: Yea, to him shall all the proud of the earth bow down; before him shall bow all who go down to the dust, and he who cannot keep himself alive.
30: Posterity shall serve him; men shall tell of the Lord to the coming generation,
31: and proclaim his deliverance to a people yet unborn, that he has wrought it
.


Does 'salvation' include the sins people continue to commit despite knowing God saves? Sin is contrary to salvation.