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Predict the Religious Landscape In 200 Years

Envisage
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3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,566
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3/14/2015 10:37:43 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

Yes, wishful thinking. In 200 years, the state of our world is going to be disastrous if climate change continues, and it will. The only way we're going to fix it is if the entire world puts aside their differences, the biggest being religions, and works together as one unit.

If not, the entire world will be at peace for the first time in it's entire history, as the dead lay on the ground.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
celestialtorahteacher
Posts: 1,369
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3/14/2015 10:39:49 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Climax Civilization will be worldwide in 200 years as it is the only way civilization can survive and will and prosper too as ecologically efficient communities of life - - meaning violent upsets to environment and community will lessen to natural disasters and not man-made warfare - - technological or economic or social (religious) as is the case now with Abrahamic religionists out of control as usual as they have been for the past 2500 years of their existence.
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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3/14/2015 12:04:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
With luck religion will become more and more marginalised as science makes new breakthroughs.
Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,280
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3/14/2015 12:24:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 10:37:43 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

Yes, wishful thinking. In 200 years, the state of our world is going to be disastrous if climate change continues, and it will. The only way we're going to fix it is if the entire world puts aside their differences, the biggest being religions, and works together as one unit.

If not, the entire world will be at peace for the first time in it's entire history, as the dead lay on the ground.

Lol, yeah, no reputable climatologist is making claims that drastic about climate change. That's a comic dramatization of the possible effects.

The Day After Tomorrow was a movie, not a documentary.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,566
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3/14/2015 12:42:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 12:24:41 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:37:43 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

Yes, wishful thinking. In 200 years, the state of our world is going to be disastrous if climate change continues, and it will. The only way we're going to fix it is if the entire world puts aside their differences, the biggest being religions, and works together as one unit.

If not, the entire world will be at peace for the first time in it's entire history, as the dead lay on the ground.

Lol, yeah, no reputable climatologist is making claims that drastic about climate change. That's a comic dramatization of the possible effects.

The Day After Tomorrow was a movie, not a documentary.

Uh no, I'm not basing anything on Hollywood movies, but more on scholarly article written in peer reviewed journals that cite the effects on radiation, temperature, ecosystems, water and plant life, all contributing to our eventual demise if we don't do something about it.

In fact, what we are experiencing now is what Venus went through long ago.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Envisage
Posts: 3,646
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3/14/2015 12:50:15 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 12:42:08 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/14/2015 12:24:41 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:37:43 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

Yes, wishful thinking. In 200 years, the state of our world is going to be disastrous if climate change continues, and it will. The only way we're going to fix it is if the entire world puts aside their differences, the biggest being religions, and works together as one unit.

If not, the entire world will be at peace for the first time in it's entire history, as the dead lay on the ground.

Lol, yeah, no reputable climatologist is making claims that drastic about climate change. That's a comic dramatization of the possible effects.

The Day After Tomorrow was a movie, not a documentary.

Uh no, I'm not basing anything on Hollywood movies, but more on scholarly article written in peer reviewed journals that cite the effects on radiation, temperature, ecosystems, water and plant life, all contributing to our eventual demise if we don't do something about it.

In fact, what we are experiencing now is what Venus went through long ago.

I think you are overstating the effects of global warming.. Yes it will (and currently is) have severe effects on the ecosystem, and on weather patterns, which will result in a harder environment to live in, but I double dare you to show me one peer reviewed paper which reports that our extinction is nigh because of it.
Skepsikyma
Posts: 8,280
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3/14/2015 12:59:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 12:50:15 PM, Envisage wrote:
At 3/14/2015 12:42:08 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/14/2015 12:24:41 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:37:43 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

Yes, wishful thinking. In 200 years, the state of our world is going to be disastrous if climate change continues, and it will. The only way we're going to fix it is if the entire world puts aside their differences, the biggest being religions, and works together as one unit.

If not, the entire world will be at peace for the first time in it's entire history, as the dead lay on the ground.

Lol, yeah, no reputable climatologist is making claims that drastic about climate change. That's a comic dramatization of the possible effects.

The Day After Tomorrow was a movie, not a documentary.

Uh no, I'm not basing anything on Hollywood movies, but more on scholarly article written in peer reviewed journals that cite the effects on radiation, temperature, ecosystems, water and plant life, all contributing to our eventual demise if we don't do something about it.

In fact, what we are experiencing now is what Venus went through long ago.

I think you are overstating the effects of global warming.. Yes it will (and currently is) have severe effects on the ecosystem, and on weather patterns, which will result in a harder environment to live in, but I double dare you to show me one peer reviewed paper which reports that our extinction is nigh because of it.

^^ this. Reputable climatologists won't be comparing Earth to Venus on any level beyond an analogy explaining the mechanism of the greenhouse effect. Any claims that drastic would be savaged during peer review.
"The Collectivist experiment is thoroughly suited (in appearance at least) to the Capitalist society which it proposes to replace. It works with the existing machinery of Capitalism, talks and thinks in the existing terms of Capitalism, appeals to just those appetites which Capitalism has aroused, and ridicules as fantastic and unheard-of just those things in society the memory of which Capitalism has killed among men wherever the blight of it has spread."
- Hilaire Belloc -
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,566
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3/14/2015 1:30:24 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 12:50:15 PM, Envisage wrote:
At 3/14/2015 12:42:08 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/14/2015 12:24:41 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:37:43 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

Yes, wishful thinking. In 200 years, the state of our world is going to be disastrous if climate change continues, and it will. The only way we're going to fix it is if the entire world puts aside their differences, the biggest being religions, and works together as one unit.

If not, the entire world will be at peace for the first time in it's entire history, as the dead lay on the ground.

Lol, yeah, no reputable climatologist is making claims that drastic about climate change. That's a comic dramatization of the possible effects.

The Day After Tomorrow was a movie, not a documentary.

Uh no, I'm not basing anything on Hollywood movies, but more on scholarly article written in peer reviewed journals that cite the effects on radiation, temperature, ecosystems, water and plant life, all contributing to our eventual demise if we don't do something about it.

In fact, what we are experiencing now is what Venus went through long ago.

I think you are overstating the effects of global warming.. Yes it will (and currently is) have severe effects on the ecosystem, and on weather patterns, which will result in a harder environment to live in, but I double dare you to show me one peer reviewed paper which reports that our extinction is nigh because of it.

Why would there be such a report? The papers currently published talk about the effects of plants and water, the things that keep everything else alive on Earth. If the effects are continuous, there will simply be no plant life and our water will be contaminated as will our air. How are animals supposed to survive, then?
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,566
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3/14/2015 1:34:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 12:59:46 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 3/14/2015 12:50:15 PM, Envisage wrote:
At 3/14/2015 12:42:08 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/14/2015 12:24:41 PM, Skepsikyma wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:37:43 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

Yes, wishful thinking. In 200 years, the state of our world is going to be disastrous if climate change continues, and it will. The only way we're going to fix it is if the entire world puts aside their differences, the biggest being religions, and works together as one unit.

If not, the entire world will be at peace for the first time in it's entire history, as the dead lay on the ground.

Lol, yeah, no reputable climatologist is making claims that drastic about climate change. That's a comic dramatization of the possible effects.

The Day After Tomorrow was a movie, not a documentary.

Uh no, I'm not basing anything on Hollywood movies, but more on scholarly article written in peer reviewed journals that cite the effects on radiation, temperature, ecosystems, water and plant life, all contributing to our eventual demise if we don't do something about it.

In fact, what we are experiencing now is what Venus went through long ago.

I think you are overstating the effects of global warming.. Yes it will (and currently is) have severe effects on the ecosystem, and on weather patterns, which will result in a harder environment to live in, but I double dare you to show me one peer reviewed paper which reports that our extinction is nigh because of it.

^^ this. Reputable climatologists won't be comparing Earth to Venus on any level beyond an analogy explaining the mechanism of the greenhouse effect. Any claims that drastic would be savaged during peer review.

Yes, the mechanisms of the greenhouse effect, along with the results; Venus.

I never suggested scientists were writing papers on our extinction.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
YassineB
Posts: 1,003
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3/14/2015 5:35:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

- 200 is a very very long time, the face of the Earth may change drastically in such a period.

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

- I am pretty sure the issues of 200 years in the future will be formulated in an entirely different discourse & context than ours.

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink.

- I think what's gonna last & keep Christianity together is the Tradition itself. The fabric & framework of a society that 200 years in the future is very unlikely to be anything close to our current notion of what a society, nation, state is.

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity.

- I think in 200 years, Islam is gonna take back what it owes: its civilisation from the West. Once the western influence weakens in Islamic countries, Islam will surely take over, & when it does, it's gonna unite the muslim world, for it's based on the concept of Ummah.
- You last statement is grossly inaccurate, China was half atheists & was really poor, & the Middle East, Arab Golf, Iran & Turkey are pretty rich, & very very religious.

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

- You're seeing this from an exclusive western modern perspective, secularism may be dominant now, but who knows what could happen in the future!

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely.

- There is a difference between superstitious & supernatural belief, the former is inherently false, & the latter is substantiated by reality, at least in the Islamic Worldview.

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

- We are talking about 200 years of change, I doubt even the word 'communist' would be recognised after all that time.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

- Unless we are talking about Islam. The Islamic Rule existed for nearly 14 century, & it was very successful in ruling muslims, it's only natural to think it'll remain successful for the same reason, as long as there are muslims.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

- If you made it 50 years, then maybe. 200 is an extremely long time for temporary issues to last.
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http://www.debate.org...

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"It is perfectly permissible to vote on sources without reading them" bluesteel.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
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3/14/2015 5:37:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

Why would anyone want to listen to guesses when they can hear the future being told by our Creator in this forum?
Envisage
Posts: 3,646
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3/14/2015 6:05:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 5:35:07 PM, YassineB wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

- 200 is a very very long time, the face of the Earth may change drastically in such a period.

Possibly. Especially when you look at the change that has already happened in past 200 years. Hell, I can barely understand English writings from 1750-1800 period.

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

- I am pretty sure the issues of 200 years in the future will be formulated in an entirely different discourse & context than ours.

Almost certainly. The issues of the day will be completely different to what we consider issues, or even fringe issues today. Even in just 50 years this will probably change a lot.

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink.

- I think what's gonna last & keep Christianity together is the Tradition itself. The fabric & framework of a society that 200 years in the future is very unlikely to be anything close to our current notion of what a society, nation, state is.

I don't think that is relevant. But ok.

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity.

- I think in 200 years, Islam is gonna take back what it owes: its civilisation from the West. Once the western influence weakens in Islamic countries, Islam will surely take over, & when it does, it's gonna unite the muslim world, for it's based on the concept of Ummah.

Yes, the effects of colonialism are still obvious... It only ended 100-50 years ago. It depends on the shape of government mostly, nothing will happen in governments which remain corrupt, ever, self-stagnating cycle. But also if you look at countries which are incentivised to conform, such as Turkey, it extends to the general economical landscape what is likely to happen.

- You last statement is grossly inaccurate, China was half atheists & was really poor, & the Middle East, Arab Golf, Iran & Turkey are pretty rich, & very very religious.

I am well aware of this, but my point was the general correlation, and also those countries have exceptional other factors at play (e.g. The source of the wealth in Middle East is almost exclusively oil, and very autocratic, very much unlike other economies, and China has communism which actively plays a role in (lack) of religiosity, which I alluded to in point #6.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org...

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

- You're seeing this from an exclusive western modern perspective, secularism may be dominant now, but who knows what could happen in the future!

It is definitely not dominant now, lol. But large scale atheism is relatively recent, and thus the void left by religion lacks many largely accepted groups except maybe Unitarianism (which isn't even atheism, but secular ) or Humanism (which again isn't exclusively atheism, only secular).

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely.

- There is a difference between superstitious & supernatural belief, the former is inherently false, & the latter is substantiated by reality, at least in the Islamic Worldview.

Neither of these statements make any sense.
1.'"Superstition is the belief in supernatural causality"that one event causes another without any natural process linking the two events" I fail to see how that is inherently false.
2. It either is or it isn't, regardless of worldview. Unless you start from some presuppositionalist position, in which case, I have nothing but negative things to say about it, lol.

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

- We are talking about 200 years of change, I doubt even the word 'communist' would be recognised after all that time.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

- Unless we are talking about Islam. The Islamic Rule existed for nearly 14 century, & it was very successful in ruling muslims, it's only natural to think it'll remain successful for the same reason, as long as there are muslims.

I wasn't really thinking about Islam, although Islam's inherent ties with policy/government make it a more obvious thought. It is very hard to coherently separate Islam as a religion, from Islam as a society.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

- If you made it 50 years, then maybe. 200 is an extremely long time for temporary issues to last.
thett3
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3/14/2015 6:10:33 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 5:37:08 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

Why would anyone want to listen to guesses when they can hear the future being told by our Creator in this forum?
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NoMagic
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3/14/2015 6:28:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

I'm in general agreement with your predictions. Trends and present demographics indicate a decline in religion. I don't think religion and superstition will ever completely go away. I suspect there is a minimum number that those can drop to. I think religion has peeked and the decline will last awhile, and I intend to play a role in that decline and savor it as I go.
bornofgod
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3/14/2015 6:40:18 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 6:28:51 PM, NoMagic wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

I'm in general agreement with your predictions. Trends and present demographics indicate a decline in religion. I don't think religion and superstition will ever completely go away. I suspect there is a minimum number that those can drop to. I think religion has peeked and the decline will last awhile, and I intend to play a role in that decline and savor it as I go.

There are more religious groups than ever before with all the false gods that men have built lately. Try get into the religious group of Apple, Inc. who design all their latest technology. They will cast you out in a minute.
Spectre2
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3/14/2015 6:46:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

I doubt superstitions will be marginalized in the future. Especially superstitions that can never truly be denied.
Philocat
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3/14/2015 6:48:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

Perhaps, but you make the assumption that science will be as respected in 200 years as it is now. I think it will, but then again a completely new epistemological framework could come into prominence.


2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

It is certainly possible that Christianity will continue to shrink, but I suspect it might actually plateau or even rise again. My reasoning for this is that the decrease in Christianity nowadays is by the largely atheistic nature of academic circles within the 20th century, as well as two world wars that raised the problem of evil to ordinary people on a huge scale.

Opposition to gay marriage will likely decrease, yes, but not abortion. Advances in medicine will further reduce the age of viability as well as make more evident the humanity of foetuses. I anticipate a drop in pro-abortion support in favour of granting the unborn more rights.


3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

Unfortunately you may be right, increasingly secular worldviews seem to be growing in popularity. I'm not sure however that this will continue even 200 years ahead, as society will struggle IMO to fill the existential/moral void normally filled by religion.

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

I'm skeptical on this one; as even if it is accepted that a secular religion is not an incoherent concept, these religions would lack a central authority. Abstract principles would struggle to inspire much loyalty or religious fervour.

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

Agreed, but I'm not sure if you're counting sophisticated theism under the bracket of superstition.

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

Perhaps, I don't really have any reason to suggest why this would be the case or why it would not. I'm neutral.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

But what major theocracies do we have now?
NoMagic
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3/14/2015 6:54:20 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 6:40:18 PM, bornofgod wrote:
At 3/14/2015 6:28:51 PM, NoMagic wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

I'm in general agreement with your predictions. Trends and present demographics indicate a decline in religion. I don't think religion and superstition will ever completely go away. I suspect there is a minimum number that those can drop to. I think religion has peeked and the decline will last awhile, and I intend to play a role in that decline and savor it as I go.

There are more religious groups than ever before with all the false gods that men have built lately. Try get into the religious group of Apple, Inc. who design all their latest technology. They will cast you out in a minute.

Not quite a LOL but enough for a LOTI (laughing on the inside)
Envisage
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3/14/2015 7:04:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 6:48:00 PM, Philocat wrote:
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

Perhaps, but you make the assumption that science will be as respected in 200 years as it is now. I think it will, but then again a completely new epistemological framework could come into prominence.

Empiricism really isn't going anywhere, virtually the entire enlightenment has been on the back of the advances brought forth by it, it is by far our most successful method for understanding reality and there are no signs that is ever going to change. In fact I expect it would would only continue to grow to be increasingly such.


2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

It is certainly possible that Christianity will continue to shrink, but I suspect it might actually plateau or even rise again. My reasoning for this is that the decrease in Christianity nowadays is by the largely atheistic nature of academic circles within the 20th century, as well as two world wars that raised the problem of evil to ordinary people on a huge scale.

The Problem of Evil is hardly a contributor to (lack) of religiosity as a whole. True some people become atheists because of it, but the vast majority of people who are atheists are not really because of investigation into theology, but because of socio cultural factors (e.g people no longer wanting/feeling compelled to go back to church, it in longer being culturally taboo to identify as irreligious, and to not go to church, etc.).

Opposition to gay marriage will likely decrease, yes, but not abortion. Advances in medicine will further reduce the age of viability as well as make more evident the humanity of foetuses. I anticipate a drop in pro-abortion support in favour of granting the unborn more rights.

I wouldn't be surprised abortion doesnt achieve consensus, but not the the reasons you posited.


3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

Unfortunately you may be right, increasingly secular worldviews seem to be growing in popularity. I'm not sure however that this will continue even 200 years ahead, as society will struggle IMO to fill the existential/moral void normally filled by religion.

Sweden, France and the Netherlands, Australia etc seem to be doing just fine, as some of the most irreligious democratic countries.

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

I'm skeptical on this one; as even if it is accepted that a secular religion is not an incoherent concept, these religions would lack a central authority. Abstract principles would struggle to inspire much loyalty or religious fervour.

Depends on how you define "religion", but no religion needs a central authority, Christians do not all follow the pope, etc.

5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

Agreed, but I'm not sure if you're counting sophisticated theism under the bracket of superstition.

'Sophisticated' theism (and atheism) make uop for like less that 1, or 0.1% of a population, probably even less. Their numbers are simply too insignificant, unfortunately. Makes me wonder if all my debates are a waste of time if virtually no one is going to understand them.

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

Perhaps, I don't really have any reason to suggest why this would be the case or why it would not. I'm neutral.

Just looking at the numerical trends. When a totalitarian government which positively oppresses religion, or a form of religion, then it's removal leads to the religion rebounding.

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

But what major theocracies do we have now?

Iran, Tibet, Vatican City
Vox_Veritas
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3/14/2015 7:31:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 10:29:52 AM, Envisage wrote:
Religious demographics are changing pretty quickly as of late, especially in the west with the decline of Christianity and the increases in 'nones' and Islam. Moreover values are becoming increasingly conservative.

So, I am going to throw in my two cents as to what I think the landscape will be like in 100 and 200 years:

1. Virtual dissapearance of frivolously anti-scientific views, such as YEC, Vaccine and Anthropogenic Climate Change Denial

I disagree that all of these are false, but okay.

2. Continued decline in Christianity, and current conservative groups being increasingly pushed to the fringe. Groups that explicitly oppose abortion, same sex marriage, etc. will be increasingly marginalised and will shrink

If by decline you mean decline in numbers, sure. I don't think that the ideas will become more fringe as much as society moving in the opposite direction will make them seem more fringe.

3. Islam and 'nones' to increase, but for religion generally to become less important in society even among the religious groups, proportions will stabilise as technological growth stabilised and poverty hits a low, since religion scales pretty closely with geographic, and socioeconomic factors. Generally wealthier and better resourced areas have lower religiosity

Correct. The world is growing more wealthy and less religious as a result.

4. Newer religions based on secular principles to become increasingly significant, with society generally the void of what religion originally provided

If by "fill the void" you mean increased hedonism, sure. However, I do not think that society will ever really solve the "void" as long as human nature exists as it does


5. General superstitious/supernatural belief to drop, but reach a minimum rather than largely disappearing completely

I agree. There will always be a few.

6. Religiosity in former communist and current communist becoming increasingly capitalist nations such as China and Russia to experience a resurge in religiosity.

No opinion

7. The number of theocratic governments to drop but probably remain about the same as what we have today - we already know that forced democracy does not work.

Okay. I can envision an increased secularization of the Middle East.

A lot of this is wishful thinking, but I don't think the guess is completely far fetched.

I wouldn't consider this to be good overall, but I do think that if Christ does not return in 200 years it'll be largely like this.
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RuvDraba
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3/14/2015 7:53:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
We know some broad and recent trends include the rapid rise of new faiths, a swing to charismatic religiosity, the rise of nontheism and nationalistic Islam. The reasons behind this are surely complex, but may link to globalisation, social fragmentation, developing-world industrialisation, and improved secular education -- all trends likely to continue.

But where this goes also depends on the ability of secular governments to maintain the rule of law and perpetuate existing civilisations. As the rule of law collapses, multiculturalism fragments, nationalism arises, and with it new faiths or the reinterpretation and reinvigoration of old faiths.

So how well can we trust the rule of law over the next 200 years?

I'm personally skeptical.

Food security is perhaps the biggest strategic problem humans face over this period. A burgeoning population, diminishing potable water supplies, accelerating world urbanisation on exactly the most irrigated and arable land we possess, along with accelerating climate change will all press on our ability to feed people. And while new technologies will surely help, we can't predict when they'll appear, or how effective they'll be.

Meanwhile, our ability to create and implement policies to buy us more time has proven very limited -- so presently food security is more of a lottery we're betting on, than a challenge we're overcoming.

So I think it will likely be a big issue; it will affect poor countries disproportionately, and world religiosity will react to that. I think we'll see fragmentation of nation-states, a swing to reinvented religious traditionalism, religion inflaming nationalism, and economic conflicts and environmental refugeeism expressed as religious wars.

We already have a split between poor religiosity and wealthy nontheism, and that may widen. The Inglehert-Welzel World Values Survey map shows that divisions are both cultural and economic, and these represent possible fracture-lines. [http://upload.wikimedia.org...]

I don't think there's much we can do about this theologically. Really, the problems need to be tackled globally and secularly.

As I mentioned, we seem to lack both the will and governance to do that at the moment, however humans work at their best when they face a common threat, and if we get the luxury of these issues breaking slowly, we might manage something extraordinary and transformative before things fragment too much.

But equally, some 98% of all species ever on this planet are extinct, so failing to adapt offers no second prizes.
Gentorev
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3/14/2015 8:44:50 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 7:53:22 PM, RuvDraba wrote:
We know some broad and recent trends include the rapid rise of new faiths, a swing to charismatic religiosity, the rise of nontheism and nationalistic Islam. The reasons behind this are surely complex, but may link to globalisation, social fragmentation, developing-world industrialisation, and improved secular education -- all trends likely to continue.

But where this goes also depends on the ability of secular governments to maintain the rule of law and perpetuate existing civilisations. As the rule of law collapses, multiculturalism fragments, nationalism arises, and with it new faiths or the reinterpretation and reinvigoration of old faiths.

So how well can we trust the rule of law over the next 200 years?

I'm personally skeptical.

Food security is perhaps the biggest strategic problem humans face over this period. A burgeoning population, diminishing potable water supplies, accelerating world urbanisation on exactly the most irrigated and arable land we possess, along with accelerating climate change will all press on our ability to feed people. And while new technologies will surely help, we can't predict when they'll appear, or how effective they'll be.

Meanwhile, our ability to create and implement policies to buy us more time has proven very limited -- so presently food security is more of a lottery we're betting on, than a challenge we're overcoming.

So I think it will likely be a big issue; it will affect poor countries disproportionately, and world religiosity will react to that. I think we'll see fragmentation of nation-states, a swing to reinvented religious traditionalism, religion inflaming nationalism, and economic conflicts and environmental refugeeism expressed as religious wars.

We already have a split between poor religiosity and wealthy nontheism, and that may widen. The Inglehert-Welzel World Values Survey map shows that divisions are both cultural and economic, and these represent possible fracture-lines. [http://upload.wikimedia.org...]

I don't think there's much we can do about this theologically. Really, the problems need to be tackled globally and secularly.

As I mentioned, we seem to lack both the will and governance to do that at the moment, however humans work at their best when they fa ce a common threat, and if we get the luxury of these issues breaking slowly, we might manage something extraordinary and transformative before things fragment too much.

But equally, some 98% of all species ever on this planet are extinct, so failing to adapt offers no second prizes.

If the biblical prophesies are to be believed, in 200 years we will be into the seventh period of one thousand years or the seventh day from when Adam ate of the forbidden fruit and died in that first day at the age of 930.

From the Book of Jubilees 4: 30; "And He (Adam) lacked seventy years of one thousand years; for one thousand years are as one day in the testimony of the heavens and therefore was it written concerning the tree of knowledge: "On the day thou eat thereof ye shall die." For this reason Adam did not complete the years of that first day; for He died during it."

We are now at the close of the sixth day, from that first day that Adam ate of the forbidden fruit,at the age of 930.

Paul reveals that the weekly Sabbath was but a shadow of the reality, which is "THE LORD'S DAY" the great Sabbath in which the Lord will rule as King for one thousand years.

Zechariah 14; reveals that the Lord through his chosen people will utterly defeat the nations that surround Jerusalem (Which are predominately Muslim nations) in their attempts to drive God's chosen people into the sea, and he will then begin his thousand year rule from Jerusalem, and all the survivors of the nations that had attacked Jerusalem will go there each year to worship the Lord Almighty as King and to pay tribute.

Zechariah 14: 12 to 19. Any nation that refuses to do so, will suffer the same catastrophe as was suffered by the nations that attacked Jerusalem, their eyes, tongue and soft tissue will melt in their sockets and their radiated flesh will slide from their bones while still standing.

As I have said, If biblical prophecy is to be believed, in 200 years all the nations of the world will worship "THE MOST HIGH" in the creation as their King and High Priest.
The tongue, the sharp two edged sword that divides the spirit from the soul.
RuvDraba
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3/14/2015 9:37:59 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 8:44:50 PM, Gentorev wrote:
As I have said, If biblical prophecy is to be believed, in 200 years all the nations of the world will worship "THE MOST HIGH" in the creation as their King and High Priest.

Many faiths have eschatological prophecies, including Baha'i, Buddhism, Christianity, Hinduism, Islam, Judaism and Zoroastrianism. Few say exactly when they're supposed to occur, and sociologically people from eschatological faiths tend to think it's always about them. Christians in the Middle Ages were sure the world would end imminently, for example.

There's no logical reason to suppose one faith's eschatology is more accurate than another's, nor that one vague prophecy is more applicable to present events than the next.
YassineB
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3/14/2015 9:40:47 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 6:05:19 PM, Envisage wrote:
Possibly. Especially when you look at the change that has already happened in past 200 years. Hell, I can barely understand English writings from 1750-1800 period.

- The US was just born then! :)

Almost certainly. The issues of the day will be completely different to what we consider issues, or even fringe issues today. Even in just 50 years this will probably change a lot.

- Agreed.

I don't think that is relevant. But ok.

- It should be relevant, the rule of majority democracy isn't supposed to be eternal, new stuff will be introduced along the way, from now until 200 years later. & so, the position of gays & who knows what in the future society is unlikely to be subject to our current understanding of state & its relation to its subject. Maybe people will live in separate communities, maybe gays will create their own nation, who knows!

Yes, the effects of colonialism are still obvious... It only ended 100-50 years ago. It depends on the shape of government mostly, nothing will happen in governments which remain corrupt, ever, self-stagnating cycle. But also if you look at countries which are incentivised to conform, such as Turkey, it extends to the general economical landscape what is likely to happen.

- Turkey is certainly going into that direction, & that's to be expected, less than a century ago it was an Empire. I think what matters is the populace, the influence of the muslim regimes is heavily backed by the West, once the backing stops, those regimes are going to have to face the populace on their own, & muslim populations all want one thing: Unity.

I am well aware of this, but my point was the general correlation, and also those countries have exceptional other factors at play (e.g. The source of the wealth in Middle East is almost exclusively oil, and very autocratic, very much unlike other economies, and China has communism which actively plays a role in (lack) of religiosity, which I alluded to in point #6.

http://en.m.wikipedia.org...

- There might be a correlation that might stem from a number of other factors. My point was, getting richer or poorer is unlikely to influence the religiosity of a country, at least that's certain for muslim countries.

It is definitely not dominant now, lol.

- Whatever do you mean? I was talking about Secularism, not Atheism.

But large scale atheism is relatively recent, and thus the void left by religion lacks many largely accepted groups except maybe Unitarianism (which isn't even atheism, but secular ) or Humanism (which again isn't exclusively atheism, only secular).

- Personally, since I am muslim, I believe that atheism is gonna take over the World. The Prophet said that towards the end of time, there will be no one left who believes in God, & he is almost always right when it comes to prophecy.

Neither of these statements make any sense.
1.'"Superstition is the belief in supernatural causality"that one event causes another without any natural process linking the two events" I fail to see how that is inherently false.

- Superstition is an unjustified belief in the supernatural, such as saying: "fingered crossed", "knock on wood". . .

2. It either is or it isn't, regardless of worldview. Unless you start from some presuppositionalist position, in which case, I have nothing but negative things to say about it, lol.

- The 'supernatural' process in Islam is studied as any other natural process, it has its sciences, its methodologies, it's also based the standard modes of reasoning, such as: Abductive & Successive Reasoning (probabilistic & statistical >> occurrences & testimonies) . . . One of the Four Pillars of Sufism, for instance, is Experience.

I wasn't really thinking about Islam, although Islam's inherent ties with policy/government make it a more obvious though. It is very hard to coherently separate Islam as a religion, from Islam as a society.

- Yeah, unlike other World's Religions, Islam was founded in a state from its birth, & the Islamic Civilisation didn't adopt Islam after being established, it came with it from the start.
- Also, due to the fact that the Prophet founded a state & was a Head of State himself, the presence of policy/government in Islam is factually inherent & inseparable.
Current Debates In Voting Period:

- The Qur'an We Have Today is Not What Muhammad Dictated Verbatim. Vs. @Envisage:
http://www.debate.org...

- Drawing Contest. Vs. @purpleduck:
http://www.debate.org...

"It is perfectly permissible to vote on sources without reading them" bluesteel.
celestialtorahteacher
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3/14/2015 9:52:12 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
There certainly won't be any Muhammadism as we see in our days--at its' End Times. God is on the side of democracy and human rights as these are conditions needed for the Meek (those who refuse to engage in warfare) to inherit the earth from the violent people keeping violence going and destroying cultures and nations along the way. Nobody really wants to live in violent societies so whenever people are given a real choice as to their society government they chose freedom and not imprisonment by unjust laws. Muhammadans are not free people so they must back Muhammadanism or face punishment within their own communities. This stops in the West so Muslims there become free to choose their destinies and they don't chose fascist rule when they are really free to choose. Freedom trumps fascism when people have a choice in the matter.

All the Abrahamic religions won't be honored like they are today because Abraham's insanity will be well-known as it is not today when Abrahamic believers never stop to question why on earth they follow a child-murderer in his heart serving a despicable deity demanding burnt children sacrificed as proof of loyalty, i.e. insanity in religious form.
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,481
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3/15/2015 4:35:20 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/14/2015 9:52:12 PM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
There certainly won't be any Muhammadism as we see in our days--at its' End Times. God is on the side of democracy and human rights as these are conditions needed for the Meek (those who refuse to engage in warfare) to inherit the earth from the violent people keeping violence going and destroying cultures and nations along the way. Nobody really wants to live in violent societies so whenever people are given a real choice as to their society government they chose freedom and not imprisonment by unjust laws. Muhammadans are not free people so they must back Muhammadanism or face punishment within their own communities. This stops in the West so Muslims there become free to choose their destinies and they don't chose fascist rule when they are really free to choose. Freedom trumps fascism when people have a choice in the matter.

All the Abrahamic religions won't be honored like they are today because Abraham's insanity will be well-known as it is not today when Abrahamic believers never stop to question why on earth they follow a child-murderer in his heart serving a despicable deity demanding burnt children sacrificed as proof of loyalty, i.e. insanity in religious form.

celestialtorahteacher are you single?
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Electric-Eccentric
Posts: 1,309
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3/15/2015 5:14:10 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
I find the concept curious and interesting as I have put some thought into this direction as I go about my daily work/play.

I foresee religion going the way of Harry Potter, Disney, Star Wars and other popular fiction of today.

In 200 years the rapture doctrines will be long gone and instead of waiting for a magic man to come down out of the sky and be taken away and such.

People will be buying and using magic powders and spells and who ever offers and does the best magic will have the followers seeking their ESCAPE from what bothers them the most..

THEMSELVES.

Nothing new under the sun when the overgrown children try and have their FUN.

When you look at the FACT that the rapture doctrine is about 160 years old,

that tells you how crazy the superstitious mindset thinks and reasons.

I like the concept of a religion that a member here brought up where you have the mother, the egg and the face grabber. Add some Pokemon and Hello Kitty and you have a hit trend to sell to the kids.
Life is what YOU make it,
Most just try and fake it...