Total Posts:56|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

Prove God.

ClashnBoom
Posts: 886
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.
I will change my sig weekly. Week 4.

Fun fact of the week
Clumsy alien Jar Jar Binks was introduced in The Phantom Menace for comic relief, but he was initially a two-faced mercenary who was to betray Qui-Gon Jinn, a Jedi Master played by Liam Neeson.

Joke of the week:
Nerd 1: "Why can't you trust atoms?"
Nerd 2: : "Cause they make everything up!"
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/27/2015 11:14:30 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

You post is as clear as mud??????????????????????????
ClashnBoom
Posts: 886
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/27/2015 9:34:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 11:14:30 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

You post is as clear as mud??????????????????????????

I mean the one thing that makes Christians Christians is faith and if evidence was given of God's existence it will be a fact not a faith.
I will change my sig weekly. Week 4.

Fun fact of the week
Clumsy alien Jar Jar Binks was introduced in The Phantom Menace for comic relief, but he was initially a two-faced mercenary who was to betray Qui-Gon Jinn, a Jedi Master played by Liam Neeson.

Joke of the week:
Nerd 1: "Why can't you trust atoms?"
Nerd 2: : "Cause they make everything up!"
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/27/2015 9:42:20 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 9:34:44 PM, ClashnBoom wrote:
At 3/27/2015 11:14:30 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

You post is as clear as mud??????????????????????????

I mean the one thing that makes Christians Christians is faith and if evidence was given of God's existence it will be a fact not a faith. : :

The one thing that makes Christians believe in false deities and build false gods is our Creator.
celestialtorahteacher
Posts: 1,369
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/27/2015 9:46:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
My faith in Christianity is based on facts, not Bible stories, but astro-theological historically traceable Pattern that anyone can see for themselves. Yes, Pauline Christianity is in its End Times as historical facts have already robbed it of its reliance on the Bible stories as historical facts when they never were anything other than our Jewish myths of origin with belief in them taken to huge extremes by Gentiles.
bornofgod
Posts: 11,322
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/27/2015 10:22:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 9:46:39 PM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
My faith in Christianity is based on facts, not Bible stories, but astro-theological historically traceable Pattern that anyone can see for themselves. Yes, Pauline Christianity is in its End Times as historical facts have already robbed it of its reliance on the Bible stories as historical facts when they never were anything other than our Jewish myths of origin with belief in them taken to huge extremes by Gentiles. : :

Saint Paul didn't know that Christians would steal his writings and make him look like a traveling church salesman. LOL !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

It's a good thing that God planned to use one last saint during the end of the 1,000 year reign of Christ who would know what really happened to start Christianity.

The feet of iron and clay is a perfect description of the Roman Catholic Church under the Vatican rule and the 40,000 Protestant denominations there are today.
tkubok
Posts: 5,044
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/27/2015 11:25:20 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

No. The reason Christians will never be able to prove Gods existance, is because you cannot prove the existance of something that doesnt exist.
ClashnBoom
Posts: 886
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/27/2015 11:30:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 11:25:20 PM, tkubok wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

No. The reason Christians will never be able to prove Gods existance, is because you cannot prove the existance of something that doesnt exist.

Thanks, we need like you cause if people didn't go to forums just to post comments like that then it'll be easier to be Christian.
I will change my sig weekly. Week 4.

Fun fact of the week
Clumsy alien Jar Jar Binks was introduced in The Phantom Menace for comic relief, but he was initially a two-faced mercenary who was to betray Qui-Gon Jinn, a Jedi Master played by Liam Neeson.

Joke of the week:
Nerd 1: "Why can't you trust atoms?"
Nerd 2: : "Cause they make everything up!"
tkubok
Posts: 5,044
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/27/2015 11:32:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 11:30:13 PM, ClashnBoom wrote:
At 3/27/2015 11:25:20 PM, tkubok wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

No. The reason Christians will never be able to prove Gods existance, is because you cannot prove the existance of something that doesnt exist.

Thanks, we need like you cause if people didn't go to forums just to post comments like that then it'll be easier to be Christian.

Im just doing my duty as a concerned citizen.
18Karl
Posts: 351
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/28/2015 9:34:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Hah! May I introduce you to the God of Spinoza?
praise the lord Chin Chin
Excalibur
Posts: 170
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/28/2015 10:54:49 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence

I have yet to see a decent reply to this. I usually leave such topics alone; but as no one here has stated the obvious someone then must.

What most constantly fail to understand is that in order to disprove God, one must, in fact, be God. We, as finite humans, can never be everywhere at once all the time nor are we omniscient; never knowing for certain if what could possibly be there is not there, as what could theoretically be in any given spot could easily move location before discovered. In simplistic terms: Unless you are omnipresent and know everything that there is to know, you cannot state for certain that something does not exist.

The claim of proof or disproof falls not only on the Christian. As an atheist, you did not come to the conclusion that God did not exist without first being informed of His existence; you cannot choose to disbelieve in something you knew not of. Atheism is an objection to, not an admission of, as the atheist feels there is nothing to accept, therefore it becomes a belief (the reason why mentioned above) and a belief must be either proven or unproven.

due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Here you imply that if God was proven to exist, people would flock to Christianity. The Bible itself is proof that this is untrue. Example:

1. Moses led the Jews out of Egypt performing miracles in God's name, the Jews still complained and worshiped other gods.

2. God made it rain manna from heaven, the Jews still complained and worshiped other God's.

3. Prophets prophesied of warnings from God, performing miracles in His name while doing so, the Jews still complained, worshiped other God's, then crawled back to God when they needed help. (this list goes on and on)

4. Christ performs miracles, Jews and gentiles had Him killed.

Point being that God Himself doing anything would do nothing in the way of people's belief. Faith will always have to be the deciding factor. If God did show Himself to the world, the world's characteristic would then become a false one. Such as how you act when your boss walks by compared to when he is out of view: you would only be morally righteous as you knew God was paying attention; choices then no longer become real but false ones. God looks for the true nature of a person. Proving Himself would result in lying features. The Jews were only righteous when God was either helping them or they needed His help (proving Himself).
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/28/2015 11:32:24 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/28/2015 10:54:49 AM, Excalibur wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence

I have yet to see a decent reply to this. I usually leave such topics alone; but as no one here has stated the obvious someone then must.

What most constantly fail to understand is that in order to disprove God, one must, in fact, be God. We, as finite humans, can never be everywhere at once all the time nor are we omniscient; never knowing for certain if what could possibly be there is not there, as what could theoretically be in any given spot could easily move location before discovered. In simplistic terms: Unless you are omnipresent and know everything that there is to know, you cannot state for certain that something does not exist.

LOL. All you've managed to do is project your lack of showing your God exists, which was the point being made. Do you ever read others posts?

The claim of proof or disproof falls not only on the Christian

Yes, it is entirely on the Christian to prove their God exists. No one else is required to disprove anything.

As an atheist, you did not come to the conclusion that God did not exist without first being informed of His existence; you cannot choose to disbelieve in something you knew not of.

So, when did you stop believing in Santa Clause? When you were informed of him?

Atheism is an objection to, not an admission of, as the atheist feels there is nothing to accept, therefore it becomes a belief (the reason why mentioned above) and a belief must be either proven or unproven.

LOL. No, not accepting your claims that your God exists is not a belief, it is a reasoned decision based on your capacity to produce any evidence.

due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Here you imply that if God was proven to exist, people would flock to Christianity. The Bible itself is proof that this is untrue. Example:

1. Moses led the Jews out of Egypt performing miracles in God's name, the Jews still complained and worshiped other gods.

2. God made it rain manna from heaven, the Jews still complained and worshiped other God's.

3. Prophets prophesied of warnings from God, performing miracles in His name while doing so, the Jews still complained, worshiped other God's, then crawled back to God when they needed help. (this list goes on and on)

4. Christ performs miracles, Jews and gentiles had Him killed.

Your conclusions are false based on the fact those so-called miracles never happened.

Point being that God Himself doing anything would do nothing in the way of people's belief. Faith will always have to be the deciding factor. If God did show Himself to the world, the world's characteristic would then become a false one.

That makes no sense. If a God shows Himself, we would all believe in Him. Duh.

Such as how you act when your boss walks by compared to when he is out of view: you would only be morally righteous as you knew God was paying attention; choices then no longer become real but false ones.

Your reasoning is false, we would know our bosses exist, unlike knowing your God exists.

God looks for the true nature of a person.

And, you know that how?

Proving Himself would result in lying features.

LOL. Again, that makes no sense whatsoever. To prove oneself is not a lie.

The Jews were only righteous when God was either helping them or they needed His help (proving Himself).
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Excalibur
Posts: 170
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/28/2015 7:20:43 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/28/2015 11:32:24 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
LOL. All you've managed to do is project your lack of showing your God exists, which was the point being made. Do you ever read others posts?

The point trying to be made by the author is one that cannot be made. You cannot prove or disprove Him for obvious reasons.

Yes, it is entirely on the Christian to prove their God exists. No one else is required to disprove anything.

Yes they are. Disbelief is a belief. As you cannot disprove God, you do not know He is not real. A belief must be either proven or disproved.

So, when did you stop believing in Santa Clause? When you were informed of him?

*facepalm* Had no one ever told me of Santa Clause, I would have nothing to disbelieve in. How incompetent are you? No one is born believing in Santa Clause. You cannot stop believing in him after being informed if you were never informed to begin with.

LOL. No, not accepting your claims that your God exists is not a belief, it is a reasoned decision based on your capacity to produce any evidence.

Again, as you cannot disprove Him, it is a belief. The same goes the other way around. As we cannot prove, it is a belief.

Your conclusions are false based on the fact those so-called miracles never happened.

prove it.

That makes no sense. If a God shows Himself, we would all believe in Him. Duh.

*facepalm* Do you read the entire post before replying, or do you just start from the top and hope you don't write something preposterous on the way down?

Your reasoning is false, we would know our bosses exist, unlike knowing your God exists.

The metaphor has apparently eluded you. You act different when your boss is around compared to when he is not.

And, you know that how?

The Bible.

LOL. Again, that makes no sense whatsoever. To prove oneself is not a lie.

*facepalm* Damn you're an idiot. To prove oneself resulting in lying features means that we would be lying. God being around constantly would force us to be good. Not allow us to make the choice.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/28/2015 8:34:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/28/2015 7:20:43 PM, Excalibur wrote:
At 3/28/2015 11:32:24 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
LOL. All you've managed to do is project your lack of showing your God exists, which was the point being made. Do you ever read others posts?

The point trying to be made by the author is one that cannot be made. You cannot prove or disprove Him for obvious reasons.

Yes, it is entirely on the Christian to prove their God exists. No one else is required to disprove anything.

Exactly, the complete lack of existence of God is one primary reason, and there are many others.

Yes they are. Disbelief is a belief. As you cannot disprove God, you do not know He is not real. A belief must be either proven or disproved.

Sorry, that's now how it works, the Burden of Proof lies entirely on the claimant, the one making the positive claim of existence, and in this case that would be you.

So, when did you stop believing in Santa Clause? When you were informed of him?

*facepalm* Had no one ever told me of Santa Clause, I would have nothing to disbelieve in.

yes, and if no one ever told you about God...

,How incompetent are you?

Enough to see you don't know what you're talking about.

No one is born believing in Santa Clause.

Or God.

You cannot stop believing in him after being informed if you were never informed to begin with.

Really? Funny how that works with all kinds of invisible things, unicorns, leprechauns, etc.

LOL. No, not accepting your claims that your God exists is not a belief, it is a reasoned decision based on your capacity to produce any evidence.

Again, as you cannot disprove Him, it is a belief.

The burden of proof is yours entirely.

The same goes the other way around. As we cannot prove, it is a belief.

Or, a delusion.

Your conclusions are false based on the fact those so-called miracles never happened.

prove it.

The laws of nature don't allow those kinds of miracles, your talking magic. Do you believe in magic, too?

That makes no sense. If a God shows Himself, we would all believe in Him. Duh.


*facepalm* Do you read the entire post before replying, or do you just start from the top and hope you don't write something preposterous on the way down?

Why not just stick to the subject matter rather than acting like an a$$.

Your reasoning is false, we would know our bosses exist, unlike knowing your God exists.

The metaphor has apparently eluded you.

Not at all,

You act different when your boss is around compared to when he is not.

No, I don't.

And, you know that how?

The Bible.

Okee dokee.

LOL. Again, that makes no sense whatsoever. To prove oneself is not a lie.

*facepalm* Damn you're an idiot.

And, you're an a$$. Isn't this fun?

To prove oneself resulting in lying features means that we would be lying.

Fail. lol.

God being around constantly would force us to be good.

Isn't that the point?

Not allow us to make the choice.

There are no choice under Gods will, none.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
celestialtorahteacher
Posts: 1,369
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/28/2015 8:52:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

I can prove God's existence any day of the week. God guided me to reveal Christ's Sword, the very one described in Revelation and without God this incredibly spiritually powerful Sword of Peace would not have been seen as miraculous and a Sign of the Messiah. Why is the Sword of Peace miraculous? Because it "speaks" God's will for humanity without need of any language. It is a real as opposed to mythological Pentecostal religious event and it was honored by over 500 Nazarean Christians who witnessed it at Easter in Nazareth, Israel, in 2003. God is a Spirit and as a Spirit God inspires people, as God inspired me. Without God, there is no religious inspiration, no religious icon, no David statue, no Sistine Chapel paintings, no Mozart, Bach, Hayden, Beethoven, no Gospels, no cathedrals, in short, Culture is and has been very much inspired by God without which no inspiration, dead landscape devoid of creative works inspired by God worship.

Atheists just don't understand spiritual consciousness as they are really only using their left-brains primarily to deal with the world, their right-brain hemisphere where spiritual processing seems to take place is disabled and not functioning, which atheist don't see as they don't see spiritual phenomena either. Brain dead is another way of putting it or half-wits, our beloved atheist mentally disabled people..
Excalibur
Posts: 170
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/28/2015 10:35:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/28/2015 8:34:55 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
Sorry, that's now how it works, the Burden of Proof lies entirely on the claimant, the one making the positive claim of existence, and in this case that would be you.

Please read in full before reply, as it is clear you do not in most cases

*sigh* I'm going to make this as simple as I possibly can and split it into two resposnes. I was just going to add you to the ignore list, but you did make a reply to something that was an actual response. So, this is how it is going to go down. Either your next replies to the debate will be coherent rebuttals, or I will put you on the Ignore list. You have proven yourself, in two threads, to be a waste of my time. You do not give retorts that would consist a win, as nothing you spew makes any sense.

As an infant, you were born with no idea as to who God was. Someone had to tell you about Him, therefore you were not born an atheist, as an atheist must choose to reject God based on being informed of God. That makes Atheism, as Christianity, a belief. It is a belief due the fact that you cannot disprove God, as you are not omnipotent or omniscient. You would have to be everywhere at the same time and know absolutely everything to disprove God, but since you cannot, as God could, at any given moment, move from one spot in the universe to the next before being discovered, you cannot know for absolute certainty. As stated, you would have to be God to disprove God. And yes, the same is said for unicorns and leprechauns. Just because something does not exist on this planet does not mean it does not exist on another. Unless you have visited every planet in the universe, you cannot make the claim that they do not exist, as you do not know with absolute certainty, even if you had visited every planet, to know with absolute certainty, again, you would have to be omnipotent. If a unicorn can fly, it could theoretically move from planet to planet as you approached, therefore it would never be discovered. Again, you would need to be everywhere at the same time to know for sure it does not exist 100%. As Atheism is a belief, the belief, like all beliefs, must be proven. Both sides of the spectrum are therefore burdened with this task.

Again, if your reply to this is not coherent, but just hearsay and opinions, I will put you on the ignore list.

The laws of nature don't allow those kinds of miracles, your talking magic. Do you believe in magic, too?

This was the reason I decided to allow you one last chance. It was a real rebuttal. Not an opinion or a whiny comment.

Here, you are asserting that the laws of nature are absolute, which is wrong. A supernatural force would not be breaking the laws of nature, but superseding the laws of nature. To put it bluntly, what is higher than one law does not break said law. A supernatural force would be higher than the laws of nature. Example:

If you were to jump off a cliff, you would surely fall to your death, right? If you were to jump off a cliff while wearing a hang glider, the hang glider would be superseding the laws of nature. The hang glider does not break the law of nature, but over passes it. Much in the same way that someone who murders in self-defense does not break the law when committing the murder, he surpasses the law, as the law would only be broken had he murdered for no reason. A supernatural force would succeed a natural force . That is why it is called supernatural. God is a supernatural force, not a natural one. As God cannot be proven or disproved, the miracles performed cannot be either.

Again, if your reply to this is not coherent, but just hearsay and opinions, I will put you on the ignore list.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/29/2015 8:56:38 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/28/2015 10:35:19 PM, Excalibur wrote:
At 3/28/2015 8:34:55 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
Sorry, that's now how it works, the Burden of Proof lies entirely on the claimant, the one making the positive claim of existence, and in this case that would be you.

Please read in full before reply, as it is clear you do not in most cases

Yes, I read your posts and I respond directly to your words. You know this already.

*sigh* I'm going to make this as simple as I possibly can and split it into two resposnes. I was just going to add you to the ignore list, but you did make a reply to something that was an actual response.

Please stop lying, I have responded to all of your words, the problem is that you are not responding to my words, so clearly you're just projecting here.

So, this is how it is going to go down.

LOL. Are you the forum police?

Either your next replies to the debate will be coherent rebuttals, or I will put you on the Ignore list.

I have refuted most of your words as nonsense so far and have shown you really don't know what you're talking about. Putting me on the ignore list simply confirms you're afraid to be exposed.

You have proven yourself, in two threads, to be a waste of my time.

Yes, I understand that, when your nonsense gets exposed for what it is must be a great deal of time wasted for you.

You do not give retorts that would consist a win, as nothing you spew makes any sense.

Yes, I understand your religious beliefs make sense but reality does not.

As an infant, you were born with no idea as to who God was.

That would be the same with Santa Clause, the Tooth Fairy and the Boogeyman.

Someone had to tell you about Him, therefore you were not born an atheist, as an atheist must choose to reject God based on being informed of God.

Sorry, but atheism is simply a lack of belief, hence everyone is born with a lack of belief in any gods, which means we are all born atheists.

That makes Atheism, as Christianity, a belief.

Clearly, you are confused with yet another definition. Have you never cracked open a dictionary before?

It is a belief due the fact that you cannot disprove God, as you are not omnipotent or omniscient.

Sorry, but the burden of proof is entirely on YOU to prove your God exists. No one has to disprove your God just we don't have to disprove unicorns and leprechauns.

You would have to be everywhere at the same time and know absolutely everything to disprove God, but since you cannot, as God could, at any given moment, move from one spot in the universe to the next before being discovered, you cannot know for absolute certainty. As stated, you would have to be God to disprove God. And yes, the same is said for unicorns and leprechauns. Just because something does not exist on this planet does not mean it does not exist on another. Unless you have visited every planet in the universe, you cannot make the claim that they do not exist, as you do not know with absolute certainty, even if you had visited every planet, to know with absolute certainty, again, you would have to be omnipotent. If a unicorn can fly, it could theoretically move from planet to planet as you approached, therefore it would never be discovered. Again, you would need to be everywhere at the same time to know for sure it does not exist 100%. As Atheism is a belief, the belief, like all beliefs, must be proven. Both sides of the spectrum are therefore burdened with this task.

Your entire explanation is complete nonsense. No one needs to disprove anything, you need to prove your God exists, that is the bottom line.

Atheism is not a belief, that is a fallacy.

Again, if your reply to this is not coherent, but just hearsay and opinions, I will put you on the ignore list.

Yes, I'm sure you will, but others here will also expose your nonsense, hence you'll just wind up putting everyone on your ignore list. That would be the cowards way out.

The laws of nature don't allow those kinds of miracles, your talking magic. Do you believe in magic, too?

This was the reason I decided to allow you one last chance. It was a real rebuttal. Not an opinion or a whiny comment.

Fvck u.

Here, you are asserting that the laws of nature are absolute, which is wrong.

Again, you are putting words in my mouth because you are dishonest and are incapable of putting together an argument yourself. I NEVER said the laws of nature are absolute, please stop lying.

A supernatural force would not be breaking the laws of nature, but superseding the laws of nature.

In other words, you believe in magic. No such things as "supernatural forces" has ever been shown to exist.

To put it bluntly, what is higher than one law does not break said law. A supernatural force would be higher than the laws of nature.

LOL, And yet, no such forces have ever been shown to exist.

Example:

If you were to jump off a cliff, you would surely fall to your death, right? If you were to jump off a cliff while wearing a hang glider, the hang glider would be superseding the laws of nature. The hang glider does not break the law of nature, but over passes it.

LOL. Wow, you really aren't very well read. A hand glider uses the atmosphere to work, which has nothing to do with breaking or superseding the laws of nature. Sorry, that you don't understand how science works.

Much in the same way that someone who murders in self-defense does not break the law when committing the murder, he surpasses the law, as the law would only be broken had he murdered for no reason.

That is a terrible example, because there are laws for self defense. Duh.

A supernatural force would succeed a natural force .

Non sequitur. No such things as "supernatural forces" have ever been shown to exist.

That is why it is called supernatural. God is a supernatural force, not a natural one.

That is positive claim that is not in the Bible, please provide evidence that God is a supernatural force?

As God cannot be proven or disproved, the miracles performed cannot be either.

And yet, the burden of proof to show miracles exist is entirely on YOU to prove, which you can't hence your claim has no more validity than claiming unicorns and leprechauns.

Again, if your reply to this is not coherent, but just hearsay and opinions, I will put you on the ignore list.

Go right ahead, that is the cowards way out and will only confirm you have no idea what you're talking about.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/29/2015 9:25:37 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Yu tend to use a very human understanding wof what faith is.

In scripture faith is not obtainable without proof to build it on..

Anything less is not faith, it is mere belief or even gullibility.

That is how God views the difference anyway.

No-one actually needs to prove the existence of God, he has already put more than enough evidence of his existence and his qualities in his creation around him, for those with the eyes to see it.

Those who do not want to see it, won;t until they are presented with no choice whatever, which will be too late for them to accept it.

Some won't even accept it then and doubtless will go down at Armageddon yelling "No! it's not true, you don't exist!".

Back in the 1st century Paul declared that those who refused to see the evidence God has provided in creation were inexcusable.

The more I watch nature and science program,s the more I realise that it has gone was past inexcusable now.

It really is all down to whether or not you choose to accept the evidence for what is truly is, or, like most people reject it out of fear of man, submission to peer pressure, or simply too much respect for humans who are only too happy to ignore the truth about God.

Don't leave God out of the equation or, like so many scientists who do so, you will continually end up with the wrong answer.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/29/2015 9:38:13 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/29/2015 9:25:37 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Yu tend to use a very human understanding wof what faith is.

In scripture faith is not obtainable without proof to build it on..

Anything less is not faith, it is mere belief or even gullibility.

That is how God views the difference anyway.

No-one actually needs to prove the existence of God, he has already put more than enough evidence of his existence and his qualities in his creation around him, for those with the eyes to see it.

Those who do not want to see it, won;t until they are presented with no choice whatever, which will be too late for them to accept it.

Some won't even accept it then and doubtless will go down at Armageddon yelling "No! it's not true, you don't exist!".

Back in the 1st century Paul declared that those who refused to see the evidence God has provided in creation were inexcusable.

The more I watch nature and science program,s the more I realise that it has gone was past inexcusable now.

It really is all down to whether or not you choose to accept the evidence for what is truly is, or, like most people reject it out of fear of man, submission to peer pressure, or simply too much respect for humans who are only too happy to ignore the truth about God.

Sorry, but the simple reason is that your god fantasy is laughably insane. No fear, peer pressure or anything else you might imagine, it's simply a matter of insanity on your part.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/29/2015 9:46:03 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/29/2015 9:38:13 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:25:37 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Yu tend to use a very human understanding wof what faith is.

In scripture faith is not obtainable without proof to build it on..

Anything less is not faith, it is mere belief or even gullibility.

That is how God views the difference anyway.

No-one actually needs to prove the existence of God, he has already put more than enough evidence of his existence and his qualities in his creation around him, for those with the eyes to see it.

Those who do not want to see it, won;t until they are presented with no choice whatever, which will be too late for them to accept it.

Some won't even accept it then and doubtless will go down at Armageddon yelling "No! it's not true, you don't exist!".

Back in the 1st century Paul declared that those who refused to see the evidence God has provided in creation were inexcusable.

The more I watch nature and science program,s the more I realise that it has gone was past inexcusable now.

It really is all down to whether or not you choose to accept the evidence for what is truly is, or, like most people reject it out of fear of man, submission to peer pressure, or simply too much respect for humans who are only too happy to ignore the truth about God.

Sorry, but the simple reason is that your god fantasy is laughably insane. No fear, peer pressure or anything else you might imagine, it's simply a matter of insanity on your part.

You have just proved my point, and that of Christ.

God is no fantasy, but people like you are too afraid of looking stupid to admit it.

You are so desperate top be taken seriously you have to cause any true believer of insanity, lol, thus revealing your own concerns about yourself and how people see you.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/29/2015 9:53:11 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/29/2015 9:46:03 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:38:13 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:25:37 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Yu tend to use a very human understanding wof what faith is.

In scripture faith is not obtainable without proof to build it on..

Anything less is not faith, it is mere belief or even gullibility.

That is how God views the difference anyway.

No-one actually needs to prove the existence of God, he has already put more than enough evidence of his existence and his qualities in his creation around him, for those with the eyes to see it.

Those who do not want to see it, won;t until they are presented with no choice whatever, which will be too late for them to accept it.

Some won't even accept it then and doubtless will go down at Armageddon yelling "No! it's not true, you don't exist!".

Back in the 1st century Paul declared that those who refused to see the evidence God has provided in creation were inexcusable.

The more I watch nature and science program,s the more I realise that it has gone was past inexcusable now.

It really is all down to whether or not you choose to accept the evidence for what is truly is, or, like most people reject it out of fear of man, submission to peer pressure, or simply too much respect for humans who are only too happy to ignore the truth about God.

Sorry, but the simple reason is that your god fantasy is laughably insane. No fear, peer pressure or anything else you might imagine, it's simply a matter of insanity on your part.

You have just proved my point, and that of Christ.

God is no fantasy, but people like you are too afraid of looking stupid to admit it.

Sorry, but your beliefs are laughably insane, key word here is not fear but laughter.

You are so desperate top be taken seriously you have to cause any true believer of insanity, lol, thus revealing your own concerns about yourself and how people see you.

You are the one making the insane claims.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/29/2015 9:56:04 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/29/2015 9:53:11 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:46:03 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:38:13 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:25:37 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Yu tend to use a very human understanding wof what faith is.

In scripture faith is not obtainable without proof to build it on..

Anything less is not faith, it is mere belief or even gullibility.

That is how God views the difference anyway.

No-one actually needs to prove the existence of God, he has already put more than enough evidence of his existence and his qualities in his creation around him, for those with the eyes to see it.

Those who do not want to see it, won;t until they are presented with no choice whatever, which will be too late for them to accept it.

Some won't even accept it then and doubtless will go down at Armageddon yelling "No! it's not true, you don't exist!".

Back in the 1st century Paul declared that those who refused to see the evidence God has provided in creation were inexcusable.

The more I watch nature and science program,s the more I realise that it has gone was past inexcusable now.

It really is all down to whether or not you choose to accept the evidence for what is truly is, or, like most people reject it out of fear of man, submission to peer pressure, or simply too much respect for humans who are only too happy to ignore the truth about God.

Sorry, but the simple reason is that your god fantasy is laughably insane. No fear, peer pressure or anything else you might imagine, it's simply a matter of insanity on your part.

You have just proved my point, and that of Christ.

God is no fantasy, but people like you are too afraid of looking stupid to admit it.

Sorry, but your beliefs are laughably insane, key word here is not fear but laughter.

You are so desperate top be taken seriously you have to cause any true believer of insanity, lol, thus revealing your own concerns about yourself and how people see you.

You are the one making the insane claims.

In your dreams.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/29/2015 10:31:27 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/29/2015 9:56:04 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:53:11 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:46:03 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:38:13 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:25:37 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Yu tend to use a very human understanding wof what faith is.

In scripture faith is not obtainable without proof to build it on..

Anything less is not faith, it is mere belief or even gullibility.

That is how God views the difference anyway.

No-one actually needs to prove the existence of God, he has already put more than enough evidence of his existence and his qualities in his creation around him, for those with the eyes to see it.

Those who do not want to see it, won;t until they are presented with no choice whatever, which will be too late for them to accept it.

Some won't even accept it then and doubtless will go down at Armageddon yelling "No! it's not true, you don't exist!".

Back in the 1st century Paul declared that those who refused to see the evidence God has provided in creation were inexcusable.

The more I watch nature and science program,s the more I realise that it has gone was past inexcusable now.

It really is all down to whether or not you choose to accept the evidence for what is truly is, or, like most people reject it out of fear of man, submission to peer pressure, or simply too much respect for humans who are only too happy to ignore the truth about God.

Sorry, but the simple reason is that your god fantasy is laughably insane. No fear, peer pressure or anything else you might imagine, it's simply a matter of insanity on your part.

You have just proved my point, and that of Christ.

God is no fantasy, but people like you are too afraid of looking stupid to admit it.

Sorry, but your beliefs are laughably insane, key word here is not fear but laughter.

You are so desperate top be taken seriously you have to cause any true believer of insanity, lol, thus revealing your own concerns about yourself and how people see you.

You are the one making the insane claims.

In your dreams.

They're your dreams, not mine.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/29/2015 2:29:23 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/29/2015 10:31:27 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:56:04 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:53:11 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:46:03 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:38:13 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/29/2015 9:25:37 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Yu tend to use a very human understanding wof what faith is.

In scripture faith is not obtainable without proof to build it on..

Anything less is not faith, it is mere belief or even gullibility.

That is how God views the difference anyway.

No-one actually needs to prove the existence of God, he has already put more than enough evidence of his existence and his qualities in his creation around him, for those with the eyes to see it.

Those who do not want to see it, won;t until they are presented with no choice whatever, which will be too late for them to accept it.

Some won't even accept it then and doubtless will go down at Armageddon yelling "No! it's not true, you don't exist!".

Back in the 1st century Paul declared that those who refused to see the evidence God has provided in creation were inexcusable.

The more I watch nature and science program,s the more I realise that it has gone was past inexcusable now.

It really is all down to whether or not you choose to accept the evidence for what is truly is, or, like most people reject it out of fear of man, submission to peer pressure, or simply too much respect for humans who are only too happy to ignore the truth about God.

Sorry, but the simple reason is that your god fantasy is laughably insane. No fear, peer pressure or anything else you might imagine, it's simply a matter of insanity on your part.

You have just proved my point, and that of Christ.

God is no fantasy, but people like you are too afraid of looking stupid to admit it.

Sorry, but your beliefs are laughably insane, key word here is not fear but laughter.

You are so desperate top be taken seriously you have to cause any true believer of insanity, lol, thus revealing your own concerns about yourself and how people see you.

You are the one making the insane claims.

In your dreams.

They're your dreams, not mine.

I don't need to dream, I have the true reality to look forward to.
bulproof
Posts: 25,303
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/29/2015 5:53:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/29/2015 2:29:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
You do understand that if you born in Afghanistan you wouldn't possess this great closeness to god, don't you?
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/30/2015 5:50:11 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/29/2015 5:53:54 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/29/2015 2:29:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
You do understand that if you born in Afghanistan you wouldn't possess this great closeness to god, don't you?

No, I do not understand that, because there are JWs in every country of the world, very few of whom were born to it, all of whom have heard the voice of the Christ in the words they were read from scripture, and have answered his call.

The majority of people in the UK are no closer to God than those in Afghanistan, yet I drew close to God as a child despite that, though admittedly I lost that closeness again for some time, but I never forgot it, and soon recognised it again when I found its "home" with the JWs.

God's work knows no national boundaries, nor racial distinctions, all human hearts are simply human hearts to him, even yours if you would only open yours to him you would know that.

http://www.jw.org...
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,328
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/30/2015 6:00:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Ever read Hebrews 11?
Scriptural faith is SUBSTANCE and EVIDENCE, not the lack thereof you have it backwards. Faith produces the fruit of the Spirit, it's a spiritual element and principle that is utilized in the life of a believer, it was never intended to be used as a substitute or a crutch for proof or reason.
As a matter of fact faith isn't even an option in the Bible unless you know God exists...

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

You see if you read the chapter you will see that faith is attributed to all the people who KNEW God existed, Jesus as well didn't apply faith to assume or guess God existed, He applied faith for results due to His trust in the Father, that is a whole different scenario.

http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org...
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,328
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/30/2015 6:14:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Having said that, God cannot be empirically proven, that is by a scientific method due to the nature of God being Spirit, this does not mean God cannot be proven, it means we can't examine God physically because there is no physical base to examine.
God is Spirit and is worshipped in spirit, seeking God by spirit not by flesh.

John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.

Romans 8
http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org...
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/31/2015 6:37:24 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/30/2015 6:14:44 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
Having said that, God cannot be empirically proven, that is by a scientific method due to the nature of God being Spirit, this does not mean God cannot be proven, it means we can't examine God physically because there is no physical base to examine.
God is Spirit and is worshipped in spirit, seeking God by spirit not by flesh.

John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.


Romans 8
http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org...

I think you are wrong.

In fact from what I have seen, science is proving the existence of God continually. It is simply that so few want to face up to what they are actually seeing.

A typical example is how scientists continually go on and on about the wonderful design of things, whilst absolutely insisting that there is no designer and therefore can be no design.

They contradict themselves continually.

There are many more examples in every science program.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
3/31/2015 7:03:04 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 3/30/2015 6:00:51 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 3/27/2015 9:59:12 AM, ClashnBoom wrote:
I believe Christians will never be able to prove God's existence due to the fact that there will be no more need to have faith.

Ever read Hebrews 11?
Scriptural faith is SUBSTANCE and EVIDENCE, not the lack thereof you have it backwards. Faith produces the fruit of the Spirit, it's a spiritual element and principle that is utilized in the life of a believer, it was never intended to be used as a substitute or a crutch for proof or reason.
As a matter of fact faith isn't even an option in the Bible unless you know God exists...

6 But without faith it is impossible to please him: for he that cometh to God must believe that he is, and that he is a rewarder of them that diligently seek him.

You see if you read the chapter you will see that faith is attributed to all the people who KNEW God existed, Jesus as well didn't apply faith to assume or guess God existed, He applied faith for results due to His trust in the Father, that is a whole different scenario.

http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org...

I could not agree more, though your choice of translation is poor, since the KJV is one of the least honest translations available. There are a number of better alternatives on http://studybible..info, including a few literal translations.

I generally use the America Standard Version, of there, because at lest it is honest enough to put God's name back in most of the places it belongs.

But to get back to faith:

In these times many have downgraded faith to the same level as mere belief, but that is not how scripture demands we view it.

Take Abraham as an example.

He knew God well enough to show sufficient faith to leave a very comfortable life behind and live in tents as a nomad, though admittedly still with a pretty large retinue.

And yet neither he nor Sarah had sufficient faith to trust God enough to provide the promised heir through Sara, as he had said he would.

Hence, at his wife's urging he fathered Ishmael by Hagar, and now, for his sin, we have to contend with Islam.

However, after Isaac was born Abraham learned to have a stronger faith because God had proved himself to Abraham, and so when Jehovah asked him to sacrifice Isaac, Abraham trusted in God enough to know that, even if he didn't understand how, Isaac would live, since he had to for all the promises to be fulfilled.

So, as you rightly say, Abraham gained knowledge of God, and the more he learned of God, the more faith he had.

Faith is most definitely not mere belief.

My knowledge of, and faith in, God has grown through many trials, invariably, like Abraham's, self inflicted,

Through them all, Jehovah has never completely deserted me.

OK sometimes he has stood back and said "OK get your fingers burned and learn from it", but he has always been there when I have needed him most, and still is.

How could I ever be insane enough to turn my back on him deliberately.