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The Love of Money

Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/19/2015 11:42:14 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
The LOVE of $$$$ seems to rule the world of humans.
Some people go to work for $$$$
Some save $$$$
Some spend $$$$
Some steal $$$$
Some manipulate others with $$$$.

Some people charge $$$$ to tell other people what they want to hear.
Some people pay $$$$ to people who tell them what they want to hear.

Very FEW hand out information for FREE.

Religious "leaders" get paid $$$ to teach the doctrines their particular religion specifies they teach.
Science "leaders" also get paid $$$ to teach what they are told to teach.
Who pays them? The people who have the MONEY to SUPPORT what they believe.
Those who have the most MONEY can PAY for the MOST advertising and whatever they are supporting or selling ends up becoming the most popular things are sold. It makes no difference if it is a soft drink or a religious doctrine of a scientific theory.
It is MONEY or the lack of it which ultimately motivates people to do what they do.

Beliefs are brought and sold by the "teachers" ( religious, scientific or otherwise) who convince others that what they are selling is valuable and true.

Why do you think the Genesis creation story is so popular?
Why do you think the big bang theory is so popular?
Why do you think people debate one against the other as if they were the ONLY two choices to believe in regarding any so called "beginning" of the universe ?
ADVERTISING.... Those which are advertised the most are what sell the most because they get the most attention.

The reason is because they MAKE MONEY for the "sellers" due to the fans of those things being "addicted" to them and being incapable of giving up their addiction.

I came across an article today which showed me how biased many scientists really are these days simply because of a fear of losing funding.

Check out http://rense.com...
dee-em
Posts: 6,482
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4/20/2015 12:40:42 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
What a load of nonsense. What you neglect to mention is that a scientific theory is falsifiable. In fact a scientist can make his/her reputation (and $$$$) by overturning a long-established theory. Science is self-correcting and that is why it is such a powerful a tool for understanding nature and has been such a boon to humanity over the centuries, unlike religion.

These constant attacks on the motivations of scientists are simply pathetic. I dare anyone to substantiate a conspiracy theory amongst a large group of scientists for any length of time. Whilst scientific hoaxes have been perpetrated by fame-seeking individuals over the years, they have usually been debunked fairly quickly by, yes, other scientists. Scientists keep other scientists honest.
dee-em
Posts: 6,482
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4/20/2015 1:29:12 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Oh heck, I admit it. I'm addicted to the Big Bang. I can't help myself. All my money goes to my Big Bang pusher. My wife has left me, I've lost my job and still I can't resist the temptation. It's at the stage where I've resorted to stealing to maintain my Big Bang habit. I need help!

LMAO.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/20/2015 2:45:09 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 12:40:42 AM, dee-em wrote:
What a load of nonsense. What you neglect to mention is that a scientific theory is falsifiable. In fact a scientist can make his/her reputation (and $$$$) by overturning a long-established theory. Science is self-correcting and that is why it is such a powerful a tool for understanding nature and has been such a boon to humanity over the centuries, unlike religion.

Yet when TOP scientists like the ones mentioned in the article manage to falsify BBT they are ridiculed and rejected by the BBT adherents as promoting nonsense the same as any EX-believers in God are ridiculed by believers in God as promoting some kind of nonsense when they try to tell believers their invisible supernatural character is a myth who does not exist and never existed.
The scientists who claim the BB never happened are also treated as outcasts by those who want to believe it did happen.
It seems scientists have the same kind of conflicts and divisions as religion does due to opposing beliefs regarding which theories are true and which are false.

These constant attacks on the motivations of scientists are simply pathetic. I dare anyone to substantiate a conspiracy theory amongst a large group of scientists for any length of time. Whilst scientific hoaxes have been perpetrated by fame-seeking individuals over the years, they have usually been debunked fairly quickly by, yes, other scientists. Scientists keep other scientists honest.

The article is scientists attacking scientists and trying to keep them honest. It is not Christians attacking scientists.
I am simply pointing it out. The scientists who wrote the article are either lying or speaking from experience. Why would they lie when their reputations are at stake? They are challenging the BIAS toward the BBT in the science community itself and explaining WHY such a BIAS exists.
Obviously Not all scientists are honest just as not all believers in God are honest. Con artists exist in every field of life. People should be honest but when people cannot even be honest with themselves they have no hope of being honest with anyone else.
Self deception is a very subtle thing from which the sufferers are not even aware they suffer.
People who believe their own lies, illusions and delusions, cannot help but teach those same lies as the truth which they sincerely believe they are.

Many dishonest people like to believe they are honest and are very good at convincing others that they are honest.
Ultimately most people seem to be easily bribed by things which appeal to them and simply reject anything that does not appeal to them.
Very FEW actually try to disprove or falsify their own beliefs and theories.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/20/2015 2:46:59 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 1:29:12 AM, dee-em wrote:
Oh heck, I admit it. I'm addicted to the Big Bang. I can't help myself. All my money goes to my Big Bang pusher. My wife has left me, I've lost my job and still I can't resist the temptation. It's at the stage where I've resorted to stealing to maintain my Big Bang habit. I need help!

LMAO.

At least you have a good sense of humor.
Bennett91
Posts: 4,237
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4/20/2015 3:07:40 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/19/2015 11:42:14 PM, Skyangel wrote:
The LOVE of $$$$ seems to rule the world of humans.
Some people go to work for $$$$
Some save $$$$
Some spend $$$$
Some steal $$$$
Some manipulate others with $$$$.

Some people charge $$$$ to tell other people what they want to hear.
Some people pay $$$$ to people who tell them what they want to hear.

Very FEW hand out information for FREE.

Religious "leaders" get paid $$$ to teach the doctrines their particular religion specifies they teach.
Science "leaders" also get paid $$$ to teach what they are told to teach.
Who pays them? The people who have the MONEY to SUPPORT what they believe.
Those who have the most MONEY can PAY for the MOST advertising and whatever they are supporting or selling ends up becoming the most popular things are sold. It makes no difference if it is a soft drink or a religious doctrine of a scientific theory.
It is MONEY or the lack of it which ultimately motivates people to do what they do.

Beliefs are brought and sold by the "teachers" ( religious, scientific or otherwise) who convince others that what they are selling is valuable and true.

Why do you think the Genesis creation story is so popular?
Why do you think the big bang theory is so popular?
Why do you think people debate one against the other as if they were the ONLY two choices to believe in regarding any so called "beginning" of the universe ?
ADVERTISING.... Those which are advertised the most are what sell the most because they get the most attention.

The reason is because they MAKE MONEY for the "sellers" due to the fans of those things being "addicted" to them and being incapable of giving up their addiction.

I came across an article today which showed me how biased many scientists really are these days simply because of a fear of losing funding.

Check out http://rense.com...

I'm confused, are you trying to criticize capitalism? Money is a necessity unless you want to go back to bartering.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/20/2015 3:34:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 3:07:40 AM, Bennett91 wrote:
At 4/19/2015 11:42:14 PM, Skyangel wrote:
The LOVE of $$$$ seems to rule the world of humans.
Some people go to work for $$$$
Some save $$$$
Some spend $$$$
Some steal $$$$
Some manipulate others with $$$$.

Some people charge $$$$ to tell other people what they want to hear.
Some people pay $$$$ to people who tell them what they want to hear.

Very FEW hand out information for FREE.

Religious "leaders" get paid $$$ to teach the doctrines their particular religion specifies they teach.
Science "leaders" also get paid $$$ to teach what they are told to teach.
Who pays them? The people who have the MONEY to SUPPORT what they believe.
Those who have the most MONEY can PAY for the MOST advertising and whatever they are supporting or selling ends up becoming the most popular things are sold. It makes no difference if it is a soft drink or a religious doctrine of a scientific theory.
It is MONEY or the lack of it which ultimately motivates people to do what they do.

Beliefs are brought and sold by the "teachers" ( religious, scientific or otherwise) who convince others that what they are selling is valuable and true.

Why do you think the Genesis creation story is so popular?
Why do you think the big bang theory is so popular?
Why do you think people debate one against the other as if they were the ONLY two choices to believe in regarding any so called "beginning" of the universe ?
ADVERTISING.... Those which are advertised the most are what sell the most because they get the most attention.

The reason is because they MAKE MONEY for the "sellers" due to the fans of those things being "addicted" to them and being incapable of giving up their addiction.

I came across an article today which showed me how biased many scientists really are these days simply because of a fear of losing funding.

Check out http://rense.com...

I'm confused, are you trying to criticize capitalism? Money is a necessity unless you want to go back to bartering.

No, I am simply pointing out that the LOVE for money can cause people to do things they might not do if money was not in the picture.
I am pointing out that people who are paid to teach a certain thing lose their job if they teach something which has not been "approved" by whoever has the greatest authority in a certain field.
I am also pointing out that there is as much division amongst scientists regarding which theories they advocate as there is amongst Christians regarding which doctrines they advocate.
Opposite opinions exist about the BBT amongst TOP scientist. It is not just a few Christians who claim the big bang never happened.

http://bigbangneverhappened.org...

Eric Learner is one of the TOP scientists who signed that original article mentioned in my OP.

It is not my reputation at stake here. It is his and his colleagues who also signed that article which basically claims that the dominance of the big bang theory rests more on funding decisions than on the scientific method.

In the end it is obviously a personal choice to believe a scientific theory is true or false just the same as it is a personal choice to believe a religious doctrine is true or false.

The amusing thing is that there are always adherents to any opposite views and those people all like to believe their own view is correct while the opposing view is false. In the end all human belief is subject to human perception and interpretation.
Any observation is subject to human perception and interpretation.
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,489
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4/20/2015 6:08:48 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 2:46:59 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/20/2015 1:29:12 AM, dee-em wrote:
Oh heck, I admit it. I'm addicted to the Big Bang. I can't help myself. All my money goes to my Big Bang pusher. My wife has left me, I've lost my job and still I can't resist the temptation. It's at the stage where I've resorted to stealing to maintain my Big Bang habit. I need help!

LMAO.

At least you have a good sense of humor.

+1
Never fart near dog
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,489
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4/20/2015 6:13:16 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/19/2015 11:42:14 PM, Skyangel wrote:
The LOVE of $$$$ seems to rule the world of humans.
Some people go to work for $$$$
Some save $$$$
Some spend $$$$
Some steal $$$$
Some manipulate others with $$$$.

Some people charge $$$$ to tell other people what they want to hear.
Some people pay $$$$ to people who tell them what they want to hear.

Very FEW hand out information for FREE.

Religious "leaders" get paid $$$ to teach the doctrines their particular religion specifies they teach.
Science "leaders" also get paid $$$ to teach what they are told to teach.
Who pays them? The people who have the MONEY to SUPPORT what they believe.
Those who have the most MONEY can PAY for the MOST advertising and whatever they are supporting or selling ends up becoming the most popular things are sold. It makes no difference if it is a soft drink or a religious doctrine of a scientific theory.
It is MONEY or the lack of it which ultimately motivates people to do what they do.

Beliefs are brought and sold by the "teachers" ( religious, scientific or otherwise) who convince others that what they are selling is valuable and true.

Why do you think the Genesis creation story is so popular?
Why do you think the big bang theory is so popular?
Why do you think people debate one against the other as if they were the ONLY two choices to believe in regarding any so called "beginning" of the universe ?
ADVERTISING.... Those which are advertised the most are what sell the most because they get the most attention.

The reason is because they MAKE MONEY for the "sellers" due to the fans of those things being "addicted" to them and being incapable of giving up their addiction.

I came across an article today which showed me how biased many scientists really are these days simply because of a fear of losing funding.

Check out http://rense.com...

most people are selfish as cr-p, this leads them to lick money's @ss where ever they can find it doesnt matter if its true wrong immoral moral good or bad... true story
Never fart near dog
dee-em
Posts: 6,482
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4/20/2015 6:16:52 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 2:45:09 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/20/2015 12:40:42 AM, dee-em wrote:
What a load of nonsense. What you neglect to mention is that a scientific theory is falsifiable. In fact a scientist can make his/her reputation (and $$$$) by overturning a long-established theory. Science is self-correcting and that is why it is such a powerful a tool for understanding nature and has been such a boon to humanity over the centuries, unlike religion.

Yet when TOP scientists like the ones mentioned in the article manage to falsify BBT they are ridiculed and rejected by the BBT adherents as promoting nonsense the same as any EX-believers in God are ridiculed by believers in God as promoting some kind of nonsense when they try to tell believers their invisible supernatural character is a myth who does not exist and never existed.

That's just BS. All they have done is publish an open letter in a magazine. They have falsified nothing without peer review in a scientific journal. Whatever problems the BBT has, and they're mainly arguments from ignorance from what I can see, the Plasma Cosmology model has far more as demonstrated here:

http://en.wikipedia.org...

The scientists who claim the BB never happened are also treated as outcasts by those who want to believe it did happen.

Nonsense. They are just being held to account for the discrepancies in their model. It's all normal.

It seems scientists have the same kind of conflicts and divisions as religion does due to opposing beliefs regarding which theories are true and which are false.

Oh please. They're taking observations and coming up with competing models. It's a healthy competition in ideas. This is a strength of science. Better ideas prevail. Tell us again what observations religious conflicts are based on? Oh, that's right --- none. It's just dogma and scripture 'interpretation'. Lol.

These constant attacks on the motivations of scientists are simply pathetic. I dare anyone to substantiate a conspiracy theory amongst a large group of scientists for any length of time. Whilst scientific hoaxes have been perpetrated by fame-seeking individuals over the years, they have usually been debunked fairly quickly by, yes, other scientists. Scientists keep other scientists honest.

The article is scientists attacking scientists and trying to keep them honest. It is not Christians attacking scientists.

That's fine in itself.

I am simply pointing it out. The scientists who wrote the article are either lying or speaking from experience. Why would they lie when their reputations are at stake? They are challenging the BIAS toward the BBT in the science community itself and explaining WHY such a BIAS exists.

No, there is no bias. These guys have their own pet theory and they're peeved that they can't get the funding they think they deserve. However, it's a competitive system and they haven't been able to convince enough people of the merits of their model. You are simply highlighting a disgruntled group and calling it bias. The guys on the fringes will always whine about lack of money. It's the nature of the beast. There's nothing to see here.

Obviously Not all scientists are honest just as not all believers in God are honest.

More BS. Where are these dishonest scientists? You could count them on your fingers. Compare that to the multitudes of religious frauds throughout history. You must be kidding.

Con artists exist in every field of life. People should be honest but when people cannot even be honest with themselves they have no hope of being honest with anyone else.
Self deception is a very subtle thing from which the sufferers are not even aware they suffer.
People who believe their own lies, illusions and delusions, cannot help but teach those same lies as the truth which they sincerely believe they are.

Which is why science has mechanisms to filter such people out by rigorous training and by insisting on repeat testing and verification of results. To publish requires that you undergo meticulous peer review . That's why instances of dishonesty in scientific fields are extremely rare. I'm sure you would agree since all you do is make accusations and cite nothing.

Many dishonest people like to believe they are honest and are very good at convincing others that they are honest.
Ultimately most people seem to be easily bribed by things which appeal to them and simply reject anything that does not appeal to them.
Very FEW actually try to disprove or falsify their own beliefs and theories.

What a pile of bovine fecal matter. You start with alleged bias (unproven) and then you graduate seamlessly into dishonesty. It's obvious you know nothing about how science is practiced and yet you come on here in your ignorance and fling accusations willy nilly. Your own dishonesty with these tawdry, concoted attempts to discredit science is the issue. You really are a piece of work.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,641
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4/20/2015 8:27:22 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/19/2015 11:42:14 PM, Skyangel wrote:

I came across an article today which showed me how biased many scientists really are these days simply because of a fear of losing funding.

Check out http://rense.com...

LOL. That letter is literally a who's-who of quacks, Lerner and Arp being two of the quackiest. Lerner's alternatives to the Big Bang theory (Plazma Universe) are riddled with inconsistencies and errors, some of which have been falsified by the data itself.

http://www.astro.ucla.edu...
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
bulproof
Posts: 25,295
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4/20/2015 11:23:09 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 1:29:12 AM, dee-em wrote:
Oh heck, I admit it. I'm addicted to the Big Bang. I can't help myself. All my money goes to my Big Bang pusher. My wife has left me, I've lost my job and still I can't resist the temptation. It's at the stage where I've resorted to stealing to maintain my Big Bang habit. I need help!

LMAO.
I can help.
Go to the casino and bet on the little bang and don't stop till you've won the lot.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/20/2015 6:59:05 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 6:16:52 AM, dee-em wrote:

What a pile of bovine fecal matter. You start with alleged bias (unproven) and then you graduate seamlessly into dishonesty. It's obvious you know nothing about how science is practiced and yet you come on here in your ignorance and fling accusations willy nilly. Your own dishonesty with these tawdry, concoted attempts to discredit science is the issue. You really are a piece of work.

The pot calling the kettle black?
You obviously have your own very strong views and believe yourself the same way as anyone else believes themselves.

All human perception is subjective to each individual.
Some see lies as truth and others see truth as lies. That is a fact of life.
Since the Truth can be seen as true and also false due to opposite perspectives, is it true or false or both or neither?
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/20/2015 7:03:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 11:23:09 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 4/20/2015 1:29:12 AM, dee-em wrote:
Oh heck, I admit it. I'm addicted to the Big Bang. I can't help myself. All my money goes to my Big Bang pusher. My wife has left me, I've lost my job and still I can't resist the temptation. It's at the stage where I've resorted to stealing to maintain my Big Bang habit. I need help!

LMAO.
I can help.
Go to the casino and bet on the little bang and don't stop till you've won the lot.

People might as well go and bang their heads against a wall but even that act does not seem to knock any sense into them or help them see things from any other perspective but their own one sided view.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/20/2015 7:12:14 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 8:27:22 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/19/2015 11:42:14 PM, Skyangel wrote:

I came across an article today which showed me how biased many scientists really are these days simply because of a fear of losing funding.

Check out http://rense.com...

LOL. That letter is literally a who's-who of quacks, Lerner and Arp being two of the quackiest. Lerner's alternatives to the Big Bang theory (Plazma Universe) are riddled with inconsistencies and errors, some of which have been falsified by the data itself.

http://www.astro.ucla.edu...

Ducks quacking about which is the quackiest duck does not stop them all from being quacks.
The fact is many different perspectives exist. Some are based on facts and some are based on fiction. Some are simply based on illusions and errors in interpreting what they observe.
dee-em
Posts: 6,482
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4/20/2015 8:16:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 6:59:05 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/20/2015 6:16:52 AM, dee-em wrote:

What a pile of bovine fecal matter. You start with alleged bias (unproven) and then you graduate seamlessly into dishonesty. It's obvious you know nothing about how science is practiced and yet you come on here in your ignorance and fling accusations willy nilly. Your own dishonesty with these tawdry, concoted attempts to discredit science is the issue. You really are a piece of work.

The pot calling the kettle black?
You obviously have your own very strong views and believe yourself the same way as anyone else believes themselves.

All human perception is subjective to each individual.
Some see lies as truth and others see truth as lies. That is a fact of life.
Since the Truth can be seen as true and also false due to opposite perspectives, is it true or false or both or neither?

Here's truth. You created a thread accusing hard-working scientists of only being in it for the filthy lucre. As if scientists are not allowed to earn a living like anybody else. You intimated that they basically whored themselves to whoever bid the highest for their services. You then progressed to allegations of bias in scientific research by citing a ridiculous letter to a magazine by a bunch of quack scientists (yes, every field has its share of crackpots). Finally you accuse scientists of outright dishonesty --- that they fudge results and suppress alternative research. And what do you base all this on? Absolutely nothing.

There is only one example of dishonesty on display here and it is yours. Your weak response above tells us all we need to know. You falsely accuse others of dishonesty and cannot even attempt to substantiate it. That's the real dishonesty.
Pase66
Posts: 775
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4/20/2015 9:01:24 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Well, Science is science. If someone disproves a theory, that theory will no longer be valid, no matte how much money was made on it.

Also, to quote from Mark Twain,
"The lack of money is the root of all evil."
Check out these Current Debates
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Electric-Eccentric
Posts: 1,309
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4/20/2015 9:08:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
The great ILLUSION of so called MONEY sure gets those of the many EXCITED and such when the money concept is ATTACKED.

WHAT am I saying in that statement?

That the WORSHIP of MONEY is a great controlling factor in HOW and WHY this world is the way that it is and the many of the people are on anti depressants, going to special "modern people problems" doctors and chasing all sorts of make believe and pretend realities that are GROWING in ANGER, frustration, HATE and BIGGER DENIAL and REJECTION of the TRUTH that would set them FREE from the HELL that a SUPERSTITIOUS mindset is CONTROLLED BY and filled with confusion and doubts as the realm of superstition is a VERY VAGUE and deceptive realm.

The land of make believe and pretend realities. The land where you can become anything that you can dream up and convince yourself to try and believe in and then IF you can get ALL others to also believe. It becomes the ONLY reality and truth.

That childish thinking and the concept of money sure can make a BIG ME$$ of things.

Now before you get overly excited and knock your bummer meds on the floor and need to call your "fix my problems quick and easy" doctors.

What a nice modern advanced society we have going on with landfills full of trash and cancer and worse pollution left for the children of the FUTURE.

Seems ALL the END of the world stuff sure has people making a BIG ME$$ and pooping in their own nest for their valuable offspring and the peoples of the future.

We have those that are waiting for the Crapture and others that are waiting for the END of the world in scientific ways and such.

ARE you 100% debt FREE?

Both financially and so called spiritually?

What I'm asking is, Do YOU KNOW HOW to handle so called MONEY with the proper RESPONSIBILITY that DOESN'T place you in DEBT?

Are YOU FREE of the need for magic doctors and pills to make you feel FREE?

I AM 100% DEBT FREE both financially and also have no requirements for others to do my personal; thinking for me as I AM FREE of the deceptions and lies called good by the many confused, angry, doubt troubled and such that chase their MONEY Gods and other grand popular illusions or Truth and Real Reality.

Do YOU WORSHIP the God of MONEY and FAME and/or some religious or scientific concepts so that you can become FREE at a later TIME?

Or do you pay your way in the NOW and do your own personal thinking?

To each their own...
Life is what YOU make it,
Most just try and fake it...
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/20/2015 11:54:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 8:16:53 PM, dee-em wrote:
At 4/20/2015 6:59:05 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/20/2015 6:16:52 AM, dee-em wrote:

What a pile of bovine fecal matter. You start with alleged bias (unproven) and then you graduate seamlessly into dishonesty. It's obvious you know nothing about how science is practiced and yet you come on here in your ignorance and fling accusations willy nilly. Your own dishonesty with these tawdry, concoted attempts to discredit science is the issue. You really are a piece of work.

The pot calling the kettle black?
You obviously have your own very strong views and believe yourself the same way as anyone else believes themselves.

All human perception is subjective to each individual.
Some see lies as truth and others see truth as lies. That is a fact of life.
Since the Truth can be seen as true and also false due to opposite perspectives, is it true or false or both or neither?

Here's truth. You created a thread accusing hard-working scientists of only being in it for the filthy lucre. As if scientists are not allowed to earn a living like anybody else. You intimated that they basically whored themselves to whoever bid the highest for their services. You then progressed to allegations of bias in scientific research by citing a ridiculous letter to a magazine by a bunch of quack scientists (yes, every field has its share of crackpots). Finally you accuse scientists of outright dishonesty --- that they fudge results and suppress alternative research. And what do you base all this on? Absolutely nothing.

There is only one example of dishonesty on display here and it is yours. Your weak response above tells us all we need to know. You falsely accuse others of dishonesty and cannot even attempt to substantiate it. That's the real dishonesty.

Feel free to believe, perceive and interpret things the way you want to see them but from my point of view you are making a huge error in judgment due to your own bias.
I am not saying people should not be allowed to earn a living.
Dishonesty exists in every field. I am not saying all people in all fields are deliberately dishonest but when any people at all cannot even be honest with themselves, how can they be honest with anyone else? Self deceived people lie to themselves and believe their own lies and do not even realize they are lying to themselves.
Self deceived people exist in all professions.
If that fact upsets you, you should ask yourself why does the truth upset you so much ?

I am not the one who is trying to teach anyone the BBT is true or that the universe was magically created by some supernatural person.
I do not support the story that "Once upon a time there was no universe" which is implied by both science and religion.
I think that story about the universe once not existing is a myth regardless of whether science or religion attempts to present it as fact, theory or doctrine.

I am not chasing awards or recognition or payment for anything. I am merely sharing my opinion for free. Make of it whatever you like. Call me whatever you like but always remember that what you see in the "black kettle" is your own blackness.
I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/21/2015 12:13:26 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 9:01:24 PM, Pase66 wrote:
Well, Science is science. If someone disproves a theory, that theory will no longer be valid, no matte how much money was made on it.

Also, to quote from Mark Twain,
"The lack of money is the root of all evil."

The interesting thing is that opposites exist in the universe.
Light, darkness, hot, cold, expansion, contraction, etc.
People argue about them as if they contradict each other but personally I don't see opposites contradicting each other. I rather see them complimenting each other and keeping things balanced.

When it comes to money there is nothing wrong with money at all. It is merely a token of value.
The lack of money is not the root of evil and neither is money itself.
It is the ATTITUDE of GREED and LUST toward that which people value which is the root of evil.
dee-em
Posts: 6,482
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4/21/2015 12:15:39 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 11:54:52 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/20/2015 8:16:53 PM, dee-em wrote:
At 4/20/2015 6:59:05 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/20/2015 6:16:52 AM, dee-em wrote:

What a pile of bovine fecal matter. You start with alleged bias (unproven) and then you graduate seamlessly into dishonesty. It's obvious you know nothing about how science is practiced and yet you come on here in your ignorance and fling accusations willy nilly. Your own dishonesty with these tawdry, concoted attempts to discredit science is the issue. You really are a piece of work.

The pot calling the kettle black?
You obviously have your own very strong views and believe yourself the same way as anyone else believes themselves.

All human perception is subjective to each individual.
Some see lies as truth and others see truth as lies. That is a fact of life.
Since the Truth can be seen as true and also false due to opposite perspectives, is it true or false or both or neither?

Here's truth. You created a thread accusing hard-working scientists of only being in it for the filthy lucre. As if scientists are not allowed to earn a living like anybody else. You intimated that they basically whored themselves to whoever bid the highest for their services. You then progressed to allegations of bias in scientific research by citing a ridiculous letter to a magazine by a bunch of quack scientists (yes, every field has its share of crackpots). Finally you accuse scientists of outright dishonesty --- that they fudge results and suppress alternative research. And what do you base all this on? Absolutely nothing.

There is only one example of dishonesty on display here and it is yours. Your weak response above tells us all we need to know. You falsely accuse others of dishonesty and cannot even attempt to substantiate it. That's the real dishonesty.

Feel free to believe, perceive and interpret things the way you want to see them but from my point of view you are making a huge error in judgment due to your own bias.
I am not saying people should not be allowed to earn a living.
Dishonesty exists in every field. I am not saying all people in all fields are deliberately dishonest but when any people at all cannot even be honest with themselves, how can they be honest with anyone else? Self deceived people lie to themselves and believe their own lies and do not even realize they are lying to themselves.
Self deceived people exist in all professions.
If that fact upsets you, you should ask yourself why does the truth upset you so much ?

I am not the one who is trying to teach anyone the BBT is true or that the universe was magically created by some supernatural person.
I do not support the story that "Once upon a time there was no universe" which is implied by both science and religion.
I think that story about the universe once not existing is a myth regardless of whether science or religion attempts to present it as fact, theory or doctrine.

I am not chasing awards or recognition or payment for anything. I am merely sharing my opinion for free. Make of it whatever you like. Call me whatever you like but always remember that what you see in the "black kettle" is your own blackness.
I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.

You're a joke.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/21/2015 12:56:54 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 9:08:09 PM, Electric-Eccentric wrote:
The great ILLUSION of so called MONEY sure gets those of the many EXCITED and such when the money concept is ATTACKED.

WHAT am I saying in that statement?

That the WORSHIP of MONEY is a great controlling factor in HOW and WHY this world is the way that it is .....etc.

I think when money is mentioned most people tend to think of the cold hard cash they work hard to earn and they get offended by any implication that it is the root of all evil.
They do not consider that money is actually neutral and the root of any evil is in human attitudes toward various things.

Money merely represents whatever people value.
Some value material things and some value immaterial things which money cannot buy.

When people have an abundance of things which money cannot buy, it seems to cause a reaction in those who do not have the same. The reactions vary according to peoples attitudes.

People do tend to worship the things they value whether they realize they worship them or not.
I agree that worship of the the things they value plays a huge part in why this world is the way it is.

Some worship mythical gods and that is why we have religions.
Some worship sports and that is why we have sports idols.
Some worship music, so we have music idols.
We have a LOT of entertainment in the world because people value FICTION and FANTASY.
Many chase fame and fortune but few find it in the big scheme of things.
Skyangel
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4/21/2015 12:59:15 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/21/2015 12:15:39 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 4/20/2015 11:54:52 PM, Skyangel wrote:

I am not chasing awards or recognition or payment for anything. I am merely sharing my opinion for free. Make of it whatever you like. Call me whatever you like but always remember that what you see in the "black kettle" is your own blackness.
I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.

You're a joke.

As I said, I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.
dee-em
Posts: 6,482
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4/21/2015 1:56:53 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/21/2015 12:59:15 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/21/2015 12:15:39 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 4/20/2015 11:54:52 PM, Skyangel wrote:

I am not chasing awards or recognition or payment for anything. I am merely sharing my opinion for free. Make of it whatever you like. Call me whatever you like but always remember that what you see in the "black kettle" is your own blackness.
I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.

You're a joke.

As I said, I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.

No. You're a cynical old biddy who is so world-weary and dissatisfied with her life that she feels she needs to tarnish everyone else with the same brush she applies to herself. In a desperate search for meaning you resort to new age spiritual woo and disown your own bonds with humanity. Or at least you try and paint a picture of everyone else as corrupt and worthless. You are not a reflection of me. Not even close.

No wonder you and BoG got along so well. You're half-way down that path already. Pretty soon you'll be telling us about invisible vibrations and how the universe is an imaginary construct. But first you have to pull everybody else down. Please, carry on.
Gentorev
Posts: 2,935
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4/21/2015 4:05:07 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/21/2015 1:56:53 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 4/21/2015 12:59:15 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/21/2015 12:15:39 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 4/20/2015 11:54:52 PM, Skyangel wrote:

I am not chasing awards or recognition or payment for anything. I am merely sharing my opinion for free. Make of it whatever you like. Call me whatever you like but always remember that what you see in the "black kettle" is your own blackness.
I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.

You're a joke.

As I said, I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.

No. You're a cynical old biddy who is so world-weary and dissatisfied with her life that she feels she needs to tarnish everyone else with the same brush she applies to herself. In a desperate search for meaning you resort to new age spiritual woo and disown your own bonds with humanity. Or at least you try and paint a picture of everyone else as corrupt and worthless. You are not a reflection of me. Not even close.

No wonder you and BoG got along so well. You're half-way down that path already. Pretty soon you'll be telling us about invisible vibrations and how the universe is an imaginary construct. But first you have to pull everybody else down. Please, carry on.

You beat me to the punch mate. You see, there are things that we agree on.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,641
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4/21/2015 12:14:32 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/20/2015 7:12:14 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/20/2015 8:27:22 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/19/2015 11:42:14 PM, Skyangel wrote:

I came across an article today which showed me how biased many scientists really are these days simply because of a fear of losing funding.

Check out http://rense.com...

LOL. That letter is literally a who's-who of quacks, Lerner and Arp being two of the quackiest. Lerner's alternatives to the Big Bang theory (Plazma Universe) are riddled with inconsistencies and errors, some of which have been falsified by the data itself.

http://www.astro.ucla.edu...

Ducks quacking about which is the quackiest duck does not stop them all from being quacks.

But, the scientific community are not quacking ducks, they are scientists who try to understand the world around us. Idiots like Lerner are incapable of keeping up with the scientific community and instead produce wacky ideas that simply do not follow the observations and data, and they are just too idiotic to understand that.

And, of course, the crackpots and cranks must appeal to the layman if they are to get any kind of support, so they try to baffle the masses with bullsh1t, and often succeed.

The fact is many different perspectives exist.

So what? This is not about perspective, it's about attempting to gain attention by introducing stupid ideas into science that are easily shown to be wrong, yet those attention whores refuse to accept they're wrong.

Why do you think Lerner wrote that letter?

Some are based on facts and some are based on fiction.

And, Lerner's assertions on a plasma universe are indeed fiction. If you knew something about what they were talking about, you would see that, too.

Some are simply based on illusions and errors in interpreting what they observe.

Not with Lerner, he and his idiotic clan of nutjobs are in for the attention and not the actual science.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Electric-Eccentric
Posts: 1,309
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4/21/2015 1:59:31 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Those that are BLIND when it comes to what IS Truth and what is NOT, like to try and keep their little circles of confusion going so that they might forget about the debt they owe for worshiping the Money & fame God/theories.

When you let others do your personal ?thinking? for a PRICE, you end up with WHAT they $ELL you at a profit to them and a loss to you in the long run.

You get what you pay for. CHEAP copies and knock offs that you can make believe and pretend are the Real Deals.

So whats in your wallet?
Life is what YOU make it,
Most just try and fake it...
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/21/2015 6:09:27 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/21/2015 1:56:53 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 4/21/2015 12:59:15 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/21/2015 12:15:39 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 4/20/2015 11:54:52 PM, Skyangel wrote:

I am not chasing awards or recognition or payment for anything. I am merely sharing my opinion for free. Make of it whatever you like. Call me whatever you like but always remember that what you see in the "black kettle" is your own blackness.
I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.

You're a joke.

As I said, I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.

No. You're a cynical old biddy who is so world-weary and dissatisfied with her life that she feels she needs to tarnish everyone else with the same brush she applies to herself. In a desperate search for meaning you resort to new age spiritual woo and disown your own bonds with humanity. Or at least you try and paint a picture of everyone else as corrupt and worthless. You are not a reflection of me. Not even close.

I see you don't think much of yourself and you obviously know nothing about me at all.
I am perfectly satisfied with my life. I have no complaints. I do not need to search for meaning since I have plenty of meaning in my life. I have more than enough of what most want and cannot be brought with money.
I would be very pleased to "tar everyone with the same brush" as I apply to myself because I love myself and my life. I am my own best friend. I know who I am and where I am going in life. I have all the LOVE I need and I am content.

What about you? Are you content with your life and with yourself that you would be happy if all others lived the same way and thought about themselves the same as you think about yourself?
Would you be happy to tar all others with the same brush as you apply to yourself and treat others the same way as you treat them?

No wonder you and BoG got along so well. You're half-way down that path already. Pretty soon you'll be telling us about invisible vibrations and how the universe is an imaginary construct. But first you have to pull everybody else down. Please, carry on.

If you paid any attention to any conversations between me and Brad, you might have noticed he thought I was an antichrist.
His universe is obviously an imaginary construct in his own mind. His mind is fooling him and he is obviously unaware of his own self deceptions.
He is a good example of what happens to people who are self deceived. They end up living in their own self made fantasy world in their desperate escape from reality.

It seems to be human nature to pull others "down" to their level. Therefore are we not all tarred with the same brush in that aspect?
You claim that I am pulling people down yet you are doing exactly the same thing but obviously cannot see it any better than Brad can see his own self deception and foolishness.
Take an objective look at your own words. Do you think your words are lifting me up or pulling me down and trashing me and my ideas?
If you trash other peoples ideas and disrespect them can you seriously expect others to build you up and respect you and your ideas?
I forgive you for your foolishness because I understand you also live in your own self made world where only you are correct.

What do you value in life? What is the "Money" that you cha$e?
Is it something material or something immaterial?
Do you want people to love and accept you?
Do you want them to PAY attention to what you $ay?
Do you treat them the way you would like them to treat you?
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/21/2015 6:12:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/21/2015 4:05:07 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 4/21/2015 1:56:53 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 4/21/2015 12:59:15 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 4/21/2015 12:15:39 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 4/20/2015 11:54:52 PM, Skyangel wrote:

I am not chasing awards or recognition or payment for anything. I am merely sharing my opinion for free. Make of it whatever you like. Call me whatever you like but always remember that what you see in the "black kettle" is your own blackness.
I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.

You're a joke.

As I said, I am merely a mirror in which you see your own reflection.

No. You're a cynical old biddy who is so world-weary and dissatisfied with her life that she feels she needs to tarnish everyone else with the same brush she applies to herself. In a desperate search for meaning you resort to new age spiritual woo and disown your own bonds with humanity. Or at least you try and paint a picture of everyone else as corrupt and worthless. You are not a reflection of me. Not even close.

No wonder you and BoG got along so well. You're half-way down that path already. Pretty soon you'll be telling us about invisible vibrations and how the universe is an imaginary construct. But first you have to pull everybody else down. Please, carry on.

You beat me to the punch mate. You see, there are things that we agree on.

Pots and kettles agree that they are black.
How "black" are you in your own judgement of yourself?
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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4/21/2015 6:49:45 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/21/2015 12:14:32 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/20/2015 7:12:14 PM, Skyangel wrote:
Ducks quacking about which is the quackiest duck does not stop them all from being quacks.

But, the scientific community are not quacking ducks, they are scientists who try to understand the world around us. Idiots like Lerner are incapable of keeping up with the scientific community and instead produce wacky ideas that simply do not follow the observations and data, and they are just too idiotic to understand that.

That's a matter of opinion. There are "quacking ducks" in all fields of expertise. The sad thing is that most cannot tell the difference between the honest people and the dishonest people in this world. All people obviously have unique ways of seeing things. It is sad when one person calls another an idiot just because they do not agree with the way they see things when they are simply sharing their unique perspectives the same as the accuser of the idiot does.

And, of course, the crackpots and cranks must appeal to the layman if they are to get any kind of support, so they try to baffle the masses with bullsh1t, and often succeed.

The pot calls the kettle an idiot, crackpot and crank because it sees its own reflection in the kettle who is not baffled by the bull and refuses to CONFORM to the belief that the bull is real.

The fact is many different perspectives exist.

So what? This is not about perspective, it's about attempting to gain attention by introducing stupid ideas into science that are easily shown to be wrong, yet those attention whores refuse to accept they're wrong.

Yes it IS all about perception in the end. The humans mind causes us to see things the way we do and our minds play tricks on us. It is very foolish to adhere to only one belief when opposites obviously exist in the universe. When science is lead astray by a stupid belief in the first place, it is not so stupid to try to correct it. MANY Flat Earth believers also thought the FEW were stupid for believing the earth was round. Don't discount things just because you believe the opposite and can't accept the opposite view to your own.

Why do you think Lerner wrote that letter?

Because he obviously wanted funding for his own research.
However, he has published his book with or without funding. His ideas and research are available to study and seem to be very controversial.

Some are based on facts and some are based on fiction.

And, Lerner's assertions on a plasma universe are indeed fiction. If you knew something about what they were talking about, you would see that, too.

The way I see it, many so called scientific theories about the beginning of the universe are science fiction. There is more speculation in them than facts.

Some are simply based on illusions and errors in interpreting what they observe.

Not with Lerner, he and his idiotic clan of nutjobs are in for the attention and not the actual science.

Your opinion is noted. Some like you obviously think he is a "nutjob". Others think the opposite. Maybe he is and maybe he is not. Only time will tell. If science is indeed honest and wants their own theories disproved, scientists ought not get so upset when people attempt to disprove them.

When science theories are based on science fiction, disproving the fiction is like trying to disprove God. How do you disprove any fiction at all?

The scientific method includes HYPOTHESIS which is nothing but SPECULATION about what humans observe.

Calling a SPECULATION a "proposed explanation" does not make it an explanation of anything factual.

The Big Bang theory is a SPECULATION about how the Universe MIGHT have begun, which in turn is based on a BELIEF or SPECULATION that once upon a time the universe did not exist at all.

Religion existed before science and has infiltrated and affected human perspective for a LONG time.
The fact that science chases the idea that the universe once did not exist in the first place proves that they must have some belief in the biblical concept that the universe was "created" by something and once upon a time did not exist.

If science could "prove" the universe has always existed there would be no arguments about how it "began". There would be no debates about whether a God created it or some random phenomenon ( Big Bang) in space created it.
It would most likely just create arguments about whether it has always existed or not.

What do you think?