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Let the Bible Answer.

olivetwo
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4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 6:01:35 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

In the bible there is not one real contradictions.

There are things which appear to be contradictions, simply because they are not understood properly, or taken out of context.

There are also things which are nothing more than a different way of reporting things.

OK. Now let's move it on.

Revelation 3:14
John 1:14
Colossians 1:16
Ephesians 1:3

What do they tell you about eh true relationship between God and his son.

Hint:

They are called father and son with good reason.
celestialtorahteacher
Posts: 1,369
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4/28/2015 6:21:03 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
How does the Bible answer the question of how Hebrews who wrote the Old Testament, Torah/Tanakh, could honestly write about "Hebrews" existing more than a thousand years prior to any archeological evidence of their existence as an identifiable separate Canaanite/Palestinian tribal population? How does the Bible explain "Abram the Hebrew ..." (Gen 14:13)?
ethang5
Posts: 4,104
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4/28/2015 6:33:32 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:

Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi olivetwo,

Yours is a good idea except that atheists feel physical pain whenever the Bible is quoted. They will not like the idea. Also, all Christians using the Bible as THE authority on Christian doctrine would render almost all of their claims moot, so for that reason they don't want the Bible to speak either.

But give it a try and see for yourself....
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 7:01:50 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 6:21:03 AM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
How does the Bible answer the question of how Hebrews who wrote the Old Testament, Torah/Tanakh, could honestly write about "Hebrews" existing more than a thousand years prior to any archeological evidence of their existence as an identifiable separate Canaanite/Palestinian tribal population? How does the Bible explain "Abram the Hebrew ..." (Gen 14:13)?

Well first you need to work out what a Hebrew is.

All tribes around in those days were actually Hebrew, whether history wishes to admit it or not, because all were descendants of Noah and his sons.

I have yet to find a definitive explanation of what a Hebrew is, scripturally or from any other source, other than to say that they are Semitic Tribes, tribes, note, not a tribe, all of which have their roots in Shem, though why that excludes his two brothers I have no idea.

Frankly though, why does it matter?
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 7:04:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 6:33:32 AM, ethang5 wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:

Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi olivetwo,

Yours is a good idea except that atheists feel physical pain whenever the Bible is quoted. They will not like the idea. Also, all Christians using the Bible as THE authority on Christian doctrine would render almost all of their claims moot, so for that reason they don't want the Bible to speak either.

But give it a try and see for yourself....

Unfortunately the only group who truly use the bible, all of it, as the basis for doctrine are the Jehovah's Witnesses, all of the others have to deny various parts of scripture to make their doctrines fit.
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,120
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4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 7:25:10 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.

People are still arguing over whether there is evidence of any of the above, and whilst it has to be admitted that there is no definitive evidence yet, the strongest evidence is the overall honesty of scripture, even in things which can be, and usually are, taken very negatively.

Once you find something to be as honest as scripture is the tendency is to talk what is says as evidence.
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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4/28/2015 7:31:35 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

The Bible is only a collection of documents by many different authors. Some of what it has to say is quite sensible, however there is a lot of garbage in it too. It is really sad that some people believe it to be literally true and the word of a deity, when it is a very human production!
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,120
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4/28/2015 7:41:51 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 7:25:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.

People are still arguing over whether there is evidence of any of the above, and whilst it has to be admitted that there is no definitive evidence yet, the strongest evidence is the overall honesty of scripture, even in things which can be, and usually are, taken very negatively.

Archaeologists, geologists, biologists, etc. are not arguing over whether there is evidence of these event. There is no evidence.

Once you find something to be as honest as scripture is the tendency is to talk what is says as evidence.

You cannot use the Bible as evidence for its own claim, MCB. We have talked about this before..
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 7:47:18 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 7:41:51 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:25:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.

People are still arguing over whether there is evidence of any of the above, and whilst it has to be admitted that there is no definitive evidence yet, the strongest evidence is the overall honesty of scripture, even in things which can be, and usually are, taken very negatively.

Archaeologists, geologists, biologists, etc. are not arguing over whether there is evidence of these event. There is no evidence.

Once you find something to be as honest as scripture is the tendency is to talk what is says as evidence.

You cannot use the Bible as evidence for its own claim, MCB. We have talked about this before..

Why not?

People's statements are used as evidence in court, and the Bible is God's statement to man.

The bible is evidence of the events it describes.

It's honesty makes that evidence valid.

In the absence of anything else, the honesty of the statement is what is examined. The bible's refusal to hide anything just because it may be seen as unflattering marks it is worthy of being used as evidence of the events it describes.

No-one can honestly fault the bible for its "warts and all" honesty.
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,120
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4/28/2015 8:29:06 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 7:47:18 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:41:51 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:25:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.

People are still arguing over whether there is evidence of any of the above, and whilst it has to be admitted that there is no definitive evidence yet, the strongest evidence is the overall honesty of scripture, even in things which can be, and usually are, taken very negatively.

Archaeologists, geologists, biologists, etc. are not arguing over whether there is evidence of these event. There is no evidence.

Once you find something to be as honest as scripture is the tendency is to talk what is says as evidence.

You cannot use the Bible as evidence for its own claim, MCB. We have talked about this before..

Why not?

People's statements are used as evidence in court, and the Bible is God's statement to man.

(In court) I suppose if the witness says "I am an honest man ...because I say so" then he is unquestionably an honest witness? I will be needing something a little more substantial than that.

As far as the Bible is concerned, the lack of expected evidence is evidence some of these stories never happened. Consider the millions of people wandering in the Sinai desert for 40 years. There should tons of evidence, but here is what archaeologists say on the matter:

The archeological evidence does not support the story told in the Book of Exodus[3] and most archaeologists have abandoned the investigation of Moses and the Exodus as "a fruitless pursuit"

http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://books.google.com.au...
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
Gentorev
Posts: 2,924
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4/28/2015 8:35:26 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."
Yes there are a lot of apparent contradictions in the bible, here is one that baffled me for a while till I found the scripture that reconciled the apparent contradiction.

Below is the apparent contradiction. Can you find the scripture that reconciles them?

In Acts 9: 7; we read, "And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man."

Then in Acts 22:9; in reference to the same event, we are told, "And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me."

Did Paul's men hear a voice as stated in Acts 9:7, or did they not hear the voice that spoke to Saul according to Acts 22:9?
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 8:55:56 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 8:35:26 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."
Yes there are a lot of apparent contradictions in the bible, here is one that baffled me for a while till I found the scripture that reconciled the apparent contradiction.

Below is the apparent contradiction. Can you find the scripture that reconciles them?

In Acts 9: 7; we read, "And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man."

Then in Acts 22:9; in reference to the same event, we are told, "And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me."

Did Paul's men hear a voice as stated in Acts 9:7, or did they not hear the voice that spoke to Saul according to Acts 22:9?


OK, which one do you feel explains it?

I don't really see the need for another scripture since the difference between the two is plain to me, so I've never looked.

To me it is clearly not a contradiction, if you bother to read it right and think about the wording.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 9:02:36 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 8:29:06 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:47:18 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:41:51 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:25:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.

People are still arguing over whether there is evidence of any of the above, and whilst it has to be admitted that there is no definitive evidence yet, the strongest evidence is the overall honesty of scripture, even in things which can be, and usually are, taken very negatively.

Archaeologists, geologists, biologists, etc. are not arguing over whether there is evidence of these event. There is no evidence.

Once you find something to be as honest as scripture is the tendency is to talk what is says as evidence.

You cannot use the Bible as evidence for its own claim, MCB. We have talked about this before..

Why not?

People's statements are used as evidence in court, and the Bible is God's statement to man.

(In court) I suppose if the witness says "I am an honest man ...because I say so" then he is unquestionably an honest witness? I will be needing something a little more substantial than that.

As far as the Bible is concerned, the lack of expected evidence is evidence some of these stories never happened. Consider the millions of people wandering in the Sinai desert for 40 years. There should tons of evidence, but here is what archaeologists say on the matter:

The archeological evidence does not support the story told in the Book of Exodus[3] and most archaeologists have abandoned the investigation of Moses and the Exodus as "a fruitless pursuit"

http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://books.google.com.au...

Well they are only human.

How do you get to trust a friend?

You get to know them.

You learn whether or not they are hiding things which may embarrass them, or whihc could be taken wrongly.

Example.

Scripture very carefully reveals that Christ made two, very obvious errors in statements to the Pharisees.

Soem try to twist the later accounts in John and Luke to deny one, and simply refuse to believe that Chris was indeed executed on Friday and resurrected on Sunday as the bible shows in order to deny that he was wrong, but he was, and that's that.

Would an unreliable witness not try to conceal his Christ's mistakes?

After all, he is God son, or in the eyes of the misguided majority God himself, so how could he make a mistake?

And yet he did.

Two of them.

That, and many other examples means that I can accept scripture as a reliable witness in itself. Because it displays the sort of honesty that Jehovah demands of us.
bulproof
Posts: 25,247
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4/28/2015 9:07:00 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 9:02:36 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 8:29:06 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:47:18 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:41:51 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:25:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.

People are still arguing over whether there is evidence of any of the above, and whilst it has to be admitted that there is no definitive evidence yet, the strongest evidence is the overall honesty of scripture, even in things which can be, and usually are, taken very negatively.

Archaeologists, geologists, biologists, etc. are not arguing over whether there is evidence of these event. There is no evidence.

Once you find something to be as honest as scripture is the tendency is to talk what is says as evidence.

You cannot use the Bible as evidence for its own claim, MCB. We have talked about this before..

Why not?

People's statements are used as evidence in court, and the Bible is God's statement to man.

(In court) I suppose if the witness says "I am an honest man ...because I say so" then he is unquestionably an honest witness? I will be needing something a little more substantial than that.

As far as the Bible is concerned, the lack of expected evidence is evidence some of these stories never happened. Consider the millions of people wandering in the Sinai desert for 40 years. There should tons of evidence, but here is what archaeologists say on the matter:

The archeological evidence does not support the story told in the Book of Exodus[3] and most archaeologists have abandoned the investigation of Moses and the Exodus as "a fruitless pursuit"

http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://books.google.com.au...

Well they are only human.

How do you get to trust a friend?

You get to know them.

You learn whether or not they are hiding things which may embarrass them, or whihc could be taken wrongly.

Example.

Scripture very carefully reveals that Christ made two, very obvious errors in statements to the Pharisees.

Soem try to twist the later accounts in John and Luke to deny one, and simply refuse to believe that Chris was indeed executed on Friday and resurrected on Sunday as the bible shows in order to deny that he was wrong, but he was, and that's that.

Would an unreliable witness not try to conceal his Christ's mistakes?

After all, he is God son, or in the eyes of the misguided majority God himself, so how could he make a mistake?

And yet he did.

Two of them.

That, and many other examples means that I can accept scripture as a reliable witness in itself. Because it displays the sort of honesty that Jehovah demands of us.
Simpleton childish response.
Oh dear.
Under the blanket time.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,120
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4/28/2015 9:13:01 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 9:02:36 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 8:29:06 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:47:18 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:41:51 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:25:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.

People are still arguing over whether there is evidence of any of the above, and whilst it has to be admitted that there is no definitive evidence yet, the strongest evidence is the overall honesty of scripture, even in things which can be, and usually are, taken very negatively.

Archaeologists, geologists, biologists, etc. are not arguing over whether there is evidence of these event. There is no evidence.

Once you find something to be as honest as scripture is the tendency is to talk what is says as evidence.

You cannot use the Bible as evidence for its own claim, MCB. We have talked about this before..

Why not?

People's statements are used as evidence in court, and the Bible is God's statement to man.

(In court) I suppose if the witness says "I am an honest man ...because I say so" then he is unquestionably an honest witness? I will be needing something a little more substantial than that.

As far as the Bible is concerned, the lack of expected evidence is evidence some of these stories never happened. Consider the millions of people wandering in the Sinai desert for 40 years. There should tons of evidence, but here is what archaeologists say on the matter:

The archeological evidence does not support the story told in the Book of Exodus[3] and most archaeologists have abandoned the investigation of Moses and the Exodus as "a fruitless pursuit"

http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://books.google.com.au...

Well they are only human.

So, you're dropping your defense of circular reasoning as well as conceding lack of evidence is evidence contrary to the stories in the Bible. We're making progress here..


How do you get to trust a friend?

You get to know them.

You learn whether or not they are hiding things which may embarrass them, or whihc could be taken wrongly.

Example.

Scripture very carefully reveals that Christ made two, very obvious errors in statements to the Pharisees.

Soem try to twist the later accounts in John and Luke to deny one, and simply refuse to believe that Chris was indeed executed on Friday and resurrected on Sunday as the bible shows in order to deny that he was wrong, but he was, and that's that.

Would an unreliable witness not try to conceal his Christ's mistakes?

After all, he is God son, or in the eyes of the misguided majority God himself, so how could he make a mistake?

And yet he did.

The criterion of embarrassment could show the author believed the story was true. However, this does not make the story true. Big difference.

Two of them.

That, and many other examples means that I can accept scripture as a reliable witness in itself. Because it displays the sort of honesty that Jehovah demands of us.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
Harikrish
Posts: 11,008
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4/28/2015 9:52:43 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

To begin with are you qualified to answer questions on the bible? Are your answers going to deal with specific questions as quoted of are you going to respond from an inspired Holy Spirit visit showering revelations on the subject which are outside the purview of scholarly inquiry? Are you going to rely on others commentaries because there are explanations for every conceivable contradiction, but they do not meet the standards of an honest straight forward answer?
Do you have religious affiliations that might taint your interpretation of the bible which will render this exercise useless because you will be responding with pre-indoctrinated (pre-canned) answers and not dealing with the actual question presented?
For example if you are a JW. You are bound to follow their cultish interpretation of the bible which does not represent the mainstream views of Christians. So which bible translation are you comfortable with or will be using in your responses?
YoshiBoy13
Posts: 96
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4/28/2015 12:19:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 8:55:56 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 8:35:26 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."
Yes there are a lot of apparent contradictions in the bible, here is one that baffled me for a while till I found the scripture that reconciled the apparent contradiction.

Below is the apparent contradiction. Can you find the scripture that reconciles them?

In Acts 9: 7; we read, "And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man."

Then in Acts 22:9; in reference to the same event, we are told, "And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me."

Did Paul's men hear a voice as stated in Acts 9:7, or did they not hear the voice that spoke to Saul according to Acts 22:9?


OK, which one do you feel explains it?

I don't really see the need for another scripture since the difference between the two is plain to me, so I've never looked.

To me it is clearly not a contradiction, if you bother to read it right and think about the wording.

Literally ANYTHING can be taken to be true if you read it a certain way. For example:

"I rode to school today on a panda."
Obviously this is false. Especially since I currently live in England and the climate would be all wrong.
HOWEVER, what if I told you that a panda is just an interpretation of a bus, since it is big. They both are big, so surely you could interpret it this way.
Hooray! Pandas for everyone!

"1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. 3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning"the first day." - Genesis 1
Obviously this is false. Especially since science has proved that the formation of the Sun took more than 24 hours.
HOWEVER, what if I told you that a day is just an interpretation of an epoch, since it is time. They both are units of time, so surely you could interpret it this way.
Hooray! Days for everyone!

The exact same logic has been used here. The conclusion is the same. I can ride to school on a panda if it is interpreted that way, and the sun could be created in 24 hours if it is interpreted that way too.
- Just because you're narrow-minded doesn't mean you're always right.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 12:56:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 12:19:25 PM, YoshiBoy13 wrote:
At 4/28/2015 8:55:56 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 8:35:26 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."
Yes there are a lot of apparent contradictions in the bible, here is one that baffled me for a while till I found the scripture that reconciled the apparent contradiction.

Below is the apparent contradiction. Can you find the scripture that reconciles them?

In Acts 9: 7; we read, "And the men which journeyed with him stood speechless, hearing a voice, but seeing no man."

Then in Acts 22:9; in reference to the same event, we are told, "And they that were with me saw indeed the light, and were afraid; but they heard not the voice of him that spake to me."

Did Paul's men hear a voice as stated in Acts 9:7, or did they not hear the voice that spoke to Saul according to Acts 22:9?


OK, which one do you feel explains it?

I don't really see the need for another scripture since the difference between the two is plain to me, so I've never looked.

To me it is clearly not a contradiction, if you bother to read it right and think about the wording.

Literally ANYTHING can be taken to be true if you read it a certain way. For example:

"I rode to school today on a panda."
Obviously this is false. Especially since I currently live in England and the climate would be all wrong.

Not a very sensible example, of course if a Panda had been an existing make of car (Fiat Panda) that would have worked.

Scripture however is not as susceptible to that as such a short passage as you used is because if you interpret one scripture wrongly you will eventually hit a contradiction, which is a sure sign that you have misunderstood something.

Hence scripture actually interprets itself really,.

That is why considering passages in isolation causes the sort of problems you exaggeratedly illustrate, but studying scripture in the light of the rest of scripture gives you God's understanding of what is there.

HOWEVER, what if I told you that a panda is just an interpretation of a bus, since it is big. They both are big, so surely you could interpret it this way.
Hooray! Pandas for everyone!

"1 In the beginning God created the heavens and the earth. 2 Now the earth was formless and empty, darkness was over the surface of the deep, and the Spirit of God was hovering over the waters. 3 And God said, "Let there be light," and there was light. 4 God saw that the light was good, and he separated the light from the darkness. 5 God called the light "day," and the darkness he called "night." And there was evening, and there was morning"the first day." - Genesis 1
Obviously this is false. Especially since science has proved that the formation of the Sun took more than 24 hours.

Scripture also says it was created in more than 24 hours.

For a start, you are applying the wrong meaning of the word day. The word day has a number of meanings, one of which is "a definite, but unspecified period of time". Logic demands that this is the interpretation to use in that case.

Secondly verse 1 says that the "heavens and the earth" were created, that would, of necessity include the sun and moon. No time scale, so no idea of how long it took.

If you read it correctly you will realise that verse 2 onward describe the events as observed from on the earth.

HOWEVER, what if I told you that a day is just an interpretation of an epoch, since it is time. They both are units of time, so surely you could interpret it this way.

That is one accepted meaning of the word, yes, and scientifically it fits the evidence.

Hooray! Days for everyone!

The exact same logic has been used here. The conclusion is the same. I can ride to school on a panda if it is interpreted that way, and the sun could be created in 24 hours if it is interpreted that way too.

I am sorry but you are being ridiculous.

Scripture clearly gives us no idea whatever of the time-scales employed. Nor, equally obviously, is it intended to.

It does however give a very accurate description of the order in which things were done.

Hence Genesis 1 is an accurate, if limited, description of creation.

That also fits in with other aspects of scripture which reveal that God does most things slowly and carefully.

After all, he first announced the coming Messiah about 4,000 years before he had developed the line into which Jesus was born sufficiently to bring him to birth.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 1:00:33 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 9:13:01 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 9:02:36 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 8:29:06 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:47:18 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:41:51 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:25:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.

People are still arguing over whether there is evidence of any of the above, and whilst it has to be admitted that there is no definitive evidence yet, the strongest evidence is the overall honesty of scripture, even in things which can be, and usually are, taken very negatively.

Archaeologists, geologists, biologists, etc. are not arguing over whether there is evidence of these event. There is no evidence.

Once you find something to be as honest as scripture is the tendency is to talk what is says as evidence.

You cannot use the Bible as evidence for its own claim, MCB. We have talked about this before..

Why not?

People's statements are used as evidence in court, and the Bible is God's statement to man.

(In court) I suppose if the witness says "I am an honest man ...because I say so" then he is unquestionably an honest witness? I will be needing something a little more substantial than that.

As far as the Bible is concerned, the lack of expected evidence is evidence some of these stories never happened. Consider the millions of people wandering in the Sinai desert for 40 years. There should tons of evidence, but here is what archaeologists say on the matter:

The archeological evidence does not support the story told in the Book of Exodus[3] and most archaeologists have abandoned the investigation of Moses and the Exodus as "a fruitless pursuit"

http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://books.google.com.au...

Well they are only human.

So, you're dropping your defense of circular reasoning as well as conceding lack of evidence is evidence contrary to the stories in the Bible. We're making progress here..


How do you get to trust a friend?

You get to know them.

You learn whether or not they are hiding things which may embarrass them, or whihc could be taken wrongly.

Example.

Scripture very carefully reveals that Christ made two, very obvious errors in statements to the Pharisees.

Soem try to twist the later accounts in John and Luke to deny one, and simply refuse to believe that Chris was indeed executed on Friday and resurrected on Sunday as the bible shows in order to deny that he was wrong, but he was, and that's that.

Would an unreliable witness not try to conceal his Christ's mistakes?

After all, he is God son, or in the eyes of the misguided majority God himself, so how could he make a mistake?

And yet he did.

The criterion of embarrassment could show the author believed the story was true. However, this does not make the story true. Big difference.

Two of them.

That, and many other examples means that I can accept scripture as a reliable witness in itself. Because it displays the sort of honesty that Jehovah demands of us.

True, but the obvious accuracy of the limited description of creation given in Genesis 1 shows that only God, his son, or the Angels, could have passed such informative on to mankind.

People try to say it isn't accurate, but any interpretation that does not show it's accuracy does violence to reason, to the extent of destroying it.

Of course if you really don;t want to believe, Jehovah has been kind enough to give you plenty of ways out.
UndeniableReality
Posts: 1,897
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4/28/2015 1:08:21 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

What is the biblical view of cybernetics and biological cybernetics?
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,120
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4/28/2015 2:04:31 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 1:00:33 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 9:13:01 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 9:02:36 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 8:29:06 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:47:18 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:41:51 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:25:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.

People are still arguing over whether there is evidence of any of the above, and whilst it has to be admitted that there is no definitive evidence yet, the strongest evidence is the overall honesty of scripture, even in things which can be, and usually are, taken very negatively.

Archaeologists, geologists, biologists, etc. are not arguing over whether there is evidence of these event. There is no evidence.

Once you find something to be as honest as scripture is the tendency is to talk what is says as evidence.

You cannot use the Bible as evidence for its own claim, MCB. We have talked about this before..

Why not?

People's statements are used as evidence in court, and the Bible is God's statement to man.

(In court) I suppose if the witness says "I am an honest man ...because I say so" then he is unquestionably an honest witness? I will be needing something a little more substantial than that.

As far as the Bible is concerned, the lack of expected evidence is evidence some of these stories never happened. Consider the millions of people wandering in the Sinai desert for 40 years. There should tons of evidence, but here is what archaeologists say on the matter:

The archeological evidence does not support the story told in the Book of Exodus[3] and most archaeologists have abandoned the investigation of Moses and the Exodus as "a fruitless pursuit"

http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://books.google.com.au...

Well they are only human.

So, you're dropping your defense of circular reasoning as well as conceding lack of evidence is evidence contrary to the stories in the Bible. We're making progress here..


How do you get to trust a friend?

You get to know them.

You learn whether or not they are hiding things which may embarrass them, or whihc could be taken wrongly.

Example.

Scripture very carefully reveals that Christ made two, very obvious errors in statements to the Pharisees.

Soem try to twist the later accounts in John and Luke to deny one, and simply refuse to believe that Chris was indeed executed on Friday and resurrected on Sunday as the bible shows in order to deny that he was wrong, but he was, and that's that.

Would an unreliable witness not try to conceal his Christ's mistakes?

After all, he is God son, or in the eyes of the misguided majority God himself, so how could he make a mistake?

And yet he did.

The criterion of embarrassment could show the author believed the story was true. However, this does not make the story true. Big difference.

Two of them.

That, and many other examples means that I can accept scripture as a reliable witness in itself. Because it displays the sort of honesty that Jehovah demands of us.

True, but the obvious accuracy of the limited description of creation given in Genesis 1 shows that only God, his son, or the Angels, could have passed such informative on to mankind.

No, there are other possibilities such as the Bible being a man-made explanation. This is in line with the ignorance illustrated in some of the stories in the Bible. We would not expect ignorance to belong to an omniscient god. There is ignorance in the Bible. Therefore the Bible cannot be the product of such a god.

1)Either God is different than described,
2)he is not responsible for the flawed parts of the Bible, or
3)he is responsible for no part of the Bible (he doesn't exist).

Your conclusion is flawed.

People try to say it isn't accurate, but any interpretation that does not show it's accuracy does violence to reason, to the extent of destroying it.

Of course if you really don;t want to believe, Jehovah has been kind enough to give you plenty of ways out.

I wanted to believe even after I realized I no longer could - because of problems like I illustrated above. Now that I have a little space from my indoctrination, I am horrified by what I allowed myself to believe. It requires a lack of critical thinking to believe. That is not a dig, when we want to believe something we rarely think to verify it (until we've learned the hard way). I've learned the hard way, and I'm sure the rest of my life will involve probing the contents of my mind with critical thought.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
annanicole
Posts: 19,787
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4/28/2015 2:21:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 6:01:35 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

In the bible there is not one real contradictions.

There are things which appear to be contradictions, simply because they are not understood properly, or taken out of context.

There are also things which are nothing more than a different way of reporting things.

OK. Now let's move it on.

Revelation 3:14
John 1:14
Colossians 1:16
Ephesians 1:3

What do they tell you about eh true relationship between God and his son.

What does a passage that states that the Son is the active cause or originator of all creation have to do with a "relationship" between Father and Son? I think we all realize - all Christians, anyway - that every created thing was created by the Son, and "without him was not anything made that hath been made."
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 2:31:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 2:21:38 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 4/28/2015 6:01:35 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

In the bible there is not one real contradictions.

There are things which appear to be contradictions, simply because they are not understood properly, or taken out of context.

There are also things which are nothing more than a different way of reporting things.

OK. Now let's move it on.

Revelation 3:14
John 1:14
Colossians 1:16
Ephesians 1:3

What do they tell you about eh true relationship between God and his son.

What does a passage that states that the Son is the active cause or originator of all creation have to do with a "relationship" between Father and Son? I think we all realize - all Christians, anyway - that every created thing was created by the Son, and "without him was not anything made that hath been made."

Simple.

That is not what it says, that is your twisted version twisted to fit in with your beliefs.

Not only that, your version means that calling them father and son is a lie.

No, know, Revelation 3:14 calls God's son the beginning, or first act, of creation.

Jehovah is the originator of Creation hence he is called the creator.

Jehovah is also the active cause of creation.

The son was his co-worker, not a creator.

There is no way you can twist beginning to mean what you want it to.

The simple fact is that they are father and son, Jehovah is the progenitor, buy creation, of his son.

There is no other reasonable or logical explanation.

I know you would rather go on teaching your false Christ, but it won;t do you any good to do so, either now or in the future. It certainly won't ingratiate you with the son who even refused to be called "good" or teh father who won;t share his glory with any.

Isaiah 42:8
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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4/28/2015 2:37:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 2:04:31 PM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 1:00:33 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 9:13:01 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 9:02:36 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 8:29:06 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:47:18 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:41:51 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:25:10 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 7:14:17 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

Hi Olive!

Why is there no evidence for the flood, Sodom and Gomorrah, the Exodus and other stories in the Bible which the god of the Bible is said to have participated? It is like these stories never happened - any evidence we would expect to find in relation to them does not exists. I look forward to your answer.

People are still arguing over whether there is evidence of any of the above, and whilst it has to be admitted that there is no definitive evidence yet, the strongest evidence is the overall honesty of scripture, even in things which can be, and usually are, taken very negatively.

Archaeologists, geologists, biologists, etc. are not arguing over whether there is evidence of these event. There is no evidence.

Once you find something to be as honest as scripture is the tendency is to talk what is says as evidence.

You cannot use the Bible as evidence for its own claim, MCB. We have talked about this before..

Why not?

People's statements are used as evidence in court, and the Bible is God's statement to man.

(In court) I suppose if the witness says "I am an honest man ...because I say so" then he is unquestionably an honest witness? I will be needing something a little more substantial than that.

As far as the Bible is concerned, the lack of expected evidence is evidence some of these stories never happened. Consider the millions of people wandering in the Sinai desert for 40 years. There should tons of evidence, but here is what archaeologists say on the matter:

The archeological evidence does not support the story told in the Book of Exodus[3] and most archaeologists have abandoned the investigation of Moses and the Exodus as "a fruitless pursuit"

http://en.wikipedia.org...
http://books.google.com.au...

Well they are only human.

So, you're dropping your defense of circular reasoning as well as conceding lack of evidence is evidence contrary to the stories in the Bible. We're making progress here..


How do you get to trust a friend?

You get to know them.

You learn whether or not they are hiding things which may embarrass them, or whihc could be taken wrongly.

Example.

Scripture very carefully reveals that Christ made two, very obvious errors in statements to the Pharisees.

Soem try to twist the later accounts in John and Luke to deny one, and simply refuse to believe that Chris was indeed executed on Friday and resurrected on Sunday as the bible shows in order to deny that he was wrong, but he was, and that's that.

Would an unreliable witness not try to conceal his Christ's mistakes?

After all, he is God son, or in the eyes of the misguided majority God himself, so how could he make a mistake?

And yet he did.

The criterion of embarrassment could show the author believed the story was true. However, this does not make the story true. Big difference.

Two of them.

That, and many other examples means that I can accept scripture as a reliable witness in itself. Because it displays the sort of honesty that Jehovah demands of us.

True, but the obvious accuracy of the limited description of creation given in Genesis 1 shows that only God, his son, or the Angels, could have passed such informative on to mankind.

No, there are other possibilities such as the Bible being a man-made explanation. This is in line with the ignorance illustrated in some of the stories in the Bible. We would not expect ignorance to belong to an omniscient god. There is ignorance in the Bible. Therefore the Bible cannot be the product of such a god.

No human had access to such accurate information


1)Either God is different than described,

He is precisely as scripture describes him if all of what it says is taken into account.

2)he is not responsible for the flawed parts of the Bible, or

There are no flawed parts of the bible, which is part of the point. Not one part of it is actually flawed.

Please tell me which bits you believe are, and I shall tell you why they are not.

It's not as if I haven't done it over again, many times

3)he is responsible for no part of the Bible (he doesn't exist).

Your conclusion is flawed.

Not in the least yours is because you refuse to accept the accuracy of scripture for what it is.


People try to say it isn't accurate, but any interpretation that does not show it's accuracy does violence to reason, to the extent of destroying it.

Of course if you really don;t want to believe, Jehovah has been kind enough to give you plenty of ways out.

I wanted to believe even after I realized I no longer could - because of problems like I illustrated above. Now that I have a little space from my indoctrination, I am horrified by what I allowed myself to believe. It requires a lack of critical thinking to believe. That is not a dig, when we want to believe something we rarely think to verify it (until we've learned the hard way). I've learned the hard way, and I'm sure the rest of my life will involve probing the contents of my mind with critical thought.

The problems you list above are of your own making. They don't really exist.
annanicole
Posts: 19,787
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4/28/2015 2:38:47 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 2:31:01 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 2:21:38 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 4/28/2015 6:01:35 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

In the bible there is not one real contradictions.

There are things which appear to be contradictions, simply because they are not understood properly, or taken out of context.

There are also things which are nothing more than a different way of reporting things.

OK. Now let's move it on.

Revelation 3:14
John 1:14
Colossians 1:16
Ephesians 1:3

What do they tell you about eh true relationship between God and his son.

What does a passage that states that the Son is the active cause or originator of all creation have to do with a "relationship" between Father and Son? I think we all realize - all Christians, anyway - that every created thing was created by the Son, and "without him was not anything made that hath been made."

Simple.

That is not what it says, that is your twisted version twisted to fit in with your beliefs.

Why, I cited the KJV or ASV just as I always do. You just slapped the passages up there. You didn't inform us of which Greek text to use.

No, know, Revelation 3:14 calls God's son the beginning, or first act, of creation.

I'm afraid, once again, that Rev 3: 14 employs the word arche which can very easily carry - and commonly does carry - the meaning "that by which anything begins to be, the origin, the active cause." You wouldn't try to use an ambiguous passage, would you?

The son was his co-worker, not a creator.

LMAO

There is no way you can twist beginning to mean what you want it to.

I don't intend to twist anything. Why don't you rattle off all of the possible meanings of arche for us?

Never mind. I know you won't do it.

1. beginning, origin
2. the person or thing that commences, the first person or thing in a series, the leader
3. that by which anything begins to be, the origin, the active cause
4. the extremity of a thing, of the corners of a sail
5. the first place, principality, rule, magistracy

Of the possible definitions, by far more of them fit my position than fit yours. You'll have to look around for another passage. Ambiguous ones do not help you.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
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4/28/2015 2:41:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 2:21:38 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 4/28/2015 6:01:35 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

In the bible there is not one real contradictions.

There are things which appear to be contradictions, simply because they are not understood properly, or taken out of context.

There are also things which are nothing more than a different way of reporting things.

OK. Now let's move it on.

Revelation 3:14
John 1:14
Colossians 1:16
Ephesians 1:3

What do they tell you about eh true relationship between God and his son.

What does a passage that states that the Son is the active cause or originator of all creation have to do with a "relationship" between Father and Son? I think we all realize - all Christians, anyway - that every created thing was created by the Son, and "without him was not anything made that hath been made."

Yes, all things after him. That is the only understanding that works without forcing contradiction.

Accept it or don't, it's up to you. But I'm not going through it with you again.

Your choice, your loss.
ThinkFirst
Posts: 1,391
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4/28/2015 2:57:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 6:01:35 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 4/28/2015 5:13:29 AM, olivetwo wrote:
Put your questions and inquiry about the Bible here. And I am very sure the Bible have an answer. To all your doubts, seems contradictions, seems not true, etc., and most especially what you've believe in. This Thread will be compacted. Anything that with surround with the Bible. You can add a spice by putting SCIENCE, MEDICINES, MORAL, QUOTES and RELIGIONS for back up. GOOD LUCK!

Let me started this way, " in the Bible there are lot of contradictions."

In the bible there is not one real contradictions.

There are things which appear to be contradictions, simply because they are not understood properly, or taken out of context.

There are also things which are nothing more than a different way of reporting things.

OK. Now let's move it on.

Revelation 3:14
John 1:14
Colossians 1:16
Ephesians 1:3

What do they tell you about eh true relationship between God and his son.

Hint:

They are called father and son with good reason.

Standard excuse used by those who oscillate between multiple "interpretation," all designed to reconcile, ignoring that they must ALL change, at some point, in order to be all "true" or "correct." At NO point, however, are they all "true" or "correct," simultaneously...

christ lineage in Matt. vs. christ lineage in Luke.

Give it a shot...
"Never attribute to villainy that which can be adequately explained by stupidity"
-----
"Men rarely if ever dream up a god superior to themselves. Most gods have the manners and morals of a spoiled child. "

-- Robert A Heinlein
bulproof
Posts: 25,247
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4/28/2015 2:59:57 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/28/2015 7:01:50 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
All tribes around in those days were actually Hebrew, whether history wishes to admit it or not, because all were descendants of Noah and his sons.
Even the ones in China, Japan, Australia?
What level of stupidity is required to make such an asinine claim?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin