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Reject God on Another Basis!

EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
The Biblical God= Spirit
Definition of Biblical God....
John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
-
-
-

God is SPIRIT, not material therefore God does not fall into the category of a material form or a material Being that can be examined like a material object.

STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over. God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

Sure, this is not the only premise being attacked but nonetheless it seems to be the majority of atheist mindset and gets repeated over and over and over. Show us Theists you are capable of learning something! especially when it's common sense.

You cannot form an argument against a Spirit God based on lack of material evidence, in doing so you're showing you own inability to be rational and truly skeptical.
We need to follow the arguments to arrive at truth.

So how do some theists relate to God and come to the realization that He exists?
Read the very first line of the passage I quoted above in John 4. Once you get this simple concept through your head and understand theists have a spiritual relation with God then you can successfully reject or argue from there, but until then the scientific method of studying the natural world is incapable and incompatible with the nature of God and addressing His existence, and it was never meant to do that. It's the atheist mindset that tries to force it to be a substantial position when in reality it is no such thing, actually the opposite.

Romans 8
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God!
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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5/29/2015 7:25:33 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 6:18:11 AM, JJ50 wrote:
You have not the slightest evidence to support your post!

Pete and Repeat were on the boat, Pete fell off and who was left?

All I needed to support was the content of this subject which is God is Spirit, support provided, dummy. The "evidence" (the concept) to support my position has been clarified plainly.

When are you going to contribute anything? What purpose do your little one line posts everyday serve? Get a life and find another hobby, this is apparently out of your league and comprehension.
dee-em
Posts: 6,444
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5/29/2015 7:51:03 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
The Biblical God= Spirit
Definition of Biblical God....
John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
-
-
-


God is SPIRIT, not material therefore God does not fall into the category of a material form or a material Being that can be examined like a material object.


STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over. God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

Sure, this is not the only premise being attacked but nonetheless it seems to be the majority of atheist mindset and gets repeated over and over and over. Show us Theists you are capable of learning something! especially when it's common sense.

You cannot form an argument against a Spirit God based on lack of material evidence, in doing so you're showing you own inability to be rational and truly skeptical.
We need to follow the arguments to arrive at truth.


So how do some theists relate to God and come to the realization that He exists?
Read the very first line of the passage I quoted above in John 4. Once you get this simple concept through your head and understand theists have a spiritual relation with God then you can successfully reject or argue from there, but until then the scientific method of studying the natural world is incapable and incompatible with the nature of God and addressing His existence, and it was never meant to do that. It's the atheist mindset that tries to force it to be a substantial position when in reality it is no such thing, actually the opposite.


Romans 8
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God!

Can spirit interact with the material world?

If no, then it is entirely irrelevant to us and our existence.

If yes, then objective evidence of such should be presentable and atheists are right to ask for material signs of God's existence.

Which do you choose?
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,566
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5/29/2015 9:02:35 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
The Biblical God= Spirit
Definition of Biblical God....
John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
-
-
-


God is SPIRIT, not material therefore God does not fall into the category of a material form or a material Being that can be examined like a material object.


STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over. God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

Sure, this is not the only premise being attacked but nonetheless it seems to be the majority of atheist mindset and gets repeated over and over and over. Show us Theists you are capable of learning something! especially when it's common sense.

You cannot form an argument against a Spirit God based on lack of material evidence, in doing so you're showing you own inability to be rational and truly skeptical.
We need to follow the arguments to arrive at truth.


So how do some theists relate to God and come to the realization that He exists?
Read the very first line of the passage I quoted above in John 4. Once you get this simple concept through your head and understand theists have a spiritual relation with God then you can successfully reject or argue from there, but until then the scientific method of studying the natural world is incapable and incompatible with the nature of God and addressing His existence, and it was never meant to do that. It's the atheist mindset that tries to force it to be a substantial position when in reality it is no such thing, actually the opposite.


Romans 8
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God!

Please seek professional help and get the medications your really need to treat those hallucinations.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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5/29/2015 10:02:34 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 7:25:33 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:18:11 AM, JJ50 wrote:
You have not the slightest evidence to support your post!

Pete and Repeat were on the boat, Pete fell off and who was left?

All I needed to support was the content of this subject which is God is Spirit, support provided, dummy. The "evidence" (the concept) to support my position has been clarified plainly.

When are you going to contribute anything? What purpose do your little one line posts everyday serve? Get a life and find another hobby, this is apparently out of your league and comprehension.

I think your comprehension and overlong posts leave a lot to be desired, lol!
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,566
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5/29/2015 10:43:11 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 7:25:33 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:18:11 AM, JJ50 wrote:
You have not the slightest evidence to support your post!

Pete and Repeat were on the boat, Pete fell off and who was left?

All I needed to support was the content of this subject which is God is Spirit, support provided, dummy. The "evidence" (the concept) to support my position has been clarified plainly.

You have evidence, you have only delusion and hallucination. And, by calling others "dummy" because they don't share your delusions only makes you look insane.

When are you going to contribute anything? What purpose do your little one line posts everyday serve? Get a life and find another hobby, this is apparently out of your league and comprehension.

Contributing your delusions and hallucinations here is not anything out of our league or comprehension. If you wish to have a normal life, seek professional help and get the medication you need.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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5/29/2015 11:00:35 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 10:02:34 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 5/29/2015 7:25:33 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:18:11 AM, JJ50 wrote:
You have not the slightest evidence to support your post!

Pete and Repeat were on the boat, Pete fell off and who was left?

All I needed to support was the content of this subject which is God is Spirit, support provided, dummy. The "evidence" (the concept) to support my position has been clarified plainly.

When are you going to contribute anything? What purpose do your little one line posts everyday serve? Get a life and find another hobby, this is apparently out of your league and comprehension.


I think your comprehension and overlong posts leave a lot to be desired, lol!

Repeat, when are you going to contribute anything? The answer is....you're not.
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,481
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5/29/2015 11:11:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 6:18:11 AM, JJ50 wrote:
You have not the slightest evidence to support your post!

lol
Never fart near dog
Usagi
Posts: 8
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5/29/2015 11:17:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
God is SPIRIT, not material therefore God does not fall into the category of a material form or a material Being that can be examined like a material object.

That is an assertion about the characteristics of "God" you are making, regardless of what "God" is. (The quotes aren't meant to be in a mocking tone, but to specify that I am referring to the existence we have named "God", regardless of what that existence is or what form it takes.) One can place God into the category of a material form by arguing different characteristics. Even if we accept God's existence itself is spiritual, it can still be proven that God's existence is irrelevant - I'll use lightning as an example for this.

Imagine people widely believed in a god of thunder and lightning. With experiments and investigation, we have discovered the causes of and patterns of thunder and lightning as a phenomenon. If we assume this god of thunder and lightning is spiritual, we can't prove or disprove it with our physical evidence. However, if we take this model of the phenomenon (which is physical evidence) and use it to predict what patterns lightning and thunder will take, and those predictions turn out to be true (which means our model has predictive power and is thus accurate), we can say that god is not needed. If the phenomena the god is influencing would not be impacted by that god not existing, a god governing it is unnecessary. It doesn't mean the god doesn't exist, merely that there is no evidence for it, and assuming its existence needlessly complicates things (see: Occam's Razor).

To go back to what I said about arguing that the existence titled "God" is a physical rather than spiritual one, it is possible to debate the nature of the existence. Your claim in this case is that "God" is a spiritual, supernatural entity. My claim in return might be that "God" is a mental perception brought about by various psychological processes - an 'imaginary friend', but without the childish connotations. If it turns out that my model follows what we already have shown to be accurate, and has accuracy itself, that adds strength to my argument that the existence of "God" is not spiritual. If it turns out that your model follows what we have already shown to be accurate and is itself accurate, the reverse happens.

The problem is, in order for your model to show it has an accurate basis and/or accuracy of its own... you need evidence to show that.
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,083
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5/29/2015 11:31:36 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 7:51:03 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
The Biblical God= Spirit
Definition of Biblical God....
John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
-
-
-


God is SPIRIT, not material therefore God does not fall into the category of a material form or a material Being that can be examined like a material object.


STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over. God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

Sure, this is not the only premise being attacked but nonetheless it seems to be the majority of atheist mindset and gets repeated over and over and over. Show us Theists you are capable of learning something! especially when it's common sense.

You cannot form an argument against a Spirit God based on lack of material evidence, in doing so you're showing you own inability to be rational and truly skeptical.
We need to follow the arguments to arrive at truth.


So how do some theists relate to God and come to the realization that He exists?
Read the very first line of the passage I quoted above in John 4. Once you get this simple concept through your head and understand theists have a spiritual relation with God then you can successfully reject or argue from there, but until then the scientific method of studying the natural world is incapable and incompatible with the nature of God and addressing His existence, and it was never meant to do that. It's the atheist mindset that tries to force it to be a substantial position when in reality it is no such thing, actually the opposite.


Romans 8
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God!


Can spirit interact with the material world?

If no, then it is entirely irrelevant to us and our existence.

If yes, then objective evidence of such should be presentable and atheists are right to ask for material signs of God's existence.

Which do you choose?

This.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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5/29/2015 11:35:34 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 7:51:03 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
The Biblical God= Spirit
Definition of Biblical God....
John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
-
-
-


God is SPIRIT, not material therefore God does not fall into the category of a material form or a material Being that can be examined like a material object.


STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over. God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

Sure, this is not the only premise being attacked but nonetheless it seems to be the majority of atheist mindset and gets repeated over and over and over. Show us Theists you are capable of learning something! especially when it's common sense.

You cannot form an argument against a Spirit God based on lack of material evidence, in doing so you're showing you own inability to be rational and truly skeptical.
We need to follow the arguments to arrive at truth.


So how do some theists relate to God and come to the realization that He exists?
Read the very first line of the passage I quoted above in John 4. Once you get this simple concept through your head and understand theists have a spiritual relation with God then you can successfully reject or argue from there, but until then the scientific method of studying the natural world is incapable and incompatible with the nature of God and addressing His existence, and it was never meant to do that. It's the atheist mindset that tries to force it to be a substantial position when in reality it is no such thing, actually the opposite.


Romans 8
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God!


Can spirit interact with the material world?
Read verse 16! It's right above in your face lol.

Yes, how many times do I need to say this? How many times have I told you guys I've had spiritual interaction lol? I feel like I'm conversing with programmed robots, don't seem to be able to retain much. Sorry if I've never explained that to you but I'm sure I have.

If no, then it is entirely irrelevant to us and our existence.

If yes, then objective evidence of such should be presentable and atheists are right to ask for material signs of God's existence.

PAT ATTENTION to my words below and don't come back repeating yourself, otherwise I will ignore you.

No, objective evidence cannot be presented for a spiritual interaction and they are not right to ask for that, that is the whole point of this thread. It's only evidence to the one receiving the interaction, I can't present that to you, that should be a no brainer. No doubt you'll call that subjective but it is not, it is not based on feelings it is a first hand encounter with the spirit and that is not something a theist can give.
Explain how I could give presentable material evidence for a spiritual interaction??

To have spiritual interaction you have to apply spiritual things, can't have one before the other.

That would be like me trying to give you all my experiences and interaction with someone you will never physically meet. Not sure why this concept is so difficult for you guys.
I can't give you guys objective evidence for my own spiritual experiences, you have to live that for yourself and apply a spiritual life. I'm trying to explain the nature of God and spirit and why presenting material evidence doesn't make any sense. But I seriously doubt I will get very far.


Which do you choose?

I've always said the same things, it's not me who is being indecisive Dee-em.
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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5/29/2015 11:36:33 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 11:00:35 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 10:02:34 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 5/29/2015 7:25:33 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:18:11 AM, JJ50 wrote:
You have not the slightest evidence to support your post!

Pete and Repeat were on the boat, Pete fell off and who was left?

All I needed to support was the content of this subject which is God is Spirit, support provided, dummy. The "evidence" (the concept) to support my position has been clarified plainly.

When are you going to contribute anything? What purpose do your little one line posts everyday serve? Get a life and find another hobby, this is apparently out of your league and comprehension.


I think your comprehension and overlong posts leave a lot to be desired, lol!

Repeat, when are you going to contribute anything? The answer is....you're not.

You don't contribute anything but overlong diatribes, which are usually garbage!
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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5/29/2015 11:37:30 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 9:02:35 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
The Biblical God= Spirit
Definition of Biblical God....
John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
-
-
-


God is SPIRIT, not material therefore God does not fall into the category of a material form or a material Being that can be examined like a material object.


STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over. God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

Sure, this is not the only premise being attacked but nonetheless it seems to be the majority of atheist mindset and gets repeated over and over and over. Show us Theists you are capable of learning something! especially when it's common sense.

You cannot form an argument against a Spirit God based on lack of material evidence, in doing so you're showing you own inability to be rational and truly skeptical.
We need to follow the arguments to arrive at truth.


So how do some theists relate to God and come to the realization that He exists?
Read the very first line of the passage I quoted above in John 4. Once you get this simple concept through your head and understand theists have a spiritual relation with God then you can successfully reject or argue from there, but until then the scientific method of studying the natural world is incapable and incompatible with the nature of God and addressing His existence, and it was never meant to do that. It's the atheist mindset that tries to force it to be a substantial position when in reality it is no such thing, actually the opposite.


Romans 8
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God!

Please seek professional help and get the medications your really need to treat those hallucinations.

Lame.
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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5/29/2015 11:40:07 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 10:43:11 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 5/29/2015 7:25:33 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:18:11 AM, JJ50 wrote:
You have not the slightest evidence to support your post!

Pete and Repeat were on the boat, Pete fell off and who was left?

All I needed to support was the content of this subject which is God is Spirit, support provided, dummy. The "evidence" (the concept) to support my position has been clarified plainly.

You have evidence, you have only delusion and hallucination. And, by calling others "dummy" because they don't share your delusions only makes you look insane.

And that is not what happened. I explained above. Dummy.

When are you going to contribute anything? What purpose do your little one line posts everyday serve? Get a life and find another hobby, this is apparently out of your league and comprehension.

Contributing your delusions and hallucinations here is not anything out of our league or comprehension. If you wish to have a normal life, seek professional help and get the medication you need.

Lame, cop out and pathetic. Like usual. Looks like this is all you are gonna add up to.
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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5/29/2015 11:41:39 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 11:36:33 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 5/29/2015 11:00:35 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 10:02:34 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 5/29/2015 7:25:33 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:18:11 AM, JJ50 wrote:
You have not the slightest evidence to support your post!

Pete and Repeat were on the boat, Pete fell off and who was left?

All I needed to support was the content of this subject which is God is Spirit, support provided, dummy. The "evidence" (the concept) to support my position has been clarified plainly.

When are you going to contribute anything? What purpose do your little one line posts everyday serve? Get a life and find another hobby, this is apparently out of your league and comprehension.


I think your comprehension and overlong posts leave a lot to be desired, lol!

Repeat, when are you going to contribute anything? The answer is....you're not.

You don't contribute anything but overlong diatribes, which are usually garbage!

No, this is garbage ^^ and that is all you contribute.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,566
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5/29/2015 11:43:15 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 11:35:34 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:

Yes, how many times do I need to say this? How many times have I told you guys I've had spiritual interaction lol?

Over and over, but it's clear you have some mental disorder and are merely hallucinating.

I feel like I'm conversing with programmed robots, don't seem to be able to retain much. Sorry if I've never explained that to you but I'm sure I have.

You've explained nothing, hence the conclusion you're delusional and need medication.

No, objective evidence cannot be presented for a spiritual interaction and they are not right to ask for that, that is the whole point of this thread. It's only evidence to the one receiving the interaction, I can't present that to you, that should be a no brainer. No doubt you'll call that subjective but it is not, it is not based on feelings it is a first hand encounter with the spirit and that is not something a theist can give.
Explain how I could give presentable material evidence for a spiritual interaction??

You can't because your interactions are just hallucinations in your head that require medication.

To have spiritual interaction you have to apply spiritual things, can't have one before the other.

That would be like me trying to give you all my experiences and interaction with someone you will never physically meet. Not sure why this concept is so difficult for you guys.
I can't give you guys objective evidence for my own spiritual experiences, you have to live that for yourself and apply a spiritual life. I'm trying to explain the nature of God and spirit and why presenting material evidence doesn't make any sense. But I seriously doubt I will get very far.

You've gotten nowhere, you've had an opportunity to explain yourself but failed miserably and it has become clear you have a mental disorder.


Which do you choose?

I've always said the same things, it's not me who is being indecisive Dee-em.

Yes, you keep repeating the same nonsense over and over, which is clearly just in your head.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,566
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5/29/2015 11:44:28 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 11:40:07 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 10:43:11 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 5/29/2015 7:25:33 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:18:11 AM, JJ50 wrote:
You have not the slightest evidence to support your post!

Pete and Repeat were on the boat, Pete fell off and who was left?

All I needed to support was the content of this subject which is God is Spirit, support provided, dummy. The "evidence" (the concept) to support my position has been clarified plainly.

You have evidence, you have only delusion and hallucination. And, by calling others "dummy" because they don't share your delusions only makes you look insane.

And that is not what happened. I explained above. Dummy.

You are lying, you explained nothing. Your delusions are obviously just a mental disorder requiring professional help.

When are you going to contribute anything? What purpose do your little one line posts everyday serve? Get a life and find another hobby, this is apparently out of your league and comprehension.

Contributing your delusions and hallucinations here is not anything out of our league or comprehension. If you wish to have a normal life, seek professional help and get the medication you need.

Lame, cop out and pathetic. Like usual. Looks like this is all you are gonna add up to.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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5/29/2015 11:46:34 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 11:43:15 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 5/29/2015 11:35:34 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:

Yes, how many times do I need to say this? How many times have I told you guys I've had spiritual interaction lol?

Over and over, but it's clear you have some mental disorder and are merely hallucinating.

I feel like I'm conversing with programmed robots, don't seem to be able to retain much. Sorry if I've never explained that to you but I'm sure I have.

You've explained nothing, hence the conclusion you're delusional and need medication.

No, objective evidence cannot be presented for a spiritual interaction and they are not right to ask for that, that is the whole point of this thread. It's only evidence to the one receiving the interaction, I can't present that to you, that should be a no brainer. No doubt you'll call that subjective but it is not, it is not based on feelings it is a first hand encounter with the spirit and that is not something a theist can give.
Explain how I could give presentable material evidence for a spiritual interaction??

You can't because your interactions are just hallucinations in your head that require medication.

To have spiritual interaction you have to apply spiritual things, can't have one before the other.

That would be like me trying to give you all my experiences and interaction with someone you will never physically meet. Not sure why this concept is so difficult for you guys.
I can't give you guys objective evidence for my own spiritual experiences, you have to live that for yourself and apply a spiritual life. I'm trying to explain the nature of God and spirit and why presenting material evidence doesn't make any sense. But I seriously doubt I will get very far.

You've gotten nowhere, you've had an opportunity to explain yourself but failed miserably and it has become clear you have a mental disorder.


Which do you choose?

I've always said the same things, it's not me who is being indecisive Dee-em.

Yes, you keep repeating the same nonsense over and over, which is clearly just in your head.

Your continual assertions of mental disorders will get you nowhere. If you can't handle spiritual discussion you need to take a walk, dummy.
EtrnlVw
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5/29/2015 11:47:26 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 11:44:28 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 5/29/2015 11:40:07 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 10:43:11 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 5/29/2015 7:25:33 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:18:11 AM, JJ50 wrote:
You have not the slightest evidence to support your post!

Pete and Repeat were on the boat, Pete fell off and who was left?

All I needed to support was the content of this subject which is God is Spirit, support provided, dummy. The "evidence" (the concept) to support my position has been clarified plainly.

You have evidence, you have only delusion and hallucination. And, by calling others "dummy" because they don't share your delusions only makes you look insane.

And that is not what happened. I explained above. Dummy.

You are lying, you explained nothing. Your delusions are obviously just a mental disorder requiring professional help.

Repeater.

When are you going to contribute anything? What purpose do your little one line posts everyday serve? Get a life and find another hobby, this is apparently out of your league and comprehension.

Contributing your delusions and hallucinations here is not anything out of our league or comprehension. If you wish to have a normal life, seek professional help and get the medication you need.

Lame, cop out and pathetic. Like usual. Looks like this is all you are gonna add up to.
EtrnlVw
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5/29/2015 11:49:08 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Well, nice dealing with the OP Atheists lol. You may need to go hang out in the science forum, the comprehension is embarrassing.
EtrnlVw
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5/29/2015 12:00:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Danne the atheist is showing his true colors now, with his pretend thread and pretend intentions trying to bait me into his little web of lies he failed at doing what he really wanted to, now he's letting it all go like a little school kid.
What a poor sucker.
Saint_of_Me
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5/29/2015 12:01:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Typical head-in-the-sand Christian apologetics. You guys continually lose badly in ANY argument asking for proof, so what do yo do? LOL..you claim that your sky god is above and beyond the parameters of the rules. You erase the playing board and say, as would a little kid, "Waah! You beat me all the time. I don't want to play anymore. I want to make up my OWN rules now!"

Pathetic.

But..hey. I am game. I'll bit. So here is an argument that does not allude to god's physicality or verifiable, tangible proof. (of which, again, there is NONE.)

OK..so. I would like you to close your eyes for a moment and think about the state of the world today. The violence; the wars; the over-population (part of the blame for which is due to ingorant peoples following a mundane rule in your bible, BTW); the famines; the disasters; the disease; the homeless; the kids living i garbage dumps in places like India.

NOW....imagine for a second that us Atheists are right: there is NO God. That mankind here on Earth is on his own and our life began like the mass majority of Biologists agree that it did: in a warm primordial pond some 3 billion years ago, and then we evolved to our present state.

Got it?

OK...lastly. Please tell me how today's Earth--with your sky god, is ANY DIFFERENT than it would be if there were NO GOD?

LOL---See? I am not asking for physical proof of his existence--again, of which there is ZERO. But only for some results or signs of it? Can you even do that?

Again: Please tell me how today's Earth--with your sky god, is ANY DIFFERENT than it would be if there were NO GOD?
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
ThinkFirst
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5/29/2015 12:27:39 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
The Biblical God= Spirit
Definition of Biblical God....
John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
-
It is the very validity of this book that is in question. Quoting the book that we don't believe serves no purpose when trying to convince us that your assertions are fact.
-
God is SPIRIT, not material therefore God does not fall into the category of a material form or a material Being that can be examined like a material object.

We don't believe that your god IS, at all. We don't necessarily need to "examine" this deity, but we would like some (ANY) viable evidence that it exists, at all...

STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over.

We'll stop repeating the same old things, when you do the same... we have been "shown" NOTHING.

God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

We are rejecting this (and all other posited gods) based on the fact that none of the stories make any sense, are not compatible with reality, and are not supported by what we know of the universe around us. The ignorance for which people settle is the blanket assertion that "GodDidIt," no matter what inexplicable phenomenon is presented.

Sure, this is not the only premise being attacked but nonetheless it seems to be the majority of atheist mindset and gets repeated over and over and over. Show us Theists you are capable of learning something! especially when it's common sense.

There is no "common sense" involved in theistic assertions. Essentially, we are asked to accept the premise of your god on your word. Moreover, you insist on shoving scripture in our face as though that provides some measure of "support" for your assertions when, in fact, it provides ZERO support for ridiculous beliefs in the first place. Without your bible, your god disappears. With the bible, your god is shown to be a malevolent invention endowed with some of the worst HUMAN attributes in existence.

You cannot form an argument against a Spirit God based on lack of material evidence, in doing so you're showing you own inability to be rational and truly skeptical.

Then show us some form of "spiritual" evidence. You keep harping on this "spiritual" thing, as though it eliminates the need for any evidence, and that simply is not reasonable. You accuse us of not being rational when, in fact, it is your irrational assertions that we are asking you to support. If you claim your deity is "spirit," fine. Give us something "spiritual." Something more than words and assertions. Something more than a demand that we accept that which makes no sense...

We need to follow the arguments to arrive at truth.

No, you don't. You want to arrange the arguments to arrive at the conclusion you derived before anything else was ever considered, in order to validate that which you have already asserted to be truth. The assertion is what we dismiss, because the assertion has proven to be quite empty for two thousand years (and counting).


So how do some theists relate to God and come to the realization that He exists?

It varies, slightly, from theist to theist, but it follows the same general pattern or acceptance based on some "spiritual experience," followed by claims that the "spiritual" cannot be disproved and, therefore MUST be accepted and considered as evidence.

Read the very first line of the passage I quoted above in John 4. Once you get this simple concept through your head and understand theists have a spiritual relation with God then you can successfully reject or argue from there, but until then the scientific method of studying the natural world is incapable and incompatible with the nature of God and addressing His existence, and it was never meant to do that. It's the atheist mindset that tries to force it to be a substantial position when in reality it is no such thing, actually the opposite.

If this deity is "spiritual" and "inaccessible," how do you know that this entity actually exists? What do you use as a foundation for your belief? What "spiritual" evidence do you have. What "spiritual" test can be performed? What "spiritual" knowledge can be obtained? Do you actually expect those of us that have no faith to accept your interpretation, ON FAITH?

Romans 8
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God!

Again, biblical scripture is no more proof to us than a passage from the qur'an would be, for you. Think of all the reasons that you reject the islamic god, then apply them to your christian god. Presto! You've just discovered why we reject what you say.
"Never attribute to villainy that which can be adequately explained by stupidity"
-----
"Men rarely if ever dream up a god superior to themselves. Most gods have the manners and morals of a spoiled child. "

-- Robert A Heinlein
ThinkFirst
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5/29/2015 12:36:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 11:35:34 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 7:51:03 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
The Biblical God= Spirit
Definition of Biblical God....
John 4
23 But the hour cometh, and now is, when the true worshippers shall worship the Father in spirit and in truth: for the Father seeketh such to worship him.

24 God is a Spirit: and they that worship him must worship him in spirit and in truth.
-
-
-


God is SPIRIT, not material therefore God does not fall into the category of a material form or a material Being that can be examined like a material object.


STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over. God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

Sure, this is not the only premise being attacked but nonetheless it seems to be the majority of atheist mindset and gets repeated over and over and over. Show us Theists you are capable of learning something! especially when it's common sense.

You cannot form an argument against a Spirit God based on lack of material evidence, in doing so you're showing you own inability to be rational and truly skeptical.
We need to follow the arguments to arrive at truth.


So how do some theists relate to God and come to the realization that He exists?
Read the very first line of the passage I quoted above in John 4. Once you get this simple concept through your head and understand theists have a spiritual relation with God then you can successfully reject or argue from there, but until then the scientific method of studying the natural world is incapable and incompatible with the nature of God and addressing His existence, and it was never meant to do that. It's the atheist mindset that tries to force it to be a substantial position when in reality it is no such thing, actually the opposite.


Romans 8
14 For as many as are led by the Spirit of God, they are the sons of God.

15 For ye have not received the spirit of bondage again to fear; but ye have received the Spirit of adoption, whereby we cry, Abba, Father.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God!


Can spirit interact with the material world?
Read verse 16! It's right above in your face lol.

Yes, how many times do I need to say this? How many times have I told you guys I've had spiritual interaction lol? I feel like I'm conversing with programmed robots, don't seem to be able to retain much. Sorry if I've never explained that to you but I'm sure I have.

If no, then it is entirely irrelevant to us and our existence.

If yes, then objective evidence of such should be presentable and atheists are right to ask for material signs of God's existence.

PAT ATTENTION to my words below and don't come back repeating yourself, otherwise I will ignore you.

No, objective evidence cannot be presented for a spiritual interaction and they are not right to ask for that, that is the whole point of this thread. It's only evidence to the one receiving the interaction, I can't present that to you, that should be a no brainer. No doubt you'll call that subjective but it is not, it is not based on feelings it is a first hand encounter with the spirit and that is not something a theist can give.
Explain how I could give presentable material evidence for a spiritual interaction??

To have spiritual interaction you have to apply spiritual things, can't have one before the other.

That would be like me trying to give you all my experiences and interaction with someone you will never physically meet. Not sure why this concept is so difficult for you guys.
I can't give you guys objective evidence for my own spiritual experiences, you have to live that for yourself and apply a spiritual life. I'm trying to explain the nature of God and spirit and why presenting material evidence doesn't make any sense. But I seriously doubt I will get very far.

It is not difficult, it is simply not demonstrable. Since only those that have had a "spiritual" experience can believe, and I have not had a "spiritual" experience, I cannot be expected to believe, now, can I? Until such time as I experience "spiritual" things, I will dismiss the existence of the "spiritual." Until such time, your bible is equally rejected.

<snip>
"Never attribute to villainy that which can be adequately explained by stupidity"
-----
"Men rarely if ever dream up a god superior to themselves. Most gods have the manners and morals of a spoiled child. "

-- Robert A Heinlein
EtrnlVw
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5/29/2015 1:05:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 12:01:46 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
Typical head-in-the-sand Christian apologetics. You guys continually lose badly in ANY argument asking for proof, so what do yo do? LOL..you claim that your sky god is above and beyond the parameters of the rules. You erase the playing board and say, as would a little kid, "Waah! You beat me all the time. I don't want to play anymore. I want to make up my OWN rules now!"

Wrong my friend. I didn't lose anything and my intentions are not to move goal posts, this was a terrible point, sorry. These are not my own rules lol.
I haven't erased anything, rather clarified what we are all here to discuss, period.

Pathetic.

You haven't shown anything to be pathetic, besides did I not show respect in your thread? now you want to go this route, very disappointed.

But..hey. I am game. I'll bit. So here is an argument that does not allude to god's physicality or verifiable, tangible proof. (of which, again, there is NONE.)

OK..so. I would like you to close your eyes for a moment and think about the state of the world today. The violence; the wars; the over-population (part of the blame for which is due to ingorant peoples following a mundane rule in your bible, BTW); the famines; the disasters; the disease; the homeless; the kids living i garbage dumps in places like India.

God does not rule mans decisions, we have dominion in this earth and we are responsible for own people. and the state of conditions. We as the guardians of our own planet are responsible for what takes place.

NOW....imagine for a second that us Atheists are right: there is NO God. That mankind here on Earth is on his own and our life began like the mass majority of Biologists agree that it did: in a warm primordial pond some 3 billion years ago, and then we evolved to our present state.

Why would you assume that I never imagine the non existence of God lol? Do you think I'm a zombie like you atheists? No, I look at everything from all angles pal. Good luck with your warm primordial pond.


Got it?

What was there to get? Nothing at all really.

OK...lastly. Please tell me how today's Earth--with your sky god, is ANY DIFFERENT than it would be if there were NO GOD?

And........?
Are you high? Completely irrelevant to the topic at hand. Address the points or beat it.


LOL---See? I am not asking for physical proof of his existence--again, of which there is ZERO. But only for some results or signs of it? Can you even do that?

No, not to someone who believes they are a product of a warm primordial pond.

Again: Please tell me how today's Earth--with your sky god, is ANY DIFFERENT than it would be if there were NO GOD?

Perhaps you should do that thinking for yourself, off topic and meaningless.
EtrnlVw
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5/29/2015 2:02:59 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 12:27:39 PM, ThinkFirst wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
The Biblical God= Spirit
-
It is the very validity of this book that is in question. Quoting the book that we don't believe serves no purpose when trying to convince us that your assertions are fact.

Not my purpose here, my purpose is to bring clarity to the subject matter.
-
God is SPIRIT, not material therefore God does not fall into the category of a material form or a material Being that can be examined like a material object.

We don't believe that your god IS, at all. We don't necessarily need to "examine" this deity, but we would like some (ANY) viable evidence that it exists, at all...

Then apply spirituality to your life and understand God is Spirit, that is how we come in contact with spirit. You don't need to accept that but you do need to understand it within the confines of religion.

STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over.

We'll stop repeating the same old things, when you do the same... we have been "shown" NOTHING.

So you rather not understand spirituality? Why do you come here if you don't want to discuss our beliefs? I'll stop repeating God is spirit when you guys stop arguing from an ignorant position.

God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

We are rejecting this (and all other posited gods) based on the fact that none of the stories make any sense, are not compatible with reality, and are not supported by what we know of the universe around us. The ignorance for which people settle is the blanket assertion that "GodDidIt," no matter what inexplicable phenomenon is presented.

And you are rejecting it based upon faulty logic, and really have no reason to other than science has been unable to produce material evidence for a God who is Spirit, and you do not want to move from that position.
How is a Creator not compatible with reality?? That is simply an atheist opinion, that is no fact sir. A Creator in many ways is rational and compatible with reality lol, but that is a whole other topic.


Sure, this is not the only premise being attacked but nonetheless it seems to be the majority of atheist mindset and gets repeated over and over and over. Show us Theists you are capable of learning something! especially when it's common sense.

There is no "common sense" involved in theistic assertions. Essentially, we are asked to accept the premise of your god on your word. Moreover, you insist on shoving scripture in our face as though that provides some measure of "support" for your assertions when, in fact, it provides ZERO support for ridiculous beliefs in the first place. Without your bible, your god disappears. With the bible, your god is shown to be a malevolent invention endowed with some of the worst HUMAN attributes in existence.

Point out then where common sense is not used on my part? Show me the words that I wrote that describe that....
I'm not asking you to accept anything, I'm simply clarifying Christian teaching and why we need to more understand the nature of God, is that so difficult?

You cannot form an argument against a Spirit God based on lack of material evidence, in doing so you're showing you own inability to be rational and truly skeptical.

Then show us some form of "spiritual" evidence. You keep harping on this "spiritual" thing, as though it eliminates the need for any evidence, and that simply is not reasonable. You accuse us of not being rational when, in fact, it is your irrational assertions that we are asking you to support. If you claim your deity is "spirit," fine. Give us something "spiritual." Something more than words and assertions. Something more than a demand that we accept that which makes no sense...

No, I'm not eliminating the need for evidence, the need for "material" evidence is what needs to be settled. Material things produce material evidence and spiritual things produce spiritual evidence, two different natures, two different experience.
I can't present spiritual evidence, that is part of your own participation and commitment. I'm simply making you aware of what we believe.

Show me how claiming God is Spirit is an assertion on my part? Both the scriptures and teachings of Christianity and my life reveals this to be true, if it wasn't I wouldn't say it, is that okay with you?

I would demand no such things Thinkfirst, I'm simply trying to get you to follow the arguments, rather than arguing from an ignorant position, like asking Theists to present material evidence for a Spirit. That is not demanding you do anything, other than using common sense.

We need to follow the arguments to arrive at truth.

No, you don't. You want to arrange the arguments to arrive at the conclusion you derived before anything else was ever considered, in order to validate that which you have already asserted to be truth. The assertion is what we dismiss, because the assertion has proven to be quite empty for two thousand years (and counting).

No, we start with the correct premises, this is how we arrive at truth. Starting from an ignorant premise gets you ignorant results. This is all I'm really pointing out here.


So how do some theists relate to God and come to the realization that He exists?

It varies, slightly, from theist to theist, but it follows the same general pattern or acceptance based on some "spiritual experience," followed by claims that the "spiritual" cannot be disproved and, therefore MUST be accepted and considered as evidence.

Read the very first line of the passage I quoted above in John 4. Once you get this simple concept through your head and understand theists have a spiritual relation with God then you can successfully reject or argue from there, but until then the scientific method of studying the natural world is incapable and incompatible with the nature of God and addressing His existence, and it was never meant to do that. It's the atheist mindset that tries to force it to be a substantial position when in reality it is no such thing, actually the opposite.

If this deity is "spiritual" and "inaccessible," how do you know that this entity actually exists? What do you use as a foundation for your belief? What "spiritual" evidence do you have. What "spiritual" test can be performed? What "spiritual" knowledge can be obtained? Do you actually expect those of us that have no faith to accept your interpretation, ON FAITH?

No, I never said inaccessible, I've said the opposite, I just said in the underline "spiritual relation". I say it in every single thread I post in. "Inaccessible" from a scientific material standpoint not a spiritual one, God is accessible by spirit, we apply what Jesus laid out and we reap the fruit thereof, simple stuff.

16 The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God!

Again, biblical scripture is no more proof to us than a passage from the qur'an would be, for you. Think of all the reasons that you reject the islamic god, then apply them to your christian god. Presto! You've just discovered why we reject what you say.

Lol I only presented scripture to represent my point, not prove it.
You completely misunderstood the point of this topic. I'm not quoting Bible verses to prove anything other than clarifying what we all are here to argue about everyday.
Why the crap do you come here if not to discuss the beliefs contained within the Bible?
RuvDraba
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5/29/2015 2:06:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over. God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

EV, I think many atheists are aware of this argument. Unfortunately, I think you have not established the authority to make it -- and neither have your co-religionists and their sources established the authority to make it to you. If they claimed physical knowledge then that would be subject to the usual rules of accountability, transparency and validation, and we could explore that claim together.

But they cannot explain how they acquired any metaphysical knowledge. They can only refer authority to other sources who have claimed it, but then can't explain how they got it either. So the moment one claims metaphysical knowledge, one dodges all accountability and transparency in one's thought, and to me that means one has disrespected critical thought, and claimed importance of belief to which one is not entitled.

Other atheists may feel differently, but I believe claims to metaphysical knowledge are in general so vain, so corrupt, so misleading, and so egregiously self-serving that they should be rejected outright, regardless of the claim. I believe resorting to them is a form of special pleading that in its abuse, can represent a deficiency of mind and character.

Or to put it another way: if metaphysical knowledge is worth the air it took to claim it, it should be able to reliably tell us facts specific, surprising, significant and independently verifiable about the physical world which the claimant knows and others don't. Because metaphysical insight surely entails significant physical insight too. If one can't do that, then one needs to ask oneself what it is one really knows, and whether one knows it or has simply seduced oneself with vanity and weak thought.

I'm sorry to be blunt here, EV. But I suspect you examine yourself more than many posters here, and may be able to make sense of what I've been saying. You've made a passionate argument to understand the claim before rejecting it. So here's a passionate rebuttal explaining that I do understand the claim, and believe that if one lacks any special physical insight, one needs to reflect on the ethics and accountability of making it.

I hope that may provoke interest and reflection. :)
EtrnlVw
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5/29/2015 2:45:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 2:06:04 PM, RuvDraba wrote:
At 5/29/2015 6:09:30 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
STOP repeating the same old things when they are shown to you over and over. God is outside the restrictions of material evidence, so reject this God based on some other premise otherwise you are rejecting God on faulty grounds and that is NOT what you want to do, that is settling for ignorance.

EV, I think many atheists are aware of this argument. Unfortunately, I think you have not established the authority to make it -- and neither have your co-religionists and their sources established the authority to make it to you. If they claimed physical knowledge then that would be subject to the usual rules of accountability, transparency and validation, and we could explore that claim together.

And in what way do I need to establish authority to express my beliefs sir? I don't say anything that I have not experienced myself, rather I share what I learn, nothing more nothing less.

But they cannot explain how they acquired any metaphysical knowledge. They can only refer authority to other sources who have claimed it, but then can't explain how they got it either. So the moment one claims metaphysical knowledge, one dodges all accountability and transparency in one's thought, and to me that means one has disrespected critical thought, and claimed importance of belief to which one is not entitled.

No, I've explained this a billion times over and I will no longer repeat it in this thread.
I HAVE explained how I acquire spiritual things! I say the same thing in almost every thread lol, not sure how to make it more clear for you.... I acquire spiritual things by applying them to my life, that is what it means to be Christian, pretty straight forward eh??

It's always the assumption that theists don't use critical thought...when will we ever get beyond such short sightedness?

Other atheists may feel differently, but I believe claims to metaphysical knowledge are in general so vain, so corrupt, so misleading, and so egregiously self-serving that they should be rejected outright, regardless of the claim. I believe resorting to them is a form of special pleading that in its abuse, can represent a deficiency of mind and character.

I have made no personal claims that are vague, actually I usually go out of my way to make things very easy to comprehend.
I don't special plead, I've given a premise for Christian beliefs.

Or to put it another way: if metaphysical knowledge is worth the air it took to claim it, it should be able to reliably tell us facts specific, surprising, significant and independently verifiable about the physical world which the claimant knows and others don't. Because metaphysical insight surely entails significant physical insight too. If one can't do that, then one needs to ask oneself what it is one really knows, and whether one knows it or has simply seduced oneself with vanity and weak thought.

Nothing but assumptions, that does not describe me. I DO give insight, explaining my position in very clear ways, perhaps you can clarify that with an example other then Danne the Atheists pretend thread....

I'm sorry to be blunt here, EV. But I suspect you examine yourself more than many posters here, and may be able to make sense of what I've been saying. You've made a passionate argument to understand the claim before rejecting it. So here's a passionate rebuttal explaining that I do understand the claim, and believe that if one lacks any special physical insight, one needs to reflect on the ethics and accountability of making it.

Yes, I examine myself without reservations, all the time. I have no fear of that, it's the opposing side that continually asserts these types of claims. So I do appreciate the acknowledgement, you are correct about that.
Could you elaborate on the last sentence please? That you Draba.

I hope that may provoke interest and reflection. :)

I appreciate the word salad but little actual content, be more direct about what you need to know my friend. I actually really like you, sometimes you are just hard to follow. I believe you could make your posts more clear by using less words to distract. In other words get to the point lol.
Saint_of_Me
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5/29/2015 3:00:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/29/2015 1:05:54 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 5/29/2015 12:01:46 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
Typical head-in-the-sand Christian apologetics. You guys continually lose badly in ANY argument asking for proof, so what do yo do? LOL..you claim that your sky god is above and beyond the parameters of the rules. You erase the playing board and say, as would a little kid, "Waah! You beat me all the time. I don't want to play anymore. I want to make up my OWN rules now!"

Wrong my friend. I didn't lose anything and my intentions are not to move goal posts, this was a terrible point, sorry. These are not my own rules lol.
I haven't erased anything, rather clarified what we are all here to discuss, period.

Pathetic.

You haven't shown anything to be pathetic, besides did I not show respect in your thread? now you want to go this route, very disappointed.

But..hey. I am game. I'll bit. So here is an argument that does not allude to god's physicality or verifiable, tangible proof. (of which, again, there is NONE.)

OK..so. I would like you to close your eyes for a moment and think about the state of the world today. The violence; the wars; the over-population (part of the blame for which is due to ingorant peoples following a mundane rule in your bible, BTW); the famines; the disasters; the disease; the homeless; the kids living i garbage dumps in places like India.

God does not rule mans decisions, we have dominion in this earth and we are responsible for own people. and the state of conditions. We as the guardians of our own planet are responsible for what takes place.

NOW....imagine for a second that us Atheists are right: there is NO God. That mankind here on Earth is on his own and our life began like the mass majority of Biologists agree that it did: in a warm primordial pond some 3 billion years ago, and then we evolved to our present state.

Why would you assume that I never imagine the non existence of God lol? Do you think I'm a zombie like you atheists? No, I look at everything from all angles pal. Good luck with your warm primordial pond.


Got it?

What was there to get? Nothing at all really.

OK...lastly. Please tell me how today's Earth--with your sky god, is ANY DIFFERENT than it would be if there were NO GOD?

And........?
Are you high? Completely irrelevant to the topic at hand. Address the points or beat it.


LOL---See? I am not asking for physical proof of his existence--again, of which there is ZERO. But only for some results or signs of it? Can you even do that?

No, not to someone who believes they are a product of a warm primordial pond.

Again: Please tell me how today's Earth--with your sky god, is ANY DIFFERENT than it would be if there were NO GOD?

Perhaps you should do that thinking for yourself, off topic and meaningless.

LOL...good job.

Very predictable, but good job.

You spent a lot of time and space in your post NOT answering my question. ANd that is: How is this current Earth ANY different than it should be if there was NO God?

The answer is, "It ii not. It is exactly as it should be if life we began by unguided, blind chance and then furthered via purely physical and scientifically biological non-divine methods."

Or, again--Last Chance, amigo!--maybe you can show me ONE thing different.

So..this God of yours. He doesn't intervene in human affairs, which means he does NOT answer prayers. He is invisible apparent powerless. His followers are usually the poorest and worse-off. (Google "why most religious nations also poorest?")

LOL. Remind us again exactly what good he is?

Game. Set. Match.
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.