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POPOO5560
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5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism... if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?

2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?
Never fart near dog
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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5/31/2015 6:15:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism... if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?

2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?

I should think the evil slave traders may have pointed out the Bible didn't list slavery as a 'thou shalt not'! That guy Paul even urged slaves to honour their masters!
celestialtorahteacher
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5/31/2015 7:06:46 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Islam promoted African slave trade as most of the African slavers rounding up Africans were Muslims. Muhammadism doesn't honor human life which is made subservient to idol worship, loyalty to the idols, Muhammad and his book, far more important than an individual's life. It's a primitive religious mindset that attracts men who want to play king of the hill, king of the house, not by ethical behavior but by using physical or social force, coercion to compel obedience of wives and women in general in Muhammadan all male dominated societies.

Like all the attention that was given Communism after Nazism died out, Muhammadism too will fall to the democracy and human rights movement and Muhammad's place as an idol that is taboo to question will be overthrown and equality will then begin to spread throughout Islamic worshipers. Muhammad's ghost keeps Muhammadans from evolving further spiritually so they're stuck in the ancient oriental despot mindset that doesn't know why democracy is so important to God and Humanity.
POPOO5560
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5/31/2015 8:13:01 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 7:06:46 AM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
Islam promoted African slave trade as most of the African slavers rounding up Africans were Muslims. Muhammadism doesn't honor human life which is made subservient to idol worship, loyalty to the idols, Muhammad and his book, far more important than an individual's life. It's a primitive religious mindset that attracts men who want to play king of the hill, king of the house, not by ethical behavior but by using physical or social force, coercion to compel obedience of wives and women in general in Muhammadan all male dominated societies.

Like all the attention that was given Communism after Nazism died out, Muhammadism too will fall to the democracy and human rights movement and Muhammad's place as an idol that is taboo to question will be overthrown and equality will then begin to spread throughout Islamic worshipers. Muhammad's ghost keeps Muhammadans from evolving further spiritually so they're stuck in the ancient oriental despot mindset that doesn't know why democracy is so important to God and Humanity.

i said no jerks allowed here
Never fart near dog
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,580
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5/31/2015 11:26:35 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism... if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?

Both Islam and Christianity/Judaism are barbaric religions filled with violence, the only difference is that the followers of Christianity/Judaism are no longer enslaving people like the followers of ISIS. Does that help?


2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

Islam also allows and condones atrocities, so you really have nothing to complain about.

3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?

Yes, the Quran talks about prisoners of war and making slaves, hence it is a barbaric, violent religion that is no more or less evil than the others.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
12_13
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5/31/2015 2:44:43 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war?

Jews had right to buy slaves. However Bible tells we should lo others as ourselves. I don"t see how person who obeys that could keep anyone as slave.

(all people who pay taxes or interest are also slaves).
celestialtorahteacher
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5/31/2015 4:06:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 8:13:01 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 5/31/2015 7:06:46 AM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
Islam promoted African slave trade as most of the African slavers rounding up Africans were Muslims. Muhammadism doesn't honor human life which is made subservient to idol worship, loyalty to the idols, Muhammad and his book, far more important than an individual's life. It's a primitive religious mindset that attracts men who want to play king of the hill, king of the house, not by ethical behavior but by using physical or social force, coercion to compel obedience of wives and women in general in Muhammadan all male dominated societies.

Like all the attention that was given Communism after Nazism died out, Muhammadism too will fall to the democracy and human rights movement and Muhammad's place as an idol that is taboo to question will be overthrown and equality will then begin to spread throughout Islamic worshipers. Muhammad's ghost keeps Muhammadans from evolving further spiritually so they're stuck in the ancient oriental despot mindset that doesn't know why democracy is so important to God and Humanity.

i said no jerks allowed here

Then why are you posting, poopoo? Only mentally and morally deficient believers fall for your religious beliefs so again I ask you, why are you posting to more mature spiritually conscious people trying to sell your rotten bill of goods, the worst, most violent of all the Abrahamic religions now that Christians have mellowed out to a great extent, forced too by secular democracy laws that will eventually have the same effect on Muslim societies.
celestialtorahteacher
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5/31/2015 4:11:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
People want freedom, not slavery, and Muhammadism wants to make mental slaves of Muhammadan believers. As long as oriental despotism was acceptable social government Muhammadism thrived in the sand, gravel and rocky hot countries with greenery or much water. But oriental despotism was forced out of Europe and America by secular democratic activism and thus Muhammadism never could take root in these regions. We don't want or need slavery and neither does God. Would God want Children of God to be slaves or Family? You decide. We Christians know the answer to that question.
celestialtorahteacher
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5/31/2015 4:16:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Make that: "without greenery or much water.. Abrahamic religions are desert born water hole defender religions where the Water Hole is under a sheik's ownership who controls its allotment to others. Much like the Abrahamic god who owns and controls the Spiritual information human beings need to emotionally govern themselves, secular intellectualism never able to teach the majority how and why to act as good people.
POPOO5560
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5/31/2015 5:36:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 4:16:00 PM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:

tremendous repeat no jerks alllowed here! how much stupidity one can hold! aahhhe!
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Forthelulz
Posts: 209
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5/31/2015 10:17:23 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 11:26:35 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism... if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?

Both Islam and Christianity/Judaism are barbaric religions filled with violence, the only difference is that the followers of Christianity/Judaism are no longer enslaving people like the followers of ISIS. Does that help?

The difference is that Islam openly advocates forcible conversion in its scripture. I believe the quote is
"But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practice regular charity, then open the way for them..."
The others listed had those in charge used secular rulers to forcibly convert people. Also, Christianity has cleaned up its act considerably, along with Judaism.

2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

Islam also allows and condones atrocities, so you really have nothing to complain about.

3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?

Yes, the Quran talks about prisoners of war and making slaves, hence it is a barbaric, violent religion that is no more or less evil than the others.
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POPOO5560
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6/1/2015 2:11:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 10:17:23 PM, Forthelulz wrote:

The difference is that Islam openly advocates forcible conversion in its scripture. I believe the quote is
"But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practice regular charity, then open the way for them..."
The others listed had those in charge used secular rulers to forcibly convert people. Also, Christianity has cleaned up its act considerably, along with Judaism.

why u guys cant answer the questions and instead deflect the issue to other nonsense. but u compel me to respond because of your ignorance....

Quran 2:256
There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing.

the second allegation u quoted from the Quran (without reference probably from anti islamic website crp...) from chapter is 9 verse 5. now please read from the start verse 1 to 5 and come back u taking out of context and its ridiculous.
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Forthelulz
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6/1/2015 3:09:37 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 2:11:05 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 5/31/2015 10:17:23 PM, Forthelulz wrote:

The difference is that Islam openly advocates forcible conversion in its scripture. I believe the quote is
"But when the forbidden months are past, then fight and slay the Pagans wherever ye find them, and seize them, beleaguer them, and lie in wait for them in every stratagem (of war); but if they repent, and establish regular prayers and practice regular charity, then open the way for them..."
The others listed had those in charge used secular rulers to forcibly convert people. Also, Christianity has cleaned up its act considerably, along with Judaism.

why u guys cant answer the questions and instead deflect the issue to other nonsense. but u compel me to respond because of your ignorance....

Quran 2:256
There shall be no compulsion in [acceptance of] the religion. The right course has become clear from the wrong. So whoever disbelieves in Taghut and believes in Allah has grasped the most trustworthy handhold with no break in it. And Allah is Hearing and Knowing.

the second allegation u quoted from the Quran (without reference probably from anti islamic website crp...) from chapter is 9 verse 5. now please read from the start verse 1 to 5 and come back u taking out of context and its ridiculous.
Actually, it's very interesting to read it in chronological order, instead of by size.
You can see how, as his power grew, he became more xenophobic. For example, he went from "You can drink" to "But not before praying" to "Don't drink."
In that time, he found out that drunken followers gives a bad image.
Also, I got that quote from the copy I got in a Friends of the Library bookstore. It was published by a Muslim publisher. In short, these guys are OCD "join us or die", and the thread has derailed to another Islam thread. What is it with these guys and their false god (note the lowercase "g") that intrigues people so?
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DanneJeRusse
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6/1/2015 12:01:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 11:31:20 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
so nobody cant answer even 1 question? zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Well, not for an Islamic propagandist who ignores the problems with his own religion and goes out bashing other religions. That's called being a hypocrite. Try cleaning up your own backyard before complaining about your neighbors.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Geogeer
Posts: 4,227
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6/1/2015 12:09:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism...

No, not for those reasons. If you have prisoners perform work that is a form of slavery - one that is permitted by the US Constitution I believe. Ancient Jewish slavery is not quite the same as what we consider slavery.

if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?

2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

Abolitionists used the Bible to make slavery illegal, so there are obviously indicators in the Bible that slavery should be abolished. In fact europe had effectively purged itself of slavery after the fall of Rome.

3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

Well, I believe that in islam you are not allowed to have sex outside of marriage, thus slave girls are not supposed to be a "harem". However, I was watching a documentary on "temporary wives" where one could arrange to be married for a day - which basically translated into prostitution.

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?

To be fair in the ancient world a woman with young children without a man was facing a very bleak life. This could be interpreted to mean that they had to be provided for when you took their the husband/father as a slave.
POPOO5560
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6/1/2015 1:16:20 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 12:01:42 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 6/1/2015 11:31:20 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
so nobody cant answer even 1 question? zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz

Well, not for an Islamic propagandist who ignores the problems with his own religion and goes out bashing other religions. That's called being a hypocrite. Try cleaning up your own backyard before complaining about your neighbors.

Please answer this question seriously... are you trying to troll here or cant comprehend that i have 2 questions about the bible and 2 questions about Islam? its not quantum mechanics! read simple plain obvious straightforward basic english! let me test your brian how much 1-2=? dont use google!
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POPOO5560
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6/1/2015 1:28:49 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 12:09:04 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism...

No, not for those reasons. If you have prisoners perform work that is a form of slavery - one that is permitted by the US Constitution I believe. Ancient Jewish slavery is not quite the same as what we consider slavery.

i dont know why u mentioned Ancient Jewish slavery when paul allowes slavery.. but anyway how jewish slavery is different from constitution slavery?


if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?



2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

Abolitionists used the Bible to make slavery illegal, so there are obviously indicators in the Bible that slavery should be abolished. In fact europe had effectively purged itself of slavery after the fall of Rome.

like what?


3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

Well, I believe that in islam you are not allowed to have sex outside of marriage, thus slave girls are not supposed to be a "harem". However, I was watching a documentary on "temporary wives" where one could arrange to be married for a day - which basically translated into prostitution.

"temporary wives"= prostitution... they appointing a time for expamle a day and they free to go doing what ever they want... but the problem is its not in sunni Islam (which comprise ~90% of muslims worldwide) its practice is in shia Islam and i dont know if every shia people/groups support it they have some sects too...

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?

To be fair in the ancient world a woman with young children without a man was facing a very bleak life. This could be interpreted to mean that they had to be provided for when you took their the husband/father as a slave.

yeah i heard one reason that after battle the women and children need ome protection,provision care for their lives after their husbands died in war (which were the main source of the famility at that time...) , neither i know much about this issue because of that im asking....
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Mhykiel
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6/1/2015 8:39:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 6:15:05 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism... if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?

2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?

I should think the evil slave traders may have pointed out the Bible didn't list slavery as a 'thou shalt not'! That guy Paul even urged slaves to honor their masters!

And the slavery practiced by the Jews was not the dehumanizing slavery enacted in the Americas.

The slavery allowed in the bible would be better than the slavery most government enact over their "citizens".
Mhykiel
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6/1/2015 9:05:57 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism... if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?

Like the Law of Moses allowing for divorce. Regulations put into place for the treatment and acquisition of slaves, but that would not be God's ideal plan for people.

Secondly, The treatment of slaves were to be no different than hired laborers. Slaves could hold property of their own and could by their freedom (at the cost of their slavery pro-rated for years served). Slaves were able to acquire an inheritance from a master. More so if they had pledged life long allegiance (symbolized by pierced ear) would be released on masters death. Slaves once free, tended to open up businesses and trades doing what their previous master did. (suggesting "slavery" was a contractual agreement for education in trade skills.) Killing a slave was considered murder, and the murderer, even if it was the master, was sentenced to death. And some biblical laws for certain types of slaves said to release slaves to freedom after 7 years (which would really be 6 years lest you transgress 7 years and one day).

female slaves could not be raped. And tho it is sad, a father could sell a daughter if the family was destitute and had to buy the daughter back as soon as possible. Plus female slaves were released when they started to go through puberty.

Clearly slavery in the biblical context, is more of a contractual work agreement for education or to pay off debts.

Is this the kind of slavery ISIS is doing?


2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

"I have the right to do anything," you say--but not everything is beneficial. "I have the right to do anything"--but not everything is constructive." 1 Corinthians 10:23


3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?

The rest I think is directed at someone with better knowledge of Islamic literature and tenets.
bulproof
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6/1/2015 9:21:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 8:39:38 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 5/31/2015 6:15:05 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism... if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?

2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?

I should think the evil slave traders may have pointed out the Bible didn't list slavery as a 'thou shalt not'! That guy Paul even urged slaves to honor their masters!

And the slavery practiced by the Jews was not the dehumanizing slavery enacted in the Americas.

The slavery allowed in the bible would be better than the slavery most government enact over their "citizens".

OWNING a human being and his/her entire family isn't dehumanising on which planet?
OYG
But of course, if you can convince yourself that infanticide is the pinnacle of morality then you can believe anything.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
bulproof
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6/1/2015 9:24:18 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 9:05:57 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
female slaves could not be raped

Oh yes they could.
It's just that nobody was allowed to call it rape.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Mhykiel
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6/1/2015 9:53:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 9:21:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 8:39:38 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 5/31/2015 6:15:05 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism... if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?

2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?

I should think the evil slave traders may have pointed out the Bible didn't list slavery as a 'thou shalt not'! That guy Paul even urged slaves to honor their masters!

And the slavery practiced by the Jews was not the dehumanizing slavery enacted in the Americas.

The slavery allowed in the bible would be better than the slavery most government enact over their "citizens".

OWNING a human being and his/her entire family isn't dehumanising on which planet?

Nations take out loans from the World Bank, using their citizens as collateral. In some respects people today are owned.

But the as I described the slavery system in biblical times was in most cases a contractual work agreement.

I see no moral conundrum in having servants, I see it almost no differently than having soldiers.

Soldiers are given there basic need sot be met for a certain number of years, they are issued usury, and are on call 24-7. Only recently were they not punished with corporeal punishment. But still discipline is kept with muscle straining exercises and verbal reprimanding. I highly doubt any civilian boss can get away with yelling, man handling, and ordering an employee to do push-ups.

So how is being a soldier different from being a slave?

OYG
But of course, if you can convince yourself that infanticide is the pinnacle of morality then you can believe anything.

Well I am not advocating for infanticide. As you well know I am pro-life. So I think it hypocritical when pro-choice atheist use such an event as evidence or premise that God is something.
Mhykiel
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6/1/2015 9:55:45 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 9:24:18 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:05:57 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
female slaves could not be raped

Oh yes they could.
It's just that nobody was allowed to call it rape.

I could be wrong. Could you support that female slaves could be raped?

Are implying that females became slaves for the sole purpose of sexual deeds?
bulproof
Posts: 25,185
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6/1/2015 10:27:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 9:55:45 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:24:18 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:05:57 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
female slaves could not be raped

Oh yes they could.
It's just that nobody was allowed to call it rape.

I could be wrong. Could you support that female slaves could be raped?

Are implying that females became slaves for the sole purpose of sexual deeds?

I could but you would be unlikely to believe me, so how about you read the bible instead?
Oh you'll need to take the indoctrinate glasses off if you really want to know.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Mhykiel
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6/1/2015 10:33:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 10:27:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:55:45 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:24:18 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:05:57 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
female slaves could not be raped

Oh yes they could.
It's just that nobody was allowed to call it rape.

I could be wrong. Could you support that female slaves could be raped?

Are implying that females became slaves for the sole purpose of sexual deeds?

I could but you would be unlikely to believe me, so how about you read the bible instead?
Oh you'll need to take the indoctrinate glasses off if you really want to know.

Do you have any verse you can cite?

You can post the verses you have in mind, then you can add additional sentences in which you describe your reasoning to why those verses support your view.

That way I can listen to your words, and decide for myself if they make a logically sound argument for your position. If they don't then I can express to you where I think a break in logical inference or a false premise is.

At that point you then defend your position, with facts, or addressing how your view accounts for both your initial statements AND accounts for my additional challenges.

that way everyone reading in the forum, you, and I, can gain understanding about the issue at hand. maybe even resolve the issue in the minds in some people.

So what do you say? Can you cite some verses supporting what you are saying?
bulproof
Posts: 25,185
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6/2/2015 12:53:21 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 9:53:41 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:21:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 8:39:38 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 5/31/2015 6:15:05 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 5/31/2015 5:58:07 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
Questions.... no jerks please lol

1) its immoral in Christianity/Judaism to enslave people for other reason beside prisoners of war? for based on skin color,nationalism... if yes, how one can criticize ISIS atrocities enslaving and subjugating indiscriminately through the Bible's eyes?

2) if there are no indication in the Bible that criticizes slavery so how the hell someone from the Judeo-Christian people can even crawl against it when God made it lawful?

3) Quran 4:3
And if you fear that you will not deal justly with the orphan girls, then marry those that please you of [other] women, two or three or four. But if you fear that you will not be just, then [marry only] one or those your right hand possesses (slave girls),That is more suitable that you may not incline [to injustice].

there is limitation for how many one can marry (4) but if he cant be just (equally between his wifes) only 1 is allowed, but the verse continues "or those your right hand possesses (slave girls)", so the the question is does it allows to have countless slave girls and if so what is the difference between this one and prostitution which is forbidden in Islam (and its free of charge)?

4) from my understanding, in Islam the prisoners of wars becomes your slaves, i can understand to capture somebody wanting to kill you, but if im not mistaken prisoners of war including their women and children, what the sh1t has to do to theiir folk and families?

I should think the evil slave traders may have pointed out the Bible didn't list slavery as a 'thou shalt not'! That guy Paul even urged slaves to honor their masters!

And the slavery practiced by the Jews was not the dehumanizing slavery enacted in the Americas.

The slavery allowed in the bible would be better than the slavery most government enact over their "citizens".

OWNING a human being and his/her entire family isn't dehumanising on which planet?

Nations take out loans from the World Bank, using their citizens as collateral. In some respects people today are owned.

But the as I described the slavery system in biblical times was in most cases a contractual work agreement.

I see no moral conundrum in having servants, I see it almost no differently than having soldiers.

Soldiers are given there basic need sot be met for a certain number of years, they are issued usury, and are on call 24-7. Only recently were they not punished with corporeal punishment. But still discipline is kept with muscle straining exercises and verbal reprimanding. I highly doubt any civilian boss can get away with yelling, man handling, and ordering an employee to do push-ups.

So how is being a soldier different from being a slave?

OYG
But of course, if you can convince yourself that infanticide is the pinnacle of morality then you can believe anything.

Well I am not advocating for infanticide. As you well know I am pro-life. So I think it hypocritical when pro-choice atheist use such an event as evidence or premise that God is something.

Which planet did you say?
And how does it feel having to justify and support slavery in order that you can claim your god is good.
What my beliefs are have no impact upon the information allegedly passed on through the bible.
Your god is a practitioner of infanticide, what has that to do with me?
The one claiming to be pro-life who then claims infanticide is the pinnacle of morality may be demonstrating far greater hypocrisy than I.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
bulproof
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6/2/2015 1:04:24 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/1/2015 10:33:36 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/1/2015 10:27:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:55:45 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:24:18 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:05:57 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
female slaves could not be raped

Oh yes they could.
It's just that nobody was allowed to call it rape.

I could be wrong. Could you support that female slaves could be raped?

Are implying that females became slaves for the sole purpose of sexual deeds?

I could but you would be unlikely to believe me, so how about you read the bible instead?
Oh you'll need to take the indoctrinate glasses off if you really want to know.

Do you have any verse you can cite?
Several, but you've been given them before and your indoctrination prevents you from understanding their import.
You can post the verses you have in mind, then you can add additional sentences in which you describe your reasoning to why those verses support your view.
Been done to death with you and as I said your indoctrination prevents you examining and understanding the passages. You have been TOLD what the passages mean and never a thought shall pass.
That way I can listen to your words, and decide for myself if they make a logically sound argument for your position. If they don't then I can express to you where I think a break in logical inference or a false premise is.
That's not how you work, you recognise immediately that your indoctrination is at odds with an intelligent understanding and so reject what is being said outright.
At that point you then defend your position, with facts, or addressing how your view accounts for both your initial statements AND accounts for my additional challenges.
That's not how it works, you produce the indoctrination you have been given and reject all else.
that way everyone reading in the forum, you, and I, can gain understanding about the issue at hand. maybe even resolve the issue in the minds in some people.
Once again that isn't how it works, if two atheists were to discuss a point of contention between them then neither would be encumbered by indoctrination and an intelligent conversation is more likely to ensue.
So what do you say? Can you cite some verses supporting what you are saying?
Accounted for earlier.
Thanks.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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6/2/2015 5:54:59 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/2/2015 1:04:24 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 10:33:36 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/1/2015 10:27:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:55:45 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:24:18 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 6/1/2015 9:05:57 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
female slaves could not be raped

Oh yes they could.
It's just that nobody was allowed to call it rape.

I could be wrong. Could you support that female slaves could be raped?

Are implying that females became slaves for the sole purpose of sexual deeds?

I could but you would be unlikely to believe me, so how about you read the bible instead?
Oh you'll need to take the indoctrinate glasses off if you really want to know.

Do you have any verse you can cite?
Several, but you've been given them before and your indoctrination prevents you from understanding their import.

I haven't seen you cite any passages. With no citations from biblical sources your statements are bare assertions, lacking any measure of reasoning to be logically discerned or maturely discussed.

You can post the verses you have in mind, then you can add additional sentences in which you describe your reasoning to why those verses support your view.
Been done to death with you and as I said your indoctrination prevents you examining and understanding the passages. You have been TOLD what the passages mean and never a thought shall pass.

What passages? I have been told what they mean to you. And others have told me what the passages meant to them. I investigated the issue and accept the best interpretation based on the evidence and context. you haven't offered either one of those.

Hitchen's razor, what is asserted without evidence can be dismissed without evidence. I dismiss your statements as meaningless chatter.

That way I can listen to your words, and decide for myself if they make a logically sound argument for your position. If they don't then I can express to you where I think a break in logical inference or a false premise is.
That's not how you work, you recognise immediately that your indoctrination is at odds with an intelligent understanding and so reject what is being said outright.

What is being said outright that I reject? I've been asking you for the verses. You haven't offered any evidence that slavery in biblical times was not generally a work contract.

At that point you then defend your position, with facts, or addressing how your view accounts for both your initial statements AND accounts for my additional challenges.
That's not how it works, you produce the indoctrination you have been given and reject all else.

I reject falsehood when the evidence implies a different scenario.

that way everyone reading in the forum, you, and I, can gain understanding about the issue at hand. maybe even resolve the issue in the minds in some people.
Once again that isn't how it works, if two atheists were to discuss a point of contention between them then neither would be encumbered by indoctrination and an intelligent conversation is more likely to ensue.

being an atheist doesn't make you smart or capable of having an intelligent conversation. I'm asking you to have an intelligent conversation, I've yet to see you even open to the idea discussion to justify your statements.

So what do you say? Can you cite some verses supporting what you are saying?
Accounted for earlier.
Thanks.

No. you lie. You haven't posted any verses to support what you said. Are female slaves synonymous with sex slave? Is biblical slavery the kind of slavery ISIS is instituting? Were master slave relationships in the bible not educational and/or work contracts in biblical times?