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Why did God create humans?

Accipiter
Posts: 1,163
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6/24/2015 12:23:02 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

You were created for a very special purpose, you are the eyes and mind of the universe.

Without someone to witness this incredible universe it would be a terrible shame.
janesix
Posts: 3,446
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6/24/2015 12:24:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 12:23:02 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

You were created for a very special purpose, you are the eyes and mind of the universe.

Without someone to witness this incredible universe it would be a terrible shame.

Yes it would, I agree.
dee-em
Posts: 6,456
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6/24/2015 2:48:56 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 12:23:02 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

You were created for a very special purpose, you are the eyes and mind of the universe.

Without someone to witness this incredible universe it would be a terrible shame.

We (homo sapiens) only appeared 500,000 years ago. Who was there to be the "eyes and mind" of the universe in the preceding 13,699,500,000 years?

We are here to admire God's handiwork? That's it?
Accipiter
Posts: 1,163
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6/24/2015 3:52:55 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 2:48:56 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:23:02 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

You were created for a very special purpose, you are the eyes and mind of the universe.

Without someone to witness this incredible universe it would be a terrible shame.

We (homo sapiens) only appeared 500,000 years ago. Who was there to be the "eyes and mind" of the universe in the preceding 13,699,500,000 years?

We are here to admire God's handiwork? That's it?

I don't really care if there is a god or not.

It takes time to make brains and then more time to make them work right, that we all know for sure.

As far as your temperament perhaps you should speak to your doctor about adding Abilify to your existing treatment.
12_13
Posts: 1,361
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6/24/2015 3:57:19 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Why did God create humans?

Probably because he taught it was good.
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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6/24/2015 4:26:08 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

If it exists it would appear it was bored and wanted human pawns to entertain it!
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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6/24/2015 5:18:37 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

https://en.wikipedia.org...
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
dee-em
Posts: 6,456
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6/24/2015 6:07:49 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 3:52:55 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 2:48:56 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:23:02 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

You were created for a very special purpose, you are the eyes and mind of the universe.

Without someone to witness this incredible universe it would be a terrible shame.

We (homo sapiens) only appeared 500,000 years ago. Who was there to be the "eyes and mind" of the universe in the preceding 13,699,500,000 years?

We are here to admire God's handiwork? That's it?

I don't really care if there is a god or not.

It takes time to make brains and then more time to make them work right, that we all know for sure.

??? You think brains are made and then refined over time?

As far as your temperament perhaps you should speak to your doctor about adding Abilify to your existing treatment.

What makes you think that I'm psychotic? I don't recall having a previous conversation with you. All I did was point out a flaw in your suggestion that we are here to appreciate the universe because God wanted an audience for his work. You are free to show me where I am wrong. Instead you ad hom me. Sheesh, talk about grumpy.
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
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6/24/2015 9:05:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Why did the supposed perfect being do anything? Perfection implies no unfulfilled needs or wants, hence, no action needed to satisfy needs or wants. A perfect being existing alone outside of time and space would never seek to create anything since there is no motivation to do so. Q.E.D.
XLAV
Posts: 13,710
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6/24/2015 9:47:53 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 9:05:14 AM, dhardage wrote:
Why did the supposed perfect being do anything? Perfection implies no unfulfilled needs or wants, hence, no action needed to satisfy needs or wants. A perfect being existing alone outside of time and space would never seek to create anything since there is no motivation to do so. Q.E.D.

^ Well said.
Accipiter
Posts: 1,163
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6/24/2015 2:07:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 6:07:49 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 3:52:55 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 2:48:56 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:23:02 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

You were created for a very special purpose, you are the eyes and mind of the universe.

Without someone to witness this incredible universe it would be a terrible shame.

We (homo sapiens) only appeared 500,000 years ago. Who was there to be the "eyes and mind" of the universe in the preceding 13,699,500,000 years?

We are here to admire God's handiwork? That's it?

I don't really care if there is a god or not.

It takes time to make brains and then more time to make them work right, that we all know for sure.

??? You think brains are made and then refined over time?

As far as your temperament perhaps you should speak to your doctor about adding Abilify to your existing treatment.

What makes you think that I'm psychotic? I don't recall having a previous conversation with you. All I did was point out a flaw in your suggestion that we are here to appreciate the universe because God wanted an audience for his work. You are free to show me where I am wrong. Instead you ad hom me. Sheesh, talk about grumpy.

I don't think you are psychotic, just maybe a little depressed.
Outplayz
Posts: 1,267
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6/24/2015 3:19:47 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

What if it wasn't god that created humans? What if you choose to come here? What if you created you? If these are the questions ... Why do you think you would come here? One of my personal reasons is to see and be with my family and loved ones. I don't think you see them in this way in your immortal form.
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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6/24/2015 3:38:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 9:05:14 AM, dhardage wrote:
Why did the supposed perfect being do anything? Perfection implies no unfulfilled needs or wants, hence, no action needed to satisfy needs or wants. A perfect being existing alone outside of time and space would never seek to create anything since there is no motivation to do so. Q.E.D.

Then according to all the assertions you made God is not perfect lol.

Let us pretend that God is indeed "perfect" (whatever that means), why would a perfect Being not want to create unless you picture someone of a perfect nature to be void of having desires. If God having desires means He is imperfect then so be it, God is imperfect HOWEVER, it is my opinion that an eternal God would absolutely want to create.
Having desires does not strip God of perfection, I think it only makes Him more perfect I guess it depends upon ones perception. God is not a robot, He actually feels and desires things and creation is on many levels. God IS a Creator and a creator expresses what it feels, not only does God feel but God feels on a much greater level than any of us.
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
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6/24/2015 4:03:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 3:38:22 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 6/24/2015 9:05:14 AM, dhardage wrote:
Why did the supposed perfect being do anything? Perfection implies no unfulfilled needs or wants, hence, no action needed to satisfy needs or wants. A perfect being existing alone outside of time and space would never seek to create anything since there is no motivation to do so. Q.E.D.

Then according to all the assertions you made God is not perfect lol.

Let us pretend that God is indeed "perfect" (whatever that means), why would a perfect Being not want to create unless you picture someone of a perfect nature to be void of having desires. If God having desires means He is imperfect then so be it, God is imperfect HOWEVER, it is my opinion that an eternal God would absolutely want to create.
Having desires does not strip God of perfection, I think it only makes Him more perfect I guess it depends upon ones perception. God is not a robot, He actually feels and desires things and creation is on many levels. God IS a Creator and a creator expresses what it feels, not only does God feel but God feels on a much greater level than any of us.

Perfection implies completeness, needing or wanting nothing. Desires imply a lack of some sort that needs to be filled, be it emotional, physical, etc. A perfect being, having no incomplete portions of its being, would have no need or desires, including creation.

Just for curiosity's sake, how do you know "God is not a robot, He actually feels and desires things and creation is on many levels. God IS a Creator and a creator expresses what it feels, not only does God feel but God feels on a much greater level than any of us."? Did you speak to him directly? Do you guys pal around and chat about your feelings? I'm very interested to know the source of your knowledge.
janesix
Posts: 3,446
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6/24/2015 4:16:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 4:03:08 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 6/24/2015 3:38:22 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 6/24/2015 9:05:14 AM, dhardage wrote:
Why did the supposed perfect being do anything? Perfection implies no unfulfilled needs or wants, hence, no action needed to satisfy needs or wants. A perfect being existing alone outside of time and space would never seek to create anything since there is no motivation to do so. Q.E.D.

Then according to all the assertions you made God is not perfect lol.

Let us pretend that God is indeed "perfect" (whatever that means), why would a perfect Being not want to create unless you picture someone of a perfect nature to be void of having desires. If God having desires means He is imperfect then so be it, God is imperfect HOWEVER, it is my opinion that an eternal God would absolutely want to create.
Having desires does not strip God of perfection, I think it only makes Him more perfect I guess it depends upon ones perception. God is not a robot, He actually feels and desires things and creation is on many levels. God IS a Creator and a creator expresses what it feels, not only does God feel but God feels on a much greater level than any of us.

Perfection implies completeness, needing or wanting nothing. Desires imply a lack of some sort that needs to be filled, be it emotional, physical, etc. A perfect being, having no incomplete portions of its being, would have no need or desires, including creation.

Just for curiosity's sake, how do you know "God is not a robot, He actually feels and desires things and creation is on many levels. God IS a Creator and a creator expresses what it feels, not only does God feel but God feels on a much greater level than any of us."? Did you speak to him directly? Do you guys pal around and chat about your feelings? I'm very interested to know the source of your knowledge.

Do you think God is perfect? If so, why?
debate_power
Posts: 726
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6/24/2015 4:17:10 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

Humans weren't intentionally created.
You can call me Mark if you like.
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
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6/24/2015 4:28:32 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 4:16:38 PM, janesix wrote:
At 6/24/2015 4:03:08 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 6/24/2015 3:38:22 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 6/24/2015 9:05:14 AM, dhardage wrote:
Why did the supposed perfect being do anything? Perfection implies no unfulfilled needs or wants, hence, no action needed to satisfy needs or wants. A perfect being existing alone outside of time and space would never seek to create anything since there is no motivation to do so. Q.E.D.

Then according to all the assertions you made God is not perfect lol.

Let us pretend that God is indeed "perfect" (whatever that means), why would a perfect Being not want to create unless you picture someone of a perfect nature to be void of having desires. If God having desires means He is imperfect then so be it, God is imperfect HOWEVER, it is my opinion that an eternal God would absolutely want to create.
Having desires does not strip God of perfection, I think it only makes Him more perfect I guess it depends upon ones perception. God is not a robot, He actually feels and desires things and creation is on many levels. God IS a Creator and a creator expresses what it feels, not only does God feel but God feels on a much greater level than any of us.

Perfection implies completeness, needing or wanting nothing. Desires imply a lack of some sort that needs to be filled, be it emotional, physical, etc. A perfect being, having no incomplete portions of its being, would have no need or desires, including creation.

Just for curiosity's sake, how do you know "God is not a robot, He actually feels and desires things and creation is on many levels. God IS a Creator and a creator expresses what it feels, not only does God feel but God feels on a much greater level than any of us."? Did you speak to him directly? Do you guys pal around and chat about your feelings? I'm very interested to know the source of your knowledge.

Do you think God is perfect? If so, why?

I don't believe the Abrahamic god exists at all. I was using the definition I most often get from Christians when I ask them to define 'God'. "All knowing, all powerful, most high", are among some of the terms used but 'perfect' is what usually pops out when I try to get a little more specific. That's why I don't see how such a being would ever be able or even think of creating a population of transient, imperfect beings such as we are and take any interest in their individual lives. It is incoherent nonsense.
dee-em
Posts: 6,456
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6/24/2015 7:16:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 2:07:51 PM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 6:07:49 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 3:52:55 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 2:48:56 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:23:02 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

You were created for a very special purpose, you are the eyes and mind of the universe.

Without someone to witness this incredible universe it would be a terrible shame.

We (homo sapiens) only appeared 500,000 years ago. Who was there to be the "eyes and mind" of the universe in the preceding 13,699,500,000 years?

We are here to admire God's handiwork? That's it?

I don't really care if there is a god or not.

It takes time to make brains and then more time to make them work right, that we all know for sure.

??? You think brains are made and then refined over time?

As far as your temperament perhaps you should speak to your doctor about adding Abilify to your existing treatment.

What makes you think that I'm psychotic? I don't recall having a previous conversation with you. All I did was point out a flaw in your suggestion that we are here to appreciate the universe because God wanted an audience for his work. You are free to show me where I am wrong. Instead you ad hom me. Sheesh, talk about grumpy.

I don't think you are psychotic, just maybe a little depressed.

On what basis have you made this clinical diagnosis, doctor?
Accipiter
Posts: 1,163
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6/24/2015 11:58:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 7:16:46 PM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 2:07:51 PM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 6:07:49 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 3:52:55 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 2:48:56 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:23:02 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

You were created for a very special purpose, you are the eyes and mind of the universe.

Without someone to witness this incredible universe it would be a terrible shame.

We (homo sapiens) only appeared 500,000 years ago. Who was there to be the "eyes and mind" of the universe in the preceding 13,699,500,000 years?

We are here to admire God's handiwork? That's it?

I don't really care if there is a god or not.

It takes time to make brains and then more time to make them work right, that we all know for sure.

??? You think brains are made and then refined over time?

As far as your temperament perhaps you should speak to your doctor about adding Abilify to your existing treatment.

What makes you think that I'm psychotic? I don't recall having a previous conversation with you. All I did was point out a flaw in your suggestion that we are here to appreciate the universe because God wanted an audience for his work. You are free to show me where I am wrong. Instead you ad hom me. Sheesh, talk about grumpy.

I don't think you are psychotic, just maybe a little depressed.

On what basis have you made this clinical diagnosis, doctor?

"We are here to admire God's handiwork? That's it?"

I would call that pessimistic at least, but I'm here for you now so just tell me everything.
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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6/25/2015 12:54:18 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
In my view, our minds are connected to, or an aspect of God's mind and he created us as a way to view himself from a different perspective. Basically, God has a more holistic view point of reality, however, by forming localized states of consciousness within himself (we would be these localized states) he can then view himself in a different way.
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
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6/25/2015 2:24:08 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 12:23:02 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?
You were created for a very special purpose, you are the eyes and mind of the universe.
Without someone to witness this incredible universe it would be a terrible shame.

Hm, so... how many humans suffice for this uncoordinated and unfocused task? Seven billion seems quite a lot, and to be honest, many don't seem to be seeing or thinking terribly well. :p Also, a lot of us are looking at the same popular TV shows. Shouldn't we diversifying a bit?

And we don't seem terribly fit for this in the first place... Poor senses... needlessly large bodies, dubiously-designed spines, eyes that can only see about 80 degrees ahead of us in any one direction, pointless body hair... And living on a planet where most things want to eat us.
Arasa
Posts: 380
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6/25/2015 6:02:08 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

Hello, Janesix.

I've received this question no less than twenty times in my life, and every time, I'm forced to give the answer that no scientist or theologian wants to give:

We simply don't know. We aren't given that information through scripture, and we cannot answer through philosophy. We do, however, know that God did not need to create us, but chose to through his own free will.

I wish I could be more helpful on the subject,

August Rasa, a 4:53 mind
Kreakin
Posts: 240
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6/25/2015 6:24:34 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Which God? Mbombo of Bakuba mythology, who vomited out the world upon feeling a stomach ache for example or one of the thousands of other created over human history?
Welfare-Worker
Posts: 1,171
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6/25/2015 6:56:46 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 9:05:14 AM, dhardage wrote:
Why did the supposed perfect being do anything? Perfection implies no unfulfilled needs or wants, hence, no action needed to satisfy needs or wants. A perfect being existing alone outside of time and space would never seek to create anything since there is no motivation to do so. Q.E.D.

So your suggestion is this 'perfect being' (your words) would do........nothing.
I need a spouse like that. One that wants me to be perfect, and do nothing.

We agree such a being as you imagine would not 'seek' anything.
It would all be right there, just as perfection would require.
Possibly without beginning, without end.
So we might assume, as things are, is perfection.
If I understood how things are with god, I would understand such things.
I am not one of the lucky few, such as yourself, who understands how things are with this god, that you are confident does not exist.

For myself, in perfection there is no motivation, we agree.
No needs, or wants, or doing. Only Being.
In just Being, all desires can be fulfilled, extinguished.
So we do seem to agree.

Outside time and space? It seems you know more about god than I do.
I have noticed that those who are confident something does not exist, often seem to know more about it than those who are confident it does exist.
Curious.

They would say - 'I only repeat what I hear from the believers.'
I would say - 'They only repeat what they choose, and ignore the remainder.'
I would say - 'Believers are not of one mind, so they must be choosing which believers they quote.'

~ ~

A special transmission outside the scriptures;
Depending not on words and letters;
Pointing directly to the human mind;
Seeing into one's nature, one becomes a Buddha.
dee-em
Posts: 6,456
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6/25/2015 8:30:15 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/24/2015 11:58:28 PM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 7:16:46 PM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 2:07:51 PM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 6:07:49 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 3:52:55 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 2:48:56 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:23:02 AM, Accipiter wrote:
At 6/24/2015 12:05:48 AM, janesix wrote:
Was God bored? For his amusement? To teach us something? For companionship?

You were created for a very special purpose, you are the eyes and mind of the universe.

Without someone to witness this incredible universe it would be a terrible shame.

We (homo sapiens) only appeared 500,000 years ago. Who was there to be the "eyes and mind" of the universe in the preceding 13,699,500,000 years?

We are here to admire God's handiwork? That's it?

I don't really care if there is a god or not.

It takes time to make brains and then more time to make them work right, that we all know for sure.

??? You think brains are made and then refined over time?

As far as your temperament perhaps you should speak to your doctor about adding Abilify to your existing treatment.

What makes you think that I'm psychotic? I don't recall having a previous conversation with you. All I did was point out a flaw in your suggestion that we are here to appreciate the universe because God wanted an audience for his work. You are free to show me where I am wrong. Instead you ad hom me. Sheesh, talk about grumpy.

I don't think you are psychotic, just maybe a little depressed.

On what basis have you made this clinical diagnosis, doctor?

"We are here to admire God's handiwork? That's it?"

I would call that pessimistic at least, but I'm here for you now so just tell me everything

I was asking a question, Accipiter. It seemed to me that this was rather a trivial and unworthy reason to bring a mortal species into existence, if there is a God. More so given that said God chooses not to reveal himself. Don't you agree?

I'm glad you are here for me. That gives me great comfort. That's a remarkable talent you have to diagnose clinical depression in someone from a single post on an internet forum. It's a rare talent and one you shouldn't waste. Not only that but you could prescribe a specific drug based on your snap diagnosis. Amazing. I had to look it up, never having heard the name before. So, yes, if you are not a doctor you have definitely missed your calling.

Excuse me now whilst I go and make some plans for slitting my wrists ...
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
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6/25/2015 9:25:30 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/25/2015 6:56:46 AM, Welfare-Worker wrote:
At 6/24/2015 9:05:14 AM, dhardage wrote:
Why did the supposed perfect being do anything? Perfection implies no unfulfilled needs or wants, hence, no action needed to satisfy needs or wants. A perfect being existing alone outside of time and space would never seek to create anything since there is no motivation to do so. Q.E.D.

So your suggestion is this 'perfect being' (your words) would do........nothing.
I need a spouse like that. One that wants me to be perfect, and do nothing.

We agree such a being as you imagine would not 'seek' anything.
It would all be right there, just as perfection would require.
Possibly without beginning, without end.
So we might assume, as things are, is perfection.
If I understood how things are with god, I would understand such things.
I am not one of the lucky few, such as yourself, who understands how things are with this god, that you are confident does not exist.

For myself, in perfection there is no motivation, we agree.
No needs, or wants, or doing. Only Being.
In just Being, all desires can be fulfilled, extinguished.
So we do seem to agree.

Outside time and space? It seems you know more about god than I do.
I have noticed that those who are confident something does not exist, often seem to know more about it than those who are confident it does exist.
Curious.

No eternal being could exist in time as we know it since time as we know it did not exist until the instant after the badly misnamed Big Bang. Thus, time had a beginning and is not eternal by the definition of the word. Will time end? Unknown at this time since we are still watching the expansion occur and it seems to be speeding up.

They would say - 'I only repeat what I hear from the believers.'
I would say - 'They only repeat what they choose, and ignore the remainder.'
I would say - 'Believers are not of one mind, so they must be choosing which believers they quote.'


Find any believer who will describe their chosen god as less than perfect?
~ ~

A special transmission outside the scriptures;
Depending not on words and letters;
Pointing directly to the human mind;
Seeing into one's nature, one becomes a Buddha.

When the mind finds stillness, silence truly roars.
Welfare-Worker
Posts: 1,171
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6/25/2015 10:15:16 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/25/2015 9:25:30 AM, dhardage wrote:
At 6/25/2015 6:56:46 AM, Welfare-Worker wrote:
At 6/24/2015 9:05:14 AM, dhardage wrote:
Why did the supposed perfect being do anything? Perfection implies no unfulfilled needs or wants, hence, no action needed to satisfy needs or wants. A perfect being existing alone outside of time and space would never seek to create anything since there is no motivation to do so. Q.E.D.

So your suggestion is this 'perfect being' (your words) would do........nothing.
I need a spouse like that. One that wants me to be perfect, and do nothing.

We agree such a being as you imagine would not 'seek' anything.
It would all be right there, just as perfection would require.
Possibly without beginning, without end.
So we might assume, as things are, is perfection.
If I understood how things are with god, I would understand such things.
I am not one of the lucky few, such as yourself, who understands how things are with this god, that you are confident does not exist.

For myself, in perfection there is no motivation, we agree.
No needs, or wants, or doing. Only Being.
In just Being, all desires can be fulfilled, extinguished.
So we do seem to agree.

Outside time and space? It seems you know more about god than I do.
I have noticed that those who are confident something does not exist, often seem to know more about it than those who are confident it does exist.
Curious.

No eternal being could exist in time as we know it since time as we know it did not exist until the instant after the badly misnamed Big Bang. Thus, time had a beginning and is not eternal by the definition of the word. Will time end? Unknown at this time since we are still watching the expansion occur and it seems to be speeding up.

Time as we know it?
Yes, we could say time as we know it, is not eternal. I was not thinking of time
being constrained by our knowledge of it.

I would say if you or others say there was no time before a certain point, you are making assumptions without evidence.
Do you have evidence?
If you assume the clock starts somewhere, that is a good place.

What changes if we say time did not start there?

When I say it might be that time is eternal, I have no empirical evidence.


They would say - 'I only repeat what I hear from the believers.'
I would say - 'They only repeat what they choose, and ignore the remainder.'
I would say - 'Believers are not of one mind, so they must be choosing which believers they quote.'


Find any believer who will describe their chosen god as less than perfect?

You are assuming they all agree on the characteristics of a perfect god.
From my experience, they do not.
~ ~

A special transmission outside the scriptures;
Depending not on words and letters;
Pointing directly to the human mind;
Seeing into one's nature, one becomes a Buddha.

When the mind finds stillness, silence truly roars.
dhardage
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6/25/2015 11:25:04 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 6/25/2015 10:15:16 AM, Welfare-Worker wrote:
At 6/25/2015 9:25:30 AM, dhardage wrote:
At 6/25/2015 6:56:46 AM, Welfare-Worker wrote:
At 6/24/2015 9:05:14 AM, dhardage wrote:
Why did the supposed perfect being do anything? Perfection implies no unfulfilled needs or wants, hence, no action needed to satisfy needs or wants. A perfect being existing alone outside of time and space would never seek to create anything since there is no motivation to do so. Q.E.D.

So your suggestion is this 'perfect being' (your words) would do........nothing.
I need a spouse like that. One that wants me to be perfect, and do nothing.

We agree such a being as you imagine would not 'seek' anything.
It would all be right there, just as perfection would require.
Possibly without beginning, without end.
So we might assume, as things are, is perfection.
If I understood how things are with god, I would understand such things.
I am not one of the lucky few, such as yourself, who understands how things are with this god, that you are confident does not exist.

For myself, in perfection there is no motivation, we agree.
No needs, or wants, or doing. Only Being.
In just Being, all desires can be fulfilled, extinguished.
So we do seem to agree.

Outside time and space? It seems you know more about god than I do.
I have noticed that those who are confident something does not exist, often seem to know more about it than those who are confident it does exist.
Curious.

No eternal being could exist in time as we know it since time as we know it did not exist until the instant after the badly misnamed Big Bang. Thus, time had a beginning and is not eternal by the definition of the word. Will time end? Unknown at this time since we are still watching the expansion occur and it seems to be speeding up.

Time as we know it?
Yes, we could say time as we know it, is not eternal. I was not thinking of time
being constrained by our knowledge of it.

Our knowledge of time is fairly extensive, demonstrated by the fact that we used time differentials due to gravity warping spacetime to produce GPS coordinates within a few feet from satellites hundreds of miles up in orbit.

I would say if you or others say there was no time before a certain point, you are making assumptions without evidence.
Do you have evidence?

Yep, it's called universal expansion. We've rewound the universe to a few microseconds before it came into existence. We don't know why it happened but we're quite certain that it did. Study a bit of current cosmology, astrophysics, etc. and you'll see that it's quite well established.
If you assume the clock starts somewhere, that is a good place.

What changes if we say time did not start there?

Our standard model of the universe.

When I say it might be that time is eternal, I have no empirical evidence.


They would say - 'I only repeat what I hear from the believers.'
I would say - 'They only repeat what they choose, and ignore the remainder.'
I would say - 'Believers are not of one mind, so they must be choosing which believers they quote.'


Find any believer who will describe their chosen god as less than perfect?

You are assuming they all agree on the characteristics of a perfect god.
From my experience, they do not.
~ ~

Perfect: Adjective
1. conforming absolutely to the description or definition of an ideal type:
a perfect sphere; a perfect gentleman.

2. excellent or complete beyond practical or theoretical improvement:
There is no perfect legal code. The proportions of this temple are almost perfect.

3. exactly fitting the need in a certain situation or for a certain purpose:
a perfect actor to play Mr. Micawber; a perfect saw for cutting out keyholes.

4. entirely without any flaws, defects, or shortcomings:
a perfect apple; the perfect crime.

5. accurate, exact, or correct in every detail:
a perfect copy.

Pick one.

A special transmission outside the scriptures;
Depending not on words and letters;
Pointing directly to the human mind;
Seeing into one's nature, one becomes a Buddha.

When the mind finds stillness, silence truly roars.