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This is why religious debates never turn well

Leugen9001
Posts: 495
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7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!
:) nac
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,622
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7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Leugen9001
Posts: 495
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7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

XKCD style alt-text: Or we could ask Hitler to tell us which religion he believes in. That would work too.
:) nac
Saint_of_Me
Posts: 2,402
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7/6/2015 8:51:40 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

Your statement regarding this man's religious preference, as well as his personal reasons for harboring them, is a non-sequitur. And off-topic. As he was asking about the nature of Theological Debate.

Therefore, you engaging in this juvenile and trouble-seeking tactic is no better than the trolling you and De-Eminem accuse BOHICA of when he strays on to the Science Forum.

Tell me how it is different?

Go troll elsewhere.

New Sheriff, baby.
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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7/6/2015 8:57:14 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

So you have decided to stick around on a debate site to debate why we should stop debating?

If you don't see the value of debating then by all means, go somewhere else. Other's like myself see a tremendous benefit in having our views challenged and learning and practicing critical thinking.
Saint_of_Me
Posts: 2,402
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7/6/2015 8:58:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

Hmm.I see what you are trying to say here, but I have to disagree that an argument is inherently flawed just because somebody can see both sides of it. Or play Devil's Advocate. Take the argument for, say, Abortion. I am pro-choice but I can certainly see the Pro-Lifers' argument. (Well, maybe a little! LOL)

Is that whole argument flawed? I think not? Not the argument itself, mind you. But a person's response or logic that is used in the argument can be flawed, to be sure.

Religion is always going to be a hot-button issue. This is because it is a crucial subject which affects many many lives. Global impact, even. I do not think this means we should cease arguing it. Rather, it deserves such passionate debate.

And, you DID use several example arguments in your OP that were flawed. But I know you did this on purpose. And sure, I have actually heard some of those silly points trying to be made.

I will close by saying that, for whatever the reason, I have found from my experience that it is usually the religious apologist that angers quicker than the Atheist or Agnostic in Theological debates. By far.
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
Leugen9001
Posts: 495
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7/6/2015 9:04:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:58:07 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

Hmm.I see what you are trying to say here, but I have to disagree that an argument is inherently flawed just because somebody can see both sides of it. Or play Devil's Advocate. Take the argument for, say, Abortion. I am pro-choice but I can certainly see the Pro-Lifers' argument. (Well, maybe a little! LOL)

Is that whole argument flawed? I think not? Not the argument itself, mind you. But a person's response or logic that is used in the argument can be flawed, to be sure.

Religion is always going to be a hot-button issue. This is because it is a crucial subject which affects many many lives. Global impact, even. I do not think this means we should cease arguing it. Rather, it deserves such passionate debate.

And, you DID use several example arguments in your OP that were flawed. But I know you did this on purpose. And sure, I have actually heard some of those silly points trying to be made.

I will close by saying that, for whatever the reason, I have found from my experience that it is usually the religious apologist that angers quicker than the Atheist or Agnostic in Theological debates. By far.

I'll try to argue for the contention that when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is flawed.

Let's say that person A and person B are debating about whether X or Y is true. The truthfulness of X and Y are mutually exclusive. They share the burden of proof.

A makes argument N to support X. B points out that N can also support Y. This is a fatal blow on X, since X cannot be just as true as Y. Therefore, N is critically flawed.
:) nac
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,622
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7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?

XKCD style alt-text: Or we could ask Hitler to tell us which religion he believes in. That would work too.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Sharku
Posts: 96
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7/6/2015 9:15:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Religion is one of those things that no one is going to change their mind on. No amount of logic and reason from either side is going to sway my personal belief system. There is no one right answer or yard stick to measure it up against. You just have to sort of do what works best for you and your lifestyle.

The problem is that most people want to make their belief system a one size fits all, which never works out, because what works for one doesn't work for another.
Saint_of_Me
Posts: 2,402
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7/6/2015 9:15:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 9:04:35 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:58:07 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

Hmm.I see what you are trying to say here, but I have to disagree that an argument is inherently flawed just because somebody can see both sides of it. Or play Devil's Advocate. Take the argument for, say, Abortion. I am pro-choice but I can certainly see the Pro-Lifers' argument. (Well, maybe a little! LOL)

Is that whole argument flawed? I think not? Not the argument itself, mind you. But a person's response or logic that is used in the argument can be flawed, to be sure.

Religion is always going to be a hot-button issue. This is because it is a crucial subject which affects many many lives. Global impact, even. I do not think this means we should cease arguing it. Rather, it deserves such passionate debate.

And, you DID use several example arguments in your OP that were flawed. But I know you did this on purpose. And sure, I have actually heard some of those silly points trying to be made.

I will close by saying that, for whatever the reason, I have found from my experience that it is usually the religious apologist that angers quicker than the Atheist or Agnostic in Theological debates. By far.

I'll try to argue for the contention that when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is flawed.

Let's say that person A and person B are debating about whether X or Y is true. The truthfulness of X and Y are mutually exclusive. They share the burden of proof.

A makes argument N to support X. B points out that N can also support Y. This is a fatal blow on X, since X cannot be just as true as Y. Therefore, N is critically flawed.

The truth of X & Y DO NOT have to be mutually exlcusive. This is where YOUR logic is flawed. I tried to explain that to you in my OP. As with the Abortion example.

Are you familiar with "Nash Equilibrium?" If not. check it out. Or "Game Theory."

It also applies to matters of debate and rhetoric.
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
B0HICA
Posts: 366
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7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?

If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?
Najs
Posts: 113
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7/7/2015 12:14:40 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

I was entertained, especially when you introduced Hitler into the conversation.
Najs
Posts: 113
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7/7/2015 12:18:55 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:57:14 PM, Double_R wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

So you have decided to stick around on a debate site to debate why we should stop debating?


lol, I questioned the same.

If you don't see the value of debating then by all means, go somewhere else. Other's like myself see a tremendous benefit in having our views challenged and learning and practicing critical thinking.
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,223
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7/7/2015 1:14:45 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

Do you have any reasonable argument beyond religion in which to enforce that from? By which I mean immediate edict, not whatever problems gays and lesbians might face some how being a reason to "closet" them.
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
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7/7/2015 1:21:00 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

I think it depends on how it's used, Leugen.

A good debate is a contest of critically-accountable arguments. If both arguments are flawed, then the same criticism might apply legitimately to each in different ways. A simple example might be spotting the same statistical errors in each argument.

The real problem is when arguments are used to evade accountability, create straw-men of failed accountability, or present false accountability.

The reason this occurs so often in religious debates is that religious claims to theological authority are usually problematic with respect to evidence.

Either a theological claim to authority is based on empirical evidence (which is independently testable, and frequently debunked), or it is based on revelation, which typically claims authority for everything, yet evades accountability for anything.

Evading accountability ruins good debate, and in order to advance a position, certain kinds of theologists will blow smoke to hide their evasions, while straw-manning to make the other party look even more evasive.

This is why it's often more constructive to dismiss claims of theological authority outright than explore them. Bad-faith debating shouldn't be indulged.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,622
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7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Fatihah
Posts: 7,740
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7/7/2015 6:22:48 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

Response: Unfortunately, the flaws and contradicting logic is found in atheists/agnostics arguments:

Hypothesis: A repeating pattern can only originate from choice.

Test subject: You.

Experiment: Draw a simple checkerboard pattern without choosing to do so (Non-choice).

Conclusion: You failed.

Thus you have firsthand evidence that a repeating pattern cannot originate from non-choice, but choice. As such the repeating patterns in the universe and life itself originated from choice, proving God's existence.

Common atheist/agnostic rebuttal:

Atheists/Agnostics say: We do have evidence of non-choice creating repeating patterns. Crystals, snowflakes, etc..

Response: If stating that non-choice can produce a repeating pattern because you have examples such as crystals, snowflakes, etc., then stating that non-choice CANNOT produce a repeating pattern is also true because we have an example of it not working (your own failure to draw a simple checkerboard without choice). As such, the argument for non-choice fails since it contradicts. Leaving the option of choice as the answer. Therefore, the repeating patterns in the universe and life itself proves originates from choice, proving God exist.

Another Common atheist/agnostics rebuttal:

Clearly, no choice was involved because you did not see a choice being made

Response:

You claim that your proof that non-choice created the pattern is because you did not see choice. Yet if you found an IPhone in the sand or on the street, and we ask was this IPhone created by choice or without choice, you would all say "someone chose to make it, despite not seeing choice. A blatant contradiction. Showing once again that non-choice is false since it is based on a contradiction, leaving choice as the option and proving God exist.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,007
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7/7/2015 8:05:49 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Religious debates never turn out well because religion is based on faith and not logic, empirical data or verifiable by the methods of science. We should debate the influence of religion on our sociopolitical and economic systems rather than religion itself because theological questions cannot be answered and are generally speculative.
When tbe pope was asked a theological question. Will gays go to heaven? The pope the head of a billion plus Catholics could only say. "Who am I to judge them if they're seeking the Lord in good faith?"
The bible is not a book of science or engineering or medicine or mathematics or social evolution. It is a book on the higher aspirations of man guided by a supreme being. It is a belief in things unseen and an expectation of things yet to come. Why such a worldview is accompanied by euphoric delusions is a condition that requires diagnosis and serious consideration which is outside the scope of this discussion.
B0HICA
Posts: 366
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7/7/2015 10:03:30 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.

Have you ever read the Bible? Show me where the Bible teaches people to hate anyone? Are you one of those people who think anyone who disagrees with them are haters?
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,622
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7/7/2015 10:05:40 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 6:22:48 AM, Fatihah wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

Response: Unfortunately, the flaws and contradicting logic is found in atheists/agnostics arguments:

Hypothesis: A repeating pattern can only originate from choice.

Test subject: You.

Experiment: Draw a simple checkerboard pattern without choosing to do so (Non-choice).

Conclusion: You failed.

Thus you have firsthand evidence that a repeating pattern cannot originate from non-choice, but choice. As such the repeating patterns in the universe and life itself originated from choice, proving God's existence.

Strawman: A logic fallacy involving the purposeful misrepresentation of an argument in order to strike it down.

Common atheist/agnostic rebuttal:

Atheists/Agnostics say: We do have evidence of non-choice creating repeating patterns. Crystals, snowflakes, etc..

Response: If stating that non-choice can produce a repeating pattern because you have examples such as crystals, snowflakes, etc., then stating that non-choice CANNOT produce a repeating pattern is also true because we have an example of it not working (your own failure to draw a simple checkerboard without choice). As such, the argument for non-choice fails since it contradicts. Leaving the option of choice as the answer. Therefore, the repeating patterns in the universe and life itself proves originates from choice, proving God exist.

Another Common atheist/agnostics rebuttal:

Clearly, no choice was involved because you did not see a choice being made

Response:

You claim that your proof that non-choice created the pattern is because you did not see choice. Yet if you found an IPhone in the sand or on the street, and we ask was this IPhone created by choice or without choice, you would all say "someone chose to make it, despite not seeing choice. A blatant contradiction. Showing once again that non-choice is false since it is based on a contradiction, leaving choice as the option and proving God exist.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,622
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7/7/2015 10:10:20 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 10:03:30 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.

Have you ever read the Bible? Show me where the Bible teaches people to hate anyone? Are you one of those people who think anyone who disagrees with them are haters?

We've already been through this countless times, you're not disagreeing for any valid reasons, you're disagreeing because the Bible teaches you to hate homosexuals. The only folks who hate homosexuals are bible thumpers like you.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
B0HICA
Posts: 366
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7/7/2015 10:18:48 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 10:10:20 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:03:30 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.

Have you ever read the Bible? Show me where the Bible teaches people to hate anyone? Are you one of those people who think anyone who disagrees with them are haters?

We've already been through this countless times, you're not disagreeing for any valid reasons, you're disagreeing because the Bible teaches you to hate homosexuals. The only folks who hate homosexuals are bible thumpers like you.

Like I just said. You think anyone who disagrees is a hater. And your use of the term Bible thumpers is quite telling. Could it be that you hate Christians? Have you ever met a real Christian? There aren't that many of them. Anyone can claim to be a Christian. Christians are those who follow Christ. If you see someone acting in ways that are not taught in Scripture, then they probably not Christians. Being a Christian involves more than just accepting a label. It is a supernatural transformation that occurs when one repents and accepts Jesus as their personal Lord and Savior. I'll be the first to admit that Christians are far from perfect. They have the same passions and faults as anyone else. But they are not haters. That is not what the Bible teaches.
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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7/7/2015 10:32:15 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 10:18:48 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:10:20 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:03:30 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.

Have you ever read the Bible? Show me where the Bible teaches people to hate anyone? Are you one of those people who think anyone who disagrees with them are haters?

We've already been through this countless times, you're not disagreeing for any valid reasons, you're disagreeing because the Bible teaches you to hate homosexuals. The only folks who hate homosexuals are bible thumpers like you.

Like I just said. You think anyone who disagrees is a hater. And your use of the term Bible thumpers is quite telling. Could it be that you hate Christians? Have you ever met a real Christian? There aren't that many of them. Anyone can claim to be a Christian. Christians are those who follow Christ. If you see someone acting in ways that are not taught in Scripture, then they probably not Christians. Being a Christian involves more than just accepting a label. It is a supernatural transformation that occurs when one repents and accepts Jesus as their personal Lord and Savior. I'll be the first to admit that Christians are far from perfect. They have the same passions and faults as anyone else. But they are not haters. That is not what the Bible teaches.

And what is a real Christian? YOU? LOL!
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,622
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7/7/2015 10:35:15 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 10:18:48 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:10:20 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:03:30 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.

Have you ever read the Bible? Show me where the Bible teaches people to hate anyone? Are you one of those people who think anyone who disagrees with them are haters?

We've already been through this countless times, you're not disagreeing for any valid reasons, you're disagreeing because the Bible teaches you to hate homosexuals. The only folks who hate homosexuals are bible thumpers like you.

Like I just said. You think anyone who disagrees is a hater.

Your reading comprehension skills are abysmal.

And your use of the term Bible thumpers is quite telling. Could it be that you hate Christians?

The Bible is the problem. Do you understand that?

Have you ever met a real Christian?

Yes, many.

There aren't that many of them.

And, you certainly are not one of them.

Anyone can claim to be a Christian. Christians are those who follow Christ.

You do not follow Christ, you follow the hatred of the Bible.

If you see someone acting in ways that are not taught in Scripture, then they probably not Christians.

No, when I see people following the hatred of Scriptures, then they are probably not Christians.

Being a Christian involves more than just accepting a label. It is a supernatural transformation that occurs when one repents and accepts Jesus as their personal Lord and Savior. I'll be the first to admit that Christians are far from perfect. They have the same passions and faults as anyone else. But they are not haters. That is not what the Bible teaches.

Yes, the Bible teaches to hate, Jesus teaches to love everyone, no matter what. That isn't you based on your words above.

You are no Christian.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Harikrish
Posts: 11,007
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7/7/2015 11:09:17 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 10:03:30 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.

Have you ever read the Bible? Show me where the Bible teaches people to hate anyone? Are you one of those people who think anyone who disagrees with them are haters?

Have you read the bible?

God commands His believers to Murder in the Bible
http://www.evilbible.com...

Jesus teaches hate and the destruction of the family as his stated mission.

Matthew 10:35 For I have come to turn " 'a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law--
36 a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.'
37 "Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me;
B0HICA
Posts: 366
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7/7/2015 11:33:31 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 10:35:15 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:18:48 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:10:20 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:03:30 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.

Have you ever read the Bible? Show me where the Bible teaches people to hate anyone? Are you one of those people who think anyone who disagrees with them are haters?

We've already been through this countless times, you're not disagreeing for any valid reasons, you're disagreeing because the Bible teaches you to hate homosexuals. The only folks who hate homosexuals are bible thumpers like you.

Like I just said. You think anyone who disagrees is a hater.

Your reading comprehension skills are abysmal.

And your use of the term Bible thumpers is quite telling. Could it be that you hate Christians?

The Bible is the problem. Do you understand that?

Have you ever met a real Christian?

Yes, many.

There aren't that many of them.

And, you certainly are not one of them.

Anyone can claim to be a Christian. Christians are those who follow Christ.

You do not follow Christ, you follow the hatred of the Bible.

If you see someone acting in ways that are not taught in Scripture, then they probably not Christians.

No, when I see people following the hatred of Scriptures, then they are probably not Christians.

Being a Christian involves more than just accepting a label. It is a supernatural transformation that occurs when one repents and accepts Jesus as their personal Lord and Savior. I'll be the first to admit that Christians are far from perfect. They have the same passions and faults as anyone else. But they are not haters. That is not what the Bible teaches.

Yes, the Bible teaches to hate, Jesus teaches to love everyone, no matter what. That isn't you based on your words above.

You are no Christian.

Not even worth replying to. If you can't figure out why, then you are hopeless.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,622
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7/7/2015 11:36:01 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 11:33:31 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:35:15 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:18:48 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:10:20 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:03:30 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.

Have you ever read the Bible? Show me where the Bible teaches people to hate anyone? Are you one of those people who think anyone who disagrees with them are haters?

We've already been through this countless times, you're not disagreeing for any valid reasons, you're disagreeing because the Bible teaches you to hate homosexuals. The only folks who hate homosexuals are bible thumpers like you.

Like I just said. You think anyone who disagrees is a hater.

Your reading comprehension skills are abysmal.

And your use of the term Bible thumpers is quite telling. Could it be that you hate Christians?

The Bible is the problem. Do you understand that?

Have you ever met a real Christian?

Yes, many.

There aren't that many of them.

And, you certainly are not one of them.

Anyone can claim to be a Christian. Christians are those who follow Christ.

You do not follow Christ, you follow the hatred of the Bible.

If you see someone acting in ways that are not taught in Scripture, then they probably not Christians.

No, when I see people following the hatred of Scriptures, then they are probably not Christians.

Being a Christian involves more than just accepting a label. It is a supernatural transformation that occurs when one repents and accepts Jesus as their personal Lord and Savior. I'll be the first to admit that Christians are far from perfect. They have the same passions and faults as anyone else. But they are not haters. That is not what the Bible teaches.

Yes, the Bible teaches to hate, Jesus teaches to love everyone, no matter what. That isn't you based on your words above.

You are no Christian.

Not even worth replying to. If you can't figure out why, then you are hopeless.

It's easy to figure out, it's true, that's why you're incapable of responding, you know it's true. You know you're not a Christian, if you were, you wouldn't be here spreading so much hatred.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
B0HICA
Posts: 366
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7/7/2015 11:37:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 11:09:17 AM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:03:30 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.

Have you ever read the Bible? Show me where the Bible teaches people to hate anyone? Are you one of those people who think anyone who disagrees with them are haters?

Have you read the bible?

God commands His believers to Murder in the Bible
http://www.evilbible.com...


Jesus teaches hate and the destruction of the family as his stated mission.


Matthew 10:35 For I have come to turn " 'a man against his father, a daughter against her mother, a daughter-in-law against her mother-in-law--
36 a man's enemies will be the members of his own household.'
37 "Anyone who loves his father or mother more than me is not worthy of me; anyone who loves his son or daughter more than me is not worthy of me;

Your ignorance is appalling. And you used evil Bible as a source? LOL! Isn't it people like you who are always going on about how some people use answersingenesis.com, and similar sites? It is to laugh. Ha ha hee hee ha ha!
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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7/7/2015 11:40:51 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
So called 'Christians' like BOHICA are so unpleasant they bring the faith into disrepute. If he had been around when Jesus was alive, I reckon he wouldn't have wanted BOHICA in his gang!
B0HICA
Posts: 366
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7/7/2015 11:45:48 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/7/2015 11:36:01 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 11:33:31 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:35:15 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:18:48 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:10:20 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/7/2015 10:03:30 AM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/7/2015 5:38:53 AM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:19:47 PM, B0HICA wrote:
At 7/6/2015 9:09:21 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:50:43 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:46:13 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 7/6/2015 8:44:01 PM, Leugen9001 wrote:
Usually when an argument can be used by both sides of a debate, said argument is critically flawed.

And most arguments in religious debates are such arguments.

And now you know why religious debates always end up in firestorms consisting of logical fallacies.

Yes, just like the Argument from Incredulity you used in another thread to explain why you became a Christian.

Atheist: [Quotes part of the bible out of context] The Bible is full of contradictions!
Christian: [Quote mines Origins of Species] Darwin admitted that his theory was false!

Atheist: Trinitarianism is really just polytheism in disguise!
Christian: Punctuated equilibrium is really just saltationism in disguise!

Christian: You Muslims can't agree on the canon of your scripture!
Muslim: You Christians can't agree on the canon of your scripture!

Atheist: The shroud of turin was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence (e.g. eclipse on passover being recorded) for Christianity are also false!
Christian: The piltdown man was a hoax, so all the other pieces of evidence for atheism are also false!

Christians: You atheists can't agree on punctuated equilibrium!
Atheists: You Christians can't agree on the milliena!

Christian: The WBC and abortion clinic bombers are unchristian!
Muslim: ISIS is unislamic!

Christian: Hitler was an atheist, because he prosecuted Christians!
Atheist: Hitler was a Christian, because he was raised Catholic!
Christian: Atheist!
Atheist: Christian!
Hitler: Actually, I believe in...
Atheist and Christian: Why is Hitler here? GAH! Everyone run!

My point is that we should stop debating about religion and just make it a personal decision, since most discussions about it inevitably end in firestorms. Eventually, everyone should go "hey, this is enough evidence for Christianity/Hinduism/Atheism/FSM, I guess I should decide to believe in it, since we cannot conclusively prove any of them and choosing to believe in any of them is a personal decision" and call it a day.

You know something, I would totally agree with you and would never say another word about religion, under one condition, that is always remains behind closed doors where it belongs, NEVER in the public eye under any circumstances. Deal?


If only gays/lesbians would do the same thing. If they went back in the closet, they could live their lives in private, instead of flaunting their perverted lifestyle. Which is what's causing the controversy in the first place. If someone wants to be gay, fine. Just as long as they keep it to themselves. Deal?

The controversy is here is caused by the hatred from religion, which is why it should be kept behind closed doors. Your religion teaches you to hate them. Their gayness is not teaching them to hate you.

Have you ever read the Bible? Show me where the Bible teaches people to hate anyone? Are you one of those people who think anyone who disagrees with them are haters?

We've already been through this countless times, you're not disagreeing for any valid reasons, you're disagreeing because the Bible teaches you to hate homosexuals. The only folks who hate homosexuals are bible thumpers like you.

Like I just said. You think anyone who disagrees is a hater.

Your reading comprehension skills are abysmal.

And your use of the term Bible thumpers is quite telling. Could it be that you hate Christians?

The Bible is the problem. Do you understand that?

Have you ever met a real Christian?

Yes, many.

There aren't that many of them.

And, you certainly are not one of them.

Anyone can claim to be a Christian. Christians are those who follow Christ.

You do not follow Christ, you follow the hatred of the Bible.

If you see someone acting in ways that are not taught in Scripture, then they probably not Christians.

No, when I see people following the hatred of Scriptures, then they are probably not Christians.

Being a Christian involves more than just accepting a label. It is a supernatural transformation that occurs when one repents and accepts Jesus as their personal Lord and Savior. I'll be the first to admit that Christians are far from perfect. They have the same passions and faults as anyone else. But they are not haters. That is not what the Bible teaches.

Yes, the Bible teaches to hate, Jesus teaches to love everyone, no matter what. That isn't you based on your words above.

You are no Christian.

Not even worth replying to. If you can't figure out why, then you are hopeless.

It's easy to figure out, it's true, that's why you're incapable of responding, you know it's true. You know you're not a Christian, if you were, you wouldn't be here spreading so much hatred.

Disagreeing with someone is not hatred. When have I ever said something hateful to someone, who didn't deserve it? And even if I did, I already admitted that I'm not perfect. I sometimes say things I shouldn't. That's what apologies are for. And I've apologized to people, on this site and others, when I've wronged them.