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jesus christ will not return?

icetiger200
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7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
Jesus christ will not be returning and the bible proves it.

"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."

"Jesus was talking to his disciples and referring to the people that were standing there 2000 years ago that they were the ones that would see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. You can say I'm taking out of context or misinterpreting all you want but my little 8 year old could read that and say the same thing...lol and since that is the case we know Jesus never came back 2000 years ago... lol. But please correct me if I'm wrong.
dee-em
Posts: 6,444
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7/15/2015 9:19:52 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
Jesus christ will not be returning and the bible proves it.


"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."


"Jesus was talking to his disciples and referring to the people that were standing there 2000 years ago that they were the ones that would see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. You can say I'm taking out of context or misinterpreting all you want but my little 8 year old could read that and say the same thing...lol and since that is the case we know Jesus never came back 2000 years ago... lol. But please correct me if I'm wrong.

Don't be naive, Ice. Words don't mean what you think unless you've done years of biblical study, dontyaknow. All those people had visions of Jesus coming in his kingdom before they died, dontyaknow. Or they didn't really die since everyone is resurrected anyway. Or Jesus was speaking in code and we just can't understand his secret message. Or something. Don't worry, I'll get better at this apologetics stuff if I practice more. Lol.
12_13
Posts: 1,361
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7/15/2015 10:24:26 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."

Please, read the whole Bible, not just parts that suits for angry atheists.

After six days, Jesus took with him Peter, James, and John his brother, and brought them up into a high mountain by themselves. He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his garments became as white as the light. Behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them talking with him.

Matt. 17:1-3

Peter, James, and John his brother saw Jesus as coming in his Kingdom after 6 days.
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,090
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7/15/2015 10:32:08 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 10:24:26 AM, 12_13 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."

Please, read the whole Bible, not just parts that suits for angry atheists.

After six days, Jesus took with him Peter, James, and John his brother, and brought them up into a high mountain by themselves. He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his garments became as white as the light. Behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them talking with him.

Matt. 17:1-3

Peter, James, and John his brother saw Jesus as coming in his Kingdom after 6 days.

So we're not waiting for the second coming, but rather the third? You guys really should stop calling it the "second coming" in that case.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

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What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
icetiger200
Posts: 33
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7/15/2015 11:25:27 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 10:24:26 AM, 12_13 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."

Please, read the whole Bible, not just parts that suits for angry atheists.

After six days, Jesus took with him Peter, James, and John his brother, and brought them up into a high mountain by themselves. He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his garments became as white as the light. Behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them talking with him.

Matt. 17:1-3

Peter, James, and John his brother saw Jesus as coming in his Kingdom after 6 days.

"Funny thing is that I believe you need to reread the bible... Because there is no way that what Jesus was referring to the "coming of the son of man" in chapter 16 was fulfilled in chapter 17! Why? Because he yet again says later in chapter 24 that the coming of the son of man is yet to happen!"

Mathew 16
28 "Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before THEY SEE THE SON OF MAN COMING IN HIS KINGDOM."

"So this is very clear the Son of Man was to come 2000 years ago before those people he was speaking to would die! Now Matthew 24 WHICH IS AFTER THE EVENTS IN MATTHEW 17 JESUS CLEARLY SAYS THAT THE COMING OF THE SON OF MAN IS YET TO HAPPEN!"
"As I have clearly pointed out before! So you need to reread what I put forth because your theory does not work!"

Matthew 24
36 "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son,[f] but only the Father. 37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. THAT IS HOW IT WILL BE WITH THE COMING OF THE SON OF MAN"

" "So obviously the "coming of the son of man" has clearly NOT HAPPENED YET!"A279;
graceofgod
Posts: 5,037
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7/15/2015 12:29:33 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 11:25:27 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 10:24:26 AM, 12_13 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."

Please, read the whole Bible, not just parts that suits for angry atheists.

After six days, Jesus took with him Peter, James, and John his brother, and brought them up into a high mountain by themselves. He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his garments became as white as the light. Behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them talking with him.

Matt. 17:1-3

Peter, James, and John his brother saw Jesus as coming in his Kingdom after 6 days.





"Funny thing is that I believe you need to reread the bible... Because there is no way that what Jesus was referring to the "coming of the son of man" in chapter 16 was fulfilled in chapter 17! Why? Because he yet again says later in chapter 24 that the coming of the son of man is yet to happen!"


Mathew 16
28 "Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before THEY SEE THE SON OF MAN COMING IN HIS KINGDOM."



"So this is very clear the Son of Man was to come 2000 years ago before those people he was speaking to would die! Now Matthew 24 WHICH IS AFTER THE EVENTS IN MATTHEW 17 JESUS CLEARLY SAYS THAT THE COMING OF THE SON OF MAN IS YET TO HAPPEN!"
"As I have clearly pointed out before! So you need to reread what I put forth because your theory does not work!"

Matthew 24
36 "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son,[f] but only the Father. 37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. THAT IS HOW IT WILL BE WITH THE COMING OF THE SON OF MAN"



" "So obviously the "coming of the son of man" has clearly NOT HAPPENED YET!"A279;

i thought the JW's believed Jesus returned invisibly in 1918, I guess you didn't believe that bit either.... or the other dates they came up with for the return of Jesus...
Geogeer
Posts: 4,227
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7/15/2015 12:31:12 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 11:25:27 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 10:24:26 AM, 12_13 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."

Please, read the whole Bible, not just parts that suits for angry atheists.

After six days, Jesus took with him Peter, James, and John his brother, and brought them up into a high mountain by themselves. He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his garments became as white as the light. Behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them talking with him.

Matt. 17:1-3

Peter, James, and John his brother saw Jesus as coming in his Kingdom after 6 days.





"Funny thing is that I believe you need to reread the bible... Because there is no way that what Jesus was referring to the "coming of the son of man" in chapter 16 was fulfilled in chapter 17! Why? Because he yet again says later in chapter 24 that the coming of the son of man is yet to happen!"


Mathew 16
28 "Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before THEY SEE THE SON OF MAN COMING IN HIS KINGDOM."



"So this is very clear the Son of Man was to come 2000 years ago before those people he was speaking to would die! Now Matthew 24 WHICH IS AFTER THE EVENTS IN MATTHEW 17 JESUS CLEARLY SAYS THAT THE COMING OF THE SON OF MAN IS YET TO HAPPEN!"
"As I have clearly pointed out before! So you need to reread what I put forth because your theory does not work!"

Matthew 24
36 "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son,[f] but only the Father. 37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. THAT IS HOW IT WILL BE WITH THE COMING OF THE SON OF MAN"



" "So obviously the "coming of the son of man" has clearly NOT HAPPENED YET!"A279;

I could quote and paste, but basically it says that this passage refers to the founding of the Church and more specifically the destruction of Jerusalem.

https://stjoeofoblog.wordpress.com...
Saint_of_Me
Posts: 2,402
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7/15/2015 9:09:29 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 10:21:30 AM, JJ50 wrote:
I am of the opinion Jesus died 2000 years ago and stayed dead, never to return.

+1
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
Geogeer
Posts: 4,227
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7/15/2015 9:13:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 9:04:18 PM, icetiger200 wrote:
So no one can disprove me?

You didn't reply to me...
icetiger200
Posts: 33
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7/15/2015 10:04:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 9:13:04 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 7/15/2015 9:04:18 PM, icetiger200 wrote:
So no one can disprove me?

You didn't reply to me...

So apparently you don't have your own opinions... lol and all these commentaries do is give their side of view so it doesn't go against what they think or may believe what the Bible says. What I do is show you what the Bible says. All this commentary says is blah blah blah blah. I show you other places where it says the Son of man coming .... or the Son of man coming in his kingdom .... which is obviously the same event as in matthew 24 ! And you are no one else can disprove that...or can u
celestialtorahteacher
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7/15/2015 10:11:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Celestial Torah Christian exegesis explains what Jesus was trying to teach us: The "Son of Man" is astrological code for the Messiah on earth who follows the Messiah in the Celestial Torah astrological configuration, the relationship between God Most High (Saturn) and the Man Sign of the Zodiac, Aquarius. The Son of Man is the one who bears the Messiah role on earth where its heavenly icon is seen in the heavens, "riding on the clouds of heaven" which was code too for the Milky Way, not earthly clouds. Since the Man Sign is always there it is possible for the Son of Man to return bearing the Messiah teachings formed from astrological lore of the Zodiac's 12 Signs. Astrological interpretation is necessary to understand why "12 Tribes of Israel, 12 Disciples of Christ"

But Jesus Christ will not return, He wasn't even a human being but a literary creation. Said so himself in the Gospels when you read carefully: "I tell you, among those born of women there is no one greater than John; yet the one who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he." Since John tells us Jesus Christ is greater than he is, and Jesus is saying John was born of women, i.e. a normal human being, it follows that Jesus isn't born of women, i.e. he isn't a human being.

Yeishu ben Pantera was the human being that became model for the Jesus Christ of the Gospels, but the Gospel Jesus is a literary creation and therefore not ever a real human being.
Geogeer
Posts: 4,227
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7/15/2015 10:38:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 10:04:42 PM, icetiger200 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 9:13:04 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 7/15/2015 9:04:18 PM, icetiger200 wrote:
So no one can disprove me?

You didn't reply to me...





So apparently you don't have your own opinions... lol and all these commentaries do is give their side of view so it doesn't go against what they think or may believe what the Bible says. What I do is show you what the Bible says. All this commentary says is blah blah blah blah. I show you other places where it says the Son of man coming .... or the Son of man coming in his kingdom .... which is obviously the same event as in matthew 24 ! And you are no one else can disprove that...or can u

And what I do is give you an authentic interpretation of the scripture. When someone has already figured it out there is no sense in repeating it.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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7/15/2015 10:40:48 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
Jesus christ will not be returning and the bible proves it.


"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."

"Jesus was talking to his disciples and referring to the people that were standing there 2000 years ago that they were the ones that would see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. You can say I'm taking out of context or misinterpreting all you want but my little 8 year old could read that and say the same thing...lol and since that is the case we know Jesus never came back 2000 years ago... lol. But please correct me if I'm wrong.

It all depends on whether you want to interpret it literally or spiritually.
The kingdom according to the bible is not a physical kingdom.

see http://www.debate.org...

The character was talking about a state of mind, inner peace, a clear conscience.
Jesus is a personification of Truth, Life, Light, Revelation and a representation of humans in general. The "son of man" is the corporate body of all human offspring of the past present and future . They were, they are and they are to come at all times. They are always coming again daily in the process of being born and they are also passing away ( "going to heaven" ) daily in the process of dying.
That is how life works for "the son of man" as a corporate body. He ( the corporate son of man ) is continually coming and going in the past present and future. Every eye of the past present and future sees him/ them daily. The promise of coming again happens every day the same as the sun rises from the east and sets in the west every day.
That is HOW the coming again was prophesied to be.... Like the sun ( astrape, lighting, lightning, shining light, gleaming lamp, glare) rising in the East.
Matt 24;27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
It is definitely not a one time event of the future. It happens all the time. It is the same kind of prophecy as saying today or tomorrow will come again. It is always coming again and always will be coming again.

Revelation, Light is always on Earth. Some just sleep right through it and never see the Light of day because they prefer to live in darkness due to their deeds being evil. They are workers of iniquity who preach a false gospel and encourage people to worship an idol rather than live in Truth, Love and the revelation that all gods including the Hebrew God are mythical.
graceofgod
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7/16/2015 7:22:43 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 9:04:18 PM, icetiger200 wrote:
So no one can disprove me?
I know at least four reasoning why you are wrong but not that you would accept any of them...
graceofgod
Posts: 5,037
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7/16/2015 7:24:12 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 10:38:38 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 7/15/2015 10:04:42 PM, icetiger200 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 9:13:04 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 7/15/2015 9:04:18 PM, icetiger200 wrote:
So no one can disprove me?

You didn't reply to me...





So apparently you don't have your own opinions... lol and all these commentaries do is give their side of view so it doesn't go against what they think or may believe what the Bible says. What I do is show you what the Bible says. All this commentary says is blah blah blah blah. I show you other places where it says the Son of man coming .... or the Son of man coming in his kingdom .... which is obviously the same event as in matthew 24 ! And you are no one else can disprove that...or can u

And what I do is give you an authentic interpretation of the scripture. When someone has already figured it out there is no sense in repeating it.

I think what he means is , oh no my pet excuse has been defeated...
UniversalTheologian
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7/16/2015 9:24:52 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
The second coming has nothing to do with Jesus flying out of the clouds and taking over the world. It is a revelation.

The Revelation of Jesus Christ. Christ in You. Christians are called to be children of God. IT happens on an individual level.

This is one of the mysteries. It would probably be considered ignoble to explain it.
"There are trivial truths and the great truths. The opposite of a trivial truth is plainly false. The opposite of a great truth is also true." ~ Niels Bohr

"All truth passes through three stages. First, it is ridiculed. Second, it is violently opposed. Third, it is accepted as being self-evident." ~ Arthur Schopenhauer
12_13
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7/16/2015 12:03:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 10:32:08 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
So we're not waiting for the second coming, but rather the third? You guys really should stop calling it the "second coming" in that case.

Coming in his kingdom is not same as coming in last day.
12_13
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7/16/2015 12:03:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 11:25:27 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
... THE SON OF MAN COMING IN HIS KINGDOM."

Is not same as

...THAT IS HOW IT WILL BE WITH THE COMING OF THE SON OF MAN"

Person must ignore almost half of what was said to think those are the same.
lotsoffun
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7/17/2015 10:09:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
Jesus christ will not be returning and the bible proves it.


"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."


"Jesus was talking to his disciples and referring to the people that were standing there 2000 years ago that they were the ones that would see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. You can say I'm taking out of context or misinterpreting all you want but my little 8 year old could read that and say the same thing...lol and since that is the case we know Jesus never came back 2000 years ago... lol. But please correct me if I'm wrong.

I don't think Jesus is coming back in the flesh. He was the embodiment of the Christ Consciousness. It is a new consciousness that will come over this planet, but probably not before a lot of pain. We create turmoil with our collective consciousness.
Saint_of_Me
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7/17/2015 10:20:20 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 10:11:25 PM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
Celestial Torah Christian exegesis explains what Jesus was trying to teach us: The "Son of Man" is astrological code for the Messiah on earth who follows the Messiah in the Celestial Torah astrological configuration, the relationship between God Most High (Saturn) and the Man Sign of the Zodiac, Aquarius. The Son of Man is the one who bears the Messiah role on earth where its heavenly icon is seen in the heavens, "riding on the clouds of heaven" which was code too for the Milky Way, not earthly clouds. Since the Man Sign is always there it is possible for the Son of Man to return bearing the Messiah teachings formed from astrological lore of the Zodiac's 12 Signs. Astrological interpretation is necessary to understand why "12 Tribes of Israel, 12 Disciples of Christ"

But Jesus Christ will not return, He wasn't even a human being but a literary creation. Said so himself in the Gospels when you read carefully: "I tell you, among those born of women there is no one greater than John; yet the one who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he." Since John tells us Jesus Christ is greater than he is, and Jesus is saying John was born of women, i.e. a normal human being, it follows that Jesus isn't born of women, i.e. he isn't a human being.

Yeishu ben Pantera was the human being that became model for the Jesus Christ of the Gospels, but the Gospel Jesus is a literary creation and therefore not ever a real human being.

Correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't Pantera the name of the Roman soldier than many biblical scholars claimed impregnated Mary?
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
Saint_of_Me
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7/17/2015 10:20:56 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 10:20:20 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/15/2015 10:11:25 PM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
Celestial Torah Christian exegesis explains what Jesus was trying to teach us: The "Son of Man" is astrological code for the Messiah on earth who follows the Messiah in the Celestial Torah astrological configuration, the relationship between God Most High (Saturn) and the Man Sign of the Zodiac, Aquarius. The Son of Man is the one who bears the Messiah role on earth where its heavenly icon is seen in the heavens, "riding on the clouds of heaven" which was code too for the Milky Way, not earthly clouds. Since the Man Sign is always there it is possible for the Son of Man to return bearing the Messiah teachings formed from astrological lore of the Zodiac's 12 Signs. Astrological interpretation is necessary to understand why "12 Tribes of Israel, 12 Disciples of Christ"

But Jesus Christ will not return, He wasn't even a human being but a literary creation. Said so himself in the Gospels when you read carefully: "I tell you, among those born of women there is no one greater than John; yet the one who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he." Since John tells us Jesus Christ is greater than he is, and Jesus is saying John was born of women, i.e. a normal human being, it follows that Jesus isn't born of women, i.e. he isn't a human being.

Yeishu ben Pantera was the human being that became model for the Jesus Christ of the Gospels, but the Gospel Jesus is a literary creation and therefore not ever a real human being.


Correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't Pantera the name of the Roman soldier than many biblical scholars claimed impregnated Mary? Thus, was JC's dad?
Science Flies Us to the Moon. Religion Flies us Into Skyscrapers.
PGA
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7/19/2015 10:31:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
Jesus christ will not be returning and the bible proves it.


"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."


"Jesus was talking to his disciples and referring to the people that were standing there 2000 years ago that they were the ones that would see the Son of man coming in his kingdom. You can say I'm taking out of context or misinterpreting all you want but my little 8 year old could read that and say the same thing...lol and since that is the case we know Jesus never came back 2000 years ago... lol. But please correct me if I'm wrong.

Sure He came back. He came in the same manner the Father came in (in the glory of the Father). The question is how did the Father come in glory in the OT. Do you understand what the term means.

Matthew 16:27 (NASB)

27 For the Son of Man is going to come in the glory of His Father with His angels, and will then repay every man according to his deeds.


The Father's coming in the OT was never in a literal, physical manner. His glory was seen or felt in His judgment when He used a nation to come in judgment of another nation. The Father came in judgment in such a manner. Jesus came in judgment of apostate Israel and to bring salvation to those waiting in the same manner. That's how His glory was seen of realized. He warned the chief priest that he would see Jesus coming on the clouds of heaven. That would have been in the High Priest's lifetime.

Matthew 26:63-64New American Standard Bible (NASB)

63 But Jesus kept silent. And the high priest said to Him, "I adjure You by the living God, that You tell us whether You are the Christ, the Son of God." 64 Jesus *said to him, "You have said it yourself; nevertheless I tell you, hereafter you will see the Son of Man sitting at the right hand of Power, and coming on the clouds of heaven."


This was something the high priest would see in his lifetime and during the fall of Jerusalem and the temple he would have understood (saw) what Jesus was speaking of.


Matthew 23:37-38New American Standard Bible (NASB)
Lament over Jerusalem

37 "Jerusalem, Jerusalem, who kills the prophets and stones those who are sent to her! How often I wanted to gather your children together, the way a hen gathers her chicks under her wings, and you were unwilling. 38 Behold, your house is being left to you desolate! 39 For I say to you, from now on you will not see Me until you say, "Blessed is He who comes in the name of the Lord!""


John the Baptist, the forerunner of the Messiah, warned the religious leaders to flee from the coming wrath. It applied to them, those in the 1st century, an Old Covenant people.

Matthew 3:1-12 (NASB)
The Preaching of John the Baptist

3 Now in those days John the Baptist *came, preaching in the wilderness of Judea, saying, 2 "Repent, for the kingdom of heaven is at hand." 3 For this is the one referred to by Isaiah the prophet when he said,

"The voice of one crying in the wilderness,
"Make ready the way of the Lord,
Make His paths straight!""

4 Now John himself had a garment of camel"s hair and a leather belt around his waist; and his food was locusts and wild honey. 5 Then Jerusalem was going out to him, and all Judea and all the district around the Jordan; 6 and they were being baptized by him in the Jordan River, as they confessed their sins.

7 But when he saw many of the Pharisees and Sadducees coming for baptism, he said to them, "You brood of vipers, who warned you to flee from the wrath to come? 8 Therefore bear fruit in keeping with repentance; 9 and do not suppose that you can say to yourselves, "We have Abraham for our father"; for I say to you that from these stones God is able to raise up children to Abraham. 10 The axe is already laid at the root of the trees; therefore every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire.

11 "As for me, I baptize you with water for repentance, but He who is coming after me is mightier than I, and I am not fit to remove His sandals; He will baptize you with the Holy Spirit and fire. 12 His winnowing fork is in His hand, and He will thoroughly clear His threshing floor; and He will gather His wheat into the barn, but He will burn up the chaff with unquenchable fire."


This in in relation to OT people. He is preaching to them telling them that the kingdom of heaven is near, to flee from the coming wrath (the destruction of the temple, the city and the OT that they had made with God. The axe was already at the tree, ready to cut it down, metaphorically speaking.

They were heaping their sins to the limit.

Matthew 23:29-36 (NASB)

29 "Woe to you, scribes and Pharisees, hypocrites! For you build the tombs of the prophets and adorn the monuments of the righteous, 30 and say, "If we had been living in the days of our fathers, we would not have been partners with them in shedding the blood of the prophets." 31 So you testify against yourselves, that you are sons of those who murdered the prophets. 32 Fill up, then, the measure of the guilt of your fathers. 33 You serpents, you brood of vipers, how will you escape the sentence of hell?

34 "Therefore, behold, I am sending you prophets and wise men and scribes; some of them you will kill and crucify, and some of them you will scourge in your synagogues, and persecute from city to city, 35 so that upon you may fall the guilt of all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of righteous Abel to the blood of Zechariah, the son of Berechiah, whom you murdered between the temple and the altar. 36 Truly I say to you, all these things will come upon this generation.



So when you say the prophesies failed you ignore a host of biblical facts. God did bring judgment on this people and this covenant in AD 70 by removing it and replacing it with a better covenant, a covenant that also grafted in the Gentiles with true Israel (the faithful) and gave us hope for the future too! After AD 70 they could not fulfill the requirements of the OT law and the covenant agreement they had made with God.

Peter
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7/19/2015 11:04:18 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 10:24:26 AM, 12_13 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom.
"

Please, read the whole Bible, not just parts that suits for angry atheists.

After six days, Jesus took with him Peter, James, and John his brother, and brought them up into a high mountain by themselves. He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his garments became as white as the light. Behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them talking with him.

Matt. 17:1-3

Peter, James, and John his brother saw Jesus as coming in his Kingdom after 6 days.

So after six days you would think that they all would be alive, not just some.

17 Six days later Jesus *took with Him Peter and James and John his brother, and *led them up on a high mountain by themselves. 2 And He was transfigured before them; and His face shone like the sun, and His garments became as white as light. 3 And behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them, talking with Him. 4 Peter said to Jesus, "Lord, it is good for us to be here; if You wish, I will make three [b]tabernacles here, one for You, and one for Moses, and one for Elijah." 5 While he was still speaking, a bright cloud overshadowed them, and behold, a voice out of the cloud said, "This is My beloved Son, with whom I am well-pleased; listen to Him!" 6 When the disciples heard this, they fell face down to the ground and were terrified. 7 And Jesus came to them and touched them and said, "Get up, and do not be afraid." 8 And lifting up their eyes, they saw no one except Jesus Himself alone.


You would not expect the prophecy of Matthew 16:27-28 to apply just six days later.

And as Skepticalone noted, you have three comings of the Lord, not two.

Hebrews 9:28
so Christ also, having been offered once to bear the sins of many, will appear a second time for salvation without reference to sin, to those who eagerly await Him.


So His first appearance was His incarnation and earthly life. His Second would be when He came with His kingdom. The coming kingdom was something that the NT believers were looking for still.


Acts 1:6-8New American Standard Bible (NASB)

6 So when they had come together, they were asking Him, saying, "Lord, is it at this time You are restoring the kingdom to Israel?" 7 He said to them, "It is not for you to know times or epochs which the Father has fixed by His own authority; 8 but you will receive power when the Holy Spirit has come upon you; and you shall be My witnesses both in Jerusalem, and in all Judea and Samaria, and even to the remotest part of the earth."


Revelation 11:15
[ The Seventh Trumpet"Christ"s Reign Foreseen ] Then the seventh angel sounded; and there were loud voices in heaven, saying, "The kingdom of the world has become the kingdom of our Lord and of His Christ; and He will reign forever and ever."

Revelation 12:10
Then I heard a loud voice in heaven, saying, "Now the salvation, and the power, and the kingdom of our God and the authority of His Christ have come, for the accuser of our brethren has been thrown down, he who accuses them before our God day and night.



Peter
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7/19/2015 11:08:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/15/2015 11:25:27 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 10:24:26 AM, 12_13 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 7:57:58 AM, icetiger200 wrote:
"Here Jesus says that the people living 2000 years ago would not die until THEY SAW HIM COME IN HIS KINGDOM!"
"
Matthew 16:28
And I tell you the truth, some standing here right now will not die before they see the Son of Man coming in his Kingdom."

Please, read the whole Bible, not just parts that suits for angry atheists.

After six days, Jesus took with him Peter, James, and John his brother, and brought them up into a high mountain by themselves. He was transfigured before them. His face shone like the sun, and his garments became as white as the light. Behold, Moses and Elijah appeared to them talking with him.

Matt. 17:1-3

Peter, James, and John his brother saw Jesus as coming in his Kingdom after 6 days.





"Funny thing is that I believe you need to reread the bible... Because there is no way that what Jesus was referring to the "coming of the son of man" in chapter 16 was fulfilled in chapter 17! Why? Because he yet again says later in chapter 24 that the coming of the son of man is yet to happen!"


Mathew 16
28 "Truly I tell you, some who are standing here will not taste death before THEY SEE THE SON OF MAN COMING IN HIS KINGDOM."



"So this is very clear the Son of Man was to come 2000 years ago before those people he was speaking to would die! Now Matthew 24 WHICH IS AFTER THE EVENTS IN MATTHEW 17 JESUS CLEARLY SAYS THAT THE COMING OF THE SON OF MAN IS YET TO HAPPEN!"
"As I have clearly pointed out before! So you need to reread what I put forth because your theory does not work!"

Matthew 24
36 "But about that day or hour no one knows, not even the angels in heaven, nor the Son,[f] but only the Father. 37 As it was in the days of Noah, so it will be at the coming of the Son of Man. 38 For in the days before the flood, people were eating and drinking, marrying and giving in marriage, up to the day Noah entered the ark; 39 and they knew nothing about what would happen until the flood came and took them all away. THAT IS HOW IT WILL BE WITH THE COMING OF THE SON OF MAN"



" "So obviously the "coming of the son of man" has clearly NOT HAPPENED YET!"A279;

Who was He coming to? What manner was His coming?

Peter
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7/19/2015 11:10:50 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 12:03:36 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 7/15/2015 10:32:08 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
So we're not waiting for the second coming, but rather the third? You guys really should stop calling it the "second coming" in that case.

Coming in his kingdom is not same as coming in last day.

Last day of what?

Peter
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7/19/2015 11:13:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 10:20:20 PM, Saint_of_Me wrote:
At 7/15/2015 10:11:25 PM, celestialtorahteacher wrote:
Celestial Torah Christian exegesis explains what Jesus was trying to teach us: The "Son of Man" is astrological code for the Messiah on earth who follows the Messiah in the Celestial Torah astrological configuration, the relationship between God Most High (Saturn) and the Man Sign of the Zodiac, Aquarius. The Son of Man is the one who bears the Messiah role on earth where its heavenly icon is seen in the heavens, "riding on the clouds of heaven" which was code too for the Milky Way, not earthly clouds. Since the Man Sign is always there it is possible for the Son of Man to return bearing the Messiah teachings formed from astrological lore of the Zodiac's 12 Signs. Astrological interpretation is necessary to understand why "12 Tribes of Israel, 12 Disciples of Christ"

But Jesus Christ will not return, He wasn't even a human being but a literary creation. Said so himself in the Gospels when you read carefully: "I tell you, among those born of women there is no one greater than John; yet the one who is least in the kingdom of God is greater than he." Since John tells us Jesus Christ is greater than he is, and Jesus is saying John was born of women, i.e. a normal human being, it follows that Jesus isn't born of women, i.e. he isn't a human being.

Yeishu ben Pantera was the human being that became model for the Jesus Christ of the Gospels, but the Gospel Jesus is a literary creation and therefore not ever a real human being.


Correct me if I am wrong, but wasn't Pantera the name of the Roman soldier than many biblical scholars claimed impregnated Mary?

What a bunch of malarkey.

Peter