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What are the criteria for a God to exist?

TyroneShelton
Posts: 19
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7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?
Imagine there's no heaven
It isn't hard to do
No hell below us
Above us only sky

Imagine all the people
Livin' for today
joetheripper117
Posts: 284
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7/16/2015 11:14:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

A is some form of evidence that supports a god.
"By all means let's be open-minded, but not so open-minded that our brains drop out."
-Richard Dawkins
"The onus is on you to say why; the onus is not on the rest of us to say why not."
-Richard Dawkins
TyroneShelton
Posts: 19
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7/16/2015 11:16:34 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 11:14:19 PM, joetheripper117 wrote:
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

A is some form of evidence that supports a god.

What is that evidence? I understand if you say if A then B exists, A is some form of evidence that supports B.

I want to know what evidence there is for God
Imagine there's no heaven
It isn't hard to do
No hell below us
Above us only sky

Imagine all the people
Livin' for today
joetheripper117
Posts: 284
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7/16/2015 11:19:49 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 11:16:34 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
At 7/16/2015 11:14:19 PM, joetheripper117 wrote:
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

A is some form of evidence that supports a god.

What is that evidence? I understand if you say if A then B exists, A is some form of evidence that supports B.

I cannot think of any evidence that would prove the existence of a deity, as if a deity were to exist in the way that modern theologians state, I do not know of a way for any evidence to be found.


I want to know what evidence there is for God

There currently is no evidence for a god.
"By all means let's be open-minded, but not so open-minded that our brains drop out."
-Richard Dawkins
"The onus is on you to say why; the onus is not on the rest of us to say why not."
-Richard Dawkins
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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7/16/2015 11:25:36 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

Can you say if B then Peter Pan exists?

What is B?
Nicoszon_the_Great
Posts: 167
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7/16/2015 11:38:45 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

I would think that some quantifiable 'something' for lack of a better word that has influenced something in the world that can be traced to a being that does not originate from within the universe. Say if this nonexistent term were found to exist on newly forming biological beings and effectively shaped their development and then retreat back to the source once sufficiently manipulating the subject.

So essentially you have to find a physical form for a god. Of course this does not necessarily mean you've even found a SENTIENT god, all forbid an omni-everything god, this would just mean you've found some complex external creature that influences the formation and combinations of some matter within this universe for some reason.
Nicoszon_the_Great
Posts: 167
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7/16/2015 11:40:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 10:35:32 PM, dee-em wrote:
A world completely without evil.

That would assume that a god can only exist if their is no evil in the world however being a god does not necessarily make one good. By a moral standpoint or a perception of skill. God could be, as it's been said so often, very wicked or very incompetent.
dee-em
Posts: 6,447
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7/16/2015 11:47:26 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 11:40:22 PM, Nicoszon_the_Great wrote:
At 7/16/2015 10:35:32 PM, dee-em wrote:
A world completely without evil.

That would assume that a god can only exist if their is no evil in the world however being a god does not necessarily make one good. By a moral standpoint or a perception of skill. God could be, as it's been said so often, very wicked or very incompetent.

I wasn't being totally serious and I was taking the accepted definition of God. You know, omni-everything, including omni-benelovent.
Geogeer
Posts: 4,227
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7/17/2015 1:50:47 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

Miracles, you know healing of the cripples, blind seeing, a resurrection...
Philocat
Posts: 728
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7/17/2015 2:42:28 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 1:50:47 AM, Geogeer wrote:
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

Miracles, you know healing of the cripples, blind seeing, a resurrection...

^this
Rational_Thinker9119
Posts: 9,054
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7/17/2015 3:29:14 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
In the most generic sense; "The mind that grounds our minds and the empirical reality we experience, and grounds the reality entailed by the empirical reality we experience if such a reality exists."

I consider myself a Generic Theist, I'm not religious, so I have no problem with God being evil or morally indifferent.
graceofgod
Posts: 5,045
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7/17/2015 3:43:24 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

what evidence disproves God existence??

Your question is very interesting, I often wonder what would non believers class as evidence, I don't think they even know themselves...
graceofgod
Posts: 5,045
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7/17/2015 3:44:17 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 10:35:32 PM, dee-em wrote:
A world completely without evil.

define evil...?

so you think God would want robots...?
Dragonfang
Posts: 1,122
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7/17/2015 4:10:44 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
If laws of logic/consciousness/reasoning/intuition/free will/morality/objective laws of nature exist then God exists.
dee-em
Posts: 6,447
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7/17/2015 4:15:51 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 3:10:28 AM, FullMetal.Alchemist wrote:
At 7/16/2015 10:35:32 PM, dee-em wrote:
A world completely without evil.

So, I take it you're a "Problem of Evil" supporter?

You bet. :-)
dee-em
Posts: 6,447
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7/17/2015 4:17:59 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 1:50:47 AM, Geogeer wrote:
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

Miracles, you know healing of the cripples, blind seeing, a resurrection...

Or failing actual miracles, hearsay reports of miracles will do. Lol.
dee-em
Posts: 6,447
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7/17/2015 4:18:53 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 1:50:47 AM, Geogeer wrote:
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

Miracles, you know healing of the cripples, blind seeing, a resurrection...

An amputee regrowing a limb ...
graceofgod
Posts: 5,045
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7/17/2015 4:23:24 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

I think one of my favourite answers to the proof question is "If Jesus stands in front of me right now, Then I will believe"....
dee-em
Posts: 6,447
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7/17/2015 4:27:08 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 3:43:24 AM, graceofgod wrote:
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

what evidence disproves God existence??

What evidence disproves the existence of ghosts??
Do you believe in ghosts?

Your question is very interesting, I often wonder what would non believers class as evidence, I don't think they even know themselves...

That's funny, I just gave you one.
dee-em
Posts: 6,447
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7/17/2015 4:31:57 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 3:44:17 AM, graceofgod wrote:
At 7/16/2015 10:35:32 PM, dee-em wrote:
A world completely without evil.

define evil...?

That which causes harm, misfortune, or destruction.

so you think God would want robots...?

Are you under the impression that evil is only caused by your fellow human beings?
Are you under the impression that an omnipotent god cannot create a world without evil?
dee-em
Posts: 6,447
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7/17/2015 4:39:31 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 4:23:24 AM, graceofgod wrote:
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

I think one of my favourite answers to the proof question is "If Jesus stands in front of me right now, Then I will believe"....

How would you recognize Jesus?
graceofgod
Posts: 5,045
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7/17/2015 5:38:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 4:39:31 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 7/17/2015 4:23:24 AM, graceofgod wrote:
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

I think one of my favourite answers to the proof question is "If Jesus stands in front of me right now, Then I will believe"....

How would you recognize Jesus?

I have no idea in the case of non believers...
dee-em
Posts: 6,447
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7/17/2015 6:04:33 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 5:38:29 AM, graceofgod wrote:
At 7/17/2015 4:39:31 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 7/17/2015 4:23:24 AM, graceofgod wrote:
At 7/16/2015 2:13:26 PM, TyroneShelton wrote:
Can you say if A then God exists.

What is A?

I think one of my favourite answers to the proof question is "If Jesus stands in front of me right now, Then I will believe"....

How would you recognize Jesus?

I have no idea in the case of non believers...

Fantastic non-answer. You have no idea because you don't know yourself.

Try looking for someone who looks like this:

http://www.popularmechanics.com...
graceofgod
Posts: 5,045
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7/17/2015 6:23:57 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 4:31:57 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 7/17/2015 3:44:17 AM, graceofgod wrote:
At 7/16/2015 10:35:32 PM, dee-em wrote:
A world completely without evil.

define evil...?

That which causes harm, misfortune, or destruction.

so you think God would want robots...?

Are you under the impression that evil is only caused by your fellow human beings?
Are you under the impression that an omnipotent god cannot create a world without evil?

how could they ever not exist in a world with freedom of choice??
FullMetal.Alchemist
Posts: 62
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7/17/2015 7:00:05 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 4:31:57 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 7/17/2015 3:44:17 AM, graceofgod wrote:
At 7/16/2015 10:35:32 PM, dee-em wrote:
A world completely without evil.

define evil...?

That which causes harm, misfortune, or destruction.

so you think God would want robots...?

Are you under the impression that evil is only caused by your fellow human beings?

No, I'm well-aware of "naturalistic" evils, as they're called. But I certainly buy the free will explanation for "man-made" evils.

Are you under the impression that an omnipotent god cannot create a world without evil?

Are you under the impression that an omnipotent, omniscient, and omnibenevolent God would want to create a world without evil?
Accipiter
Posts: 1,162
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7/17/2015 7:01:50 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/16/2015 10:35:32 PM, dee-em wrote:
A world completely without evil.

Yeah I think you are right, he did invent evil after all.
kp98
Posts: 729
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7/17/2015 7:02:44 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
I don't think there is just one scenario that would get me to question my atheism. There are probably several, but they are all pretty dramatic. For example if the skies parted and trumpet blowing, winged angels in their thousands descended through the clouds I'd probably get on the phone asking for a refund on my purchase of The God Delusion. But I won't be doing the next time a baby survives an air crash.

I'm pretty sure that this time round God won't leave people in any doubt. He won't - for instance - appear to me in a dream. If he did the best that could happen is I'd get my own padded cell.

So I don't know exactly what would convince me, but I'd definitely look for a non-theistic explanation first for just about anything less than armaggeddon.
Chaosism
Posts: 2,649
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7/17/2015 7:20:16 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 7/17/2015 4:31:57 AM, dee-em wrote:
At 7/17/2015 3:44:17 AM, graceofgod wrote:
At 7/16/2015 10:35:32 PM, dee-em wrote:
A world completely without evil.

define evil...?

That which causes harm, misfortune, or destruction.

so you think God would want robots...?

Are you under the impression that evil is only caused by your fellow human beings?
Are you under the impression that an omnipotent god cannot create a world without evil?

I am under the impression that evil is only perceived by beings. Evil is a concept, the definition of which is molded to the perceived world. If there were no pain, for instance, we would be unaware of the possibility. I have an analogy in another thread (http://www.debate.org...), post #25. A world without evil is a world without good. Since evil relies on comparison, it cannot be vanquished without removing all means of comparison. Evil is in the mind of the beholder.