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Arguments against any belief

bagelgirl7952294
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8/25/2010 6:34:25 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I want to know HOW atheists see the world, me being myself, wants to know how you all put up the empty hole of crap we all live in with no hope. How do you sleep at night, how do you sit there and are able to say, "Oh we came from a rotting piece of meat BILLIONS OR MILLIONS of years ago by chance." That gives life no meaning. Honestly I would kill myself, I dont understand how some one could sit there and say that.
~Bagel~
LaissezFaire
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8/25/2010 6:37:49 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
No meaning? Life is its own meaning; it doesn't need an external one. Why do you find more comfort in the belief that this life is just a test?
Should we subsidize education?
http://www.debate.org...

http://mises.org...

http://lewrockwell.com...

http://antiwar.com...

: At 6/22/2011 6:57:23 PM, el-badgero wrote:
: i didn't like [Obama]. he was the only black dude in moneygall yet he claimed to be home. obvious liar is obvious liar. i bet him and bin laden are bumfvcking right now.
bagelgirl7952294
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8/25/2010 6:42:55 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
A belief that life is just a test? what religion is that? I find my religion comforting to know that I come from a God or Creator that is powerful, not a piece of rotting meat that over time grew into something that looks like fish and went on from there.
~Bagel~
LaissezFaire
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8/25/2010 6:49:04 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
The only difference in the meaningfulness of life between Christianity and Atheism is that Christians believe that after this life, God judges whether or not you were good, and then you go to heaven or hell. That's what I meant by "test."

As for God creating human vs. evolution:
It doesn't matter which is more comforting. Evolution is true regardless of what makes you feel better. But even so, why is being created more comforting than being the result of evolution? What difference does it make where your ancestors came from? You, personally, came from your parents either way. Furthermore, what would you think of someone who finds comfort in the fact that their ancestors were white? You'd think that belief is rediculous, wouldn't you, because it doesn't matter where one's ancestors came from; what matters is the individual themselves.
Should we subsidize education?
http://www.debate.org...

http://mises.org...

http://lewrockwell.com...

http://antiwar.com...

: At 6/22/2011 6:57:23 PM, el-badgero wrote:
: i didn't like [Obama]. he was the only black dude in moneygall yet he claimed to be home. obvious liar is obvious liar. i bet him and bin laden are bumfvcking right now.
LaissezFaire
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8/25/2010 6:55:54 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
In what sense is evolution guided by 'chance'? All evolution means is, basically, that stronger individuals are more likely to survive, and, thus, more likely to pass on their genetic traits. Over time, this results in changes in species, as the stronger traits become more prevalent. It's not chance; it's survival of the fittest.
Should we subsidize education?
http://www.debate.org...

http://mises.org...

http://lewrockwell.com...

http://antiwar.com...

: At 6/22/2011 6:57:23 PM, el-badgero wrote:
: i didn't like [Obama]. he was the only black dude in moneygall yet he claimed to be home. obvious liar is obvious liar. i bet him and bin laden are bumfvcking right now.
LaissezFaire
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8/25/2010 6:59:00 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
The big bang created the universe and Earth, and evolution created the living beings on Earth.
Should we subsidize education?
http://www.debate.org...

http://mises.org...

http://lewrockwell.com...

http://antiwar.com...

: At 6/22/2011 6:57:23 PM, el-badgero wrote:
: i didn't like [Obama]. he was the only black dude in moneygall yet he claimed to be home. obvious liar is obvious liar. i bet him and bin laden are bumfvcking right now.
LaissezFaire
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8/25/2010 6:59:45 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
That is, the living beings on Earth came to be through the process of evolution, not that evolution somehow 'created' them.
Should we subsidize education?
http://www.debate.org...

http://mises.org...

http://lewrockwell.com...

http://antiwar.com...

: At 6/22/2011 6:57:23 PM, el-badgero wrote:
: i didn't like [Obama]. he was the only black dude in moneygall yet he claimed to be home. obvious liar is obvious liar. i bet him and bin laden are bumfvcking right now.
LaissezFaire
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8/25/2010 7:02:30 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
You can read this if you want a summary of the science behind it: http://en.wikipedia.org...
Should we subsidize education?
http://www.debate.org...

http://mises.org...

http://lewrockwell.com...

http://antiwar.com...

: At 6/22/2011 6:57:23 PM, el-badgero wrote:
: i didn't like [Obama]. he was the only black dude in moneygall yet he claimed to be home. obvious liar is obvious liar. i bet him and bin laden are bumfvcking right now.
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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8/25/2010 7:03:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 6:42:55 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
A belief that life is just a test? what religion is that? I find my religion comforting to know that I come from a God or Creator that is powerful, not a piece of rotting meat that over time grew into something that looks like fish and went on from there.

Life is much more fulfilling without God.

"Is it possible to live life without God? It is ONLY possible to live life without God." - Osho

"Either God can exist or freedom. Both cannot exist together." - Osho


A life with God would be enslavement.

"[Belief in God] is a totalitarian belief. It is the wish to be a slave. It is the desire that there be an unalterable, unchallengeable, tyrannical authority who can convict you of thought crime while you are asleep, who can subject you - who must, indeed, subject you - to total surveillance around the clock every waking and sleeping minute of your life - I say, of your life - before you're born and, even worse and where the real fun begins, after you're dead." -- Christopher Hitchens
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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8/25/2010 7:07:04 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 6:52:33 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
First of all I want to ask you how can you look outside and say that all came from chance? I wanna know.

You are creating a false dichotomy.

"Therefore, we argue that all things that exist are not without a cause. However, neither God, nor the Absolute, nor the self, no causeless chance, is the maker ...The whole world is under the law of causation, and the causes that act are not un-mental" -- the Buddha
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
bagelgirl7952294
Posts: 40
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8/25/2010 7:11:02 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I want to say that the statement "Either God can exist or freedom" is wrong. You see God gave people the free will to do what they choose. That's why we are discussing what we are.
Now, I want to thank both of you for joining in on this conversation, but I have things to do. However, I want to leave you both with one statement,
"If I'm wrong, what difference does it make. However, if I'm right, and you are wrong, You will be suffering the consequences."
~Bagel~
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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8/25/2010 7:17:04 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 7:11:02 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
I want to say that the statement "Either God can exist or freedom" is wrong. You see God gave people the free will to do what they choose.

It's not freedom if you are punished for exercising your freedom. The 10 Commandments are a binding dictatorial set of laws that, if not followed, you will be burned and tortured infinitely in the eternal "weeping and gnashing of teeth."

That doesn't sound like freedom to me.

That's why we are discussing what we are.

No, we are free because God doesn't exist, lol. You are presuming his existence when you make that statement.

"If I'm wrong, what difference does it make. However, if I'm right, and you are wrong, You will be suffering the consequences."

If you are wrong, you will have wasted your life living in fear of a vengeful God, worshiping, going to church, and all other religious activities that will have been done in vain.

Did you ever think, what if you are wrong about Zeus and you risk being sent to Hades? You might as well believe in every God and every religion if you want to play it safe.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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8/25/2010 7:17:22 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 7:12:51 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
Isn't Buddha a type of God?

No.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
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8/25/2010 8:06:48 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 6:34:25 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
I want to know HOW atheists see the world, me being myself, wants to know how you all put up the empty hole of crap we all live in with no hope. How do you sleep at night, how do you sit there and are able to say, "Oh we came from a rotting piece of meat BILLIONS OR MILLIONS of years ago by chance." That gives life no meaning. Honestly I would kill myself, I dont understand how some one could sit there and say that.

I am how I am..

why would how I came about bother me?

I like that I am... why would the fact that I didn't come from some Super Powerful dude bother me
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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8/25/2010 8:09:20 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 7:17:04 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 8/25/2010 7:11:02 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
I want to say that the statement "Either God can exist or freedom" is wrong. You see God gave people the free will to do what they choose.

It's not freedom if you are punished for exercising your freedom. The 10 Commandments are a binding dictatorial set of laws that, if not followed, you will be burned and tortured infinitely in the eternal "weeping and gnashing of teeth."


You're aware that that phrase is used all throughout the OT (and the NT too, of course) and that it never refers to the agony of pain or torture, right?
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
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8/25/2010 8:13:40 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 8:09:20 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
You're aware that that phrase is used all throughout the OT (and the NT too, of course) and that it never refers to the agony of pain or torture, right?

what does it refer to? Or is it another metaphorical one?

sounds like sadness and Mental agony/crazyness to me.
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
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8/25/2010 8:14:31 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 8:09:20 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 8/25/2010 7:17:04 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
It's not freedom if you are punished for exercising your freedom. The 10 Commandments are a binding dictatorial set of laws that, if not followed, you will be burned and tortured infinitely in the eternal "weeping and gnashing of teeth."


You're aware that that phrase is used all throughout the OT (and the NT too, of course) and that it never refers to the agony of pain or torture, right?

Lol, whatever it is, it doesn't sound pleasant!!

So what does it really mean?
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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8/25/2010 8:18:08 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 8:14:31 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 8/25/2010 8:09:20 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 8/25/2010 7:17:04 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
It's not freedom if you are punished for exercising your freedom. The 10 Commandments are a binding dictatorial set of laws that, if not followed, you will be burned and tortured infinitely in the eternal "weeping and gnashing of teeth."


You're aware that that phrase is used all throughout the OT (and the NT too, of course) and that it never refers to the agony of pain or torture, right?

Lol, whatever it is, it doesn't sound pleasant!!

So what does it really mean?

Anger, extreme hatred, envy (etc) with God or other people.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
TheSkeptic
Posts: 1,362
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8/25/2010 11:56:57 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 8:18:08 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 8/25/2010 8:14:31 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 8/25/2010 8:09:20 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 8/25/2010 7:17:04 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
It's not freedom if you are punished for exercising your freedom. The 10 Commandments are a binding dictatorial set of laws that, if not followed, you will be burned and tortured infinitely in the eternal "weeping and gnashing of teeth."


You're aware that that phrase is used all throughout the OT (and the NT too, of course) and that it never refers to the agony of pain or torture, right?

Lol, whatever it is, it doesn't sound pleasant!!

So what does it really mean?

Anger, extreme hatred, envy (etc) with God or other people.

If you don't follow the commandments you'll be pissed off? What?
Cerebral_Narcissist
Posts: 10,806
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8/26/2010 12:02:26 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 6:34:25 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
I want to know HOW atheists see the world, me being myself, wants to know how you all put up the empty hole of crap we all live in with no hope. How do you sleep at night, how do you sit there and are able to say, "Oh we came from a rotting piece of meat BILLIONS OR MILLIONS of years ago by chance." That gives life no meaning. Honestly I would kill myself, I dont understand how some one could sit there and say that.

The atheist world view does not fill me with glee, but you get used to the negatives. You can't just believe in a religion because you want it to be true.
I am voting for Innomen because of his intelligence, common sense, humility and the fact that Juggle appears to listen to him. Any other Presidential style would have a large sub-section of the site up in arms. If I was President I would destroy the site though elitism, others would let it run riot. Innomen represents a middle way that works, neither draconian nor anarchic and that is the only way things can work. Plus he does it all without ego trips.
tvellalott
Posts: 10,864
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8/26/2010 12:13:34 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 6:34:25 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
I want to know HOW atheists see the world, me being myself, wants to know how you all put up the empty hole of crap we all live in with no hope. How do you sleep at night, how do you sit there and are able to say, "Oh we came from a rotting piece of meat BILLIONS OR MILLIONS of years ago by chance." That gives life no meaning. Honestly I would kill myself, I dont understand how some one could sit there and say that.

Thats because you're weak.

At 8/25/2010 6:52:33 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
First of all I want to ask you how can you look outside and say that all came from chance? I wanna know.

Million to one chances happen every single moment on our tiny rock. In a Universe as large as ours a Google to 1 is CERTAIN.
"Caitlyn Jenner is an incredibly brave and stunningly beautiful woman."

Muh threads
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popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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8/26/2010 6:13:29 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 11:56:57 PM, TheSkeptic wrote:
At 8/25/2010 8:18:08 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 8/25/2010 8:14:31 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 8/25/2010 8:09:20 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 8/25/2010 7:17:04 PM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
It's not freedom if you are punished for exercising your freedom. The 10 Commandments are a binding dictatorial set of laws that, if not followed, you will be burned and tortured infinitely in the eternal "weeping and gnashing of teeth."


You're aware that that phrase is used all throughout the OT (and the NT too, of course) and that it never refers to the agony of pain or torture, right?

Lol, whatever it is, it doesn't sound pleasant!!

So what does it really mean?

Anger, extreme hatred, envy (etc) with God or other people.

If you don't follow the commandments you'll be pissed off? What?

? The phrase generally isn't used like that. I'm not exactly sure what you mean, anyhow....I don't think it's used with the commandments except in a very general way I guess.

The Stoning of Stephen
54When they heard this, they were furious and gnashed their teeth at him.55But Stephen, full of the Holy Spirit, looked up to heaven and saw the glory of God, and Jesus standing at the right hand of God. 56"Look," he said, "I see heaven open and the Son of Man standing at the right hand of God."

57At this they covered their ears and, yelling at the top of their voices, they all rushed at him, 58dragged him out of the city and began to stone him. Meanwhile, the witnesses laid their clothes at the feet of a young man named Saul.

59While they were stoning him, Stephen prayed, "Lord Jesus, receive my spirit." 60Then he fell on his knees and cried out, "Lord, do not hold this sin against them." When he had said this, he fell asleep.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
I-am-a-panda
Posts: 15,380
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8/26/2010 7:27:56 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 7:11:02 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
"If I'm wrong, what difference does it make. However, if I'm right, and you are wrong, You will be suffering the consequences."

Pascals wager. Fail.
Pizza. I have enormous respect for Pizza.
vivalayeo
Posts: 142
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8/26/2010 8:47:27 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 6:34:25 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
I want to know HOW atheists see the world, me being myself, wants to know how you all put up the empty hole of crap we all live in with no hope. How do you sleep at night, how do you sit there and are able to say, "Oh we came from a rotting piece of meat BILLIONS OR MILLIONS of years ago by chance." That gives life no meaning. Honestly I would kill myself, I dont understand how some one could sit there and say that.

It's about finding your own meaning to life. Where does there have to be a divine purpose, to make my life worth while? You seem afraid to accept that maybe you are not the centre of the universe, and that at the end of the day, compared to the cosmo's you are but a grain of sand on the beach.

Does that sound depressing? To me, no.

I'm fascinated with how we got here, how we have developed and much there is still to learn. I know that I won't make much of a difference to the universe, and I'm content with that. Life is about finding your own meaning. Mine is having fun. You only have one shot at life, therefore enjoy it. That should be the same for everyone, even theist's because you have no guarantee that you have another one.

My meaning to life is to have fun, do the thing's I enjoy doing, push myself to my limit's and make a fair amount of money, doing what I want to do, so I can live comfortably.
mattrodstrom
Posts: 12,028
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8/26/2010 8:49:21 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/26/2010 6:13:29 AM, popculturepooka wrote:
The phrase generally isn't used like that.... etc.

your phrase didn't even have the full quote... here's some which do, that ARE seemingly used to signify the torture/sadness/anguish of Hell:

TheOtherMatthew Wrote:

The Son of man shall send forth his angels, and they shall gather out of his kingdom all things that offend, and them which do iniquity; And shall cast them into a furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth (Matthew 13:41-42).

So shall it be at the end of the world: the angels shall come forth, and sever the wicked from among the just, And shall cast them into the furnace of fire: there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth (Matthew 13:49-50).

The lord of that servant shall come in a day when he looketh not for him, and in an hour that he is not aware of, And shall cut him asunder, and appoint him his portion with the hypocrites: there shall be weeping and gnashing of teeth (Matthew 24:50-51).
"He who does not know how to put his will into things at least puts a meaning into them: that is, he believes there is a will in them already."

Metaphysics:
"The science.. which deals with the fundamental errors of mankind - but as if they were the fundamental truths."
JustCallMeTarzan
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8/26/2010 9:12:12 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 8/25/2010 6:34:25 PM, bagelgirl7952294 wrote:
I want to know HOW atheists see the world, me being myself, wants to know how you all put up the empty hole of crap

Actually, the world is a pretty nice place. Strange that you would refer to (I presume) what you believe is God's creation as an empty hole of crap.

we all live in with no hope.

Hope for WHAT exactly? That things will be better? You better your situation by DOING something about it. Not praying to a fairy in the sky.

How do you sleep at night,

Very soundly, excepting when the dog needs to pee..

how do you sit there and are able to say, "Oh we came from a rotting piece of meat BILLIONS OR MILLIONS of years ago by chance."

Easy - we look at the facts of the world around us that show us exactly how this happened. Conversely, how can you say that a magical man we've never seen magicked the world into being and made man and woman by playing in the mud?

That gives life no meaning.

Incorrect. The meaning of life comes from the meaning we assign to it, not from the external world.

Honestly I would kill myself, I dont understand how some one could sit there and say that.

Do you often want to kill yourself when you don't understand something? If you actually understood it... you'd probably feel pretty good about atheism.