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**Religious Forum Rewards Nominations**

Blade-of-Truth
Posts: 5,032
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8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!
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JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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8/20/2015 8:18:19 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Why?
Blade-of-Truth
Posts: 5,032
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8/20/2015 8:41:21 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 8:18:19 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Why?

Because this is the most popular forum on the site and deserves its community leaders to be recognized.
Debate.org Deputy Vote Moderator
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
DDO Voting Guide: http://www.debate.org...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Need a judge on your debate? Nominate me! http://www.debate.org...
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,622
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8/20/2015 2:00:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 8:41:21 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 8/20/2015 8:18:19 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Why?

Because this is the most popular forum on the site and deserves its community leaders to be recognized.

Why? I would prefer better forum moderation than wasting time on that crap.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Chaosism
Posts: 2,662
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8/20/2015 4:49:33 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

This is a nice intention, but I think it would be a bad idea. The categories aren't that cleanly established; Christians quite frequently disagree with other Christians and that goes for each of the other categories, as well. Such a declaration of superiority would serve only to sharpen the lines that have already been drawn between everyone. This could easily lead to egotistical flaming and attacks of character.

My two cents...
Geogeer
Posts: 4,258
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8/20/2015 7:10:29 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Thanks for the sentiment. However, I don't think it'll receive much traction in this forum. Given, the nature of the topics being discussed and the average age of participants being significantly older, people won't want this forum turned into a popularity contest. A discussion over ultimate truth doesn't mix well with popularity.

Thanks again for the thought though.
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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8/20/2015 9:36:20 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Lol, what are you going to do when you find the "best of the best"?
Geogeer
Posts: 4,258
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8/20/2015 11:09:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 9:36:20 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Lol, what are you going to do when you find the "best of the best"?

Well he's either going to go to their houses and murder them in their sleep, or set up a religion forum hall of fame. I suspect its the latter, if it is the former please nominate someone other than me.
August_Burns_Red
Posts: 1,253
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8/21/2015 1:49:09 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

But none of us can know any of those answers, since none of us here dont really know each other, only what we post here. Like who's the most devout Christian? Who knows? to give my opinion on that I'd need to know them all here and see their Good Works. And know if they truly Pray and believe in God and in the Teachings of Jesus. Forgive me if Im wrong, anybody, but I really dont feel to many so-called Christians here do Good Works, at least not on the level Jesus or God the Father would want. I just got back from serving dinner at the Homeless shelter downtown with a couple guys from my Church. I saw TRUE Christians there. I KNOW what they and we do. What we think. What we want to do with our lives. but of the DDO folks here I know NONE of that. Even if I did I wouldnt give my vote because that would be to Judge, which goes against what Jesus taught. I also cannot cast blame or accusations---which MANY folks here are expert at--because that is ignoring my own Plank cuz of my Brother's speck.
As far as the most vigorous Atheists? That would be a dubious acheivement? When I was one if I was here it would have been me. But that got me nowhere and alost killed me. So what good is that award. Biggest Atheist = "Most Lost Soul." Not hardly award-worthy. But the Good News (Gospels!) is that the lost can be Found! THAT is award worthy!!! God Bless.

I notice no Jews here. And I avoid Muslims for my own reasons. Not accusing them of anything, just my own personal ideas.
Tomorrow's forecast: God reigns and the Son shines!
Blade-of-Truth
Posts: 5,032
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8/21/2015 2:35:25 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 2:00:00 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 8/20/2015 8:41:21 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 8/20/2015 8:18:19 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Why?

Because this is the most popular forum on the site and deserves its community leaders to be recognized.

Why? I would prefer better forum moderation than wasting time on that crap.

I hear your concerns, and can just say that there is a method to my madness. If you'd like to reply with your nominations, I'd be grateful!
Debate.org Deputy Vote Moderator
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DDO Voting Guide: http://www.debate.org...
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Need a judge on your debate? Nominate me! http://www.debate.org...
Blade-of-Truth
Posts: 5,032
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8/21/2015 2:36:33 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 4:49:33 PM, Chaosism wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

This is a nice intention, but I think it would be a bad idea. The categories aren't that cleanly established; Christians quite frequently disagree with other Christians and that goes for each of the other categories, as well. Such a declaration of superiority would serve only to sharpen the lines that have already been drawn between everyone. This could easily lead to egotistical flaming and attacks of character.

My two cents...

Good points. Perhaps I should re-state the question...

Who has the loudest voices here in the respective categories and who do you personally respect the most?
Debate.org Deputy Vote Moderator
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DDO Voting Guide: http://www.debate.org...
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Blade-of-Truth
Posts: 5,032
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8/21/2015 2:39:19 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 7:10:29 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Thanks for the sentiment. However, I don't think it'll receive much traction in this forum. Given, the nature of the topics being discussed and the average age of participants being significantly older, people won't want this forum turned into a popularity contest. A discussion over ultimate truth doesn't mix well with popularity.

Thanks again for the thought though.

Yeah, I'm starting to notice that.... Ultimately I just want to know, in your opinion, who are the most respectable voices within the categories given?
Debate.org Deputy Vote Moderator
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DDO Voting Guide: http://www.debate.org...
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Blade-of-Truth
Posts: 5,032
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8/21/2015 2:39:50 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 9:36:20 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Lol, what are you going to do when you find the "best of the best"?

That's for me to know, and for you to find out.
Debate.org Deputy Vote Moderator
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
DDO Voting Guide: http://www.debate.org...
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Need a judge on your debate? Nominate me! http://www.debate.org...
annanicole
Posts: 19,785
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8/21/2015 2:51:48 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 2:36:33 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 8/20/2015 4:49:33 PM, Chaosism wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

This is a nice intention, but I think it would be a bad idea. The categories aren't that cleanly established; Christians quite frequently disagree with other Christians and that goes for each of the other categories, as well. Such a declaration of superiority would serve only to sharpen the lines that have already been drawn between everyone. This could easily lead to egotistical flaming and attacks of character.

My two cents...

Good points. Perhaps I should re-state the question...

Who has the loudest voices here in the respective categories

I'd like to nominate MadCornish as the leading representative of shunned/disfellowshipped/kicked out Jehovah's Witnesses.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
August_Burns_Red
Posts: 1,253
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8/21/2015 2:53:58 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 2:39:50 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 8/20/2015 9:36:20 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Lol, what are you going to do when you find the "best of the best"?

That's for me to know, and for you to find out.

What CAN Serato do? Nothing. LOL
Tomorrow's forecast: God reigns and the Son shines!
tstor
Posts: 1,467
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8/21/2015 2:56:09 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 2:51:48 AM, annanicole wrote:

I'd like to nominate MadCornish as the leading representative of shunned/disfellowshipped/kicked out Jehovah's Witnesses.
This is just bad taste and you know it.
"The afternoon came down as imperceptibly as age comes to a happy man. A little gold entered into the sunlight. The bay became bluer and dimpled with shore-wind ripples. Those lonely fishermen who believe that the fish bite at high tide left their rocks, and their places were taken by others, who were convinced that the fish bite at low tide." (John Steinbeck; Tortilla Flat, 1935)
annanicole
Posts: 19,785
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8/21/2015 2:57:33 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 2:56:09 AM, tstor wrote:
At 8/21/2015 2:51:48 AM, annanicole wrote:

I'd like to nominate MadCornish as the leading representative of shunned/disfellowshipped/kicked out Jehovah's Witnesses.
This is just bad taste and you know it.

Well, I wanted to nominate him for something, and of the four or five categories I had in mind, that one was the most complimentary.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
tstor
Posts: 1,467
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8/21/2015 3:00:37 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 2:57:33 AM, annanicole wrote:

Well, I wanted to nominate him for something, and of the four or five categories I had in mind, that one was the most complimentary.
Why not nominate him for the most devout Christian? Afterall, he is working hard to overcome being disfellowshipped and to become an active member again.
"The afternoon came down as imperceptibly as age comes to a happy man. A little gold entered into the sunlight. The bay became bluer and dimpled with shore-wind ripples. Those lonely fishermen who believe that the fish bite at high tide left their rocks, and their places were taken by others, who were convinced that the fish bite at low tide." (John Steinbeck; Tortilla Flat, 1935)
ReformedPresbyterian72598
Posts: 293
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8/21/2015 3:02:20 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Haha, flattered. :P My question is: how devout can we get? We talking "Thundering from the pulpit" here? Lol.
If so, I feel like that sometimes. I may be a pastor someday(probably in my retired life), we'll see.
The best of the best is hard to find my friend, I'm not sure you will find it. You've gotta know the highest level of devoutness, and I'm not sure who does.
annanicole
Posts: 19,785
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8/21/2015 3:02:50 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 3:00:37 AM, tstor wrote:
At 8/21/2015 2:57:33 AM, annanicole wrote:

Well, I wanted to nominate him for something, and of the four or five categories I had in mind, that one was the most complimentary.
Why not nominate him for the most devout Christian?

Because he says he's not a Christian in the first place. He decided that the appellation was applied in derision to followers of Christ by some "Greek oracle." Don't ask me the reasoning that he used.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
tstor
Posts: 1,467
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8/21/2015 3:04:50 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 3:02:50 AM, annanicole wrote:

Because he says he's not a Christian in the first place. He decided that the appellation was applied in derision to followers of Christ by some "Greek oracle." Don't ask me the reasoning that he used.
Well, I wouldn't know about Greek oracles.
"The afternoon came down as imperceptibly as age comes to a happy man. A little gold entered into the sunlight. The bay became bluer and dimpled with shore-wind ripples. Those lonely fishermen who believe that the fish bite at high tide left their rocks, and their places were taken by others, who were convinced that the fish bite at low tide." (John Steinbeck; Tortilla Flat, 1935)
annanicole
Posts: 19,785
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8/21/2015 3:10:27 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 3:04:50 AM, tstor wrote:
At 8/21/2015 3:02:50 AM, annanicole wrote:

Because he says he's not a Christian in the first place. He decided that the appellation was applied in derision to followers of Christ by some "Greek oracle." Don't ask me the reasoning that he used.
Well, I wouldn't know about Greek oracles.

That makes three of us. He had to make up something on the spur of the moment since chrematizo ("called" in Acts 11: 26, "The disciples were called Christians first at Antioch.") carries with the meaning of "divinely called".

"to give a response to those consulting an oracle, to give a divine command or admonition; to teach from heaven, to be divinely commanded, admonished, instructed; to be the mouthpiece of divine revelations, to promulgate the commands of God"

He saw the "oracle" part up there in the definition and concluded that the name came from a Greek oracle.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,095
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8/21/2015 4:51:13 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Okay, I'll play since no one else will.

Atheist: Ruv Draba

Christian: PGA

Muslim: Yassine

Jew: I'll abstain on this one. I have only seen one Jew participating in this forum - and then only sporadically.

If I didn't mention your name - sorry. There are many who could easily have been nominated, but these were the first to come to mind.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
Chaosism
Posts: 2,662
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8/21/2015 1:34:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 2:36:33 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 8/20/2015 4:49:33 PM, Chaosism wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

This is a nice intention, but I think it would be a bad idea. The categories aren't that cleanly established; Christians quite frequently disagree with other Christians and that goes for each of the other categories, as well. Such a declaration of superiority would serve only to sharpen the lines that have already been drawn between everyone. This could easily lead to egotistical flaming and attacks of character.

My two cents...

Good points. Perhaps I should re-state the question...

Who has the loudest voices here in the respective categories and who do you personally respect the most?

The only one I feel I can say stands out from their group is RuvDraba for atheism.
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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8/21/2015 1:50:26 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 2:39:50 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 8/20/2015 9:36:20 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Lol, what are you going to do when you find the "best of the best"?

That's for me to know, and for you to find out.

Well you will be hard pressed to find someone more "devout" than me, though we are all at different levels and commitment I'm not very old but I have been consistent in my beliefs for 30 of my 37 years of life and have no plans of turning back. I've known some pretty strong believers but you must realize this whole thing is a process, a cultivation that really never ends until we leave this physical body and even then we have much to learn, none of us are in a perfect state of condition other than what God has given grace to, that is why we keep moving forward, because we keep receiving, Christianity is a cycle of giving and receiving, tearing down and rebuilding, dying to the flesh and living in the Spirit....

Sorry about the rant but let me know when you know so I can find out lol....
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
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8/21/2015 1:57:15 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 4:51:13 AM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Okay, I'll play since no one else will.

Atheist: Ruv Draba
I second this nomination. He is the most articulate member of the forum as well.

Christian: PGA

Muslim: Yassine

Jew: I'll abstain on this one. I have only seen one Jew participating in this forum - and then only sporadically.


If I didn't mention your name - sorry. There are many who could easily have been nominated, but these were the first to come to mind.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,622
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8/21/2015 2:35:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 2:35:25 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 8/20/2015 2:00:00 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 8/20/2015 8:41:21 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
At 8/20/2015 8:18:19 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 8/20/2015 7:25:17 AM, Blade-of-Truth wrote:
I'd like to know the following:

Who is the most rigorous atheist here?

Who is the most devout Christian?

Who is the most devout Muslim?

Who is the most devout Jew?

...

I am seeking the best-of-the-best. I'd truly appreciate serious nominations only. Please partake in the nomination process and let your voices be heard!!

Why?

Because this is the most popular forum on the site and deserves its community leaders to be recognized.

Why? I would prefer better forum moderation than wasting time on that crap.

I hear your concerns, and can just say that there is a method to my madness. If you'd like to reply with your nominations, I'd be grateful!

Yes, I understand it's so much easier to have a mutual admiration contest than engage in making the forums better. I've noticed all the little pet projects going on, like making these kinds of thread, trailers for fake movies, hang out threads, that sort of thing, to wile away the time in meaningless chatter instead of actually doing something constructive. This thread is an insult to injury.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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8/21/2015 5:33:26 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Is RuvDraba really an atheist?
I found an exchange between us where he claimed to be some hybrid. The OP should add a category for hybrids such as RuvDraba instead of stealing the spot from some true atheist who worked hard to remain true to his disbelief in the existence of God..

In "The preponderance of evidence has swayed me."

http://www.debate.org...

RuvDraba said.

At 7/10/2015 10:51:14 AM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/10/2015 3:37:24 PM, RuvDraba wrote:

Most atheists are Deistically agnostic (they have no reason to accept or reject that the universe was created.)
That is not possible.
"The agnostic believes only what is knowable. He rejects revelation and the doctrine of the Trinity as "past human understanding." He is neither theist, deist, nor atheist, as all these are past understanding."
"The atheist disbelieves even the existence of a God. He thinks matter is eternal, and what we call "creation" is the result of natural laws."

I'm agnostic Drew, in the sense that I profess to don't know, but not antignostic in the sense of believing we can't possibly know.
Yes, I'm deistically agnostic. I don't presume to guess the probability of deism being correct, because probability requires a representative sample space, while we can't sample at all. So I believe we can't guess what's probable with any integrity; we can only discuss what's plausible. The basic deistic premise is plausible, but not the only plausible account for the universe we see. Moreover Deism often includes some unacknowledged assumptions borrowed from theology, to which I'm opposed. Which leads me to...

Again it is not possible to be both deist and agnostic because:
"A deist believes there is a God who created all things, but does not believe in His superintendence and government. He thinks the Creator implanted in all things certain immutable laws, called the Laws of Nature, which act per se, as a watch acts without the supervision of its maker. Like the theist, he does not believe in the doctrine of the Trinity, nor in a divine revelation."
"The agnostic believes only what is knowable. He rejects revelation and the doctrine of the Trinity as "past human understanding." He is neither theist, deist, nor atheist, as all these are past understanding."

I'm not simply atheistic. I'm antitheistic. By that I mean, I don't just reject the truth of theology; under most modern circumstances I oppose the propagation of theology as a needless humanitarian abuse (albeit, often ignorantly and unintentionally abusive, as passive smoking was once for babies.)

I'm not militant about it, in the sense of agitating for the abolition of religion. I don't hate theistic people or even theistic institutions. Nor do I disrespect the fundamental motives behind the theological endeavour: to provide comfort, cultural cohesion and human dignity. It just means I oppose theology as an outdated, unnecessary and often harmful means of pursuing those ends.

So I hold that I have no burden of proof to be deistically agnostic, while theists and deists hold a burden of proof to advocate for their beliefs. I also have no burden of proof to reject theology as truth, however theists hold a burden of proof to demonstrate both creation and the metaphysical efficacy of their theology.

However, I do hold a burden of proof to show theology generally harmful and unnecessary (and to acknowledge those times when it's not harmful, or vaguely beneficial), and also acknowledge an intellectual obligation to hold deistic and theistic pseudoproofs to critical account...

You are simply an " Anti-theist. A person who holds the view that organized religion when considered throughout the centuries has been a destructive force in society."

...and that's not hard since theology is one of the most corrupt, cynical and evasive intellectual endeavours ever devised, while deism is more an aesthetic apprehension than a philosophy anyway. :D

It is hard to be a anti-theist as well as a deists. If you already believe in God how can you be against religion whose purpose is to spread the knowledge of God?

So there's a high-level mental map of how I apprehend our metaphysics. I hope that may be useful. :)
All this suggests is you are obsessed with God, religion and at the same time struggling with your atheistic inclination.
You are in the classical sense a fence sitter an equal opportunity offender. Giving equal weight to unsubstantiated positions knowing they all cannot be right shows your lack of integrity or conviction. I wonder if your geographic isolation from the rest of the world contributes to your isolated position.

Hi Hari. Since you have worked so hard to persuade me that you are a sadist, a bully and a grudge-carrying obsessive, I'm sorry to say that I now pay very little heed to what you think.

On the other hand, if you believe you have a legitimate philosophical point to make, and that you can make it without insult, then I'm happy to overlook your deficiencies of character while ever you can manage to conceal them in your posts.

If you feel you can, you are welcome to repost your argument above, without the insults, and if you can manage that, I'll read it and respond. :)

If you can't though, please don't be afraid of disappointing me. I assure you, you won't.
Chaosism
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8/21/2015 6:02:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
This is the reason why I thought this concept was a bad idea. I'm not implying that Harikrish is attacking here, but this can escalate depending on who is the subject and what is said.

Can I give my opinion, Harikrish?

At 8/21/2015 5:33:26 PM, Harikrish wrote:
Is RuvDraba really an atheist?
I found an exchange between us where he claimed to be some hybrid. The OP should add a category for hybrids such as RuvDraba instead of stealing the spot from some true atheist who worked hard to remain true to his disbelief in the existence of God..

In "The preponderance of evidence has swayed me."

http://www.debate.org...

RuvDraba said.


At 7/10/2015 10:51:14 AM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/10/2015 3:37:24 PM, RuvDraba wrote:

Most atheists are Deistically agnostic (they have no reason to accept or reject that the universe was created.)
That is not possible.
"The agnostic believes only what is knowable. He rejects revelation and the doctrine of the Trinity as "past human understanding." He is neither theist, deist, nor atheist, as all these are past understanding."
"The atheist disbelieves even the existence of a God. He thinks matter is eternal, and what we call "creation" is the result of natural laws."

It looks like he said, "Deistically agnostic", not "an agnostic deist". I understand this stance. There is literally no information to go by about a deistic God; there is nothing knowable or proclaimed about such a being. Therefore, there is nothing by which to determine the possible existence of such a God. With Theism, the Gods are known to mankind and at least some of their attributes and motives are known or described by holy books, so there is at least something to assess in terms of reason, although the concept is still scientifically unfalsifiable. It is ridiculous for one to claim that a deistic God does not exist, given the existence of the natural world is the only evidence that is subject to evaluation. It is impossible to calculate a probability.

I'm agnostic Drew, in the sense that I profess to don't know, but not antignostic in the sense of believing we can't possibly know.
Yes, I'm deistically agnostic. I don't presume to guess the probability of deism being correct, because probability requires a representative sample space, while we can't sample at all. So I believe we can't guess what's probable with any integrity; we can only discuss what's plausible. The basic deistic premise is plausible, but not the only plausible account for the universe we see. Moreover Deism often includes some unacknowledged assumptions borrowed from theology, to which I'm opposed. Which leads me to...

Again it is not possible to be both deist and agnostic because:
"A deist believes there is a God who created all things, but does not believe in His superintendence and government. He thinks the Creator implanted in all things certain immutable laws, called the Laws of Nature, which act per se, as a watch acts without the supervision of its maker. Like the theist, he does not believe in the doctrine of the Trinity, nor in a divine revelation."
"The agnostic believes only what is knowable. He rejects revelation and the doctrine of the Trinity as "past human understanding." He is neither theist, deist, nor atheist, as all these are past understanding."

"The agnostic believes only what is knowable" doesn't fit for the meaning of the word, "agnostic" to me. It is the belief that such things are ultimately unknowable to us, not that one can't believe such things. The lack of belief only pertains to God, specifically.

Agnostic : A person who believes that nothing is known or can be known of the existence or nature of God or of anything beyond material phenomena; a person who claims neither faith nor disbelief in God. (Oxford, US)

I'm not simply atheistic. I'm antitheistic. By that I mean, I don't just reject the truth of theology; under most modern circumstances I oppose the propagation of theology as a needless humanitarian abuse (albeit, often ignorantly and unintentionally abusive, as passive smoking was once for babies.)

I'm not militant about it, in the sense of agitating for the abolition of religion. I don't hate theistic people or even theistic institutions. Nor do I disrespect the fundamental motives behind the theological endeavour: to provide comfort, cultural cohesion and human dignity. It just means I oppose theology as an outdated, unnecessary and often harmful means of pursuing those ends.

So I hold that I have no burden of proof to be deistically agnostic, while theists and deists hold a burden of proof to advocate for their beliefs. I also have no burden of proof to reject theology as truth, however theists hold a burden of proof to demonstrate both creation and the metaphysical efficacy of their theology.

However, I do hold a burden of proof to show theology generally harmful and unnecessary (and to acknowledge those times when it's not harmful, or vaguely beneficial), and also acknowledge an intellectual obligation to hold deistic and theistic pseudoproofs to critical account...

You are simply an " Anti-theist. A person who holds the view that organized religion when considered throughout the centuries has been a destructive force in society."


...and that's not hard since theology is one of the most corrupt, cynical and evasive intellectual endeavours ever devised, while deism is more an aesthetic apprehension than a philosophy anyway. :D

It is hard to be a anti-theist as well as a deists. If you already believe in God how can you be against religion whose purpose is to spread the knowledge of God?

So there's a high-level mental map of how I apprehend our metaphysics. I hope that may be useful. :)
All this suggests is you are obsessed with God, religion and at the same time struggling with your atheistic inclination.
You are in the classical sense a fence sitter an equal opportunity offender. Giving equal weight to unsubstantiated positions knowing they all cannot be right shows your lack of integrity or conviction. I wonder if your geographic isolation from the rest of the world contributes to your isolated position.

Hi Hari. Since you have worked so hard to persuade me that you are a sadist, a bully and a grudge-carrying obsessive, I'm sorry to say that I now pay very little heed to what you think.

On the other hand, if you believe you have a legitimate philosophical point to make, and that you can make it without insult, then I'm happy to overlook your deficiencies of character while ever you can manage to conceal them in your posts.

If you feel you can, you are welcome to repost your argument above, without the insults, and if you can manage that, I'll read it and respond. :)

If you can't though, please don't be afraid of disappointing me. I assure you, you won't.
RuvDraba
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8/21/2015 8:08:23 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 8/21/2015 5:33:26 PM, Harikrish wrote:
Is RuvDraba really an atheist?

Let me resolve this simply.

For reasons other members have already articulated quite clearly, I do not support the premise of this thread, and decline to participate.

If you want to engage me on any other matter, Hari, kindly make your own thread.

Thanks.