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Stumbling isn't the end

MadCornishBiker
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9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

And I have no intention of judging them.

As Christ's servants they get judged by him from day to day, as I do in fact, yes they get an adverse judgement when they are wrong, but when they put it right the judgement goes back to where it belongs.

They and I keep in mind words you would do well to remember:

James 3:2
ASV(i) 2 For in many things we all stumble. If any stumbleth not in word, the same is a perfect man, able to bridle the whole body also.

Why did James remind us of that?

Because unlike the Job's comforters like those who can't forget the history of the JWs, who always look on the black side, Christ does not.

He knows the Brothers have always been faithful servants. He knows their hearts and so make allowances when they stumble, just so long as they get back up again.

They always have, and always will.

That is Christ's judgement of them, if it is not yours, that is your loss.

They stumble, they struggle, but they get up of their metaphorical knees and do something about it.

They don't hide behind some fantasy world.

They don't hide behind false doctrines they don't have the courage to turn away from. They don't look back. As scripture tells us we must, they keep their eyes on the Prize that is ahead and get up off their knees if needs be and get on with life.

Do you have the courage to do that?
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

OF COURSE, the JW's are "judged" for their past mistakes, just as the supposed prophet spoken of in Deuteronomy was to be "judged" for his false prophesies. Certainly the false prophet of Deuteronomy was to be forgiven upon his repentance for his lies. Anyone should be. He should be forgiven for claiming that God spoke through him, if he repented. He should be forgiven for claiming that he has some special insight through the Holy Spirit, if he repented. That doesn't mean that people are obligated to pay much attention to him in the future, though.

Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit that the Holy Spirit does NOT directly influence any of them, including the Governing Body? Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit they it has made some pretty outrageous claims? Ummmmm .... no, of course not! What you do not seem to comprehend is that the tap root of their entire prophetic system is wrong - yet they cling tenaciously to it, all the while begging forgiveness and acceptance decade after decade. It doesn't work that way.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

OF COURSE, the JW's are "judged" for their past mistakes, just as the supposed prophet spoken of in Deuteronomy was to be "judged" for his false prophesies. Certainly the false prophet of Deuteronomy was to be forgiven upon his repentance for his lies. Anyone should be. He should be forgiven for claiming that God spoke through him, if he repented. He should be forgiven for claiming that he has some special insight through the Holy Spirit, if he repented. That doesn't mean that people are obligated to pay much attention to him in the future, though.

No but it does mean they should take care to check out what they teach and see if it is in line with scripture, which it is.

Past mistakes are always forgiven, if you still maintain an honest attitude pick yourself up.

Where would we be now if Christ hadn't immediately been forgiven the errors he made?

Would his following have done what you did and said "Wrong predication, we can;t trust him any more"?

With your attitude that is precisely what they would have done, but they didn't.

True, they had his past record to go by, you don't.

However that is no excuse for simply assuming that it is "once wrong always wrong".

There has been more than enough time one for Jehovah's backing of them to become obvious to any who know the history of the organisation from, just as an arbitrary date, 1935 on.

Of curse to someone like you who doesn't believe in holy spirit, or at least in what it really is, or how it is used,, that would mean little.

I wonder how you would feel if you went on the website and read some of the yearbooks you would find on there?

I doubt it would make much difference to you because your feelings about them are fanatical and not open to reason.


Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit that the Holy Spirit does NOT directly influence any of them, including the Governing Body? Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit they it has made some pretty outrageous claims? Ummmmm .... no, of course not! What you do not seem to comprehend is that the tap root of their entire prophetic system is wrong - yet they cling tenaciously to it, all the while begging forgiveness and acceptance decade after decade. It doesn't work that way.

Why would they admit something which isn't true.

Holy spirit definitely does guide them. Any errors have been when they have tried to move a head of them.

What you forget is the meaning of the word "guide".

That is what holy spirit is used to do. It is not used to force them to think certain thoughts, or carry out certain actions, it has never been used that way.

It is a guide and guides can be ignored, missed, moved ahead of.

If you knew as much about them as I do you would not be able to doubt the influence of holy spirit on their thinking and actions.

Of course like so many you don;t know, and don;t really want to know. Despite scripture making it very clear what sort of people Jehovah uses, you look down on the lowly state of many, but definitely not all of them.

It is exactly that attitude which Jesus had in mind when he told his disciples what he did at Matthew 13:15, and which puts you firmly in that bracket.
thegraduate
Posts: 7
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9/23/2015 3:32:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

And I have no intention of judging them.

As Christ's servants they get judged by him from day to day, as I do in fact, yes they get an adverse judgement when they are wrong, but when they put it right the judgement goes back to where it belongs.

They and I keep in mind words you would do well to remember:

James 3:2
ASV(i) 2 For in many things we all stumble. If any stumbleth not in word, the same is a perfect man, able to bridle the whole body also.

Why did James remind us of that?

Because unlike the Job's comforters like those who can't forget the history of the JWs, who always look on the black side, Christ does not.

He knows the Brothers have always been faithful servants. He knows their hearts and so make allowances when they stumble, just so long as they get back up again.

They always have, and always will.

That is Christ's judgement of them, if it is not yours, that is your loss.

They stumble, they struggle, but they get up of their metaphorical knees and do something about it.

They don't hide behind some fantasy world.

They don't hide behind false doctrines they don't have the courage to turn away from. They don't look back. As scripture tells us we must, they keep their eyes on the Prize that is ahead and get up off their knees if needs be and get on with life.

Do you have the courage to do that? : :

I have enough courage to stand before any man on this planet and tell them I speak for our Creator. I will be killed for being the voice of God and that's what most prophets and all the other saints had to face in this world.

Revelation 6
9: When he opened the fifth seal, I saw under the altar the souls of those who had been slain for the word of God and for the witness they had borne;
10: they cried out with a loud voice, "O Sovereign Lord, holy and true, how long before thou wilt judge and avenge our blood on those who dwell upon the earth?"
11: Then they were each given a white robe and told to rest a little longer, until the number of their fellow servants and their brethren should be complete, who were to be killed as they themselves had been.
bulproof
Posts: 25,203
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9/23/2015 3:35:30 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
It is exactly that attitude which Jesus had in mind when he told his disciples what he did at Matthew 13:15, and which puts you firmly in that bracket.
Allegedly that wasn't Jesus but Mick.
Can you confirm that for us and what ever happened to Jesus when Mick moved in?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

OF COURSE, the JW's are "judged" for their past mistakes, just as the supposed prophet spoken of in Deuteronomy was to be "judged" for his false prophesies. Certainly the false prophet of Deuteronomy was to be forgiven upon his repentance for his lies. Anyone should be. He should be forgiven for claiming that God spoke through him, if he repented. He should be forgiven for claiming that he has some special insight through the Holy Spirit, if he repented. That doesn't mean that people are obligated to pay much attention to him in the future, though.

No but it does mean they should take care to check out what they teach and see if it is in line with scripture, which it is.

Past mistakes are always forgiven, if you still maintain an honest attitude pick yourself up.

Where would we be now if Christ hadn't immediately been forgiven the errors he made?

Would his following have done what you did and said "Wrong predication, we can;t trust him any more"?

With your attitude that is precisely what they would have done, but they didn't.

True, they had his past record to go by, you don't.

However that is no excuse for simply assuming that it is "once wrong always wrong".

There has been more than enough time one for Jehovah's backing of them to become obvious to any who know the history of the organisation from, just as an arbitrary date, 1935 on.

Of curse to someone like you who doesn't believe in holy spirit, or at least in what it really is, or how it is used,, that would mean little.

I wonder how you would feel if you went on the website and read some of the yearbooks you would find on there?

I doubt it would make much difference to you because your feelings about them are fanatical and not open to reason.


Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit that the Holy Spirit does NOT directly influence any of them, including the Governing Body? Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit they it has made some pretty outrageous claims? Ummmmm .... no, of course not! What you do not seem to comprehend is that the tap root of their entire prophetic system is wrong - yet they cling tenaciously to it, all the while begging forgiveness and acceptance decade after decade. It doesn't work that way.

Why would they admit something which isn't true.

Holy spirit definitely does guide them. Any errors have been when they have tried to move a head of them.

What you forget is the meaning of the word "guide".

That is what holy spirit is used to do. It is not used to force them to think certain thoughts, or carry out certain actions, it has never been used that way.

"And when they bring you before the synagogues, and the rulers, and the authorities, be not anxious how or what ye shall answer, or what ye shall say: for the Holy Spirit shall teach you in that very hour what ye ought to say." (Luke 12: 11-12)

Does that sound like the Jehovah's Witnesses? Of course not!
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
thegraduate
Posts: 7
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9/23/2015 3:52:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

OF COURSE, the JW's are "judged" for their past mistakes, just as the supposed prophet spoken of in Deuteronomy was to be "judged" for his false prophesies. Certainly the false prophet of Deuteronomy was to be forgiven upon his repentance for his lies. Anyone should be. He should be forgiven for claiming that God spoke through him, if he repented. He should be forgiven for claiming that he has some special insight through the Holy Spirit, if he repented. That doesn't mean that people are obligated to pay much attention to him in the future, though.

No but it does mean they should take care to check out what they teach and see if it is in line with scripture, which it is.

Past mistakes are always forgiven, if you still maintain an honest attitude pick yourself up.

Where would we be now if Christ hadn't immediately been forgiven the errors he made?

Would his following have done what you did and said "Wrong predication, we can;t trust him any more"?

With your attitude that is precisely what they would have done, but they didn't.

True, they had his past record to go by, you don't.

However that is no excuse for simply assuming that it is "once wrong always wrong".

There has been more than enough time one for Jehovah's backing of them to become obvious to any who know the history of the organisation from, just as an arbitrary date, 1935 on.

Of curse to someone like you who doesn't believe in holy spirit, or at least in what it really is, or how it is used,, that would mean little.

I wonder how you would feel if you went on the website and read some of the yearbooks you would find on there?

I doubt it would make much difference to you because your feelings about them are fanatical and not open to reason.


Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit that the Holy Spirit does NOT directly influence any of them, including the Governing Body? Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit they it has made some pretty outrageous claims? Ummmmm .... no, of course not! What you do not seem to comprehend is that the tap root of their entire prophetic system is wrong - yet they cling tenaciously to it, all the while begging forgiveness and acceptance decade after decade. It doesn't work that way.

Why would they admit something which isn't true.

Holy spirit definitely does guide them. Any errors have been when they have tried to move a head of them.

What you forget is the meaning of the word "guide".

That is what holy spirit is used to do. It is not used to force them to think certain thoughts, or carry out certain actions, it has never been used that way.

"And when they bring you before the synagogues, and the rulers, and the authorities, be not anxious how or what ye shall answer, or what ye shall say: for the Holy Spirit shall teach you in that very hour what ye ought to say." (Luke 12: 11-12)

Does that sound like the Jehovah's Witnesses? Of course not! : :

The Beast of God teaches Christians everything but the Truth.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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9/23/2015 3:55:07 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 3:52:54 PM, thegraduate wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

The Beast of God teaches Christians everything but the Truth.

Run along, Brad. Go wait around in the Campbell Community Center. Surely your number will eventually turn up.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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9/23/2015 5:13:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

OF COURSE, the JW's are "judged" for their past mistakes, just as the supposed prophet spoken of in Deuteronomy was to be "judged" for his false prophesies. Certainly the false prophet of Deuteronomy was to be forgiven upon his repentance for his lies. Anyone should be. He should be forgiven for claiming that God spoke through him, if he repented. He should be forgiven for claiming that he has some special insight through the Holy Spirit, if he repented. That doesn't mean that people are obligated to pay much attention to him in the future, though.

No but it does mean they should take care to check out what they teach and see if it is in line with scripture, which it is.

Past mistakes are always forgiven, if you still maintain an honest attitude pick yourself up.

Where would we be now if Christ hadn't immediately been forgiven the errors he made?

Would his following have done what you did and said "Wrong predication, we can;t trust him any more"?

With your attitude that is precisely what they would have done, but they didn't.

True, they had his past record to go by, you don't.

However that is no excuse for simply assuming that it is "once wrong always wrong".

There has been more than enough time one for Jehovah's backing of them to become obvious to any who know the history of the organisation from, just as an arbitrary date, 1935 on.

Of curse to someone like you who doesn't believe in holy spirit, or at least in what it really is, or how it is used,, that would mean little.

I wonder how you would feel if you went on the website and read some of the yearbooks you would find on there?

I doubt it would make much difference to you because your feelings about them are fanatical and not open to reason.


Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit that the Holy Spirit does NOT directly influence any of them, including the Governing Body? Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit they it has made some pretty outrageous claims? Ummmmm .... no, of course not! What you do not seem to comprehend is that the tap root of their entire prophetic system is wrong - yet they cling tenaciously to it, all the while begging forgiveness and acceptance decade after decade. It doesn't work that way.

Why would they admit something which isn't true.

Holy spirit definitely does guide them. Any errors have been when they have tried to move a head of them.

What you forget is the meaning of the word "guide".

That is what holy spirit is used to do. It is not used to force them to think certain thoughts, or carry out certain actions, it has never been used that way.

"And when they bring you before the synagogues, and the rulers, and the authorities, be not anxious how or what ye shall answer, or what ye shall say: for the Holy Spirit shall teach you in that very hour what ye ought to say." (Luke 12: 11-12)

Does that sound like the Jehovah's Witnesses? Of course not!

Yup, and you are the modern day equivalent of just that.

You slander Jesus and his father yet again. They do not leave their servants to struggle unaided, never have, never will. You are a skilled as your Master, Satan, at misapplying scripture. And as arrogant with it.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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9/23/2015 5:16:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 3:35:30 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
It is exactly that attitude which Jesus had in mind when he told his disciples what he did at Matthew 13:15, and which puts you firmly in that bracket.
Allegedly that wasn't Jesus but Mick.
Can you confirm that for us and what ever happened to Jesus when Mick moved in?

Considering that the Bible suggests that Jehovah's only begotten son carried the name Michael, and Jesus, by this stage was Jehovah's only begotten son incarnate., they were at that point, one and the same.

Scripture does not tell us what was done with Jesus body, any more than it tells us what happened to the body of Moses.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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9/23/2015 7:37:18 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 5:13:35 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

OF COURSE, the JW's are "judged" for their past mistakes, just as the supposed prophet spoken of in Deuteronomy was to be "judged" for his false prophesies. Certainly the false prophet of Deuteronomy was to be forgiven upon his repentance for his lies. Anyone should be. He should be forgiven for claiming that God spoke through him, if he repented. He should be forgiven for claiming that he has some special insight through the Holy Spirit, if he repented. That doesn't mean that people are obligated to pay much attention to him in the future, though.

No but it does mean they should take care to check out what they teach and see if it is in line with scripture, which it is.

Past mistakes are always forgiven, if you still maintain an honest attitude pick yourself up.

Where would we be now if Christ hadn't immediately been forgiven the errors he made?

Would his following have done what you did and said "Wrong predication, we can;t trust him any more"?

With your attitude that is precisely what they would have done, but they didn't.

True, they had his past record to go by, you don't.

However that is no excuse for simply assuming that it is "once wrong always wrong".

There has been more than enough time one for Jehovah's backing of them to become obvious to any who know the history of the organisation from, just as an arbitrary date, 1935 on.

Of curse to someone like you who doesn't believe in holy spirit, or at least in what it really is, or how it is used,, that would mean little.

I wonder how you would feel if you went on the website and read some of the yearbooks you would find on there?

I doubt it would make much difference to you because your feelings about them are fanatical and not open to reason.


Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit that the Holy Spirit does NOT directly influence any of them, including the Governing Body? Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit they it has made some pretty outrageous claims? Ummmmm .... no, of course not! What you do not seem to comprehend is that the tap root of their entire prophetic system is wrong - yet they cling tenaciously to it, all the while begging forgiveness and acceptance decade after decade. It doesn't work that way.

Why would they admit something which isn't true.

Holy spirit definitely does guide them. Any errors have been when they have tried to move a head of them.

What you forget is the meaning of the word "guide".

That is what holy spirit is used to do. It is not used to force them to think certain thoughts, or carry out certain actions, it has never been used that way.

"And when they bring you before the synagogues, and the rulers, and the authorities, be not anxious how or what ye shall answer, or what ye shall say: for the Holy Spirit shall teach you in that very hour what ye ought to say." (Luke 12: 11-12)

Does that sound like the Jehovah's Witnesses? Of course not!

Yup, and you are the modern day equivalent of just that.

You slander Jesus and his father yet again. They do not leave their servants to struggle unaided, never have, never will. You are a skilled as your Master, Satan, at misapplying scripture. And as arrogant with it.

Hardly. The passage states, "Take no thought of what ye shall say." Why not? Because the Holy Spirit will guide your thoughts! That's what the passage is saying.

Now we'll see exactly what YOU said. "That is what holy spirit is used to do. It is not used to force them to think certain thoughts, or carry out certain actions, it has never been used that way."

You needn't try to dwell on the word "force". That's about all you can do is quibble about your use of the word. No, the Holy Spirit gave them the very thoughts and words to express the thoughts as the parallel passage in Matt 10 states:

"But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

Was that ever true of the BotchTower Governing Body? Of course not. They claimed it, as have other fringe groups.

Well, it is a fact that Jehovah's Witnesses were delivered "before councils". I'd hate to think that their contradictory and semi-embarrassing testimony was supplied directly by the Holy Spirit.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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9/23/2015 9:08:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 7:37:18 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 5:13:35 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

OF COURSE, the JW's are "judged" for their past mistakes, just as the supposed prophet spoken of in Deuteronomy was to be "judged" for his false prophesies. Certainly the false prophet of Deuteronomy was to be forgiven upon his repentance for his lies. Anyone should be. He should be forgiven for claiming that God spoke through him, if he repented. He should be forgiven for claiming that he has some special insight through the Holy Spirit, if he repented. That doesn't mean that people are obligated to pay much attention to him in the future, though.

No but it does mean they should take care to check out what they teach and see if it is in line with scripture, which it is.

Past mistakes are always forgiven, if you still maintain an honest attitude pick yourself up.

Where would we be now if Christ hadn't immediately been forgiven the errors he made?

Would his following have done what you did and said "Wrong predication, we can;t trust him any more"?

With your attitude that is precisely what they would have done, but they didn't.

True, they had his past record to go by, you don't.

However that is no excuse for simply assuming that it is "once wrong always wrong".

There has been more than enough time one for Jehovah's backing of them to become obvious to any who know the history of the organisation from, just as an arbitrary date, 1935 on.

Of curse to someone like you who doesn't believe in holy spirit, or at least in what it really is, or how it is used,, that would mean little.

I wonder how you would feel if you went on the website and read some of the yearbooks you would find on there?

I doubt it would make much difference to you because your feelings about them are fanatical and not open to reason.


Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit that the Holy Spirit does NOT directly influence any of them, including the Governing Body? Does the BotchTower have the courage, the conviction, to fully admit they it has made some pretty outrageous claims? Ummmmm .... no, of course not! What you do not seem to comprehend is that the tap root of their entire prophetic system is wrong - yet they cling tenaciously to it, all the while begging forgiveness and acceptance decade after decade. It doesn't work that way.

Why would they admit something which isn't true.

Holy spirit definitely does guide them. Any errors have been when they have tried to move a head of them.

What you forget is the meaning of the word "guide".

That is what holy spirit is used to do. It is not used to force them to think certain thoughts, or carry out certain actions, it has never been used that way.

"And when they bring you before the synagogues, and the rulers, and the authorities, be not anxious how or what ye shall answer, or what ye shall say: for the Holy Spirit shall teach you in that very hour what ye ought to say." (Luke 12: 11-12)

Does that sound like the Jehovah's Witnesses? Of course not!

Yup, and you are the modern day equivalent of just that.

You slander Jesus and his father yet again. They do not leave their servants to struggle unaided, never have, never will. You are a skilled as your Master, Satan, at misapplying scripture. And as arrogant with it.

Hardly. The passage states, "Take no thought of what ye shall say." Why not? Because the Holy Spirit will guide your thoughts! That's what the passage is saying.

Now we'll see exactly what YOU said. "That is what holy spirit is used to do. It is not used to force them to think certain thoughts, or carry out certain actions, it has never been used that way."

You needn't try to dwell on the word "force". That's about all you can do is quibble about your use of the word. No, the Holy Spirit gave them the very thoughts and words to express the thoughts as the parallel passage in Matt 10 states:

"But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

Was that ever true of the BotchTower Governing Body? Of course not. They claimed it, as have other fringe groups.

Well, it is a fact that Jehovah's Witnesses were delivered "before councils". I'd hate to think that their contradictory and semi-embarrassing testimony was supplied directly by the Holy Spirit.

It wasn't contradictory, if you think that then you misunderstood what they were saying.

They have been hailed before many Governments in many courts throughout the world, including the European Court of Human Rights, and have frequently won outstanding victories to enable them to continue to continue in doing Christ's work and his father's will.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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9/23/2015 9:41:46 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

And I have no intention of judging them.

As Christ's servants they get judged by him from day to day, as I do in fact, yes they get an adverse judgement when they are wrong, but when they put it right the judgement goes back to where it belongs.

They and I keep in mind words you would do well to remember:

James 3:2
ASV(i) 2 For in many things we all stumble. If any stumbleth not in word, the same is a perfect man, able to bridle the whole body also.

Why did James remind us of that?

Because unlike the Job's comforters like those who can't forget the history of the JWs, who always look on the black side, Christ does not.

He knows the Brothers have always been faithful servants. He knows their hearts and so make allowances when they stumble, just so long as they get back up again.

They always have, and always will.

That is Christ's judgement of them, if it is not yours, that is your loss.

They stumble, they struggle, but they get up of their metaphorical knees and do something about it.

They don't hide behind some fantasy world.

They don't hide behind false doctrines they don't have the courage to turn away from. They don't look back. As scripture tells us we must, they keep their eyes on the Prize that is ahead and get up off their knees if needs be and get on with life.

Do you have the courage to do that?

The JW have judged you and disfellowshipped and shunned you. You now have even less credibility than the cult JW because you are not even good enough for them. Defending them is not how you achieve atonement for your wicked perverted ways. That is why you still remain banned and shunned.
Until you are reinstated you are eternally damned. You have conveniently forgotten what you agreed to when you joined the JW. Now your word is worthless trash.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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9/23/2015 11:10:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 9:08:55 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 7:37:18 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 5:13:35 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

"But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

Was that ever true of the BotchTower Governing Body? Of course not. They claimed it, as have other fringe groups.

Well, it is a fact that Jehovah's Witnesses were delivered "before councils". I'd hate to think that their contradictory and semi-embarrassing testimony was supplied directly by the Holy Spirit.

It wasn't contradictory, if you think that then you misunderstood what they were saying.

Wait a minute! Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred? That would be singularly odd, since one JW has contradicted other JW's under oath. So answer the preceding:

Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred?
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
bulproof
Posts: 25,203
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9/23/2015 11:58:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 5:16:09 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:35:30 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
It is exactly that attitude which Jesus had in mind when he told his disciples what he did at Matthew 13:15, and which puts you firmly in that bracket.
Allegedly that wasn't Jesus but Mick.
Can you confirm that for us and what ever happened to Jesus when Mick moved in?

Considering that the Bible suggests that Jehovah's only begotten son carried the name Michael, and Jesus, by this stage was Jehovah's only begotten son incarnate., they were at that point, one and the same.

Scripture does not tell us what was done with Jesus body, any more than it tells us what happened to the body of Moses.

I didn't ask what happened to his body.
I asked what happened to the person Jesus when Mick occupied his body unbidden?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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9/24/2015 11:20:28 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 11:58:22 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 9/23/2015 5:16:09 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:35:30 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
It is exactly that attitude which Jesus had in mind when he told his disciples what he did at Matthew 13:15, and which puts you firmly in that bracket.
Allegedly that wasn't Jesus but Mick.
Can you confirm that for us and what ever happened to Jesus when Mick moved in?

Considering that the Bible suggests that Jehovah's only begotten son carried the name Michael, and Jesus, by this stage was Jehovah's only begotten son incarnate., they were at that point, one and the same.

Scripture does not tell us what was done with Jesus body, any more than it tells us what happened to the body of Moses.

I didn't ask what happened to his body.
I asked what happened to the person Jesus when Mick occupied his body unbidden?

Scripture is silent on that. I guess that is between him and Jehovah.

I confess it is something I have wondered in the past.

The only thing I know for certain is that whatever happened, or happens to him it will be a suitable compensation for what he also gave up.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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9/24/2015 11:24:28 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 11:10:25 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 9:08:55 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 7:37:18 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 5:13:35 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

"But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

Was that ever true of the BotchTower Governing Body? Of course not. They claimed it, as have other fringe groups.

Well, it is a fact that Jehovah's Witnesses were delivered "before councils". I'd hate to think that their contradictory and semi-embarrassing testimony was supplied directly by the Holy Spirit.

It wasn't contradictory, if you think that then you misunderstood what they were saying.

Wait a minute! Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred? That would be singularly odd, since one JW has contradicted other JW's under oath. So answer the preceding:

Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred?

It did indeed, that is why they won so many cases against the odds.

Why would it not? It is what Christ promised to his servants for all time, and Christ does not let his servants down.

True, he doesn't stop them letting themselves down at times, but he never lets them down and never will. He is our king and current ruler, and he takes that responsibility very seriously.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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9/24/2015 11:26:29 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 9:41:46 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

And I have no intention of judging them.

As Christ's servants they get judged by him from day to day, as I do in fact, yes they get an adverse judgement when they are wrong, but when they put it right the judgement goes back to where it belongs.

They and I keep in mind words you would do well to remember:

James 3:2
ASV(i) 2 For in many things we all stumble. If any stumbleth not in word, the same is a perfect man, able to bridle the whole body also.

Why did James remind us of that?

Because unlike the Job's comforters like those who can't forget the history of the JWs, who always look on the black side, Christ does not.

He knows the Brothers have always been faithful servants. He knows their hearts and so make allowances when they stumble, just so long as they get back up again.

They always have, and always will.

That is Christ's judgement of them, if it is not yours, that is your loss.

They stumble, they struggle, but they get up of their metaphorical knees and do something about it.

They don't hide behind some fantasy world.

They don't hide behind false doctrines they don't have the courage to turn away from. They don't look back. As scripture tells us we must, they keep their eyes on the Prize that is ahead and get up off their knees if needs be and get on with life.

Do you have the courage to do that?

The JW have judged you and disfellowshipped and shunned you. You now have even less credibility than the cult JW because you are not even good enough for them. Defending them is not how you achieve atonement for your wicked perverted ways. That is why you still remain banned and shunned.
Until you are reinstated you are eternally damned. You have conveniently forgotten what you agreed to when you joined the JW. Now your word is worthless trash.

As scripture says, no man can judge me.
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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9/24/2015 2:02:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/23/2015 9:41:46 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

And I have no intention of judging them.

As Christ's servants they get judged by him from day to day, as I do in fact, yes they get an adverse judgement when they are wrong, but when they put it right the judgement goes back to where it belongs.

They and I keep in mind words you would do well to remember:

James 3:2
ASV(i) 2 For in many things we all stumble. If any stumbleth not in word, the same is a perfect man, able to bridle the whole body also.

Why did James remind us of that?

Because unlike the Job's comforters like those who can't forget the history of the JWs, who always look on the black side, Christ does not.

He knows the Brothers have always been faithful servants. He knows their hearts and so make allowances when they stumble, just so long as they get back up again.

They always have, and always will.

That is Christ's judgement of them, if it is not yours, that is your loss.

They stumble, they struggle, but they get up of their metaphorical knees and do something about it.

They don't hide behind some fantasy world.

They don't hide behind false doctrines they don't have the courage to turn away from. They don't look back. As scripture tells us we must, they keep their eyes on the Prize that is ahead and get up off their knees if needs be and get on with life.

Do you have the courage to do that?

The JW have judged you and disfellowshipped and shunned you. You now have even less credibility than the cult JW because you are not even good enough for them. Defending them is not how you achieve atonement for your wicked perverted ways. That is why you still remain banned and shunned.
Until you are reinstated you are eternally damned. You have conveniently forgotten what you agreed to when you joined the JW. Now your word is worthless trash.

It is very sad that MCB is so desperate to get his place back in that nasty cult, he spends so much time on this forum singing their evil praises, to no avail. I doubt there is anyone who treats him seriously, even the ghastly JWs!
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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9/24/2015 2:50:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/24/2015 2:02:53 PM, JJ50 wrote:
At 9/23/2015 9:41:46 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

And I have no intention of judging them.

As Christ's servants they get judged by him from day to day, as I do in fact, yes they get an adverse judgement when they are wrong, but when they put it right the judgement goes back to where it belongs.

They and I keep in mind words you would do well to remember:

James 3:2
ASV(i) 2 For in many things we all stumble. If any stumbleth not in word, the same is a perfect man, able to bridle the whole body also.

Why did James remind us of that?

Because unlike the Job's comforters like those who can't forget the history of the JWs, who always look on the black side, Christ does not.

He knows the Brothers have always been faithful servants. He knows their hearts and so make allowances when they stumble, just so long as they get back up again.

They always have, and always will.

That is Christ's judgement of them, if it is not yours, that is your loss.

They stumble, they struggle, but they get up of their metaphorical knees and do something about it.

They don't hide behind some fantasy world.

They don't hide behind false doctrines they don't have the courage to turn away from. They don't look back. As scripture tells us we must, they keep their eyes on the Prize that is ahead and get up off their knees if needs be and get on with life.

Do you have the courage to do that?

The JW have judged you and disfellowshipped and shunned you. You now have even less credibility than the cult JW because you are not even good enough for them. Defending them is not how you achieve atonement for your wicked perverted ways. That is why you still remain banned and shunned.
Until you are reinstated you are eternally damned. You have conveniently forgotten what you agreed to when you joined the JW. Now your word is worthless trash.

It is very sad that MCB is so desperate to get his place back in that nasty cult, he spends so much time on this forum singing their evil praises, to no avail. I doubt there is anyone who treats him seriously, even the ghastly JWs!
You must have noticed no JW member will engage MCB. Until he is reinstated he is eternally damned and to be shunned by all JW members. He has proven time and again to be a person of low character and his words are worthless trash. 4 divorces and his dismissal by the JW shows his lack of fidelity and commitment. He tried to blame it on his parents then his mental condition. Yet he continues to exploit the people closest and farthest from him like the exotic Asians he has targeted to be his live in caretaker. She doesn't look very big or strong to be pushing around a fat Buffalo like him in a wheel chair.
All his pretentious sacrimonous BS and public display of hypocritically expounding the bible is lost in light of his past perverted wayward ways. He should show a more contrite heart and be remorseful of his misguided past and in private deal with his demons instead of continuing his cultish denial of his depraved morality.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,598
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9/24/2015 4:10:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/24/2015 2:50:51 PM, Harikrish wrote:
You must have noticed no JW member will engage MCB. Until he is reinstated he is eternally damned and to be shunned by all JW members. He has proven time and again to be a person of low character and his words are worthless trash. 4 divorces and his dismissal by the JW shows his lack of fidelity and commitment. He tried to blame it on his parents then his mental condition. Yet he continues to exploit the people closest and farthest from him like the exotic Asians he has targeted to be his live in caretaker. She doesn't look very big or strong to be pushing around a fat Buffalo like him in a wheel chair.
All his pretentious sacrimonous BS and public display of hypocritically expounding the bible is lost in light of his past perverted wayward ways. He should show a more contrite heart and be remorseful of his misguided past and in private deal with his demons instead of continuing his cultish denial of his depraved morality.

Ah Hari, now look what you did, I went to so much trouble to openly apologize for your behavior here and you go and start it all over again. So much for your clean slate.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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9/24/2015 4:18:41 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/24/2015 11:24:28 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:10:25 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 9:08:55 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 7:37:18 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 5:13:35 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

"But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

Was that ever true of the BotchTower Governing Body? Of course not. They claimed it, as have other fringe groups.

Well, it is a fact that Jehovah's Witnesses were delivered "before councils". I'd hate to think that their contradictory and semi-embarrassing testimony was supplied directly by the Holy Spirit.

It wasn't contradictory, if you think that then you misunderstood what they were saying.

Wait a minute! Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred? That would be singularly odd, since one JW has contradicted other JW's under oath. So answer the preceding:

Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred?

It did indeed, that is why they won so many cases against the odds.

Why would it not? It is what Christ promised to his servants for all time, and Christ does not let his servants down.

Very well.

***** EXAMINATION OF FREDERICK FRANZ in Olin R Moyle Vs The Watchtower Society. Trial held in the New York Supreme Court in 1943. Mr. Moyle won the case.

Q. Who subsequently became the Editor of the magazine, the main Editor of the "Watchtower" magazine?

Holy Spirit: In 1931, October 15th,as I recall,the"Watch Tower" discontinued publishing the names of any editorial committee on the second page.

The Court: He asked you who became the Editor.

Holy Spirit: And it said....

The Court: Who became the Editor?

Q. Who became the Editor when this was discontinued?

Holy Spirit: Jehovah God.


***** CROSS-EXAMINATION OF FREDERICK FRANZ in Olin R Moyle Vs The Watchtower Society.

Q. I understand that you say that in 1931, the Watch Tower discontinued naming the editorial committee, and then Jehovah God became the editor, is that correct?

Holy Spirit: Jehovah's editorship was indicated thereby citing Isaiah 54.13

The Court: He asked you if in 1931 Jehovah God became Editor, according to your theory?

Holy Spirit: No, I wouldn't say so.


*****

There you have "holy spirit" telling folks that in 1931 Jehovah God became editor of the WatchTower magazine. Then under cross-examination, "holy spirit" did NOT become the editor in 1931. Continuing .....

Q. Didn't you say that Jehovah God became the editor of this paper at some time?

Holy Spirit: He was always the One guiding the course of the paper.

Q. Didn't you state that on October 15th, 1931, the Watch Tower discontinued the naming of an editorial committee and then Jehovah God became the editor.

Holy Spirit: Yes sir.

Q. In connection with your statement, you say that the "Watch Tower" does not set forth the opinion of men - that is your statement?

Holy Spirit: That is right.


*****

So I'll ask you, "Who is the editor of the WatchTower?" I guarantee that you cannot answer without directly contradicting the Holy Spirit.

Also, the Holy Spirit said in 1943 that the WatchTower did not set forth the mere opinions of men. Is that true, or not?
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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9/24/2015 5:47:48 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/24/2015 4:10:55 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 9/24/2015 2:50:51 PM, Harikrish wrote:
You must have noticed no JW member will engage MCB. Until he is reinstated he is eternally damned and to be shunned by all JW members. He has proven time and again to be a person of low character and his words are worthless trash. 4 divorces and his dismissal by the JW shows his lack of fidelity and commitment. He tried to blame it on his parents then his mental condition. Yet he continues to exploit the people closest and farthest from him like the exotic Asians he has targeted to be his live in caretaker. She doesn't look very big or strong to be pushing around a fat Buffalo like him in a wheel chair.
All his pretentious sacrimonous BS and public display of hypocritically expounding the bible is lost in light of his past perverted wayward ways. He should show a more contrite heart and be remorseful of his misguided past and in private deal with his demons instead of continuing his cultish denial of his depraved morality.

Ah Hari, now look what you did, I went to so much trouble to openly apologize for your behavior here and you go and start it all over again. So much for your clean slate.

You haven't even apologized for your own despicable behaviour. You are the most despised member here on DDO. Your ignorance is only matched by your stupidity.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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9/24/2015 9:49:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/24/2015 4:18:41 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/24/2015 11:24:28 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:10:25 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 9:08:55 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 7:37:18 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 5:13:35 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

"But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

Was that ever true of the BotchTower Governing Body? Of course not. They claimed it, as have other fringe groups.

Well, it is a fact that Jehovah's Witnesses were delivered "before councils". I'd hate to think that their contradictory and semi-embarrassing testimony was supplied directly by the Holy Spirit.

It wasn't contradictory, if you think that then you misunderstood what they were saying.

Wait a minute! Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred? That would be singularly odd, since one JW has contradicted other JW's under oath. So answer the preceding:

Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred?

It did indeed, that is why they won so many cases against the odds.

Why would it not? It is what Christ promised to his servants for all time, and Christ does not let his servants down.


Very well.

***** EXAMINATION OF FREDERICK FRANZ in Olin R Moyle Vs The Watchtower Society. Trial held in the New York Supreme Court in 1943. Mr. Moyle won the case.

Q. Who subsequently became the Editor of the magazine, the main Editor of the "Watchtower" magazine?

Holy Spirit: In 1931, October 15th,as I recall,the"Watch Tower" discontinued publishing the names of any editorial committee on the second page.

The Court: He asked you who became the Editor.

Holy Spirit: And it said....

The Court: Who became the Editor?

Q. Who became the Editor when this was discontinued?

Holy Spirit: Jehovah God.


***** CROSS-EXAMINATION OF FREDERICK FRANZ in Olin R Moyle Vs The Watchtower Society.

Q. I understand that you say that in 1931, the Watch Tower discontinued naming the editorial committee, and then Jehovah God became the editor, is that correct?

Holy Spirit: Jehovah's editorship was indicated thereby citing Isaiah 54.13

The Court: He asked you if in 1931 Jehovah God became Editor, according to your theory?

Holy Spirit: No, I wouldn't say so.


*****

There you have "holy spirit" telling folks that in 1931 Jehovah God became editor of the WatchTower magazine. Then under cross-examination, "holy spirit" did NOT become the editor in 1931. Continuing .....

How can holy spirit be an editor when holy spirit is not a sentient being.

The simple answer is that the Organisation is run under the Guidance of our reigning King through the use of holy spirit to guide them.


Q. Didn't you say that Jehovah God became the editor of this paper at some time?


Holy Spirit: He was always the One guiding the course of the paper.

Q. Didn't you state that on October 15th, 1931, the Watch Tower discontinued the naming of an editorial committee and then Jehovah God became the editor.

Holy Spirit: Yes sir.

Q. In connection with your statement, you say that the "Watch Tower" does not set forth the opinion of men - that is your statement?

Holy Spirit: That is right.


*****

So I'll ask you, "Who is the editor of the WatchTower?" I guarantee that you cannot answer without directly contradicting the Holy Spirit.

I can answer, and with holy spirit behind me.

The simple answer is that The Editor is guided by Christ, on his father's behalf using holy spirit as his communications medium.

That is the matter.

Since holy spirit is not a sentient being it cannot literally guide, however it can be used to guide.


Also, the Holy Spirit said in 1943 that the WatchTower did not set forth the mere opinions of men. Is that true, or not?

Unfortunately that proved to be the brothers moving somewhat ahead of holy spirit. Hence it was badly worded and did not say exactly what it was intended to say.

That statement was eventually removed and replaced with:

THIS MAGAZINE, The Watchtower, honors Jehovah God, the Ruler of the universe. It comforts people with the good news that God"s heavenly Kingdom will soon end all
wickedness and transform the earth into a paradise. It promotes faith in Jesus Christ, who died so that we might gain everlasting life and who is now ruling as King of God"s Kingdom. This magazine has been published continuously since 1879 and is nonpolitical. It adheres to the Bible as its authority.

Now that truly is a holy spirit guided truth.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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9/24/2015 9:56:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/24/2015 2:02:53 PM, JJ50 wrote:
At 9/23/2015 9:41:46 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
Remember the old saying.

Treat others as you would like to be treated yourself, remember that little saying?

Well I do, but there are many on here who don;t believe in it or practice it.

They judge the JWs for past mistakes but take no account of the fact that, though they truly did stumble, they got up off their knees and carried on.

And I have no intention of judging them.

As Christ's servants they get judged by him from day to day, as I do in fact, yes they get an adverse judgement when they are wrong, but when they put it right the judgement goes back to where it belongs.

They and I keep in mind words you would do well to remember:

James 3:2
ASV(i) 2 For in many things we all stumble. If any stumbleth not in word, the same is a perfect man, able to bridle the whole body also.

Why did James remind us of that?

Because unlike the Job's comforters like those who can't forget the history of the JWs, who always look on the black side, Christ does not.

He knows the Brothers have always been faithful servants. He knows their hearts and so make allowances when they stumble, just so long as they get back up again.

They always have, and always will.

That is Christ's judgement of them, if it is not yours, that is your loss.

They stumble, they struggle, but they get up of their metaphorical knees and do something about it.

They don't hide behind some fantasy world.

They don't hide behind false doctrines they don't have the courage to turn away from. They don't look back. As scripture tells us we must, they keep their eyes on the Prize that is ahead and get up off their knees if needs be and get on with life.

Do you have the courage to do that?

The JW have judged you and disfellowshipped and shunned you. You now have even less credibility than the cult JW because you are not even good enough for them. Defending them is not how you achieve atonement for your wicked perverted ways. That is why you still remain banned and shunned.
Until you are reinstated you are eternally damned. You have conveniently forgotten what you agreed to when you joined the JW. Now your word is worthless trash.

It is very sad that MCB is so desperate to get his place back in that nasty cult, he spends so much time on this forum singing their evil praises, to no avail. I doubt there is anyone who treats him seriously, even the ghastly JWs!

No, I'm not desperate. I will know when the time is right, but it isn't yet.

What is really a shame is that you are so embittered in your thoughts about them because you could not be further from the truth if you tried.

I am on here because I love Jehovah's word and wish to share the truth of it with any who will listen.

It doesn't matter to me that there may not be one who does, I still enjoy trying. That is how much I care about people and how much I want to see as many as possible surviving into God's New World on earth.

The more there are, the merrier it will be.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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9/24/2015 9:57:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/24/2015 9:49:55 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/24/2015 4:18:41 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/24/2015 11:24:28 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:10:25 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 9:08:55 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 7:37:18 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 5:13:35 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

"But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

Was that ever true of the BotchTower Governing Body? Of course not. They claimed it, as have other fringe groups.

Well, it is a fact that Jehovah's Witnesses were delivered "before councils". I'd hate to think that their contradictory and semi-embarrassing testimony was supplied directly by the Holy Spirit.

It wasn't contradictory, if you think that then you misunderstood what they were saying.

Wait a minute! Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred? That would be singularly odd, since one JW has contradicted other JW's under oath. So answer the preceding:

Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred?

It did indeed, that is why they won so many cases against the odds.

Why would it not? It is what Christ promised to his servants for all time, and Christ does not let his servants down.


Very well.

***** EXAMINATION OF FREDERICK FRANZ in Olin R Moyle Vs The Watchtower Society. Trial held in the New York Supreme Court in 1943. Mr. Moyle won the case.

Q. Who subsequently became the Editor of the magazine, the main Editor of the "Watchtower" magazine?

Holy Spirit: In 1931, October 15th,as I recall,the"Watch Tower" discontinued publishing the names of any editorial committee on the second page.

The Court: He asked you who became the Editor.

Holy Spirit: And it said....

The Court: Who became the Editor?

Q. Who became the Editor when this was discontinued?

Holy Spirit: Jehovah God.


***** CROSS-EXAMINATION OF FREDERICK FRANZ in Olin R Moyle Vs The Watchtower Society.

Q. I understand that you say that in 1931, the Watch Tower discontinued naming the editorial committee, and then Jehovah God became the editor, is that correct?

Holy Spirit: Jehovah's editorship was indicated thereby citing Isaiah 54.13

The Court: He asked you if in 1931 Jehovah God became Editor, according to your theory?

Holy Spirit: No, I wouldn't say so.


*****

There you have "holy spirit" telling folks that in 1931 Jehovah God became editor of the WatchTower magazine. Then under cross-examination, "holy spirit" did NOT become the editor in 1931. Continuing .....

How can holy spirit be an editor when holy spirit is not a sentient being.

The simple answer is that the Organisation is run under the Guidance of our reigning King through the use of holy spirit to guide them.


Q. Didn't you say that Jehovah God became the editor of this paper at some time?



Holy Spirit: He was always the One guiding the course of the paper.

Q. Didn't you state that on October 15th, 1931, the Watch Tower discontinued the naming of an editorial committee and then Jehovah God became the editor.

Holy Spirit: Yes sir.

Q. In connection with your statement, you say that the "Watch Tower" does not set forth the opinion of men - that is your statement?

Holy Spirit: That is right.


*****

So I'll ask you, "Who is the editor of the WatchTower?" I guarantee that you cannot answer without directly contradicting the Holy Spirit.

I can answer, and with holy spirit behind me.

The simple answer is that The Editor is guided by Christ, on his father's behalf using holy spirit as his communications medium.

I didn't ask how the editor was "guided", did I? I asked - just as Mr. Franz was asked - "Who is the editor?" The Holy Spirit's answer, once anyway, was "Jehovah God". Are you disputing the Spirit?

Also, the Holy Spirit said in 1943 that the WatchTower did not set forth the mere opinions of men. Is that true, or not?

Unfortunately that proved to be the brothers moving somewhat ahead of holy spirit. Hence it was badly worded and did not say exactly what it was intended to say.

It wasn't "the brothers". It was the Holy Spirit speaking, because "the brothers" were called before a court.

Try again - and try a little harder: "But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

I asked if that happened when JW's were "delivered up." You said it did. So I presume it happened when Mr. Franz was "delivered up."
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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9/25/2015 2:45:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/24/2015 9:57:44 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/24/2015 9:49:55 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/24/2015 4:18:41 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/24/2015 11:24:28 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:10:25 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 9:08:55 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 7:37:18 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 5:13:35 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

"But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

Was that ever true of the BotchTower Governing Body? Of course not. They claimed it, as have other fringe groups.

Well, it is a fact that Jehovah's Witnesses were delivered "before councils". I'd hate to think that their contradictory and semi-embarrassing testimony was supplied directly by the Holy Spirit.

It wasn't contradictory, if you think that then you misunderstood what they were saying.

Wait a minute! Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred? That would be singularly odd, since one JW has contradicted other JW's under oath. So answer the preceding:

Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred?

It did indeed, that is why they won so many cases against the odds.

Why would it not? It is what Christ promised to his servants for all time, and Christ does not let his servants down.


Very well.

***** EXAMINATION OF FREDERICK FRANZ in Olin R Moyle Vs The Watchtower Society. Trial held in the New York Supreme Court in 1943. Mr. Moyle won the case.

Q. Who subsequently became the Editor of the magazine, the main Editor of the "Watchtower" magazine?

Holy Spirit: In 1931, October 15th,as I recall,the"Watch Tower" discontinued publishing the names of any editorial committee on the second page.

The Court: He asked you who became the Editor.

Holy Spirit: And it said....

The Court: Who became the Editor?

Q. Who became the Editor when this was discontinued?

Holy Spirit: Jehovah God.


***** CROSS-EXAMINATION OF FREDERICK FRANZ in Olin R Moyle Vs The Watchtower Society.

Q. I understand that you say that in 1931, the Watch Tower discontinued naming the editorial committee, and then Jehovah God became the editor, is that correct?

Holy Spirit: Jehovah's editorship was indicated thereby citing Isaiah 54.13

The Court: He asked you if in 1931 Jehovah God became Editor, according to your theory?

Holy Spirit: No, I wouldn't say so.


*****

There you have "holy spirit" telling folks that in 1931 Jehovah God became editor of the WatchTower magazine. Then under cross-examination, "holy spirit" did NOT become the editor in 1931. Continuing .....

How can holy spirit be an editor when holy spirit is not a sentient being.

The simple answer is that the Organisation is run under the Guidance of our reigning King through the use of holy spirit to guide them.


Q. Didn't you say that Jehovah God became the editor of this paper at some time?



Holy Spirit: He was always the One guiding the course of the paper.

Q. Didn't you state that on October 15th, 1931, the Watch Tower discontinued the naming of an editorial committee and then Jehovah God became the editor.

Holy Spirit: Yes sir.

Q. In connection with your statement, you say that the "Watch Tower" does not set forth the opinion of men - that is your statement?

Holy Spirit: That is right.


*****

So I'll ask you, "Who is the editor of the WatchTower?" I guarantee that you cannot answer without directly contradicting the Holy Spirit.

I can answer, and with holy spirit behind me.

The simple answer is that The Editor is guided by Christ, on his father's behalf using holy spirit as his communications medium.

I didn't ask how the editor was "guided", did I? I asked - just as Mr. Franz was asked - "Who is the editor?" The Holy Spirit's answer, once anyway, was "Jehovah God". Are you disputing the Spirit?


Also, the Holy Spirit said in 1943 that the WatchTower did not set forth the mere opinions of men. Is that true, or not?

Unfortunately that proved to be the brothers moving somewhat ahead of holy spirit. Hence it was badly worded and did not say exactly what it was intended to say.

It wasn't "the brothers". It was the Holy Spirit speaking, because "the brothers" were called before a court.

Try again - and try a little harder: "But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

I asked if that happened when JW's were "delivered up." You said it did. So I presume it happened when Mr. Franz was "delivered up."

All you are doing is showing your ignorance of how holy spirit works, and be careful you don;t start speaking against it. That could be fatal.
annanicole
Posts: 19,782
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9/25/2015 5:16:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/25/2015 2:45:38 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/24/2015 9:57:44 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/24/2015 9:49:55 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/24/2015 4:18:41 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/24/2015 11:24:28 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:10:25 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 9:08:55 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 7:37:18 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 5:13:35 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 3:50:58 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/23/2015 11:56:54 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 9/23/2015 10:19:08 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 9/22/2015 8:20:23 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

"But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

Was that ever true of the BotchTower Governing Body? Of course not. They claimed it, as have other fringe groups.

Well, it is a fact that Jehovah's Witnesses were delivered "before councils". I'd hate to think that their contradictory and semi-embarrassing testimony was supplied directly by the Holy Spirit.

It wasn't contradictory, if you think that then you misunderstood what they were saying.

Wait a minute! Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred? That would be singularly odd, since one JW has contradicted other JW's under oath. So answer the preceding:

Do you mean to tell us that when Jehovah's Witnesses have been called before councils that Matt 10: 19-20 actually occurred?

It did indeed, that is why they won so many cases against the odds.

Why would it not? It is what Christ promised to his servants for all time, and Christ does not let his servants down.


Very well.

***** EXAMINATION OF FREDERICK FRANZ in Olin R Moyle Vs The Watchtower Society. Trial held in the New York Supreme Court in 1943. Mr. Moyle won the case.

Q. Who subsequently became the Editor of the magazine, the main Editor of the "Watchtower" magazine?

Holy Spirit: In 1931, October 15th,as I recall,the"Watch Tower" discontinued publishing the names of any editorial committee on the second page.

The Court: He asked you who became the Editor.

Holy Spirit: And it said....

The Court: Who became the Editor?

Q. Who became the Editor when this was discontinued?

Holy Spirit: Jehovah God.


***** CROSS-EXAMINATION OF FREDERICK FRANZ in Olin R Moyle Vs The Watchtower Society.

Q. I understand that you say that in 1931, the Watch Tower discontinued naming the editorial committee, and then Jehovah God became the editor, is that correct?

Holy Spirit: Jehovah's editorship was indicated thereby citing Isaiah 54.13

The Court: He asked you if in 1931 Jehovah God became Editor, according to your theory?

Holy Spirit: No, I wouldn't say so.


*****

There you have "holy spirit" telling folks that in 1931 Jehovah God became editor of the WatchTower magazine. Then under cross-examination, "holy spirit" did NOT become the editor in 1931. Continuing .....

How can holy spirit be an editor when holy spirit is not a sentient being.

The simple answer is that the Organisation is run under the Guidance of our reigning King through the use of holy spirit to guide them.


Q. Didn't you say that Jehovah God became the editor of this paper at some time?



Holy Spirit: He was always the One guiding the course of the paper.

Q. Didn't you state that on October 15th, 1931, the Watch Tower discontinued the naming of an editorial committee and then Jehovah God became the editor.

Holy Spirit: Yes sir.

Q. In connection with your statement, you say that the "Watch Tower" does not set forth the opinion of men - that is your statement?

Holy Spirit: That is right.


*****

So I'll ask you, "Who is the editor of the WatchTower?" I guarantee that you cannot answer without directly contradicting the Holy Spirit.

I can answer, and with holy spirit behind me.

The simple answer is that The Editor is guided by Christ, on his father's behalf using holy spirit as his communications medium.

I didn't ask how the editor was "guided", did I? I asked - just as Mr. Franz was asked - "Who is the editor?" The Holy Spirit's answer, once anyway, was "Jehovah God". Are you disputing the Spirit?


Also, the Holy Spirit said in 1943 that the WatchTower did not set forth the mere opinions of men. Is that true, or not?

Unfortunately that proved to be the brothers moving somewhat ahead of holy spirit. Hence it was badly worded and did not say exactly what it was intended to say.

It wasn't "the brothers". It was the Holy Spirit speaking, because "the brothers" were called before a court.

Try again - and try a little harder: "But when they deliver you up, be not anxious how or what ye shall speak: for it shall be given you in that hour what ye shall speak. For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you." (Matt 10: 19-20)

I asked if that happened when JW's were "delivered up." You said it did. So I presume it happened when Mr. Franz was "delivered up."


All you are doing is showing your ignorance of how holy spirit works, and be careful you don;t start speaking against it. That could be fatal.

There is no need in either of us being ignorant of how it is supposed to work in this case.

(1) Take no thought of what YOU will say,
(2) For it is not ye that speak, but the Spirit of your Father that speaketh in you.

When Mr. Franz was speaking, whose thoughts was he verbalizing? Tell us.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."