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When did spirituality turn into fear?

Outplayz
Posts: 1,266
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9/22/2015 9:30:59 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
For god sake ... people are afraid to even talk about their faith to another. It is one of the 3 things you don't bring up in conversations. People in most cases are afraid of a violent reaction or action... Religion is clearly on the wrong path; spirituality is clearly ingrained into the culture of greed and egos... far from any love that it preaches.
joetheripper117
Posts: 284
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9/22/2015 9:44:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/22/2015 9:30:59 PM, Outplayz wrote:
For god sake ... people are afraid to even talk about their faith to another. It is one of the 3 things you don't bring up in conversations. People in most cases are afraid of a violent reaction or action... Religion is clearly on the wrong path; spirituality is clearly ingrained into the culture of greed and egos... far from any love that it preaches.

I always have found it rather odd that religion cannot be discussed in polite conversation. Why is it socially acceptable to discuss your other beliefs, but not your religious ones?
"By all means let's be open-minded, but not so open-minded that our brains drop out."
-Richard Dawkins
"The onus is on you to say why; the onus is not on the rest of us to say why not."
-Richard Dawkins
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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9/22/2015 9:50:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/22/2015 9:44:13 PM, joetheripper117 wrote:
At 9/22/2015 9:30:59 PM, Outplayz wrote:
For god sake ... people are afraid to even talk about their faith to another. It is one of the 3 things you don't bring up in conversations. People in most cases are afraid of a violent reaction or action... Religion is clearly on the wrong path; spirituality is clearly ingrained into the culture of greed and egos... far from any love that it preaches.

I always have found it rather odd that religion cannot be discussed in polite conversation. Why is it socially acceptable to discuss your other beliefs, but not your religious ones?

Religion just like anything else can be brought up in polite conversation.

But anything has potential for violent reaction. Like that Atheist that shot his neighbors dead because of disagreement over a parking spot.

Polite conversation and enlightening exchanges can occur if both sides stay away from tangents and address each others rebuttals in peaceful exchange.
joetheripper117
Posts: 284
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9/22/2015 9:54:27 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/22/2015 9:50:04 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 9/22/2015 9:44:13 PM, joetheripper117 wrote:
At 9/22/2015 9:30:59 PM, Outplayz wrote:
For god sake ... people are afraid to even talk about their faith to another. It is one of the 3 things you don't bring up in conversations. People in most cases are afraid of a violent reaction or action... Religion is clearly on the wrong path; spirituality is clearly ingrained into the culture of greed and egos... far from any love that it preaches.

I always have found it rather odd that religion cannot be discussed in polite conversation. Why is it socially acceptable to discuss your other beliefs, but not your religious ones?

Religion just like anything else can be brought up in polite conversation.

I would have to disagree. Whenever religion is brought up in standard conversation, it only serves to make everyone else uncomfortable. What I am saying is that this discomfort is unnecessary.

But anything has potential for violent reaction. Like that Atheist that shot his neighbors dead because of disagreement over a parking spot.

Very true, anything you say could spark violence in the one you are communicating with.

Polite conversation and enlightening exchanges can occur if both sides stay away from tangents and address each others rebuttals in peaceful exchange.

Agreed.
"By all means let's be open-minded, but not so open-minded that our brains drop out."
-Richard Dawkins
"The onus is on you to say why; the onus is not on the rest of us to say why not."
-Richard Dawkins
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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9/22/2015 10:00:45 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/22/2015 9:54:27 PM, joetheripper117 wrote:
At 9/22/2015 9:50:04 PM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 9/22/2015 9:44:13 PM, joetheripper117 wrote:
At 9/22/2015 9:30:59 PM, Outplayz wrote:
For god sake ... people are afraid to even talk about their faith to another. It is one of the 3 things you don't bring up in conversations. People in most cases are afraid of a violent reaction or action... Religion is clearly on the wrong path; spirituality is clearly ingrained into the culture of greed and egos... far from any love that it preaches.

I always have found it rather odd that religion cannot be discussed in polite conversation. Why is it socially acceptable to discuss your other beliefs, but not your religious ones?

Religion just like anything else can be brought up in polite conversation.

I would have to disagree. Whenever religion is brought up in standard conversation, it only serves to make everyone else uncomfortable. What I am saying is that this discomfort is unnecessary.

I'm not discomforted when religion comes up. I've had great open conversations with Muslims, Atheist, Pagans, and Hindus.

Any discomfort is probably what was said earlier, an expression of fearing the other persons actions.

It's a sick, dysfunctional mentality of society today that disagreement equates to intolerance. That being offended by a statement automatically makes it an offensive comment or a personal attack. Neither of which is true.


But anything has potential for violent reaction. Like that Atheist that shot his neighbors dead because of disagreement over a parking spot.

Very true, anything you say could spark violence in the one you are communicating with.

Polite conversation and enlightening exchanges can occur if both sides stay away from tangents and address each others rebuttals in peaceful exchange.

Agreed.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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9/22/2015 10:03:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/22/2015 9:30:59 PM, Outplayz wrote:
For god sake ... people are afraid to even talk about their faith to another. It is one of the 3 things you don't bring up in conversations. People in most cases are afraid of a violent reaction or action... Religion is clearly on the wrong path; spirituality is clearly ingrained into the culture of greed and egos... far from any love that it preaches.

I think people who talk about their faith should be more assertive and less apologetic. Faith, religion, beliefs are all very personal and intimate to the individual. It shapes their worldview and define who they are.
In "The Most Spiritual discusses Spirituality" I show how theses objectives can be met.
http://www.debate.org...

At 8/22/2015 12:09:59 AM, RuvDraba wrote:
In a recent shock announcement in the Nominations thread [http://www.debate.org...], our beloved colleague, the sensitive, compassionate and humble Harikrish revealed:

Even if I was nominated I would have to decline because I don't fit in any of the categories listed. What is missing is 6. Most spiritual member.
As a Vedantist raised in the Vedantic tradition and trained in the reading of esoteric scriptures, Christian Theology and Islamic fundamentalism. My spiritual aura alone would blind my detractors.

Since spirituality is a concern to many members in the Religion thread, I would like to cordially invite our Most Spiritual Member to explain it to us. In particular:

* What is spirituality?

Since you have to ask what is spirituality . It is obvious you do not know what it is nor have you experienced it, which implies all your knowledge comes from cerebral activity. It is all mind and no personal transcendental experience.

Spirituality is transcending of the physical boundaries that limit our bodies and minds. The spiritual realm has no need for material or physical pleasures or possession, which are only distractions that prevent us from reaching our ultimate goal which is our larger consciousness of the universe and the need for harmony with it.
The products of spirituality is love, kindness and infinite patience. I spend hours in meditation and focus on the goodness that can come from DDO members if they all shared my spirituality. But I accept we are a cloth of many colours and my patience must endure our differences..
Every word that I meditate on is rich with the knowledge you all will someday be enlightened too.
Spirituality is not hope but a disciplined certainty. What you put in you will be enriched proportionately . Consider yourself embraced by my abundance.

* Is it inborn or developed? Can you improve it? How?
It is developed. You can improve your spirituality by living a pure life and by meditation to resist material/physical desires that cannot be satiated and are only deceptive distractions.

Here is a meditation chant to help you along.
http://www.meditationiseasy.com...

* How can we recognise just how spiritual a member is? Frankly, Hari, you knocked my socks off when you explained that you'd appraised everyone and pronounced yourself spiritually superior to us all. I didn't even know one could do that over the Internet. Please explain all!

Let me start with:
Seven characteristics of a spiritual person.
http://www.tsgfoundation.org...

The only available example of a Spiritual person.
Harikrish

Recognizable qualities found in Harikrish.
1. Trust
2. Honesty
3. Tolerance
4. Gentleness
5. Joy
6. Defencelessness
7. Generosity
8. Patience
9. Faithfulness
10. Open-mindedness

Harikrish's Spiritual level.
Second stage of spiritual enlightenment.

Why I can tell even over the internet the level of spiritual development of others is because of my connectedness. I am at the second stage of spiritual enlightenment.

"The second stage of spiritual enlightenment

At the second stage of enlightenment, you feel apart of yourself in everything around you. You feel a connection with every object and individual in the world. The borders between yourself and the world around you dissipate. Your soul begins to merge with Supreme Soul. You feel that you are not individual anymore and not separate from anything. You feel that you are in everything and everything is just a part of the Supreme Soul from where you also have emerged. Many people describe this feelings of completeness and love."

* What is an 'aura'? How can it be detected?

Aura is the radiance that is generated from someone who is both healthy and spiritually at peace. It has a glow and can easily be detected on a person who is healthy, happy and comfortable in ones skin. It radiates confidence. There is even technology that can capture a persons aura. They are called Aura scanners.

* Just how bright does it have to be to blind you; is the blindness permanent or (hopefully) only just passingly impressive? Which part of the body is actually blinded, and is there any lasting damage?
There are two forms of blindness that can occur when faced with a person who has a fully developed aura. A temporary retina shock is caused by the blinding intense light of the aura followed by an awareness of the darkness within. The aura does not have to be that bright. It is the darkness that you lived under that makes you sensitive to the brightness of the aura.

* Does one have to learn Islamic fundamentalism to be spiritual? Does studying the Qur'an but taking a liberal interpretation on it count?
All religions can help you recognize spirituality. But not all can get you there because you get caught up in religious dogma instead of being spiritually set free.

* Which esoteric scriptures are recommended, just how does one make any sense of them, and how can one be sure one's sense is correct?
You need a spiritual teacher who can teach you meditation and some familiarity with Vedic scriptures so you can focus on your spiritual goals.

* Universal Theologian has previously argued that atheists aren't spiritual. Would you agree, Hari? Is my aura depleted? And should that concern me? Why or why not?


Spirituality will lead you to God. God is the larger consciousness that unites the universe.
Your never had the opportunity to develop your aura because of your low caste and exclusion. But the times are different and you are less restricted.

I'm so very much looking forward to an education on this.

You have chosen well.

To back my claims of spirituality I have submitted some empirical research on spiritual intelligence.

"The evidence for spiritual intelligence derived from direct personal experience is corroborated by the findings of scientific research. Recent scientific evidence establishes that there is a state of conscious identity, distinct from the ego, associated with hemispheric synchronisation and whole-brain activation [5]. This distinct sense of self coincides with the experience of being identified with feeling-awareness itself (or consciousness itself), in contrast to being identified with the body and mind [6]. The native qualities of feeling-awareness itself are experienced at the subject-pole of attention in moments of presence, in the form of wisdom, compassion, integrity, joy, love, creativity, and peace [7]. Thus the qualities traditionally ascribed to the soul by religious beliefs have an accessible psychological location, associated with a distinct sense of self, with a detectable neurological signature [8]. This combined evidence represents the scientific synthesis behind the science of the soul."

The psychology of spiritual intelligence.

http://sqi.co...
Hitchian
Posts: 764
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9/22/2015 10:04:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/22/2015 9:50:04 PM, Mhykiel wrote:

Religion just like anything else can be brought up in polite conversation.

Mostly true.
But that would exclude pre-supositionalists. Tell me, how can atheists, agnostics and even deists engage in civil conversation with someone whose basic premise is that his interlocutor is lying and that he knows his interlocutor's most intimate thoughts better than he does?

There's a subtle but important distinction between civility and politeness. And once in a very long while, an insult might even be called-for.
Geogeer
Posts: 4,227
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9/22/2015 10:19:13 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 9/22/2015 9:30:59 PM, Outplayz wrote:
For god sake ... people are afraid to even talk about their faith to another. It is one of the 3 things you don't bring up in conversations. People in most cases are afraid of a violent reaction or action... Religion is clearly on the wrong path; spirituality is clearly ingrained into the culture of greed and egos... far from any love that it preaches.

Because the truth is divisive. Jesus clearly recognized this:

Do not think that I came to send peace upon earth: I came not to send peace, but the sword. For I came to set a man at variance against his father, and the daughter against her mother, and the daughter in law against her mother in law.

People do not want the way they live their lives challenged...