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dhardage
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10/1/2015 2:11:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 2:09:29 PM, johnlubba wrote:
Go

Explain why you choose to believe in something that cannot be seen, heard, felt, smelt, or in any other way detected and defend that belief so vociferously.
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 2:16:59 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 2:11:37 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:09:29 PM, johnlubba wrote:
Go

Explain why you choose to believe in something that cannot be seen, heard, felt, smelt, or in any other way detected and defend that belief so vociferously.

I've never seen, heard, felt, or smelt many personalities but I still believe they were real.

Example; Attila the Hun
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being, Supreme means the first in rank or the highest authority, God must necessarily be the highest authority otherwise he would not be God, The title would fall to the entity who is first in rank or the highest authority.
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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10/1/2015 2:27:23 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being,
God/s are defined by men, what they claim is as , meaningless as the definition of unicorns that men claim.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 2:38:14 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 2:27:23 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being,
God/s are defined by men, what they claim is as , meaningless as the definition of unicorns that men claim.

Not necessarily, weather real or fictional a unicorn must posses certain attributes that make it worthy of the title of a unicorn, such as, it must have a unicorn head and body and hooves, Otherwise it simply would not be defined as a unicorn.

God must also be the highest authority otherwise He would not be God.
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
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10/1/2015 3:10:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 2:16:59 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:11:37 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:09:29 PM, johnlubba wrote:
Go

Explain why you choose to believe in something that cannot be seen, heard, felt, smelt, or in any other way detected and defend that belief so vociferously.

I've never seen, heard, felt, or smelt many personalities but I still believe they were real.

Example; Attila the Hun

Attila was a human being and his existence is demonstrated by a number of facts. Please explain what facts you have that led you to believe in you God?
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,560
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10/1/2015 3:19:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being, Supreme means the first in rank or the highest authority, God must necessarily be the highest authority otherwise he would not be God, The title would fall to the entity who is first in rank or the highest authority.

Hello John. If for the sake of clarity, we remove the concept of highest authority and first rank, can we define God in another way that would make God more significant an entity for humans rather than just an authority figure? Thanks.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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10/1/2015 3:26:20 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 2:38:14 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:27:23 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being,
God/s are defined by men, what they claim is as , meaningless as the definition of unicorns that men claim.


Not necessarily, weather real or fictional a unicorn must posses certain attributes that make it worthy of the title of a unicorn, such as, it must have a unicorn head and body and hooves, Otherwise it simply would not be defined as a unicorn.

God must also be the highest authority otherwise He would not be God.

Is there a unicorn who possesses those attributes?
Can yo show me such an entity?
Can you show me a god that possesses the attributes you assign to it?
Or is your god as mythical as the unicorn, by your definition?
I think you have just proven that your god is a myth, just like the unicorn.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 3:30:48 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 3:10:58 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:16:59 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:11:37 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:09:29 PM, johnlubba wrote:
Go

Explain why you choose to believe in something that cannot be seen, heard, felt, smelt, or in any other way detected and defend that belief so vociferously.

I've never seen, heard, felt, or smelt many personalities but I still believe they were real.

Example; Attila the Hun

Attila was a human being and his existence is demonstrated by a number of facts. Please explain what facts you have that led you to believe in you God?

God existence is also demonstrated by a number of facts, That life can not arise from non life, the fact that the appearance of nature is made up from a combination of chemicals that serve specific purposes only when combined, Is beyond mean to believe that there is no combiner or director. That points toGod.

This among other things.
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 3:35:52 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 3:19:28 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being, Supreme means the first in rank or the highest authority, God must necessarily be the highest authority otherwise he would not be God, The title would fall to the entity who is first in rank or the highest authority.

Hello John. If for the sake of clarity, we remove the concept of highest authority and first rank, can we define God in another way that would make God more significant an entity for humans rather than just an authority figure? Thanks.

Good question

Yes God is the supreme proprietor, director and maintainer of the universe.

That's all I got now.
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
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10/1/2015 3:40:54 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 3:30:48 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:10:58 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:16:59 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:11:37 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:09:29 PM, johnlubba wrote:
Go

Explain why you choose to believe in something that cannot be seen, heard, felt, smelt, or in any other way detected and defend that belief so vociferously.

I've never seen, heard, felt, or smelt many personalities but I still believe they were real.

Example; Attila the Hun

Attila was a human being and his existence is demonstrated by a number of facts. Please explain what facts you have that led you to believe in you God?

God existence is also demonstrated by a number of facts, That life can not arise from non life,

Assertion, not fact.

the fact that the appearance of nature is made up from a combination of chemicals that serve specific purposes only when combined, Is beyond mean to believe that there is no combiner or director.

Argument from incredulity, not fact. You have not shown a single, verifiable, testable fact, only assertions that cannot be supported with evidence.

That points toGod.

This among other things.

Only to those who already believe in God. Still waiting for a fact, not an opinion or unsupported assertion.
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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10/1/2015 3:48:15 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 3:30:48 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:10:58 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:16:59 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:11:37 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:09:29 PM, johnlubba wrote:
Go

Explain why you choose to believe in something that cannot be seen, heard, felt, smelt, or in any other way detected and defend that belief so vociferously.

I've never seen, heard, felt, or smelt many personalities but I still believe they were real.

Example; Attila the Hun

Attila was a human being and his existence is demonstrated by a number of facts. Please explain what facts you have that led you to believe in you God?

God existence is also demonstrated by a number of facts,
Facts are always a good demonstration of the truth of your CLAIM.
That life can not arise from non life,
This would be a claim, made by you, that neither you nor anyone else has ever witnessed it.
Of course neither you nor anyone else has ever seen your god creating life.
the fact that the appearance of nature is made up from a combination of chemicals that serve specific purposes only when combined, Is beyond mean to believe that there is no combiner or director. That points toGod.
And you come to this conclusion by believing in a creator god and assigning everything to it. Your contention is dependent upon your conclusion. Runing in circles.
This among other things.
Oh please bring your other things, since what you have been indoctrinated with, just doesn't cut the mustard.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 3:56:28 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 3:40:54 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:30:48 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:10:58 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:16:59 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:11:37 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:09:29 PM, johnlubba wrote:
Go

Explain why you choose to believe in something that cannot be seen, heard, felt, smelt, or in any other way detected and defend that belief so vociferously.

I've never seen, heard, felt, or smelt many personalities but I still believe they were real.

Example; Attila the Hun

Attila was a human being and his existence is demonstrated by a number of facts. Please explain what facts you have that led you to believe in you God?

God existence is also demonstrated by a number of facts, That life can not arise from non life,

Assertion, not fact.

So you believe life can come from non life.

That has never been demonstrated, Life from life has, The belief that an eternal omnipotent being can give life,is faith, faith based on facts, the fact that life comes from life.


the fact that the appearance of nature is made up from a combination of chemicals that serve specific purposes only when combined, Is beyond mean to believe that there is no combiner or director.

Argument from incredulity, not fact. You have not shown a single, verifiable, testable fact, only assertions that cannot be supported with evidence.

That the appearance of nature is made up from a combination of chemicals and moreover that serve specific function only when combined, is not an assertion it's a fact. The belief that God is the combiner is based on faith, faith based on facts.


That points toGod.

This among other things.

Only to those who already believe in God. Still waiting for a fact, not an opinion or unsupported assertion.
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 3:58:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 3:26:20 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:38:14 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:27:23 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being,
God/s are defined by men, what they claim is as , meaningless as the definition of unicorns that men claim.


Not necessarily, weather real or fictional a unicorn must posses certain attributes that make it worthy of the title of a unicorn, such as, it must have a unicorn head and body and hooves, Otherwise it simply would not be defined as a unicorn.

God must also be the highest authority otherwise He would not be God.

Is there a unicorn who possesses those attributes?
Can yo show me such an entity?
Can you show me a god that possesses the attributes you assign to it?
Or is your god as mythical as the unicorn, by your definition?
I think you have just proven that your god is a myth, just like the unicorn.

You miss the point, and I can't be bothered showing how you fail to comprehend it. Sorry.
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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10/1/2015 4:09:31 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 3:58:55 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:26:20 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:38:14 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:27:23 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being,
God/s are defined by men, what they claim is as , meaningless as the definition of unicorns that men claim.


Not necessarily, weather real or fictional a unicorn must posses certain attributes that make it worthy of the title of a unicorn, such as, it must have a unicorn head and body and hooves, Otherwise it simply would not be defined as a unicorn.

God must also be the highest authority otherwise He would not be God.

Is there a unicorn who possesses those attributes?
Can yo show me such an entity?
Can you show me a god that possesses the attributes you assign to it?
Or is your god as mythical as the unicorn, by your definition?
I think you have just proven that your god is a myth, just like the unicorn.


You miss the point, and I can't be bothered showing how you fail to comprehend it. Sorry.

Translation::
lubba has no idea what he is saying because his thought processes are restricted to the imagination of bronze age goatherds.
They have been dead for a very long time, you would be better to employ the greay matter you were born with. Or perhaps not.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 4:16:05 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 4:09:31 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:58:55 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:26:20 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:38:14 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:27:23 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being,
God/s are defined by men, what they claim is as , meaningless as the definition of unicorns that men claim.


Not necessarily, weather real or fictional a unicorn must posses certain attributes that make it worthy of the title of a unicorn, such as, it must have a unicorn head and body and hooves, Otherwise it simply would not be defined as a unicorn.

God must also be the highest authority otherwise He would not be God.

Is there a unicorn who possesses those attributes?
Can yo show me such an entity?
Can you show me a god that possesses the attributes you assign to it?
Or is your god as mythical as the unicorn, by your definition?
I think you have just proven that your god is a myth, just like the unicorn.


You miss the point, and I can't be bothered showing how you fail to comprehend it. Sorry.

Translation::
lubba has no idea what he is saying because his thought processes are restricted to the imagination of bronze age goatherds.
They have been dead for a very long time, you would be better to employ the greay matter you were born with. Or perhaps not.

Or that I have very little interest in speaking with someone who's only intention is to speak in a derogatory tone.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,560
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10/1/2015 4:18:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 3:35:52 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:19:28 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being, Supreme means the first in rank or the highest authority, God must necessarily be the highest authority otherwise he would not be God, The title would fall to the entity who is first in rank or the highest authority.

Hello John. If for the sake of clarity, we remove the concept of highest authority and first rank, can we define God in another way that would make God more significant an entity for humans rather than just an authority figure? Thanks.

Good question



Yes God is the supreme proprietor, director and maintainer of the universe.

That's all I got now.

Thanks John. I was hoping you might ponder this question a little more, the reason why is because for some, like myself, for example, would very much like to understand God as being just more than an authority figure or proprietor if I were going to engage in the concept of God beyond those reasons so that I may find meaning and purpose from the position of knowing God.

For me, I don't really find that much purpose and meaning in a God that is little more than an authority figure or proprietor. That reason is due to the fact that I can find a lot more meaning and purpose in life. I hope you understand what I'm getting at here. Thanks again.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 4:26:12 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 4:18:53 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:35:52 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:19:28 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being, Supreme means the first in rank or the highest authority, God must necessarily be the highest authority otherwise he would not be God, The title would fall to the entity who is first in rank or the highest authority.

Hello John. If for the sake of clarity, we remove the concept of highest authority and first rank, can we define God in another way that would make God more significant an entity for humans rather than just an authority figure? Thanks.

Good question



Yes God is the supreme proprietor, director and maintainer of the universe.

That's all I got now.

Thanks John. I was hoping you might ponder this question a little more, the reason why is because for some, like myself, for example, would very much like to understand God as being just more than an authority figure or proprietor if I were going to engage in the concept of God beyond those reasons so that I may find meaning and purpose from the position of knowing God.

For me, I don't really find that much purpose and meaning in a God that is little more than an authority figure or proprietor. That reason is due to the fact that I can find a lot more meaning and purpose in life. I hope you understand what I'm getting at here. Thanks again.

God is so many things, God can be your servant or your master or even both simultaneously as well as an inspiring friend or a fearful foe.
bulproof
Posts: 25,168
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10/1/2015 4:29:25 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 4:16:05 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 4:09:31 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:58:55 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:26:20 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:38:14 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:27:23 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being,
God/s are defined by men, what they claim is as , meaningless as the definition of unicorns that men claim.


Not necessarily, weather real or fictional a unicorn must posses certain attributes that make it worthy of the title of a unicorn, such as, it must have a unicorn head and body and hooves, Otherwise it simply would not be defined as a unicorn.

God must also be the highest authority otherwise He would not be God.

Is there a unicorn who possesses those attributes?
Can yo show me such an entity?
Can you show me a god that possesses the attributes you assign to it?
Or is your god as mythical as the unicorn, by your definition?
I think you have just proven that your god is a myth, just like the unicorn.


You miss the point, and I can't be bothered showing how you fail to comprehend it. Sorry.

Translation::
lubba has no idea what he is saying because his thought processes are restricted to the imagination of bronze age goatherds.
They have been dead for a very long time, you would be better to employ the greay matter you were born with. Or perhaps not.

Or that I have very little interest in speaking with someone who's only intention is to speak in a derogatory tone.

Umm no, my explanation is more truthful.
Fear is your greatest friend.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
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10/1/2015 5:04:43 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 3:56:28 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:40:54 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:30:48 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:10:58 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:16:59 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:11:37 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:09:29 PM, johnlubba wrote:
Go

Explain why you choose to believe in something that cannot be seen, heard, felt, smelt, or in any other way detected and defend that belief so vociferously.

I've never seen, heard, felt, or smelt many personalities but I still believe they were real.

Example; Attila the Hun

Attila was a human being and his existence is demonstrated by a number of facts. Please explain what facts you have that led you to believe in you God?

God existence is also demonstrated by a number of facts, That life can not arise from non life,

Assertion, not fact.

So you believe life can come from non life.

That has never been demonstrated, Life from life has, The belief that an eternal omnipotent being can give life,is faith, faith based on facts, the fact that life comes from life.

Research continues and it has yet to be proven, that is true. You have not disproven it with your observation. Evidence points to the possibility.





the fact that the appearance of nature is made up from a combination of chemicals that serve specific purposes only when combined, Is beyond mean to believe that there is no combiner or director.

Argument from incredulity, not fact. You have not shown a single, verifiable, testable fact, only assertions that cannot be supported with evidence.

That the appearance of nature is made up from a combination of chemicals and moreover that serve specific function only when combined, is not an assertion it's a fact.

Assuming you are correct, they are not necessarily the result of a conscious plan but a slow development where numerous combinations were generated an only the successful ones remained. Your conclusion is not based in fact but your desire to demonstrate something that is essentially undemonstrable.

Let us assume that you are correct about the intelligence of the design. That only proves a designer (and not a very good one at that. Our bodies do things that are decidedly not intelligent). It in no way demonstrates any particular deity and there are quite literally hundreds who are claimed to have created humankind.

; The belief that God is the combiner is based on faith, faith based on facts.

Again, no, it is based on your presupposition that he exists and is a post-hoc attempt to justify that belief. You reasoning is faulty and your conclusion is in error.


That points toGod.

This among other things.

Only to those who already believe in God. Still waiting for a fact, not an opinion or unsupported assertion.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,560
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10/1/2015 5:24:53 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 4:26:12 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 4:18:53 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:35:52 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:19:28 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being, Supreme means the first in rank or the highest authority, God must necessarily be the highest authority otherwise he would not be God, The title would fall to the entity who is first in rank or the highest authority.

Hello John. If for the sake of clarity, we remove the concept of highest authority and first rank, can we define God in another way that would make God more significant an entity for humans rather than just an authority figure? Thanks.

Good question



Yes God is the supreme proprietor, director and maintainer of the universe.

That's all I got now.

Thanks John. I was hoping you might ponder this question a little more, the reason why is because for some, like myself, for example, would very much like to understand God as being just more than an authority figure or proprietor if I were going to engage in the concept of God beyond those reasons so that I may find meaning and purpose from the position of knowing God.

For me, I don't really find that much purpose and meaning in a God that is little more than an authority figure or proprietor. That reason is due to the fact that I can find a lot more meaning and purpose in life. I hope you understand what I'm getting at here. Thanks again.


God is so many things, God can be your servant or your master or even both simultaneously as well as an inspiring friend or a fearful foe.

Thanks John, once again I would like to explore the concept of God well beyond that of a master/servant - friend/foe relationship as that doesn't really interest me very much, it provides no further meaning or purpose in my life as far as I can see.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 5:30:55 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 5:04:43 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:56:28 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:40:54 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:30:48 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:10:58 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:16:59 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:11:37 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:09:29 PM, johnlubba wrote:
Go

Explain why you choose to believe in something that cannot be seen, heard, felt, smelt, or in any other way detected and defend that belief so vociferously.

I've never seen, heard, felt, or smelt many personalities but I still believe they were real.

Example; Attila the Hun

Attila was a human being and his existence is demonstrated by a number of facts. Please explain what facts you have that led you to believe in you God?

God existence is also demonstrated by a number of facts, That life can not arise from non life,

Assertion, not fact.

So you believe life can come from non life.

That has never been demonstrated, Life from life has, The belief that an eternal omnipotent being can give life,is faith, faith based on facts, the fact that life comes from life.

Research continues and it has yet to be proven, that is true. You have not disproven it with your observation. Evidence points to the possibility.

biogenesis is an established fact, abiogenesis is not. Untill it becomes one then I might change my view, but as it stands, all the evidence shows that life comes from life, this is shown over and over again.






the fact that the appearance of nature is made up from a combination of chemicals that serve specific purposes only when combined, Is beyond mean to believe that there is no combiner or director.

Argument from incredulity, not fact. You have not shown a single, verifiable, testable fact, only assertions that cannot be supported with evidence.

That the appearance of nature is made up from a combination of chemicals and moreover that serve specific function only when combined, is not an assertion it's a fact.

Assuming you are correct, they are not necessarily the result of a conscious plan but a slow development where numerous combinations were generated an only the successful ones remained. Your conclusion is not based in fact but your desire to demonstrate something that is essentially undemonstrable.

Not at all, but why the chemicals should exist at all and moreover serve a purpose only when combined leaves a lot to be questioned


Let us assume that you are correct about the intelligence of the design. That only proves a designer (and not a very good one at that. Our bodies do things that are decidedly not intelligent). It in no way demonstrates any particular deity and there are quite literally hundreds who are claimed to have created humankind.

; The belief that God is the combiner is based on faith, faith based on facts.

Again, no, it is based on your presupposition that he exists and is a post-hoc attempt to justify that belief. You reasoning is faulty and your conclusion is in error.

Actually I think the same about your reasoning.


That points toGod.

This among other things.

Only to those who already believe in God. Still waiting for a fact, not an opinion or unsupported assertion.
johnlubba
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10/1/2015 5:31:58 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 5:24:53 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 4:26:12 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 4:18:53 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:35:52 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:19:28 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being, Supreme means the first in rank or the highest authority, God must necessarily be the highest authority otherwise he would not be God, The title would fall to the entity who is first in rank or the highest authority.

Hello John. If for the sake of clarity, we remove the concept of highest authority and first rank, can we define God in another way that would make God more significant an entity for humans rather than just an authority figure? Thanks.

Good question



Yes God is the supreme proprietor, director and maintainer of the universe.

That's all I got now.

Thanks John. I was hoping you might ponder this question a little more, the reason why is because for some, like myself, for example, would very much like to understand God as being just more than an authority figure or proprietor if I were going to engage in the concept of God beyond those reasons so that I may find meaning and purpose from the position of knowing God.

For me, I don't really find that much purpose and meaning in a God that is little more than an authority figure or proprietor. That reason is due to the fact that I can find a lot more meaning and purpose in life. I hope you understand what I'm getting at here. Thanks again.


God is so many things, God can be your servant or your master or even both simultaneously as well as an inspiring friend or a fearful foe.

Thanks John, once again I would like to explore the concept of God well beyond that of a master/servant - friend/foe relationship as that doesn't really interest me very much, it provides no further meaning or purpose in my life as far as I can see.

Ok, Maybe I am missing your point here, what exactly are you trying to state?
johnlubba
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10/1/2015 5:48:40 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 4:47:50 PM, intellectuallyprimitive wrote:
Which god and would this god be able to be submitted for scrutinization by science?

There is no which God, God by definition is the supreme being, So the supreme being is God. Scrutinizing God via science is futile as God is not a material entity, but a spirit and spirit is beyond the realm of science, science can only analyse material things.
DanneJeRusse
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10/1/2015 5:54:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 5:31:58 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 5:24:53 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 4:26:12 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 4:18:53 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:35:52 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:19:28 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being, Supreme means the first in rank or the highest authority, God must necessarily be the highest authority otherwise he would not be God, The title would fall to the entity who is first in rank or the highest authority.

Hello John. If for the sake of clarity, we remove the concept of highest authority and first rank, can we define God in another way that would make God more significant an entity for humans rather than just an authority figure? Thanks.

Good question



Yes God is the supreme proprietor, director and maintainer of the universe.

That's all I got now.

Thanks John. I was hoping you might ponder this question a little more, the reason why is because for some, like myself, for example, would very much like to understand God as being just more than an authority figure or proprietor if I were going to engage in the concept of God beyond those reasons so that I may find meaning and purpose from the position of knowing God.

For me, I don't really find that much purpose and meaning in a God that is little more than an authority figure or proprietor. That reason is due to the fact that I can find a lot more meaning and purpose in life. I hope you understand what I'm getting at here. Thanks again.


God is so many things, God can be your servant or your master or even both simultaneously as well as an inspiring friend or a fearful foe.

Thanks John, once again I would like to explore the concept of God well beyond that of a master/servant - friend/foe relationship as that doesn't really interest me very much, it provides no further meaning or purpose in my life as far as I can see.


Ok, Maybe I am missing your point here, what exactly are you trying to state?

Sorry John, it's difficult to put into words what I'm trying to get at, I apologize if I'm not getting my point across with clarity.

For me, there has to be far more to God than just the characteristics you've put forth thus far in order for me to find any meaning or purpose in accepting God. While the relationships you've described may be good for others, I don't know, but I would like to understand God in far more depth. And, if God is all-knowing, I would hope at the very least God would appreciate my request for that depth and understanding as opposed to perhaps a superficial relationship of say a master/servant, for example.

Does that make any sense? Thanks again, John.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
johnlubba
Posts: 2,892
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10/1/2015 6:20:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 10/1/2015 5:54:42 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 5:31:58 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 5:24:53 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 4:26:12 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 4:18:53 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:35:52 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 3:19:28 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:22:03 PM, johnlubba wrote:
At 10/1/2015 2:13:01 PM, Benshapiro wrote:
Who is God?

God is to be defined in the very least as the supreme being, Supreme means the first in rank or the highest authority, God must necessarily be the highest authority otherwise he would not be God, The title would fall to the entity who is first in rank or the highest authority.

Hello John. If for the sake of clarity, we remove the concept of highest authority and first rank, can we define God in another way that would make God more significant an entity for humans rather than just an authority figure? Thanks.

Good question



Yes God is the supreme proprietor, director and maintainer of the universe.

That's all I got now.

Thanks John. I was hoping you might ponder this question a little more, the reason why is because for some, like myself, for example, would very much like to understand God as being just more than an authority figure or proprietor if I were going to engage in the concept of God beyond those reasons so that I may find meaning and purpose from the position of knowing God.

For me, I don't really find that much purpose and meaning in a God that is little more than an authority figure or proprietor. That reason is due to the fact that I can find a lot more meaning and purpose in life. I hope you understand what I'm getting at here. Thanks again.


God is so many things, God can be your servant or your master or even both simultaneously as well as an inspiring friend or a fearful foe.

Thanks John, once again I would like to explore the concept of God well beyond that of a master/servant - friend/foe relationship as that doesn't really interest me very much, it provides no further meaning or purpose in my life as far as I can see.


Ok, Maybe I am missing your point here, what exactly are you trying to state?

Sorry John, it's difficult to put into words what I'm trying to get at, I apologize if I'm not getting my point across with clarity.

For me, there has to be far more to God than just the characteristics you've put forth thus far in order for me to find any meaning or purpose in accepting God. While the relationships you've described may be good for others, I don't know, but I would like to understand God in far more depth. And, if God is all-knowing, I would hope at the very least God would appreciate my request for that depth and understanding as opposed to perhaps a superficial relationship of say a master/servant, for example.

Does that make any sense? Thanks again, John.

Yes, I think I get the gist of what you are saying a bit more now, I hope.

In my opinion, consciousness is fundamental, therefore we must try to find the highest state of consciousness, that can be found in ecstatic love between two reciprocal entities. God is there for us to love and God can also love us back, but this doesn't mean that we should demand God to serve our every whims for us to show Him our love, love must be without any motive for it to be love, so even in instances where we might find life tough and unbearable we should still show our love for God, regardless of any nonsense, and even in instances where we are feeling very fortunate we should not forget our love for God and think we are powerful on our own. therefore God and I can be in an eternal reciprocal relationship of ecstatic bliss through love. Regardless.

This is why Rudyard Kipling states in his most famous poem, if you can meet with triumph and disaster and treat these two imposters just the same

That is what I believe is the highest state of consciousness, an eternal reciprocal relationship between every living entity and God, which can be permanent, whereas every other thing is based on a temporary platform.

Cheers
johnlubba
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10/1/2015 6:29:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
My shift is now over until Saturday for a few hours and then Sunday, I will have no access to a computer until then. I hope my response was useful.

Although, something tells me you will object.
But it's all good. Take care.

Peace