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Misunderstanding Atheism

Danielle
Posts: 21,330
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9/20/2010 4:03:40 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
This topic was inspired by its counterpart, Misunderstanding Islam.

There are a lot of misconceptions about atheism, including but not limited to:

- People are atheists because they've had a bad experience with religion, and/or a poor upbringing.

- Atheists reject the idea of god because they don't want to be held accountable for their sins.

- Atheists have no consistent set of values or morality (and can only ascribe to moral relativism).

- Atheism will cause chaos and destruction (eg. Hitler).

- Atheists seek to eliminate religion and spirituality from government and society.

- Atheists know deep down that god exists, but refuse to accept it, etc.

There are also a lot of discrepancies in describing gnostic atheism vs. agnostic atheism, the tendency to label all atheists as militant (which is annoying coming from theists who simultaneously warn us about not using extremists to define all of them) and general misconceptions about the goals and other tenets of atheism. Obviously there are stereotypes about all groups. To theists: what are some of your questions regarding atheism, or what do you find to be inconsistent, implausible, silly, mean, etc?
President of DDO
Korashk
Posts: 4,597
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9/20/2010 4:07:21 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I like this thread already.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,484
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9/20/2010 4:19:30 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:03:40 PM, theLwerd wrote:
This topic was inspired by its counterpart, Misunderstanding Islam.

There are a lot of misconceptions about atheism, including but not limited to:

- People are atheists because they've had a bad experience with religion, and/or a poor upbringing.

- Atheists reject the idea of god because they don't want to be held accountable for their sins.

- Atheists have no consistent set of values or morality (and can only ascribe to moral relativism).

This isn't characteristic of atheism, but some do subscribe to such a notion. I agree that it's a hasty generalization, though.

- Atheism will cause chaos and destruction (eg. Hitler).

- Atheists seek to eliminate religion and spirituality from government and society.

I'm okay with this one, as long as we eliminate it through reason - not force.

- Atheists know deep down that god exists, but refuse to accept it, etc.

There are also a lot of discrepancies in describing gnostic atheism vs. agnostic atheism, the tendency to label all atheists as militant (which is annoying coming from theists who simultaneously warn us about not using extremists to define all of them) and general misconceptions about the goals and other tenets of atheism. Obviously there are stereotypes about all groups. To theists: what are some of your questions regarding atheism, or what do you find to be inconsistent, implausible, silly, mean, etc?
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:19:30 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:03:40 PM, theLwerd wrote:
This topic was inspired by its counterpart, Misunderstanding Islam.

There are a lot of misconceptions about atheism, including but not limited to:

- People are atheists because they've had a bad experience with religion, and/or a poor upbringing.

- Atheists reject the idea of god because they don't want to be held accountable for their sins.

- Atheists have no consistent set of values or morality (and can only ascribe to moral relativism).

This isn't characteristic of atheism, but some do subscribe to such a notion. I agree that it's a hasty generalization, though.

- Atheism will cause chaos and destruction (eg. Hitler).

- Atheists seek to eliminate religion and spirituality from government and society.

I'm okay with this one, as long as we eliminate it through reason - not force.

- Atheists know deep down that god exists, but refuse to accept it, etc.

There are also a lot of discrepancies in describing gnostic atheism vs. agnostic atheism, the tendency to label all atheists as militant (which is annoying coming from theists who simultaneously warn us about not using extremists to define all of them) and general misconceptions about the goals and other tenets of atheism. Obviously there are stereotypes about all groups. To theists: what are some of your questions regarding atheism, or what do you find to be inconsistent, implausible, silly, mean, etc?

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
InsertNameHere
Posts: 15,699
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9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,484
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9/20/2010 4:39:33 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world.

"Many" is a nebulous term.

Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before.

I call shenanigans. Appeal to tradition.

Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

I prefer to let them destroy themselves.
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,484
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9/20/2010 4:40:07 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:19:30 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:03:40 PM, theLwerd wrote:
This topic was inspired by its counterpart, Misunderstanding Islam.

There are a lot of misconceptions about atheism, including but not limited to:

- People are atheists because they've had a bad experience with religion, and/or a poor upbringing.

- Atheists reject the idea of god because they don't want to be held accountable for their sins.

- Atheists have no consistent set of values or morality (and can only ascribe to moral relativism).

This isn't characteristic of atheism, but some do subscribe to such a notion. I agree that it's a hasty generalization, though.

- Atheism will cause chaos and destruction (eg. Hitler).

- Atheists seek to eliminate religion and spirituality from government and society.

I'm okay with this one, as long as we eliminate it through reason - not force.

- Atheists know deep down that god exists, but refuse to accept it, etc.

There are also a lot of discrepancies in describing gnostic atheism vs. agnostic atheism, the tendency to label all atheists as militant (which is annoying coming from theists who simultaneously warn us about not using extremists to define all of them) and general misconceptions about the goals and other tenets of atheism. Obviously there are stereotypes about all groups. To theists: what are some of your questions regarding atheism, or what do you find to be inconsistent, implausible, silly, mean, etc?

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Argument from personal incredulity, then?
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
Atheism
Posts: 2,033
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9/20/2010 4:40:39 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.
Most atheists just want to be left alone, and want a secular society. That's it.

Same. Not all, but some of them may be just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers.

Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Some also express desire to rid religion from the world.
Well, why not, considering all the harm its followers have done.
Well that's not going to happen.
Says you.
There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before.
False, we are born atheist. As such, at the dawn of civilization, we were atheists.
Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.
That's right, we will have them kill themselves off.
I miss the old members.
Atheism
Posts: 2,033
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9/20/2010 4:41:24 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.
That is perhaps one of the most bigoted comments I've ever read on this site.
I miss the old members.
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,484
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9/20/2010 4:41:59 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.

Ironically, theists and conservatives tend to claim that all life has an equal, intrinsic value. :P
nonentity
Posts: 5,008
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9/20/2010 4:42:07 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.

You're joking, right? I'm sorry, as I've always said, sarcasm eludes me...
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,484
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9/20/2010 4:42:46 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:41:24 PM, Atheism wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.
That is perhaps one of the most bigoted comments I've ever read on this site.

Meh. Don't respond to logical fallacies by employing logical fallacies (ad hominem in this case). :P
Danielle
Posts: 21,330
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9/20/2010 4:42:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
Atheists don't seek to eliminate religion but rather eliminate the impact religion has on their lives. If you believe in god, fine, but believing to theists is not enough; they actively seek to convert and in fact a true theist would not only admit that but embrace it considering preaching and recruiting is advocated in most holy text.

Moreover theists seek to impose their values based on religious principles alone which is not fair. As I explained to PCP in our debate regarding secular ethics in politics, it's best to have a set of governing laws that allows each the freedom to abide by their own moral system while still ensuring some basic rights for all citizens (i.e. freedom from theft, etc). If theists did not seek to say keep gay marriage illegal -- and mind you it's primarily theists advocating this policy -- then atheists would have no qualms about what other people practice. It's the imposition and implications theists provoke that warrant such a negative response from atheists.

Of course, though, it's natural to want to eliminate something you see as a threat. Religious people prohibiting the teaching of evolution in schools (when in fact it is scientifically sound), for example, promotes anti-intellectual ideals. It's true that an atheist would probably prefer if religion were eradicated, but most really do not give a hoot about it. If you meet a militant atheist, they've probably reached that point because they've been berated in the name of religion many times. Even when I get really snarky to theists on DDO, it's probably because I've been so negatively impacted by theism that it makes me angry. However "bad experiences" are not why I'm an atheist; it just contributes to the resentment.
President of DDO
PARADIGM_L0ST
Posts: 6,958
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9/20/2010 4:43:19 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.:

There are quite a bit of anti-theists on DDO who would happily trim a little fat off of the Constitution to suit an agenda. That said, there are also a myriad of atheists who will protect the right to be religious, even if they themselves don't subscribe to it. Don't confuse atheism with anti-theism. Though all anti-theists are atheists, not all atheists are anti-theists, in the same way that all Floridians are Americans, but not all Americans are Floridians.
"Have you ever considered suicide? If not, please do." -- Mouthwash (to Inferno)
Atheism
Posts: 2,033
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9/20/2010 4:43:42 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:42:46 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:41:24 PM, Atheism wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.
That is perhaps one of the most bigoted comments I've ever read on this site.

Meh. Don't respond to logical fallacies by employing logical fallacies (ad hominem in this case). :P
I'm not attacking him, I'm attacking his comment.
I miss the old members.
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,484
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9/20/2010 4:43:55 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:42:07 PM, TulleKrazy wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.

You're joking, right? I'm sorry, as I've always said, sarcasm eludes me...

Beware, for his troll fu is strong.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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9/20/2010 4:44:09 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:03:40 PM, theLwerd wrote:
This topic was inspired by its counterpart, Misunderstanding Islam.

There are a lot of misconceptions about atheism, including but not limited to:

- People are atheists because they've had a bad experience with religion, and/or a poor upbringing.
In my limited discussions I have found this to be the majority of atheists.

- Atheists reject the idea of god because they don't want to be held accountable for their sins.
That Hawkins guy basically said that in an interview that someone posted here, he seems to be most atheists "god" or sorts. Put his books together in one book and you would basically have an atheist bible. From what I have seen.

- Atheists have no consistent set of values or morality (and can only ascribe to moral relativism).
That seems to be contrary to the discussions I've had and viewed on this site so far.

- Atheism will cause chaos and destruction (eg. Hitler).
Stalin pops into most Theists minds, a government without religion.

- Atheists seek to eliminate religion and spirituality from government and society.
Again, many conversations have seemed to point the other way.

- Atheists know deep down that god exists, but refuse to accept it, etc.

There are also a lot of discrepancies in describing gnostic atheism vs. agnostic atheism, the tendency to label all atheists as militant (which is annoying coming from theists who simultaneously warn us about not using extremists to define all of them) and general misconceptions about the goals and other tenets of atheism. Obviously there are stereotypes about all groups. To theists: what are some of your questions regarding atheism, or what do you find to be inconsistent, implausible, silly, mean, etc?
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,484
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9/20/2010 4:44:12 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:43:42 PM, Atheism wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:42:46 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:41:24 PM, Atheism wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.
That is perhaps one of the most bigoted comments I've ever read on this site.

Meh. Don't respond to logical fallacies by employing logical fallacies (ad hominem in this case). :P
I'm not attacking him, I'm attacking his comment.

By calling him a bigot.
Atheism
Posts: 2,033
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9/20/2010 4:44:19 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:43:19 PM, PARADIGM_L0ST wrote:
I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.:

There are quite a bit of anti-theists on DDO who would happily trim a little fat off of the Constitution to suit an agenda. That said, there are also a myriad of atheists who will protect the right to be religious, even if they themselves don't subscribe to it. Don't confuse atheism with anti-theism. Though all anti-theists are atheists, not all atheists are anti-theists, in the same way that all Floridians are Americans, but not all Americans are Floridians.
That's a very good analogy.
I miss the old members.
nonentity
Posts: 5,008
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9/20/2010 4:45:24 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:42:56 PM, theLwerd wrote:
Atheists don't seek to eliminate religion but rather eliminate the impact religion has on their lives. If you believe in god, fine, but believing to theists is not enough; they actively seek to convert and in fact a true theist would not only admit that but embrace it considering preaching and recruiting is advocated in most holy text.

Moreover theists seek to impose their values based on religious principles alone which is not fair. As I explained to PCP in our debate regarding secular ethics in politics, it's best to have a set of governing laws that allows each the freedom to abide by their own moral system while still ensuring some basic rights for all citizens (i.e. freedom from theft, etc). If theists did not seek to say keep gay marriage illegal -- and mind you it's primarily theists advocating this policy -- then atheists would have no qualms about what other people practice. It's the imposition and implications theists provoke that warrant such a negative response from atheists.

Of course, though, it's natural to want to eliminate something you see as a threat. Religious people prohibiting the teaching of evolution in schools (when in fact it is scientifically sound), for example, promotes anti-intellectual ideals. It's true that an atheist would probably prefer if religion were eradicated, but most really do not give a hoot about it. If you meet a militant atheist, they've probably reached that point because they've been berated in the name of religion many times. Even when I get really snarky to theists on DDO, it's probably because I've been so negatively impacted by theism that it makes me angry. However "bad experiences" are not why I'm an atheist; it just contributes to the resentment.

Very well said.
Atheism
Posts: 2,033
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9/20/2010 4:45:47 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:44:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:43:42 PM, Atheism wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:42:46 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:41:24 PM, Atheism wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.
That is perhaps one of the most bigoted comments I've ever read on this site.

Meh. Don't respond to logical fallacies by employing logical fallacies (ad hominem in this case). :P
I'm not attacking him, I'm attacking his comment.

By calling him a bigot.
I called his comment bigoted, not him.
Not calling him bigoted, I'm calling his comment bigoted.
In the same way that someone can make a silly comment and not be silly themselves, he can make a bigoted comment and not be a bigot himself.
I miss the old members.
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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9/20/2010 4:46:06 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:42:07 PM, TulleKrazy wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.

You're joking, right? I'm sorry, as I've always said, sarcasm eludes me...

Yes it was a joke.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
Korashk
Posts: 4,597
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9/20/2010 4:46:08 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:44:09 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:03:40 PM, theLwerd wrote:
This topic was inspired by its counterpart, Misunderstanding Islam.

There are a lot of misconceptions about atheism, including but not limited to:

- People are atheists because they've had a bad experience with religion, and/or a poor upbringing.
In my limited discussions I have found this to be the majority of atheists.

- Atheists reject the idea of god because they don't want to be held accountable for their sins.
That Hawkins guy basically said that in an interview that someone posted here, he seems to be most atheists "god" or sorts. Put his books together in one book and you would basically have an atheist bible. From what I have seen.

- Atheists have no consistent set of values or morality (and can only ascribe to moral relativism).
That seems to be contrary to the discussions I've had and viewed on this site so far.

- Atheism will cause chaos and destruction (eg. Hitler).
Stalin pops into most Theists minds, a government without religion.

- Atheists seek to eliminate religion and spirituality from government and society.
Again, many conversations have seemed to point the other way.

- Atheists know deep down that god exists, but refuse to accept it, etc.

There are also a lot of discrepancies in describing gnostic atheism vs. agnostic atheism, the tendency to label all atheists as militant (which is annoying coming from theists who simultaneously warn us about not using extremists to define all of them) and general misconceptions about the goals and other tenets of atheism. Obviously there are stereotypes about all groups. To theists: what are some of your questions regarding atheism, or what do you find to be inconsistent, implausible, silly, mean, etc?

Wow, you are a troll. Don't know how I haven't noticed it before.
When large numbers of otherwise-law abiding people break specific laws en masse, it's usually a fault that lies with the law. - Unknown
Danielle
Posts: 21,330
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9/20/2010 4:47:14 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:19:30 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
This isn't characteristic of atheism, but some do subscribe to such a notion. I agree that it's a hasty generalization, though.

I KNOW it's not a characteristic of atheism -- that was the whole point lol -- I was listing the misconceptions.

I'm okay with this one, as long as we eliminate it through reason - not force.

The point is that I think atheists just want to remove the legal stronghold that theists hold over them. For instance, if a Christian doesn't believe in abortion, they don't have to get one. However a Christian imposing a moral standard on a non-believer based on religion alone is not cohesive to a productive government and society. As I also explained in my latest debate with PCP (about religion and government) it's one thing to be against abortion and have a rational basis for this position. For instance, one could argue logically that life begins at conception, that it's equivalent to murder, etc. However to oppose abortion on the basis of faith alone is not just. People have disputes over morality all the time, but there's no need to have God be the determining factor in legislation (otherwise you might as well be a theocracy).
President of DDO
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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9/20/2010 4:48:10 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:40:07 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:19:30 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:03:40 PM, theLwerd wrote:
This topic was inspired by its counterpart, Misunderstanding Islam.

There are a lot of misconceptions about atheism, including but not limited to:

- People are atheists because they've had a bad experience with religion, and/or a poor upbringing.

- Atheists reject the idea of god because they don't want to be held accountable for their sins.

- Atheists have no consistent set of values or morality (and can only ascribe to moral relativism).

This isn't characteristic of atheism, but some do subscribe to such a notion. I agree that it's a hasty generalization, though.

- Atheism will cause chaos and destruction (eg. Hitler).

- Atheists seek to eliminate religion and spirituality from government and society.

I'm okay with this one, as long as we eliminate it through reason - not force.

- Atheists know deep down that god exists, but refuse to accept it, etc.

There are also a lot of discrepancies in describing gnostic atheism vs. agnostic atheism, the tendency to label all atheists as militant (which is annoying coming from theists who simultaneously warn us about not using extremists to define all of them) and general misconceptions about the goals and other tenets of atheism. Obviously there are stereotypes about all groups. To theists: what are some of your questions regarding atheism, or what do you find to be inconsistent, implausible, silly, mean, etc?

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Argument from personal incredulity, then?

Just call em like I see em bub. Never said I was right, just my ability to believe something when I've seen a lot that contradicts that statement.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen
Atheism
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9/20/2010 4:48:21 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:47:14 PM, theLwerd wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:19:30 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
This isn't characteristic of atheism, but some do subscribe to such a notion. I agree that it's a hasty generalization, though.

I KNOW it's not a characteristic of atheism -- that was the whole point lol -- I was listing the misconceptions.
No, he meant that he knew it was not a characteristic of atheism, he just stated that some atheists actually subscribe to that particular mindset/philosophy/belief.
I miss the old members.
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,484
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9/20/2010 4:49:35 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:45:47 PM, Atheism wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:44:12 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:43:42 PM, Atheism wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:42:46 PM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:41:24 PM, Atheism wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:40:11 PM, jharry wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.

Same. Not all, but many of them are just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers. Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Many also express desire to rid religion from the world. Well that's not going to happen. There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before. Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.

That is my only hope for abortion, maybe enough atheists will abort their children and what ever it is will die out of the population.
That is perhaps one of the most bigoted comments I've ever read on this site.

Meh. Don't respond to logical fallacies by employing logical fallacies (ad hominem in this case). :P
I'm not attacking him, I'm attacking his comment.

By calling him a bigot.
I called his comment bigoted, not him.
Not calling him bigoted, I'm calling his comment bigoted.
In the same way that someone can make a silly comment and not be silly themselves, he can make a bigoted comment and not be a bigot himself.

Fair enough. At that point, then, it merely becomes a matter of pejorative language. :P
jharry
Posts: 4,984
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9/20/2010 4:50:52 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 9/20/2010 4:40:39 PM, Atheism wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:29:53 PM, InsertNameHere wrote:
At 9/20/2010 4:24:55 PM, jharry wrote:

I have a hard time believing that the majority of atheists don't actively seek to remove religion.
Most atheists just want to be left alone, and want a secular society. That's it.
That's it. And most religious just want to be left alone and practice their religion as they feel fit. And they prefer their vote to actually count, you know. Democracy and all.

Same. Not all, but some of them may be just as bad as the hardcore religious preachers.

Even I get people trying to convert me to atheism all the time. Some also express desire to rid religion from the world.
Well, why not, considering all the harm its followers have done.
Well that's not going to happen.
Says you.
There has always been some form of spirituality since the beginning of human civilization, even before.
False, we are born atheist. As such, at the dawn of civilization, we were atheists.
Besides, there are some people out there who would rather die than give up their religious beliefs. You can't just kill those people off.
That's right, we will have them kill themselves off.

Yes. I doubt that you hate the religious. Thanks for clearing that up for me.
In nomine Patris, et Filii, et Spiritus Sancti. Amen