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Born Sinners?

Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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11/23/2015 12:00:44 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

Sinner- a person who transgresses against divine law by committing an immoral act or acts.
Of course, it's just supposed to be a simple truth, not something degrading. It points to human flaw and nothing more, we ALL know we are not perfect and that is the only point, we fall short of the perfect nature of God.

Sins can range from teenie weenie to outright sick things you would never dream of, however they all fall within the same category.

Evil- profoundly immoral and malevolent.

Of course not and the scriptures are not saying that, are some people?...yes some people meet that description but no, that is not the same as the concept of sinner though sins can be evil, that doesn't mean all people meet this definition.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/23/2015 1:03:34 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 12:00:44 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

Sinner- a person who transgresses against divine law by committing an immoral act or acts.
Of course, it's just supposed to be a simple truth, not something degrading. It points to human flaw and nothing more, we ALL know we are not perfect and that is the only point, we fall short of the perfect nature of God.

What is your definition of perfection and perfect nature ?

What flaws does a baby have? It doesn't even know the difference between good and evil so it is perfect and totally innocent of anything till people start brainwashing it with human concepts and judgments.

Sins can range from teenie weenie to outright sick things you would never dream of, however they all fall within the same category.

You seem to imply that sin is an action. Is that what you are claiming?
If it is how can any babies be born in sin ?

Psalm 51:5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me.
Does the above scripture apply to all people or just to the psalmist?

Romans 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

To whom does "all" refer in the above scripture? Just the people who did something wrong at the time or all of humanity of the past present and future?

What sins has a new born baby committed?

Evil- profoundly immoral and malevolent.

Of course not and the scriptures are not saying that, are some people?...yes some people meet that description but no, that is not the same as the concept of sinner though sins can be evil, that doesn't mean all people meet this definition.

Scriptures imply it IF they teach that sin is evil.
It seems religion teaches that all have inherited the sins of adam at birth which implies they are born guilty of being sinners.
Are you saying babies are not born sinners and not guilty of being sinners?
Are you saying sin is not evil ?
Are you saying sinners are not evil ?
AVicu
Posts: 126
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11/23/2015 3:35:50 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

You come from me like it or lump it.
DanMGTOW
Posts: 1,144
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11/23/2015 4:46:12 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

to stop people from killing infants so they would be guaranteed to go to heaven
however killing fetuses is still fair game according to most religions
i suppose it depends on if you believe that fetuses already have a soul or not
if they don't get a soul until their 1st breath then killing them wouldn't do any good
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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11/23/2015 11:32:25 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 1:03:34 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/23/2015 12:00:44 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

Sinner- a person who transgresses against divine law by committing an immoral act or acts.
Of course, it's just supposed to be a simple truth, not something degrading. It points to human flaw and nothing more, we ALL know we are not perfect and that is the only point, we fall short of the perfect nature of God.

What is your definition of perfection and perfect nature ?
Read the definition I provided for sinner, to be perfect means to not do what is in the definition.


What flaws does a baby have? It doesn't even know the difference between good and evil so it is perfect and totally innocent of anything till people start brainwashing it with human concepts and judgments.

You seem to be looking for a fight. I gave you clear cut simple answers and now you want to twist my point into something evil and something I never alluded to.
First of all a baby is a human, doesn't mean it's evil or bad I never said anything like that. I have 4 babies myself and they are the most amazing things I've ever experienced so don't begin your little smear campaign.

What it DOES mean (had you not started to jump to conclusions) is simply that throughout the babies life there will be times when he or she will act imperfectly (since it's human), and we all should be able to scream an amen to that. Simple stuff.



Sins can range from teenie weenie to outright sick things you would never dream of, however they all fall within the same category.

You seem to imply that sin is an action. Is that what you are claiming?
If it is how can any babies be born in sin ?

Read the definition I supplied.

Psalm 51:5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me.
Does the above scripture apply to all people or just to the psalmist?

It's simple, he was birthed into the world by an imperfect human. You don't seem to get the simplistic point of the idea, we are capable of doing wrong things and you want to twist it to mean something it doesn't. Just accept the simplicity of it and move on, unless you are claiming you've never acted inappropriately......

Romans 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

Yes, I've already said that, it's simple stuff. Doesn't mean babies are evil silly, it means we are capable of sin, big deal move on.

To whom does "all" refer in the above scripture? Just the people who did something wrong at the time or all of humanity of the past present and future?

Simplicity doesn't seem to be your forte.

What sins has a new born baby committed?

Nonsense, I've given you solid answers, just stop.



Evil- profoundly immoral and malevolent.

Of course not and the scriptures are not saying that, are some people?...yes some people meet that description but no, that is not the same as the concept of sinner though sins can be evil, that doesn't mean all people meet this definition.

Scriptures imply it IF they teach that sin is evil.
It seems religion teaches that all have inherited the sins of adam at birth which implies they are born guilty of being sinners.
Are you saying babies are not born sinners and not guilty of being sinners?
Are you saying sin is not evil ?
Are you saying sinners are not evil ?

All answered in my two posts, should be enough to cover every aspect.
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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11/23/2015 11:40:22 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

It is a load of garbage, a new born baby hasn't had the chance to do anything wrong!
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,482
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11/23/2015 12:21:09 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 11:40:22 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

It is a load of garbage, a new born baby hasn't had the chance to do anything wrong!

babies will go to hell for eternity because of what Adam and eve did... haleloya!
Never fart near dog
JJ50
Posts: 2,144
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11/23/2015 12:25:05 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 12:21:09 PM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 11/23/2015 11:40:22 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

It is a load of garbage, a new born baby hasn't had the chance to do anything wrong!

babies will go to hell for eternity because of what Adam and eve did... haleloya!

How anyone can believe that to be true beats me!
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,482
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11/23/2015 12:58:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 12:25:05 PM, JJ50 wrote:
At 11/23/2015 12:21:09 PM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 11/23/2015 11:40:22 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

It is a load of garbage, a new born baby hasn't had the chance to do anything wrong!

babies will go to hell for eternity because of what Adam and eve did... haleloya!

How anyone can believe that to be true beats me!

ohh wait!! u dont believe that ??! u going with me to hell praise the lord!
Never fart near dog
Electric-Eccentric
Posts: 1,309
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11/23/2015 7:12:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
If so called SIN is simply put, the DENIAL & rejection of a truth, fact, reality or such that CAN be KNOWN.

Then a baby wouldn't have the capability to SIN until the parents or others had passed the make believe and pretend realities of santa, the tooth fairy, easter bunny and such on to them.

The deceptions and lies of the parents and such are passed on to those that CHOOSE with their inner free will choices to SIN and reject and deny the TRUTH that can be known.

I know this for fact as I didn't choose to be FOOLED by the so called adults and older others when young.

I have been a people watcher since I could assemble the thoughts for watching the BIG show and show offs.

ALL have sinned some may say?

Even if that is TRUE, a person can CHOOSE to GROW UP and SIN NO MORE and be FREE of the confusion and doubt that the SINNERS have.

don't like what I wrote as it gets in the way of your make believe and pretend realities?

that is your FREE WILL choice to reject and deny what you don't like.

It is YOUR PERSONAL choice to make or not.
Life is what YOU make it,
Most just try and fake it...
10cents
Posts: 61
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11/23/2015 7:21:42 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

Sinning has nothing to do with being good or evil. If you don't listen to the voice of God and obey his commandments, you will remain confused like all sinners are.
Electric-Eccentric
Posts: 1,309
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11/23/2015 7:53:04 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 7:21:42 PM, 10cents wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

Sinning has nothing to do with being good or evil. If you don't listen to the voice of God and obey his commandments, you will remain confused like all sinners are.

EE: Howdy Brad, What do you have to say about my post?

You seem to FIT the concept of a sinner that chooses to remain a sinner like most choose their make believe and pretend realities as a means of possible ESCAPE from themselves and what ever gets in the way of what you CHOOSE to TRY and believe.

GROW UP and SIN no more.
Life is what YOU make it,
Most just try and fake it...
10cents
Posts: 61
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11/23/2015 8:02:17 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 7:53:04 PM, Electric-Eccentric wrote:
At 11/23/2015 7:21:42 PM, 10cents wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

Sinning has nothing to do with being good or evil. If you don't listen to the voice of God and obey his commandments, you will remain confused like all sinners are.

EE: Howdy Brad, What do you have to say about my post?

You seem to FIT the concept of a sinner that chooses to remain a sinner like most choose their make believe and pretend realities as a means of possible ESCAPE from themselves and what ever gets in the way of what you CHOOSE to TRY and believe.

GROW UP and SIN no more. : :

A sinner is a reference to the visible flesh and all it's experiences during this first age that will be destroyed according to our Creator's plan. The invisible man will awaken in new flesh and experience life without ever understanding what death means.

I know you believe life created life which is actually a true statement but the life we're experiencing is simulated from the life that created the simulation. The life that created the simulation is our Creator who is totally invisible to his created characters and their consciousness he created for them to make them believe they are real.

If you believe you're a real person made out of hard physical matter, then you've been greatly deceived. If you believe we were created in the mind of a Creator who spoke his thoughts into a computer simulation, then you believe in the Truth.
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
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11/23/2015 8:06:57 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 8:02:17 PM, 10cents wrote:
At 11/23/2015 7:53:04 PM, Electric-Eccentric wrote:
At 11/23/2015 7:21:42 PM, 10cents wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

Sinning has nothing to do with being good or evil. If you don't listen to the voice of God and obey his commandments, you will remain confused like all sinners are.

EE: Howdy Brad, What do you have to say about my post?

You seem to FIT the concept of a sinner that chooses to remain a sinner like most choose their make believe and pretend realities as a means of possible ESCAPE from themselves and what ever gets in the way of what you CHOOSE to TRY and believe.

GROW UP and SIN no more. : :

A sinner is a reference to the visible flesh and all it's experiences during this first age that will be destroyed according to our Creator's plan. The invisible man will awaken in new flesh and experience life without ever understanding what death means.

I know you believe life created life which is actually a true statement but the life we're experiencing is simulated from the life that created the simulation. The life that created the simulation is our Creator who is totally invisible to his created characters and their consciousness he created for them to make them believe they are real.

If you believe you're a real person made out of hard physical matter, then you've been greatly deceived. If you believe we were created in the mind of a Creator who spoke his thoughts into a computer simulation, then you believe in the Truth.

BOG, once again, seek professional help.
10cents
Posts: 61
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11/23/2015 8:14:08 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 8:06:57 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 11/23/2015 8:02:17 PM, 10cents wrote:
At 11/23/2015 7:53:04 PM, Electric-Eccentric wrote:
At 11/23/2015 7:21:42 PM, 10cents wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

Sinning has nothing to do with being good or evil. If you don't listen to the voice of God and obey his commandments, you will remain confused like all sinners are.

EE: Howdy Brad, What do you have to say about my post?

You seem to FIT the concept of a sinner that chooses to remain a sinner like most choose their make believe and pretend realities as a means of possible ESCAPE from themselves and what ever gets in the way of what you CHOOSE to TRY and believe.

GROW UP and SIN no more. : :

A sinner is a reference to the visible flesh and all it's experiences during this first age that will be destroyed according to our Creator's plan. The invisible man will awaken in new flesh and experience life without ever understanding what death means.

I know you believe life created life which is actually a true statement but the life we're experiencing is simulated from the life that created the simulation. The life that created the simulation is our Creator who is totally invisible to his created characters and their consciousness he created for them to make them believe they are real.

If you believe you're a real person made out of hard physical matter, then you've been greatly deceived. If you believe we were created in the mind of a Creator who spoke his thoughts into a computer simulation, then you believe in the Truth.

BOG, once again, seek professional help. : :

What you call professional help can't help anyone keep from dying in this world. I only listen to our Creator who made psychologists believe they are real people making a good living by lying to their customers.

Those professionals you're suggesting I go see are no different than all the confused religious people who believe their god is coming back in a body and protect them from the evil people.

We're living in a simulation that will never end and there isn't any professionals on this planet who can prove that we're not living in a simulation.
Jovian
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11/23/2015 8:19:51 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

This seems to be some religious peoples' doctrines. People are dirty because of their lusts, which God gave them. You always solve a problem by going to the root of the problem. Who gave us our lusts? God. He is the one to blame, if we should listen to these human-haters' logics.
10cents
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11/23/2015 8:22:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 8:19:51 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

This seems to be some religious peoples' doctrines. People are dirty because of their lusts, which God gave them. You always solve a problem by going to the root of the problem. Who gave us our lusts? God. He is the one to blame, if we should listen to these human-haters' logics. : :

The Creator of all things gave you the wisdom to know that he's to blame for everything we characters experience.
Jovian
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11/23/2015 8:24:19 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 8:22:06 PM, 10cents wrote:
At 11/23/2015 8:19:51 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

This seems to be some religious peoples' doctrines. People are dirty because of their lusts, which God gave them. You always solve a problem by going to the root of the problem. Who gave us our lusts? God. He is the one to blame, if we should listen to these human-haters' logics. : :

The Creator of all things gave you the wisdom to know that he's to blame for everything we characters experience.

One good thing does not obliterate one bad thing.
10cents
Posts: 61
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11/23/2015 8:26:14 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 8:24:19 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 11/23/2015 8:22:06 PM, 10cents wrote:
At 11/23/2015 8:19:51 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

This seems to be some religious peoples' doctrines. People are dirty because of their lusts, which God gave them. You always solve a problem by going to the root of the problem. Who gave us our lusts? God. He is the one to blame, if we should listen to these human-haters' logics. : :

The Creator of all things gave you the wisdom to know that he's to blame for everything we characters experience.

One good thing does not obliterate one bad thing. : :

Don't let good and bad deceive you of the Truth. Most people were deceived by such things they couldn't explain without listening to our Creator's voice.
12_13
Posts: 1,361
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11/23/2015 10:15:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

I have understood that sin means to reject God or to live without God. All people that are born to this world are born in separation from God, so all live in sin here, until the connection is restored.
Electric-Eccentric
Posts: 1,309
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11/23/2015 10:27:48 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 10:15:44 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

I have understood that sin means to reject God or to live without God. All people that are born to this world are born in separation from God, so all live in sin here, until the connection is restored.

EE: It is clear to see for those with the understanding to SEE, that there are those of the MANY that try and JOIN IN on the worldly ways,

be they religious or choose another popular label to apply to themselves.

Then there are those of the FEW that make a much different choice and leave the ways of the popular world behind them.

What are the ways of the world? Choosing to deceive and lie to ones self and any spreading the deceptions and lies called good.

The reason that those of the MANY try and defend their deceptions and lies called good is that they don't want to GROW UP and be RESPONSIBLE for their own personal thoughts and actions.

They try and place the blame on some made up God, so called scientific theories or what ever seems to make sense within their delusional realities.

GROW UP, be responsible and SIN no more.
Life is what YOU make it,
Most just try and fake it...
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/24/2015 4:03:09 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 3:35:50 AM, AVicu wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

You come from me like it or lump it.

I suggest you discuss that with Brad. He is convinced we all come from him.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/24/2015 4:09:46 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 4:01:46 AM, missmedic wrote:
Is disobeying a commandment immoral?

Depends on who gave the commandment or wrote the law and whether humans judge it as something moral in the first place.

Eg ...Any law or commandment that tells people to love a mythical god or any invisible supernatural character, is ridiculous. It is neither moral nor immoral to disobey it but it is totally foolish to obey it.

Punishing children for the crimes of the parents is immoral.

I agree with that.
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/24/2015 4:38:25 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 11:32:25 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 11/23/2015 1:03:34 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/23/2015 12:00:44 AM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

Sinner- a person who transgresses against divine law by committing an immoral act or acts.
Of course, it's just supposed to be a simple truth, not something degrading. It points to human flaw and nothing more, we ALL know we are not perfect and that is the only point, we fall short of the perfect nature of God.

What is your definition of perfection and perfect nature ?
Read the definition I provided for sinner, to be perfect means to not do what is in the definition.

Believers in Jesus are supposed to sin no more yet they continue to sin because they do not believe they can stop.
Jesus commanded them to be perfect as the father is perfect , yet they still whine about how imperfect they are because they have no clue how to be perfect. They also seem to think that claiming imperfection is somehow manifesting humility.
Obviously they don't realize how foolish it is.

What flaws does a baby have? It doesn't even know the difference between good and evil so it is perfect and totally innocent of anything till people start brainwashing it with human concepts and judgments.

You seem to be looking for a fight. I gave you clear cut simple answers and now you want to twist my point into something evil and something I never alluded to.
First of all a baby is a human, doesn't mean it's evil or bad I never said anything like that. I have 4 babies myself and they are the most amazing things I've ever experienced so don't begin your little smear campaign.

Do you believe they are born perfect?
No smear campaign going on anywhere except in your mind.
Religion has smeared your mind with false doctrines.
I am merely trying to make people think for themselves instead of blindly following their religious beliefs.

What it DOES mean (had you not started to jump to conclusions) is simply that throughout the babies life there will be times when he or she will act imperfectly (since it's human), and we all should be able to scream an amen to that. Simple stuff.

Imperfectly according to whose judgements?
Jesus also acted imperfectly according to the judgment of some characters in the bible stories. Did that make him imperfect? It obviously did in the judgments of those who saw him as evil.
Human judgment can obviously be in error and perfection is a matter of perception.

Sins can range from teenie weenie to outright sick things you would never dream of, however they all fall within the same category.

You seem to imply that sin is an action. Is that what you are claiming?
If it is how can any babies be born in sin ?

Read the definition I supplied.

Babies are born perfect. They break no laws and are guilty of nothing at all since they don't even know the difference between right and wrong.

Psalm 51:5 Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me.
Does the above scripture apply to all people or just to the psalmist?

It's simple, he was birthed into the world by an imperfect human. You don't seem to get the simplistic point of the idea, we are capable of doing wrong things and you want to twist it to mean something it doesn't. Just accept the simplicity of it and move on, unless you are claiming you've never acted inappropriately......

Right and wrong are human judgments. Jesus did wrong in the eyes of some people. Did that make him imperfect ?
Do you think calling religious people who worship the God or Abraham, fools is disrespectful and inappropriate?

Romans 3:23 for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God,

Yes, I've already said that, it's simple stuff. Doesn't mean babies are evil silly, it means we are capable of sin, big deal move on.

What about the Jesus character? Was he capable of sin? Did he sin ? Was he perfect or imperfect or does perfection/imperfection depend entirely on the perception of the human judges who condemned him to death like a criminal?

To whom does "all" refer in the above scripture? Just the people who did something wrong at the time or all of humanity of the past present and future?

Simplicity doesn't seem to be your forte.

I am merely a teacher who already knows the answers and is testing the readers to see what answers they come up with.
When a teacher asks a student to do the math.... 2+2=? It is not because they don't know the answer. It is because they are encouraging the student to work it out.
Get it?

What sins has a new born baby committed?

Nonsense, I've given you solid answers, just stop.

Still don't want to think for yourself ?
So far you have told me we are all sinners due to being capable of wrongdoing.
Was Jesus also a sinner in that case? He did wrong in the eyes of the religious leaders who judged him as being an evil blasphemer.

Evil- profoundly immoral and malevolent.

Of course not and the scriptures are not saying that, are some people?...yes some people meet that description but no, that is not the same as the concept of sinner though sins can be evil, that doesn't mean all people meet this definition.

Scriptures imply it IF they teach that sin is evil.
It seems religion teaches that all have inherited the sins of adam at birth which implies they are born guilty of being sinners.
Are you saying babies are not born sinners and not guilty of being sinners?
Are you saying sin is not evil ?
Are you saying sinners are not evil ?

All answered in my two posts, should be enough to cover every aspect.

I see you still don't want to think any deeper than you are accustomed.
Skyangel
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11/24/2015 4:39:08 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 11:40:22 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

It is a load of garbage, a new born baby hasn't had the chance to do anything wrong!

Obviously.
Skyangel
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11/24/2015 4:41:46 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 12:21:09 PM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 11/23/2015 11:40:22 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

It is a load of garbage, a new born baby hasn't had the chance to do anything wrong!

babies will go to hell for eternity because of what Adam and eve did... haleloya!

Do you believe that is what happens to babies if they die soon after they are born ?
Skyangel
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11/24/2015 4:44:17 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 12:58:17 PM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 11/23/2015 12:25:05 PM, JJ50 wrote:
At 11/23/2015 12:21:09 PM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 11/23/2015 11:40:22 AM, JJ50 wrote:
At 11/22/2015 11:50:02 PM, Skyangel wrote:
What do you think about the doctrine or concept regarding all people being born sinners?

It seems religion accuses people of being evil as soon as they are born before they even do anything wrong.

Are people innocent till proven guilty or are they guilty till proven innocent ?

It is a load of garbage, a new born baby hasn't had the chance to do anything wrong!

babies will go to hell for eternity because of what Adam and eve did... haleloya!

How anyone can believe that to be true beats me!

ohh wait!! u dont believe that ??! u going with me to hell praise the lord!

If you believe you are going to hell, obviously your religion has not done you any good or converted you from being a sinner.
Skyangel
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11/24/2015 5:24:48 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/23/2015 7:12:51 PM, Electric-Eccentric wrote:
If so called SIN is simply put, the DENIAL & rejection of a truth, fact, reality or such that CAN be KNOWN.

I understand and agree with your perception.

Then a baby wouldn't have the capability to SIN until the parents or others had passed the make believe and pretend realities of santa, the tooth fairy, easter bunny and such on to them.

People who believe in mythical characters making laws for them, seem to be under the impression that it is a sin to disobey commands of mythical characters.

The deceptions and lies of the parents and such are passed on to those that CHOOSE with their inner free will choices to SIN and reject and deny the TRUTH that can be known.

The parents are sinning in the first place by lying to their children. They also sin against themselves by lying to themselves.

I know this for fact as I didn't choose to be FOOLED by the so called adults and older others when young.

I have been a people watcher since I could assemble the thoughts for watching the BIG show and show offs.

ALL have sinned some may say?

It depends entirely on perception and the moral standards one chooses to live by.

Even if that is TRUE, a person can CHOOSE to GROW UP and SIN NO MORE and be FREE of the confusion and doubt that the SINNERS have.

It is obviously the "sin no more" concept that believers have a problem with. They seem to see sin as an outward action and do not look deeper at the motivations for the action.

don't like what I wrote as it gets in the way of your make believe and pretend realities?

that is your FREE WILL choice to reject and deny what you don't like.

It is YOUR PERSONAL choice to make or not.

Most people seem to choose to follow their own instincts and beliefs.
It is obviously not easy to change life long brainwashing and programming by society and become an independent thinker who can think outside the boxes of society, their false doctrines and sci fi theories.