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Finished his work or not ?

Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/28/2015 10:52:37 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
According to Jesus his work was to fulfil all prophecies. (Matt 5:17 )

The work of fulfilling all prophecies is finished according to Jesus own words. ( John 17:4 )

Since it is finished there is no reason for him to return at any future time to finish anything.

If he needs to return to fulfil some other prophecies, his work of fulfilling all prophecies is obviously not finished and John 17:4 is a lie.

Therefore why are so many believers waiting for a physical return of Jesus Christ in literal clouds in the future?

Don't they know his work is finished?
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,095
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11/29/2015 6:47:21 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/28/2015 10:52:37 PM, Skyangel wrote:
According to Jesus his work was to fulfil all prophecies. (Matt 5:17 )

The work of fulfilling all prophecies is finished according to Jesus own words. ( John 17:4 )

Since it is finished there is no reason for him to return at any future time to finish anything.

If he needs to return to fulfil some other prophecies, his work of fulfilling all prophecies is obviously not finished and John 17:4 is a lie.

Therefore why are so many believers waiting for a physical return of Jesus Christ in literal clouds in the future?

Don't they know his work is finished?

Jesus did not fulfill all the messianic prophecies much less all prophecy.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/29/2015 8:48:45 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/29/2015 6:47:21 PM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 11/28/2015 10:52:37 PM, Skyangel wrote:
According to Jesus his work was to fulfil all prophecies. (Matt 5:17 )

The work of fulfilling all prophecies is finished according to Jesus own words. ( John 17:4 )

Since it is finished there is no reason for him to return at any future time to finish anything.

If he needs to return to fulfil some other prophecies, his work of fulfilling all prophecies is obviously not finished and John 17:4 is a lie.

Therefore why are so many believers waiting for a physical return of Jesus Christ in literal clouds in the future?

Don't they know his work is finished?

Jesus did not fulfill all the messianic prophecies much less all prophecy.

Do you believe the character Jesus was lying when he claimed to have finished his work.?

Whether people believe the character fulfilled all prophecies or not depends on how they choose to interpret the prophecies.

If you take them literally, it is not hard to see how many people believe they have not been fulfilled.

If you look at them all in an allegorical sense, they have indeed all been fulfilled in the past, are still being fulfilled today and will still continue to be fulfilled in the future.

However you need to understand the concept of the word of God being the same yesterday today and forever and being relevant to all generations of the past present and future.

If people do not understand the principle of the WORD which WAS and IS and IS TO COME at all times, they will obviously lack comprehension of how any prophecies which appear to be futuristic can already have been fulfilled in the past as well as still continuing to be fulfilled in the future.

I understand that concept will most likely confuse most readers but I am sure a FEW intelligent people will grasp it eventually.

It is really not that hard to comprehend.
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,095
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11/29/2015 11:03:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/29/2015 8:48:45 PM, Skyangel wrote:
At 11/29/2015 6:47:21 PM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 11/28/2015 10:52:37 PM, Skyangel wrote:
According to Jesus his work was to fulfil all prophecies. (Matt 5:17 )

The work of fulfilling all prophecies is finished according to Jesus own words. ( John 17:4 )

Since it is finished there is no reason for him to return at any future time to finish anything.

If he needs to return to fulfil some other prophecies, his work of fulfilling all prophecies is obviously not finished and John 17:4 is a lie.

Therefore why are so many believers waiting for a physical return of Jesus Christ in literal clouds in the future?

Don't they know his work is finished?

Jesus did not fulfill all the messianic prophecies much less all prophecy.

Do you believe the character Jesus was lying when he claimed to have finished his work.?

Not necessarily.

Whether people believe the character fulfilled all prophecies or not depends on how they choose to interpret the prophecies.

If you take them literally, it is not hard to see how many people believe they have not been fulfilled.

If you look at them all in an allegorical sense, they have indeed all been fulfilled in the past, are still being fulfilled today and will still continue to be fulfilled in the future.

Even allegory has meaning. You can't just say it is figurative and ignore the intended meaning of the words. For instance:

He will swallow up death forever,
And the Lord God will wipe away tears from all faces

And they will hammer their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks.
Nation will not lift up sword against nation,
And never again will they learn war

Does this describe anything Jesus did?

However you need to understand the concept of the word of God being the same yesterday today and forever and being relevant to all generations of the past present and future.

I believe this type of obfuscation has become popular only because it is now obvious that certain parts of the Bible cannot be taken literally.

If people do not understand the principle of the WORD which WAS and IS and IS TO COME at all times, they will obviously lack comprehension of how any prophecies which appear to be futuristic can already have been fulfilled in the past as well as still continuing to be fulfilled in the future.

I understand that concept will most likely confuse most readers but I am sure a FEW intelligent people will grasp it eventually.

It is really not that hard to comprehend.

Yes, the Bible becomes much easier to understand when the meaning is dependent on the reader and not the words.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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11/30/2015 3:35:43 AM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 11/29/2015 11:03:00 PM, Skepticalone wrote:
At 11/29/2015 8:48:45 PM, Skyangel wrote:

If you take them literally, it is not hard to see how many people believe they have not been fulfilled.

If you look at them all in an allegorical sense, they have indeed all been fulfilled in the past, are still being fulfilled today and will still continue to be fulfilled in the future.

Even allegory has meaning. You can't just say it is figurative and ignore the intended meaning of the words. For instance:

He will swallow up death forever,

Of course you need to take it all context.
Swallowing death forever in context does not seem to refer to physical death being annihilated forever as being an intricate part of life.
Physical death is a normal part of physical life and will always be with us as long as life remains.
Once we are dead physically we remain dead physically as individuals.

And the Lord God will wipe away tears from all faces

If you can mange to see Life itself as Lord of our lives and as the one in charge of death as well as life, then all our tears are indeed wiped away on the day we die since we will never cry again. The dead know and feel nothing.
It is the living that cry and feel pain.
No supernatural character is going to take your hand and sit you on his knee and wipe your nose for you and tell you everything will be better tomorrow.

And they will hammer their swords into plowshares and their spears into pruning hooks.
Nation will not lift up sword against nation,
And never again will they learn war

Does this describe anything Jesus did?

That depends on how you wish to interpret it. It can be interpreted in a literal way as nations of the planet Earth or in a spiritual way as the nations of darkness and light.
The war can be referring to literal war on planet Earth or individual inner wars and conflicts of the mind between the inner light and darkness.
Some people find peace through the Word of Truth and others continue to war and argue all about it.
Some live their lives struggling between the inner good and evil as they try to embrace their own goodness and reject their own evil which causes them to hate a part of themselves.
Others find peace as they find reconciliation between the good and evil within them in the same way you can reconcile night and day as being part of the same day. In that perspective you do not see either side as evil but you see how both work together for good and compliment each other.
The word of TRUTH is a two edged sword which can cut both ways and cause division or create unity.
Heb 4:12 For the word of God is quick, and powerful, and sharper than any twoedged sword, piercing even to the dividing asunder of soul and spirit, and of the joints and marrow, and is a discerner of the thoughts and intents of the heart.

However you need to understand the concept of the word of God being the same yesterday today and forever and being relevant to all generations of the past present and future.

I believe this type of obfuscation has become popular only because it is now obvious that certain parts of the Bible cannot be taken literally.

It should be obvious to all from the beginning that none of it is to be taken literally. Obviously the taking serpent in the story seems real to those who want to believe in talking animals.
You would think humanity would have grown out of childish beliefs in such nonsense in this day and age but obviously the human mind is slow to evolve intelligence.

If people do not understand the principle of the WORD which WAS and IS and IS TO COME at all times, they will obviously lack comprehension of how any prophecies which appear to be futuristic can already have been fulfilled in the past as well as still continuing to be fulfilled in the future.

I understand that concept will most likely confuse most readers but I am sure a FEW intelligent people will grasp it eventually.

It is really not that hard to comprehend.

Yes, the Bible becomes much easier to understand when the meaning is dependent on the reader and not the words.

A double edged sword can cut both ways so you need to be able to comprehend both ways of cutting rather than sticking to only way of slicing the cake or bread or whatever you wish to eat as literal food or spiritual food.
There are many ways to cut up food, cook it and share it around or eat it raw and people are welcome to take what they want and leave the rest for whoever else wants a bit.

There is more then one way to skin a cat.
There are more than a few ways to interpret the bible stories. If there were not, we would not have so many different doctrines and divisions in this world.

Each to his own.
Different strokes for different folks.