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Question to christians???

kjw47
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12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.
Geogeer
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12/22/2015 4:49:12 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

Ver. 6. To us there is but one God, the Father; of whom all things, and we unto him. Of or from the Father are all things, even the eternal Son and the Holy Ghost, though they are one and the same God with the Father. --- And one Lord Jesus Christ: by whom are all things, and we by him. All things were created by the Son of God, the eternal and uncreated wisdom of the Father, from whom he proceeds from eternity, and also by the Holy Ghost, all creatures being equally the work of the three divine persons. The Arians and Socinians pretend from this place, that only the Father is truly and properly God. The Catholics answer, that he is called the God, of whom all, because from him always proceeded, do proceed, and shall always proceed the Son and the Holy Ghost, though one and the same God in nature, substance, &c. And that when he is called the one God, by these words are excluded the false gods of the heathens, not the Son, and the Holy Ghost, who are but one God with the Father. St. Chrysostom also here observes, (hom. xx.) that if the two other persons are excluded, because the Father is called one God, by the same way of reasoning it would follow, that because Jesus Christ is called the one Lord, neither the Holy Ghost, nor even the Father, are the one Lord, whereas the Scriptures many times express the divine majesty, as well by the word Lord as by the word God. (Witham)

http://haydock1859.tripod.com...
SNP1
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12/22/2015 5:27:58 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and

Well, I personally think that Paul is another name for Simon Magus (Robert Price makes a good case for it), and am a Jesus mythicist, but I will answer this the best I can.

Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

That is not what 1Cor 8:6 says. What it says is:
"As far as we are concerned, there is one God, the Father..."

The important part is what you left out.
The reason is that that part of 1Cor seems to be a Marcionite writing.
Marcionism (and some other Simonian derived denominations) took the position that the god of the OT and the god that was Jesus' father were separate beings.
So, what it is saying is that to those that have the gnosis, the god they care about is the Father, not the god of the OT.
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SNP1
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12/22/2015 5:33:08 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
Also, no, I am not a Christian, but I study the Bible enough that I think I can give some input that others miss.
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kjw47
Posts: 1,624
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12/23/2015 5:09:15 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/22/2015 4:49:12 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

Ver. 6. To us there is but one God, the Father; of whom all things, and we unto him. Of or from the Father are all things, even the eternal Son and the Holy Ghost, though they are one and the same God with the Father. --- And one Lord Jesus Christ: by whom are all things, and we by him. All things were created by the Son of God, the eternal and uncreated wisdom of the Father, from whom he proceeds from eternity, and also by the Holy Ghost, all creatures being equally the work of the three divine persons. The Arians and Socinians pretend from this place, that only the Father is truly and properly God. The Catholics answer, that he is called the God, of whom all, because from him always proceeded, do proceed, and shall always proceed the Son and the Holy Ghost, though one and the same God in nature, substance, &c. And that when he is called the one God, by these words are excluded the false gods of the heathens, not the Son, and the Holy Ghost, who are but one God with the Father. St. Chrysostom also here observes, (hom. xx.) that if the two other persons are excluded, because the Father is called one God, by the same way of reasoning it would follow, that because Jesus Christ is called the one Lord, neither the Holy Ghost, nor even the Father, are the one Lord, whereas the Scriptures many times express the divine majesty, as well by the word Lord as by the word God. (Witham)

http://haydock1859.tripod.com...

1Cor 8:6 doesn't say what you wrote.
kjw47
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12/23/2015 5:10:39 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/22/2015 5:27:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and

Well, I personally think that Paul is another name for Simon Magus (Robert Price makes a good case for it), and am a Jesus mythicist, but I will answer this the best I can.

Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

That is not what 1Cor 8:6 says. What it says is:
"As far as we are concerned, there is one God, the Father..."

The important part is what you left out.
The reason is that that part of 1Cor seems to be a Marcionite writing.
Marcionism (and some other Simonian derived denominations) took the position that the god of the OT and the god that was Jesus' father were separate beings.
So, what it is saying is that to those that have the gnosis, the god they care about is the Father, not the god of the OT.

The Father is the God of the ot=YHWH(Jehovah=John 4:22-24
Geogeer
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12/23/2015 5:20:04 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/23/2015 5:09:15 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:49:12 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

Ver. 6. To us there is but one God, the Father; of whom all things, and we unto him. Of or from the Father are all things, even the eternal Son and the Holy Ghost, though they are one and the same God with the Father. --- And one Lord Jesus Christ: by whom are all things, and we by him. All things were created by the Son of God, the eternal and uncreated wisdom of the Father, from whom he proceeds from eternity, and also by the Holy Ghost, all creatures being equally the work of the three divine persons. The Arians and Socinians pretend from this place, that only the Father is truly and properly God. The Catholics answer, that he is called the God, of whom all, because from him always proceeded, do proceed, and shall always proceed the Son and the Holy Ghost, though one and the same God in nature, substance, &c. And that when he is called the one God, by these words are excluded the false gods of the heathens, not the Son, and the Holy Ghost, who are but one God with the Father. St. Chrysostom also here observes, (hom. xx.) that if the two other persons are excluded, because the Father is called one God, by the same way of reasoning it would follow, that because Jesus Christ is called the one Lord, neither the Holy Ghost, nor even the Father, are the one Lord, whereas the Scriptures many times express the divine majesty, as well by the word Lord as by the word God. (Witham)

http://haydock1859.tripod.com...


1Cor 8:6 doesn't say what you wrote.

What I gave you was a exegesis on the topic that interprets that verse in context of the remainder of Christian teaching. What Paul is doing is shown 2 of the persons of the triune God. How can we know this? Look at the 10 commandment. I am the Lord thy God... Paul is attributing an attribute of God, namely being Lord, to Jesus.
SNP1
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12/23/2015 5:23:58 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/23/2015 5:10:39 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 5:27:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and

Well, I personally think that Paul is another name for Simon Magus (Robert Price makes a good case for it), and am a Jesus mythicist, but I will answer this the best I can.

Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

That is not what 1Cor 8:6 says. What it says is:
"As far as we are concerned, there is one God, the Father..."

The important part is what you left out.
The reason is that that part of 1Cor seems to be a Marcionite writing.
Marcionism (and some other Simonian derived denominations) took the position that the god of the OT and the god that was Jesus' father were separate beings.
So, what it is saying is that to those that have the gnosis, the god they care about is the Father, not the god of the OT.


The Father is the God of the ot=YHWH(Jehovah=John 4:22-24

That is one interpretation.
Not all early Christians took that position.
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kjw47
Posts: 1,624
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12/23/2015 9:07:26 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/23/2015 5:20:04 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:09:15 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:49:12 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

Ver. 6. To us there is but one God, the Father; of whom all things, and we unto him. Of or from the Father are all things, even the eternal Son and the Holy Ghost, though they are one and the same God with the Father. --- And one Lord Jesus Christ: by whom are all things, and we by him. All things were created by the Son of God, the eternal and uncreated wisdom of the Father, from whom he proceeds from eternity, and also by the Holy Ghost, all creatures being equally the work of the three divine persons. The Arians and Socinians pretend from this place, that only the Father is truly and properly God. The Catholics answer, that he is called the God, of whom all, because from him always proceeded, do proceed, and shall always proceed the Son and the Holy Ghost, though one and the same God in nature, substance, &c. And that when he is called the one God, by these words are excluded the false gods of the heathens, not the Son, and the Holy Ghost, who are but one God with the Father. St. Chrysostom also here observes, (hom. xx.) that if the two other persons are excluded, because the Father is called one God, by the same way of reasoning it would follow, that because Jesus Christ is called the one Lord, neither the Holy Ghost, nor even the Father, are the one Lord, whereas the Scriptures many times express the divine majesty, as well by the word Lord as by the word God. (Witham)

http://haydock1859.tripod.com...


1Cor 8:6 doesn't say what you wrote.

What I gave you was a exegesis on the topic that interprets that verse in context of the remainder of Christian teaching. What Paul is doing is shown 2 of the persons of the triune God. How can we know this? Look at the 10 commandment. I am the Lord thy God... Paul is attributing an attribute of God, namely being Lord, to Jesus.

The world is mistaken--in the OT every spot where--GOD-LORD( all capitols) the tetragramoton belongs --YHWH(Jehovah)-- wicked men removed Gods personal name and replaced it with Titles--God inspired his name to be in those nearly 6800 places because God wants his name there. They had 0 right to remove it. They have 0 right to keep removing it. The NWT was condemned for having enough love for God to put it back--- finally after years of being told these facts--the divine name KJV has put it back where it belongs.
Jehovah is called sovereign Lord--Jesus never is. Jehovah is called the almighty--Jesus never is.
Jesus and his real teachers all agree--Jesus has a God-his Father. There is no trinity in existence
kjw47
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12/23/2015 9:08:42 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/23/2015 5:23:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:10:39 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 5:27:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and

Well, I personally think that Paul is another name for Simon Magus (Robert Price makes a good case for it), and am a Jesus mythicist, but I will answer this the best I can.

Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

That is not what 1Cor 8:6 says. What it says is:
"As far as we are concerned, there is one God, the Father..."

The important part is what you left out.
The reason is that that part of 1Cor seems to be a Marcionite writing.
Marcionism (and some other Simonian derived denominations) took the position that the god of the OT and the god that was Jesus' father were separate beings.
So, what it is saying is that to those that have the gnosis, the god they care about is the Father, not the god of the OT.


The Father is the God of the ot=YHWH(Jehovah=John 4:22-24

That is one interpretation.
Not all early Christians took that position.

All the real ones did. This is the true God--John 4:22-24=Jehovah
SNP1
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12/24/2015 3:43:56 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/23/2015 9:08:42 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:23:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:10:39 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 5:27:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and

Well, I personally think that Paul is another name for Simon Magus (Robert Price makes a good case for it), and am a Jesus mythicist, but I will answer this the best I can.

Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

That is not what 1Cor 8:6 says. What it says is:
"As far as we are concerned, there is one God, the Father..."

The important part is what you left out.
The reason is that that part of 1Cor seems to be a Marcionite writing.
Marcionism (and some other Simonian derived denominations) took the position that the god of the OT and the god that was Jesus' father were separate beings.
So, what it is saying is that to those that have the gnosis, the god they care about is the Father, not the god of the OT.


The Father is the God of the ot=YHWH(Jehovah=John 4:22-24

That is one interpretation.
Not all early Christians took that position.


All the real ones did. This is the true God--John 4:22-24=Jehovah

If you wish to ignore history then don't ask questions that require knowledge of historical context to answer.
#TheApatheticNihilistPartyofAmerica
#WarOnDDO
DPMartin
Posts: 1,096
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12/24/2015 4:19:54 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

You omit the rest of the statement:

6: But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

Hence one Lord, and what Lord would that be? Isn"t this also the Lord?

Ex:6:7: And I will take you to me for a people, and I will be to you a God: and ye shall know that I am the LORD your God, which bringeth you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians.

Isn"t Jesus the Word of God made flesh?

Anyway you take your text out of context, Paul is merely stating for the record on the subject of eating things offered to idols:
4: As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.

His statement in vers 6 is merely the continued acknowledgment of, of God are all things and through His Word His Son are all things. which isn't contrary to, the trinity.

No different then your words are of you, and how the rest of the world knows you and your character, and what you will do, or in the case of you being somebody"s boss, how that which is subordinate to you knows your will. And in the case of the Creator and Judge His Word is Lord over all that there is.
kjw47
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12/24/2015 6:02:47 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/24/2015 3:43:56 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 9:08:42 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:23:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:10:39 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 5:27:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and

Well, I personally think that Paul is another name for Simon Magus (Robert Price makes a good case for it), and am a Jesus mythicist, but I will answer this the best I can.

Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

That is not what 1Cor 8:6 says. What it says is:
"As far as we are concerned, there is one God, the Father..."

The important part is what you left out.
The reason is that that part of 1Cor seems to be a Marcionite writing.
Marcionism (and some other Simonian derived denominations) took the position that the god of the OT and the god that was Jesus' father were separate beings.
So, what it is saying is that to those that have the gnosis, the god they care about is the Father, not the god of the OT.


The Father is the God of the ot=YHWH(Jehovah=John 4:22-24

That is one interpretation.
Not all early Christians took that position.


All the real ones did. This is the true God--John 4:22-24=Jehovah

If you wish to ignore history then don't ask questions that require knowledge of historical context to answer.

I know history pretty well, do you?
After the apostles were killed, the followers were hunted and taken and thrown to hungry wild animals in the collosium as a public spectacle--not only did they all die, the religion died as well for the most part--much truth was lost---- the great apostasy rose up shortly after( 2Thess 2:3)--- not until these last days did truth come back-Daniel 12:4)
kjw47
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12/24/2015 6:05:41 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/24/2015 4:19:54 PM, DPMartin wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

You omit the rest of the statement:

6: But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him; and one Lord Jesus Christ, by whom are all things, and we by him.

Hence one Lord, and what Lord would that be? Isn"t this also the Lord?

Ex:6:7: And I will take you to me for a people, and I will be to you a God: and ye shall know that I am the LORD your God, which bringeth you out from under the burdens of the Egyptians.

Isn"t Jesus the Word of God made flesh?

Anyway you take your text out of context, Paul is merely stating for the record on the subject of eating things offered to idols:
4: As concerning therefore the eating of those things that are offered in sacrifice unto idols, we know that an idol is nothing in the world, and that there is none other God but one.

His statement in vers 6 is merely the continued acknowledgment of, of God are all things and through His Word His Son are all things. which isn't contrary to, the trinity.

No different then your words are of you, and how the rest of the world knows you and your character, and what you will do, or in the case of you being somebody"s boss, how that which is subordinate to you knows your will. And in the case of the Creator and Judge His Word is Lord over all that there is.

What you are missing is the fact--LORD-OR GOD( all capitols) does not belong in the ot--the tetragramoton belongs in nearly 6800 places--YHWH(Jehovah) every spot--LORD-GOD are in trinity translations--- the supposed scholars know it is fact. It has confused many.
SNP1
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12/24/2015 6:21:53 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/24/2015 6:02:47 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 3:43:56 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 9:08:42 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:23:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:10:39 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 5:27:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and

Well, I personally think that Paul is another name for Simon Magus (Robert Price makes a good case for it), and am a Jesus mythicist, but I will answer this the best I can.

Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

That is not what 1Cor 8:6 says. What it says is:
"As far as we are concerned, there is one God, the Father..."

The important part is what you left out.
The reason is that that part of 1Cor seems to be a Marcionite writing.
Marcionism (and some other Simonian derived denominations) took the position that the god of the OT and the god that was Jesus' father were separate beings.
So, what it is saying is that to those that have the gnosis, the god they care about is the Father, not the god of the OT.


The Father is the God of the ot=YHWH(Jehovah=John 4:22-24

That is one interpretation.
Not all early Christians took that position.


All the real ones did. This is the true God--John 4:22-24=Jehovah

If you wish to ignore history then don't ask questions that require knowledge of historical context to answer.



I know history pretty well, do you?

I am going to college for history with specialization in early Christian history. I am pretty sure I know history on this topic at a decent level.

After the apostles were killed, the followers were hunted and taken and thrown to hungry wild animals in the collosium as a public spectacle--not only did they all die, the religion died as well for the most part--much truth was lost---- the great apostasy rose up shortly after( 2Thess 2:3)--- not until these last days did truth come back-Daniel 12:4)

You do realize there aren't ANY reliable historical sources for ANYTHING about the apostles, right?

The books of the Bible are some of the WORST sources for information.

Honestly, at least try and use Josephus as a source for the persecution of James the Just (though that passage probably includes an interpolation which makes it not about that James).
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kjw47
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12/24/2015 8:53:42 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/24/2015 6:21:53 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 6:02:47 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 3:43:56 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 9:08:42 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:23:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:10:39 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 5:27:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and

Well, I personally think that Paul is another name for Simon Magus (Robert Price makes a good case for it), and am a Jesus mythicist, but I will answer this the best I can.

Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

That is not what 1Cor 8:6 says. What it says is:
"As far as we are concerned, there is one God, the Father..."

The important part is what you left out.
The reason is that that part of 1Cor seems to be a Marcionite writing.
Marcionism (and some other Simonian derived denominations) took the position that the god of the OT and the god that was Jesus' father were separate beings.
So, what it is saying is that to those that have the gnosis, the god they care about is the Father, not the god of the OT.


The Father is the God of the ot=YHWH(Jehovah=John 4:22-24

That is one interpretation.
Not all early Christians took that position.


All the real ones did. This is the true God--John 4:22-24=Jehovah

If you wish to ignore history then don't ask questions that require knowledge of historical context to answer.



I know history pretty well, do you?

I am going to college for history with specialization in early Christian history. I am pretty sure I know history on this topic at a decent level.

After the apostles were killed, the followers were hunted and taken and thrown to hungry wild animals in the collosium as a public spectacle--not only did they all die, the religion died as well for the most part--much truth was lost---- the great apostasy rose up shortly after( 2Thess 2:3)--- not until these last days did truth come back-Daniel 12:4)

You do realize there aren't ANY reliable historical sources for ANYTHING about the apostles, right?

The books of the Bible are some of the WORST sources for information.

Honestly, at least try and use Josephus as a source for the persecution of James the Just (though that passage probably includes an interpolation which makes it not about that James).

I will believe the bible writers over men any day of the week.
SNP1
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12/25/2015 12:32:57 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/24/2015 8:53:42 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 6:21:53 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 6:02:47 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 3:43:56 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 9:08:42 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:23:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:10:39 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 5:27:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and

Well, I personally think that Paul is another name for Simon Magus (Robert Price makes a good case for it), and am a Jesus mythicist, but I will answer this the best I can.

Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

That is not what 1Cor 8:6 says. What it says is:
"As far as we are concerned, there is one God, the Father..."

The important part is what you left out.
The reason is that that part of 1Cor seems to be a Marcionite writing.
Marcionism (and some other Simonian derived denominations) took the position that the god of the OT and the god that was Jesus' father were separate beings.
So, what it is saying is that to those that have the gnosis, the god they care about is the Father, not the god of the OT.


The Father is the God of the ot=YHWH(Jehovah=John 4:22-24

That is one interpretation.
Not all early Christians took that position.


All the real ones did. This is the true God--John 4:22-24=Jehovah

If you wish to ignore history then don't ask questions that require knowledge of historical context to answer.



I know history pretty well, do you?

I am going to college for history with specialization in early Christian history. I am pretty sure I know history on this topic at a decent level.

After the apostles were killed, the followers were hunted and taken and thrown to hungry wild animals in the collosium as a public spectacle--not only did they all die, the religion died as well for the most part--much truth was lost---- the great apostasy rose up shortly after( 2Thess 2:3)--- not until these last days did truth come back-Daniel 12:4)

You do realize there aren't ANY reliable historical sources for ANYTHING about the apostles, right?

The books of the Bible are some of the WORST sources for information.

Honestly, at least try and use Josephus as a source for the persecution of James the Just (though that passage probably includes an interpolation which makes it not about that James).


I will believe the bible writers over men any day of the week.

THEN YOU AREN'T TALKING ABOUT HISTORY BUT THEOLOGY.

And, as I said, Paul WAS gnostic-like in his views.
#TheApatheticNihilistPartyofAmerica
#WarOnDDO
bulproof
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12/25/2015 12:45:44 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/24/2015 8:53:42 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 6:21:53 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 6:02:47 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 3:43:56 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 9:08:42 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:23:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/23/2015 5:10:39 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 5:27:58 PM, SNP1 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and

Well, I personally think that Paul is another name for Simon Magus (Robert Price makes a good case for it), and am a Jesus mythicist, but I will answer this the best I can.

Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

That is not what 1Cor 8:6 says. What it says is:
"As far as we are concerned, there is one God, the Father..."

The important part is what you left out.
The reason is that that part of 1Cor seems to be a Marcionite writing.
Marcionism (and some other Simonian derived denominations) took the position that the god of the OT and the god that was Jesus' father were separate beings.
So, what it is saying is that to those that have the gnosis, the god they care about is the Father, not the god of the OT.


The Father is the God of the ot=YHWH(Jehovah=John 4:22-24

That is one interpretation.
Not all early Christians took that position.


All the real ones did. This is the true God--John 4:22-24=Jehovah

If you wish to ignore history then don't ask questions that require knowledge of historical context to answer.



I know history pretty well, do you?

I am going to college for history with specialization in early Christian history. I am pretty sure I know history on this topic at a decent level.

After the apostles were killed, the followers were hunted and taken and thrown to hungry wild animals in the collosium as a public spectacle--not only did they all die, the religion died as well for the most part--much truth was lost---- the great apostasy rose up shortly after( 2Thess 2:3)--- not until these last days did truth come back-Daniel 12:4)

You do realize there aren't ANY reliable historical sources for ANYTHING about the apostles, right?

The books of the Bible are some of the WORST sources for information.

Honestly, at least try and use Josephus as a source for the persecution of James the Just (though that passage probably includes an interpolation which makes it not about that James).


I will believe the bible writers over men any day of the week.
Good for you.
The women who wrote the bible were divine.
Does dummy mean anything to you?
bulproof
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12/25/2015 3:58:58 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/25/2015 3:18:30 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 11:05:50 PM, Pollux wrote:
The bible writers were men.


Men inspired by God to write his words.
Did you miss this?
Good for you.
The women who wrote the bible were divine.
Does dummy mean anything to you?
ReformedPresbyterian72598
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12/25/2015 4:52:56 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

First of all, in 1Cor 8:6 notice how he is presenting God. There is one God to all, the Father... This does not deny the Trinity. All it is telling us is that there is a God the Father to all. Where'd you get no God is Triune?
Secondly, read the entire verse.
"But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him(theFather); and one(singular) Lord(original trans. means Ruler or King) Jesus Christ, by(referring to anything existing) whom are all things, and we by Him."

Hence, the verse addresses Jesus as God, just as the Father is God.
kjw47
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12/25/2015 5:23:26 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/25/2015 4:52:56 PM, ReformedPresbyterian72598 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

First of all, in 1Cor 8:6 notice how he is presenting God. There is one God to all, the Father... This does not deny the Trinity. All it is telling us is that there is a God the Father to all. Where'd you get no God is Triune?
Secondly, read the entire verse.
"But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him(theFather); and one(singular) Lord(original trans. means Ruler or King) Jesus Christ, by(referring to anything existing) whom are all things, and we by Him."

Hence, the verse addresses Jesus as God, just as the Father is God.

No it does not address Jesus as God--it says he is Lord--Gods appointed king( Daniel 7:13-15) otherwise he wouldn't be king. And when his 1000 year reign is done--1Cor 15:24-28) Jesus hands back the kingdom to his God and Father and subjects himself---forever. ---this is the only true God=John 4:22-24
Trinity translations are erred to fit false council teachings.
kjw47
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12/25/2015 5:24:47 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/25/2015 3:58:58 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 12/25/2015 3:18:30 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/24/2015 11:05:50 PM, Pollux wrote:
The bible writers were men.


Men inspired by God to write his words.
Did you miss this?
Good for you.
The women who wrote the bible were divine.
Does dummy mean anything to you?

No I didn't miss it---- you seemed to have missed something along the way.
ReformedPresbyterian72598
Posts: 293
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12/26/2015 6:03:31 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/25/2015 5:23:26 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/25/2015 4:52:56 PM, ReformedPresbyterian72598 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

First of all, in 1Cor 8:6 notice how he is presenting God. There is one God to all, the Father... This does not deny the Trinity. All it is telling us is that there is a God the Father to all. Where'd you get no God is Triune?
Secondly, read the entire verse.
"But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him(theFather); and one(singular) Lord(original trans. means Ruler or King) Jesus Christ, by(referring to anything existing) whom are all things, and we by Him."

Hence, the verse addresses Jesus as God, just as the Father is God.


No it does not address Jesus as God--it says he is Lord--Gods appointed king( Daniel 7:13-15) otherwise he wouldn't be king. And when his 1000 year reign is done--1Cor 15:24-28) Jesus hands back the kingdom to his God and Father and subjects himself---forever. ---this is the only true God=John 4:22-24
Trinity translations are erred to fit false council teachings.

You forgot to explain that in order for something to exist, it must come into, and stay in, existence by the decree of God. "one Lord Jesus Christ by whom are all things." - emphasizing sovereignty.

Who is the Christ? You apparently have read John so, who is the Christ? I will direct you to the books of 1st, 2nd, and 3rd John to answer this question.
kjw47
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12/26/2015 5:02:15 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/26/2015 6:03:31 AM, ReformedPresbyterian72598 wrote:
At 12/25/2015 5:23:26 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/25/2015 4:52:56 PM, ReformedPresbyterian72598 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

First of all, in 1Cor 8:6 notice how he is presenting God. There is one God to all, the Father... This does not deny the Trinity. All it is telling us is that there is a God the Father to all. Where'd you get no God is Triune?
Secondly, read the entire verse.
"But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him(theFather); and one(singular) Lord(original trans. means Ruler or King) Jesus Christ, by(referring to anything existing) whom are all things, and we by Him."

Hence, the verse addresses Jesus as God, just as the Father is God.


No it does not address Jesus as God--it says he is Lord--Gods appointed king( Daniel 7:13-15) otherwise he wouldn't be king. And when his 1000 year reign is done--1Cor 15:24-28) Jesus hands back the kingdom to his God and Father and subjects himself---forever. ---this is the only true God=John 4:22-24
Trinity translations are erred to fit false council teachings.

You forgot to explain that in order for something to exist, it must come into, and stay in, existence by the decree of God. "one Lord Jesus Christ by whom are all things." - emphasizing sovereignty.

Who is the Christ? You apparently have read John so, who is the Christ? I will direct you to the books of 1st, 2nd, and 3rd John to answer this question.

This is the Christ--Coll 1:15-- the firstborn of all creation( created direct-first and last) all other things created through him( Gods master worker) = Prov 8--verse 22--produced me( created direct first and last) as the beginning of your way( creation)--1Cor 1:30)

Let us( Jehovah and his master worker) create man in our image.
ReformedPresbyterian72598
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12/26/2015 5:16:34 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/26/2015 5:02:15 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/26/2015 6:03:31 AM, ReformedPresbyterian72598 wrote:
At 12/25/2015 5:23:26 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/25/2015 4:52:56 PM, ReformedPresbyterian72598 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

First of all, in 1Cor 8:6 notice how he is presenting God. There is one God to all, the Father... This does not deny the Trinity. All it is telling us is that there is a God the Father to all. Where'd you get no God is Triune?
Secondly, read the entire verse.
"But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him(theFather); and one(singular) Lord(original trans. means Ruler or King) Jesus Christ, by(referring to anything existing) whom are all things, and we by Him."

Hence, the verse addresses Jesus as God, just as the Father is God.


No it does not address Jesus as God--it says he is Lord--Gods appointed king( Daniel 7:13-15) otherwise he wouldn't be king. And when his 1000 year reign is done--1Cor 15:24-28) Jesus hands back the kingdom to his God and Father and subjects himself---forever. ---this is the only true God=John 4:22-24
Trinity translations are erred to fit false council teachings.

You forgot to explain that in order for something to exist, it must come into, and stay in, existence by the decree of God. "one Lord Jesus Christ by whom are all things." - emphasizing sovereignty.

Who is the Christ? You apparently have read John so, who is the Christ? I will direct you to the books of 1st, 2nd, and 3rd John to answer this question.


This is the Christ--Coll 1:15-- the firstborn of all creation( created direct-first and last) all other things created through him( Gods master worker) = Prov 8--verse 22--produced me( created direct first and last) as the beginning of your way( creation)--1Cor 1:30)


Let us( Jehovah and his master worker) create man in our image.

K, hold up. ALL power in heaven and earth is given to Christ. He is also the image of the invisible God(a part you missed in Colossians 1:15). Not made in His image, as are we, but the image. He is the only mediator between God and man. All things are created through Him, and by Him do they continue to exist.
You didn't read 1st, 2nd, or 3rd John.
Only God can kill and make alive, wound and heal(Deut 32:39). Not to mention, create the world as shown in Genesis 1 and John 1. BTW, Christ is the Word made flesh - "the Word was with God and the Word was God...All things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that was made."
Yeah, read 1st, 2nd, and 3rd John. It'll do you good.
kjw47
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12/26/2015 5:49:03 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/26/2015 5:16:34 PM, ReformedPresbyterian72598 wrote:
At 12/26/2015 5:02:15 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/26/2015 6:03:31 AM, ReformedPresbyterian72598 wrote:
At 12/25/2015 5:23:26 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 12/25/2015 4:52:56 PM, ReformedPresbyterian72598 wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

First of all, in 1Cor 8:6 notice how he is presenting God. There is one God to all, the Father... This does not deny the Trinity. All it is telling us is that there is a God the Father to all. Where'd you get no God is Triune?
Secondly, read the entire verse.
"But to us there is but one God, the Father, of whom are all things, and we in him(theFather); and one(singular) Lord(original trans. means Ruler or King) Jesus Christ, by(referring to anything existing) whom are all things, and we by Him."

Hence, the verse addresses Jesus as God, just as the Father is God.


No it does not address Jesus as God--it says he is Lord--Gods appointed king( Daniel 7:13-15) otherwise he wouldn't be king. And when his 1000 year reign is done--1Cor 15:24-28) Jesus hands back the kingdom to his God and Father and subjects himself---forever. ---this is the only true God=John 4:22-24
Trinity translations are erred to fit false council teachings.

You forgot to explain that in order for something to exist, it must come into, and stay in, existence by the decree of God. "one Lord Jesus Christ by whom are all things." - emphasizing sovereignty.

Who is the Christ? You apparently have read John so, who is the Christ? I will direct you to the books of 1st, 2nd, and 3rd John to answer this question.


This is the Christ--Coll 1:15-- the firstborn of all creation( created direct-first and last) all other things created through him( Gods master worker) = Prov 8--verse 22--produced me( created direct first and last) as the beginning of your way( creation)--1Cor 1:30)


Let us( Jehovah and his master worker) create man in our image.

K, hold up. ALL power in heaven and earth is given to Christ. He is also the image of the invisible God(a part you missed in Colossians 1:15). Not made in His image, as are we, but the image. He is the only mediator between God and man. All things are created through Him, and by Him do they continue to exist.
You didn't read 1st, 2nd, or 3rd John.
Only God can kill and make alive, wound and heal(Deut 32:39). Not to mention, create the world as shown in Genesis 1 and John 1. BTW, Christ is the Word made flesh - "the Word was with God and the Word was God...All things were made by Him, and without Him was not anything made that was made."
Yeah, read 1st, 2nd, and 3rd John. It'll do you good.

You have missed the facts of reality.

If Jesus were God--it is already all his, yet it had to be given to him, and taught to him.
God is Eternal king---Jesus had to be appointed( Daniel 7:13-15) then he must hand the kingdom back to his God and Father( 1Cor 15:24-28)--- Since Gods word is 100% clear on the fact that Jesus has a God--you would have to teach--God has a God--as well in the 2nd line of John 1:1--God was with God is the trinity teaching in plain English---How can God be with God if there is only one God?
The 100% truth from Jesus--John 17:1-6,26---Jesus clearly teaches here--the one who sent him( Father) is THE ONLY TRUE GOD---( what don't trinities understand about this fact?)--verse 6=Jehovah, 26= Jehovah. makes this reality--this is the only true God=John 4:22-24
graceofgod
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12/26/2015 9:49:33 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

it's even more confusing on it saying there is only one Jesus and doesn't mention michael??? how odd is that....

but of course there is one God to all, father, son and holy spirit are one....

it doesn't mention the holy spirit is an impersonal force, so how do you feel when the bible says the holy spirit can teach you, it can be grieved yet your jw teachers say it is just an impersonal thought...

how do you feel when the bible says no man knows the time of the end and you know your teachers have tried time and time again to guess it....
kjw47
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12/26/2015 10:54:11 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/26/2015 9:49:33 PM, graceofgod wrote:
At 12/22/2015 4:26:32 PM, kjw47 wrote:
If Paul a real teacher of Jesus' or your teacher both stood in front of you and Paul stated--1Cor 8:6--there is one God to all, the Father--and your teacher said--no God is triune--Who do you believe? Because they teach the opposite truths, yet one is correct.

it's even more confusing on it saying there is only one Jesus and doesn't mention michael??? how odd is that....

but of course there is one God to all, father, son and holy spirit are one....

it doesn't mention the holy spirit is an impersonal force, so how do you feel when the bible says the holy spirit can teach you, it can be grieved yet your jw teachers say it is just an impersonal thought...

how do you feel when the bible says no man knows the time of the end and you know your teachers have tried time and time again to guess it....

There is only one you need to listen to=Jesus--John 17:3--- Jesus teaches--the one( Father-John 5:30) who sent him = THE ONLY TRUE GOD.---Why do you call Jesus a liar and teach a trinity?
Jesus saw why---You don't know the one who sent him- John 15:20-21