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Convince me to convert to Atheism

Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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12/28/2015 2:59:35 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are all sorts of things you don't believe are true or exist, even though you can't "prove" they don't exist.

Now just apply that to the God in question.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
IntellectVsSpirit5000
Posts: 1,266
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12/28/2015 3:15:47 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 2:59:35 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are all sorts of things you don't believe are true or exist, even though you can't "prove" they don't exist.

Now just apply that to the God in question.

Jesus is a part of history according to historians, even Atheist ones. My god actually made an entrance. The other gods never existed, died, or decided to never make an entrance into our planet nor our history. What would Atheism add to my life?
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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12/28/2015 3:26:49 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 3:15:47 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:59:35 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are all sorts of things you don't believe are true or exist, even though you can't "prove" they don't exist.

Now just apply that to the God in question.

Jesus is a part of history according to historians, even Atheist ones. My god actually made an entrance. The other gods never existed, died, or decided to never make an entrance into our planet nor our history. What would Atheism add to my life?

Your not even trying, not even trying and f*cking wasting everyone time.

You know what else historians will tell you ? that aztecs or some Mexican tribe long ago had their civilizations and their Gods.

Oh and you know who else existed, fricking Mohamed.

You know damm well why the mere existence of Muhamed doesn't prove the existence of God.

You know damm well why the existence of aztecs of a mexican civ doesn't prove the existence of God.
.
Don't every bring such weakness again, are you serious ? I mean if this is your standard then I give you the following proof of God,

Pretty birds, pretty sunsets, just look,just look all around you..........GOD !!!!!!!!!!

Don't think okey ? just accept it ? it's so much easier.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
dsjpk5
Posts: 3,007
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12/28/2015 3:38:11 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 3:26:49 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:15:47 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:59:35 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are all sorts of things you don't believe are true or exist, even though you can't "prove" they don't exist.

Now just apply that to the God in question.

Jesus is a part of history according to historians, even Atheist ones. My god actually made an entrance. The other gods never existed, died, or decided to never make an entrance into our planet nor our history. What would Atheism add to my life?

Your not even trying, not even trying and f*cking wasting everyone time.

You know what else historians will tell you ? that aztecs or some Mexican tribe long ago had their civilizations and their Gods.

Oh and you know who else existed, fricking Mohamed.

You know damm well why the mere existence of Muhamed doesn't prove the existence of God.

You know damm well why the existence of aztecs of a mexican civ doesn't prove the existence of God.
.
Don't every bring such weakness again, are you serious ? I mean if this is your standard then I give you the following proof of God,

Pretty birds, pretty sunsets, just look,just look all around you..........GOD !!!!!!!!!!

Don't think okey ? just accept it ? it's so much easier.

That's not an analogous argument. Mohammed never claimed to be God.
If that was the only issue, then vote moderation could be avoided more often, since a vote in which the voter does explain sufficiently how at least one point a debater made swung their vote, would be considered sufficient. -Airmax
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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12/28/2015 3:39:24 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

We make great pot brownies
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
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12/28/2015 3:40:18 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are no benefits to being an atheist that you could not also gain from being a non-observant member of a popular church.

Really, the only sensible reason I can think of for rejecting gods is that you think it's more compassionate and ethical to reject them than entertain them.

However, adopting that position won't by itself make you more compassionate or ethical. So if you're already compassionate and ethical enough to reject religious beliefs that are bad for people, we could have a conversation about the harm that can arise from taking god-beliefs seriously.

But if you're not, I think you're asking the wrong question. My suggestion: stay religious unless your conscience begins to nag you about the integrity and goodness of such commitment.
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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12/28/2015 3:43:35 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 3:38:11 AM, dsjpk5 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:26:49 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:15:47 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:59:35 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are all sorts of things you don't believe are true or exist, even though you can't "prove" they don't exist.

Now just apply that to the God in question.

Jesus is a part of history according to historians, even Atheist ones. My god actually made an entrance. The other gods never existed, died, or decided to never make an entrance into our planet nor our history. What would Atheism add to my life?

Your not even trying, not even trying and f*cking wasting everyone time.

You know what else historians will tell you ? that aztecs or some Mexican tribe long ago had their civilizations and their Gods.

Oh and you know who else existed, fricking Mohamed.

You know damm well why the mere existence of Muhamed doesn't prove the existence of God.

You know damm well why the existence of aztecs of a mexican civ doesn't prove the existence of God.
.
Don't every bring such weakness again, are you serious ? I mean if this is your standard then I give you the following proof of God,

Pretty birds, pretty sunsets, just look,just look all around you..........GOD !!!!!!!!!!

Don't think okey ? just accept it ? it's so much easier.

That's not an analogous argument. Mohammed never claimed to be God.

Jesus claimed (or it is claimed he claimed) he is God therefore God exists..............

Okey I need to pray here for a second........

Dear God, WTF ? no seriously ? there has got to be a limit on people being so blind they can come up with the most weak sh*t to justify their religious propositions.

If your not too busy if you could give said people a crash course in critical thinking skills that would really save us all alot of time here.

Anyway I will let you get back to saving babies from diseases and floods and restoring limbs of amputees...............hahahaha j/k.
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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12/28/2015 3:45:20 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

You can convert... Not really. You could just stop believing in a god, but I don't think it is reasonable to call that conversion.

But... Here is some place to start. Why add a god? I know there is lots of stuff we just don't know, but why just leap to a god?
dsjpk5
Posts: 3,007
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12/28/2015 3:49:50 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 3:40:18 AM, RuvDraba wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are no benefits to being an atheist that you could not also gain from being a non-observant member of a popular church.

Really, the only sensible reason I can think of for rejecting gods is that you think it's more compassionate and ethical to reject them than entertain them.

However, adopting that position won't by itself make you more compassionate or ethical. So if you're already compassionate and ethical enough to reject religious beliefs that are bad for people, we could have a conversation about the harm that can arise from taking god-beliefs seriously.

But if you're not, I think you're asking the wrong question. My suggestion: stay religious unless your conscience begins to nag you about the integrity and goodness of such commitment.

Excellent, thoughtful response.
If that was the only issue, then vote moderation could be avoided more often, since a vote in which the voter does explain sufficiently how at least one point a debater made swung their vote, would be considered sufficient. -Airmax
IntellectVsSpirit5000
Posts: 1,266
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12/28/2015 3:51:35 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 3:45:20 AM, TBR wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

You can convert... Not really. You could just stop believing in a god, but I don't think it is reasonable to call that conversion.

But... Here is some place to start. Why add a god? I know there is lots of stuff we just don't know, but why just leap to a god?

There is a lot of stuff we just don't know. So...I choose grace. I choose hope. I have placed before me life and death. I would have me choose life...not only for me, but for those I love...I choose life even for you. But why? That's what love does.
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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12/28/2015 3:53:58 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 3:51:35 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:45:20 AM, TBR wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

You can convert... Not really. You could just stop believing in a god, but I don't think it is reasonable to call that conversion.

But... Here is some place to start. Why add a god? I know there is lots of stuff we just don't know, but why just leap to a god?

There is a lot of stuff we just don't know. So...I choose grace. I choose hope. I have placed before me life and death. I would have me choose life...not only for me, but for those I love...I choose life even for you. But why? That's what love does.

Well, I know you are not sincere in the question, but I would say - why does that mean you have to embrace delusions? Choosing "love" or "live" really has nothing to do with the existence of a god.
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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12/28/2015 3:55:48 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 3:38:11 AM, dsjpk5 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:26:49 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:15:47 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:59:35 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are all sorts of things you don't believe are true or exist, even though you can't "prove" they don't exist.

Now just apply that to the God in question.

Jesus is a part of history according to historians, even Atheist ones. My god actually made an entrance. The other gods never existed, died, or decided to never make an entrance into our planet nor our history. What would Atheism add to my life?

Your not even trying, not even trying and f*cking wasting everyone time.

You know what else historians will tell you ? that aztecs or some Mexican tribe long ago had their civilizations and their Gods.

Oh and you know who else existed, fricking Mohamed.

You know damm well why the mere existence of Muhamed doesn't prove the existence of God.

You know damm well why the existence of aztecs of a mexican civ doesn't prove the existence of God.
.
Don't every bring such weakness again, are you serious ? I mean if this is your standard then I give you the following proof of God,

Pretty birds, pretty sunsets, just look,just look all around you..........GOD !!!!!!!!!!

Don't think okey ? just accept it ? it's so much easier.

That's not an analogous argument. Mohammed never claimed to be God.

Lots of people have claimed to be God. It's kinda a stupid reason to believe one exists.
IntellectVsSpirit5000
Posts: 1,266
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12/28/2015 4:03:08 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 3:53:58 AM, TBR wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:51:35 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:45:20 AM, TBR wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

You can convert... Not really. You could just stop believing in a god, but I don't think it is reasonable to call that conversion.

But... Here is some place to start. Why add a god? I know there is lots of stuff we just don't know, but why just leap to a god?

There is a lot of stuff we just don't know. So...I choose grace. I choose hope. I have placed before me life and death. I would have me choose life...not only for me, but for those I love...I choose life even for you. But why? That's what love does.

Well, I know you are not sincere in the question, but I would say - why does that mean you have to embrace delusions? Choosing "love" or "live" really has nothing to do with the existence of a god.

I know this is hard for nontheists to accept, but their belief is based off of faith as much as theism. Science has no definitive answer for creation. Both beliefs/lack of beliefs are based off of the hope that theism is true or the hope that theism is false. The first round for both is faith. The second is acceptance. In my opinion, if we go strictly by logic, Theists have chosen the one that is safer and has a reward. Nontheists choose the more dangerous choice, meaning if God does exist, they may be screwed, and recieve no reward. If you can get a lottery ticket or no lottery ticket, logic says take the ticket and at least have hope of victory. Take no ticket and have no chance of victory. A chance is better than no chance. Hope vs. No hope. Better. Reward vs. No reward. Better. Life vs. No life. Better. That's my story. I'm sticking with it.
IntellectVsSpirit5000
Posts: 1,266
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12/28/2015 4:05:39 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 3:55:48 AM, Wylted wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:38:11 AM, dsjpk5 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:26:49 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:15:47 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:59:35 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are all sorts of things you don't believe are true or exist, even though you can't "prove" they don't exist.

Now just apply that to the God in question.

Jesus is a part of history according to historians, even Atheist ones. My god actually made an entrance. The other gods never existed, died, or decided to never make an entrance into our planet nor our history. What would Atheism add to my life?

Your not even trying, not even trying and f*cking wasting everyone time.

You know what else historians will tell you ? that aztecs or some Mexican tribe long ago had their civilizations and their Gods.

Oh and you know who else existed, fricking Mohamed.

You know damm well why the mere existence of Muhamed doesn't prove the existence of God.

You know damm well why the existence of aztecs of a mexican civ doesn't prove the existence of God.
.
Don't every bring such weakness again, are you serious ? I mean if this is your standard then I give you the following proof of God,

Pretty birds, pretty sunsets, just look,just look all around you..........GOD !!!!!!!!!!

Don't think okey ? just accept it ? it's so much easier.

That's not an analogous argument. Mohammed never claimed to be God.

Lots of people have claimed to be God. It's kinda a stupid reason to believe one exists.

No one claimed to have seen these others raise the dead and even raised themselves from death. Jesus is claimed to have done both.
Wylted
Posts: 21,167
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12/28/2015 4:07:31 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 4:05:39 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:55:48 AM, Wylted wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:38:11 AM, dsjpk5 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:26:49 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:15:47 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:59:35 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are all sorts of things you don't believe are true or exist, even though you can't "prove" they don't exist.

Now just apply that to the God in question.

Jesus is a part of history according to historians, even Atheist ones. My god actually made an entrance. The other gods never existed, died, or decided to never make an entrance into our planet nor our history. What would Atheism add to my life?

Your not even trying, not even trying and f*cking wasting everyone time.

You know what else historians will tell you ? that aztecs or some Mexican tribe long ago had their civilizations and their Gods.

Oh and you know who else existed, fricking Mohamed.

You know damm well why the mere existence of Muhamed doesn't prove the existence of God.

You know damm well why the existence of aztecs of a mexican civ doesn't prove the existence of God.
.
Don't every bring such weakness again, are you serious ? I mean if this is your standard then I give you the following proof of God,

Pretty birds, pretty sunsets, just look,just look all around you..........GOD !!!!!!!!!!

Don't think okey ? just accept it ? it's so much easier.

That's not an analogous argument. Mohammed never claimed to be God.

Lots of people have claimed to be God. It's kinda a stupid reason to believe one exists.

No one claimed to have seen these others raise the dead and even raised themselves from death. Jesus is claimed to have done both.

I've seen people claim all types of odd things. Alien abductions, there was a mass sighting of a mermaid in South America not too long ago. I've heard of modern day dinosaur sightings.
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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12/28/2015 4:14:00 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 4:03:08 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:53:58 AM, TBR wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:51:35 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:45:20 AM, TBR wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

You can convert... Not really. You could just stop believing in a god, but I don't think it is reasonable to call that conversion.

But... Here is some place to start. Why add a god? I know there is lots of stuff we just don't know, but why just leap to a god?

There is a lot of stuff we just don't know. So...I choose grace. I choose hope. I have placed before me life and death. I would have me choose life...not only for me, but for those I love...I choose life even for you. But why? That's what love does.

Well, I know you are not sincere in the question, but I would say - why does that mean you have to embrace delusions? Choosing "love" or "live" really has nothing to do with the existence of a god.

I know this is hard for nontheists to accept, but their belief is based off of faith as much as theism. Science has no definitive answer for creation.
One, you seem to substitute science for religion. That is common for the faithful. That is not how atheists usually think about any question, but I will play along a little for your sake.

Creation... Well, where there is lack of information, I have no problem accepting that we simply lack the information. Further, if some new information came along to challenge any existing theory, I would have no issue accepting the better information. Its not faith, it is nothing like faith.

Both beliefs/lack of beliefs are based off of the hope that theism is true or the hope that theism is false. The first round for both is faith. The second is acceptance. In my opinion, if we go strictly by logic, Theists have chosen the one that is safer and has a reward. Nontheists choose the more dangerous choice, meaning if God does exist, they may be screwed, and recieve no reward. If you can get a lottery ticket or no lottery ticket, logic says take the ticket and at least have hope of victory. Take no ticket and have no chance of victory. A chance is better than no chance. Hope vs. No hope. Better. Reward vs. No reward. Better. Life vs. No life. Better. That's my story. I'm sticking with it.

You can't have faith out of fear that "there is a god, and he is going to be pissed!". This is Pascal's wager, and honestly, it is just stupid to most atheists. I am not inclined to add god, just in case.
dsjpk5
Posts: 3,007
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12/28/2015 4:18:50 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 12/28/2015 3:55:48 AM, Wylted wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:38:11 AM, dsjpk5 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:26:49 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 3:15:47 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:59:35 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
At 12/28/2015 2:51:38 AM, IntellectVsSpirit5000 wrote:
Okay. Go ahead.

There are all sorts of things you don't believe are true or exist, even though you can't "prove" they don't exist.

Now just apply that to the God in question.

Jesus is a part of history according to historians, even Atheist ones. My god actually made an entrance. The other gods never existed, died, or decided to never make an entrance into our planet nor our history. What would Atheism add to my life?

Your not even trying, not even trying and f*cking wasting everyone time.

You know what else historians will tell you ? that aztecs or some Mexican tribe long ago had their civilizations and their Gods.

Oh and you know who else existed, fricking Mohamed.

You know damm well why the mere existence of Muhamed doesn't prove the existence of God.

You know damm well why the existence of aztecs of a mexican civ doesn't prove the existence of God.
.
Don't every bring such weakness again, are you serious ? I mean if this is your standard then I give you the following proof of God,

Pretty birds, pretty sunsets, just look,just look all around you..........GOD !!!!!!!!!!

Don't think okey ? just accept it ? it's so much easier.

That's not an analogous argument. Mohammed never claimed to be God.

Lots of people have claimed to be God. It's kinda a stupid reason to believe one exists.

Not my point.
If that was the only issue, then vote moderation could be avoided more often, since a vote in which the voter does explain sufficiently how at least one point a debater made swung their vote, would be considered sufficient. -Airmax