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Playing solitaire is a sin

Jovian
Posts: 1,720
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1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM
Posted: 11 months ago
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.
12_13
Posts: 1,365
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1/4/2016 6:41:41 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

I have understood that sin is to reject God. If person rejects God, because of solitaire, solitaire is sin. If not, then it is not sin.
Jovian
Posts: 1,720
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1/4/2016 6:48:05 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 6:41:41 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

I have understood that sin is to reject God. If person rejects God, because of solitaire, solitaire is sin. If not, then it is not sin.

This argument would although condone religious terrorists.
Geogeer
Posts: 4,286
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1/4/2016 8:03:21 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

It isn't self gratification, but rather a misuse of the sexual faculties that makes masturbation a sin. Thus your entire argument falls apart.
Jovian
Posts: 1,720
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1/4/2016 8:21:19 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 8:03:21 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

It isn't self gratification, but rather a misuse of the sexual faculties that makes masturbation a sin. Thus your entire argument falls apart.

This so called misuse is a deep misunderstanding since the old Israelities believed the volume of sperm was easily depleted.

You could just as well apply anti-masturbation logics on all recreational things: Why do you play solitaire or any digital one player game? Do you really want your wife to have a husband who sits all day doing nothing but playing games, without your wife involved? Games of all kinds are addictive.
Geogeer
Posts: 4,286
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1/4/2016 8:31:34 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 8:21:19 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:03:21 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

It isn't self gratification, but rather a misuse of the sexual faculties that makes masturbation a sin. Thus your entire argument falls apart.

This so called misuse is a deep misunderstanding since the old Israelities believed the volume of sperm was easily depleted.

So what you are saying is that you agree with me that it is about even the ancient Israelites understanding that it was a misuse of the sexual faculties (even if they were mistaken as to why according to your assertion). Thus you have conceded the agreement.

You could just as well apply anti-masturbation logics on all recreational things: Why do you play solitaire or any digital one player game? Do you really want your wife to have a husband who sits all day doing nothing but playing games, without your wife involved? Games of all kinds are addictive.

Any solo interests that I do pursue are because my wife likes to go to bed earlier than me. As such I am not depriving her of anything by using this time to pursue my own interests.
Jovian
Posts: 1,720
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1/4/2016 8:36:12 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 8:31:34 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:21:19 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:03:21 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

It isn't self gratification, but rather a misuse of the sexual faculties that makes masturbation a sin. Thus your entire argument falls apart.

This so called misuse is a deep misunderstanding since the old Israelities believed the volume of sperm was easily depleted.

So what you are saying is that you agree with me that it is about even the ancient Israelites understanding that it was a misuse of the sexual faculties (even if they were mistaken as to why according to your assertion). Thus you have conceded the agreement.

I don't think I agreed with you anyhow, I said your beliefs were mistaken.

You could just as well apply anti-masturbation logics on all recreational things: Why do you play solitaire or any digital one player game? Do you really want your wife to have a husband who sits all day doing nothing but playing games, without your wife involved? Games of all kinds are addictive.

Any solo interests that I do pursue are because my wife likes to go to bed earlier than me. As such I am not depriving her of anything by using this time to pursue my own interests.

Most anti-masturbation logics I've heard have been of the fear that masturbation makes you narcissistic and never ever please your partner afterwards. There have been many cases where someone in a relationship finds an entertaining game and afterwards become addicted to it, whereas the non-gameplayer becomes tired of this and break up.

The real story is that both of these things could be perfectly done in moderation. So either see all kinds of solo interests as sinful or nothing.
DPMartin
Posts: 1,096
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1/4/2016 8:36:35 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

If you are in agreement with those, who agree that solitary gratification is not to be done. Then if one gratifies one"s self according to or in the spirit of what is agreed to as solitary gratification then one has sinned against those in whom he has come into agreement with.

In the case of sin against God or man now in sin, it was an agreement between God and Adam that Adam agreed to by default by staying voluntarily in the Garden that when Adam decided to listen to the voice of the woman, he blew it, by not listening to what God told him.

Females may scream all they want on that statement, but the truth is, the agreement was between Adam and God.
jodybirdy
Posts: 2,089
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1/4/2016 8:41:10 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 6:41:41 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

I have understood that sin is to reject God. If person rejects God, because of solitaire, solitaire is sin. If not, then it is not sin.

So self gratification is rejecting God? If my husband were to prefer sex with himself over me, I'd feel rejected. I have lust for my husband. I married him because I want to have sex with him along with liking many other great attributes he has. So, does God have a jealous lust for human flesh? Does he feel rejected if we have sex with ourselves or someone other than him? That's just ridiculous. Why do people apply human attributes to God?
A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral."
Jovian
Posts: 1,720
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1/4/2016 8:41:11 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 8:36:35 PM, DPMartin wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

If you are in agreement with those, who agree that solitary gratification is not to be done. Then if one gratifies one"s self according to or in the spirit of what is agreed to as solitary gratification then one has sinned against those in whom he has come into agreement with.

In the case of sin against God or man now in sin, it was an agreement between God and Adam that Adam agreed to by default by staying voluntarily in the Garden that when Adam decided to listen to the voice of the woman, he blew it, by not listening to what God told him.

Females may scream all they want on that statement, but the truth is, the agreement was between Adam and God.

I can't really see any point that is to be intertwined into this topic? Could you explain?
Jovian
Posts: 1,720
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1/4/2016 8:45:46 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 8:41:10 PM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 1/4/2016 6:41:41 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

I have understood that sin is to reject God. If person rejects God, because of solitaire, solitaire is sin. If not, then it is not sin.

So self gratification is rejecting God? If my husband were to prefer sex with himself over me, I'd feel rejected. I have lust for my husband.

This is the reason why masturbation became sinful in the first place. This + that they believed in older times that men could deplete their sperm, thus wanting them to not waste their sperm.

I married him because I want to have sex with him along with liking many other great attributes he has. So, does God have a jealous lust for human flesh? Does he feel rejected if we have sex with ourselves or someone other than him? That's just ridiculous. Why do people apply human attributes to God?

The old Israelites did. Because of this:

Intellectuals: People! Doeth listen to me! We have seen how masturbation is problematic in relationship. So don't masturbate ever!
People: Ok. We don't care, what will you do?
Intellectuals: Ehm....there is a....ehm....man in the clouds who will....burn you forever if you do. And yeah, he told this to me.
People: Oh no! Alright alright! I will refrain from it further on.
Geogeer
Posts: 4,286
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1/4/2016 8:49:39 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 8:36:12 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:31:34 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:21:19 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:03:21 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

It isn't self gratification, but rather a misuse of the sexual faculties that makes masturbation a sin. Thus your entire argument falls apart.

This so called misuse is a deep misunderstanding since the old Israelities believed the volume of sperm was easily depleted.

So what you are saying is that you agree with me that it is about even the ancient Israelites understanding that it was a misuse of the sexual faculties (even if they were mistaken as to why according to your assertion). Thus you have conceded the agreement.

I don't think I agreed with you anyhow, I said your beliefs were mistaken.

Then you don't understand why it is considered sinful. All of the other things that you mention are mere possible side effects of something that is intrinsically wrong. It is sinful because it is a misuse of the sexual faculties given by God.

The fact that there are regular side effects is further evidence of its wrongness.

You could just as well apply anti-masturbation logics on all recreational things: Why do you play solitaire or any digital one player game? Do you really want your wife to have a husband who sits all day doing nothing but playing games, without your wife involved? Games of all kinds are addictive.

Most anti-masturbation logics I've heard have been of the fear that masturbation makes you narcissistic and never ever please your partner afterwards.

Odd, I've never heard those as arguments.

There have been many cases where someone in a relationship finds an entertaining game and afterwards become addicted to it, whereas the non-gameplayer becomes tired of this and break up.

So little boys have to learn to put their toys away. Your point?

The real story is that both of these things could be perfectly done in moderation. So either see all kinds of solo interests as sinful or nothing.

There is nothing fundamentally wrong with a bit of entertainment playing games. In the same way as there is nothing wrong with eating. There is something wrong with masturbation.
Jovian
Posts: 1,720
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1/4/2016 8:54:28 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 8:49:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:36:12 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:31:34 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:21:19 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:03:21 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

It isn't self gratification, but rather a misuse of the sexual faculties that makes masturbation a sin. Thus your entire argument falls apart.

This so called misuse is a deep misunderstanding since the old Israelities believed the volume of sperm was easily depleted.

So what you are saying is that you agree with me that it is about even the ancient Israelites understanding that it was a misuse of the sexual faculties (even if they were mistaken as to why according to your assertion). Thus you have conceded the agreement.

I don't think I agreed with you anyhow, I said your beliefs were mistaken.

Then you don't understand why it is considered sinful. All of the other things that you mention are mere possible side effects of something that is intrinsically wrong. It is sinful because it is a misuse of the sexual faculties given by God.

This is a little begging the question, to me. "God doesn't like it because God doesn't like it". But that's a thing many religious people do anyway.

The fact that there are regular side effects is further evidence of its wrongness.

Like decreased stress or lesser risk for prostate cancer in men?

http://www.menshealth.com...

Or just the simple fact that it's a way for people too nervous to get a sex partner to have a release?

You could just as well apply anti-masturbation logics on all recreational things: Why do you play solitaire or any digital one player game? Do you really want your wife to have a husband who sits all day doing nothing but playing games, without your wife involved? Games of all kinds are addictive.

Most anti-masturbation logics I've heard have been of the fear that masturbation makes you narcissistic and never ever please your partner afterwards.

Odd, I've never heard those as arguments.

Your arguments were not better though.

There have been many cases where someone in a relationship finds an entertaining game and afterwards become addicted to it, whereas the non-gameplayer becomes tired of this and break up.

So little boys have to learn to put their toys away. Your point?

As I've said, learn to do things in moderation.

The real story is that both of these things could be perfectly done in moderation. So either see all kinds of solo interests as sinful or nothing.

There is nothing fundamentally wrong with a bit of entertainment playing games. In the same way as there is nothing wrong with eating. There is something wrong with masturbation.

Because a book written millennias ago weren't as educated in it as we are.
jodybirdy
Posts: 2,089
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1/4/2016 9:23:42 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 8:45:46 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:41:10 PM, jodybirdy wrote:
At 1/4/2016 6:41:41 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

I have understood that sin is to reject God. If person rejects God, because of solitaire, solitaire is sin. If not, then it is not sin.

So self gratification is rejecting God? If my husband were to prefer sex with himself over me, I'd feel rejected. I have lust for my husband.

This is the reason why masturbation became sinful in the first place. This + that they believed in older times that men could deplete their sperm, thus wanting them to not waste their sperm.

I married him because I want to have sex with him along with liking many other great attributes he has. So, does God have a jealous lust for human flesh? Does he feel rejected if we have sex with ourselves or someone other than him? That's just ridiculous. Why do people apply human attributes to God?

The old Israelites did. Because of this:

Intellectuals: People! Doeth listen to me! We have seen how masturbation is problematic in relationship. So don't masturbate ever!
People: Ok. We don't care, what will you do?
Intellectuals: Ehm....there is a....ehm....man in the clouds who will....burn you forever if you do. And yeah, he told this to me.
People: Oh no! Alright alright! I will refrain from it further on.

Haha! I couldn't have said it better.
A rock pile ceases to be a rock pile the moment a single man contemplates it, bearing within him the image of a cathedral."
Geogeer
Posts: 4,286
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1/4/2016 9:29:08 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 8:54:28 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:49:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:36:12 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:31:34 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:21:19 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:03:21 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

It isn't self gratification, but rather a misuse of the sexual faculties that makes masturbation a sin. Thus your entire argument falls apart.

This so called misuse is a deep misunderstanding since the old Israelities believed the volume of sperm was easily depleted.

So what you are saying is that you agree with me that it is about even the ancient Israelites understanding that it was a misuse of the sexual faculties (even if they were mistaken as to why according to your assertion). Thus you have conceded the agreement.

I don't think I agreed with you anyhow, I said your beliefs were mistaken.

Then you don't understand why it is considered sinful. All of the other things that you mention are mere possible side effects of something that is intrinsically wrong. It is sinful because it is a misuse of the sexual faculties given by God.

This is a little begging the question, to me. "God doesn't like it because God doesn't like it". But that's a thing many religious people do anyway.

Well you did begin this with word sin.

Sin: an immoral act considered to be a transgression against divine law.

So yeah. This is all about divine law.

The fact that there are regular side effects is further evidence of its wrongness.

Like decreased stress

So instead of learning to deal with stress with positive traits, you essentially train yourself to need an endorphin release to cope with the difficulties of the world. Way to be a man.

or lesser risk for prostate cancer in men?

Oddly enough regular masturbation actually increases the chances of prostrate cancer in young men.

http://www.webmd.com...

It only has a beneficial effect in older men (over 60). However, it isn't specifically masturbation that improves the odds against prostrate cancer, but rather ejaculation. Oddly enough sex results in ejaculation. And the most reliable way to ensure regular sex is marriage. Marriage requires meeting getting out and meeting ladies. Something one is far less likely to do sitting around and masturbating.

http://www.menshealth.com...

Or just the simple fact that it's a way for people too nervous to get a sex partner to have a release?

Or it just continues their insecurities and prevents them from getting out and meeting someone.

Odd, I've never heard those as arguments.

Your arguments were not better though.

You've framed it in terms of sin, not me.

There have been many cases where someone in a relationship finds an entertaining game and afterwards become addicted to it, whereas the non-gameplayer becomes tired of this and break up.

So little boys have to learn to put their toys away. Your point?

As I've said, learn to do things in moderation.

So self cutting in moderation is okay, or a sign of something wrong?

The real story is that both of these things could be perfectly done in moderation. So either see all kinds of solo interests as sinful or nothing.

There is nothing fundamentally wrong with a bit of entertainment playing games. In the same way as there is nothing wrong with eating. There is something wrong with masturbation.

Because a book written millennias ago weren't as educated in it as we are.

Lol. Falling back to the we know so much more now. Yet when people obeyed these "stone age" laws we had more families without divorce and children growing up in intact families.
Jovian
Posts: 1,720
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1/4/2016 9:48:05 PM
Posted: 11 months ago
At 1/4/2016 9:29:08 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:54:28 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:49:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:36:12 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:31:34 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:21:19 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 1/4/2016 8:03:21 PM, Geogeer wrote:
At 1/4/2016 2:22:38 AM, Jovian wrote:
I've read many people with "moral" speak out about self-gratification. For example concerning masturbation. That it should be done with a partner, not to please yourself.

Solitaire (Patience in UK English) is a card game = recreation. It is a one player card game. Self gratification right there. People play it to pleasure themselves. How evil isn't that? I've just uninstalled Solitaire from my computer FYI. Card games should be done with at least someone else. Just like all hobbies. Recreational time with only yourself featured, forget about that.

It isn't self gratification, but rather a misuse of the sexual faculties that makes masturbation a sin. Thus your entire argument falls apart.

This so called misuse is a deep misunderstanding since the old Israelities believed the volume of sperm was easily depleted.

So what you are saying is that you agree with me that it is about even the ancient Israelites understanding that it was a misuse of the sexual faculties (even if they were mistaken as to why according to your assertion). Thus you have conceded the agreement.

I don't think I agreed with you anyhow, I said your beliefs were mistaken.

Then you don't understand why it is considered sinful. All of the other things that you mention are mere possible side effects of something that is intrinsically wrong. It is sinful because it is a misuse of the sexual faculties given by God.

This is a little begging the question, to me. "God doesn't like it because God doesn't like it". But that's a thing many religious people do anyway.

Well you did begin this with word sin.

Sin: an immoral act considered to be a transgression against divine law.

So yeah. This is all about divine law.

The fact that there are regular side effects is further evidence of its wrongness.

Like decreased stress

So instead of learning to deal with stress with positive traits, you essentially train yourself to need an endorphin release to cope with the difficulties of the world. Way to be a man.

If so, then you should just refrain from exercising aswell. I mean, that's endorphin release aswell. Instead of learning to cope with stress like a troo maayn, you go out and run it off. Talking about running away from your problems.

Both masturbation/exercising and mental hardening could be done of course.

or lesser risk for prostate cancer in men?

Oddly enough regular masturbation actually increases the chances of prostrate cancer in young men.

http://www.webmd.com...

If it was true, then any kind of sex would increase this risk too. I mean, why is a hand pushing the genital to orgasm more dangerous than a vagina doing it? Conclusion: We're all doomed.

It only has a beneficial effect in older men (over 60).

So these people get a carte blanche from you?

However, it isn't specifically masturbation that improves the odds against prostrate cancer, but rather ejaculation. Oddly enough sex results in ejaculation. And the most reliable way to ensure regular sex is marriage.

Wait, did you just imply that only married people have sex?

Marriage requires meeting getting out and meeting ladies. Something one is far less likely to do sitting around and masturbating.

How many men do you really know except yourself? Seems like it's a maximum of 3. What if I told you that you could do BOTH of these?

Basically, you want people to stop masturbating in order to fulfill your dream of that people should go and marry each other. Good news, people do what they want today. Maybe this is something alien in your Bible Belt village though.

http://www.menshealth.com...

Or just the simple fact that it's a way for people too nervous to get a sex partner to have a release?

Or it just continues their insecurities and prevents them from getting out and meeting someone.

What if someone is conceived as really ugly and no one wants to have sex with him/her?

Odd, I've never heard those as arguments.

Your arguments were not better though.

You've framed it in terms of sin, not me.

There have been many cases where someone in a relationship finds an entertaining game and afterwards become addicted to it, whereas the non-gameplayer becomes tired of this and break up.

So little boys have to learn to put their toys away. Your point?

As I've said, learn to do things in moderation.

So self cutting in moderation is okay, or a sign of something wrong?

Regarding masturbation on the same level as self cutting...

Well, both give endorphines, but masturbation could impossibly be hurting the genitals. How would that be?

The real story is that both of these things could be perfectly done in moderation. So either see all kinds of solo interests as sinful or nothing.

There is nothing fundamentally wrong with a bit of entertainment playing games. In the same way as there is nothing wrong with eating. There is something wrong with masturbation.

Because a book written millennias ago weren't as educated in it as we are.

Lol. Falling back to the we know so much more now. Yet when people obeyed these "stone age" laws we had more families without divorce and children growing up in intact families.

Listen to me now. The only reason people divorce more today is that it is more socially acceptable to do it now than before. If you did a divorce in the 1800s, you would face the risks of becoming shunned. At least in rural areas, where the highest power were held by...the church. Isn't it even in the Bible that a widow should remain sexually untouched if her husband has died/divorced her?

Do a divorce today though and people will say:

"Well if you tried and tried without coming any further in your marriage, maybe this was the best. Despite that you've had a nice past together, if you don't have a good future upcoming, you shouldn't go for it."