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Logic's Jurisdiction

Sophisto
Posts: 121
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1/27/2016 5:43:16 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
Is it omnipresent? Can logic go where fallacies roam free? No. Also, stupidity and craziness have a more potent range. So why do atheists worship its "sovereignty"? Logic isn't perfect and if it is, then they are essentially deifying it, which is eternally amusing. Logic can't even kill faith.

Faith, stupidity, craziness and fallacies. These four gospels are what keep atheists at bay while a clever arbiter of existence uses metaphysical stealth to operate in plain sight. Too bad empiricism has its limits as well. Science's ambition does not match its abilities.

Are atheists willing to prevent faith, but not able?
Then they are impotent.
Are they able, but not willing?
Then they are malevolent.
Are they both able and willing?
Then whence cometh faith?
Are they neither able or willing?
Then why call them logical?
DPMartin
Posts: 1,096
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1/27/2016 6:46:05 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 5:43:16 PM, Sophisto wrote:
Is it omnipresent? Can logic go where fallacies roam free? No. Also, stupidity and craziness have a more potent range. So why do atheists worship its "sovereignty"? Logic isn't perfect and if it is, then they are essentially deifying it, which is eternally amusing. Logic can't even kill faith.

Faith, stupidity, craziness and fallacies. These four gospels are what keep atheists at bay while a clever arbiter of existence uses metaphysical stealth to operate in plain sight. Too bad empiricism has its limits as well. Science's ambition does not match its abilities.

Are atheists willing to prevent faith, but not able?
Then they are impotent.
Are they able, but not willing?
Then they are malevolent.
Are they both able and willing?
Then whence cometh faith?
Are they neither able or willing?
Then why call them logical?

Logic is like a computer, and the user thereof. It"s a garbage in garbage out system, a system of belief for them that is their sovereign seeking to make it the sovereign of others. Like Muslims do with Islam. Or the Catholic Church did when it was the Church of the state, meaning Rome.

In other words, they would be happy with whatever a computer computes, because they are in control of it, and can manipulate whatever goes in, until they get the answers they want out of it. Hence logic is their god.

You are correct about faith, and yes nothing can overcome the Faithful, because that is what God is looking for in the sons of men, the Faithful.
bulproof
Posts: 25,218
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1/28/2016 2:04:55 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
Atheism = The rejection of man's unsubstantiated claim that gods exist.

Why are the deluded so slow on the uptake?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Sophisto
Posts: 121
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1/28/2016 2:13:12 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
Since atheism has developed its own stereotypes and counterculture, it is not simply a denial. It has a personality as well. Prove me wrong...wait. That's right. You are too lazy to be thorough and utilize that intellectual might to swat gadflies into nonexistence.
bulproof
Posts: 25,218
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1/28/2016 2:48:58 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/28/2016 2:13:12 AM, Sophisto wrote:
Since atheism has developed its own stereotypes and counterculture, it is not simply a denial. It has a personality as well. Prove me wrong...wait. That's right. You are too lazy to be thorough and utilize that intellectual might to swat gadflies into nonexistence.

Atheism = The rejection of man's unsubstantiated claim that gods exist.

Why are the deluded so slow on the uptake?
I mean really slow.
Your strawman is not atheism, please try to use what few neurons you possess.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Sophisto
Posts: 121
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1/28/2016 2:53:56 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
You are not the arbiter of what atheism is and how it defines itself. Since it lacks sentience, good luck on that front. Consistently avoiding my assertions without addressing them only speaks to your condescending insecurity as to how to even approach my ideas. They still stand thanks to your godlike inaction.
bulproof
Posts: 25,218
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1/28/2016 3:12:12 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/28/2016 2:53:56 AM, Sophisto wrote:
You are not the arbiter of what atheism is and how it defines itself. Since it lacks sentience, good luck on that front. Consistently avoiding my assertions without addressing them only speaks to your condescending insecurity as to how to even approach my ideas. They still stand thanks to your godlike inaction.
Your assertions have been refuted by simply informing of what atheism is, it ain't your strawman.
Run away you have no argument.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Sophisto
Posts: 121
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1/28/2016 3:16:17 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
Atheistic stereotypes: arrogance.
Atheistic personality: arrogant.
Atheist counterculture: arrogant.

Run away from my own thread? Get real.
You're only calling it a strawman because you see it as a threat.
You're a self-professed troll with no debates. Know your enemy.
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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1/28/2016 3:17:29 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 5:43:16 PM, Sophisto wrote:
Is it omnipresent? Can logic go where fallacies roam free? No. Also, stupidity and craziness have a more potent range. So why do atheists worship its "sovereignty"? Logic isn't perfect and if it is, then they are essentially deifying it, which is eternally amusing. Logic can't even kill faith.

Please provide your understanding of what the word "logic" means.
Sophisto
Posts: 121
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1/28/2016 3:24:22 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
(Insert universally recognized definition here.)

I challenge logic's capabilities and you challenge my legitimacy? How dare you. Logic is a system of reasoning, a syllogism being the epitome of basic logical exemplification. Without a sound and valid minor and major premise, good luck with the conclusion.

Did I bunt the baseball too close to you?

Mind if I steal home base?
AWSM0055
Posts: 751
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1/28/2016 4:41:13 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 5:43:16 PM, Sophisto wrote:
Is it omnipresent? Can logic go where fallacies roam free? No. Also, stupidity and craziness have a more potent range. So why do atheists worship its "sovereignty"? Logic isn't perfect and if it is, then they are essentially deifying it, which is eternally amusing. Logic can't even kill faith.

Stupidity and craziness have potent range? What does that mean? Are you saying that stupidity and craziness are more effective at convincing people than logic is?

Also, logic is contained within ones mind, or brain. Fallacies are simply bad logic. Atheists don't worship anything, especially not logic. Logic is simply used to review and examine claims or support one's own claims. To say that atheists then worship it is nonsensical and non-sequitur.

Furthermore, logic is only as good as ones understanding of the world, and since humans have a very good grasp on how the world works (nudge nudge, science), human logic can get us very far to finding reasonable answers to certain claims and questions. Not completely obviously, but it's good nonetheless.

And yes, logic can and has killed faith, because logic is better then faith. Believing in something via faith is baseless, whereas believing is something via logic is based on observation and reason.

Faith, stupidity, craziness and fallacies. These four gospels are what keep atheists at bay while a clever arbiter of existence uses metaphysical stealth to operate in plain sight. Too bad empiricism has its limits as well. Science's ambition does not match its abilities.

None of what you just said makes any sense. A clever arbiter of existence uses metaphysical stealth in plain sight? Absolutely meaningless when you actually translate it:

A smart authority of reality using abstract concepts stealth in plain sight?

See what I mean! What smart authority? Who's an authority or arbiter of existence? What abstract concepts/metaphysical concepts? How can an abstract concept be in plain sight?

But yes, science and logic does have it's limits (for instance, logic would dictate that the outer part of galaxies should be moving slower than the inner parts. In reality, we see a constant speed across the galaxy, which we now attribute to an invisible dark matter, which is seemingly unintuitive or illogical.)

Are atheists willing to prevent faith, but not able?
Then they are impotent.

Ok, so? All humans are impotent at a certain point, so I don't know what your point is.

Are they able, but not willing?
Then they are malevolent.

We're not able, so this doesn't apply. Besides, I don't see how allowing somebody to be delusional is exactly malevolent. Unhelpful, maybe, but I doubt it's malevolent.

Are they both able and willing?
Then whence cometh faith?

N/A. Atheists aren't all-powerful.

Are they neither able or willing?
Then why call them logical?

N/A. Atheists (generally) are willing. Able? Not really. No atheist is able to completely eliminate faith.
"Evolution proves necessity is the mother of invention" - David Henson

"Calling my atheism a religion, is like calling my non-stamp-collecting a hobby" - MagicAintReal 2016

___________________________________________________________________________________________

Matt8800: "When warring men kidnap damsels of the enemy, what do they do?"

Jerry947: "They give them the option of marriage."

Matt8800: "Correct! You won idiot of the year award!"

http://explosm.net...
AWSM0055
Posts: 751
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1/28/2016 4:56:07 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/27/2016 6:46:05 PM, DPMartin wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:43:16 PM, Sophisto wrote:
Is it omnipresent? Can logic go where fallacies roam free? No. Also, stupidity and craziness have a more potent range. So why do atheists worship its "sovereignty"? Logic isn't perfect and if it is, then they are essentially deifying it, which is eternally amusing. Logic can't even kill faith.

Faith, stupidity, craziness and fallacies. These four gospels are what keep atheists at bay while a clever arbiter of existence uses metaphysical stealth to operate in plain sight. Too bad empiricism has its limits as well. Science's ambition does not match its abilities.

Are atheists willing to prevent faith, but not able?
Then they are impotent.
Are they able, but not willing?
Then they are malevolent.
Are they both able and willing?
Then whence cometh faith?
Are they neither able or willing?
Then why call them logical?

Logic is like a computer, and the user thereof. It"s a garbage in garbage out system, a system of belief for them that is their sovereign seeking to make it the sovereign of others. Like Muslims do with Islam. Or the Catholic Church did when it was the Church of the state, meaning Rome.

Not necessarily. If you have a good understanding of nature and reason, any claims regarding nature can be assessed using your understanding. It's certainly not a perfect system, but it's better than, say, "faith". It isn't a "garbage in, garbage out" system as you say however,

In other words, they would be happy with whatever a computer computes, because they are in control of it, and can manipulate whatever goes in, until they get the answers they want out of it. Hence logic is their god.

No, a computer computes logically. Hyper logically in fact, without emotions or fallacies. That's why many people like them for logical understanding. Not simply because we can control them. Any person that has even dabbled in computer programming knows this.

And your conclusion that "hence logic is their God" is non sequitur and nonsensical because logic isnt a being.

You are correct about faith, and yes nothing can overcome the Faithful, because that is what God is looking for in the sons of men, the Faithful.

Of course, because faith is stupid and "God" (cough cough religion) likes stupid people. Without stupid illogical people, religion (and the money thereafter) could not thrive. How do I know this?

Faith is firmly believing in something regardless of evidence or lack thereof.
Faith is illogical by definition because faith is the belief in something without evidence or reason. Logic is using reason and evidence to believe in something.

Faith is illogical. People who rely on faith for their beliefs are therefore also illogical and hence, stupid.

I used logic to prove your illogical. Come at me bruh!
"Evolution proves necessity is the mother of invention" - David Henson

"Calling my atheism a religion, is like calling my non-stamp-collecting a hobby" - MagicAintReal 2016

___________________________________________________________________________________________

Matt8800: "When warring men kidnap damsels of the enemy, what do they do?"

Jerry947: "They give them the option of marriage."

Matt8800: "Correct! You won idiot of the year award!"

http://explosm.net...
Sophisto
Posts: 121
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1/28/2016 10:59:07 PM
Posted: 10 months ago
I do not mind being illogical, hence my name.
It is the hysteria that should ensue when I overcome such deliberate handicaps.

Worship is more than bowing down and singing praise, although atheists do that anyway when they preach it to the hopelessly faithful. Worship can be anything being held in extremely high esteem with strict adherence to its nature.

Logical people are a minority. How do you count truly logical people? Consistency? Proficiency? Since religion dominates the human population, it is difficult to determine just how well we understand the world even with the rapid maturity of science, which is not intrinsically within logic's nature. Despite that, their compatibility renders any competitive doubt between the two irrelevant.

Believing is unnecessary when you have empirical evidence. Belief is a metaphysical utility. Casually using belief as a term for logical scrutiny is apples and oranges. The common ground is the claims both make. People need to learn to compartmentalize words that belong to certain worlds and styles of thought. Jargon. Don't mismatch it because you think it is synonymous.

You shouldn't try to translate my words literally if they are symbolically insinuating or metaphysically based. Abstract concepts use humility to be stealthily underestimated. Bad ideas can be useful just as good ideas can sound questionable.
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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1/29/2016 2:18:14 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/28/2016 3:24:22 AM, Sophisto wrote:
At 1/28/2016 3:17:29 AM, Double_R wrote:
At 1/27/2016 5:43:16 PM, Sophisto wrote:
Is it omnipresent? Can logic go where fallacies roam free? No. Also, stupidity and craziness have a more potent range. So why do atheists worship its "sovereignty"? Logic isn't perfect and if it is, then they are essentially deifying it, which is eternally amusing. Logic can't even kill faith.

Please provide your understanding of what the word "logic" means.

(Insert universally recognized definition here.)

I challenge logic's capabilities and you challenge my legitimacy? How dare you. Logic is a system of reasoning, a syllogism being the epitome of basic logical exemplification. Without a sound and valid minor and major premise, good luck with the conclusion.

Great. Now please explain how your definition fits into any of the assertions below to form a coherent point...

"why do atheists worship its "sovereignty"?"
"Logic isn't perfect"
"Logic can't even kill faith"
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
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1/29/2016 6:14:38 AM
Posted: 10 months ago
At 1/28/2016 2:13:12 AM, Sophisto wrote:
Since atheism has developed its own stereotypes and counterculture, it is not simply a denial. It has a personality as well.
Atheism doesn't, but there are subcultures that are atheistic.

For example, there used to be (still are, though much reduced) Marxist socialist subcultures that are atheistic. There are also humanist subcultures that are nontheistic (i.e. atheist or agnostic), and Buddhist cultures and subcultures that are atheistic. And there are overlaps...

Whether they're subcultures or countercultures is debatable and may depend on where you live. Certain parts of Europe now consider themselves 'post Christian', so nontheism is considered normal, and religious adherence unusual. It wouldn't be fair to call atheism a counter-culture there. But in other parts of the world, religious adherence is considered normal, and atheism is still viewed as a sort of morally suspect heresy. In such an environment, atheists may group for mutual support, and there may be various atheistic counter-cultures present, or atheists may simply be too isolated/disinterested/private to form counter-cultures.