Total Posts:50|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

Worship

DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 8:10:52 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

I'm not bound to anything, I adore and honor the Creator for many reasons, all of which an atheist like you will dismiss as delusion. That's about all you will offer.
As I'll explain below, worship (for me) is not forced, needed or bound, it is a conscious, voluntary reaction.


It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

Maybe if you're a teeny bopper but I am nothing close to it. Nothing gets my worship or adoration unless I say so, and I don't worship anything other than the Creator.


This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

And you wouldn't need to succumb to loving your spouse if you had one but you did because they earned it and so it was natural, not because you were bond to or because it was necessary.

Read the underlined words above in your definition. There is no "need" to succumb to anything, you're missing the point of worship entirely and hopefully this post will clear things up for you.
Atheists dismiss and do not acknowledge Gods existence therefore they have not that connection and then compulsion to adore the Creator. When was the last time you were forced to adore something lol? kinda an oxymoron correct?

Feeling, expression and adoration don't come from being needed, just like you don't need to love your mommy rather you do because you desire to, because you've grown to adore and respect her therefore the act of loving her comes natural.
Likewise the act of adoration and honor come natural. That is why they will "will protect it with every fiber of their being", it's the same as protecting something you love, it's a natural reaction.
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 8:12:28 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 8:10:52 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

I'm not bound to anything, I adore and honor the Creator for many reasons, all of which an atheist like you will dismiss as delusion. That's about all you will offer.
As I'll explain below, worship (for me) is not forced, needed or bound, it is a conscious, voluntary reaction.


It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

Maybe if you're a teeny bopper but I am nothing close to it. Nothing gets my worship or adoration unless I say so, and I don't worship anything other than the Creator.


This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

And you wouldn't need to succumb to loving your spouse if you had one but you did because they earned it and so it was natural, not because you were bond to or because it was necessary.

Excuse me.."bound to it"....

Read the underlined words above in your definition. There is no "need" to succumb to anything, you're missing the point of worship entirely and hopefully this post will clear things up for you.
Atheists dismiss and do not acknowledge Gods existence therefore they have not that connection and then compulsion to adore the Creator. When was the last time you were forced to adore something lol? kinda an oxymoron correct?

Feeling, expression and adoration don't come from being needed, just like you don't need to love your mommy rather you do because you desire to, because you've grown to adore and respect her therefore the act of loving her comes natural.
Likewise the act of adoration and honor come natural. That is why they will "will protect it with every fiber of their being", it's the same as protecting something you love, it's a natural reaction.
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 2,181
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 8:28:01 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 8:12:28 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 2/27/2016 8:10:52 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

I'm not bound to anything, I adore and honor the Creator for many reasons, all of which an atheist like you will dismiss as delusion. That's about all you will offer.
As I'll explain below, worship (for me) is not forced, needed or bound, it is a conscious, voluntary reaction.


It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

Maybe if you're a teeny bopper but I am nothing close to it. Nothing gets my worship or adoration unless I say so, and I don't worship anything other than the Creator.


This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

And you wouldn't need to succumb to loving your spouse if you had one but you did because they earned it and so it was natural, not because you were bond to or because it was necessary.

Excuse me.."bound to it"....

Read the underlined words above in your definition. There is no "need" to succumb to anything, you're missing the point of worship entirely and hopefully this post will clear things up for you.
Atheists dismiss and do not acknowledge Gods existence therefore they have not that connection and then compulsion to adore the Creator. When was the last time you were forced to adore something lol? kinda an oxymoron correct?

Feeling, expression and adoration don't come from being needed, just like you don't need to love your mommy rather you do because you desire to, because you've grown to adore and respect her therefore the act of loving her comes natural.
Likewise the act of adoration and honor come natural. That is why they will "will protect it with every fiber of their being", it's the same as protecting something you love, it's a natural reaction.

Calm down big fella. Oh nothing gets my worship. Unless I say . Pull ya head in
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 2,181
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 8:32:38 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 8:28:01 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
At 2/27/2016 8:12:28 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 2/27/2016 8:10:52 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

I'm not bound to anything, I adore and honor the Creator for many reasons, all of which an atheist like you will dismiss as delusion. That's about all you will offer.
As I'll explain below, worship (for me) is not forced, needed or bound, it is a conscious, voluntary reaction.


It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

Maybe if you're a teeny bopper but I am nothing close to it. Nothing gets my worship or adoration unless I say so, and I don't worship anything other than the Creator.


This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

And you wouldn't need to succumb to loving your spouse if you had one but you did because they earned it and so it was natural, not because you were bond to or because it was necessary.

Excuse me.."bound to it"....

Read the underlined words above in your definition. There is no "need" to succumb to anything, you're missing the point of worship entirely and hopefully this post will clear things up for you.
Atheists dismiss and do not acknowledge Gods existence therefore they have not that connection and then compulsion to adore the Creator. When was the last time you were forced to adore something lol? kinda an oxymoron correct?

Feeling, expression and adoration don't come from being needed, just like you don't need to love your mommy rather you do because you desire to, because you've grown to adore and respect her therefore the act of loving her comes natural.
Likewise the act of adoration and honor come natural. That is why they will "will protect it with every fiber of their being", it's the same as protecting something you love, it's a natural reaction.

Calm down big fella. Oh nothing gets my worship. Unless I say . Pull ya head in

I was going to be Christian friendly today , but you just tore a hole in my nighty.
janesix
Posts: 3,467
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 8:56:13 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

Even if I found out today God was real, I doubt I would worship it. It would have a lot of explaining to do.
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 2,181
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 9:05:17 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

I've been thinking about the reason for a church for a while now, do you think worship is the 1 and only reason why they built a church .
Danb6177
Posts: 433
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 9:12:46 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

Id take out the words ignorance and delusion but outside of that, very good post. I think its spot on
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 11:03:29 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

Yes, whilst those definitions are correct, there are a number of alternative meanings, some of which are archaich, and mean little more that profound respect, as in the current English custom of addressing a town mayor as "The Worshipful" whoeveer "Mayor of" wherever.

The sae goes for Judges in the UK who are addressed as "Your worship".

In scripture Worship is generally used in that sense, though to varying degrees.

I. e. Worshipping Jehovah means treating him with the utmost respect as is due to our loving creator.

Worshipping Christ means giving him the full respect, and credit due for his faithful service to his father, right up to and beyond a very painful death. However that is not respect to the same level as his father who made Christ's sacrifice possible for our sakes, or at least for the sake of all who truly accept it.


While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.


I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

That also varies from faith to faith, for instance in Catholicism it involves a great deal of ritual, pomp and circumstance.

It bears little or no resemblance to the worship of the Apostles, or even of Jehovah's Witnesses is which based entirely around the principle that the one you worship is in fact the one you obey.

According to that scriptural principle, it is all too easy to end up worshipping Satan without even realising in, purely because you are not worshipping Jehovah.

That is because the issue that is currently being tested is the challenge by Satan, firstly that people will only serve Jehovah because of what they may get out of it, and secondly that they will refuse to serve if their life is threatened.

The best known example of that latter form, which is detailed in Job 2, is the refusal to obey Jehovah's ban on the use of blood in case we die by obeying.


Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

That argument is completely without basis. The vast majority of theists worship completely without the accurate knowledge which is essential to faith in the Biblical meaning of the word. The have a belief, and generally a false one, but no real faith.

Lack of faith invariably leads to sin.

For example Abraham's lack of faith in Jehovah's promise led to him fathering Ishmael by his maidservant Hagar, an error for which we still pay today through Islam.

However, Abraham eventually Abraham learned to have real faith in Jehovah to the extent that he believed Jehovah's promises through his son Isaac sufficiently to know that as long as he was obedient and prepared his son for sacrifice, Isaac would, somehow, survive the experience, as Paul explains at Hebrews 11:17-19.

Of course in that, Abraham was a type, a pattern, of Jehovah himself who, in due time, offered his only begotten son up for sacrifice in the flesh of Jesus, but thanks to his son's obedience was able to resurrect him to his former state.


This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

Oh there is far more that separates the believer from the non-believer.

For instance whilst the non-believer (in truth and the importance of) only chooses to believe that which suits him, the real believer in the power of truth accepts truths whether or not they suit him or make him feel comfortable.

Eventually the true believer learns to like those truths for exactly what the are. truth.

By now you should realise that, according to that usage of the term "believer" the sense in which scripture uses it, there are multitudes who claim to be believers who in fact are not.

Why?

Because like it or not, truth is the only thing worth believing, the only thing which will bring real, lasting benefits.
Stronn
Posts: 318
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 11:19:42 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 8:10:52 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:

I'm not bound to anything, I adore and honor the Creator for many reasons, all of which an atheist like you will dismiss as delusion. That's about all you will offer.
As I'll explain below, worship (for me) is not forced, needed or bound, it is a conscious, voluntary reaction.

And you wouldn't need to succumb to loving your spouse if you had one but you did because they earned it and so it was natural, not because you were bond to or because it was necessary.

Read the underlined words above in your definition. There is no "need" to succumb to anything, you're missing the point of worship entirely and hopefully this post will clear things up for you.

In the Christian worldview, you are commanded to worship God or suffer eternal damnation. If that is not forced, then I don't know what is.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/27/2016 11:49:16 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 11:19:42 PM, Stronn wrote:
At 2/27/2016 8:10:52 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:

I'm not bound to anything, I adore and honor the Creator for many reasons, all of which an atheist like you will dismiss as delusion. That's about all you will offer.
As I'll explain below, worship (for me) is not forced, needed or bound, it is a conscious, voluntary reaction.

And you wouldn't need to succumb to loving your spouse if you had one but you did because they earned it and so it was natural, not because you were bond to or because it was necessary.

Read the underlined words above in your definition. There is no "need" to succumb to anything, you're missing the point of worship entirely and hopefully this post will clear things up for you.

In the Christian worldview, you are commanded to worship God or suffer eternal damnation. If that is not forced, then I don't know what is.

No, that is only in the fake Christian world.

In the world of true Christians we realise that God is not cruel enough to treat anyone so unfairly.

You need to learn two things.

Well actually you need to learn a lot, most especially who and what Jehovah and his son really are, however, n this context, what you really need to learn is:

1: Why the term "Eternal torment" is figurative not literal.

2: What eternal really means in scripture..
bulproof
Posts: 25,274
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 12:02:56 AM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 8:10:52 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
Atheists dismiss and do not acknowledge Gods existence therefore they have not that connection and then compulsion to adore the Creator.
Oh dear.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 3:32:08 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 8:10:52 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

I'm not bound to anything, I adore and honor the Creator for many reasons, all of which an atheist like you will dismiss as delusion. That's about all you will offer.

You have only one reason, it's called the Bible.

As I'll explain below, worship (for me) is not forced, needed or bound, it is a conscious, voluntary reaction.

Where did I say it was forced?


It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

Maybe if you're a teeny bopper but I am nothing close to it. Nothing gets my worship or adoration unless I say so, and I don't worship anything other than the Creator.

I never said you did. But, what you worship are merely words in a book written centuries ago by men.


This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

And you wouldn't need to succumb to loving your spouse if you had one but you did because they earned it and so it was natural, not because you were bond to or because it was necessary.

What does that have to do with worshiping and the intent of this thread?

Read the underlined words above in your definition. There is no "need" to succumb to anything, you're missing the point of worship entirely and hopefully this post will clear things up for you.

You're missing the point of this thread.

Atheists dismiss and do not acknowledge Gods existence therefore they have not that connection and then compulsion to adore the Creator.

No, atheists understand there is no evidence of a God/Creator and have therefore moved beyond the need to worship one. If there were connections to a God/Creator, we would all have and know it.

When was the last time you were forced to adore something lol? kinda an oxymoron correct?

Where do you keep getting the notion of "forced". Your reading comprehension skills are abysmal.

Feeling, expression and adoration don't come from being needed, just like you don't need to love your mommy rather you do because you desire to, because you've grown to adore and respect her therefore the act of loving her comes natural.
Likewise the act of adoration and honor come natural. That is why they will "will protect it with every fiber of their being", it's the same as protecting something you love, it's a natural reaction.

But, you're talking about something completely different that has nothing to do with this thread. Try and focus and think for a change.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 3:33:42 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 8:56:13 PM, janesix wrote:
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

Even if I found out today God was real, I doubt I would worship it. It would have a lot of explaining to do.

That may be true, but the intent of this thread is to point out the need to worship as the foundation of faiths.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 3:34:13 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 9:12:46 PM, Danb6177 wrote:
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.

I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

Id take out the words ignorance and delusion but outside of that, very good post. I think its spot on

Thank you, sir.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 11:03:29 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

Yes, whilst those definitions are correct, there are a number of alternative meanings, some of which are archaich, and mean little more that profound respect, as in the current English custom of addressing a town mayor as "The Worshipful" whoeveer "Mayor of" wherever.

The sae goes for Judges in the UK who are addressed as "Your worship".

In scripture Worship is generally used in that sense, though to varying degrees.

I. e. Worshipping Jehovah means treating him with the utmost respect as is due to our loving creator.

Worshipping Christ means giving him the full respect, and credit due for his faithful service to his father, right up to and beyond a very painful death. However that is not respect to the same level as his father who made Christ's sacrifice possible for our sakes, or at least for the sake of all who truly accept it.



While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.


I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

That also varies from faith to faith, for instance in Catholicism it involves a great deal of ritual, pomp and circumstance.

It bears little or no resemblance to the worship of the Apostles, or even of Jehovah's Witnesses is which based entirely around the principle that the one you worship is in fact the one you obey.

According to that scriptural principle, it is all too easy to end up worshipping Satan without even realising in, purely because you are not worshipping Jehovah.

That is because the issue that is currently being tested is the challenge by Satan, firstly that people will only serve Jehovah because of what they may get out of it, and secondly that they will refuse to serve if their life is threatened.

The best known example of that latter form, which is detailed in Job 2, is the refusal to obey Jehovah's ban on the use of blood in case we die by obeying.


Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

That argument is completely without basis. The vast majority of theists worship completely without the accurate knowledge which is essential to faith in the Biblical meaning of the word. The have a belief, and generally a false one, but no real faith.

Lack of faith invariably leads to sin.

For example Abraham's lack of faith in Jehovah's promise led to him fathering Ishmael by his maidservant Hagar, an error for which we still pay today through Islam.

However, Abraham eventually Abraham learned to have real faith in Jehovah to the extent that he believed Jehovah's promises through his son Isaac sufficiently to know that as long as he was obedient and prepared his son for sacrifice, Isaac would, somehow, survive the experience, as Paul explains at Hebrews 11:17-19.

Of course in that, Abraham was a type, a pattern, of Jehovah himself who, in due time, offered his only begotten son up for sacrifice in the flesh of Jesus, but thanks to his son's obedience was able to resurrect him to his former state.


This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

Oh there is far more that separates the believer from the non-believer.

For instance whilst the non-believer (in truth and the importance of) only chooses to believe that which suits him, the real believer in the power of truth accepts truths whether or not they suit him or make him feel comfortable.

Eventually the true believer learns to like those truths for exactly what the are. truth.

By now you should realise that, according to that usage of the term "believer" the sense in which scripture uses it, there are multitudes who claim to be believers who in fact are not.

Why?

Because like it or not, truth is the only thing worth believing, the only thing which will bring real, lasting benefits.

Yes, thank you once again for repeating ad nausea the No True Scotsman fallacy.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
missmedic
Posts: 388
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 4:04:11 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

What is worship?
Worship is the act of sending/offering love, devotion and gratitude to a deity or idol.
They say that love is understanding and yet no one really understands God at all. How can you love something or someone whom you can neither understand or communicate with properly?
Love and worship is also about admiration, adoration and gratitude but how can one feel these things towards someone whom they've never seen or spent time with?
No God has ever asked anyone to worship him so man's desire to worship a deity is nothing more than an ego based need to make himself feel useful to a god who otherwise probably has no real use for anything man has to offer.
There is no evidence that whatever or whoever created us needs us to worship them because the probability is that if we were created by a god or an advanced race then they were doing it for their own purpose and agenda. Why would you worship someone just for carrying out their own agenda? Would an all powerful creator create a dysfunctional bunch of lemmings just for the purpose of worship? Why then give us intelligence, free choice, diversity, individuality and a strong will and then threaten to disown or terminate us as soon as we try to use them?
If a single true God does exist then creating a race of selfish, sinful, ignorant, arrogant, egotistical, money hungry and sex obsessed beings for the sole purpose of worshiping him would have to be the stupidest thing he's ever done.
It's fairly clear that some people have allowed themselves to become ignorant and dumbed-down by the pompous tradition of religion.
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 2,181
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 4:14:43 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/27/2016 11:03:29 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
"A man can no more diminish God's glory by refusing to worship Him than a lunatic can put out the sun by scribbling the word, 'darkness' on the walls of his cell." C. S. Lewis

Worship:

1. the feeling or expression of reverence and adoration for a deity.
2. show reverence and adoration for (a deity); honor with religious rites.

Yes, whilst those definitions are correct, there are a number of alternative meanings, some of which are archaich, and mean little more that profound respect, as in the current English custom of addressing a town mayor as "The Worshipful" whoeveer "Mayor of" wherever.

The sae goes for Judges in the UK who are addressed as "Your worship".

In scripture Worship is generally used in that sense, though to varying degrees.

I. e. Worshipping Jehovah means treating him with the utmost respect as is due to our loving creator.

Worshipping Christ means giving him the full respect, and credit due for his faithful service to his father, right up to and beyond a very painful death. However that is not respect to the same level as his father who made Christ's sacrifice possible for our sakes, or at least for the sake of all who truly accept it.



While I'm sure there are more definitions, these are probably adequate to define worship for the purpose of this thread.


I have found that the bottom line with religions is not so much the dogma, the belief systems or deities involved. But rather, it seems to all boil down to worshiping, which is probably the most common denominator among all faiths. Clearly, it's not difficult for people to convert from one faith to another, so it can't be the actual religion itself that is important.

That also varies from faith to faith, for instance in Catholicism it involves a great deal of ritual, pomp and circumstance.

It bears little or no resemblance to the worship of the Apostles, or even of Jehovah's Witnesses is which based entirely around the principle that the one you worship is in fact the one you obey.

According to that scriptural principle, it is all too easy to end up worshipping Satan without even realising in, purely because you are not worshipping Jehovah.

That is because the issue that is currently being tested is the challenge by Satan, firstly that people will only serve Jehovah because of what they may get out of it, and secondly that they will refuse to serve if their life is threatened.

The best known example of that latter form, which is detailed in Job 2, is the refusal to obey Jehovah's ban on the use of blood in case we die by obeying.


Worshiping is the one thing that the human condition is bound, it is the crux of all that has been required to build and fortify any given faith. It is the one thing common with the psyche and what people will do in order to worship something or somebody.

It has been argued that faith and religion is something we all share, that it is embedded in our DNA and our psychological makeup. It isn't. Worship is what is part of us all, the "need to express reverence and adoration" whether it be a god, an athlete or a rock star.

That argument is completely without basis. The vast majority of theists worship completely without the accurate knowledge which is essential to faith in the Biblical meaning of the word. The have a belief, and generally a false one, but no real faith.

Lack of faith invariably leads to sin.

For example Abraham's lack of faith in Jehovah's promise led to him fathering Ishmael by his maidservant Hagar, an error for which we still pay today through Islam.

However, Abraham eventually Abraham learned to have real faith in Jehovah to the extent that he believed Jehovah's promises through his son Isaac sufficiently to know that as long as he was obedient and prepared his son for sacrifice, Isaac would, somehow, survive the experience, as Paul explains at Hebrews 11:17-19.

Of course in that, Abraham was a type, a pattern, of Jehovah himself who, in due time, offered his only begotten son up for sacrifice in the flesh of Jesus, but thanks to his son's obedience was able to resurrect him to his former state.


This is what separates the believer from the non-believer, the understanding that the need to worship is not necessary to succumb, that to move beyond the ignorance and delusion of the mind, one gives up the need to worship. For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

Oh there is far more that separates the believer from the non-believer.

For instance whilst the non-believer (in truth and the importance of) only chooses to believe that which suits him, the real believer in the power of truth accepts truths whether or not they suit him or make him feel comfortable.

Eventually the true believer learns to like those truths for exactly what the are. truth.

By now you should realise that, according to that usage of the term "believer" the sense in which scripture uses it, there are multitudes who claim to be believers who in fact are not.

Why?

Because like it or not, truth is the only thing worth believing, the only thing which will bring real, lasting benefits.

Yes, thank you once again for repeating ad nausea the No True Scotsman fallacy.

It's the biggest thing I think that separates atheists and theists.
Christians worship God .
But god has never been worshiped .

Believe in somthing you can't prove that's OK , we are human . But to worship something you can't ever prove. And live by it
That's getting in the area of stupid.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 6:46:36 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/28/2016 4:14:43 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:


It's the biggest thing I think that separates atheists and theists.
Christians worship God .
But god has never been worshiped .

Believe in somthing you can't prove that's OK , we are human . But to worship something you can't ever prove. And live by it
That's getting in the area of stupid.

I have proven that Jehovah exists.

It is not my fault that you refuse to accept the evidence which is right under your nose, for whatever reason.

Evidence, no matter how obvious, is useless if you choose to ignore it.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 6:48:21 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/27/2016 11:03:29 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Because like it or not, truth is the only thing worth believing, the only thing which will bring real, lasting benefits.

Yes, thank you once again for repeating ad nausea the No True Scotsman fallacy.

I don't, you have simply swallowed the fallacy whole. I see through it to the truth that it hides.

Boy are you going to feel dumb when you find out.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 6:53:40 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/28/2016 6:46:36 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/28/2016 4:14:43 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:


It's the biggest thing I think that separates atheists and theists.
Christians worship God .
But god has never been worshiped .

Believe in somthing you can't prove that's OK , we are human . But to worship something you can't ever prove. And live by it
That's getting in the area of stupid.

I have proven that Jehovah exists.

It is not my fault that you refuse to accept the evidence which is right under your nose, for whatever reason.

Evidence, no matter how obvious, is useless if you choose to ignore it.

Ah yes, the imaginary evidence that you never explain.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 6:57:06 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/28/2016 6:48:21 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/27/2016 11:03:29 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Because like it or not, truth is the only thing worth believing, the only thing which will bring real, lasting benefits.

Yes, thank you once again for repeating ad nausea the No True Scotsman fallacy.

I don't, you have simply swallowed the fallacy whole. I see through it to the truth that it hides.

Boy are you going to feel dumb when you find out.

Not interested in your crap. Take your lies somewhere else.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 10:58:53 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/28/2016 6:57:06 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/28/2016 6:48:21 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/27/2016 11:03:29 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Because like it or not, truth is the only thing worth believing, the only thing which will bring real, lasting benefits.

Yes, thank you once again for repeating ad nausea the No True Scotsman fallacy.

I don't, you have simply swallowed the fallacy whole. I see through it to the truth that it hides.

Boy are you going to feel dumb when you find out.

Not interested in your crap. Take your lies somewhere else.

If you aren't interested in the truths I teach don't read them and don't respond, it is in your hands. No-one is forcing you to read it or respond to it, and there are enough people on here who very successfully ignore me. Why not join them.

However what teach remains true whatever you may choose to think or do.

If you really believed the lies you support, what I say would not trouble you.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 11:00:50 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/28/2016 6:53:40 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/28/2016 6:46:36 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/28/2016 4:14:43 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:


It's the biggest thing I think that separates atheists and theists.
Christians worship God .
But god has never been worshiped .

Believe in somthing you can't prove that's OK , we are human . But to worship something you can't ever prove. And live by it
That's getting in the area of stupid.

I have proven that Jehovah exists.

It is not my fault that you refuse to accept the evidence which is right under your nose, for whatever reason.

Evidence, no matter how obvious, is useless if you choose to ignore it.

Ah yes, the imaginary evidence that you never explain.

I have explained it, but you prefer not to admit that t truly is evidence.

The fact that you find it impossible to ignore what I teach shows that deep down inside you suspect it is true and it troubles you too much for you to ignore it.

You have what is sometimes called a "Hair Shirt Complex".
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,633
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/28/2016 11:22:11 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/28/2016 11:00:50 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/28/2016 6:53:40 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/28/2016 6:46:36 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/28/2016 4:14:43 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:


It's the biggest thing I think that separates atheists and theists.
Christians worship God .
But god has never been worshiped .

Believe in somthing you can't prove that's OK , we are human . But to worship something you can't ever prove. And live by it
That's getting in the area of stupid.

I have proven that Jehovah exists.

It is not my fault that you refuse to accept the evidence which is right under your nose, for whatever reason.

Evidence, no matter how obvious, is useless if you choose to ignore it.

Ah yes, the imaginary evidence that you never explain.

I have explained it, but you prefer not to admit that t truly is evidence.

You've explained nothing.

The fact that you find it impossible to ignore what I teach shows that deep down inside you suspect it is true and it troubles you too much for you to ignore it.

You teach crap.

You have what is sometimes called a "Hair Shirt Complex".

You have what is sometimes called insanity.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/29/2016 12:01:04 AM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/27/2016 5:09:19 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
For the believer, worshiping is the most powerful trait they posses and will protect it with every fiber of their being, regardless of what religion they follow or what religion they convert.

I don't believe humans have an innate need to worship, Danne, however I think they do have need to displace anxieties, to expunge guilt or shame, to form communities and to feel united.

Worship is not the only way to do that, but it's a convenient way when ignorant people feel powerless and scared. Invoking magical thought through group worship builds culture from mutual mollification. It doesn't solve any problems in itself, and arguably may help to create new problems. But if the problems are thought unsolvable in the first place, it's a psychologically convenient recourse.

But as science and engineering have become more effective, there are fewer excuses to worship from desperation, and more demands for people to be diligent, accountable and transparent in their thought. Today, clerical classes and their ailing institutions struggle for relevance, since they offer nothing better than theatre, outdated dogmas and ill-informed, self-interested advice.

Our cultures are changing, and people are changing with them. Clerics often cavil that if people find no need to worship gods, then they'll worship celebrities. But it's media themselves that promote celebrity-worship, much as ancient clerics used to promote the worship of saints. if we demand more from our media, they will give more. If we demand less, they'll distract us with whatever we'll tolerate.

In the end, if we can solve problems constructively we won't feel the need to worship. And why would we not seek to solve problems constructively?
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/29/2016 1:08:28 AM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/28/2016 6:48:21 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/27/2016 11:03:29 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Because like it or not, truth is the only thing worth believing, the only thing which will bring real, lasting benefits.

Yes, thank you once again for repeating ad nausea the No True Scotsman fallacy.

I don't, you have simply swallowed the fallacy whole. I see through it to the truth that it hides.

Boy are you going to feel dumb when you find out.

Why do you spend so much time on this site when all you can offer are childish hand waiving and declarations of one day being proven right? I mean seriously, do you realize how ridiculous you sound to everyone that is not you?
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/29/2016 6:15:43 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/29/2016 1:08:28 AM, Double_R wrote:
At 2/28/2016 6:48:21 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/27/2016 11:03:29 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Because like it or not, truth is the only thing worth believing, the only thing which will bring real, lasting benefits.

Yes, thank you once again for repeating ad nausea the No True Scotsman fallacy.

I don't, you have simply swallowed the fallacy whole. I see through it to the truth that it hides.

Boy are you going to feel dumb when you find out.

Why do you spend so much time on this site when all you can offer are childish hand waiving and declarations of one day being proven right? I mean seriously, do you realize how ridiculous you sound to everyone that is not you?

Because I can offer truth and life to those who accept what Christ and his father teach.

I should cease trying to save the eternal lives of such as you?

Never may that be.

If you saw someone unwittingly walking towards the cliff edge, when would you stop calling out to them?

Only after they have disappeared over the edge I hope.

That is how it is for me except that it is not this second rate life I am trying to save, but your eternal life n perfect peace and security in paradise on the restored earth.

Those that die for their unwillingness to learn will never be able to point to me and say "he didn't tell me". As Paul said, my hands are clean of the blood of all men, your blood will be on your own head unless you learn.

The more people can be helped to survive what is to come the better.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/29/2016 6:18:17 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/28/2016 11:22:11 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/28/2016 11:00:50 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


I have explained it, but you prefer not to admit that t truly is evidence.

You've explained nothing.

Only because you have not accepted the truth of what I teach.


The fact that you find it impossible to ignore what I teach shows that deep down inside you suspect it is true and it troubles you too much for you to ignore it.

You teach crap.

Not in the least. The absolute opposite in fact.


You have what is sometimes called a "Hair Shirt Complex".

You have what is sometimes called insanity.

Yes, it has often been called that by those in the world who are trapped in the world's wisdom and do not wish to escape.

However, it is what you have been duped into believing which is far closer to insanity than anything I teach.
annanicole
Posts: 19,788
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
2/29/2016 9:46:26 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 2/29/2016 6:15:43 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/29/2016 1:08:28 AM, Double_R wrote:
At 2/28/2016 6:48:21 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 2/28/2016 3:41:37 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 2/27/2016 11:03:29 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Because like it or not, truth is the only thing worth believing, the only thing which will bring real, lasting benefits.

Yes, thank you once again for repeating ad nausea the No True Scotsman fallacy.

I don't, you have simply swallowed the fallacy whole. I see through it to the truth that it hides.

Boy are you going to feel dumb when you find out.

Why do you spend so much time on this site when all you can offer are childish hand waiving and declarations of one day being proven right? I mean seriously, do you realize how ridiculous you sound to everyone that is not you?

Because I can offer truth and life to those who accept what Christ and his father teach.

To the contrary, you offer what the WatchTower teaches, which apparently causes you to constantly have to claim, "Oh, yeah, well, Jesus got that one wrong" or "Paul was just ignorant when he wrote that." Over and over you have informed us that truly inspired men got it all wrong, yet the bumbling nincompoops at the WatchTower know better.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."