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How do atheists know right from wrong?

Godgirl
Posts: 500
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3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 2,181
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3/12/2016 2:05:59 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

I got 36 years experience , with no rules .
Ive been winging it.
You got a book.
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 2,181
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3/12/2016 2:07:16 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

So do you dislike homosexuals?
Godgirl
Posts: 500
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3/12/2016 2:19:21 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:07:16 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

So do you dislike homosexuals?

Not sure how this relates to the question . . .
I dislike homosexuality, but not homosexuals.
Jovian
Posts: 1,720
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3/12/2016 2:32:38 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

What matters right from wrong differs between all cultures. It has also always changed even in your religion. Interpretations change all the time. You haven't met many Christian women who believe it's wrong to wear braids, silver jewellery or pearls (1 Timothy 2:9), now have you? I guess you neither have met many Jews who believe rape victims should marry their rapists (Deuteronomy 22:28-29) or that people who are working on Saturdays should be executed (Exodus 35:2)?

However, it could be quite shady but the most fundamental in the whole is a natural compassion. Most people wouldn't want themselves, their family members or friends to become killed, harassed etc, so thus they won't do this to others. I mean, let us imagine a situation where a random person is out walking and then they see a child falling into a lake and screaming for help because he can't swim. I would guess that an even amount of people from all religious camps would react on instinct and rescue him. Yes, even adult humans from a primitive isolated tribe would had done the same thing (unless the drowning would be an adult outsider man, they are always seen as hostile to primitive humans). Even many ANIMALS have a natural compassion incorporated, haven't you heard of all those histories of miracle dogs or dolphins who attack sharks about to attack a human?

These biological things could although be quite shady too. Something being done solely with good intetions doesn't automatically condone it. I guess what the majority of the people within your culture thinks plays a role here. For example, there is nothing harmful in waving your hand to greet someone, but what if you would live in a country where that gesture were seen by everyone as insulting?

What do you think of what I've written? It's mostly thoughts right now though.
DPMartin
Posts: 1,096
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3/12/2016 2:43:44 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

They don"t, nobody does. People only know what they agree to as right or wrong meaning in their own judgement of what is good for themselves and what is evil or a detriment to the fulfillment of what is in their hearts to do.
AWSM0055
Posts: 751
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3/12/2016 2:52:40 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

It's a combination of many things, mainly culture and social instinct.
"Evolution proves necessity is the mother of invention" - David Henson

"Calling my atheism a religion, is like calling my non-stamp-collecting a hobby" - MagicAintReal 2016

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FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,240
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3/12/2016 2:55:54 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

Good Morning Godgirl, welcome to the forums. Please allow me to give you the most immediate, but salient "canned" answer that comes in the form of a question.

Were you to not have read the Bible/have religion, would you be raping, murdering, killing etc? That is to say without Bible/religion, would you be an immoral monster? Should God be found not to exist, and it be some other equally interesting but not deific/no afterlife, does that sound to you like a "pass" to begin a murder spree?

The short answer to your question is "empathy". That being if I did it to some one, some one could do it to me. Or, I know what it might feel like to have something done to me, so out of compassion for my fellow man, I should help to not have that something effect some one else.
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
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bulproof
Posts: 25,308
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3/12/2016 3:09:54 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Firstly you don't have enough experience or knowledge to be condescending secondly is the bible the only reason you believe infanticide to be RIGHT?
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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3/12/2016 3:28:34 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

We decipher what is right from from the same way you do, the difference is that we don't credit a book for our ability to understand these things.

Here is a question for you, if the bible said that you would be moral to kill your child, would you then believe that killing your child is moral? What if they were not listening to you, would it be moral then?
RedAtheist219
Posts: 17
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3/12/2016 3:47:42 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

Good day, ma'am.
First of all, atheists do not have religious texts.
Now, it seems as if religion has objective morality. Islam has killing in the name of Allah for example. You may find this absurd, but the fact that Christianity already has someone sacrificing their own son just because there was some voices in their head is quite the same level of ridicule. Well, in this case I wouldn't want objective morality, your "right or wrong" as depicted in your holy texts. The very fact that what is moral in your religion could be considered immoral in others would raise another question, which I am going to ask right now: How do theists know right from wrong?

Now, the thing about morality is you don't need to teach your children that in order for them to learn it. The Golden Rule - treat someone as how you'd treat yourself - children can learn that by themselves. About the Bible, have you actually read it? There are heaps of bull and utter nonsense in there, and you come to the occasional moral verse and say "hey, that's Christianity!" What about all the other parts? "well, that doesn't really apply to us anymore. We've grown out of it." Of course you've grown out of it, in our modern society you'd be in jail if you hadn't. You don't need religion to have morality - it comes to humans naturally. Atheists know right from wrong the same way as anybody and everybody else. Your conscience within. Would you find somebody that is moral in their own behalf more assuring than someone who's moral just because of that great big surveillance camera in the sky?
missmedic
Posts: 390
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3/12/2016 4:10:14 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

Real morality does not come from authority, real morality comes from choice as each man must decide where he stands morally for himself.
How does a Christian decide what commandments to follow and what commandments to ignore (there are over 1000 commandments in the NT alone)?
tarantula
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3/12/2016 4:16:11 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

There is a lot that is bad in the Bible, especially the evil deity featured there, Satan couldn't be any worse!
Pase66
Posts: 775
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3/12/2016 4:19:06 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

I'm an atheist. Yes, I don't have any "book" that lays down a moral framework for me. Yet, if I were to have a book, I sure hope that it wouldn't condone the stoning of adulterers; condone slavery; saying that giving up your daughter to be raped is "good"; and calls homosexuality a "sin", while it has been demonstrated to be biological, and not a choice. Also, all because a book claims that there is a moral framework, doesn't mean that there actually exists a moral framework.
Check out these Current Debates
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Godgirl
Posts: 500
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3/12/2016 4:19:22 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 3:09:54 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Firstly you don't have enough experience or knowledge to be condescending
Sorry, I really wasn't trying to be condescending
secondly is the bible the only reason you believe infanticide to be RIGHT?
I don't know . . .
Godgirl
Posts: 500
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3/12/2016 4:22:04 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:32:38 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

What matters right from wrong differs between all cultures. It has also always changed even in your religion. Interpretations change all the time. You haven't met many Christian women who believe it's wrong to wear braids, silver jewellery or pearls (1 Timothy 2:9), now have you? I guess you neither have met many Jews who believe rape victims should marry their rapists (Deuteronomy 22:28-29) or that people who are working on Saturdays should be executed (Exodus 35:2)?

However, it could be quite shady but the most fundamental in the whole is a natural compassion. Most people wouldn't want themselves, their family members or friends to become killed, harassed etc, so thus they won't do this to others. I mean, let us imagine a situation where a random person is out walking and then they see a child falling into a lake and screaming for help because he can't swim. I would guess that an even amount of people from all religious camps would react on instinct and rescue him. Yes, even adult humans from a primitive isolated tribe would had done the same thing (unless the drowning would be an adult outsider man, they are always seen as hostile to primitive humans). Even many ANIMALS have a natural compassion incorporated, haven't you heard of all those histories of miracle dogs or dolphins who attack sharks about to attack a human?

These biological things could although be quite shady too. Something being done solely with good intetions doesn't automatically condone it. I guess what the majority of the people within your culture thinks plays a role here. For example, there is nothing harmful in waving your hand to greet someone, but what if you would live in a country where that gesture were seen by everyone as insulting?

What do you think of what I've written? It's mostly thoughts right now though.

I like it. Most of it makes sense to me. But if we do have compassion as a natural part of us, why are there murderers and rapists?
Godgirl
Posts: 500
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3/12/2016 4:28:20 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 3:47:42 PM, RedAtheist219 wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

Good day, ma'am.
First of all, atheists do not have religious texts.
That's not what I meant. I meant that there are other religious texts beside the bible, like Muslims have the Qu'ran.
Now, it seems as if religion has objective morality. Islam has killing in the name of Allah for example. You may find this absurd, but the fact that Christianity already has someone sacrificing their own son just because there was some voices in their head is quite the same level of ridicule. Well, in this case I wouldn't want objective morality, your "right or wrong" as depicted in your holy texts. The very fact that what is moral in your religion could be considered immoral in others would raise another question, which I am going to ask right now: How do theists know right from wrong?
We have the bible. It generally tells us what is right.

Now, the thing about morality is you don't need to teach your children that in order for them to learn it. The Golden Rule - treat someone as how you'd treat yourself - children can learn that by themselves. About the Bible, have you actually read it? There are heaps of bull and utter nonsense in there, and you come to the occasional moral verse and say "hey, that's Christianity!" What about all the other parts? "well, that doesn't really apply to us anymore. We've grown out of it." Of course you've grown out of it, in our modern society you'd be in jail if you hadn't. You don't need religion to have morality - it comes to humans naturally. Atheists know right from wrong the same way as anybody and everybody else. Your conscience within. Would you find somebody that is moral in their own behalf more assuring than someone who's moral just because of that great big surveillance camera in the sky?
bulproof
Posts: 25,308
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3/12/2016 4:33:58 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 4:19:22 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 3:09:54 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Firstly you don't have enough experience or knowledge to be condescending
Sorry, I really wasn't trying to be condescending
secondly is the bible the only reason you believe infanticide to be RIGHT?
I don't know . . .
The bible claims that infanticide is morally right, is the bible right?
matt8800
Posts: 2,077
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3/12/2016 4:34:05 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

Most people are born with empathy hardwired into them. Not only do people possess a natural empathy from birth, many animals do also.

Morality emerges from empathy and is shaped by intelligence.
Godgirl
Posts: 500
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3/12/2016 4:40:30 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 4:33:58 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:19:22 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 3:09:54 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Firstly you don't have enough experience or knowledge to be condescending
Sorry, I really wasn't trying to be condescending
secondly is the bible the only reason you believe infanticide to be RIGHT?
I don't know . . .
The bible claims that infanticide is morally right, is the bible right?

I already said I don't know. I'm mostly just very confused. I don't even know what I believe. I mean, I think there has to be a creator of this world; I don't think it could all be by chance. But there are so many holes in the idea of a perfect loving God that I just can't believe anything anymore.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
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3/12/2016 4:42:49 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

Does the bible really lay it all out for you? I don't think so. The bible has a series of commandments, not explanations, the bible has certain commandments that are now viewed as immoral, the bible did not invent or is the origin of those commandments, which actually came about from the minds of men.

The real question for the OP should be, "Why don't theists know right from wrong?"
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
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matt8800
Posts: 2,077
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3/12/2016 4:43:33 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?

Also, what makes anyone's morality more right than another's? It is common for religious people to relish the idea of non-believers to be burned and tortured forever because they share a different opinion. This type of desire would be foreign to most atheists and agnostics. In many cases, religious people have demonstrated they are very capable of immorality.

There was a study that found that religious children were meaner to the peers than secular children - http://www.theguardian.com...

There are plenty of example of moral and immoral people in Islam, Christianity, Atheism, etc. It is unfortunate that some people feel that their favorite religion has a monopoly on morality.

Sometimes religion can be detrimental to morality.
missmedic
Posts: 390
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3/12/2016 4:44:03 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 4:40:30 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:33:58 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:19:22 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 3:09:54 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Firstly you don't have enough experience or knowledge to be condescending
Sorry, I really wasn't trying to be condescending
secondly is the bible the only reason you believe infanticide to be RIGHT?
I don't know . . .
The bible claims that infanticide is morally right, is the bible right?

I already said I don't know. I'm mostly just very confused. I don't even know what I believe. I mean, I think there has to be a creator of this world; I don't think it could all be by chance. But there are so many holes in the idea of a perfect loving God that I just can't believe anything anymore.

Doubt is a good thing, it makes you ask questions.
bulproof
Posts: 25,308
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3/12/2016 4:46:09 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 4:40:30 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:33:58 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:19:22 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 3:09:54 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Firstly you don't have enough experience or knowledge to be condescending
Sorry, I really wasn't trying to be condescending
secondly is the bible the only reason you believe infanticide to be RIGHT?
I don't know . . .
The bible claims that infanticide is morally right, is the bible right?

I already said I don't know. I'm mostly just very confused. I don't even know what I believe. I mean, I think there has to be a creator of this world; I don't think it could all be by chance. But there are so many holes in the idea of a perfect loving God that I just can't believe anything anymore.
I'm sorry for my aggressive response, there is no excuse for that behaviour. I wish you luck in your search and will endeavour do be far more tactful in the future.
Godgirl
Posts: 500
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3/12/2016 4:47:27 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 4:44:03 PM, missmedic wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:40:30 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:33:58 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:19:22 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 3:09:54 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Firstly you don't have enough experience or knowledge to be condescending
Sorry, I really wasn't trying to be condescending
secondly is the bible the only reason you believe infanticide to be RIGHT?
I don't know . . .
The bible claims that infanticide is morally right, is the bible right?

I already said I don't know. I'm mostly just very confused. I don't even know what I believe. I mean, I think there has to be a creator of this world; I don't think it could all be by chance. But there are so many holes in the idea of a perfect loving God that I just can't believe anything anymore.

Doubt is a good thing, it makes you ask questions.

Yeah, but where do I find answers?
matt8800
Posts: 2,077
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3/12/2016 4:49:17 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 4:22:04 PM, Godgirl wrote:


I like it. Most of it makes sense to me. But if we do have compassion as a natural part of us, why are there murderers and rapists?

People are born with different capacities to feel compassion irrespective of their religion. Sociopathy does not discriminate.

Most murders and rapists have religious beliefs and ARE NOT atheists. Less than 1/10th of 1% of the prison population are atheists. https://www.google.com...
Godgirl
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3/12/2016 4:50:25 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 4:46:09 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:40:30 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:33:58 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:19:22 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 3:09:54 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Firstly you don't have enough experience or knowledge to be condescending
Sorry, I really wasn't trying to be condescending
secondly is the bible the only reason you believe infanticide to be RIGHT?
I don't know . . .
The bible claims that infanticide is morally right, is the bible right?

I already said I don't know. I'm mostly just very confused. I don't even know what I believe. I mean, I think there has to be a creator of this world; I don't think it could all be by chance. But there are so many holes in the idea of a perfect loving God that I just can't believe anything anymore.
I'm sorry for my aggressive response, there is no excuse for that behaviour. I wish you luck in your search and will endeavour do be far more tactful in the future.

I don't think you did anything wrong, I just don't know how to answer your question.
matt8800
Posts: 2,077
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3/12/2016 4:57:27 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 4:47:27 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:44:03 PM, missmedic wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:40:30 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:33:58 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:19:22 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 3:09:54 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Firstly you don't have enough experience or knowledge to be condescending
Sorry, I really wasn't trying to be condescending
secondly is the bible the only reason you believe infanticide to be RIGHT?
I don't know . . .
The bible claims that infanticide is morally right, is the bible right?

I already said I don't know. I'm mostly just very confused. I don't even know what I believe. I mean, I think there has to be a creator of this world; I don't think it could all be by chance. But there are so many holes in the idea of a perfect loving God that I just can't believe anything anymore.

Doubt is a good thing, it makes you ask questions.

Yeah, but where do I find answers?

I was raised a devout Christian. It didn't take 20 years to figure out that stories like Abraham being commanded to take his son to the top of a hill and stab/burn his body was twisted. It took 20 years to give myself permission to really analyze it objectively.

Losing religion can be devastating to many people temporarily so can be extremely difficult to be truly objective.

The answers are obvious when you look at it without bias.
Godgirl
Posts: 500
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3/12/2016 5:13:39 PM
Posted: 9 months ago
At 3/12/2016 4:57:27 PM, matt8800 wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:47:27 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:44:03 PM, missmedic wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:40:30 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:33:58 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 4:19:22 PM, Godgirl wrote:
At 3/12/2016 3:09:54 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/12/2016 2:00:45 PM, Godgirl wrote:
First, I am not trying to be insulting. I know some atheists who have morals. I just don't understand how they determine right and wrong. With religion, the bible (or whatever your religious text is) lays it all out for you. Without it, are you just supposed to decide what is moral on your own? If so, what makes your morals more right or better than others'?
Firstly you don't have enough experience or knowledge to be condescending
Sorry, I really wasn't trying to be condescending
secondly is the bible the only reason you believe infanticide to be RIGHT?
I don't know . . .
The bible claims that infanticide is morally right, is the bible right?

I already said I don't know. I'm mostly just very confused. I don't even know what I believe. I mean, I think there has to be a creator of this world; I don't think it could all be by chance. But there are so many holes in the idea of a perfect loving God that I just can't believe anything anymore.

Doubt is a good thing, it makes you ask questions.

Yeah, but where do I find answers?

I was raised a devout Christian. It didn't take 20 years to figure out that stories like Abraham being commanded to take his son to the top of a hill and stab/burn his body was twisted. It took 20 years to give myself permission to really analyze it objectively.

Losing religion can be devastating to many people temporarily so can be extremely difficult to be truly objective.

The answers are obvious when you look at it without bias.

I really want to stay a Christian. Sometimes I just can't. I keep wishing that I'm just "experiencing doubt" or that I'm in a "spiritual desert", and when it's all over, I'll be a stronger Christian because of it. And maybe I am. Maybe I will. But right now, I kind of doubt it.