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Stop the Lies!

NewLifeChristian
Posts: 1,236
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3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?
Pro-Life Quotes:

"I've noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born."
- Ronald Reagan

"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only object of good government."
- Thomas Jefferson

"A person is a person no matter how small."
- Dr. Seuss
tarantula
Posts: 849
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3/15/2016 5:36:05 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

There is no verifiable evidence to support the existence of a god or afterlife. There is no verifiable evidence that the less than credible stories attributed to Jesus are true.
Rosalie
Posts: 4,605
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3/15/2016 5:38:41 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:36:05 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

There is no verifiable evidence to support the existence of a god or afterlife. There is no verifiable evidence that the less than credible stories attributed to Jesus are true.

Exactly.
" We need more videos of cat's playing the piano on the internet" - My art professor.

"Criticism is easier to take when you realize that the only people who aren't criticized are those who don't take risks." - Donald Trump

Officially Mrs. 16Kadams 8-30-16
The-Holy-Macrel
Posts: 777
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3/15/2016 5:56:46 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:36:05 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

There is no verifiable evidence to support the existence of a god or afterlife. There is no verifiable evidence that the less than credible stories attributed to Jesus are true.

I have logic.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,566
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3/15/2016 5:59:42 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

An intelligent person would see that Zuckerman's study was not flawed nor is it completely bunk, they would also see the geeky christian did not do a good job at pointing out any flaws.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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3/15/2016 6:20:52 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:36:05 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

There is no verifiable evidence to support the existence of a god or afterlife. There is no verifiable evidence that the less than credible stories attributed to Jesus are true.

Well.......I guess you can go home now then why discuss it? lol.

....but.... "No verifiable evidence" to support the existence of an afterlife or God?? what planet have you grown up on then? If by "verifiable" you mean some scientists have produced a material experiment verifying the existence of God or spirituality then no, but if you mean verifiable as in personal witness, observation and experience then there is more evidence for it than any other topic or subject hands down.

No, you won't find any finger prints or hair samples for God or spirits and you won't find any lab experiments conducted by secular scientists that confirm the existence of God for you but you WILL find that the evidence, witness and support for the existence of a spiritual dimension undeniable, or at the least a head turner. I'd be lying to say spirits don't exist because I've seen them.
Look at the continuity and consistency in NDE's and spiritual experiences that all support the existence of an afterlife, sorry but delusions and imagination will never adequately account for the remarkable continuity of an after life and the existence of spiritual beings and most certainly not all spiritual people are nuts or crazy.
Look at all the religions all over the world and people who attempt to interpret the spiritual realms, all the cultures, tribes, countries and historical figures throughout our entire history testify to an afterlife or a Creator to the point it makes atheism/materialism extraordinary. There is more literature, eye witnesses, personal testimonies, spiritual experiences and accounts for an afterlife and God than any other discussion, sorry but mental illness does not account for such stability and reality.
Don't forget the theological, philosophical and logical support for a created existence so let's not pretend your materialistic world view has more "support" or credibility than Theism. Actually according to all the statistics between people, materialism is the absurd claim so it's not the claims of an afterlife or a Creator that are lacking support, it's the other way around.
Theism has more support than any one single ideology or theory therefore it is misleading to say there is no evidence or support for it, that is absurd and if were true we could all pack up and go home.

As far as your last statement, when was the last time you applied anything Jesus taught to come to the conclusion it's "less than credible"?? maybe it's your perception/perspective getting in the way?
Chloe8
Posts: 2,579
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3/15/2016 6:24:44 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Atheists are on average more intelligent than Christians.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Another way of looking at it is to show that as development of a country improves atheism increases.

http://www.humanreligions.info...

People with higher iq levels (115+) are more likely to be atheists.
DavidHenson
Posts: 446
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3/15/2016 6:37:00 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Well, the atheists, you know, they're hip to all the fool proof tests of scientific doo-dads and book learnin' and they sure wouldn't be fooled by no awful study just because it made them feel smarter than those Christians.
"Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty." - Frank Herbert, Chapterhouse: Dune
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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3/15/2016 7:54:39 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Here ya go newlife.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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3/15/2016 7:55:33 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
"10 highest IQ's, 8 are Theists, 6 Christians"

http://www.examiner.com...
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
famousdebater
Posts: 3,934
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3/15/2016 7:59:49 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Well I'm an atheist but I've never claimed or believed that atheists are smarter than Christians. I don't really think that it has anything to do with religion. I don't think that atheists are smarter than Christians. I also don't think that Christians are smarter than atheists. It's not really about religion in my opinion. It's about education level, upbringing, environment, friends, etc.
"Life calls the tune, we dance."
John Galsworthy
NewLifeChristian
Posts: 1,236
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3/16/2016 12:22:26 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:59:42 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

An intelligent person would see that Zuckerman's study was not flawed nor is it completely bunk, they would also see the geeky christian did not do a good job at pointing out any flaws.
It is flawed, and I can tell that you didn't bother to do your research on Zuckerman's study. In his study, he defined atheism as "non-religiosity", and "religiosity" means "excessively religious", so Christians who don't regularly attend church could full under the category of "non-religiosity". In addition to this, "religion" could also mean organized religion to some, and there are many Christians out there who don't belong to an organized religious sect. So, non-denominational Christians could fall under the category of "non-religiosity", as well. For us to come to the conclusion that atheists are, on average, more intelligent than Christians, we would have to actually use the word "atheist" in a study showing that atheists are more intelligent than Christians.
Pro-Life Quotes:

"I've noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born."
- Ronald Reagan

"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only object of good government."
- Thomas Jefferson

"A person is a person no matter how small."
- Dr. Seuss
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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3/16/2016 12:31:48 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 6:24:44 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Atheists are on average more intelligent than Christians.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Another way of looking at it is to show that as development of a country improves atheism increases.

http://www.humanreligions.info...

People with higher iq levels (115+) are more likely to be atheists.

Even if one accepts that on average atheist are more intelligent than Christians. That does not mean you are more intelligent for being an Atheist.
matt8800
Posts: 2,077
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3/16/2016 12:48:17 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 12:31:48 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 3/15/2016 6:24:44 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Atheists are on average more intelligent than Christians.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Another way of looking at it is to show that as development of a country improves atheism increases.

http://www.humanreligions.info...

People with higher iq levels (115+) are more likely to be atheists.

Even if one accepts that on average atheist are more intelligent than Christians. That does not mean you are more intelligent for being an Atheist.

That is correct. Conversely, someone does not necessarily have a lower IQ for being a Christian.

In my opinion, faith and critical thought are incompatible. People with higher IQs are MORE LIKELY to value critical thought resulting in LESS LIKELY acceptance of faith without evidence.

The worldview does not cause the IQ. The IQ has somewhat of an influence on what worldview they accept.
matt8800
Posts: 2,077
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3/16/2016 12:53:45 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Newlifechristian, if you would like to find someone to debate this topic with you, Id be happy to volunteer :)
Mhykiel
Posts: 5,987
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3/16/2016 12:58:49 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 12:48:17 AM, matt8800 wrote:
At 3/16/2016 12:31:48 AM, Mhykiel wrote:
At 3/15/2016 6:24:44 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Atheists are on average more intelligent than Christians.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

Another way of looking at it is to show that as development of a country improves atheism increases.

http://www.humanreligions.info...

People with higher iq levels (115+) are more likely to be atheists.

Even if one accepts that on average atheist are more intelligent than Christians. That does not mean you are more intelligent for being an Atheist.

That is correct. Conversely, someone does not necessarily have a lower IQ for being a Christian.

In my opinion, faith and critical thought are incompatible. People with higher IQs are MORE LIKELY to value critical thought resulting in LESS LIKELY acceptance of faith without evidence.

The worldview does not cause the IQ. The IQ has somewhat of an influence on what worldview they accept.

And the assumption the Atheist here are trying to push is that someone with a high IQ is more apt to choose a correct world view.

And to reject the highly intelligent theist as being really smart people but are still wrong.

So to the atheist what is the argument here? An argument to the authority of high IQ people? or is it an argument to the majority opinion of a high IQ population?

Neither such things could be a fallacy. Not from the self righteous, ego centric Atheist camp.
NewLifeChristian
Posts: 1,236
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3/16/2016 1:05:32 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 6:24:44 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Atheists are on average more intelligent than Christians.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

I hate to break it to you bud, but the Daily Mail isn't exactly a reliable website . . . It's a fringe used-to-be Nazi-sympathizing tabloid that has almost zero reputability. Even your friends at "RationalWiki" agree with me. Just look up their article on the Daily Mail!

Another way of looking at it is to show that as development of a country improves atheism increases.

http://www.humanreligions.info...

People with higher iq levels (115+) are more likely to be atheists.
Yeah, that is definitely up for debate. The United States has always been a great nation, and it was even better (fiscally and morally) when Christians were a larger majority. Now with the rise in atheism, the debt seems to be climbing as well. :-)
Pro-Life Quotes:

"I've noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born."
- Ronald Reagan

"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only object of good government."
- Thomas Jefferson

"A person is a person no matter how small."
- Dr. Seuss
NewLifeChristian
Posts: 1,236
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3/16/2016 1:06:37 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 7:55:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"10 highest IQ's, 8 are Theists, 6 Christians"

http://www.examiner.com...
Exactly, I wish atheists would look at this study . . .
Pro-Life Quotes:

"I've noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born."
- Ronald Reagan

"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only object of good government."
- Thomas Jefferson

"A person is a person no matter how small."
- Dr. Seuss
NewLifeChristian
Posts: 1,236
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3/16/2016 1:10:31 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 7:59:49 PM, famousdebater wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Well I'm an atheist but I've never claimed or believed that atheists are smarter than Christians. I don't really think that it has anything to do with religion. I don't think that atheists are smarter than Christians. I also don't think that Christians are smarter than atheists. It's not really about religion in my opinion. It's about education level, upbringing, environment, friends, etc.
I'm glad you understand . . . Many atheists use this bogus study to demean Christians by telling them that they are less intelligent than atheists. And yes, I would have to agree with you that there is really no correlation between religion and intelligence, just like there's no correlation between race and intelligence. (I don't care what those fake studies published by racist "scientists" say about blacks and Latinos being "dumber" than non-Latino whites.)
Pro-Life Quotes:

"I've noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born."
- Ronald Reagan

"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only object of good government."
- Thomas Jefferson

"A person is a person no matter how small."
- Dr. Seuss
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
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3/16/2016 1:45:24 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...
Thoughts?
I think philosophers should in general, not offer scientific critique, since for most philosophers it's outside their professional expertise, and I wish more of them knew it.

My suggestion, NLC, is to survey the science literature yourself, and follow the scientific discussions.
NewLifeChristian
Posts: 1,236
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3/16/2016 2:35:26 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 12:53:45 AM, matt8800 wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Newlifechristian, if you would like to find someone to debate this topic with you, Id be happy to volunteer :)
Great! I'll debate you after I finish my debate with famousdebater.
Pro-Life Quotes:

"I've noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born."
- Ronald Reagan

"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only object of good government."
- Thomas Jefferson

"A person is a person no matter how small."
- Dr. Seuss
NewLifeChristian
Posts: 1,236
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3/16/2016 2:49:53 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 1:45:24 AM, RuvDraba wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...
Thoughts?
I think philosophers should in general, not offer scientific critique, since for most philosophers it's outside their professional expertise, and I wish more of them knew it.

My suggestion, NLC, is to survey the science literature yourself, and follow the scientific discussions.
I did my homework on Mr. Zuckerman's study and found a lot of flaws in it. Read my comment above.
Pro-Life Quotes:

"I've noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born."
- Ronald Reagan

"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only object of good government."
- Thomas Jefferson

"A person is a person no matter how small."
- Dr. Seuss
bulproof
Posts: 25,184
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3/16/2016 3:01:34 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 1:06:37 AM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
At 3/15/2016 7:55:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"10 highest IQ's, 8 are Theists, 6 Christians"

http://www.examiner.com...
Exactly, I wish atheists would look at this study . . .
You've got all that on your side and your "average" is still lower. I don't think you should brag.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
NewLifeChristian
Posts: 1,236
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3/16/2016 3:02:43 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 3:01:34 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/16/2016 1:06:37 AM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
At 3/15/2016 7:55:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"10 highest IQ's, 8 are Theists, 6 Christians"

http://www.examiner.com...
Exactly, I wish atheists would look at this study . . .
You've got all that on your side and your "average" is still lower. I don't think you should brag.
Yeah, that "study" that "proves" that atheists are smarter than Christians is nonsense. You should read the article I posted originally.
Pro-Life Quotes:

"I've noticed that everyone who is for abortion has already been born."
- Ronald Reagan

"The care of human life and happiness, and not their destruction, is the first and only object of good government."
- Thomas Jefferson

"A person is a person no matter how small."
- Dr. Seuss
TBR
Posts: 9,991
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3/16/2016 3:04:03 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Well... Thoughts? OK. I will give some. Yea, atheists have higher IQs. There have been a number of studies that say this.

Things is. Its a bit skewed to start. What I am saying is, there are plenty of smart Christians. Being Christian does not make you necessary "dumb". Atheists (professed atheists) are generally better educated. What I am getting at is. The real take-away is, there is a big glut of low IQ people who are Christians, not that the upper-end of the scale is exclusive ground for atheists.
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
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3/16/2016 3:21:49 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 2:49:53 AM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
At 3/16/2016 1:45:24 AM, RuvDraba wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...
Thoughts?
I think philosophers should in general, not offer scientific critique, since for most philosophers it's outside their professional expertise, and I wish more of them knew it.

My suggestion, NLC, is to survey the science literature yourself, and follow the scientific discussions.
I did my homework on Mr. Zuckerman's study and found a lot of flaws in it. Read my comment above.
If you did your science homework NLC, then I wonder why you resorted to quoting a philosopher and not sociologists and psychologists who've had interest in the predictors of religiosity and irreligiosity for some years.

This matter has had substantial discussion both before and since Zuckerman's paper [http://psr.sagepub.com...] including work by Harris et al [http://journals.plos.org...], Shenhav et al [http://www.anth.uconn.edu...], Gervais et al [http://www2.psych.ubc.ca...], and Nyborg et al [http://www.sciencedirect.com...].

The findings aren't yet conclusive because -- as we might expect -- both intelligence and religiosity have multiple correlates. But there's enough to make it a legitimate scientific question, it's not warranted to call Zuckerman's paper a lie, and quoting philosophers and theologians on scientific matters isn't adequate rebuttal anyway.

Speaking personally, it does seem to me that religious thought isn't very compatible with well-developed strengths in analytic thinking. But that shouldn't be very surprising since most people adopt the beliefs of their parents -- and if people were thinking analytically about religion rather than being entrained to it, you'd expect a much higher rate of religious churn between faiths.

So being told that adopting your faith because your parents believed it isn't very intelligent shouldn't really offend anyone. And being told that if you questioned more you'd probably be less religious shouldn't really surprise or offend anyone.

And to be honest, NLC, as an atheist surrounded by faithful trying to tell me I'm doomed, hedonistic, nihilistic, incapable of moral thought and less trustworthy than a rapist simply because of my capacity to question and examine, I have very little sympathy for those complaining at how offensive it is to hear their ancient, erroneous, and frequently cruel, conceited and unjust beliefs are ignorant, superstitious and stupid.
bulproof
Posts: 25,184
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3/16/2016 3:46:40 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 3:02:43 AM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
At 3/16/2016 3:01:34 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 3/16/2016 1:06:37 AM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
At 3/15/2016 7:55:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"10 highest IQ's, 8 are Theists, 6 Christians"

http://www.examiner.com...
Exactly, I wish atheists would look at this study . . .
You've got all that on your side and your "average" is still lower. I don't think you should brag.
Yeah, that "study" that "proves" that atheists are smarter than Christians is nonsense. You should read the article I posted originally.
You don't understand average do you? You are obviously not the person to discuss IQ.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
missmedic
Posts: 385
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3/16/2016 7:26:46 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

You need to understand that the study was comparing groups not individuals.

Many people have low IQs, poor education, and or are just intellectually lazy, so along comes religion and offers to do the thinking for them, all they have to do is believe, no thinking required. So most of your low scorers prefer religion and that my friend is why your group scores lower. It is not because Atheists are smarter then Christians, we just have more smart people on our side.
Going from a Christian to an Atheist takes a bit of intellectual muscle, I did not choose not to believe, it is a result of what I have learned and how I reason. Religion does not withstand the scrutiny of the critical thinking intellect, however if you supress that part of your mind (or don't care to use it) when it comes to belief, then religion is right for you. Faith is not a reliable path to knowledge, and I want knowledge not faith because I would rather know the world through natural explanations then believe in the supernatural and the lack of explanations.
Chloe8
Posts: 2,579
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3/16/2016 8:21:53 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 1:05:32 AM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
At 3/15/2016 6:24:44 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

Atheists are on average more intelligent than Christians.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk...

I hate to break it to you bud, but the Daily Mail isn't exactly a reliable website . . . It's a fringe used-to-be Nazi-sympathizing tabloid that has almost zero reputability. Even your friends at "RationalWiki" agree with me. Just look up their article on the Daily Mail!

I actually live in the UK. The daily mail is certainly not Nazi sympathizing! That is a silly unfounded lie. It is the second biggest UK newspaper by daily circulation so claiming it is a fringe website shows your lack of knowledge. It is a typical right wing news paper. I could have provided very similar articles from left wing or centrist newspapers but assumed a Christman would give more value to a right wing source. You must be very far to the left if you think the daily mail is an extremist source!

http://www.independent.co.uk...

http://m.huffpost.com...

Another way of looking at it is to show that as development of a country improves atheism increases.

http://www.humanreligions.info...

People with higher iq levels (115+) are more likely to be atheists.
Yeah, that is definitely up for debate. The United States has always been a great nation, and it was even better (fiscally and morally) when Christians were a larger majority. Now with the rise in atheism, the debt seems to be climbing as well. :-)

Christians are still a huge majority in the USA. Name some important government figures who are atheists. I'm not from the USA but as far as I know all your mainstream politicians are Christians. So you can't blame atheists for the stagnant low growth high debt economy. Blame Barack Obama (a christian).
tarantula
Posts: 849
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3/16/2016 8:30:25 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/15/2016 6:20:52 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:36:05 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 3/15/2016 5:31:41 PM, NewLifeChristian wrote:
Atheists are not smarter than Christians. This is something I have been hearing for a while now, but its simply not true. The study, which was done by Miron Zuckerman, had many flaws and is completely bunk . . . Anyway, "Geeky Christian", an online ministry, did a great job pointing out the flaws in the "study". You can read their take on this here: http://geekychristian.com...

Thoughts?

There is no verifiable evidence to support the existence of a god or afterlife. There is no verifiable evidence that the less than credible stories attributed to Jesus are true.

Well.......I guess you can go home now then why discuss it? lol.

....but.... "No verifiable evidence" to support the existence of an afterlife or God?? what planet have you grown up on then? If by "verifiable" you mean some scientists have produced a material experiment verifying the existence of God or spirituality then no, but if you mean verifiable as in personal witness, observation and experience then there is more evidence for it than any other topic or subject hands down.

No, you won't find any finger prints or hair samples for God or spirits and you won't find any lab experiments conducted by secular scientists that confirm the existence of God for you but you WILL find that the evidence, witness and support for the existence of a spiritual dimension undeniable, or at the least a head turner. I'd be lying to say spirits don't exist because I've seen them.
Look at the continuity and consistency in NDE's and spiritual experiences that all support the existence of an afterlife, sorry but delusions and imagination will never adequately account for the remarkable continuity of an after life and the existence of spiritual beings and most certainly not all spiritual people are nuts or crazy.
Look at all the religions all over the world and people who attempt to interpret the spiritual realms, all the cultures, tribes, countries and historical figures throughout our entire history testify to an afterlife or a Creator to the point it makes atheism/materialism extraordinary. There is more literature, eye witnesses, personal testimonies, spiritual experiences and accounts for an afterlife and God than any other discussion, sorry but mental illness does not account for such stability and reality.
Don't forget the theological, philosophical and logical support for a created existence so let's not pretend your materialistic world view has more "support" or credibility than Theism. Actually according to all the statistics between people, materialism is the absurd claim so it's not the claims of an afterlife or a Creator that are lacking support, it's the other way around.
Theism has more support than any one single ideology or theory therefore it is misleading to say there is no evidence or support for it, that is absurd and if were true we could all pack up and go home.

As far as your last statement, when was the last time you applied anything Jesus taught to come to the conclusion it's "less than credible"?? maybe it's your perception/perspective getting in the way?

Jesus is reported as having said some things which were sensible, but others which were crass and stupid, imo. But as a mere human he made mistakes just like the rest of us.