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4 Arguments for Same-Sex Marriage

popculturepooka
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3/16/2016 3:45:59 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
"1. Apples and Oranges
Similar to the Copernican Revolution, when we came to recognize that the earth revolves around the sun, humanity has only just come to recognize sexual orientation as a durable and intrinsic feature of human sexuality. That is, sexual orientation is not a choice and it's not amenable to change.

Consequently, when the biblical authors, in both the Old and New Testaments, observed sexual activity they could only explain what they were seeing through the only lens they had, that of disordered and excessive sexual desire. That was the only reasonable explanation, in the eyes of the biblical writers, for why men would desire sex with men. Or women with women. What was being condemned in the Bible was this excessive and disordered sexual desire, desires deemed, given the science of the time, as being "contrary to nature."

We're in a very different situation today with our modern understanding of sexual orientation. When a teenage boy or girl, often raised in good, stable Christian homes, begins to experience same-sex desire during puberty we don't see those desires as intrinsically disordered or "contrary to nature." Even many conservative Christians have stopped condemning these desires as "unnatural."

All that to say, what the Bible condemns when in comes to human sexuality is licentiousness, sexual lust run amok. For the ancients, homosexuality appeared to be one among many examples of licentiousness, sexual desires so excessive and out of control that men could get to the point of desiring sex with other men.

An affirming position regarding same-sex marriage comes alongside the Bible in condemning licentiousness, same-sex and straight manifestations of it. But the affirming position recognizes that a same-sex couple who pledges life-long and monogamous fidelity to each other in the Christian sacrament of marriage don't fit what the Bible is condemning. It's apples and oranges. If anything, given that we recognize sexual orientation as natural (as even many conservative Christians now do), and that the marriage covenant is devoted to disciplining our sexuality--training eros to become agape--married same-sex Christians are the exact opposite of what the Bible is condemning.

Again, apples and oranges. What the Bible is condemning isn't what we're talking about in affirming same-sex Christian marriage.

As an example of this argument see Matthew Vines' God and the Gay Christian.

2. Marriage as Grace
"Male and female God created them" and "Be fruitful and multiply." Non-affirming views of same-sex marriage root their views of marriage in biological complementarity and biological reproduction. Marriage is between a man and a woman. In this Adam and Eve become the model of marriage, what we mean when we say that a marriage reflects the Image of God.

Affirming views of same-sex marriage argue, however, that there is another marriage found in the Bible, the marriage between God and Israel. This marriage is not based upon biology but upon election and grace. In this marriage the Image of God is witnessed in covenantal fidelity.

The primacy of grace over biology is also highlighted by Paul when he discusses the inclusion of the Gentiles into the church, the non-biological children who are grafted into Israel "contrary to nature" via the grace and election of God. This grace is also displayed in the family of the church, a family not formed through biology but through the Spirit and our pledges of covenantal fidelity to God and each other.

In short, an affirming position of same-sex marriage argues that marriages can reflect the Image of God in different ways. There are marriages and families in the Bible that are born out of grace and covenantal fidelity rather than biology.

As an example of this argument see Eugene Rogers' Sexuality and the Christian Body or Rowan Williams' essay "The Body's Grace."

3. The Holy Spirit Changing a Literal and Traditional Reading of the Bible
A huge hermeneutical crisis faced the early church when the Holy Spirit fell upon Cornelius and his household in Acts 10 and Peter allowed them to be baptized, formally bringing the Gentiles into the church and recognizing them as co-heirs of the covenant God made to Abraham. This was a hermeneutical crisis so big it split the church.

The issue was that circumcision was proclaimed by God to be an "everlasting" sign "in the flesh" of the covenant between God and Israel (Gen. 17.13). A plain and literal reading of the text argued that the Gentiles, therefore, would have to be circumcised to gain access to the promises made by God to Abraham.

And yet, the Holy Spirit was being poured out upon the uncircumcised. God was doing a new thing. Not just with Cornelius, but also with the Gentile converts in Antioch. How was the church to reconcile a plain, literal and centuries old traditional reading of the Bible in light of what was happening among the Gentile converts?

The issue came to a head in Acts 15 in what we call the First Apostolic Counsel. There the issues were debated--literal and traditional readings of Scripture clashing with experiences and testimony about the Holy Spirit at work among the uncircumcised. Hesitantly, the church decided in favor of experience and testimony over literal and traditional readings of Scripture.

In short, the Bible itself shows us how the action and activity of the Holy Spirit can guide the church toward different readings of Scripture, even overturning literal and traditional readings. Affirming views of same-sex marriage argue that something similar is happening in our time. We observe the fruits of the Spirit in same-sex unions, evidences of holiness, fidelity and grace. The same way the early Jewish Christians saw the fruits of the Spirit manifest among a group they knew to be--because the Bible told them so--sexually depraved and under the judgment and wrath of God.

For an example of this argument see Luke Timothy Johnson's Scripture and Discernment.

4. Love and Liberation
The fourth argument for an affirming position regarding same-sex marriage is a direct appeal to the Golden Rule: Love your neighbor as you love yourself.

In some hands this appeal is a simple appeal to love and compassion in embracing our shared humanity as beloved children of God in affirming same-sex marriages. 1 John 4.8: "Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love."

In other hands, the appeal is for justice, often informed by a biblical and prophetic appeal to liberation theology: God's preferential option for those who are oppressed and suffering. Following the Hebrew prophets and Jesus' Nazareth Manifesto (Luke 4.16-21), the Bible must be read as "good news" for those who are suffering in the world due to hate, violence, oppression and marginalization. As it says in Romans 13.10: "Love does no harm to a neighbor."

For an example of this argument, on the love side more than liberation, see Gene Robinson's God Believes in Love.

Affirming Christian arguments for same-sex marriages, I told the evangelical organization, generally use one or some mixture of these four arguments. The arguments are nuanced, supplemented and blended in various ways, but these are the four recurring arguments.

For example, you can make the appeal for compassion and justice (Argument #4) more compelling and urgent by citing statistics about gay teen suicide and homelessness. The argument that the activity of the Holy Spirit affects how we read Scripture (Argument #3) can be supported in a variety of ways. A common example is how the Holy Spirit convicted the church about slavery. Evidences for how sexual orientation is now understood to be a natural and durable feature of our sexuality (Argument #1) and stories of the Spirit's fruits exhibited among gay Christians and same-sex couples (Arguments #2 and #3) are often given in memoir form (see Justin Lee's Torn)."

Thoughts?
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
Maikuru
Posts: 9,112
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3/16/2016 3:48:00 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 3:46:16 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
http://experimentaltheology.blogspot.com...

It's from here btw.

How often do you get in disagreements irl about same-sex marriage and your religious beliefs?
"You assume I wouldn't want to burn this whole place to the ground."
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popculturepooka
Posts: 7,924
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3/16/2016 3:56:16 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 3:48:00 PM, Maikuru wrote:
At 3/16/2016 3:46:16 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
http://experimentaltheology.blogspot.com...

It's from here btw.

How often do you get in disagreements irl about same-sex marriage and your religious beliefs?

At least once a month. Although, as far as I know, I dont hang Mainly when I go to my parents church with them on occasion. I've succeeded in changing their minds though.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
12_13
Posts: 1,361
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3/16/2016 9:40:26 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 3:45:59 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
That is, sexual orientation is not a choice

I don"t believe that. If person doesn"t want to do homosexual act, he doesn"t do that. If person want to do so, he does so. Therefore it is a choice. What causes person want something can be changed. People are not mindless idiots and can really rationalize things and think what is wise and do accordingly.

But obviously it can be difficult, if person is brainwashed in young age to believe nonsense.

4. Love and Liberation
The fourth argument for an affirming position regarding same-sex marriage is a direct appeal to the Golden Rule: Love your neighbor as you love yourself.

If person loves as God has commanded, he wants to prevent people to do things against God"s will.
graceofgod
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3/16/2016 9:51:25 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
you can argue by today's standards that same sex marriage is acceptable but you cannot balance it with what the bible teaches and to do so is wrong... the bible is quite clear what marriage is and that is between man and woman...
popculturepooka
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3/17/2016 12:26:22 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 9:40:26 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/16/2016 3:45:59 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
That is, sexual orientation is not a choice

I don"t believe that. If person doesn"t want to do homosexual act, he doesn"t do that. If person want to do so, he does so. Therefore it is a choice.

Did you choose to be heterosexual? If you have never had heterosexual sex in your life, but still have heterosexual urges, did you choose to be orientated that way?

What causes person want something can be changed. People are not mindless idiots and can really rationalize things and think what is wise and do accordingly.

But obviously it can be difficult, if person is brainwashed in young age to believe nonsense.

4. Love and Liberation
The fourth argument for an affirming position regarding same-sex marriage is a direct appeal to the Golden Rule: Love your neighbor as you love yourself.

If person loves as God has commanded, he wants to prevent people to do things against God"s will.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
popculturepooka
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3/17/2016 1:41:33 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 9:51:25 PM, graceofgod wrote:
you can argue by today's standards that same sex marriage is acceptable but you cannot balance it with what the bible teaches and to do so is wrong... the bible is quite clear what marriage is and that is between man and woman...

Did you read it? One of the arguments goes that they really aren't even talking about the same thing. That'd be like going to the bible to find out what Jesus thought about the ethicality of driving cars specifically.
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
Hayd
Posts: 4,022
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3/17/2016 2:24:11 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 9:40:26 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/16/2016 3:45:59 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
That is, sexual orientation is not a choice

I don"t believe that. If person doesn"t want to do homosexual act, he doesn"t do that. If person want to do so, he does so. Therefore it is a choice. What causes person want something can be changed. People are not mindless idiots and can really rationalize things and think what is wise and do accordingly.

This is blatant straw man fallacy. The OP did not claim homosexual acts was not a choice, they said sexual orientation was not. There is no rationalizing, there are not even any actions. THis is absurd

But obviously it can be difficult, if person is brainwashed in young age to believe nonsense.

What do you mean by this? That at a young age someone is deliberately brainwashing there children to be gay because they want them to be treated like second-hand citizens? This is one of the most idiotic things Ive heard in a while.
Hayd
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3/17/2016 2:25:07 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 9:51:25 PM, graceofgod wrote:
you can argue by today's standards that same sex marriage is acceptable but you cannot balance it with what the bible teaches and to do so is wrong... the bible is quite clear what marriage is and that is between man and woman...

Yes, its also clear that all gay people should be stoned to death. Do you agree with that passage?
12_13
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3/17/2016 8:57:56 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 12:26:22 AM, popculturepooka wrote:
Did you choose to be heterosexual? If you have never had heterosexual sex in your life, but still have heterosexual urges, did you choose to be orientated that way?

I choose what I want. I deside what I do. I am not programmed to do anything.
12_13
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3/17/2016 8:59:44 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 2:24:11 AM, Hayd wrote:
.... said sexual orientation was not.

What do you mean with orientation?

I think sexuality can be compared to taste for food. If I like more strawberries than vanilla, isn"t that also orientation? Isn"t it based on what I like? On what is that what I like based? It is based on the attributes of the matter. For some reason I like the attributes that something has. It can be changed by showing some attributes bad, or by showing some attributes good and therefrore desirable. Person can be made to like different matters by making him see something desirable in that. And person can be made dislike something by makind him see something unpleasant or traumatic in that. I am sure that when person becomes homosexual, it comes by learning that it is nicer than the other option. That is also because children are not sexual. It develops when child grows. And that development can be distorted. But when it has hapenned, it is more dificult to change. It is easier to learn when young than when person is grown up and ideas have come solid.

Young people can be quided to become homosexual by making them learn to like it. And it seems to me that media is nowadays actively making homosexuality desirable and in my opnion it is bad.

What do you mean by this? That at a young age someone is deliberately brainwashing there children to be gay because they want them to be treated like second-hand citizens? This is one of the most idiotic things Ive heard in a while.

World has many people that want to limit population growth. Promoting homosexuality is one way to do that.

And it seems to me that homosexuals are at the moment first class citisens that are tried to be protected even from wrong opinions.
Jovian
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3/17/2016 10:00:19 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 8:59:44 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/17/2016 2:24:11 AM, Hayd wrote:
What do you mean by this? That at a young age someone is deliberately brainwashing there children to be gay because they want them to be treated like second-hand citizens? This is one of the most idiotic things Ive heard in a while.

World has many people that want to limit population growth. Promoting homosexuality is one way to do that.

And I don't really think you genuinely care about 100 000 babies failed to be conceived. A big loss to our scarcely populated barren world indeed.

And it seems to me that homosexuals are at the moment first class citisens that are tried to be protected even from wrong opinions.

They are first class citizens indeed. Just check the high rates of hate crimes made against them.
Double_R
Posts: 4,886
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3/28/2016 11:39:41 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 1:41:33 AM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 3/16/2016 9:51:25 PM, graceofgod wrote:
you can argue by today's standards that same sex marriage is acceptable but you cannot balance it with what the bible teaches and to do so is wrong... the bible is quite clear what marriage is and that is between man and woman...

Did you read it?

Of course not. Too many words for him...
skipsaweirdo
Posts: 1,863
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3/28/2016 11:42:01 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 3:56:16 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
At 3/16/2016 3:48:00 PM, Maikuru wrote:
At 3/16/2016 3:46:16 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
http://experimentaltheology.blogspot.com...

It's from here btw.

How often do you get in disagreements irl about same-sex marriage and your religious beliefs?

At least once a month. Although, as far as I know, I dont hang Mainly when I go to my parents church with them on occasion. I've succeeded in changing their minds though.
Marriage in America is and has always been nothing more than a contractual agreement among adults. It's always been legal for any 2 adults to get married if you consider it a constitutional issue as it is. You'll find that insurance companies exploited religious right law makers to obscure the issue. Once it became or was moving towards Obama Care the fight by the insurance companies was no longer needed because they now have a federal law that makes everyone have to pay for their services. Insurance companies simply didn't want to accept a same sex couple as being eligible for one or the others insurance policy through employer. That's why they lobbied religious lawmakers to make it "religious". No one can deny a government contract to anyone based on sex, any contract marriage or otherwise. Just another example of how Americans literally are led by the idiocy of ideology instead of the actual issue or laws.
RuvDraba
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3/28/2016 11:49:50 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 3:45:59 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
"1. Apples and Oranges
2. Marriage as Grace
3. The Holy Spirit Changing a Literal and Traditional Reading of the Bible
4. Love and Liberation
Thoughts?

As thoughtful are these theological expositions, PCP, what about the most basic moral notion here...

As dearly as many Christians hold it, epistemologically, the authenticity of the Bible, and its accuracy cannot be more than a conjecture in most cases, and therefore the existence of and human knowledge of an Abrahamic God cannot be more than conjecture either.

That being so, it is downright evil to claim the authority of conjecture to the extent of doing harm to another human being.

So it boils down to this: no matter how dearly you love the conjectures of your canon, don't be a paternalistic prat when it comes to interfering the lives of fellow humans.
Mhykiel
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3/29/2016 2:56:18 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/16/2016 3:45:59 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
"1. Apples and Oranges
Similar to the Copernican Revolution, when we came to recognize that the earth revolves around the sun, humanity has only just come to recognize sexual orientation as a durable and intrinsic feature of human sexuality. That is, sexual orientation is not a choice and it's not amenable to change.
...

The Bible speaks of sexual desire as a choice, that men and women can turn their hearts to sexual immorality.

You have no substantial evidence that sexual desire like homosexuality, bestiality, necrophilia, pedophilia are anything but choices. At least they are as much a choice as Alcoholism, bulimia, anorexia.. People are born with a tri-fold persona composed of nurture, nature, and choice.

It's also interesting to note that the legal batteles to recognize homosexuality as anything but a mental disorder, argued that it was a choice made by consenting sane adults. And yet now LGBQTI are saying it is not a choice. AND YET it is fluid. I've seen it argued that our sexuality, our gender is fluid and that at different stages of our lifes it changes.

When we talk about things like downsyndrome being natural and not by choice, guess what? It doesn't change. But homosexuality according to the LGBQTI advocates is changing, fluid, vague, unpredictable. Those are the properties of confusion. not nature. (http://www.theglobeandmail.com...)

2. Marriage as Grace

Israel is pronoun-ed as feminine, same as with the Church. So even in the allegorical use of marriage as a description of 2 entities becoming one mind and body, is 2 entities male and female.

Jesus sermon about Marriage and Eunuchs reaffirm that Marriage is between 1 man and 1 woman for life.

Grace is the forgiveness that God gave for our sins. That isn't the marriage contract. Only once saved, once God ignores Sin, Only when Grace completed is a relationship even POSSIBLE.

So them marriage comes after grace.


3. The Holy Spirit Changing a Literal and Traditional Reading of the Bible

The crisis you speak of is why today we have terms like "the New covenant". But the Torah was taken Literally by the a few sects, The very sects Jesus called Hypocrites. But none of the old testament or Torah was done away with. It was completed.

And when we look at the regulations around circumcision we have one's like

So He let him alone. At that time she said, "You are a bridegroom of blood "-- because of the circumcision. - Exodus 4.26

"A servant who is born in your house or who is bought with your money shall surely be circumcised; thus shall My covenant be in your flesh for an everlasting covenant. 14"But an uncircumcised male who is not circumcised in the flesh of his foreskin, that person shall be cut off from his people; he has broken My covenant." - Genesis 17.14

In addition to all your other detestable practices, you brought foreigners uncircumcised in heart and flesh into my sanctuary, desecrating my temple while you offered me food, fat and blood, and you broke my covenant. - Ezekiel 44.7

Again we see that the "New Covenant" is actual more specifically talking about circumcision. But it doesn't do away with the old regulations, they just are not of concern anymore. The covenant was to set God's people the Israelite apart from the rest of the world. Holy means separate.

And the gentiles and Jews both are brought into the family of God. to be a bride groom. The circumcision was a covenant made by flesh and blood, that is now achieved by the flesh and blood of Christ.

Now.. being uncircumcised isn't immoral. Being circumcised not unsinful. Circumcision was an act of public display. A physical representation of a spiritual destiny of the Israelite people. It wasn't sinful for a Gentile in Rome to be uncircumcised.

But it is always sinful to worship idols. It is a sin the gentiles commit. A Gentile who isn't a believer in the Israelite God who fornicated in orgies would be committing a sin.

So Sinful acts don't matter if you are part of God's people or Not. And in this regard homosexuality falls into the latter group. It is always revered to as sinful, as sexual immorality not because of a stipulation on the Israelite people to keep Moses Law. But because the action itself is abhorrent to God.


4. Love and Liberation

"Love thy neighbor as thyself".. Does it mean all actions are permissible under God's love? What's to stop using this same argument for any other action?

Paul warns tho all is permissible not all is beneficial.

What shall we say then? Are we to continue in sin so that grace may increase? 2May it never be! How shall we who died to sin still live in it? - Romans 6.2
Mhykiel
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3/29/2016 3:04:36 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 2:24:11 AM, Hayd wrote:
At 3/16/2016 9:40:26 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/16/2016 3:45:59 PM, popculturepooka wrote:
That is, sexual orientation is not a choice

I don"t believe that. If person doesn"t want to do homosexual act, he doesn"t do that. If person want to do so, he does so. Therefore it is a choice. What causes person want something can be changed. People are not mindless idiots and can really rationalize things and think what is wise and do accordingly.

This is blatant straw man fallacy. The OP did not claim homosexual acts was not a choice, they said sexual orientation was not. There is no rationalizing, there are not even any actions. THis is absurd

The people that have chosen to commit homosexual acts, shocker, have homosexual desires.

The desires encourage the acts and as external entities unable to read minds, the external acts are our best judge of mental state and intention.

Even if the desire is not a choice, it doesn't make it morally right. Doesn't make it socially acceptable.


But obviously it can be difficult, if person is brainwashed in young age to believe nonsense.

What do you mean by this? That at a young age someone is deliberately brainwashing there children to be gay because they want them to be treated like second-hand citizens? This is one of the most idiotic things Ive heard in a while.

I seen some stuff that would make me think some parents are doing that. Like raising kids to be the next baseball star, having a sexually confused kid and being okay with it is vogue.
popculturepooka
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3/29/2016 6:36:27 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 8:57:56 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/17/2016 12:26:22 AM, popculturepooka wrote:
Did you choose to be heterosexual? If you have never had heterosexual sex in your life, but still have heterosexual urges, did you choose to be orientated that way?

I choose what I want. I deside what I do. I am not programmed to do anything.

You chose to be heterosexual?
At 10/3/2016 11:49:13 PM, thett3 wrote:
BLACK LIVES MATTER!
autocorrect
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3/29/2016 6:50:33 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
I've had a question on this subject percolating in the back of my mind for some time now; waiting for an opportunity to be asked. I should probably first say, I don't care what consenting adults do to eachother in the privacy of their own bedrooms. It's not my business. However...

Is it not the case that sexuality is a spectrum, and also - subject to formative influences? Thus, a child born with a mid-range sexuality as a consequence of nature - may be pushed either way by nurture?
someloser
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3/29/2016 7:26:38 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/29/2016 6:50:33 AM, autocorrect wrote:
Is it not the case that sexuality is a spectrum, and also - subject to formative influences? Thus, a child born with a mid-range sexuality as a consequence of nature - may be pushed either way by nurture?

Generally: no and no.
Ego sum qui sum. Deus lo vult.

"America is ungovernable; those who served the revolution have plowed the sea." - Simon Bolivar

"A healthy nation is as unconscious of its nationality as a healthy man of his bones. But if you break a nation's nationality it will think of nothing else but getting it set again." - George Bernard Shaw
autocorrect
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3/29/2016 7:33:25 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/29/2016 7:26:38 AM, someloser wrote:
At 3/29/2016 6:50:33 AM, autocorrect wrote:
Is it not the case that sexuality is a spectrum, and also - subject to formative influences? Thus, a child born with a mid-range sexuality as a consequence of nature - may be pushed either way by nurture?

Generally: no and no.

What's your basis for this answer?
someloser
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3/29/2016 7:37:15 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/29/2016 7:33:25 AM, autocorrect wrote:

What's your basis for this answer?

Sexuality does not generally function as a spectrum in de-facto reality, and nurture does not do much in the majority of cases.
Ego sum qui sum. Deus lo vult.

"America is ungovernable; those who served the revolution have plowed the sea." - Simon Bolivar

"A healthy nation is as unconscious of its nationality as a healthy man of his bones. But if you break a nation's nationality it will think of nothing else but getting it set again." - George Bernard Shaw
autocorrect
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3/29/2016 7:44:51 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/29/2016 7:37:15 AM, someloser wrote:
At 3/29/2016 7:33:25 AM, autocorrect wrote:

What's your basis for this answer?

Sexuality does not generally function as a spectrum in de-facto reality, and nurture does not do much in the majority of cases.

That's an elaboration, not an explanation of the basis upon which you refute my understanding of these issues.
someloser
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3/29/2016 8:17:54 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/29/2016 7:44:51 AM, autocorrect wrote:
That's an elaboration, not an explanation of the basis upon which you refute my understanding of these issues.

No.. it is the basis. It's observable that sexuality does not function as a spectrum - the majority of people identify as heterosexual, a tiny minority are homosexual or bisexual, and an even tinier one (whose existence is under mild dispute) may be somewhere in between the others.

As for nurture v nature, I've yet to see any evidence that suggests nurture has influenced the sexuality of people more (or more regularly) than inborn factors.
Ego sum qui sum. Deus lo vult.

"America is ungovernable; those who served the revolution have plowed the sea." - Simon Bolivar

"A healthy nation is as unconscious of its nationality as a healthy man of his bones. But if you break a nation's nationality it will think of nothing else but getting it set again." - George Bernard Shaw
autocorrect
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3/29/2016 8:44:17 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/29/2016 8:17:54 AM, someloser wrote:
At 3/29/2016 7:44:51 AM, autocorrect wrote:
That's an elaboration, not an explanation of the basis upon which you refute my understanding of these issues.

No.. it is the basis. It's observable that sexuality does not function as a spectrum - the majority of people identify as heterosexual, a tiny minority are homosexual or bisexual, and an even tinier one (whose existence is under mild dispute) may be somewhere in between the others.

As for nurture v nature, I've yet to see any evidence that suggests nurture has influenced the sexuality of people more (or more regularly) than inborn factors.

Okay. So it's your opinion?! That's fine. I mean, my own knowledge of the subject is not grounded upon anything solid. I saw a documentary on the Kinsey Report, and I've seen the film. That's the basis of my question, and I'll be the first to admit that it's not very substantial. I'm very heterosexual myself - so I have no personal knowledge to rely on. But I believe the idea of sexuality as a spectrum is out there - it's not my own idea, and if it does come from Kinsey; to me, that's a slightly more authoritative source that your unsubstantiated opinion. No offence intended. You could be right for all I know, but until I know why you think what you think, it's difficult to tell what weight to attach to what you're saying.

Further, what I'm talking about is possibly in the realms of developmental psychology - such that, a survey of adults asked to identify their sexual preference, would have very little bearing on the question. My contention is that an adolescent may be quite undecided as to sexual preference, and impressionable - with regard to experiences, social attitudes and various other factors.