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Jesus's missing years.

Chloe8
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3/17/2016 7:26:59 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
In the gospels, there is only one account of Jesus"s life during the 30-year period between his birth and his baptism- an story in Luke that tells of him teaching in the temple. Given the majestic spectacle of his birth that included a star, a visitation of kings, and an area-wide massacre of infant children, it would seem that Jesus would have been quite famous even as a child growing up. There should have been myriad accounts of his childhood, not just in the gospels, but in other accounts as well. There have been many cases in history where children have been worshiped or received special attention for similar reasons.

The absence of childhood stories in the gospels points to the probable fact that Jesus was just a regular boy growing up in a small town working as a carpenter. Not until he began his ministry, probably as a disciple of John the Baptist, did the local populace begin to take notice. This presents a problem for Christianity. The spectacular features of his birth would seem to be nothing more than myths. Then there is the problem of God roaming the earth for 30 years without calling attention to himself. It all points to the highly likely fact that Jesus was just a normal human being who at around the age of 30 decided he wanted to become a preacher.
"I don't need experience.to knock you out. I'm a man. that's all I need to beat you and any woman."

Fatihah, in his delusion that he could knock out any woman while bragging about being able to knock me out. An example of 7th century Islamic thinking inspired by his hero the paedophile Muhammad.
DavidHenson
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3/17/2016 8:17:18 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 7:26:59 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
It all points to the highly likely fact that Jesus was just a normal human being who at around the age of 30 decided he wanted to become a preacher.

And here you are, 2, 000 years later, trying to convince everyone he never existed.

Kind'a funny, don't 'ya think?
"Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty." - Frank Herbert, Chapterhouse: Dune
Skepticalone
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3/17/2016 8:17:34 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 7:26:59 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
In the gospels, there is only one account of Jesus"s life during the 30-year period between his birth and his baptism- an story in Luke that tells of him teaching in the temple. Given the majestic spectacle of his birth that included a star, a visitation of kings, and an area-wide massacre of infant children, it would seem that Jesus would have been quite famous even as a child growing up. There should have been myriad accounts of his childhood, not just in the gospels, but in other accounts as well. There have been many cases in history where children have been worshiped or received special attention for similar reasons.

The absence of childhood stories in the gospels points to the probable fact that Jesus was just a regular boy growing up in a small town working as a carpenter. Not until he began his ministry, probably as a disciple of John the Baptist, did the local populace begin to take notice. This presents a problem for Christianity. The spectacular features of his birth would seem to be nothing more than myths. Then there is the problem of God roaming the earth for 30 years without calling attention to himself. It all points to the highly likely fact that Jesus was just a normal human being who at around the age of 30 decided he wanted to become a preacher.

This OP made me think of a book I read a few years back. "Lamb: The Gospel According to Biff, Christ's Childhood Pal"

http://www.audible.com...
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

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What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
Skepticalone
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3/17/2016 8:26:49 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 8:17:18 PM, DavidHenson wrote:
At 3/17/2016 7:26:59 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
It all points to the highly likely fact that Jesus was just a normal human being who at around the age of 30 decided he wanted to become a preacher.

And here you are, 2, 000 years later, trying to convince everyone he never existed.

Kind'a funny, don't 'ya think?

Actually, she stated he was normal.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
DavidHenson
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3/17/2016 8:45:51 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 8:26:49 PM, Skepticalone wrote:
Actually, she stated he was normal.

Nothing normal about that. How many other average preachers of that day do we still debate two millennial later?
"Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty." - Frank Herbert, Chapterhouse: Dune
Chloe8
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3/17/2016 8:51:41 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 8:17:18 PM, DavidHenson wrote:
At 3/17/2016 7:26:59 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
It all points to the highly likely fact that Jesus was just a normal human being who at around the age of 30 decided he wanted to become a preacher.

And here you are, 2, 000 years later, trying to convince everyone he never existed.

Kind'a funny, don't 'ya think?

I'm not claiming to be God. So what point are you trying to make?
"I don't need experience.to knock you out. I'm a man. that's all I need to beat you and any woman."

Fatihah, in his delusion that he could knock out any woman while bragging about being able to knock me out. An example of 7th century Islamic thinking inspired by his hero the paedophile Muhammad.
DavidHenson
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3/17/2016 8:54:58 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 8:51:41 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
I'm not claiming to be God. So what point are you trying to make?

You seem to be dismissing Jesus as just this average preacher of no significance, a difficult task, don't you think, since we are discussing and debating his life's work over two thousand years later?

Do you think they will be debating you or I two thousand years from now?
"Seek freedom and become captive of your desires. Seek discipline and find your liberty." - Frank Herbert, Chapterhouse: Dune
Skepticalone
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3/17/2016 8:55:35 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 8:45:51 PM, DavidHenson wrote:
At 3/17/2016 8:26:49 PM, Skepticalone wrote:
Actually, she stated he was normal.

Nothing normal about that. How many other average preachers of that day do we still debate two millennial later?

So, if an individual is remembered by history, they are supernatural? Great argument...
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
12_13
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3/17/2016 9:06:24 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 7:26:59 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
There should have been myriad accounts of his childhood

Why?

The absence of childhood stories in the gospels points to the probable fact that Jesus was just a regular boy growing up in a small town working as a carpenter.

Jesus could have been quite regular when young. I don"t see any problem in that. The point was tell the Gosple, when the time was right and it was doen. The point was not make cult and Jesus didn"t want earthly kingdom, even though it was also offered to him.
Chloe8
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3/17/2016 9:11:26 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 8:54:58 PM, DavidHenson wrote:
At 3/17/2016 8:51:41 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
I'm not claiming to be God. So what point are you trying to make?

You seem to be dismissing Jesus as just this average preacher of no significance, a difficult task, don't you think, since we are discussing and debating his life's work over two thousand years later?

Do you think they will be debating you or I two thousand years from now?

I highly doubt anyone will be interested in debating me or you in 2, 000 years time. It's true few people are remembered for more than a century after their death. However just because a lot of people believe in Christianity that does not mean it's credible. It's important to remember that Christianity became the state religion of the Roman empire which controlled most of Europe. Europe went on to colonize the world and spread Christianity. Quite simply if the Romans had chosen a different state religion you would believe in that instead. I bet if you were born in Egypt to Muslim parents you would be a Muslim, if you were born in India to Hindu parents you would be Hindu, if you were born in Sri Lanka to Buddhist parents you would be Buddhist. If I had been born hundreds of years ago before the means of questioning and understanding religion existed I too most likely would have followed the beliefs of my parents /culture.
"I don't need experience.to knock you out. I'm a man. that's all I need to beat you and any woman."

Fatihah, in his delusion that he could knock out any woman while bragging about being able to knock me out. An example of 7th century Islamic thinking inspired by his hero the paedophile Muhammad.
Chloe8
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3/17/2016 9:18:31 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 9:06:24 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/17/2016 7:26:59 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
There should have been myriad accounts of his childhood

Why?

Because he was supposedly god. You would think the presence of god in human form would have gathered a lot of attention and many stories.

The absence of childhood stories in the gospels points to the probable fact that Jesus was just a regular boy growing up in a small town working as a carpenter.

Jesus could have been quite regular when young. I don"t see any problem in that. The point was tell the Gosple, when the time was right and it was doen. The point was not make cult and Jesus didn"t want earthly kingdom, even though it was also offered to him.

Why would a god choose to live a regular unspectacular life? Jesus failed to fulfil Jewish prophecy to rule Israel as a king. Why would he not want an earthly kingdom? It's not logical. It was prophesied. Jesus achieved nothing during his time on earth.
"I don't need experience.to knock you out. I'm a man. that's all I need to beat you and any woman."

Fatihah, in his delusion that he could knock out any woman while bragging about being able to knock me out. An example of 7th century Islamic thinking inspired by his hero the paedophile Muhammad.
12_13
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3/17/2016 9:37:39 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 9:18:31 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
Because he was supposedly god.

On basis of what the Bible tells, he is the temple of God. Or more precisely, the corner stone of that temple.

Jesus said to them, "Have you never read in the Scriptures, "The stone that the builders rejected has become the cornerstone. This was the Lord's doing, and it is amazing in our eyes"? That is why I tell you that the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a people who will produce fruit for it. The person who falls over this stone will be broken to pieces, but it will crush anyone on whom it falls."
Matt. 21:42-44

Disciples of Jesus are the other stones.

You would think the presence of god in human form would have gathered a lot of attention and many stories.

Jesus was hated, so they could have also been destroyed and only the most important parts are left.

And also, the point was not his life, but the words he preached. The goal was to proclaim the Gosplel.

"The Spirit of the Lord is on me, Because he has anointed me to preach good news to the poor. He has sent me to heal the brokenhearted, To proclaim release to the captives, Recovering of sight to the blind, To deliver those who are crushed, And to proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord."
Luke 4:18-19

But he said to them, "I must preach the good news of the Kingdom of God to the other cities also. For this reason I have been sent."
Luke 4:43

You are too fucused on material world.

Why would a god choose to live a regular unspectacular life? Jesus failed to fulfil Jewish prophecy to rule Israel as a king. Why would he not want an earthly kingdom? It's not logical. It was prophesied. Jesus achieved nothing during his time on earth.

Jesus established the God"s Kingdom that still exists in all of his disciples.

Jesus answered, "My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, then my servants would fight, that I wouldn't be delivered to the Jews. But now my kingdom is not from here."
John 18:36

It is Kingdom of everlasting peace, and nothng can really destroy it. Most of people don"t have even idea where and what it is.

"The Kingdom of God doesn't come with observation; neither will they say, 'Look, here!' or, 'Look, there!' for behold, the Kingdom of God is within you."
Luke 17:20-21

Jesus answered him, "Most assuredly, I tell you, unless one is born anew, he can't see the Kingdom of God." Nicodemus said to him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb, and be born?" Jesus answered, "Most assuredly I tell you, unless one is born of water and spirit, he can't enter into the Kingdom of God! That which is born of the flesh is flesh. That which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Don't marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born anew.'
John 3:3-7

"Therefore don't be anxious, saying, 'What will we eat?', 'What will we drink?' or, 'With what will we be clothed?' For the Gentiles seek after all these things, for your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. But seek first God's Kingdom, and his righteousness; and all these things will be given to you as well.
Matthew 6:31-33

I keep Jesus as my King, so the kingdom lives also here. :)
Chloe8
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3/17/2016 9:56:03 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 9:37:39 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/17/2016 9:18:31 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
Because he was supposedly god.

On basis of what the Bible tells, he is the temple of God. Or more precisely, the corner stone of that temple.

Jesus said to them, "Have you never read in the Scriptures, "The stone that the builders rejected has become the cornerstone. This was the Lord's doing, and it is amazing in our eyes"? That is why I tell you that the kingdom of God will be taken away from you and given to a people who will produce fruit for it. The person who falls over this stone will be broken to pieces, but it will crush anyone on whom it falls."
Matt. 21:42-44

Disciples of Jesus are the other stones.

How does that explain his missing years?

You would think the presence of god in human form would have gathered a lot of attention and many stories.

Jesus was hated, so they could have also been destroyed and only the most important parts are left.

He was hated because he was a false prophet. He was a mortal human. If God was real he would have revealed the important details to the gospel writers.

And also, the point was not his life, but the words he preached. The goal was to proclaim the Gosplel.

But he wrote absolutely nothing down and left it 30 years after his death before anyone else did.

"The Spirit of the Lord is on me, Because he has anointed me to preach good news to the poor. He has sent me to heal the brokenhearted, To proclaim release to the captives, Recovering of sight to the blind, To deliver those who are crushed, And to proclaim the acceptable year of the Lord."
Luke 4:18-19

But he said to them, "I must preach the good news of the Kingdom of God to the other cities also. For this reason I have been sent."
Luke 4:43

You are too fucused on material world.

Because it exists. The mythical world of Christianity does not.

Why would a god choose to live a regular unspectacular life? Jesus failed to fulfil Jewish prophecy to rule Israel as a king. Why would he not want an earthly kingdom? It's not logical. It was prophesied. Jesus achieved nothing during his time on earth.

Jesus established the God"s Kingdom that still exists in all of his disciples.

Specifically, the Bible says he will:

1. Build the Third Temple (Ezekiel 37:26-28).
2. Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel (Isaiah 43:5-6).
3. Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. As it says: "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore." (Isaiah 2:4)
4. Spread universal knowledge of the God of Israel, which will unite humanity as one. As it says: "God will be King over all the world " on that day, God will be One and His Name will be One" (Zechariah 14:9).

If an individual fails to fulfill even one of these conditions, then he cannot be the Messiah.

So he was obviously not the messiah prophesised by the Jews.

Jesus answered, "My kingdom is not of this world. If my kingdom were of this world, then my servants would fight, that I wouldn't be delivered to the Jews. But now my kingdom is not from here."
John 18:36

It is Kingdom of everlasting peace, and nothng can really destroy it. Most of people don"t have even idea where and what it is.

"The Kingdom of God doesn't come with observation; neither will they say, 'Look, here!' or, 'Look, there!' for behold, the Kingdom of God is within you."
Luke 17:20-21

Jesus answered him, "Most assuredly, I tell you, unless one is born anew, he can't see the Kingdom of God." Nicodemus said to him, "How can a man be born when he is old? Can he enter a second time into his mother's womb, and be born?" Jesus answered, "Most assuredly I tell you, unless one is born of water and spirit, he can't enter into the Kingdom of God! That which is born of the flesh is flesh. That which is born of the Spirit is spirit. Don't marvel that I said to you, 'You must be born anew.'
John 3:3-7

"Therefore don't be anxious, saying, 'What will we eat?', 'What will we drink?' or, 'With what will we be clothed?' For the Gentiles seek after all these things, for your heavenly Father knows that you need all these things. But seek first God's Kingdom, and his righteousness; and all these things will be given to you as well.
Matthew 6:31-33

I keep Jesus as my King, so the kingdom lives also here. :)

I can claim I'm queen of the world. Im not so its a baseless lie. Jesus does not rule the world as a king so has no kingdom on earth. So your claim is a baseless lie.

A real messiah would have descended from David and installed a kingdom on earth, being accepted by Jews and fulfilled all prophecies. The thought a god could not convince ancient Israelites he was God is laughable. A few miracles or predictions they would have been bowing at his feet.
"I don't need experience.to knock you out. I'm a man. that's all I need to beat you and any woman."

Fatihah, in his delusion that he could knock out any woman while bragging about being able to knock me out. An example of 7th century Islamic thinking inspired by his hero the paedophile Muhammad.
matt8800
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3/18/2016 2:26:51 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 7:26:59 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
In the gospels, there is only one account of Jesus"s life during the 30-year period between his birth and his baptism- an story in Luke that tells of him teaching in the temple. Given the majestic spectacle of his birth that included a star, a visitation of kings, and an area-wide massacre of infant children, it would seem that Jesus would have been quite famous even as a child growing up. There should have been myriad accounts of his childhood, not just in the gospels, but in other accounts as well. There have been many cases in history where children have been worshiped or received special attention for similar reasons.

The absence of childhood stories in the gospels points to the probable fact that Jesus was just a regular boy growing up in a small town working as a carpenter. Not until he began his ministry, probably as a disciple of John the Baptist, did the local populace begin to take notice. This presents a problem for Christianity. The spectacular features of his birth would seem to be nothing more than myths. Then there is the problem of God roaming the earth for 30 years without calling attention to himself. It all points to the highly likely fact that Jesus was just a normal human being who at around the age of 30 decided he wanted to become a preacher.

Obviously, those childhood stories were passed on from his parents. To say parents can embellish is an understatement. Maybe they weren't really that impressive.
12_13
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3/18/2016 9:40:44 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/17/2016 9:56:03 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
He was hated because he was a false prophet.

He was not false prophet. Everything he said is true. Or can you prove that he lied something?

But he wrote absolutely nothing down and left it 30 years after his death before anyone else did.

I have no reason to believe that.

Specifically, the Bible says he will:

1. Build the Third Temple (Ezekiel 37:26-28).

That doesn"t say "third temple". And I don"t see it even speaking about Messiah, unless Messiah is the "sanctuary" that God will set in the midst of them.

2. Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel (Isaiah 43:5-6).

That is what God is doing. Your scripture doesn"t mention Messiah.

3. Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. As it says: "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore." (Isaiah 2:4)

Hmmm" I don"t see Bible saying that Messiah does that.

4. Spread universal knowledge of the God of Israel,

I think God did that through Jesus.

If an individual fails to fulfill even one of these conditions, then he cannot be the Messiah.

Really interesting, I taught that there would be real conditions from the Bible. But those that you showed don"t even seem to be mentioning Messiah.

I can claim I'm queen of the world. Im not so its a baseless lie. Jesus does not rule the world as a king so has no kingdom on earth. So your claim is a baseless lie.

Kingdom is what consists of people that keep someone as their king. If disciples of Jesus keep Jesus as their King, they form Kingdom.

A real messiah would have descended from David and installed a kingdom on earth,

Messiah was expected to be part of David"s family, as Jesus was, because he was counted to that family. Not necessary biological offspring.

Jesus installed kingdom on earth that still exists.

http://www.kolumbus.fi...
Chloe8
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3/18/2016 10:32:03 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/18/2016 9:40:44 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 3/17/2016 9:56:03 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
He was hated because he was a false prophet.

He was not false prophet. Everything he said is true. Or can you prove that he lied something?

Consider the following passage from Matthew 12:39-41:

But He answered and said to them, "An evil and adulterous generation craves for a sign; and yet no sign will be given to it but the sign of Jonah the prophet; for just as Jonah was three days and three nights in the the belly of a sea monster, so will the Son of Man be three days and three nights in the heart of the earth. "The men of Nineveh will stand up with this generation at the judgment, and will condemn it because they repented at the preaching of Jonah; and behold, something greater than Jonah is here."

There are two problems with this statement. First, it seems to imply that Jesus believed literally in the story of Jonah, recognized by sane people today to be a fable. Either Jesus actually believed the Jonah story and made this statement or it was the fabrication of the author, neither of which bodes well for Christianity. Second, by all Gospel accounts, Jesus was dead for only two nights and one day. He was crucified late on Friday and rose on Sunday morning.

But he wrote absolutely nothing down and left it 30 years after his death before anyone else did.

I have no reason to believe that.

Do you claim the gospels were written earlier than even your religion acknowledges? Clearly if Jesus was God he would have written down some important information. But he didn't as even Christians acknowledge.

Specifically, the Bible says he will:

1. Build the Third Temple (Ezekiel 37:26-28).

That doesn"t say "third temple". And I don"t see it even speaking about Messiah, unless Messiah is the "sanctuary" that God will set in the midst of them.

2. Gather all Jews back to the Land of Israel (Isaiah 43:5-6).

That is what God is doing. Your scripture doesn"t mention Messiah.

3. Usher in an era of world peace, and end all hatred, oppression, suffering and disease. As it says: "Nation shall not lift up sword against nation, neither shall man learn war anymore." (Isaiah 2:4)

Hmmm" I don"t see Bible saying that Messiah does that.

4. Spread universal knowledge of the God of Israel,

I think God did that through Jesus.

If an individual fails to fulfill even one of these conditions, then he cannot be the Messiah.

Really interesting, I taught that there would be real conditions from the Bible. But those that you showed don"t even seem to be mentioning Messiah.

The messiah must be of the tribe of Judah and a descendant of King David and King Solomon. The New Testament scriptures confirm that Jesus did not have a birth father, and thus could not fulfill this requirement.

The temple in Jerusalem will be rebuilt. The temple was destroyed 38 years after Jesus"s death and has not been rebuilt.

There will be worldwide peace and a complete end to war. Wars have increased since the birth of Christianity.

The messiah will reign as a king, with all Jews observing the Jewish commandments. Jesus never reigned as a king and all Jews do not observe the commandments.

The messiah is to rule when all the people of the world acknowledge and worship the one true god. This has not happened.

There will be an in-gathering of Jews to Israel. This has begun to happen, but has not been completed.

Christians claim that Jesus will fulfill all of these requirements when he returns. But Jewish people consider this claim to be an admission that Jesus failed to fulfill the Messianic criteria.

The fact that Jesus is a failed messiah destroys the credibility of Christianity. It creates a disconnect between the Old Testament god and the god of Christianity, but Jesus himself worshiped the Old Testament god. Therefore, Christianity can only be true if Jesus was the Jewish messiah and was universally accepted as such.

I can claim I'm queen of the world. Im not so its a baseless lie. Jesus does not rule the world as a king so has no kingdom on earth. So your claim is a baseless lie.

Kingdom is what consists of people that keep someone as their king. If disciples of Jesus keep Jesus as their King, they form Kingdom.

A real messiah would have descended from David and installed a kingdom on earth,

Messiah was expected to be part of David"s family, as Jesus was, because he was counted to that family. Not necessary biological

What is the Messiah supposed to accomplish? One of the central themes of biblical prophecy is the promise of a future age of perfection characterized by universal peace and recognition of God. (Isaiah 2:1-4, 32:15-18, 60:15-18; Zephaniah 3:9; Hosea 2:20-22; Amos 9:13-15; Micah 4:1-4; Zechariah 8:23, 14:9; Jeremiah 31:33-34)

There is no biblical basis for the idea of a father passing on his tribal line by adoption. A priest who adopts a son from another tribe cannot make him a priest by adoption.

Joseph could never pass on by adoption that which he doesn't have. Because Joseph descended from Jeconiah (Matthew 1:11) he fell under the curse of that king that none of his descendants could ever sit as king upon the throne of David. (Jeremiah 22:30; 36:30)
"I don't need experience.to knock you out. I'm a man. that's all I need to beat you and any woman."

Fatihah, in his delusion that he could knock out any woman while bragging about being able to knock me out. An example of 7th century Islamic thinking inspired by his hero the paedophile Muhammad.
12_13
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3/20/2016 12:42:46 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 3/18/2016 10:32:03 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
There are two problems with this statement. First, it seems to imply that Jesus believed literally in the story of Jonah, recognized by sane people today to be a fable.

Interesting opinion, unfortunately it is only your opinion, not actual fact or truth.

Second, by all Gospel accounts, Jesus was dead for only two nights and one day. He was crucified late on Friday and rose on Sunday morning.

That is not true. Jesus was crucified on Thursday, if we understand well what the Bible tells. And in any case we should notice, Bible doesn"t use word Friday, it is entirely someone"s interpretation.

http://www.kolumbus.fi...

Do you claim the gospels were written earlier than even your religion acknowledges? Clearly if Jesus was God he would have written down some important information. But he didn't as even Christians acknowledge.

Actually written word is death word, it doesn"t adapt to changes that happen in the language. That is why it could be better to set teachers that know what they are talking about so that they can give the message in fresh words to others, in meanings that they understand well.

But my claim is, it is possible that the story was written instantly, we just have not found the first writings, perhaps because Christians were persecuted and all scriptures that were not hidden well enough were destroyed.

The messiah must be of the tribe of Judah and a descendant of King David and King Solomon. The New Testament scriptures confirm that Jesus did not have a birth father, and thus could not fulfill this requirement.

By what I know, Messiah would be counted into Family of David. Not necessary direct offspring of him.

There will be worldwide peace and a complete end to war. Wars have increased since the birth of Christianity.

On basis of what I have read, this world gets newer peace. Peace will be for God"s people.

Perhaps you should show by Bible how it is really. Now that we see only your words and opinion, it is not really very meaningful.

The messiah will reign as a king, with all Jews observing the Jewish commandments. Jesus never reigned as a king and all Jews do not observe the commandments.

Jesus still reign as a King, but not in way you expect.

The messiah is to rule when all the people of the world acknowledge and worship the one true god. This has not happened.

Before that all those who don"t accept Jesus and God probably die.

The fact that Jesus is a failed messiah destroys the credibility of Christianity. It creates a disconnect between the Old Testament god and the god of Christianity, but Jesus himself worshiped the Old Testament god. Therefore, Christianity can only be true if Jesus was the Jewish messiah and was universally accepted as such.

Yeah, but Jews should also get the right understanding of what the Messiah will be.

What is the Messiah supposed to accomplish? One of the central themes of biblical prophecy is the promise of a future age of perfection characterized by universal peace and recognition of God. (Isaiah 2:1-4, 32:15-18, 60:15-18; Zephaniah 3:9; Hosea 2:20-22; Amos 9:13-15; Micah 4:1-4; Zechariah 8:23, 14:9; Jeremiah 31:33-34)

Isaiah 2:1-4: tells about God, not a single word about Messiah.
Isaiah 32:15-18: Don"t mention word Messiah. God is the one who will do what is said in this.
Iasiah 60:15-18: Don"t mention word Messiah. God is the one who will do what is said in this.
Zephaniah 3:9: Speaks about Yahweh.
Hosea 2:20-22: Speaks about Yahweh.
Amos 9:13-15: Speaks about Yahweh.
Micah 4:1-4: No word Messiah.
Zechariah 8:23, 14:9: Nothing about Messiah.
Jeremiah 31:33-34: Speaks about God. The thing mentioned is done through Jesus.

It is odd that not even one mentions word Messiah. Have you just copied those from some place? What was the point?

God is the one who brings eventually the peace. But I believe Jesus is God"s temple, and God works through Jesus. But the end of this world was not meant to be yet.

There is no biblical basis for the idea of a father passing on his tribal line by adoption.

And no mention that it could not happen by so that Son is born in to family of David and by so be part of David"s family.

But maybe we should also notice this question that Jesus asked without getting any answer:

Now while the Pharisees were gathered together, Jesus asked them a question, saying, "What do you think of the Christ? Whose son is he?" They said to him, "Of David." He said to them, "How then does David in the Spirit call him Lord, saying, 'The Lord said to my Lord, Sit on my right hand, Until I make your enemies a footstool for your feet?' "If then David calls him Lord, how is he his son?"
Matt. 22:41-45

Do you have good and reasonable and scriptural answer to that?