Total Posts:134|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

Atheists wont convert via logic

vardas0antras
Posts: 983
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 10:55:16 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
My point isn't that Atheists don't need logic for conversion, not at all ! Furthermore I'm speaking in general terms. Now that we consider these two previous points, I must say that logic and reason alone wouldn't convert an Atheist there must also be other factors involved (emotions, personal experience, etcetera). However it seems that this is the case with all beliefs. Anyway what are your thoughts on this, any mistakes or am I right ?
"When he awoke in a tomb three days later he would actually have believed that he rose from the dead" FREEDO about the resurrection of Jesus Christ
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 11:01:17 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
No. It was purely logic that caused me to convert to atheism.
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
studentathletechristian8
Posts: 5,810
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 11:06:41 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 11:01:17 AM, annhasle wrote:
No. It was purely logic that caused me to convert to atheism.

You do realize that almost no decision can be based purely off of logic? There is *almost* always an influence of our emotions / feelings on every choice we make.
vardas0antras
Posts: 983
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 11:14:44 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 11:01:17 AM, annhasle wrote:
No. It was purely logic that caused me to convert to atheism.

I find that odd
"When he awoke in a tomb three days later he would actually have believed that he rose from the dead" FREEDO about the resurrection of Jesus Christ
GeoLaureate8
Posts: 12,252
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 11:30:54 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 11:01:17 AM, annhasle wrote:
No. It was purely logic that caused me to convert to atheism.

I HIGHLY doubt that. Did someone present to you a linear deductive syllogism that demonstrated God's existence is improbable or impossible, and then suddenly in an instant, you became Atheist? Because if it was purely logic, it would have been instant just like that.

But for most, including myself, it was a gradual process of becoming Atheist because it wasn't just some logical syllogism that converted me.
"We must raise the standard of the Old, free, decentralized, and strictly limited Republic."
-- Murray Rothbard

"The worst thing that can happen to a good cause is, not to be skillfully attacked, but to be ineptly defended."
-- Frederic Bastiat
vardas0antras
Posts: 983
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 11:33:44 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 11:30:54 AM, GeoLaureate8 wrote:
At 11/14/2010 11:01:17 AM, annhasle wrote:
No. It was purely logic that caused me to convert to atheism.

I HIGHLY doubt that. Did someone present to you a linear deductive syllogism that demonstrated God's existence is improbable or impossible, and then suddenly in an instant, you became Atheist? Because if it was purely logic, it would have been instant just like that.

But for most, including myself, it was a gradual process of becoming Atheist because it wasn't just some logical syllogism that converted me.

Indeed
"When he awoke in a tomb three days later he would actually have believed that he rose from the dead" FREEDO about the resurrection of Jesus Christ
vardas0antras
Posts: 983
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 11:39:59 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
"When he awoke in a tomb three days later he would actually have believed that he rose from the dead" FREEDO about the resurrection of Jesus Christ
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 11:43:55 AM
Posted: 6 years ago
Regardless of you all finding it odd, unlikely or highly doubtful - that's what happened. Did I say it happened instantaneously? No. So I have no idea what you mean, Geo. Just because it was pure logic does not mean that it happened within a second.

I would go to church every Sunday. And every time I would approach the Priest and ask a question, usually along the lines of "Where's the proof?" I've always been an inquisitive thinker. And when his answers were almost always, "You have to find God yourself", I became skeptical. It wasn't until I read Thomas Hobbes that I figured out I would most likely be an atheist. But it wasn't emotionality or a personal experience that caused me to change, really. It was the lack of proof and my quest for a logical explanation. If God had seemed logical to me, I would be religious right now.

I'm sure most would argue that my personal experience with the Priest was a factor, and I guess it was to an extent. But nonetheless, if the Priest had given me some sort of logical explanation - like I said before - I would be a theist. So in my eyes, it came down to logic.
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
vardas0antras
Posts: 983
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 12:27:39 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 12:04:14 PM, Koopin wrote:
I love onion rings.

Me too !!! I also like turtles, anime and cool soundtracks. Incidentally its nice to know.
"When he awoke in a tomb three days later he would actually have believed that he rose from the dead" FREEDO about the resurrection of Jesus Christ
vardas0antras
Posts: 983
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 12:36:10 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 11:43:55 AM, annhasle wrote:
Regardless of you all finding it odd, unlikely or highly doubtful - that's what happened. Did I say it happened instantaneously? No. So I have no idea what you mean, Geo. Just because it was pure logic does not mean that it happened within a second.

I would go to church every Sunday. And every time I would approach the Priest and ask a question, usually along the lines of "Where's the proof?" I've always been an inquisitive thinker. And when his answers were almost always, "You have to find God yourself", I became skeptical. It wasn't until I read Thomas Hobbes that I figured out I would most likely be an atheist. But it wasn't emotionality or a personal experience that caused me to change, really. It was the lack of proof and my quest for a logical explanation. If God had seemed logical to me, I would be religious right now.

I'm sure most would argue that my personal experience with the Priest was a factor, and I guess it was to an extent. But nonetheless, if the Priest had given me some sort of logical explanation - like I said before - I would be a theist. So in my eyes, it came down to logic.

"You have to find God yourself"
I am guilty of doing this sometimes but how can you blame me:
http://www.debate.org...

Furthermore I never said that from your perspective it wasn't just logic which converted you but what I did say is that its immensely likely that it wasn't just logic which made you an Atheist.
"When he awoke in a tomb three days later he would actually have believed that he rose from the dead" FREEDO about the resurrection of Jesus Christ
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 12:42:18 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 12:36:10 PM, vardas0antras wrote:
At 11/14/2010 11:43:55 AM, annhasle wrote:
Regardless of you all finding it odd, unlikely or highly doubtful - that's what happened. Did I say it happened instantaneously? No. So I have no idea what you mean, Geo. Just because it was pure logic does not mean that it happened within a second.

I would go to church every Sunday. And every time I would approach the Priest and ask a question, usually along the lines of "Where's the proof?" I've always been an inquisitive thinker. And when his answers were almost always, "You have to find God yourself", I became skeptical. It wasn't until I read Thomas Hobbes that I figured out I would most likely be an atheist. But it wasn't emotionality or a personal experience that caused me to change, really. It was the lack of proof and my quest for a logical explanation. If God had seemed logical to me, I would be religious right now.

I'm sure most would argue that my personal experience with the Priest was a factor, and I guess it was to an extent. But nonetheless, if the Priest had given me some sort of logical explanation - like I said before - I would be a theist. So in my eyes, it came down to logic.

"You have to find God yourself"
I am guilty of doing this sometimes but how can you blame me:
http://www.debate.org...

Furthermore I never said that from your perspective it wasn't just logic which converted you but what I did say is that its immensely likely that it wasn't just logic which made you an Atheist.

Lolwut? I'm not sure what you're trying to convey here. If, in my perspective, it was just logic that converted me to atheism - isn't it just logic then? I mean, are you saying that I am unaware to other factors that caused my conversion? That, in theory, could be true - but what's your basis for such a statement?
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
vardas0antras
Posts: 983
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 1:48:08 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 12:42:18 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 11/14/2010 12:36:10 PM, vardas0antras wrote:
At 11/14/2010 11:43:55 AM, annhasle wrote:
Regardless of you all finding it odd, unlikely or highly doubtful - that's what happened. Did I say it happened instantaneously? No. So I have no idea what you mean, Geo. Just because it was pure logic does not mean that it happened within a second.

I would go to church every Sunday. And every time I would approach the Priest and ask a question, usually along the lines of "Where's the proof?" I've always been an inquisitive thinker. And when his answers were almost always, "You have to find God yourself", I became skeptical. It wasn't until I read Thomas Hobbes that I figured out I would most likely be an atheist. But it wasn't emotionality or a personal experience that caused me to change, really. It was the lack of proof and my quest for a logical explanation. If God had seemed logical to me, I would be religious right now.

I'm sure most would argue that my personal experience with the Priest was a factor, and I guess it was to an extent. But nonetheless, if the Priest had given me some sort of logical explanation - like I said before - I would be a theist. So in my eyes, it came down to logic.

"You have to find God yourself"
I am guilty of doing this sometimes but how can you blame me:
http://www.debate.org...

Furthermore I never said that from your perspective it wasn't just logic which converted you but what I did say is that its immensely likely that it wasn't just logic which made you an Atheist.

Lolwut? I'm not sure what you're trying to convey here. If, in my perspective, it was just logic that converted me to atheism - isn't it just logic then? I mean, are you saying that I am unaware to other factors that caused my conversion? That, in theory, could be true - but what's your basis for such a statement?

What I was trying to say is that... I ignored you and told everybody else that just because you say differently doesn't mean that you're right even in your own case, sorry I didn't think that I was ingoring you when I posted the response, honestly.
"When he awoke in a tomb three days later he would actually have believed that he rose from the dead" FREEDO about the resurrection of Jesus Christ
vardas0antras
Posts: 983
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 2:54:45 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
an extra post for the sake of an extra post
"When he awoke in a tomb three days later he would actually have believed that he rose from the dead" FREEDO about the resurrection of Jesus Christ
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:05:52 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
If atheists based their perspectives on logic, then they'd all study theology before they made a decision.

If the atheists on this site based their perspectives on logic, then they would not gravitate toward the most nonsensical arguments posited by the Christians on this site.

The end.
innomen
Posts: 10,052
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:06:40 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
When i was about 20 i left my faith, my religion and became an agnostic. I couldn't make the leap to asserting there was no God, but if there was i had no knowledge of Him. It wasn't logic really that brought me there, but a lack of meaning to the words that were being told to me. I would hear the words spoken to me about God and the bible, but they seemed hollow and void of meaning. I realized i was going through the motion for years. I never really felt a presence other than those around me who say they did. I actually felt more alone at this time than any other time in my life. I couldn't relate to anyone who had faith and sort of left all that stuff that i had learned behind me. I could find no purpose because i believed there was no purpose. I wasn't angry, or sad really, actually slightly empowered. I used to study philosophy a lot, and figured what i needed could be gleaned from that. That was my exit from what i thought was faith. I do understand that i had to be there in order to be where i am now.
innomen
Posts: 10,052
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:08:49 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:05:52 PM, Ren wrote:
If atheists based their perspectives on logic, then they'd all study theology before they made a decision.

If the atheists on this site based their perspectives on logic, then they would not gravitate toward the most nonsensical arguments posited by the Christians on this site.

The end.

Low hanging fruit.
the-good-teacher
Posts: 444
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:10:06 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
The Greeks invented logic, but were never fooled by it.
There's only one way to be converted to Christianity.- "the Father has to choose you"

Rom 9:14-18:
14 What shall we say then? [Is there] unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then [it is] not of him that willeth (wants it), nor of him that runneth (works for it), but of God that showeth mercy.
17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might show my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will [have mercy], and whom he will he hardeneth.

Matt 16:17.
And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:11:20 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 11:43:55 AM, annhasle wrote:
Regardless of you all finding it odd, unlikely or highly doubtful - that's what happened. Did I say it happened instantaneously? No. So I have no idea what you mean, Geo. Just because it was pure logic does not mean that it happened within a second.

I would go to church every Sunday. And every time I would approach the Priest and ask a question, usually along the lines of "Where's the proof?" I've always been an inquisitive thinker. And when his answers were almost always, "You have to find God yourself", I became skeptical. It wasn't until I read Thomas Hobbes that I figured out I would most likely be an atheist. But it wasn't emotionality or a personal experience that caused me to change, really. It was the lack of proof and my quest for a logical explanation. If God had seemed logical to me, I would be religious right now.

I'm sure most would argue that my personal experience with the Priest was a factor, and I guess it was to an extent. But nonetheless, if the Priest had given me some sort of logical explanation - like I said before - I would be a theist. So in my eyes, it came down to logic.

You derive some of your beliefs from Hobbes? Dude had practically no understanding of humanity whatsoever.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:12:42 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:08:49 PM, innomen wrote:
At 11/14/2010 3:05:52 PM, Ren wrote:
If atheists based their perspectives on logic, then they'd all study theology before they made a decision.

If the atheists on this site based their perspectives on logic, then they would not gravitate toward the most nonsensical arguments posited by the Christians on this site.

The end.

Low hanging fruit.

Exactly.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:14:37 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:10:06 PM, the-good-teacher wrote:
The Greeks invented logic, but were never fooled by it.
There's only one way to be converted to Christianity.- "the Father has to choose you"

Rom 9:14-18:
14 What shall we say then? [Is there] unrighteousness with God? God forbid.
15 For he saith to Moses, I will have mercy on whom I will have mercy, and I will have compassion on whom I will have compassion.
16 So then [it is] not of him that willeth (wants it), nor of him that runneth (works for it), but of God that showeth mercy.
17 For the scripture saith unto Pharaoh, Even for this same purpose have I raised thee up, that I might show my power in thee, and that my name might be declared throughout all the earth.
18 Therefore hath he mercy on whom he will [have mercy], and whom he will he hardeneth.

Matt 16:17.
And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.

The Greeks didn't invent logic, they just gave it a particular name that distinguished it from ethics (ethos) and emotion (pathos).
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:16:15 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:11:20 PM, Ren wrote:
At 11/14/2010 11:43:55 AM, annhasle wrote:
Regardless of you all finding it odd, unlikely or highly doubtful - that's what happened. Did I say it happened instantaneously? No. So I have no idea what you mean, Geo. Just because it was pure logic does not mean that it happened within a second.

I would go to church every Sunday. And every time I would approach the Priest and ask a question, usually along the lines of "Where's the proof?" I've always been an inquisitive thinker. And when his answers were almost always, "You have to find God yourself", I became skeptical. It wasn't until I read Thomas Hobbes that I figured out I would most likely be an atheist. But it wasn't emotionality or a personal experience that caused me to change, really. It was the lack of proof and my quest for a logical explanation. If God had seemed logical to me, I would be religious right now.

I'm sure most would argue that my personal experience with the Priest was a factor, and I guess it was to an extent. But nonetheless, if the Priest had given me some sort of logical explanation - like I said before - I would be a theist. So in my eyes, it came down to logic.

You derive some of your beliefs from Hobbes? Dude had practically no understanding of humanity whatsoever.

Not at all. He's fun to read but that's about it. I was 12 and read... Oh, I can't remember what work exactly and got in trouble since my grandmother found out and called me a "heathen". I looked up the word, and saw it meant "godless" and realized - 'Sh!t. Am I Catholic?" The rest is history...
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:20:32 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:16:15 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 11/14/2010 3:11:20 PM, Ren wrote:
At 11/14/2010 11:43:55 AM, annhasle wrote:
Regardless of you all finding it odd, unlikely or highly doubtful - that's what happened. Did I say it happened instantaneously? No. So I have no idea what you mean, Geo. Just because it was pure logic does not mean that it happened within a second.

I would go to church every Sunday. And every time I would approach the Priest and ask a question, usually along the lines of "Where's the proof?" I've always been an inquisitive thinker. And when his answers were almost always, "You have to find God yourself", I became skeptical. It wasn't until I read Thomas Hobbes that I figured out I would most likely be an atheist. But it wasn't emotionality or a personal experience that caused me to change, really. It was the lack of proof and my quest for a logical explanation. If God had seemed logical to me, I would be religious right now.

I'm sure most would argue that my personal experience with the Priest was a factor, and I guess it was to an extent. But nonetheless, if the Priest had given me some sort of logical explanation - like I said before - I would be a theist. So in my eyes, it came down to logic.

You derive some of your beliefs from Hobbes? Dude had practically no understanding of humanity whatsoever.

Not at all. He's fun to read but that's about it. I was 12 and read... Oh, I can't remember what work exactly and got in trouble since my grandmother found out and called me a "heathen". I looked up the word, and saw it meant "godless" and realized - 'Sh!t. Am I Catholic?" The rest is history...

Oh, Lawd.

Well, on a lighter note, ever read Rushdie? That'd make more sense... ;)
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:27:08 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:20:32 PM, Ren wrote:
At 11/14/2010 3:16:15 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 11/14/2010 3:11:20 PM, Ren wrote:
At 11/14/2010 11:43:55 AM, annhasle wrote:
Regardless of you all finding it odd, unlikely or highly doubtful - that's what happened. Did I say it happened instantaneously? No. So I have no idea what you mean, Geo. Just because it was pure logic does not mean that it happened within a second.

I would go to church every Sunday. And every time I would approach the Priest and ask a question, usually along the lines of "Where's the proof?" I've always been an inquisitive thinker. And when his answers were almost always, "You have to find God yourself", I became skeptical. It wasn't until I read Thomas Hobbes that I figured out I would most likely be an atheist. But it wasn't emotionality or a personal experience that caused me to change, really. It was the lack of proof and my quest for a logical explanation. If God had seemed logical to me, I would be religious right now.

I'm sure most would argue that my personal experience with the Priest was a factor, and I guess it was to an extent. But nonetheless, if the Priest had given me some sort of logical explanation - like I said before - I would be a theist. So in my eyes, it came down to logic.

You derive some of your beliefs from Hobbes? Dude had practically no understanding of humanity whatsoever.

Not at all. He's fun to read but that's about it. I was 12 and read... Oh, I can't remember what work exactly and got in trouble since my grandmother found out and called me a "heathen". I looked up the word, and saw it meant "godless" and realized - 'Sh!t. Am I Catholic?" The rest is history...

Oh, Lawd.

Don't worry. As I grew older, I became more informed. However, I keep getting the impression that you think atheists are willfully ignorant of religion. Is that a correct impression?

Well, on a lighter note, ever read Rushdie? That'd make more sense... ;)

Yes, I have. And though I found his work, the Satanic Verses, to be amusing - it's not something that I'll advertise for all atheists. :)
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:27:56 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:24:27 PM, Ren wrote:
You know what? I'd like to say here that I rather like Annhassle.

Clever girl, that one.

I'm really hoping that this isn't sarcasm. :)
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:36:43 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:27:08 PM, annhasle wrote:
Don't worry. As I grew older, I became more informed. However, I keep getting the impression that you think atheists are willfully ignorant of religion. Is that a correct impression?

Hmm. I'd have to admit that I believe that most are. Those who are informed about religion, but do not find it very logical, tend to be agnostic instead, in my experience.

Religion itself is a funny thing. You see, if rejecting religion in any capacity were atheism, then I'd be an atheist, too. It's nothing but a collection of political platforms. However, to outright reject the notion of God altogether is just as preposterous to me as claiming to understand everything or being capable of perfect logic. I think it's pretty self-aggrandizing to make any sort of claim like that.

I mean, back when the sun was a god as well, it didn't change what the sun was. Clearly, there's something there that every single collection of people on earth have acknowledged at one point or another, we're just not entirely certain what it is. But, as a god, it was still dependable, permanent, and it did give life. Now, we just happen to know that it's a sustained nuclear explosion due to hydrogen fusion. I mean, that's still pretty godlike, if you ask me, if only due to its epicness.

Getting past all of the allegorical and political nonsense that comprises a good deal of the Bible, I think that it's rather straightforward with its message and it's one that coincides with my beliefs. I think that may help explain my perspectives despite knowing the truth about religion.

Well, on a lighter note, ever read Rushdie? That'd make more sense... ;)

Yes, I have. And though I found his work, the Satanic Verses, to be amusing - it's not something that I'll advertise for all atheists. :)

Hahahahaha, indeed!

Tell me, have you ever read I, Lucifer by Glen Duncan??

Please do! Such an excellent book! Those who aren't all fervent and such may really appreciate such a masterwork.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:37:07 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:27:56 PM, annhasle wrote:
At 11/14/2010 3:24:27 PM, Ren wrote:
You know what? I'd like to say here that I rather like Annhassle.

Clever girl, that one.

I'm really hoping that this isn't sarcasm. :)

It isn't.
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 3:54:21 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:36:43 PM, Ren wrote:
At 11/14/2010 3:27:08 PM, annhasle wrote:
Don't worry. As I grew older, I became more informed. However, I keep getting the impression that you think atheists are willfully ignorant of religion. Is that a correct impression?

Hmm. I'd have to admit that I believe that most are. Those who are informed about religion, but do not find it very logical, tend to be agnostic instead, in my experience.

Religion itself is a funny thing. You see, if rejecting religion in any capacity were atheism, then I'd be an atheist, too. It's nothing but a collection of political platforms. However, to outright reject the notion of God altogether is just as preposterous to me as claiming to understand everything or being capable of perfect logic. I think it's pretty self-aggrandizing to make any sort of claim like that.

I mean, back when the sun was a god as well, it didn't change what the sun was. Clearly, there's something there that every single collection of people on earth have acknowledged at one point or another, we're just not entirely certain what it is. But, as a god, it was still dependable, permanent, and it did give life. Now, we just happen to know that it's a sustained nuclear explosion due to hydrogen fusion. I mean, that's still pretty godlike, if you ask me, if only due to its epicness.

Getting past all of the allegorical and political nonsense that comprises a good deal of the Bible, I think that it's rather straightforward with its message and it's one that coincides with my beliefs. I think that may help explain my perspectives despite knowing the truth about religion.

While I find that to be interesting, I also find it to be disappointing. While I recognize that a good amount of "atheists" in RL I have had the pleasure of talking to, do not have many logical reasons for their denial of a deity - most say, "well, I don't see him" -, I also have met a sizable amount of people that DO have good reasons. Now, personally, if I knew someone that rejected the existence of a god without proper knowledge of what god they are denying or the faith they are speaking ill of, I'd be incredibly disappointed in them. In my eyes, to actually reject the notion of a god - you must know what god or the IDEA of the god you are against.

That is the reason I have studied many different religions along with multiple other users on this site. I still go to churches, synagogues and temples - even as an avowed atheist - to hear what is being preached and to see the people who are taking place in such religious rituals. I mean, when I went to Tanzania this summer, I spent one week shadowing the Preacher of the local Lutheran seminary just so I could have the experience of seeing the Tanzanian approach to faith.

I do understand that many are against God for very simplistic and uninformed reasons - and that can skew your overall view of atheists. But I'd ask you to stand back a bit on this site and observe a wholly different side of atheism. At least on this site, you have to justify your every belief and that is caused by a LOT of self-reflection. Now, I'm even more secure in my atheistic perspective and more comfortable explaining why I am who I am. But because I find atheism to hold more truth in MY opinion, I would never claim to know everything, to know THE truth nor would I ever attempt to take your beliefs away - or the importance of them.

I have found that just as many theists fall to the "I'm a theist but I have no clear reason why other than being raised this way" as atheists fall to the "God isn't real. Uhh, that's about it" line of thinking. I mean no offense by that.

Well, on a lighter note, ever read Rushdie? That'd make more sense... ;)

Yes, I have. And though I found his work, the Satanic Verses, to be amusing - it's not something that I'll advertise for all atheists. :)

Hahahahaha, indeed!

Tell me, have you ever read I, Lucifer by Glen Duncan??

YES! You are the first person I have heard on this site to have read it! ^_^

Please do! Such an excellent book! Those who aren't all fervent and such may really appreciate such a masterwork.

Agreed.
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
11/14/2010 4:05:02 PM
Posted: 6 years ago
At 11/14/2010 3:54:21 PM, annhasle wrote:
While I find that to be interesting, I also find it to be disappointing. While I recognize that a good amount of "atheists" in RL I have had the pleasure of talking to, do not have many logical reasons for their denial of a deity - most say, "well, I don't see him" -, I also have met a sizable amount of people that DO have good reasons. Now, personally, if I knew someone that rejected the existence of a god without proper knowledge of what god they are denying or the faith they are speaking ill of, I'd be incredibly disappointed in them. In my eyes, to actually reject the notion of a god - you must know what god or the IDEA of the god you are against.

That is the reason I have studied many different religions along with multiple other users on this site. I still go to churches, synagogues and temples - even as an avowed atheist - to hear what is being preached and to see the people who are taking place in such religious rituals. I mean, when I went to Tanzania this summer, I spent one week shadowing the Preacher of the local Lutheran seminary just so I could have the experience of seeing the Tanzanian approach to faith.

I do understand that many are against God for very simplistic and uninformed reasons - and that can skew your overall view of atheists. But I'd ask you to stand back a bit on this site and observe a wholly different side of atheism. At least on this site, you have to justify your every belief and that is caused by a LOT of self-reflection. Now, I'm even more secure in my atheistic perspective and more comfortable explaining why I am who I am. But because I find atheism to hold more truth in MY opinion, I would never claim to know everything, to know THE truth nor would I ever attempt to take your beliefs away - or the importance of them.

You are fascinating. Please don't take this the wrong way, but I have an inkling that you will not remain an atheist forever. This is not because I believe that intellect is contingent on a belief in god, but rather that you seem open enough to embrace a brush with divinity, which, it seems, eventually happens to everyone.

Also, I would really like you to direct me to the other atheists that have applied so much thought to their beliefs on this site, because insofar, most that I've seen have expressed just as much ignorance about what they're rejecting as they have expressed their atheism.

I have found that just as many theists fall to the "I'm a theist but I have no clear reason why other than being raised this way" as atheists fall to the "God isn't real. Uhh, that's about it" line of thinking. I mean no offense by that.

You are absolutely right.

Well, on a lighter note, ever read Rushdie? That'd make more sense... ;)

Yes, I have. And though I found his work, the Satanic Verses, to be amusing - it's not something that I'll advertise for all atheists. :)

Hahahahaha, indeed!

Tell me, have you ever read I, Lucifer by Glen Duncan??

YES! You are the first person I have heard on this site to have read it! ^_^

Please do! Such an excellent book! Those who aren't all fervent and such may really appreciate such a masterwork.

Agreed.

Ha, word. I heard he wrote another that was just as good, but without a religious basis. Can you believe that was his debut novel? Man!