Total Posts:133|Showing Posts:1-30|Last Page
Jump to topic:

Pitiless indifference of the Atheist

brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 4:39:29 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

Facts really, really really bother you, don't they.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 4:50:33 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 4:39:29 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

Facts really, really really bother you, don't they.

Are they facts? Prophecy would say nope.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 4:51:33 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
The kalam argument says nope. The fermi paradox says nope. The Cambrian explosion says nope. Lots of nopes.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 4:52:58 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
Too many nopes...

http://www.debate.org...
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
Redfordnutt
Posts: 222
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 4:54:09 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

What point are you trying to make/ what question are you trying to ask?
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 4:58:43 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 4:51:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The kalam argument says nope. The fermi paradox says nope. The Cambrian explosion says nope. Lots of nopes.

None of these are evidence, only arguments.
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 4:58:43 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
Nut oh. Is it true? You'd better believe it.

http://theawakenment.com...
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 5:00:43 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 4:54:09 PM, Redfordnutt wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

What point are you trying to make/ what question are you trying to ask?

Atheists have pitiless indifference as their moral code, meaning there is no moral code. There is no right. No wrong. No good. No evil.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 5:01:36 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 4:58:43 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:51:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The kalam argument says nope. The fermi paradox says nope. The Cambrian explosion says nope. Lots of nopes.

None of these are evidence, only arguments.

Yeah? Take a look.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 5:03:10 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 4:50:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:39:29 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

Facts really, really really bother you, don't they.

Are they facts?

Yes.

Prophecy would say nope.

Prophecies are not valid when compared to reality.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 5:04:58 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 5:01:36 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:58:43 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:51:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The kalam argument says nope. The fermi paradox says nope. The Cambrian explosion says nope. Lots of nopes.

None of these are evidence, only arguments.

Yeah? Take a look.

I have, a number of times. Even if I conceded all of the presuppositions involved, they all just point to some creator, not to any particular entity. They violate both Occam's Razor and the requirement for valid arguments. They are not evidence of any kind for your particular deity.
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 5:06:35 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 5:04:58 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 4/4/2016 5:01:36 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:58:43 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:51:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The kalam argument says nope. The fermi paradox says nope. The Cambrian explosion says nope. Lots of nopes.

None of these are evidence, only arguments.

Yeah? Take a look.

I have, a number of times. Even if I conceded all of the presuppositions involved, they all just point to some creator, not to any particular entity. They violate both Occam's Razor and the requirement for valid arguments. They are not evidence of any kind for your particular deity.

You must have missed the prophetic argument in my debate if you looked at it.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 5:08:11 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 5:03:10 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:50:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:39:29 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

Facts really, really really bother you, don't they.

Are they facts?

Yes.

Prophecy would say nope.

Prophecies are not valid when compared to reality.

Sure they are. Did you look at the debate I offered. If a person picked heads or tails correctly 1,000 times in a row you could say there is ample evidence that they are telepathic.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
Redfordnutt
Posts: 222
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 5:15:42 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 5:00:43 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:54:09 PM, Redfordnutt wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

What point are you trying to make/ what question are you trying to ask?

Atheists have pitiless indifference as their moral code, meaning there is no moral code. There is no right. No wrong. No good. No evil.

For arguments sake let's say your correct. In practice Atheists are just as morally upstanding even by the religious standards as any other group of peoples.

Also humans develop Morales of time by learning, trial and error, empathy. The only time people have done terrible things yet still believe them to be morale is when they are psychotic or religious.

I want a morale code that is thought about and examined not some absolute morality that will not be relevant in the future and just says itbis good because it says it is good (which is a circular argument)
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 5:15:56 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 5:08:11 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 5:03:10 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:50:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:39:29 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

Facts really, really really bother you, don't they.

Are they facts?

Yes.

Prophecy would say nope.

Prophecies are not valid when compared to reality.

Sure they are. Did you look at the debate I offered.

Yes, it completely lacked any form of intelligence, facts or evidence, all magical, incoherent thinking.

If a person picked heads or tails correctly 1,000 times in a row you could say there is ample evidence that they are telepathic.

No, I wouldn't make such a stupid conclusion.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
dhardage
Posts: 4,545
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 5:16:27 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 5:06:35 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 5:04:58 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 4/4/2016 5:01:36 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:58:43 PM, dhardage wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:51:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The kalam argument says nope. The fermi paradox says nope. The Cambrian explosion says nope. Lots of nopes.

None of these are evidence, only arguments.

Yeah? Take a look.

I have, a number of times. Even if I conceded all of the presuppositions involved, they all just point to some creator, not to any particular entity. They violate both Occam's Razor and the requirement for valid arguments. They are not evidence of any kind for your particular deity.

You must have missed the prophetic argument in my debate if you looked at it.

Any of those prophecies fulfilled were self-fulfilling, much like Israel forming. It said so in their book so they did it. All of the others are so nebulous that they could mean any number of things and others have been proven wrong. All of your arguments are fallacious and have zero factual underpinning.
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 5:33:05 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

Dawkins is an atheist, but more importantly for the quote, Bronto, he's also an ethologist -- a studier of wild animal behaviour. That means, when he says compassionate justice aren't much to be found in nature, there's a lot of systematic observation (his own, and that of other ethologists) under that opinion. And just as Galileo knew more about astronomy than did the Popes of his day, Dawkins is more qualified to offer opinion about animal behaviour than (say) you, or some theologian.

I realise you don't like his opinions, Bronto, but the scorn of people who do not systematically study natural behaviour is not evidence. What you need is a reputable, well-published ethologist who has a different view, and is willing to defend it on observable evidence.

Good luck finding one!

Meanwhile, how you make the leap from observation of cruelty to cruelty of character is beyond me. Is this supposed to be a 'who smelt it dealt it' argument? Your faith's scriptures are full of cruelty and injustice too. Will you use the same argument to say that everyone who reveres the Bible is cruel and unjust?
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 6:21:54 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 5:33:05 PM, RuvDraba wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

Dawkins is an atheist, but more importantly for the quote, Bronto, he's also an ethologist -- a studier of wild animal behaviour. That means, when he says compassionate justice aren't much to be found in nature, there's a lot of systematic observation (his own, and that of other ethologists) under that opinion. And just as Galileo knew more about astronomy than did the Popes of his day, Dawkins is more qualified to offer opinion about animal behaviour than (say) you, or some theologian.

I realise you don't like his opinions, Bronto, but the scorn of people who do not systematically study natural behaviour is not evidence. What you need is a reputable, well-published ethologist who has a different view, and is willing to defend it on observable evidence.

Good luck finding one!

Meanwhile, how you make the leap from observation of cruelty to cruelty of character is beyond me. Is this supposed to be a 'who smelt it dealt it' argument? Your faith's scriptures are full of cruelty and injustice too. Will you use the same argument to say that everyone who reveres the Bible is cruel and unjust?

It's ad homen. You have no construct to judge omniscient or omnipresent action. If a person knew you would become a homicidal terrorist who lets loose a nuke, is he "immoral" for killing you before the fact? Omniscient morality would be dictated on knowledge of the future and impossible for you to discern. Nevertheless, we have a moral compass given to us and passed down through our children, even to you. You don't think so? Western "morality" was passed down from Christianity's culture. Islamic "morality" looks nothing like yours because of your westernized, Christian historical culture. Without it what would have been your moral guide or moral construct? Communism? Naziism? Sharia?
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
matt8800
Posts: 2,077
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 6:24:09 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 5:00:43 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:54:09 PM, Redfordnutt wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

What point are you trying to make/ what question are you trying to ask?

Atheists have pitiless indifference as their moral code, meaning there is no moral code. There is no right. No wrong. No good. No evil.

1. I belong to no religion yet I take my own moral code very seriously. That proves your assertion wrong. Furthermore, despite the quotes that you attribute to Dawkins, he has his own opinion of good and evil and he takes that seriously also.

2. The world is harsh and indifferent. I don't know how that is even debatable.
desmac
Posts: 5,078
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 6:45:10 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
There is no cruelty in nature, it is a purely human construct. Animals will kill other animals to ensure their own and their offspring's survival. They will do this through instinct and learned behaviour, not through any thought process or moral judgement.
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 6:53:21 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 6:24:09 PM, matt8800 wrote:
At 4/4/2016 5:00:43 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:54:09 PM, Redfordnutt wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

What point are you trying to make/ what question are you trying to ask?

Atheists have pitiless indifference as their moral code, meaning there is no moral code. There is no right. No wrong. No good. No evil.

1. I belong to no religion yet I take my own moral code very seriously. That proves your assertion wrong. Furthermore, despite the quotes that you attribute to Dawkins, he has his own opinion of good and evil and he takes that seriously also.

2. The world is harsh and indifferent. I don't know how that is even debatable.

What is the moral code based on? What things are good? What things are bad? You said you were raised Christian. Thus, I assume your general "morality" stems from your raising. If not, you seem westernized in mindset, so why not the moral code of Iran? Why not the moral code of China? Their moral codes are vastly different than ours. Can you admit that your moral code generally stems from your Christian raising, or do you claim "acting Christianly" by your own accord completely, seeing that the moral code is different in most parts of the world?
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 6:54:48 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 6:45:10 PM, desmac wrote:
There is no cruelty in nature, it is a purely human construct. Animals will kill other animals to ensure their own and their offspring's survival. They will do this through instinct and learned behaviour, not through any thought process or moral judgement.

Would you kill and eat me to survive?
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 6:56:17 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 6:24:09 PM, matt8800 wrote:
At 4/4/2016 5:00:43 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:54:09 PM, Redfordnutt wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

What point are you trying to make/ what question are you trying to ask?

Atheists have pitiless indifference as their moral code, meaning there is no moral code. There is no right. No wrong. No good. No evil.

1. I belong to no religion yet I take my own moral code very seriously. That proves your assertion wrong. Furthermore, despite the quotes that you attribute to Dawkins, he has his own opinion of good and evil and he takes that seriously also.

2. The world is harsh and indifferent. I don't know how that is even debatable.

If we are raptured away and God proves His existance will you still reject Him or do a 180 back to your original roots?
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
desmac
Posts: 5,078
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 6:58:11 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 6:54:48 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 6:45:10 PM, desmac wrote:
There is no cruelty in nature, it is a purely human construct. Animals will kill other animals to ensure their own and their offspring's survival. They will do this through instinct and learned behaviour, not through any thought process or moral judgement.

Would you kill and eat me to survive?

If absolutely necessary, yes.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 7:02:45 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 6:54:48 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 6:45:10 PM, desmac wrote:
There is no cruelty in nature, it is a purely human construct. Animals will kill other animals to ensure their own and their offspring's survival. They will do this through instinct and learned behaviour, not through any thought process or moral judgement.

Would you kill and eat me to survive?

Only with tar tar sauce and bourbon. Can you provide both?
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
TBR
Posts: 9,991
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 7:30:16 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

As usual, I don't get where you are driving this bus. Sad part is, when I started reading it I though you were the author. It sounded so sane.

Anyway. What are you trying to get at? That the description is wrong? That Atheists are indifferent because of the reality of his statement? I seriously don't what you are trying to get at - if anything.
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,136
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 7:38:45 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 5:00:43 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:54:09 PM, Redfordnutt wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

What point are you trying to make/ what question are you trying to ask?

Atheists have pitiless indifference as their moral code, meaning there is no moral code. There is no right. No wrong. No good. No evil.

No, you twit, Dawkins isn't describing the morality of atheists. He is describing an amoral universe.
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten
Skepticalone
Posts: 6,136
Add as Friend
Challenge to a Debate
Send a Message
4/4/2016 7:41:01 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 4/4/2016 5:08:11 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 5:03:10 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:50:33 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:39:29 PM, DanneJeRusse wrote:
At 4/4/2016 4:37:03 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
The total amount of suffering per year in the natural world is beyond all decent contemplation. During the minute that it takes me to compose this sentence, thousands of animals are being eaten alive, many others are running for their lives, whimpering with fear, others are slowly being devoured from within by rasping parasites, thousands of all kinds are dying of starvation, thirst, and disease. It must be so. If there ever is a time of plenty, this very fact will automatically lead to an increase in the population until the natural state of starvation and misery is restored. In a universe of electrons and selfish genes, blind physical forces and genetic replication, some people are going to get hurt, other people are going to get lucky, and you won't find any rhyme or reason in it, nor any justice. The universe that we observe has precisely the properties we should expect if there is, at bottom, no design, no purpose, no evil, no good, nothing but pitiless indifference.
-Richard Dawkins(Atheist author)

Facts really, really really bother you, don't they.

Are they facts?

Yes.

Prophecy would say nope.

Prophecies are not valid when compared to reality.

Sure they are. Did you look at the debate I offered. If a person picked heads or tails correctly 1,000 times in a row you could say there is ample evidence that they are telepathic.

"Telepathic"? Can they read the mind of the quarter?! That makes no cents. (Pun intended)
This thread is like eavesdropping on a conversation in a mental asylum. - Bulproof

You can call your invisible friends whatever you like. - Desmac

What the hell kind of coked up sideshow has this thread turned into. - Casten