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The temptation of Jesus

Chloe8
Posts: 3,571
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4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.
janesix
Posts: 6,495
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4/15/2016 10:20:22 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

A healthy adult human can easily fast for 40 days.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.
The-Holy-Macrel
Posts: 777
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4/15/2016 10:30:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

So?

Unlikely. Really.

Oh, another unlikely.

Not literal.

Jesus told the disiples.

They wrote the books.

Could and much more.

Yeah, he still tried though.

All history is a myth.

Some flying spaghetti monster could have wrote everything and brainwashed our knowledge of what happened.

The only thing we know for certain is we exist.

"Reality" just seems ligit.

Look! Likely again!

<(O._.O)>

(supposed to be kirby smiling)
Harikrish
Posts: 14,755
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4/15/2016 10:35:06 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

What you don't get is the moral of the story. Satan tempted Eve a woman and she succumbed. Satan tried to tempt Jesus a man and he resisted. We now know Eve a woman was the weakest link.
Chloe8
Posts: 3,571
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4/15/2016 10:47:40 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 10:35:06 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

What you don't get is the moral of the story. Satan tempted Eve a woman and she succumbed. Satan tried to tempt Jesus a man and he resisted. We now know Eve a woman was the weakest link.

Don't you agree its ridiculous that a god (jesus) would be tempted to worship an evil angel he was actually sent to this earth to destroy? It's impossible that a creature of Jesus's intelligence, knowledge and power would even comprehend such a thing!

Eve has nothing to do with the temptation of Jesus.
random_noob
Posts: 21
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4/15/2016 10:53:35 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

OP, may I ask, are you an atheist? If yes, why would you read the bible? Just curious
Harikrish
Posts: 14,755
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4/15/2016 11:06:11 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 10:47:40 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:35:06 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

What you don't get is the moral of the story. Satan tempted Eve a woman and she succumbed. Satan tried to tempt Jesus a man and he resisted. We now know Eve a woman was the weakest link.

Don't you agree its ridiculous that a god (jesus) would be tempted to worship an evil angel he was actually sent to this earth to destroy? It's impossible that a creature of Jesus's intelligence, knowledge and power would even comprehend such a thing!

Eve has nothing to do with the temptation of Jesus.

Jesus was not sent to destroy Satan. He was sent to save the sick children of Israel. Jesus only rebuked Satan after Satan failed to tempt him. You are out of your league when it comes to scriptures.
Women are not only easily tempted by the knowledge contained in a fruit as Eve was. We know today women are also attracted to the shape and size of fruits and vegetables for other reasons than what possible knowledge they might possess. How did Satan know the weakness women had for certain fruits and vegetables?
Chloe8
Posts: 3,571
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4/15/2016 11:09:44 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 10:53:35 PM, random_noob wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

OP, may I ask, are you an atheist? If yes, why would you read the bible? Just curious

My position is best described as very atheistic agnosticism. I know all of the world's religions are false but I acknowledge I can't disprove the theory of some type of non interventionist god causing the big bang or possibly even an earlier event as unlikely as it seems. Ultimately I accept that before the big bang it is impossible to know with certainty what happened. I often just call myself an atheist though as my views are more in line with atheism than agnosticism and my position takes some explaining.

I am interested in religion and religious debate. I enjoy reading Christian scripture and exposing its flaws. It actually amazes me how people actually believe in Christianity. It's so obvious it's false!

Reading the bible is not neccessary To know Christianity is false but To disprove religions in arguments you have to know about their beliefs. I know Sikhism is false but as I know nothing of its scripture I would struggle in an argument with a Sikh over whether their religion is true or not.
EtrnlVw
Posts: 4,238
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4/15/2016 11:12:01 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

Sounds like maybe you are reading the Gospels at least now, imagine that....an atheist gathering the Gospels in an attempt to educate itself lol, and this is what happens..... doesn't understand fasting, doesn't understand spiritual visions, doesn't understand spiritual encounters or types and shadows. Doesn't realize that the encounter speaks to several weaknesses people struggle with..... power, selfishness and the rejection of righteousness and commitment to God... what more can we ask of an atheist here? oh well...
Chloe8
Posts: 3,571
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4/15/2016 11:41:11 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 11:06:11 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:47:40 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:35:06 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

What you don't get is the moral of the story. Satan tempted Eve a woman and she succumbed. Satan tried to tempt Jesus a man and he resisted. We now know Eve a woman was the weakest link.

Don't you agree its ridiculous that a god (jesus) would be tempted to worship an evil angel he was actually sent to this earth to destroy? It's impossible that a creature of Jesus's intelligence, knowledge and power would even comprehend such a thing!

Eve has nothing to do with the temptation of Jesus.

Jesus was not sent to destroy Satan. He was sent to save the sick children of Israel. Jesus only rebuked Satan after Satan failed to tempt him. You are out of your league when it comes to scriptures.

Hebrews 2:14-15 tells us: "Since then the children [that"s us, the children of God] share in flesh and blood [that is, we have physical bodies], He Himself [Jesus] likewise also partook of the same [a physical body], that through death He might render powerless him who had the power of death, that is, the devil; and might deliver those who through fear of death were subject to slavery all their lives." (emphasis added).

I know more about scripture than most Christians, especially the half hearted ones here in the uk!

Jesus's death is supposed to render Satan powerless and I should have stated that instead. I agree Jesus was not meant to completely destroy Satan but i was implying he was sent to defeat satan and stop his evil influence on humanity. I know that according to the bible satan has a big role to play in the future it prophesises.

Women are not only easily tempted by the knowledge contained in a fruit as Eve was. We know today women are also attracted to the shape and size of fruits and vegetables for other reasons than what possible knowledge they might possess. How did Satan know the weakness women had for certain fruits and vegetables?

I don't see how this sexist nonsense has any relevance to this thread. The garden of Eden is a myth. Adam and eve didn't exist.

Do you think they did exist? How do you manage to blend Christianity, Islam and Hinduism into one religion?
Chloe8
Posts: 3,571
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4/15/2016 11:47:00 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 11:12:01 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

Sounds like maybe you are reading the Gospels at least now, imagine that....an atheist gathering the Gospels in an attempt to educate itself lol, and this is what happens..... doesn't understand fasting, doesn't understand spiritual visions, doesn't understand spiritual encounters or types and shadows. Doesn't realize that the encounter speaks to several weaknesses people struggle with..... power, selfishness and the rejection of righteousness and commitment to God... what more can we ask of an atheist here? oh well...

So do you actually think Satan tried to tempt Jesus to worship him after Jesus fasted in a desert for 40 days on top of a mountain where all of earths kingdoms were visible?

Or do you agree its just a made up story?
Harikrish
Posts: 14,755
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4/15/2016 11:55:31 PM
Posted: 1 year ago
At 4/15/2016 11:41:11 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 4/15/2016 11:06:11 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:47:40 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:35:06 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

What you don't get is the moral of the story. Satan tempted Eve a woman and she succumbed. Satan tried to tempt Jesus a man and he resisted. We now know Eve a woman was the weakest link.

Don't you agree its ridiculous that a god (jesus) would be tempted to worship an evil angel he was actually sent to this earth to destroy? It's impossible that a creature of Jesus's intelligence, knowledge and power would even comprehend such a thing!

Eve has nothing to do with the temptation of Jesus.

Jesus was not sent to destroy Satan. He was sent to save the sick children of Israel. Jesus only rebuked Satan after Satan failed to tempt him. You are out of your league when it comes to scriptures.

Hebrews 2:14-15 tells us: "Since then the children [that"s us, the children of God] share in flesh and blood [that is, we have physical bodies], He Himself [Jesus] likewise also partook of the same [a physical body], that through death He might render powerless him who had the power of death, that is, the devil; and might deliver those who through fear of death were subject to slavery all their lives." (emphasis added).

I know more about scripture than most Christians, especially the half hearted ones here in the uk!

Jesus's death is supposed to render Satan powerless and I should have stated that instead. I agree Jesus was not meant to completely destroy Satan but i was implying he was sent to defeat satan and stop his evil influence on humanity. I know that according to the bible satan has a big role to play in the future it prophesises.

Women are not only easily tempted by the knowledge contained in a fruit as Eve was. We know today women are also attracted to the shape and size of fruits and vegetables for other reasons than what possible knowledge they might possess. How did Satan know the weakness women had for certain fruits and vegetables?

I don't see how this sexist nonsense has any relevance to this thread. The garden of Eden is a myth. Adam and eve didn't exist.

Do you think they did exist? How do you manage to blend Christianity, Islam and Hinduism into one religion?

By observing how people handle the produce at the grocery store.
SingularityofLight
Posts: 1,207
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6/2/2017 11:16:39 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 4/15/2016 11:09:44 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:53:35 PM, random_noob wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

OP, may I ask, are you an atheist? If yes, why would you read the bible? Just curious

My position is best described as very atheistic agnosticism. I know all of the world's religions are false but I acknowledge I can't disprove the theory of some type of non interventionist god causing the big bang or possibly even an earlier event as unlikely as it seems. Ultimately I accept that before the big bang it is impossible to know with certainty what happened. I often just call myself an atheist though as my views are more in line with atheism than agnosticism and my position takes some explaining.

I am interested in religion and religious debate. I enjoy reading Christian scripture and exposing its flaws. It actually amazes me how people actually believe in Christianity. It's so obvious it's false!

Reading the bible is not neccessary To know Christianity is false but To disprove religions in arguments you have to know about their beliefs. I know Sikhism is false but as I know nothing of its scripture I would struggle in an argument with a Sikh over whether their religion is true or not.
This is a very interesting statement by someone who claims they don't believe in spirituality (which includes instincts, intuition, inspiration). You know it is false, but you don't really know anything about it?
Chloe8
Posts: 3,571
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6/2/2017 11:36:18 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/2/2017 11:16:39 PM, SingularityofLight wrote:
At 4/15/2016 11:09:44 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:53:35 PM, random_noob wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

OP, may I ask, are you an atheist? If yes, why would you read the bible? Just curious

My position is best described as very atheistic agnosticism. I know all of the world's religions are false but I acknowledge I can't disprove the theory of some type of non interventionist god causing the big bang or possibly even an earlier event as unlikely as it seems. Ultimately I accept that before the big bang it is impossible to know with certainty what happened. I often just call myself an atheist though as my views are more in line with atheism than agnosticism and my position takes some explaining.

I am interested in religion and religious debate. I enjoy reading Christian scripture and exposing its flaws. It actually amazes me how people actually believe in Christianity. It's so obvious it's false!

Reading the bible is not neccessary To know Christianity is false but To disprove religions in arguments you have to know about their beliefs. I know Sikhism is false but as I know nothing of its scripture I would struggle in an argument with a Sikh over whether their religion is true or not.
This is a very interesting statement by someone who claims they don't believe in spirituality (which includes instincts, intuition, inspiration). You know it is false, but you don't really know anything about it?

I challenge you to provide some evidence that spirituality is real. It is possible to logically conclude something is false without significant study or research of the nature of what is claimed is as ludicrous as for example the existence of flying sheep or the religion of Sikhism. You are picking at straws anyway. The point is that Christianity is demonstrably false, not that I'm anything special at arguing the position. I'm not the first or the last person to point out these flaws.
Quadrunner
Posts: 4,241
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6/2/2017 11:43:39 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 4/15/2016 10:53:35 PM, random_noob wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

OP, may I ask, are you an atheist? If yes, why would you read the bible? Just curious

She is going covering this in my thread
SingularityofLight
Posts: 1,207
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6/2/2017 11:44:54 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/2/2017 11:36:18 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 6/2/2017 11:16:39 PM, SingularityofLight wrote:
At 4/15/2016 11:09:44 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:53:35 PM, random_noob wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

OP, may I ask, are you an atheist? If yes, why would you read the bible? Just curious

My position is best described as very atheistic agnosticism. I know all of the world's religions are false but I acknowledge I can't disprove the theory of some type of non interventionist god causing the big bang or possibly even an earlier event as unlikely as it seems. Ultimately I accept that before the big bang it is impossible to know with certainty what happened. I often just call myself an atheist though as my views are more in line with atheism than agnosticism and my position takes some explaining.

I am interested in religion and religious debate. I enjoy reading Christian scripture and exposing its flaws. It actually amazes me how people actually believe in Christianity. It's so obvious it's false!

Reading the bible is not neccessary To know Christianity is false but To disprove religions in arguments you have to know about their beliefs. I know Sikhism is false but as I know nothing of its scripture I would struggle in an argument with a Sikh over whether their religion is true or not.
This is a very interesting statement by someone who claims they don't believe in spirituality (which includes instincts, intuition, inspiration). You know it is false, but you don't really know anything about it?

I challenge you to provide some evidence that spirituality is real. It is possible to logically conclude something is false without significant study or research of the nature of what is claimed is as ludicrous as for example the existence of flying sheep or the religion of Sikhism. You are picking at straws anyway. The point is that Christianity is demonstrably false, not that I'm anything special at arguing the position. I'm not the first or the last person to point out these flaws.

Watch the video I posted on "Question to the spiritually minded." In fact, watch both parts. It's probably not the proof you are looking for. But watch them both, and tell me your impressions.
Composer
Posts: 6,182
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6/3/2017 1:55:31 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
Story book Jebus "was in all points tempted like as we are" (Heb. 4:15), but who today is ever engaged in discussion by a fallen angel devil?
rnjs
Posts: 689
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6/3/2017 12:14:49 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

If it is mentioned in Mathew, Mark and Luke then why would it need to be mentioned by John, plus there are other things that aren't mentioned by all three, but that is the nature of witnessing.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

People fast for longer than 40 days and many say it has health benefits.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

How do you know the likelihood of it happening.


4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

All the kingdoms in existence at the time would not require a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

How do you know who may have witnessed it in whole or parts.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

Just because some one is tempting another, it may not be tempting in the least to the one being tempted.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

The Gospels have been shown to be quite trustworthy.
bulproof
Posts: 30,233
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6/3/2017 12:45:57 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/3/2017 12:14:49 PM, rnjs wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.


If it is mentioned in Mathew, Mark and Luke then why would it need to be mentioned by John, plus there are other things that aren't mentioned by all three, but that is the nature of witnessing.


2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.


People fast for longer than 40 days and many say it has health benefits.


3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.


How do you know the likelihood of it happening.



4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

All the kingdoms in existence at the time would not require a flat earth.


5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

How do you know who may have witnessed it in whole or parts.


6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.


Just because some one is tempting another, it may not be tempting in the least to the one being tempted.


http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

The Gospels have been shown to be quite trustworthy.
There isn't even corroborative evidence that the main character ever existed.
Produce one credible historian who will attest to the historicity of the miracle working bible Jesus.
When logic and proportion have fallen sloppy dead
And the white knight is talking backwards
And the red queen's off with her head
Remember what the dormouse said
Feed your head, feed your head
SingularityofLight
Posts: 1,207
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6/3/2017 5:44:48 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/2/2017 11:36:18 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 6/2/2017 11:16:39 PM, SingularityofLight wrote:
At 4/15/2016 11:09:44 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:53:35 PM, random_noob wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

OP, may I ask, are you an atheist? If yes, why would you read the bible? Just curious

My position is best described as very atheistic agnosticism. I know all of the world's religions are false but I acknowledge I can't disprove the theory of some type of non interventionist god causing the big bang or possibly even an earlier event as unlikely as it seems. Ultimately I accept that before the big bang it is impossible to know with certainty what happened. I often just call myself an atheist though as my views are more in line with atheism than agnosticism and my position takes some explaining.

I am interested in religion and religious debate. I enjoy reading Christian scripture and exposing its flaws. It actually amazes me how people actually believe in Christianity. It's so obvious it's false!

Reading the bible is not neccessary To know Christianity is false but To disprove religions in arguments you have to know about their beliefs. I know Sikhism is false but as I know nothing of its scripture I would struggle in an argument with a Sikh over whether their religion is true or not.
This is a very interesting statement by someone who claims they don't believe in spirituality (which includes instincts, intuition, inspiration). You know it is false, but you don't really know anything about it?

I challenge you to provide some evidence that spirituality is real. It is possible to logically conclude something is false without significant study or research of the nature of what is claimed is as ludicrous as for example the existence of flying sheep or the religion of Sikhism. You are picking at straws anyway. The point is that Christianity is demonstrably false, not that I'm anything special at arguing the position. I'm not the first or the last person to point out these flaws.

Here is a link to the video which may or may not provide the "evidence" you are looking for:

https://www.youtube.com...
SingularityofLight
Posts: 1,207
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6/3/2017 5:50:00 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/2/2017 11:36:18 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 6/2/2017 11:16:39 PM, SingularityofLight wrote:
At 4/15/2016 11:09:44 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:53:35 PM, random_noob wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

OP, may I ask, are you an atheist? If yes, why would you read the bible? Just curious

My position is best described as very atheistic agnosticism. I know all of the world's religions are false but I acknowledge I can't disprove the theory of some type of non interventionist god causing the big bang or possibly even an earlier event as unlikely as it seems. Ultimately I accept that before the big bang it is impossible to know with certainty what happened. I often just call myself an atheist though as my views are more in line with atheism than agnosticism and my position takes some explaining.

I am interested in religion and religious debate. I enjoy reading Christian scripture and exposing its flaws. It actually amazes me how people actually believe in Christianity. It's so obvious it's false!

Reading the bible is not neccessary To know Christianity is false but To disprove religions in arguments you have to know about their beliefs. I know Sikhism is false but as I know nothing of its scripture I would struggle in an argument with a Sikh over whether their religion is true or not.
This is a very interesting statement by someone who claims they don't believe in spirituality (which includes instincts, intuition, inspiration). You know it is false, but you don't really know anything about it?

I challenge you to provide some evidence that spirituality is real. It is possible to logically conclude something is false without significant study or research of the nature of what is claimed is as ludicrous as for example the existence of flying sheep or the religion of Sikhism. You are picking at straws anyway. The point is that Christianity is demonstrably false, not that I'm anything special at arguing the position. I'm not the first or the last person to point out these flaws.

And, unless you believe in the "order out of chaos" crap of self-organizational theory, the molecular transport of molecules to make the coding which goes into protein and DNA sequences within living cells.
PureX
Posts: 3,549
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6/3/2017 5:56:38 PM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

You're never going to understand any of this stuff if you keep insisting on reading the Bible like it's a newspaper.
dee-em
Posts: 8,294
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6/4/2017 2:11:06 AM
Posted: 5 months ago
At 6/3/2017 5:56:38 PM, PureX wrote:
At 4/15/2016 10:06:38 PM, Chloe8 wrote:
The story of the temptation of Jesus is full of problems, as follows:

1. It is only mentioned in Mark, Matthew, and Luke, but not in John.

2. It supposedly happened after Jesus went into the desert and fasted for 40 days- a very unlikely occurrence and likely not survivable.

3. It involves the physical appearance of Satan and a highly unlikely conversation between the two.

4. It speaks of being on a tall mountain such that Jesus could see all of the kingdoms of the world, something that might make sense on a flat earth.

5. It clearly lacked any witnesses other than Jesus and Satan.

6. Jesus is tempted to worship Satan, but since Jesus was divine, such would not be a valid temptation, because Jesus could have attained everything Satan offered (turning stones into bread, jumping off the mountain safely, and taking over the kingdoms of the world) without needing to worship him.

http://en.wikipedia.org...

It is unfortunate for Christianity that this mythical episode was documented in the gospels. It strains credulity, and it is not necessary to the overall message of the gospels. It does nothing to enhance the image of Jesus. Furthermore, it telegraphs the fact that other stories in the gospels are likely mythical- even those that otherwise sound plausible.

You're never going to understand any of this stuff if you keep insisting on reading the Bible like it's a newspaper.

Do you mean there's another way of reading English besides left to right and top to bottom? What is it? Lol.
Fatihah: It's like your mother making spaghetti and after you taste it and don't like it, you say "well my mom must not exist". Not because their is no logical evidence but because she doesn't do what you want.