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John 17:3

MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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5/30/2016 1:46:40 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

John 17 is Jesus's explanation of his mission and the role he will play in our salvation. He glorified his father and now the father was glorifying him. Everyone knows jesus said all his powers came from his father. But what were these powers and why was it given to him?
Jesus was give all authority over heaven and earth. The only name that can offer you salvation and eternal life is Jesus, not Jehovah, not Michael. Jehovah is not even mentioned as the name that leads one to salvation or forgiveness from sin.
"Salvation is found in no one else, for there is no other name under heaven given to mankind by which we must be saved" (Acts 4:12)

And only Jesus was the way to salvation and the one to judge who received it.
John 5:22""For the Father judges no one at all, but he has entrusted all the judging to the Son,

What name do you depend on for your salvatio, Jesus, Michael, Jehovah?

"After Jesus said this, he looked toward heaven and prayed: "Father, the time has come. Glorify YOUR SON, that YOUR SON may glorify you. For you granted him authority over all people THAT HE MIGHT GIVE ETERNAL LIFE TO ALL THOSE YOU HAVE GIVEN HIM. Now this is eternal life: that they may know you, the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom you have sent. I have brought you glory on earth by completing the work you gave me to do. And now, Father, glorify me in your presence with the glory I HAD WITH YOU BEFORE THE WORLD BEGAN " For I gave them the words you gave me and they accepted them. They knew with certainty that I came from you, and they believed that you sent me " All I have is yours, and all you have is mine. And glory has come TO ME through them. I will remain in the world no longer, but they are still in the world, and I am coming to you. Holy Father, protect them by the power of your name - the name you gave me - so that they may be one as we are one " My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be IN US so that the world may believe that you have sent me. I have given them the glory that you gave me, that they may be one as we are one: I IN THEM and you in me. May they be brought to complete unity to let the world know that you sent me and have loved them even as you have loved me. Father, I want those you have given me to be with me where I am, and to see my glory, the glory you have given me BECAUSE YOU LOVED ME BEFORE THE CREATION OF THE WORLD. Righteous Father, though the world does not know you, I know you, and they know that you have sent me. I have made you known to them, and will continue to make you known in order that the love you have for me may be in them AND THAT I MYSELF MAY BE IN THEM."" John 17:1-5, 8, 10-11, 20-26"
simplelife
Posts: 134
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5/30/2016 3:10:28 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

Colossians doesn't tell us anything. It's amazing how many Christians think the Bible can speak to them. They don't understand that it's their own interpretations of what they read in the Bible that they believe in. Do you know how easy it was for those Satan-minded Catholic and Jews to change the writings they put together to add to the OT prophecies? Their New Testament has deceived everyone who has read them.

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians. : :
tarantula
Posts: 854
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5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

YAWN!
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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5/30/2016 5:03:16 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

YAWN!

No-one forced you to read it, lol.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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5/30/2016 8:02:07 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 5:03:16 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

YAWN!

No-one forced you to read it, lol.

Each member of the Trinity is God. The Father is God (John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2). The Son is God (John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16).
annanicole
Posts: 19,785
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5/30/2016 8:15:54 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

Colossians says both "by" and "through", which are both accurate as they are used in the passage. The word "di" or "dia" is translated "by" much more often than anything else.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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5/30/2016 8:40:43 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 8:02:07 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 5/30/2016 5:03:16 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Each member of the Trinity is God. The Father is God (John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2). The Son is God (John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16).

John 6:27
27 Work, not for the food that perishes, but for the food that remains for everlasting life, which the Son of man will give you; for on this one the Father, God himself, has put his seal of approval."

That does not support the trinity and in fact separates God and the son because it shows that the son needed God's approval to act. Thus disproving the Trinity.

Romans 1:7
7 to all those who are in Rome as God"s beloved ones, called to be holy ones:
May you have undeserved kindness and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Again this scripture denies the trinity because it mentions both individually and uses the connective "and" to unite them.

1 Peter 1:2, 3
2 according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, with sanctification by the spirit, for the purpose of being obedient and sprinkled with the blood of Jesus Christ:
May undeserved kindness and peace be increased to you.
3 Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, for according to his great mercy he gave us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Again this passage mentions the three separately which shows them to be individuals, each with their own role, but the following verse, which you carefully and deliberately avoided because it completely kills the trinity by declaring that the son has a God over him, which would not be the case in a trinity of equals.

John 1:1 when correctly translated actually also disproves the Trinity, but I won;t include it here all the same.

John 1:14
14 So the Word became flesh and resided among us, and we had a view of his glory, a glory such as belongs to an only-begotten son from a father; and he was full of divine favor and truth.

Again this completely disproves the Trinity in that is tells us that the Word (not the flesh of Jesus) is Jehovah's only begotten (by creation) son.

Since Jehovah has no other way of begetting a son it can only be by creation.

Romans 9:5
5 To them the forefathers belong, and from them the Christ descended according to the flesh. God, who is over all, be praised forever. Amen.

Again this is no support to the Trinity because Paul is praising God (Jehovah) for the provision of the Christ.

Colossians 2:9
9 because it is in him that all the fullness of the divine quality dwells bodily.

How does this support the Trinity?

All spirit beings are divine, that is why even the Angels are called gods. Being divine is what beings spirit means. Paul there is doing nothing but commenting on the nature of Christ before and after his human experience, which he shares with his father and all the angels. Exactly as a correct translation of John 1:1 does.

Hebrews 1:8
8 But about the Son, he says: "God is your throne forever and ever, and the scepter of your Kingdom is the scepter of uprightness.

Again this is no support to the trinity since it tells the son that God is his throne, it does not call him God.

Of course God is his throne, since it is God who has appointed him King of his Kingdom.

Again that is anti-trinity not pro-trinity.

1 John 5:20
20 But we know that the Son of God has come, and he has given us insight so that we may gain the knowledge of the one who is true. And we are in union with the one who is true, by means of his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and life everlasting.

Again no support to the trinity.

John is here pointing out to us that Christ, the son, has given us insight into the father, not that he is the father.

He then goes on to say that we are in union with the father through the son. The antecedent to "This" being the father not the son.

Acts 5:3, 4
3 But Peter said: "Ananias, why has Satan emboldened you to lie to the holy spirit and secretly hold back some of the price of the field? 4 As long as it remained with you, did it not remain yours? And after it was sold, was it not in your control? Why have you thought up such a deed as this in your heart? You have lied, not to men, but to God.

Whilst I admit I can see where you are coming from with this one it still does not prove your case. Since holy spirit is Jehovah's communication medium if you lie to it that lie is passed on to Jehovah. You have been forced to provide a meaning which simply cannot be there, just like all desperate supporters of the lie which is the trinity teaching.

1 Corinthians 3:16
16 Do you not know that you yourselves are God"s temple and that the spirit of God dwells in you?

How does that support the trinity. All Paul is pointing out is that spirit of God dwells in us. Of course it does, it is what gives us life and consciousness, that is why Paul ould also say that " god's spirit bears witness with our spirit" because that is how he communicates with us, by joining our spirit with his spirit.

There is only one spirit and it is in all that posses life.

It is not holy of itself but is only holy when used fro r holy purposes.

All yu have shown is that you are prepared to distort and misapply Jehovah's word to your own purposes.

The trinity is not only false it is impossible.

You cannot have a trinity, one part of which is clearly stated by scripture to be created (begotten). John 1:14, Revelation 3:14.

You can twist scripture all you like Hari,but it will always bite you back as the scriptures you have cited here have done, and as I have shown clearly.
annanicole
Posts: 19,785
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5/30/2016 9:44:32 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 8:40:43 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:02:07 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 5/30/2016 5:03:16 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Each member of the Trinity is God. The Father is God (John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2). The Son is God (John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16).

John 6:27
27 Work, not for the food that perishes, but for the food that remains for everlasting life, which the Son of man will give you; for on this one the Father, God himself, has put his seal of approval."

That does not support the trinity and in fact separates God and the son because it shows that the son needed God's approval to act. Thus disproving the Trinity.

... and THAT does zilch to disprove the triune nature of the godhead, for everyone knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities. I fail to see why you concern yourself so much with the subject, other than possibly you fare a little better on it.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Rukado
Posts: 527
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5/30/2016 9:58:27 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

Do you believe Jesus is God?

Without regard for the Trinity, there are a lot of verses that seem to equate Jesus with God. John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God... 14a And the Word became flesh and dwelt among us.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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5/30/2016 9:59:38 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 8:40:43 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:02:07 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 5/30/2016 5:03:16 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Each member of the Trinity is God. The Father is God (John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2). The Son is God (John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16).

John 6:27
27 Work, not for the food that perishes, but for the food that remains for everlasting life, which the Son of man will give you; for on this one the Father, God himself, has put his seal of approval."

That does not support the trinity and in fact separates God and the son because it shows that the son needed God's approval to act. Thus disproving the Trinity.

The verse is to prove the Father is God. God the father.
Romans 1:7
7 to all those who are in Rome as God"s beloved ones, called to be holy ones:
May you have undeserved kindness and peace from God our Father and the Lord Jesus Christ.

Again this scripture denies the trinity because it mentions both individually and uses the connective "and" to unite them.

The verse is to prove the Father is God. God the father
1 Peter 1:2, 3
2 according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, with sanctification by the spirit, for the purpose of being obedient and sprinkled with the blood of Jesus Christ:
May undeserved kindness and peace be increased to you.
3 Praised be the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, for according to his great mercy he gave us a new birth to a living hope through the resurrection of Jesus Christ from the dead,

Again this passage mentions the three separately which shows them to be individuals, each with their own role, but the following verse, which you carefully and deliberately avoided because it completely kills the trinity by declaring that the son has a God over him, which would not be the case in a trinity of equals.

The verse is to prove the Father is God. God the father.

John 1:1 when correctly translated actually also disproves the Trinity, but I won;t include it here all the same.

The verse is to prove the Son is God. God the Son.
John 1:14
14 So the Word became flesh and resided among us, and we had a view of his glory, a glory such as belongs to an only-begotten son from a father; and he was full of divine favor and truth.

Again this completely disproves the Trinity in that is tells us that the Word (not the flesh of Jesus) is Jehovah's only begotten (by creation) son.

Since Jehovah has no other way of begetting a son it can only be by creation.

The verse is to prove the Son is God. God the Son.
Romans 9:5
5 To them the forefathers belong, and from them the Christ descended according to the flesh. God, who is over all, be praised forever. Amen.

Again this is no support to the Trinity because Paul is praising God (Jehovah) for the provision of the Christ.

The verse is to prove the Son is God. God the Son.

Colossians 2:9
9 because it is in him that all the fullness of the divine quality dwells bodily.

How does this support the Trinity?

All spirit beings are divine, that is why even the Angels are called gods. Being divine is what beings spirit means. Paul there is doing nothing but commenting on the nature of Christ before and after his human experience, which he shares with his father and all the angels. Exactly as a correct translation of John 1:1 does.

The verse is to prove the Son is God. God the Son.

Hebrews 1:8
8 But about the Son, he says: "God is your throne forever and ever, and the scepter of your Kingdom is the scepter of uprightness.

Again this is no support to the trinity since it tells the son that God is his throne, it does not call him God.

Of course God is his throne, since it is God who has appointed him King of his Kingdom.

Again that is anti-trinity not pro-trinity.

The verse is to prove the Son is God. God the Son.

1 John 5:20
20 But we know that the Son of God has come, and he has given us insight so that we may gain the knowledge of the one who is true. And we are in union with the one who is true, by means of his Son Jesus Christ. This is the true God and life everlasting.

Again no support to the trinity.

John is here pointing out to us that Christ, the son, has given us insight into the father, not that he is the father.

He then goes on to say that we are in union with the father through the son. The antecedent to "This" being the father not the son.

The verse is to prove the Son is God. God the Son.

Acts 5:3, 4
3 But Peter said: "Ananias, why has Satan emboldened you to lie to the holy spirit and secretly hold back some of the price of the field? 4 As long as it remained with you, did it not remain yours? And after it was sold, was it not in your control? Why have you thought up such a deed as this in your heart? You have lied, not to men, but to God.

Whilst I admit I can see where you are coming from with this one it still does not prove your case. Since holy spirit is Jehovah's communication medium if you lie to it that lie is passed on to Jehovah. You have been forced to provide a meaning which simply cannot be there, just like all desperate supporters of the lie which is the trinity teaching.

The verse is to prove the Holy Spirit is God. God the Holy Spirit.

1 Corinthians 3:16
16 Do you not know that you yourselves are God"s temple and that the spirit of God dwells in you?

How does that support the trinity. All Paul is pointing out is that spirit of God dwells in us. Of course it does, it is what gives us life and consciousness, that is why Paul ould also say that " god's spirit bears witness with our spirit" because that is how he communicates with us, by joining our spirit with his spirit.

The verse is to prove the Holy Spirit is God. God the Holy Spirit

There is only one spirit and it is in all that posses life.

It is not holy of itself but is only holy when used fro r holy purposes.

All yu have shown is that you are prepared to distort and misapply Jehovah's word to your own purposes.

The trinity is not only false it is impossible.

You cannot have a trinity, one part of which is clearly stated by scripture to be created (begotten). John 1:14, Revelation 3:14.

You can twist scripture all you like Hari,but it will always bite you back as the scriptures you have cited here have done, and as I have shown clearly.

The verses show each entity is a God. God the Father, God the Son and God the Holy Spirit. Together they make up the Trinity which means three or triune.

Showing they are three is simple. Showing together they make one reguires an understanding of the Godhead.
kjw47
Posts: 1,624
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5/30/2016 10:58:58 PM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

YAWN!

Its astounding--every time a JW teaches something Jesus taught--it is rejected by the majority--the only reasoning behind that can be--the hatred of truth. Just like in Jesus day-- Jesus' truths exposed 99% of all religion as false and that they were misleading all who listened to them to partake off the table of demons( 1Cor 10:21)-- so the world murdered Jesus, apostles and Christians.
bulproof
Posts: 25,227
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5/31/2016 12:59:47 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 10:58:58 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

YAWN!


Its astounding--every time a JW teaches something Jesus taught--it is rejected by the majority--the only reasoning behind that can be--the hatred of truth. Just like in Jesus day-- Jesus' truths exposed 99% of all religion as false and that they were misleading all who listened to them to partake off the table of demons( 1Cor 10:21)-- so the world murdered Jesus, apostles and Christians.

Madman says there weren't any demons back then, so there.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
annanicole
Posts: 19,785
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5/31/2016 2:43:43 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 10:58:58 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Its astounding--every time a JW teaches something Jesus taught--it is rejected by the majority--the only reasoning behind that can be--the hatred of truth.

No, the problem comes when the WatchTower followers venture off into teaching things that Jesus did NOT teach. An example is John 2: 19. Jesus certainly taught His own bodily resurrection.

Your disfellowshipped cohort, the MadClown, just speculates the Jesus didn't know what He was talking about. Jesus was just spouting off obvious nonsense because He was mad. Jesus might have known better, but alas, His temper got the best of Him.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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5/31/2016 3:26:21 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

Hi mad, you obviously oppose trinitarianism.
What do you think of dualism?
If you believe in two invisible people with supernatural powers, are you not promoting dualism?
You obviously do not believe in monism ( defined as only one person with supernatural powers ).
As long as you believe there is a Father as well as a Son as well as a devil, and you believe all of them have supernatural powers, in reality you believe in three supernatural beings.

Where exactly does the Holy Spirit fit in to your belief if he/it is not another spirit with supernatural powers?

Do you think the Holy Spirit is the same spirit as the spirit of God or are they different spirits in your belief and opinion ?
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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5/31/2016 3:37:14 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 9:44:32 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:40:43 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:02:07 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 5/30/2016 5:03:16 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Each member of the Trinity is God. The Father is God (John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2). The Son is God (John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16).

John 6:27
27 Work, not for the food that perishes, but for the food that remains for everlasting life, which the Son of man will give you; for on this one the Father, God himself, has put his seal of approval."

That does not support the trinity and in fact separates God and the son because it shows that the son needed God's approval to act. Thus disproving the Trinity.

... and THAT does zilch to disprove the triune nature of the godhead, for everyone knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities. I fail to see why you concern yourself so much with the subject, other than possibly you fare a little better on it.

NOT "everyone" knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities, Anna.
Not all people believe the same things or see scriptures in the same way.
A person can be a Father as well as a son. Being a Father AND a Son does not make them two distinct people or personalities.
I AM a mother, AND a grandmother, AND a daughter, AND an aunt. Does that make me four different people or four different personalities? Obviously not.

The concept of Father and Son are merely two different ASPECTS of one person and can also be two different aspects of any form of life, the Father being the aspect of maturity and the son being the aspect of immaturity.
annanicole
Posts: 19,785
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5/31/2016 3:43:50 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 3:37:14 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 5/30/2016 9:44:32 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:40:43 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:02:07 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 5/30/2016 5:03:16 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Each member of the Trinity is God. The Father is God (John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2). The Son is God (John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16).

John 6:27
27 Work, not for the food that perishes, but for the food that remains for everlasting life, which the Son of man will give you; for on this one the Father, God himself, has put his seal of approval."

That does not support the trinity and in fact separates God and the son because it shows that the son needed God's approval to act. Thus disproving the Trinity.

... and THAT does zilch to disprove the triune nature of the godhead, for everyone knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities. I fail to see why you concern yourself so much with the subject, other than possibly you fare a little better on it.

NOT "everyone" knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities, Anna.

Ok, I stand corrected: everyone other than you.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Skyangel
Posts: 8,234
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5/31/2016 5:03:43 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 3:43:50 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/31/2016 3:37:14 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 5/30/2016 9:44:32 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:40:43 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:02:07 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 5/30/2016 5:03:16 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Each member of the Trinity is God. The Father is God (John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2). The Son is God (John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16).

John 6:27
27 Work, not for the food that perishes, but for the food that remains for everlasting life, which the Son of man will give you; for on this one the Father, God himself, has put his seal of approval."

That does not support the trinity and in fact separates God and the son because it shows that the son needed God's approval to act. Thus disproving the Trinity.

... and THAT does zilch to disprove the triune nature of the godhead, for everyone knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities. I fail to see why you concern yourself so much with the subject, other than possibly you fare a little better on it.

NOT "everyone" knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities, Anna.

Ok, I stand corrected: everyone other than you.

Actually Anna, many people actually believe Jesus IS God.
Those people obviously believe the Father and Son are the same single person not two distinct persons or personalities.

You seem to believe that the characters Father and Son, are two distinct persons and not ONE.
Do you believe the Holy Spirit is another distinct person ?
tarantula
Posts: 854
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5/31/2016 7:46:11 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/30/2016 10:58:58 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

YAWN!


Its astounding--every time a JW teaches something Jesus taught--it is rejected by the majority--the only reasoning behind that can be--the hatred of truth. Just like in Jesus day-- Jesus' truths exposed 99% of all religion as false and that they were misleading all who listened to them to partake off the table of demons( 1Cor 10:21)-- so the world murdered Jesus, apostles and Christians.

The nasty JW cult wouldn't know the elusive 'truth' if it bit them on the bottom!
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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5/31/2016 8:19:34 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 3:26:21 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

Hi mad, you obviously oppose trinitarianism.

Scripture opposes it, so I oppose it.

What do you think of dualism?

The same as I think of Trinitarianism

If you believe in two invisible people with supernatural powers, are you not promoting dualism?

No because they are completely distinct and separate beings who could if they choose take different paths. However the son has chosen to follow the father.

Also they are literally father and son since the father produced the son.
Between them they created everything else, Jehovah creating everything else through his son. Colossians 1:16.

Then you would also have to include an unknown number of Angels including Satan and his demons, since all are spirit beings.

You obviously do not believe in monism ( defined as only one person with supernatural powers ).

I believe in monotheism, completely and utterly.

Montheism defined as One True God, and an unknown number of lesser gods (divine beings, spirit beings) all of whom were created using his power and according to his will none of whom has more than the smallest proportion of his power in themselves.

Having said that, their power is still immeasurably greater than ours..

As long as you believe there is a Father as well as a Son as well as a devil, and you believe all of them have supernatural powers, in reality you believe in three supernatural beings.

No, because you are not including all the Angels and demons of whom we do not know their number, just "myriads of myriads. All of whom are spirits. All of whom are what we in our ignorance call supernatural, though in reality there is nothing more natural than them.

In fact if anything is truly unnatural it is the entire physical realm since Jehovah's spirit had to be completely, drastically altered to produce it.


Where exactly does the Holy Spirit fit in to your belief if he/it is not another spirit with supernatural powers?

It fits in precisely where scripture puts it. It is the substance from which all spirit beings are made, but it is only "holy" spirit when it is used for holy purposes.

It is precisely the same with humans. All are flesh. Some are closer to being holy, some are not remotely close to it.

Put another way, Holy is, as holy does.


Do you think the Holy Spirit is the same spirit as the spirit of God or are they different spirits in your belief and opinion ?

I do not have an opinion, I accept the opinions of Jehovah and Christ as expressed in scripture.

I do not just believe, I have faith.

Holy Spirit s not a person, it is the substance from which all spirit beings are made, and is only holy if used for holy purposes.

I thought I made that clear in my post.

There is only one spirit and all that have life in them have a minuscule amount of that spirit in them.

It is that spirit which is the very substance of God, and that spirit he made his only begotten son from. It was that spirit they between them made the Angels from which means that Satan and his demons are also of that spirit.

They are all divine, holy or unholy, it is the same spirit used for different purposes by different beings.

Even the physical ream was made from substances made from a much altered, lifeless version of that spirit.

In that very basic sense God is literally in everything, but not everything is God.

Look at it this way.

If you were to take a single cell of your body and clone it, creating another "you" from that cell. Would that other "you" truly be you.

Of course it wouldn't. It would be, and certainly almost instantly literally become an increasingly different person as it grew developed and changed.

That is how it is with all spirit beings, all Angels, faithful and unfaithful.

All were created from a very small part of Jehovah's spirit.

However it is only "holy spirit" when it is used for holy purposes.

Life is far more simple than people wish it to be.

I hope I have managed to make this more understandable to you.
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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5/31/2016 8:20:25 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 7:46:11 AM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 10:58:58 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

YAWN!


Its astounding--every time a JW teaches something Jesus taught--it is rejected by the majority--the only reasoning behind that can be--the hatred of truth. Just like in Jesus day-- Jesus' truths exposed 99% of all religion as false and that they were misleading all who listened to them to partake off the table of demons( 1Cor 10:21)-- so the world murdered Jesus, apostles and Christians.

The nasty JW cult wouldn't know the elusive 'truth' if it bit them on the bottom!

They now the truth and teach it.

It is those who oppose the truth who are truly "nasty".
tarantula
Posts: 854
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5/31/2016 8:25:49 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:20:25 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/31/2016 7:46:11 AM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 10:58:58 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

YAWN!


Its astounding--every time a JW teaches something Jesus taught--it is rejected by the majority--the only reasoning behind that can be--the hatred of truth. Just like in Jesus day-- Jesus' truths exposed 99% of all religion as false and that they were misleading all who listened to them to partake off the table of demons( 1Cor 10:21)-- so the world murdered Jesus, apostles and Christians.

The nasty JW cult wouldn't know the elusive 'truth' if it bit them on the bottom!

They now the truth and teach it.

It is those who oppose the truth who are truly "nasty".

Oh funny, you are a very sad person. I suggest you attend to your own shortcomings, instead of preaching your cult's nasty garbage.
bulproof
Posts: 25,227
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5/31/2016 8:30:02 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:20:25 AM, MadCornishBiker
Hey mad, what about your claim that there were no evil demons 2000yrs ago because they were only kicked out of heaven 200yrs ago?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
MadCornishBiker
Posts: 23,302
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5/31/2016 8:34:37 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 2:43:43 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/30/2016 10:58:58 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Its astounding--every time a JW teaches something Jesus taught--it is rejected by the majority--the only reasoning behind that can be--the hatred of truth.

That is true, but not hatred on the part of the JWs, hatred of the truth by such as you who refuse to believe it, even when it is clear and plain for all to see.

It is a truism that what we fear, we hate.

Of course, you ignore the fact that Jesus made it very clear that the majority would indeed refuse to believe what he taught, so it is unsurprising that the majority also reject it when the JWs also teach it. Matthew 7:21-23; Luke 17:26-30; 2 Timothy 3:1-7.

If the majority believed Christ, why did he have so few followers?

Your argumentation is so weak it is self-defeating.


No, the problem comes when the WatchTower followers venture off into teaching things that Jesus did NOT teach. An example is John 2: 19. Jesus certainly taught His own bodily resurrection.

Except that Jesus was not teaching then.

Why would he bother trying to teach those who had no interest in truth (Matthew 7:6).

John 2:19 is nothing more than an erroneous statement, which scripture reveals as being erroneous when it describes his resurrection as being in spirit not in the flesh, and certanily not in that particular body of flesh

Even you have to twist what he is saying to try to fit yur beliefe.

If it was literally his body that was resurrected it would have been recognised by all who knew him.

It was not.

Therefore Jesus was wrong. Simple as.


Your disfellowshipped cohort, the MadClown, just speculates the Jesus didn't know what He was talking about. Jesus was just spouting off obvious nonsense because He was mad. Jesus might have known better, but alas, His temper got the best of Him.

I don't need to speculate Anna, Jesus admitted there were thing he did not know, and he set no limit to his lack of knowledge.

What was obvious about what he said at the time?

Only Jehovah knew he was wrong, and the events as they unfolded proved that.

In fact the only thing which is truly obvious is that Jesus statement was wrong, as made obvious by how his resurrection unfolded.

Why d you cling so fiercely to the obvious lies you teach Anna?

What are you so afraid of?
annanicole
Posts: 19,785
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5/31/2016 9:10:39 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 5:03:43 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 5/31/2016 3:43:50 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/31/2016 3:37:14 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 5/30/2016 9:44:32 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:40:43 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:02:07 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 5/30/2016 5:03:16 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Each member of the Trinity is God. The Father is God (John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2). The Son is God (John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16).

John 6:27
27 Work, not for the food that perishes, but for the food that remains for everlasting life, which the Son of man will give you; for on this one the Father, God himself, has put his seal of approval."

That does not support the trinity and in fact separates God and the son because it shows that the son needed God's approval to act. Thus disproving the Trinity.

... and THAT does zilch to disprove the triune nature of the godhead, for everyone knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities. I fail to see why you concern yourself so much with the subject, other than possibly you fare a little better on it.

NOT "everyone" knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities, Anna.

Ok, I stand corrected: everyone other than you.

Actually Anna, many people actually believe Jesus IS God.
Those people obviously believe the Father and Son are the same single person not two distinct persons or personalities.

Name one.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
annanicole
Posts: 19,785
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5/31/2016 9:19:45 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:34:37 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/31/2016 2:43:43 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/30/2016 10:58:58 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Your disfellowshipped cohort, the MadClown, just speculates the Jesus didn't know what He was talking about. Jesus was just spouting off obvious nonsense because He was mad. Jesus might have known better, but alas, His temper got the best of Him.

I don't need to speculate Anna, Jesus admitted there were thing he did not know, and he set no limit to his lack of knowledge.

What was obvious about what he said at the time?

Only Jehovah knew he was wrong, and the events as they unfolded proved that.

Jesus knew He was wrong, since - if He had been correct in His statement - the entire sacrifice would have been negated, according to you. That is, unless your position is that Jesus didn't even understand the Mosaic system.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
MadCornishBiker
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5/31/2016 10:37:24 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 9:19:45 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:34:37 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/31/2016 2:43:43 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/30/2016 10:58:58 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:

Your disfellowshipped cohort, the MadClown, just speculates the Jesus didn't know what He was talking about. Jesus was just spouting off obvious nonsense because He was mad. Jesus might have known better, but alas, His temper got the best of Him.

I don't need to speculate Anna, Jesus admitted there were thing he did not know, and he set no limit to his lack of knowledge.

What was obvious about what he said at the time?

Only Jehovah knew he was wrong, and the events as they unfolded proved that.

Jesus knew He was wrong, since - if He had been correct in His statement - the entire sacrifice would have been negated, according to you. That is, unless your position is that Jesus didn't even understand the Mosaic system.

Oh he understood the Mosaic Law, but he did not understand how it related to his obedience apparently.

However neither you nor I can say what Jesus knew and didn't know, only the evidence can tell us that, and since I refuse to believe that Jesus would deliberately lie I have to believe that he was mistaken, in error, there is no other option since scriptural evidence proves he was wrong beyond honest doubt.

It is a position I struggled with for quite some time until I realised the positives it brings to the Kingdom message, as I have explained before to you.

If Jesus had known he was wrong he would not have said what he did, even in anger, which judging by the rest of the passage was his state at the time.

This is just another of the false paths your wrong belief that Jesus is God, as the deliberately mistranslated version of John 1:1 tells you leads you down. Matthew 7:13-14.

No Ana it is not according to me it is according to scripture. Simple as. I have proved it to you way beyond honest doubt over and again.

Of course it would have negated the sacrifice had Jesus been given back his fleshly body, since that was the basis of the whole sacrifice, it was what Christ sacrificed to buy us our life back.

You cannot "sacrifice" money to "ransom" something and expect to have your money back as well can you?

Jesus, as scripture said, paid the price. He could not have it back, that would be dishonest, it would be cheating, and Jehovah never cheats, nor does his son.

You must know yu are wrong on that and yet you cling to it as if your life depends on it when in fact it is that belief that will cost you your life, along with all the other false, and often insulting beliefs you cling to.

OK changing might make you unpopular with your friends, but can your friends give you your eternal life back?

Of course they can't.

Jehovah can, through his son.

Is it it better to be friends with them even if it means losing every friend you have at present?

Of course it is.

You are simply showing Christ where your loyalties truly lay, and they are not with him or his father.

Your beliefs are what are according to you, and your own understanding. I prefer to lean on that of Jehovah and Christ.
MadCornishBiker
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5/31/2016 10:48:55 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 9:10:39 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/31/2016 5:03:43 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 5/31/2016 3:43:50 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/31/2016 3:37:14 AM, Skyangel wrote:
At 5/30/2016 9:44:32 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:40:43 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/30/2016 8:02:07 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 5/30/2016 5:03:16 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:


Each member of the Trinity is God. The Father is God (John 6:27; Romans 1:7; 1 Peter 1:2). The Son is God (John 1:1, 14; Romans 9:5; Colossians 2:9; Hebrews 1:8; 1 John 5:20). The Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4; 1 Corinthians 3:16).

John 6:27
27 Work, not for the food that perishes, but for the food that remains for everlasting life, which the Son of man will give you; for on this one the Father, God himself, has put his seal of approval."

That does not support the trinity and in fact separates God and the son because it shows that the son needed God's approval to act. Thus disproving the Trinity.

... and THAT does zilch to disprove the triune nature of the godhead, for everyone knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities. I fail to see why you concern yourself so much with the subject, other than possibly you fare a little better on it.

NOT "everyone" knows that the Father and the Son are two distinct persons or personalities, Anna.

Ok, I stand corrected: everyone other than you.

Actually Anna, many people actually believe Jesus IS God.
Those people obviously believe the Father and Son are the same single person not two distinct persons or personalities.

Name one.

All Trinitarians because the trinity teaches:

"Neither confounding the Persons: nor dividing the Substance".

"And yet they are not three eternals: but one eternal.
As also there are not three incomprehensibles, nor three uncreated: but one uncreated, and one incomprehensible.
So likewise the Father is Almighty, the Son Almighty: and the Holy Ghost Almighty.
And yet they are not three Almighties: but one Almighty.
So the Father is God, the Son is God: and the Holy Ghost is God.
And yet they are not three Gods: but one God.
So likewise the Father is Lord, the Son Lord: and the Holy Ghost Lord.
And yet not three Lords: but one Lord."

All of which claim they are one person.

Interestingly it also teaches:

"The Son is of the Father alone: not made, nor created, but begotten."

Which when you stop to think about it is a contradiction in terms, since if he is begotten he is created, since Jehovah has no other means of begetting any.

Also:

"The Father eternal, the Son eternal: and the Holy Ghost eternal."

Interestingly eternal does not mean without beginning necessarily, though it can do, and in the case of Jehovah.

However if the son is begotten, as the Trinity teaches he cannot be eternal in that sense, but only in the sense of being eternal from the moment of creation on.

It is no wonder that both the Anglican Church (from whose "book of common prayer" I took this version of the Athanasian Creed the official trinity teaching without following which one cannot be either Catholic or Anglican according to official church teachings https://www.churchofengland.org...), has to be called a mystery.

If you read it properly it contradicts itself all the way through, making the only mystery that of how anyone can possibly accept something so impossible.
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5/31/2016 10:54:00 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:30:02 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:20:25 AM, MadCornishBiker
Hey mad, what about your claim that there were no evil demons 2000yrs ago because they were only kicked out of heaven 200yrs ago?

I have never claimed that.

You are even more confused than usual, and that's going some.

being kicked out of heaven did not make them evil, they were evil long before that happened.

They were evil from the moment they chose to follow Satan down his chosen evil path, not long after the creation of Adam and Eve.

They were allowed in and out of heaven for millennia because it took some of their attention off causing trouble down here, also, presumably it was part of the allowance granted to Satan so he could have his fair chance to prove his case.

After all that is why he as angry when he was cast down because as the scripture says he knew he "had but a short period of time", he had lost his case as far as that penultimate stage went.

One phase to go, and it is soon to start.
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5/31/2016 10:55:23 AM
Posted: 6 months ago
At 5/31/2016 8:25:49 AM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/31/2016 8:20:25 AM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
At 5/31/2016 7:46:11 AM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 10:58:58 PM, kjw47 wrote:
At 5/30/2016 3:18:58 PM, tarantula wrote:
At 5/30/2016 1:18:04 PM, MadCornishBiker wrote:
John 17:3
3 This means everlasting life, their coming to know you, the only true God, and the one whom you sent, Jesus Christ.

That is the simple truth.

With no mention of holy spirit you notice.

If you don't start by using the bible to get to know both Christ and his father, Jehovah, you will ever get to understand scripture correctly.

Unfortunately very few do.

Most fall for the trinity teaching or one of it's variations, corruptions on a corruption.

If the trinity were true why do we only need to get to know Christ and his father, not holy spirit as well? You would think it would be either all or one, not just two.

If the trinity were true why did Christ say, even after his resurrection to spirit life that he has a God over him?

If the trinity were true why do the Apostles continually praise the "God and father of our Lord Jesus Christ", and not Christ himself? 1 Peter 1:3; Ephesians 1:3.
If the trinity were true why did they say that God is the head of Christ in the same sense that Christ is the head of the man and the man is head of the woman? 1 Corinthians 11:3

If the trinity were true why does Colossians tells us that everything was created through and for Christ, not by him?

There are so many scriptural holes in the trinity teaching that the only real mystery about it is why anyone can possibly believe it.

No, start by getting to know Jehovah and Christ for who and what they really are, and then you will have entered your journey through the right gate and be on the road to life Matthew 7:13,14, not the road to destruction with all those trinitarians.

YAWN!


Its astounding--every time a JW teaches something Jesus taught--it is rejected by the majority--the only reasoning behind that can be--the hatred of truth. Just like in Jesus day-- Jesus' truths exposed 99% of all religion as false and that they were misleading all who listened to them to partake off the table of demons( 1Cor 10:21)-- so the world murdered Jesus, apostles and Christians.

The nasty JW cult wouldn't know the elusive 'truth' if it bit them on the bottom!

They now the truth and teach it.

It is those who oppose the truth who are truly "nasty".

Oh funny, you are a very sad person. I suggest you attend to your own shortcomings, instead of preaching your cult's nasty garbage.

I have, ad continue to do so, whihc is why I can preach now and why I have Jehovah's spirit to help me do so.

I do not preach "nasty garbage" I preach the truth from God's own word.