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Making logical sense of the Bible.

Stupidape
Posts: 171
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7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

My friend has a shirt that states "good men fear Jesus." So, even if you are a good person your supposed to be in constant fear of God?

Let alone, the ultimate questions, which God, which religion, and which faith? I keep asking people who believe strongly the simple question "How do you know that your God is the one and only true God?" I never seem to get an answer that satisfies me. My one friend's response was "just get behind religion don't question." Note, the quote might not be exact, but how do you know?

I've lost so many nights sleep laying in bed wide awake terrified I might be worshiping the wrong God or even if I have the right God, the wrong faith. Are we supposed to live in constant terror of God? Never knowing which is the correct God and the correct religion? Am I alone in my thoughts and feelings? Thanks in advance for reading.

http://biblehub.com...
annanicole
Posts: 19,793
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7/18/2016 8:24:46 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

Many Jews believed in Jesus, three thousand of them on Pentecost alone.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

No one has claimed it is a sin to be angry, much less a "deadly sin" (whatever that is).

Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

Since when were love and fear mutually exclusive?
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
DanMGTOW
Posts: 1,144
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7/18/2016 9:30:57 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 8:24:46 AM, annanicole wrote:
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

Many Jews believed in Jesus, three thousand of them on Pentecost alone.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

No one has claimed it is a sin to be angry, much less a "deadly sin" (whatever that is).

Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

Since when were love and fear mutually exclusive?

1 john 4:18
There is no fear in love. But perfect love drives out fear, because fear has to do with punishment. The one who fears is not made perfect in love.
Looncall
Posts: 463
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7/18/2016 9:34:52 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

My friend has a shirt that states "good men fear Jesus." So, even if you are a good person your supposed to be in constant fear of God?

Let alone, the ultimate questions, which God, which religion, and which faith? I keep asking people who believe strongly the simple question "How do you know that your God is the one and only true God?" I never seem to get an answer that satisfies me. My one friend's response was "just get behind religion don't question." Note, the quote might not be exact, but how do you know?

I've lost so many nights sleep laying in bed wide awake terrified I might be worshiping the wrong God or even if I have the right God, the wrong faith. Are we supposed to live in constant terror of God? Never knowing which is the correct God and the correct religion? Am I alone in my thoughts and feelings? Thanks in advance for reading.

http://biblehub.com...

What you describe is exactly how the Great Scam works. Once one realizes that it is just an elaborate con game honed over millenia by clergy for their own benefit, it becomes easy to jettison the whole mess.

Be free!
The metaphysicist has no laboratory.
Willows
Posts: 2,084
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7/18/2016 11:38:59 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

My friend has a shirt that states "good men fear Jesus." So, even if you are a good person your supposed to be in constant fear of God?

Let alone, the ultimate questions, which God, which religion, and which faith? I keep asking people who believe strongly the simple question "How do you know that your God is the one and only true God?" I never seem to get an answer that satisfies me. My one friend's response was "just get behind religion don't question." Note, the quote might not be exact, but how do you know?

I've lost so many nights sleep laying in bed wide awake terrified I might be worshiping the wrong God or even if I have the right God, the wrong faith. Are we supposed to live in constant terror of God? Never knowing which is the correct God and the correct religion? Am I alone in my thoughts and feelings? Thanks in advance for reading.

http://biblehub.com...

"But Marge, what if we chose the wrong religion? Each week we just make God madder and madder. "... Homer Simpson
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,328
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7/18/2016 12:39:35 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

What's so difficult about understanding "I am first and last"? wow, that's pretty straight forward. However, I know it's common here for atheists to trip up on words and miss the simple meanings of things. Basically God is saying nothing came before Him and He alone dictates the "end", if after everything else is gone He alone remains. It's just a poetic way of suggesting the authority of God.


For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.


That didn't make any sense sorry, that's called a non sequitur. Anyway's it was prophesied He would be rejected, that was part of the sacrifice.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

No, spirituality is about honing qualities that reflect the light of God regardless of circumstances...to maximize them. They get stretched through your reactions over trial and error. All people are on different levels, like a giant equalizer the objective is to replace anger with love and forgiveness, to raise one level and reduce the other.

If you haven't come very far and fall easily it's only an opportunity to show you can do better next time, it's not about condemnation but freedom, there is freedom in God.


Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

Fear is representative of one's respect for God as an authoritative figure, and as One who judges but God can still be loved despite that. I "fear" God and love God tremendously....pretty much with all my being yet I also reverence God and am in awe.


My friend has a shirt that states "good men fear Jesus." So, even if you are a good person your supposed to be in constant fear of God?

No not at all...
John 15
9 As the Father hath loved me, so have I loved you: continue ye in my love.

10 If ye keep my commandments, ye shall abide in my love; even as I have kept my Father's commandments, and abide in his love.

11 These things have I spoken unto you, that my joy might remain in you, and that your joy might be full.

12 This is my commandment, That ye love one another, as I have loved you.

13 Greater love hath no man than this, that a man lay down his life for his friends.

John 14

16 And I will pray the Father, and he shall give you another Comforter, that he may abide with you for ever;

17 Even the Spirit of truth; whom the world cannot receive, because it seeth him not, neither knoweth him: but ye know him; for he dwelleth with you, and shall be in you.

18 I will not leave you comfortless: I will come to you.

23 Jesus answered and said unto him, If a man love me, he will keep my words: and my Father will love him, and we will come unto him, and make our abode with him.

John 4

10 Jesus answered and said unto her, If thou knewest the gift of God, and who it is that saith to thee, Give me to drink; thou wouldest have asked of him, and he would have given thee living water.

14 But whosoever drinketh of the water that I shall give him shall never thirst; but the water that I shall give him shall be in him a well of water springing up into everlasting life.

Does that sound like constant fear??


Let alone, the ultimate questions, which God, which religion, and which faith? I keep asking people who believe strongly the simple question "How do you know that your God is the one and only true God?" I never seem to get an answer that satisfies me. My one friend's response was "just get behind religion don't question." Note, the quote might not be exact, but how do you know?


Picture religions (and not all of them certainly) as an interpretation of the spiritual worlds mixed with culture, opinions, traditions ect and even non-truths and fiction. Some are simply more accurate than the others as they obviously can't all be equal but if you narrow things down a bit you can start there.
Christianity in specific reveals IMO unmatched spiritual truth/laws/principles, other reveal some things as well but it's not nearly as concentrated. I'm not gonna tell you what to believe but I'll suggest keeping your eyes pealed. Jesus is a good Master, you cannot fail abiding in that for sure.
You can know or at least have certainty in many ares of your life, especially spiritually but the point is for you to be involved, without that you will never find anything. You keep moving forward, pressing deeper towards that spiritual pull inside of you, there are reasons God takes you deeper that you must learn.

I've lost so many nights sleep laying in bed wide awake terrified I might be worshiping the wrong God or even if I have the right God, the wrong faith. Are we supposed to live in constant terror of God? Never knowing which is the correct God and the correct religion? Am I alone in my thoughts and feelings? Thanks in advance for reading.


What do you worship? remember God is not religion, religion interprets God so don't be afraid by that. Seek God and you will will learn what to discard and what to treasure and pursue, but you have to move your feet, awaken that spiritual part of yourself through application.

http://biblehub.com...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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7/18/2016 1:37:14 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

My friend has a shirt that states "good men fear Jesus." So, even if you are a good person your supposed to be in constant fear of God?

Let alone, the ultimate questions, which God, which religion, and which faith? I keep asking people who believe strongly the simple question "How do you know that your God is the one and only true God?" I never seem to get an answer that satisfies me. My one friend's response was "just get behind religion don't question." Note, the quote might not be exact, but how do you know?

I've lost so many nights sleep laying in bed wide awake terrified I might be worshiping the wrong God or even if I have the right God, the wrong faith. Are we supposed to live in constant terror of God? Never knowing which is the correct God and the correct religion? Am I alone in my thoughts and feelings? Thanks in advance for reading.

http://biblehub.com...

You worry too much ape. Jesus forgave a prostitute, a man who denied him 3 times, and a thief on the cross next to him. None of the 3 was labeled "Christian"or had a denomination.

In Revelation John uses the phrase "the harvest is ripe" meaning Christ is saving an unimaginable amount of people. It also refers to Heaven and the multitude bring too many to count.

Study Romans and "grace".
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
Harikrish
Posts: 11,014
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7/18/2016 1:53:21 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 1:37:14 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

My friend has a shirt that states "good men fear Jesus." So, even if you are a good person your supposed to be in constant fear of God?

Let alone, the ultimate questions, which God, which religion, and which faith? I keep asking people who believe strongly the simple question "How do you know that your God is the one and only true God?" I never seem to get an answer that satisfies me. My one friend's response was "just get behind religion don't question." Note, the quote might not be exact, but how do you know?

I've lost so many nights sleep laying in bed wide awake terrified I might be worshiping the wrong God or even if I have the right God, the wrong faith. Are we supposed to live in constant terror of God? Never knowing which is the correct God and the correct religion? Am I alone in my thoughts and feelings? Thanks in advance for reading.

http://biblehub.com...

You worry too much ape. Jesus forgave a prostitute, a man who denied him 3 times, and a thief on the cross next to him. None of the 3 was labeled "Christian"or had a denomination.

In Revelation John uses the phrase "the harvest is ripe" meaning Christ is saving an unimaginable amount of people. It also refers to Heaven and the multitude bring too many to count.

Study Romans and "grace".

Jesus also ended his mission nailed to a cross feeling betrayed and forsaken by God. His delusions ended on the cross. Yours began when you started worshipping a dead corpse nailed to across.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").
ethang5
Posts: 4,117
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7/18/2016 1:57:48 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:

I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

(If you didn't get this, please remember that since atheists think words in the Bible can have only one meaning, the word "Jew" cannot refer, at one time, to ones ethnicity, and at another time, to ones religion. That is not allowed.

My friend has a shirt that states "good men fear Jesus." So, even if you are a good person your supposed to be in constant fear of God?

Same thing here for "fear". In any other topic, it could also mean "respect". But the topic here is religion, and atheists allow only one meaning per word when it comes to religion.

For the noobs out there, this post is what we call an Abbott and Costello act. Some poor sincere soul pretends to be a confused Christian and pitches a "softball" to the Atheists on the thread, and they proceed to "knock it out to the ballpark".

Consider:
Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

And his name is "stupidape".

Strong positions do not need setups. They do not need pretense. And they do not need softball pitches.

But hey, I got one.....

1. God is a spirit.
2. Spirits evaporate.
3. Therefore, God must now be a gas.

- stupidathe
bulproof
Posts: 25,303
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7/18/2016 1:59:48 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 8:24:46 AM, annanicole wrote:
Since when were love and fear mutually exclusive?
Always Annie, always.
bulproof
Posts: 25,303
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7/18/2016 2:00:54 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 11:38:59 AM, Willows wrote:
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

My friend has a shirt that states "good men fear Jesus." So, even if you are a good person your supposed to be in constant fear of God?

Let alone, the ultimate questions, which God, which religion, and which faith? I keep asking people who believe strongly the simple question "How do you know that your God is the one and only true God?" I never seem to get an answer that satisfies me. My one friend's response was "just get behind religion don't question." Note, the quote might not be exact, but how do you know?

I've lost so many nights sleep laying in bed wide awake terrified I might be worshiping the wrong God or even if I have the right God, the wrong faith. Are we supposed to live in constant terror of God? Never knowing which is the correct God and the correct religion? Am I alone in my thoughts and feelings? Thanks in advance for reading.

http://biblehub.com...

"But Marge, what if we chose the wrong religion? Each week we just make God madder and madder. "... Homer Simpson
"The Truth"
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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7/18/2016 2:23:52 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

My friend has a shirt that states "good men fear Jesus." So, even if you are a good person your supposed to be in constant fear of God?

Let alone, the ultimate questions, which God, which religion, and which faith? I keep asking people who believe strongly the simple question "How do you know that your God is the one and only true God?" I never seem to get an answer that satisfies me. My one friend's response was "just get behind religion don't question." Note, the quote might not be exact, but how do you know?

I've lost so many nights sleep laying in bed wide awake terrified I might be worshiping the wrong God or even if I have the right God, the wrong faith. Are we supposed to live in constant terror of God? Never knowing which is the correct God and the correct religion? Am I alone in my thoughts and feelings? Thanks in advance for reading.

http://biblehub.com...

Here ya go ape.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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7/18/2016 2:24:15 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
(Romans 3:23)

"And all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus."
(Romans 3:24)

--

Be Humble-

"Jesus said, "If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains."
(John 9:41)

--

"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'
(Luke 18:13)

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you."
(Matthew 21:31)

--

GRACE-

Ephesians Chapter 2

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

--

Romans 6:14 - For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

James 4:6 - But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

John 1:16 - And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

Romans 3:24 - Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

2 Timothy 2:1 - Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

Grace-
The love and mercy given to us by God because God desires us to have it, not because of anything we have done to earn it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org...

THE THIEF-

(Luke 23:42)
Then he said, "Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom."

(Luke 23:42)
Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."

--
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
annanicole
Posts: 19,793
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7/18/2016 2:44:00 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 1:59:48 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/18/2016 8:24:46 AM, annanicole wrote:
Since when were love and fear mutually exclusive?
Always Annie, always.

Really? I take it that you love Mrs. Bulproof - yet under certain circumstances you would also have a fear of her.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
Harikrish
Posts: 11,014
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7/18/2016 2:44:02 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 2:24:15 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
(Romans 3:23)

"And all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus."
(Romans 3:24)

--

Be Humble-

"Jesus said, "If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains."
(John 9:41)

--

"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'
(Luke 18:13)

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you."
(Matthew 21:31)

--

GRACE-

Ephesians Chapter 2

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

--

Romans 6:14 - For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

James 4:6 - But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

John 1:16 - And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

Romans 3:24 - Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

2 Timothy 2:1 - Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

Grace-
The love and mercy given to us by God because God desires us to have it, not because of anything we have done to earn it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org...

THE THIEF-

(Luke 23:42)
Then he said, "Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom."

(Luke 23:42)
Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."

--

That was until Jesus found himself nailed to a cross and in deep pain. His delusions ended and he felt betrayed and forsaken.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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7/18/2016 3:07:48 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 2:44:02 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:24:15 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
(Romans 3:23)

"And all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus."
(Romans 3:24)

--

Be Humble-

"Jesus said, "If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains."
(John 9:41)

--

"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'
(Luke 18:13)

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you."
(Matthew 21:31)

--

GRACE-

Ephesians Chapter 2

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

--

Romans 6:14 - For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

James 4:6 - But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

John 1:16 - And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

Romans 3:24 - Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

2 Timothy 2:1 - Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

Grace-
The love and mercy given to us by God because God desires us to have it, not because of anything we have done to earn it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org...

THE THIEF-

(Luke 23:42)
Then he said, "Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom."

(Luke 23:42)
Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."

--

That was until Jesus found himself nailed to a cross and in deep pain. His delusions ended and he felt betrayed and forsaken.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

He was quoting David from the psalms.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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7/18/2016 3:09:17 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
Psalm 22:1
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
bulproof
Posts: 25,303
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7/18/2016 3:25:38 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 2:44:00 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 7/18/2016 1:59:48 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/18/2016 8:24:46 AM, annanicole wrote:
Since when were love and fear mutually exclusive?
Always Annie, always.

Really? I take it that you love Mrs. Bulproof - yet under certain circumstances you would also have a fear of her.

I pretend that and claim that but I have never been afraid of her and she has never been afraid of me Annie.
I can't believe that someone like you can't say the same thing.
Mrs bul has been the best thing in my life for 44yrs now and our children and grand children and great grandchildren now just make me whole.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,014
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7/18/2016 3:27:43 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 3:07:48 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:44:02 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:24:15 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
(Romans 3:23)

"And all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus."
(Romans 3:24)

--

Be Humble-

"Jesus said, "If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains."
(John 9:41)

--

"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'
(Luke 18:13)

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you."
(Matthew 21:31)

--

GRACE-

Ephesians Chapter 2

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

--

Romans 6:14 - For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

James 4:6 - But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

John 1:16 - And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

Romans 3:24 - Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

2 Timothy 2:1 - Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

Grace-
The love and mercy given to us by God because God desires us to have it, not because of anything we have done to earn it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org...

THE THIEF-

(Luke 23:42)
Then he said, "Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom."

(Luke 23:42)
Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."

--

That was until Jesus found himself nailed to a cross and in deep pain. His delusions ended and he felt betrayed and forsaken.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

He was quoting David from the psalms.
Jesus seldom spoke with any originality. He quoted from 24 Old Testament Books and when he spoke outside of the Bibke he claimed the words were put in his mount suggesting he was just an empty vessel. But the pain was real. He felt what David felt betrayed and forsaken.
Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").
For someone who was promised as a new Davidic covernant he was a pathetic failure.
Making logical sense of the bible is an exercise in futility. Blind faith is required as in justification by faith.
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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7/18/2016 3:48:05 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18:/2016 3:27:43 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/18/2016 3:07:48 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:44:02 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:24:15 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
(Romans 3:23)

"And all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus."
(Romans 3:24)

--

Be Humble-

"Jesus said, "If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains."
(John 9:41)

--

"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'
(Luke 18:13)

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you."
(Matthew 21:31)

--

GRACE-

Ephesians Chapter 2

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

--

Romans 6:14 - For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

James 4:6 - But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

John 1:16 - And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

Romans 3:24 - Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

2 Timothy 2:1 - Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

Grace-
The love and mercy given to us by God because God desires us to have it, not because of anything we have done to earn it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org...

THE THIEF-

(Luke 23:42)
Then he said, "Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom."

(Luke 23:42)
Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."

--

That was until Jesus found himself nailed to a cross and in deep pain. His delusions ended and he felt betrayed and forsaken.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

He was quoting David from the psalms.
Jesus seldom spoke with any originality. He quoted from 24 Old Testament Books and when he spoke outside of the Bibke he claimed the words were put in his mount suggesting he was just an empty vessel. But the pain was real. He felt what David felt betrayed and forsaken.
Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").
For someone who was promised as a new Davidic covernant he was a pathetic failure.
Making logical sense of the bible is an exercise in futility. Blind faith is required as in justification by faith.

So he fulfilled the messianic prophecies of being beaten, battered, depressed, and brought to nothing as was fortold.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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7/18/2016 3:49:47 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
Isaiah 53:4
Surely he took up our pain and bore our suffering, yet we considered him punished by God, stricken by him, and afflicted.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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7/18/2016 3:51:21 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
Isaiah 53:5
But he was pierced for our transgressions, he was crushed for our iniquities; the punishment that brought us peace was on him, and by his wounds we are healed.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
brontoraptor
Posts: 11,685
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7/18/2016 3:53:10 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
Zechariah 12:10
"And I will pour out on the house of David and the inhabitants of Jerusalem a spirit of grace and supplication. They will look on me, the one they have pierced, and they will mourn for him as one mourns for an only child, and grieve bitterly for him as one grieves for a firstborn son.
"What Donald Trump is doing is representing the absolute heartbreak, and anger, and frustration at a government gone mad."

http://youtu.be...
Harikrish
Posts: 11,014
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7/18/2016 3:54:02 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 3:48:05 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 7/18:/2016 3:27:43 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/18/2016 3:07:48 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:44:02 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:24:15 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
(Romans 3:23)

"And all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus."
(Romans 3:24)

--

Be Humble-

"Jesus said, "If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains."
(John 9:41)

--

"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'
(Luke 18:13)

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you."
(Matthew 21:31)

--

GRACE-

Ephesians Chapter 2

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

--

Romans 6:14 - For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

James 4:6 - But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

John 1:16 - And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

Romans 3:24 - Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

2 Timothy 2:1 - Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

Grace-
The love and mercy given to us by God because God desires us to have it, not because of anything we have done to earn it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org...

THE THIEF-

(Luke 23:42)
Then he said, "Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom."

(Luke 23:42)
Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."

--

That was until Jesus found himself nailed to a cross and in deep pain. His delusions ended and he felt betrayed and forsaken.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

He was quoting David from the psalms.
Jesus seldom spoke with any originality. He quoted from 24 Old Testament Books and when he spoke outside of the Bibke he claimed the words were put in his mount suggesting he was just an empty vessel. But the pain was real. He felt what David felt betrayed and forsaken.
Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").
For someone who was promised as a new Davidic covernant he was a pathetic failure.
Making logical sense of the bible is an exercise in futility. Blind faith is required as in justification by faith.

So he fulfilled the messianic prophecies of being beaten, battered, depressed, and brought to nothing as was fortold.

So did thousands of other Jews during biblical times and 6 million in modern times. The Jews are a messianic race. Jesus was just another Jew. If he pursued his fathers profession he might have created something like IKEA.
annanicole
Posts: 19,793
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7/19/2016 6:09:43 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 3:25:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:44:00 PM, annanicole wrote:
At 7/18/2016 1:59:48 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 7/18/2016 8:24:46 AM, annanicole wrote:
Since when were love and fear mutually exclusive?
Always Annie, always.

Really? I take it that you love Mrs. Bulproof - yet under certain circumstances you would also have a fear of her.

I pretend that and claim that but I have never been afraid of her and she has never been afraid of me Annie.
I can't believe that someone like you can't say the same thing.
Mrs bul has been the best thing in my life for 44yrs now and our children and grand children and great grandchildren now just make me whole.

Then according to you the Bible, you experience what is called "perfect love", or 100% complete love, for Mrs. Bul. As a rule, this is unattainable.
Madcornishbiker: "No, I don't need a dictionary, I know how scripture uses words and that is all I need to now."
KendoRe2
Posts: 126
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7/19/2016 6:17:01 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 8:03:52 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I'm having a lot of trouble making logical sense of the Bible. This statement is particular hard for me to grasp.

"I am Alpha and Omega, the beginning and the end, the first and the last."

I mean, what in the world is this supposed to mean? This isn't like math class or even chemistry. I've struggled with this statement in particular for years. There is other themes I can't grasp.

For example,

Jesus is a Jew.
Jews don't believe in Jesus.
Therefore, Jesus doesn't believe in himself.

How about anger? Is it a deadly sin to be angry? Even when somebody smacks you in the face, you have now committed the unforgivable sin of anger?

Or how about your supposed to love and fear God? I just don't get it. How can you fear and love simultaneously?

My friend has a shirt that states "good men fear Jesus." So, even if you are a good person your supposed to be in constant fear of God?

Let alone, the ultimate questions, which God, which religion, and which faith? I keep asking people who believe strongly the simple question "How do you know that your God is the one and only true God?" I never seem to get an answer that satisfies me. My one friend's response was "just get behind religion don't question." Note, the quote might not be exact, but how do you know?

I've lost so many nights sleep laying in bed wide awake terrified I might be worshiping the wrong God or even if I have the right God, the wrong faith. Are we supposed to live in constant terror of God? Never knowing which is the correct God and the correct religion? Am I alone in my thoughts and feelings? Thanks in advance for reading.

http://biblehub.com...

You need life experiences. Get laid. Fall in love, marry. Then you will gain perspective
FaustianJustice
Posts: 6,240
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7/19/2016 12:18:09 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 3:48:05 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 7/18:/2016 3:27:43 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/18/2016 3:07:48 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:44:02 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:24:15 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
(Romans 3:23)

"And all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus."
(Romans 3:24)

--

Be Humble-

"Jesus said, "If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains."
(John 9:41)

--

"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'
(Luke 18:13)

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you."
(Matthew 21:31)

--

GRACE-

Ephesians Chapter 2

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

--

Romans 6:14 - For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

James 4:6 - But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

John 1:16 - And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

Romans 3:24 - Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

2 Timothy 2:1 - Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

Grace-
The love and mercy given to us by God because God desires us to have it, not because of anything we have done to earn it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org...

THE THIEF-

(Luke 23:42)
Then he said, "Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom."

(Luke 23:42)
Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."

--

That was until Jesus found himself nailed to a cross and in deep pain. His delusions ended and he felt betrayed and forsaken.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

He was quoting David from the psalms.
Jesus seldom spoke with any originality. He quoted from 24 Old Testament Books and when he spoke outside of the Bibke he claimed the words were put in his mount suggesting he was just an empty vessel. But the pain was real. He felt what David felt betrayed and forsaken.
Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").
For someone who was promised as a new Davidic covernant he was a pathetic failure.
Making logical sense of the bible is an exercise in futility. Blind faith is required as in justification by faith.

So he fulfilled the messianic prophecies of being beaten, battered, depressed, and brought to nothing as was fortold.

... you don't consider that to be rather vague? How many people did that describe around 33 AD?
Here we have an advocate for Islamic arranged marriages demonstrating that children can consent to sex.
http://www.debate.org...
ethang5
Posts: 4,117
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7/19/2016 4:49:10 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/18/2016 3:07:48 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:44:02 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/18/2016 2:24:15 PM, brontoraptor wrote:
"For all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God."
(Romans 3:23)

"And all are justified freely by his grace through the redemption that came by Christ Jesus."
(Romans 3:24)

--

Be Humble-

"Jesus said, "If you were blind, you would not be guilty of sin; but now that you claim you can see, your guilt remains."
(John 9:41)

--

"But the tax collector stood at a distance. He would not even look up to heaven, but beat his breast and said, 'God, have mercy on me, a sinner.'
(Luke 18:13)

"Truly I tell you, the tax collectors and the prostitutes are entering the kingdom of God ahead of you."
(Matthew 21:31)

--

GRACE-

Ephesians Chapter 2

8 For by grace are ye saved through faith; and that not of yourselves: it is the gift of God:
9 Not of works, lest any man should boast.

--

Romans 6:14 - For sin shall not have dominion over you: for ye are not under the law, but under grace.

James 4:6 - But he giveth more grace. Wherefore he saith, God resisteth the proud, but giveth grace unto the humble.

John 1:16 - And of his fulness have all we received, and grace for grace.

Romans 3:24 - Being justified freely by his grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus.

2 Timothy 2:1 - Thou therefore, my son, be strong in the grace that is in Christ Jesus.

Grace-
The love and mercy given to us by God because God desires us to have it, not because of anything we have done to earn it.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org...

THE THIEF-

(Luke 23:42)
Then he said, "Lord, remember me when you come into your kingdom."

(Luke 23:42)
Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."

--

That was until Jesus found himself nailed to a cross and in deep pain. His delusions ended and he felt betrayed and forsaken.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

He was quoting David from the psalms.

He knows it Bronto. I and other members have told him, but as you know, he'd rather be a dolt if it affords him a chance to take a swipe at God than be reasonable.

Jesus was actually quoting a prophesy about Him written 2,000+ before. But that is logical and we know that Hari doesn't do logic, so he'll be stupid because insulting Jesus gives him an emotional high.

How do you feel Harikrishna?