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Was Jesus a liar and lunatic?

Harikrish
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7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
We can get the lunatic checked off easily.

John 10:20 Many of them said, "He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?"

Mark 3:21 when his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, "He is out of his mind."

Jesus was deluded and believed God spoke through him.
John 12:49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.

Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

John expresses doubts Jesus is the promised one.
Matthew 11:2"When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3"to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

We know Jesus was crucified for his blasphemous lies.
Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.
According to the Jewish law:
Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

Jesus was a liar and a lunatic before and after his death. Unfortunately he could only be crucified once.

So why are Christians turning God into a liar and lunatic or turning a liar and lunatic into a God?

As a Vedantist raised in the Vedantuc tradition and trained in the reading of esoteric scriptures, Christian Theology and Islamic fundamentalist, I am not at liberty to speculate outside of scriptures. And the scriptures are clear that Jesus was tried, convicted and put to death for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

So why are Christians perpetrating the delusions of a Jewish rabbi who was put to death for his delusional blasphemous lies?

We have to turn to our experts in tbe field of human behaviour. As a student of the behavioural sciences (CBT) I have also explored a diagnostic approach.

Kathleen Taylor, Neuroscientist, Says Religious Fundamentalism Could Be Treated As A Mental Illness - Huffington Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
Throwback
Posts: 421
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7/28/2016 2:48:58 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
We can get the lunatic checked off easily.

John 10:20 Many of them said, "He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?"

Mark 3:21 when his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, "He is out of his mind."

Jesus was deluded and believed God spoke through him.
John 12:49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.

Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

John expresses doubts Jesus is the promised one.
Matthew 11:2"When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3"to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

We know Jesus was crucified for his blasphemous lies.
Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.
According to the Jewish law:
Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

Jesus was a liar and a lunatic before and after his death. Unfortunately he could only be crucified once.

So why are Christians turning God into a liar and lunatic or turning a liar and lunatic into a God?

As a Vedantist raised in the Vedantuc tradition and trained in the reading of esoteric scriptures, Christian Theology and Islamic fundamentalist, I am not at liberty to speculate outside of scriptures. And the scriptures are clear that Jesus was tried, convicted and put to death for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

So why are Christians perpetrating the delusions of a Jewish rabbi who was put to death for his delusional blasphemous lies?

We have to turn to our experts in tbe field of human behaviour. As a student of the behavioural sciences (CBT) I have also explored a diagnostic approach.

Kathleen Taylor, Neuroscientist, Says Religious Fundamentalism Could Be Treated As A Mental Illness - Huffington Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.com...

The link to the Huffington Post speaks volumes of you personally, and where your views originate. Funny stuff that.
When I respond with "OK" don't take it personally. I'm simply being appropriately dismissive.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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7/28/2016 3:39:40 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/28/2016 2:48:58 PM, Throwback wrote:
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
We can get the lunatic checked off easily.

John 10:20 Many of them said, "He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?"

Mark 3:21 when his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, "He is out of his mind."

Jesus was deluded and believed God spoke through him.
John 12:49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.

Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

John expresses doubts Jesus is the promised one.
Matthew 11:2"When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3"to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

We know Jesus was crucified for his blasphemous lies.
Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.
According to the Jewish law:
Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

Jesus was a liar and a lunatic before and after his death. Unfortunately he could only be crucified once.

So why are Christians turning God into a liar and lunatic or turning a liar and lunatic into a God?

As a Vedantist raised in the Vedantuc tradition and trained in the reading of esoteric scriptures, Christian Theology and Islamic fundamentalist, I am not at liberty to speculate outside of scriptures. And the scriptures are clear that Jesus was tried, convicted and put to death for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

So why are Christians perpetrating the delusions of a Jewish rabbi who was put to death for his delusional blasphemous lies?

We have to turn to our experts in tbe field of human behaviour. As a student of the behavioural sciences (CBT) I have also explored a diagnostic approach.

Kathleen Taylor, Neuroscientist, Says Religious Fundamentalism Could Be Treated As A Mental Illness - Huffington Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.com...

The link to the Huffington Post speaks volumes of you personally, and where your views originate. Funny stuff that.

Her credentials.

Kathleen E. Taylor is a research scientist in the Department of Physiology, Anatomy and Genetics at the University of Oxford. In July 2012[1] she was appointed as a Science Fellow of the Institute for Food, Brain and Behaviour[2]

Taylor attended the University of Oxford where she studied physiology and philosophy.[3] She obtained a Masters degree in psychology from Stirling University, and received her doctorate in computational neuroscience from the University of Oxford.[3]
12_13
Posts: 1,361
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7/28/2016 7:06:22 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

It would be good to understand, Elijah came, in spirit and power. Maybe John was not physically Elijah, but spiritually he worked same way.

He will go before him in the spirit and power of Elijah, 'to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children,' and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord."
Luke 1:17

On basis of that I think Jesus didn"t lie.

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

In that there is no doubt.

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

By what I see, Jesus fulfilled all prophesies that he should have fulfilled.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

And where exactly did Jesus say he will be sacrificed?

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

On what basis? Bible tells Jesus was raised after 3 days and so came first time back only after 3 days.

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

That generation who will see all those things happened, may not have existed yet. It would also be truthful to notice that the speech continues with this:

But no one knows of that day and hour, not even the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
Matt. 24:36

It is interesting why people have so much effort to prove Bible wrong with untruthful and foolish arguments. If Bible or Jesus would e wrong, there would not be need to make those twisted arguments.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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7/29/2016 2:37:46 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/28/2016 7:06:22 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

It would be good to understand, Elijah came, in spirit and power. Maybe John was not physically Elijah, but spiritually he worked same way.

Why suggest 'maybe'. John emphatically denied he was Elijah. John was a physical presence not a spirit. Jesus did not say John was Elijah in the spirit.

He will go before him in the spirit and power of Elijah, 'to turn the hearts of the fathers to the children,' and the disobedient to the wisdom of the just; to make ready a people prepared for the Lord."
Luke 1:17

On basis of that I think Jesus didn"t lie.

Jesus was often clueless as often as he was wrong.

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

In that there is no doubt.

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

By what I see, Jesus fulfilled all prophesies that he should have fulfilled.

Jesus was not above the law. He was subject to the law. And the law dictated false prophets should be put to death. Jesus was put to death. Jesus did not fulfil a prophecy, he fulfilled the law that applied to false prophets. He was put to death according to the law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

And where exactly did Jesus say he will be sacrificed?

So you agree Jesus was not sacrificed, he was crucified.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

On what basis? Bible tells Jesus was raised after 3 days and so came first time back only after 3 days.

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

That generation who will see all those things happened, may not have existed yet. It would also be truthful to notice that the speech continues with this:

But no one knows of that day and hour, not even the angels of heaven, but my Father only.
Matt. 24:36

It is interesting why people have so much effort to prove Bible wrong with untruthful and foolish arguments. If Bible or Jesus would e wrong, there would not be need to make those twisted arguments.

It is interesting Christians changed the crucifixion of Jesus for his blasphemous lies to a human sacrifice for the atonement if their sins.
1 John 2:2 He is the atoning sacrifice for our sins, and not only for ours but also for the sins of the whole world.

This is a religious forum. There are many Christians who are scripturally illiterate and poorly educated and easily overwhelmed by the voluminous size of the bible. They are asked to accept the Bible in blind faith to spare themselves from having to read it. There is a need to shatter their blissful ignorance and that is a job left to biblical scholars. I fortunately happened to be the only biblical scholar on DDO and volunteered to campion this Christian cause.
12_13
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7/29/2016 6:44:53 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/29/2016 2:37:46 PM, Harikrish wrote:
Why suggest 'maybe'. John emphatically denied he was Elijah. John was a physical presence not a spirit. Jesus did not say John was Elijah in the spirit.

I didn"t mean John was Elijah in the spirit, I meant Elijah was in spirit in John, or Elijah"s spirit was in John. John was John, but he had the spirit of Elijah.

Jesus was not above the law. He was subject to the law. And the law dictated false prophets should be put to death. Jesus was put to death. Jesus did not fulfil a prophecy, he fulfilled the law that applied to false prophets. He was put to death according to the law.

On basis of what the Bible tells, there were only false witnesses. There was no lawful reason for the judgment, on basis of the knowledge that I have. If you have some other evidence, please show them.

Jesus fulfilled all that he was meant to fulfill.
Harikrish
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7/29/2016 9:19:03 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/29/2016 6:44:53 PM, 12_13 wrote:
At 7/29/2016 2:37:46 PM, Harikrish wrote:
Why suggest 'maybe'. John emphatically denied he was Elijah. John was a physical presence not a spirit. Jesus did not say John was Elijah in the spirit.

I didn"t mean John was Elijah in the spirit, I meant Elijah was in spirit in John, or Elijah"s spirit was in John. John was John, but he had the spirit of Elijah.

John showed no such delusion. John would have admitted if the spirit of Elijah was in him, he did not. Jesus on the other hand actually believed he only spoke what God put in his mouth. But did God ask him to say?

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?"). -

Jesus was not above the law. He was subject to the law. And the law dictated false prophets should be put to death. Jesus was put to death. Jesus did not fulfil a prophecy, he fulfilled the law that applied to false prophets. He was put to death according to the law.

On basis of what the Bible tells, there were only false witnesses. There was no lawful reason for the judgment, on basis of the knowledge that I have. If you have some other evidence, please show them.

Jesus was put to death for his blasphemous lies. There are several examples where the crowd threatened to stone Jesus for blasphemy. Jesus had to slip away and hide for his safety. They even told him why they wanted to stone him.

John 10:33 "We are not stoning you for any good work," they replied, "but for blasphemy, because you, a mere man, claim to be God."

Those were the same eyewitnesses at his trial who shouted Crucify him! Crucify him.

Jesus fulfilled all that he was meant to fulfill.

If he fulfilled everything he was sent to do, there would be no need for him to return. Jesus realized his mission was not going well and he was going to fail. So it makes no sense that God did not give Jesus more time. Moses spent 40 years wandering around in the desert looking for the promised land. Jesus was sent to save the Jews and the world in just 3 years. Ironically Jesus never stepped far from his hometown Galilee. He never saw his mission as universal saviour. He was more interested in saving the children of Israel.

Matthew 10:5 These twelve Jesus sent out with the following instructions: "Do not go among the Gentiles or enter any town of the Samaritans.
Harikrish
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7/30/2016 6:09:44 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
Jesus claimed Moses spoke of his coming as a prophet.

John 5:46 If you believed Moses, you would believe me, for he wrote about me.

So what did Moses say about prophets.

Deuteronomy 18:15-18

15 The Lord your God will raise up for you a prophet like me from among you, from your fellow Israelites. You must listen to him. 16 For this is what you asked of the Lord your God at Horeb on the day of the assembly when you said, "Let us not hear the voice of the Lord our God nor see this great fire anymore, or we will die."

17 The Lord said to me: "What they say is good.
18 I will raise up for them a prophet like you from among their fellow Israelites, and I will put my words in his mouth. He will tell them everything I command him.
19 I myself will call to account anyone who does not listen to my words that the prophet speaks in my name.

But when Jesus was asked directly if he was the prophet Moses spoke of Jesus said no he was not a prophet. Was Jesus lying to escape the crown because there are other examples where he admitted he was the messiah.

" Jews had always understood that this prophecy would one day be fulfilled in a literal way by the coming of a "the Prophet" who would either A) come just before Messiah or B) would, in fact, be the Messiah. That expectation helps explain the dialogue between the Jews and John the Baptist in John 1:19-21. When they ask who he was, he said, "I am not the Christ." "Who are you, then? Are you Elijah?" "No. "Well, then, are you the Prophet." "No." When they said, "the Prophet," both the Jews and John the Baptist understood the reference to be the prophecy of Deuteronomy 18."

Here Jesus said he was the messiah.
John 4:25 The woman said, "I know that Messiah" (called Christ) "is coming. When he comes, he will explain everything to us."
26 Then Jesus declared, "I, the one speaking to you--I am he."

Jesus's answers changed with the crowds he was addressing. But the law to deal with false prophets never changes and was well known to the Jews. False prophets had to be put to death. Jesus was crucified for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

Deuteronomy 18:20
But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."
bigotry
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7/30/2016 6:12:36 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
We can get the lunatic checked off easily.

John 10:20 Many of them said, "He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?"

Mark 3:21 when his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, "He is out of his mind."

Jesus was deluded and believed God spoke through him.
John 12:49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.

Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

John expresses doubts Jesus is the promised one.
Matthew 11:2"When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3"to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

We know Jesus was crucified for his blasphemous lies.
Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.
According to the Jewish law:
Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

Jesus was a liar and a lunatic before and after his death. Unfortunately he could only be crucified once.

So why are Christians turning God into a liar and lunatic or turning a liar and lunatic into a God?

As a Vedantist raised in the Vedantuc tradition and trained in the reading of esoteric scriptures, Christian Theology and Islamic fundamentalist, I am not at liberty to speculate outside of scriptures. And the scriptures are clear that Jesus was tried, convicted and put to death for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

So why are Christians perpetrating the delusions of a Jewish rabbi who was put to death for his delusional blasphemous lies?

We have to turn to our experts in tbe field of human behaviour. As a student of the behavioural sciences (CBT) I have also explored a diagnostic approach.

Kathleen Taylor, Neuroscientist, Says Religious Fundamentalism Could Be Treated As A Mental Illness - Huffington Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.com...

Right the huffington post is a great scholarly source for this very topic.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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7/30/2016 6:38:04 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/30/2016 6:12:36 PM, bigotry wrote:
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
We can get the lunatic checked off easily.

John 10:20 Many of them said, "He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?"

Mark 3:21 when his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, "He is out of his mind."

Jesus was deluded and believed God spoke through him.
John 12:49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.

Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

John expresses doubts Jesus is the promised one.
Matthew 11:2"When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3"to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

We know Jesus was crucified for his blasphemous lies.
Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.
According to the Jewish law:
Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

Jesus was a liar and a lunatic before and after his death. Unfortunately he could only be crucified once.

So why are Christians turning God into a liar and lunatic or turning a liar and lunatic into a God?

As a Vedantist raised in the Vedantuc tradition and trained in the reading of esoteric scriptures, Christian Theology and Islamic fundamentalist, I am not at liberty to speculate outside of scriptures. And the scriptures are clear that Jesus was tried, convicted and put to death for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

So why are Christians perpetrating the delusions of a Jewish rabbi who was put to death for his delusional blasphemous lies?

We have to turn to our experts in tbe field of human behaviour. As a student of the behavioural sciences (CBT) I have also explored a diagnostic approach.

Kathleen Taylor, Neuroscientist, Says Religious Fundamentalism Could Be Treated As A Mental Illness - Huffington Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.com...

Right the huffington post is a great scholarly source for this very topic.

The Huffington Post was only reporting what neuroscientist Kathleen Taylor said at a conference of her peers.

(Raw Story) A leading neurologist at the University of Oxford said this week that recent developments meant that science may one day be able to identify religious fundamentalism as a "mental illness" and a cure it.

During a talk at the Hay Literary Festival in Wales on Wednesday, Kathleen Taylor was asked what positive developments she anticipated in neuroscience in the next 60 years.

"One of the surprises may be to see people with certain beliefs as people who can be treated," she explained, according to The Times of London. "Somebody who has for example become radicalised to a cult ideology " we might stop seeing that as a personal choice that they have chosen as a result of pure free will and may start treating it as some kind of mental disturbance."
bigotry
Posts: 1,068
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7/30/2016 7:57:39 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/30/2016 6:38:04 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/30/2016 6:12:36 PM, bigotry wrote:
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
We can get the lunatic checked off easily.

John 10:20 Many of them said, "He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?"

Mark 3:21 when his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, "He is out of his mind."

Jesus was deluded and believed God spoke through him.
John 12:49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.

Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

John expresses doubts Jesus is the promised one.
Matthew 11:2"When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3"to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

We know Jesus was crucified for his blasphemous lies.
Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.
According to the Jewish law:
Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

Jesus was a liar and a lunatic before and after his death. Unfortunately he could only be crucified once.

So why are Christians turning God into a liar and lunatic or turning a liar and lunatic into a God?

As a Vedantist raised in the Vedantuc tradition and trained in the reading of esoteric scriptures, Christian Theology and Islamic fundamentalist, I am not at liberty to speculate outside of scriptures. And the scriptures are clear that Jesus was tried, convicted and put to death for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

So why are Christians perpetrating the delusions of a Jewish rabbi who was put to death for his delusional blasphemous lies?

We have to turn to our experts in tbe field of human behaviour. As a student of the behavioural sciences (CBT) I have also explored a diagnostic approach.

Kathleen Taylor, Neuroscientist, Says Religious Fundamentalism Could Be Treated As A Mental Illness - Huffington Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.com...

Right the huffington post is a great scholarly source for this very topic.

The Huffington Post was only reporting what neuroscientist Kathleen Taylor said at a conference of her peers.

(Raw Story) A leading neurologist at the University of Oxford said this week that recent developments meant that science may one day be able to identify religious fundamentalism as a "mental illness" and a cure it.

During a talk at the Hay Literary Festival in Wales on Wednesday, Kathleen Taylor was asked what positive developments she anticipated in neuroscience in the next 60 years.

"One of the surprises may be to see people with certain beliefs as people who can be treated," she explained, according to The Times of London. "Somebody who has for example become radicalised to a cult ideology " we might stop seeing that as a personal choice that they have chosen as a result of pure free will and may start treating it as some kind of mental disturbance."

I find it interesting you would cite a neurologist rather than a theologian or someone with a doctorate degree in religious studies of some kind in regard to this kind of textual critique.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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7/30/2016 8:37:20 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/30/2016 7:57:39 PM, bigotry wrote:
At 7/30/2016 6:38:04 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 7/30/2016 6:12:36 PM, bigotry wrote:
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
We can get the lunatic checked off easily.

John 10:20 Many of them said, "He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?"

Mark 3:21 when his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, "He is out of his mind."

Jesus was deluded and believed God spoke through him.
John 12:49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.

Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

John expresses doubts Jesus is the promised one.
Matthew 11:2"When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3"to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

We know Jesus was crucified for his blasphemous lies.
Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.
According to the Jewish law:
Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

Jesus was a liar and a lunatic before and after his death. Unfortunately he could only be crucified once.

So why are Christians turning God into a liar and lunatic or turning a liar and lunatic into a God?

As a Vedantist raised in the Vedantic tradition and trained in the reading of esoteric scriptures, Christian Theology and Islamic fundamentalist, I am not at liberty to speculate outside of scriptures. And the scriptures are clear that Jesus was tried, convicted and put to death for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

So why are Christians perpetrating the delusions of a Jewish rabbi who was put to death for his delusional blasphemous lies?

We have to turn to our experts in tbe field of human behaviour. As a student of the behavioural sciences (CBT) I have also explored a diagnostic approach.

Kathleen Taylor, Neuroscientist, Says Religious Fundamentalism Could Be Treated As A Mental Illness - Huffington Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.com...

Right the huffington post is a great scholarly source for this very topic.

The Huffington Post was only reporting what neuroscientist Kathleen Taylor said at a conference of her peers.

(Raw Story) A leading neurologist at the University of Oxford said this week that recent developments meant that science may one day be able to identify religious fundamentalism as a "mental illness" and a cure it.

During a talk at the Hay Literary Festival in Wales on Wednesday, Kathleen Taylor was asked what positive developments she anticipated in neuroscience in the next 60 years.

"One of the surprises may be to see people with certain beliefs as people who can be treated," she explained, according to The Times of London. "Somebody who has for example become radicalised to a cult ideology " we might stop seeing that as a personal choice that they have chosen as a result of pure free will and may start treating it as some kind of mental disturbance."

I find it interesting you would cite a neurologist rather than a theologian or someone with a doctorate degree in religious studies of some kind in regard to this kind of textual critique.

It is interesting to read the diagnosis of experts in the field of mental illness to find correlation between ones belief and mental illness.
Kathleen Taylor, Neuroscientist, Says Religious Fundamentalism Could Be Treated As A Mental Illness

What diagnostic conclusions have the experts reached about their deluded leader Jesus who triggered a similar condition among his followers?
And how can his condition be triggered in his followers is explained by Kathleen Taylor in her research. That this delusion exist is evidenced by those members claiming to be possessed by God. Read their delusional posts and unsubstantiated experiences and their 'death wish' that Jesus was obsessed with fulfilling.

Today, Psychiatry diagnoses Jesus with schizophrenia:
"In short, the nature of the hallucinations of Jesus, as they are described in the orthodox Gospels, permits us to conclude that the founder of the Christian religion was afflicted with religious paranoia." (Charles Binet-Sangl", La Folie de J"sus, The Madness of Jesus, 1910, p 393)
"Everything that we know about him [Jesus] conforms so perfectly to the clinical picture of paranoia that it is hardly conceivable that people can even question the accuracy of the diagnosis."(American psychiatrist William Hirsch, Conclusions of a Psychiatrist, 1912, p 99)
"Jesus Christ might simply have returned to his carpentry following the use of modern [psychiatric] treatments." (William Sargant).
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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7/31/2016 1:25:48 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
We all know Jesus was crucified. Christians believe he was innocent. Jesus was asked at his trial if he was what he claimed he was. Jesus could have easily proven he was the Christ, Messiah and even God if he had their power. Elijah, Moses and other prophets smited their enemies. Moses brought about several plagues against the Pharorah. But Jesus never defended his title and accepted his guilt. Only a liar and a lunatic would make all those claims and refuse to demonstrate any evidence to rebut any charges to the contrary. God never hesitated to show who he was in the past. Since he was controlling Jesus, why did he choose to do otherwise and surrender?
EtrnlVw
Posts: 2,307
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7/31/2016 12:40:33 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
Harikrish doesn't accept the OT prophesies concerning the Messiah and therefore does not accept Jesus as the fulfillment of the them. The only way Hari can reject Jesus as the fulfillment of Jewish OT prophesy is by distorting and twisting content, by literally lying and being deceptive, I believe he knows what he is doing, but why? why would Hari intentionally lie and be deceptive? think about that, we all know that this poster is manipulative, perverted, insensitive and untrustworthy, and so is the content of his doings here.

Hari knows full well little Kathleen would apply the same standards to Hinduism and it's nutty revelations of God and it's Gurus.
The only way Hari can gain any traction is by accusing Jesus of being a liar, and by asserting mental illness, in other words baseless assertions and flat out falsary. He can not do that through scripture and by the testimony and works of Jesus, no, rather he needs to go behind the scenes and work through deception rather than through truth.

Jesus, IS the world's greatest spiritual leader through word and action, His standard rises above the mediocre, generic watered down spiritualists in the world and has become an icon of spirituality.

Jesus wasn't a "liar", He spoke the truth despite circumstances and threats to his life, he did not back down and he never turned back, he was faithful to his own words to the end. Jesus' very own testimony and words are truth and life, there is no lie in them, there are no lies or distortions in the principles He taught, they are truth.

BTW, as Harold runs around the forum like a child attacking Christianity/Jesus while evading his own religious beliefs he mocks concepts in Christian teachings such as the "trinity", Hinduism has a trinity concept, he mocks Jesus as God in the flesh yet Hinduism has avatars "diety on earth", he mocks the unity Jesus had with God by labeling Him delusional yet both Hinduism and Buddhism relate the same concepts. He claims of course only the prophets of the Bible to have mental illness while not Hindu guru's lol. Of course only the spirituality in the Bible is a mental illness....not his own beliefs, no way right? anyone say double standard??

Harold misrepresents the teachings of Jesus by twisting the intentions and applications of them such as "cannibalism", which is the way Jesus illustrates application (by saying eat my flesh, I am the bread of life, drink my blood), the consumption of spiritual principles to ones thoughts and actions and life, it's just a poetic way of suggesting following....doing, putting beliefs in action. Jesus didn't teach cannibalism, that is just dumb, Jesus taught application but illustrated it with examples or parables.
But Hari must twist that principle to make it seem like Jesus was nuts and taught us to eat flesh rather than revealing a legitimate truth, a spiritual principle. Why?
Why does he need to accuse Jesus of being gay? that he was a liar? that he was delusional? that he taught cannibiilsm and taught us to hate our families? why would Hari do all of this when he could simply represent his own beliefs?
So why does this member have to go to such desperate measures all the time to discredit Jesus? because in reality he really has nothing, and the reputation of Jesus precedes Him and there is nothing that Hari can lie about to change that.

Jesus was compassionate, he reached out to outcasts and the sick with no motive other than love, that is not the actions of a liar.

Jesus was courageous, he spoke against the darkness and evil in the religious system (institutions) and never backed down. He maintained His testimony, word and mission without wavering and never gave in to the ridiculousness of religious oppression rather triumphed over it by giving His life, changing the face of religion and customs and leaving the greatest legacy known.

Jesus was practical, He made spirituality accessible. He single-handedly made the relation between God and man applicable, reachable, tangible and observable. He taught with precision and clarity that even as a young kid I could digest and apply it. Only a crooked adult could mess up such simplicity and honesty!

Jesus was loyal, committed and steadfast. He stood by His Father, honored God, carried out His word and truth and never swayed from that. Jesus was the real deal, He is what we all try to be and can never quite fulfill, He is the Messiah, the perfect lamb.

Jesus was gentle but passionate, showed empathy and sympathy. He didn't try and fight with force, He didn't resist the sacrifice, he never ran from it, he never said what they wanted to hear only what was true and only what was righteous.

Jesus was DOER, not a talker. That means He had integrity, again not the characteristics of a liar or someone mentally ill. Jesus actually walked the walk, where can Hari show us where Jesus actually intentionally told lies? was a liar?

Jesus resurfaced the face of religion in about three years, that's all it took Him, imagine what He could have done in a lifetime....
Jesus was a hero, someone willing to turn around all wrongs and make them right through action, no wonder He said "I make all things new", He did!

Jesus was a truth teller, a truthful person and possessed truthful characteristics. He was a spiritual Master and has all the qualities, attributes and qualities that make a truthful, sane man, unique but not a liar and a lunatic, but you on the other hand..... well, you know how reaping and sowing works (karma). What you claim and say here will come back on you, not Jesus. You will be known as a liar and a lunatic on DDO, and that is pretty accurate.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,586
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7/31/2016 1:45:32 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/31/2016 12:40:33 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
Harikrish doesn't accept the OT prophesies concerning the Messiah and therefore does not accept Jesus as the fulfillment of the them. The only way Hari can reject Jesus as the fulfillment of Jewish OT prophesy is by distorting and twisting content, by literally lying and being deceptive, I believe he knows what he is doing, but why? why would Hari intentionally lie and be deceptive? think about that, we all know that this poster is manipulative, perverted, insensitive and untrustworthy, and so is the content of his doings here.

Hari knows full well little Kathleen would apply the same standards to Hinduism and it's nutty revelations of God and it's Gurus.
The only way Hari can gain any traction is by accusing Jesus of being a liar, and by asserting mental illness, in other words baseless assertions and flat out falsary. He can not do that through scripture and by the testimony and works of Jesus, no, rather he needs to go behind the scenes and work through deception rather than through truth.

Jesus, IS the world's greatest spiritual leader through word and action, His standard rises above the mediocre, generic watered down spiritualists in the world and has become an icon of spirituality.

Jesus wasn't a "liar", He spoke the truth despite circumstances and threats to his life, he did not back down and he never turned back, he was faithful to his own words to the end. Jesus' very own testimony and words are truth and life, there is no lie in them, there are no lies or distortions in the principles He taught, they are truth.

BTW, as Harold runs around the forum like a child attacking Christianity/Jesus while evading his own religious beliefs he mocks concepts in Christian teachings such as the "trinity", Hinduism has a trinity concept, he mocks Jesus as God in the flesh yet Hinduism has avatars "diety on earth", he mocks the unity Jesus had with God by labeling Him delusional yet both Hinduism and Buddhism relate the same concepts. He claims of course only the prophets of the Bible to have mental illness while not Hindu guru's lol. Of course only the spirituality in the Bible is a mental illness....not his own beliefs, no way right? anyone say double standard??

Harold misrepresents the teachings of Jesus by twisting the intentions and applications of them such as "cannibalism", which is the way Jesus illustrates application (by saying eat my flesh, I am the bread of life, drink my blood), the consumption of spiritual principles to ones thoughts and actions and life, it's just a poetic way of suggesting following....doing, putting beliefs in action. Jesus didn't teach cannibalism, that is just dumb, Jesus taught application but illustrated it with examples or parables.
But Hari must twist that principle to make it seem like Jesus was nuts and taught us to eat flesh rather than revealing a legitimate truth, a spiritual principle. Why?
Why does he need to accuse Jesus of being gay? that he was a liar? that he was delusional? that he taught cannibiilsm and taught us to hate our families? why would Hari do all of this when he could simply represent his own beliefs?
So why does this member have to go to such desperate measures all the time to discredit Jesus? because in reality he really has nothing, and the reputation of Jesus precedes Him and there is nothing that Hari can lie about to change that.

Jesus was compassionate, he reached out to outcasts and the sick with no motive other than love, that is not the actions of a liar.

Jesus was courageous, he spoke against the darkness and evil in the religious system (institutions) and never backed down. He maintained His testimony, word and mission without wavering and never gave in to the ridiculousness of religious oppression rather triumphed over it by giving His life, changing the face of religion and customs and leaving the greatest legacy known.

Jesus was practical, He made spirituality accessible. He single-handedly made the relation between God and man applicable, reachable, tangible and observable. He taught with precision and clarity that even as a young kid I could digest and apply it. Only a crooked adult could mess up such simplicity and honesty!

Jesus was loyal, committed and steadfast. He stood by His Father, honored God, carried out His word and truth and never swayed from that. Jesus was the real deal, He is what we all try to be and can never quite fulfill, He is the Messiah, the perfect lamb.

Jesus was gentle but passionate, showed empathy and sympathy. He didn't try and fight with force, He didn't resist the sacrifice, he never ran from it, he never said what they wanted to hear only what was true and only what was righteous.

Jesus was DOER, not a talker. That means He had integrity, again not the characteristics of a liar or someone mentally ill. Jesus actually walked the walk, where can Hari show us where Jesus actually intentionally told lies? was a liar?

Jesus resurfaced the face of religion in about three years, that's all it took Him, imagine what He could have done in a lifetime....
Jesus was a hero, someone willing to turn around all wrongs and make them right through action, no wonder He said "I make all things new", He did!

Jesus was a truth teller, a truthful person and possessed truthful characteristics. He was a spiritual Master and has all the qualities, attributes and qualities that make a truthful, sane man, unique but not a liar and a lunatic, but you on the other hand..... well, you know how reaping and sowing works (karma). What you claim and say here will come back on you, not Jesus. You will be known as a liar and a lunatic on DDO, and that is pretty accurate.

Don't be silly, E, you and the other believers here are just as much lunatics and liars as Hari. He does not hold the monopoly on that.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth
bulproof
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7/31/2016 2:11:09 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/31/2016 12:40:33 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
Harikrish doesn't accept the OT prophesies concerning the Messiah and therefore does not accept Jesus as the fulfillment of the them.
Neither does the Jewish religion ie. the OT.
What a stupid argument.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
bulproof
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7/31/2016 2:14:46 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
Which Jesus are we discussing? The one accepted as historical by most historians or the one in the bible who is rejected by most historians?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Harikrish
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7/31/2016 3:51:18 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/31/2016 12:40:33 PM, EtrnlVw wrote:
Harikrish doesn't accept the OT prophesies concerning the Messiah and therefore does not accept Jesus as the fulfillment of the them. The only way Hari can reject Jesus as the fulfillment of Jewish OT prophesy is by distorting and twisting content, by literally lying and being deceptive, I believe he knows what he is doing, but why? why would Hari intentionally lie and be deceptive? think about that, we all know that this poster is manipulative, perverted, insensitive and untrustworthy, and so is the content of his doings here.

It was the scriptures that incriminated him. He was tried, convicted and put to death for his blasphemous lies.

Hari knows full well little Kathleen would apply the same standards to Hinduism and it's nutty revelations of God and it's Gurus.
The only way Hari can gain any traction is by accusing Jesus of being a liar, and by asserting mental illness, in other words baseless assertions and flat out falsary. He can not do that through scripture and by the testimony and works of Jesus, no, rather he needs to go behind the scenes and work through deception rather than through truth.

I provided links from a host of psychiatrist that diagnosed Jesus's mental state which are listed in the DSM-5 manual of mental disorders.

Jesus, IS the world's greatest spiritual leader through word and action, His standard rises above the mediocre, generic watered down spiritualists in the world and has become an icon of spirituality.

Jesus was the only spiritual leader who was crucified as a criminal along with criminals.

Jesus wasn't a "liar", He spoke the truth despite circumstances and threats to his life, he did not back down and he never turned back, he was faithful to his own words to the end. Jesus' very own testimony and words are truth and life, there is no lie in them, there are no lies or distortions in the principles He taught, they are truth.

When Jesus was asked to be specific about the signs to follow, his return and the end times, Jesus said he did not know, only God knows. He was often clueless just as often as he was wrong.

BTW, as Harold runs around the forum like a child attacking Christianity/Jesus while evading his own religious beliefs he mocks concepts in Christian teachings such as the "trinity", Hinduism has a trinity concept, he mocks Jesus as God in the flesh yet Hinduism has avatars "diety on earth", he mocks the unity Jesus had with God by labeling Him delusional yet both Hinduism and Buddhism relate the same concepts. He claims of course only the prophets of the Bible to have mental illness while not Hindu guru's lol. Of course only the spirituality in the Bible is a mental illness....not his own beliefs, no way right? anyone say double standard??

Christianity by your own admission compares poorly against Hinduism and Buddhism. No avatar has been so ridiculed, mocked, beaten and torturously put to death than Jesus and by the very people God sent him to save. Such contradictions are not found in Hinduism or Buddhism. Get an education.

Harold misrepresents the teachings of Jesus by twisting the intentions and applications of them such as "cannibalism", which is the way Jesus illustrates application (by saying eat my flesh, I am the bread of life, drink my blood), the consumption of spiritual principles to ones thoughts and actions and life, it's just a poetic way of suggesting following....doing, putting beliefs in action. Jesus didn't teach cannibalism, that is just dumb, Jesus taught application but illustrated it with examples or parables.
Jesus said eat my flesh it is real, drink my blood it is real. You cannot get more real than that about promoting cannibalism..

But Hari must twist that principle to make it seem like Jesus was nuts and taught us to eat flesh rather than revealing a legitimate truth, a spiritual principle. Why?
The experts have diagnosed his mental condition based on his life, teachings and beliefs and concluded he suffered from serious mental illness.
Read the link.
http://www.bible.ca...

Why does he need to accuse Jesus of being gay? that he was a liar? that he was delusional? that he taught cannibiilsm and taught us to hate our families? why would Hari do all of this when he could simply represent his own beliefs?
Jesus was unmarried at the age of 30 which is very unusual for a Jew. He also surrounded himself with very unsavoury characters. One lied about him and the other betrayed him. But Secret Mark went beyond and revealed his relationship with men he invited to his secret chamber.

So why does this member have to go to such desperate measures all the time to discredit Jesus? because in reality he really has nothing, and the reputation of Jesus precedes Him and there is nothing that Hari can lie about to change that.

That Jesus was a liar and a lunatic was first raised by C.S. Lewis. Lewis said no normal person would make the claims about himself that Jesus made knowing he would be put to death unless he was a liar and a lunatic. Jesus was put to death.

Jesus was compassionate, he reached out to outcasts and the sick with no motive other than love, that is not the actions of a liar.

Jesus bragged all authority over heaven and earth was given to him. Yet his disciples were all eventually killed.

Jesus was courageous, he spoke against the darkness and evil in the religious system (institutions) and never backed down. He maintained His testimony, word and mission without wavering and never gave in to the ridiculousness of religious oppression rather triumphed over it by giving His life, changing the face of religion and customs and leaving the greatest legacy known.

Jesus on the cross accused God for betraying and forsaking him.

Jesus was practical, He made spirituality accessible. He single-handedly made the relation between God and man applicable, reachable, tangible and observable. He taught with precision and clarity that even as a young kid I could digest and apply it. Only a crooked adult could mess up such simplicity and honesty!

Jesus said he did not come to spread peace but to destroy the traditional family turning each against the other.

Jesus was loyal, committed and steadfast. He stood by His Father, honored God, carried out His word and truth and never swayed from that. Jesus was the real deal, He is what we all try to be and can never quite fulfill, He is the Messiah, the perfect lamb.

Jesus was crucified not sacrificed.

Jesus was gentle but passionate, showed empathy and sympathy. He didn't try and fight with force, He didn't resist the sacrifice, he never ran from it, he never said what they wanted to hear only what was true and only what was righteous.

Jesus was DOER, not a talker. That means He had integrity, again not the characteristics of a liar or someone mentally ill. Jesus actually walked the walk, where can Hari show us where Jesus actually intentionally told lies? was a liar?

Jesus resurfaced the face of religion in about three years, that's all it took Him, imagine what He could have done in a lifetime....
Jesus was a hero, someone willing to turn around all wrongs and make them right through action, no wonder He said "I make all things new", He did!

Jesus was a truth teller, a truthful person and possessed truthful characteristics. He was a spiritual Master and has all the qualities, attributes and qualities that make a truthful, sane man, unique but not a liar and a lunatic, but you on the other hand..... well, you know how reaping and sowing works (karma). What you claim and say here will come back on you, not Jesus. You will be known as a liar and a lunatic on DDO, and that is pretty accurate.
Jesus was tried, convicted and put to death.
Harikrish
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8/3/2016 2:51:50 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
Even the pope reminds Christians they like Jesus are failures just like Jesus was a failure of the cross. And they as followers of Jesus should expect nothing less and prepare to see their efforts and works fail and produce no fruit.
The more Christians fail the closer they feel they are like Jesus. Jesus failed to convert the Jews he was sent to save. He was despised and held in low esteem. He was tried, convicted and crucified. Even on the cross he felt betrayed and forsaken.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

The pope shares some encouraging words with Christians who are losers.

" God sees to the fruits of our labors," Pope Francis said during his whirlwind U.S. tour. "And if at times our efforts and works seem to fail and produce no fruit, we need to remember that we are followers of Jesus ... and His life, humanly speaking, ended in failure, the failure of the cross."
Harikrish
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8/3/2016 8:31:50 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
We have the experts give us a diagnostic analysis of Jesus's mental disorder. But what about those who have given up their lives to serve God. What do they have to say about Jesus and the myth surrounding him?

"A third of Church of England clergy doubt or disbelieve in the physical Resurrection and only half are convinced of the truth of the Virgin birth, according to a new survey.
The poll of nearly 2,000 of the Church's 10,000 clergy also found that only half believe that faith in Christ is the only route to salvation.
While it has long been known that numerous clerics are dubious about the historic creeds of the Church, the survey is the first to disclose how widespread is the scepticism.
Few bishops would now share the views of the former Bishop of Durham, the Rt Rev David Jenkins, who caused a scandal in the 1980s when he contrasted the Resurrection with a "conjuring trick with bones".
Nevertheless liberal clergy, who represent about one in eight of the total, remain profoundly uncertain about the Church's core doctrines. In the survey, two thirds of them expressed doubts in the physical Resurrection and three quarters are unconvinced by the Virgin birth."
Harikrish
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8/4/2016 1:53:39 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
JW"s believe that Jesus Christ was a perfect man, and that He is a person distinct from God the Father. However, they also teach that before His Earthly life, Jesus was a spirit creature, Michael the archangel, who was created by God and became the Messiah at His baptism. According to Jehovah"s Witnesses, Jesus is a mighty one, although not almighty as Jehovah God is. According to John 1:1 in their Bible, The New World Translation, Christ is "a god," but not "the God." They teach that Jesus "was and is and always will be beneath Jehovah" and that "Christ and God are not coequal".

Why didn't Jesus tell his believers he was the archangel Michael instead of claiming he was something he was not?
Harikrish
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8/4/2016 8:07:19 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
The Pharisees demand a sign from Jesus to prove his claims. Not an unreasonable request from someone claiming to be sent by God. Jesus could offer no evidence.

Mark 8:The Demand for a Sign
11 The Pharisees came and began to argue with him, asking him for a sign from heaven, to test him. 12 And he sighed deeply in his spirit and said, "Why does this generation ask for a sign? Truly I tell you, no sign will be given to this generation." 13 And he left them, and getting into the boat again, he went across to the other side.

Jesus was often clueless as often as he was wrong. He did not know what the people thought he was anymore than what the disciples thought he was. Only Peter dared to offer a guess.

Mark 8:
27 Jesus went on with his disciples to the villages of Caesarea Philippi; and on the way he asked his disciples, "Who do people say that I am?" 28 And they answered him, "John the Baptist; and others, Elijah; and still others, one of the prophets." 29 He asked them, "But who do you say that I am?" Peter answered him, "You are the Messiah."[h] 30 And he sternly ordered them not to tell anyone about him.

Jesus was sent to save the Jews. How were they to know if Jesus told his disciples not to tell them what he was and to keep it a secret from them? Any wonder why they crucified him. He refused to show them signs as evidence and he kept the truth from them.
David_Debates
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8/5/2016 9:30:56 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
We can get the lunatic checked off easily.

John 10:20 Many of them said, "He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?"

Mark 3:21 when his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, "He is out of his mind."

Jesus was deluded and believed God spoke through him.
John 12:49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.

Have you heard this quote by C.S. Lewis?
"I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: I"m ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don"t accept his claim to be God. That is the one thing we must not say. A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic " on the level with the man who says he is a poached egg " or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God, or else a madman or something worse. You can shut him up for a fool, you can spit at him and kill him as a demon or you can fall at his feet and call him Lord and God, but let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about his being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to."

Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

Oh hell no! Don't misinterpret the Bible! This is a misquotation!
Matthew 11:14
"And if you are willing to accept it, he is the Elijah who was to come (NIV)."
He is not Elijah, he is the Elijah who was to come. Take it into context.


In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

No. See above.


John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

John expresses doubts Jesus is the promised one.
Matthew 11:2"When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3"to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

We know Jesus was crucified for his blasphemous lies.

No. He was crucified because the synagogue wanted him dead.
John 18:38-40
""What is truth?" retorted Pilate. With this he went out again to the Jews gathered there and said, "I find no basis for a charge against him. But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover. Do you want me to release "the king of the Jews"?" They shouted back, "No, not him! Give us Barabbas!" Now Barabbas had taken part in an uprising."
Jesus couldn't be convicted of any charge. He said it himself: "I find no basis for a charge against him." What crucified him is a custom. "But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover." They released Barabbas (a murderer), thereby convicting Jesus.

Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.
According to the Jewish law:
Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

In what sense was he using the word "sacrificed?" Did he mean he was a sacrifice for our sins or that others were to sacrifice him?

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

It seemed to be fulfilled in the years AD 66-70. The destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans?

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

Generation as in...?
Once again, a problem with your definitions.


Jesus was a liar and a lunatic before and after his death. Unfortunately he could only be crucified once.

You would want him to be crucified more than once?

So why are Christians turning God into a liar and lunatic or turning a liar and lunatic into a God?

We aren't. We're turning to a God that loves and cares deeply about us.

As a Vedantist raised in the Vedantuc tradition and trained in the reading of esoteric scriptures, Christian Theology and Islamic fundamentalist, I am not at liberty to speculate outside of scriptures. And the scriptures are clear that Jesus was tried, convicted and put to death for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

So why are Christians perpetrating the delusions of a Jewish rabbi who was put to death for his delusional blasphemous lies?

We have to turn to our experts in tbe field of human behaviour. As a student of the behavioural sciences (CBT) I have also explored a diagnostic approach.

Kathleen Taylor, Neuroscientist, Says Religious Fundamentalism Could Be Treated As A Mental Illness - Huffington Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
bulproof
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8/5/2016 9:51:49 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/5/2016 9:30:56 AM, David_Debates wrote:
You would want him to be crucified more than once?
Would you hammer in the nails?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Harikrish
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8/5/2016 12:23:04 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/5/2016 9:30:56 AM, David_Debates wrote:
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
We can get the lunatic checked off easily.

John 10:20 Many of them said, "He is demon-possessed and raving mad. Why listen to him?"

Mark 3:21 when his family heard about this, they went to take charge of him, for they said, "He is out of his mind."

Jesus was deluded and believed God spoke through him.
John 12:49 For I did not speak on my own, but the Father who sent me commanded me to say all that I have spoken.

But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.

Have you heard this quote by C.S. Lewis?
"I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: I"m ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don"t accept his claim to be God. That is the one thing we must not say. A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic " on the level with the man who says he is a poached egg " or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God, or else a madman or something worse. You can shut him up for a fool, you can spit at him and kill him as a demon or you can fall at his feet and call him Lord and God, but let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about his being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to."

Jesus was a liar and a lunatic making blasphemous claims knowing he was going to be put to death. If he was lord he did not convince anyone at the trial.

Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

Oh hell no! Don't misinterpret the Bible! This is a misquotation!
Matthew 11:14
"And if you are willing to accept it, he is the Elijah who was to come (NIV)."
He is not Elijah, he is the Elijah who was to come. Take it into context.

John was Elijah that the people did not recognize according to Jesus. But Johndenied he was Elijah. Learn to read the bible.

Matthew 17:12 But I tell you, Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but have done to him everything they wished. In the same way the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

No. See above.

Yes, learn to read.

John 1:21"They asked him, "Then who are you? Are you Elijah?"
He said, "I am not."
"Are you the Prophet?"
He answered, "No."

John expresses doubts Jesus is the promised one.
Matthew 11:2"When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3"to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

Jesus expresses his own doubts on the cross.

Matthew 27:46 About three in the afternoon Jesus cried out in a loud voice, "Eli, Eli, lema sabachthani?" (which means "My God, my God, why have you forsaken me?").

We know Jesus was crucified for his blasphemous lies.

No. He was crucified because the synagogue wanted him dead.
The people wanted Jesus dead. They shouted Crucufy him, Crucify him.

John 18:38-40
""What is truth?" retorted Pilate. With this he went out again to the Jews gathered there and said, "I find no basis for a charge against him. But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover. Do you want me to release "the king of the Jews"?" They shouted back, "No, not him! Give us Barabbas!" Now Barabbas had taken part in an uprising."
Jesus couldn't be convicted of any charge. He said it himself: "I find no basis for a charge against him." What crucified him is a custom. "But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover." They released Barabbas (a murderer), thereby convicting Jesus.

The crowd shouted Crucify him, Crucify him. And accepted they judgement of Jesus.
MATTHEW 27:25 KJV "Then answered all the people, and said, His blood [be] on us, and on our children."

Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.

According to the Jewish law:
Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

In what sense was he using the word "sacrificed?" Did he mean he was a sacrifice for our sins or that others were to sacrifice him?

He was confusing sacrifice with crucify.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

It seemed to be fulfilled in the years AD 66-70. The destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans?

The Romans destroyed the temple after the Jews revolted.

2. Matthew 24:34
Truly I tell you, this generation will certainly not pass away until all these things have happened.

2000 years have passed and many generation have gone by yet his promise remains unfulfilled.

Jesus was a liar and a lunatic before and after his death. Unfortunately he could only be crucified once.


So why are Christians turning God into a liar and lunatic or turning a liar and lunatic into a God?

We aren't. We're turning to a God that loves and cares deeply about us.

As a Vedantist raised in the Vedantuc tradition and trained in the reading of esoteric scriptures, Christian Theology and Islamic fundamentalist, I am not at liberty to speculate outside of scriptures. And the scriptures are clear that Jesus was tried, convicted and put to death for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

So why are Christians perpetrating the delusions of a Jewish rabbi who was put to death for his delusional blasphemous lies?

We have to turn to our experts in tbe field of human behaviour. As a student of the behavioural sciences (CBT) I have also explored a diagnostic approach.

Kathleen Taylor, Neuroscientist, Says Religious Fundamentalism Could Be Treated As A Mental Illness - Huffington Post

http://www.huffingtonpost.com...
Harikrish
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8/5/2016 2:03:45 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
Here is another example of Jesus lying.

At the cross he told his fellow criminals tbey would be with him in paradise.

Luke 23:43 Jesus answered him, "Truly I tell you, today you will be with me in paradise."

Jesus said he would be in paradise soon after his death. Was the resurrection then a lie?

But to his disciples he says destroy this temple and it will be rebuilt in 3 days. The temple remains destroyed 2000 years later.

Starting with Jesus visiting the temple.

John 2:14 In the temple courts he found people selling cattle, sheep and doves, and others sitting at tables exchanging money.

The people asking him for a sign to prove his authority.

John 2:18 The Jews then responded to him, "What sign can you show us to prove your authority to do all this?"

Jesus making a claim that remains unfulfilled.

John 2:19 Jesus answered and said unto them, Destroy this temple, and in three days I will raise it up.

Here is another reference Jesus made to the temple destruction.

Matthew 24:2 "Do you see all these things?" he asked. "Truly I tell you, not one stone here will be left on another; every one will be thrown down."

Paradoxically Jesus who was given all authority over heaven and earth did nothing to stop the Romans from destroying the temple. Yet he was furious when he saw merchants desecration the temple. Jesus was often clueless as often as he was wrong.

Matthew 21:12 Jesus entered the temple courts and drove out all who were buying and selling there. He overturned the tables of the money changers and the benches of those selling doves.
David_Debates
Posts: 244
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8/5/2016 6:06:21 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/5/2016 12:23:04 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 8/5/2016 9:30:56 AM, David_Debates wrote:
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.

Have you heard this quote by C.S. Lewis?
"I am trying here to prevent anyone saying the really foolish thing that people often say about Him: I"m ready to accept Jesus as a great moral teacher, but I don"t accept his claim to be God. That is the one thing we must not say. A man who was merely a man and said the sort of things Jesus said would not be a great moral teacher. He would either be a lunatic " on the level with the man who says he is a poached egg " or else he would be the Devil of Hell. You must make your choice. Either this man was, and is, the Son of God, or else a madman or something worse. You can shut him up for a fool, you can spit at him and kill him as a demon or you can fall at his feet and call him Lord and God, but let us not come with any patronizing nonsense about his being a great human teacher. He has not left that open to us. He did not intend to."

Jesus was a liar and a lunatic making blasphemous claims knowing he was going to be put to death. If he was lord he did not convince anyone at the trial.

He did not try to. He knew why he was on earth (being omnicient) and he knew that if he were to save himself he would not fufil that reason for being on earth (to sacrifice himself to save us from sin).

Learn to read, I guess.


Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

Oh hell no! Don't misinterpret the Bible! This is a misquotation!
Matthew 11:14
"And if you are willing to accept it, he is the Elijah who was to come (NIV)."
He is not Elijah, he is the Elijah who was to come. Take it into context.

John was Elijah that the people did not recognize according to Jesus. But Johndenied he was Elijah. Learn to read the bible.

Matthew 17:12 But I tell you, Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but have done to him everything they wished. In the same way the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands.

There was a man in the Old Testament named Elijah. He was persecuted, almost killed. He had to run away, always within an inch of his life because of the Jewish authorities at the time. In no way does this refer to John the Baptist.

Learn to read, I guess.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

No. See above.

Yes, learn to read.

See above.

No. He was crucified because the synagogue wanted him dead.
The people wanted Jesus dead. They shouted Crucufy him, Crucify him.

John 18:38-40
""What is truth?" retorted Pilate. With this he went out again to the Jews gathered there and said, "I find no basis for a charge against him. But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover. Do you want me to release "the king of the Jews"?" They shouted back, "No, not him! Give us Barabbas!" Now Barabbas had taken part in an uprising."
Jesus couldn't be convicted of any charge. He said it himself: "I find no basis for a charge against him." What crucified him is a custom. "But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover." They released Barabbas (a murderer), thereby convicting Jesus.

The crowd shouted Crucify him, Crucify him. And accepted they judgement of Jesus.
MATTHEW 27:25 KJV "Then answered all the people, and said, His blood [be] on us, and on our children."

Not because he commuted any crime punishable by death, let alone crucifixion, but because the synagogue wanted him dead. Doesn't this verse prove my very point?

Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.

According to the Jewish law:
Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."

It is clear Jesus did not fulfill the prophesies. Instead, He was subjected to the law and put to death as demanded of false prophets according to Mosaic law.

Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

In what sense was he using the word "sacrificed?" Did he mean he was a sacrifice for our sins or that others were to sacrifice him?

He was confusing sacrifice with crucify.

Sacrifice: destruction or surrender of something for the sake of something else.
Jesus died on the cross in order to save us from grave sin, to reunite us with God. He wasn't confusing any terms.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

It seemed to be fulfilled in the years AD 66-70. The destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans?

The Romans destroyed the temple after the Jews revolted.

And slaughtered many of Jews. Have you read the book Josephus? It goes into detail on the siege. The Son of Man certainly came.
http://www.christianitytoday.com...
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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8/5/2016 6:56:31 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/5/2016 6:06:21 PM, David_Debates wrote:
At 8/5/2016 12:23:04 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 8/5/2016 9:30:56 AM, David_Debates wrote:
At 7/28/2016 2:46:14 PM, Harikrish wrote:
But when the people listened to the words he spoke they did not understand him, even his disciples struggled to understand him. Jesus had to explain to them in secret what he was saying in his parables. But he explained with more parables which suggests God was also incoherent and inarticulate and failed to communicate through Jesus. But we know God turned Moses who was slow in speech and mind into a leader and messenger. The problem was Jesus not God.

Mark 4:34 He did not say anything to them without using a parable. But when he was alone with his own disciples, he explained everything.


Jesus was a liar and a lunatic making blasphemous claims knowing he was going to be put to death. If he was lord he did not convince anyone at the trial.

He did not try to. He knew why he was on earth (being omnicient) and he knew that if he were to save himself he would not fufil that reason for being on earth (to sacrifice himself to save us from sin).

Learn to read, I guess.

Jesus tried but he was found evasive.

Luke 23:3 So Pilate asked Jesus, "Are you the king of the Jews?" "You have said so," Jesus replied.

Luke 22:70 They all asked, "Are you then the Son of God?" He replied, "You say that I am."

Jesus even tried to fake he was an alien from another place.

John 18:36 Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jewish leaders. But now my kingdom is from another place."

But his evasiveness or incoherency did not help him. He was tried, convicted and crucified.

Jesus was a notorious liar. Even John the Baptist expressed his doubts to Jesus and asked Jesus if he was really the promised one.
Jesus lied when he said John the Baptist was Elijah. John denied he was Elijah.

Here are the scriptures to back my claims. Jesus said John was Elijah, John denies he is Elijah.

Matthew 11:14
And if you are willing to accept what I say, he is Elijah, the one the prophets said would come.

Oh hell no! Don't misinterpret the Bible! This is a misquotation!
Matthew 11:14
"And if you are willing to accept it, he is the Elijah who was to come (NIV)."
He is not Elijah, he is the Elijah who was to come. Take it into context.

John was Elijah that the people did not recognize according to Jesus. But John denied he was Elijah. Learn to read the bible.

Matthew 17:12 But I tell you, Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but have done to him everything they wished. In the same way the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands.

There was a man in the Old Testament named Elijah. He was persecuted, almost killed. He had to run away, always within an inch of his life because of the Jewish authorities at the time. In no way does this refer to John the Baptist.

Learn to read, I guess.

Jesus pointed to John as Elijah in the New Testament.
You have both a reading problem and scripturally ignorant.

Matthew 17:12 but I tell you that Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but they did to him whatever they pleased. So also the Son of Man is about to suffer at their hands." 13 Then the disciples understood that he was speaking to them about John the Baptist.

In John 1:6"8 and John 1:19"28, John the Baptist denies he is Elijah. Yet in Matthew 17:9"13, Jesus implies that he was. Isn't this a contradiction?

No. See above.

13 Then the disciples understood that he was speaking to them about John the Baptist.

Yes, learn to read.

See above.

13 Then the disciples understood that he was speaking to them about John the Baptist.

No. He was crucified because the synagogue wanted him dead.
The people wanted Jesus dead. They shouted Crucify him, Crucify him.

John 18:38-40
""What is truth?" retorted Pilate. With this he went out again to the Jews gathered there and said, "I find no basis for a charge against him. But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover. Do you want me to release "the king of the Jews"?" They shouted back, "No, not him! Give us Barabbas!" Now Barabbas had taken part in an uprising."
Jesus couldn't be convicted of any charge. He said it himself: "I find no basis for a charge against him." What crucified him is a custom. "But it is your custom for me to release to you one prisoner at the time of the Passover." They released Barabbas (a murderer), thereby convicting Jesus.

The crowd shouted Crucify him, Crucify him. And accepted they judgement of Jesus.
MATTHEW 27:25 KJV "Then answered all the people, and said, His blood [be] on us, and on our children."

Not because he commuted any crime punishable by death, let alone crucifixion, but because the synagogue wanted him dead. Doesn't this verse prove my very point?

The people asked for Jesus to be crucified. They even said let his blood and guilt be on us.
The high priest tried Jesus but it was the people that convicted Jesus by shouting crucify him! Crucify him. Read your bible.

Jesus did not fulfill any prophesies. By his own account he did not come to change the laws of the prophets. He proved he was subjected to the laws even in his life and thereby validating the Mosaic law given to the Jews by God.

Deuteronomy 18:20 But a prophet who presumes to speak in my name anything I have not commanded, or a prophet who speaks in the name of other gods, is to be put to death."


Jesus lied that he was to be sacrificed.

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

In what sense was he using the word "sacrificed?" Did he mean he was a sacrifice for our sins or that others were to sacrifice him?

He was confusing sacrifice with crucify.

Sacrifice: destruction or surrender of something for the sake of something else.
Jesus died on the cross in order to save us from grave sin, to reunite us with God. He wasn't confusing any terms.

There is no Jewish law or Roman law or any law even today that allows a human being to sacrifice himself for the sins of others. Each one is responsible for his own actions. Christians tried to change Jesus's crucifixion to a ridiculous human sacrifice which was both forbidden and irrational.

Many argue Jesus's death was prophesied. But even Jesus's prophesies were not fulfilled.

1. Matthew 10:23 When you are persecuted in one place, flee to another. Truly I tell you, you will not finish going through the towns of Israel before the Son of Man comes.

Jesus never fulfilled that promise.

It seemed to be fulfilled in the years AD 66-70. The destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans?

The Romans destroyed the temple after the Jews revolted.

And slaughtered many of Jews. Have you read the book Josephus? It goes into detail on the siege. The Son of Man certainly came.
http://www.christianitytoday.com...

So I was right the Romans destroyed the temple, slaughtered the Jews because of a Jewish revolt and not because of some past prophesy.

Christians claim Jesus predicted the destruction of the temple. Jesus also claimed the temple would be rebuilt in 3 days. 2000 years later the temple is still in ruins. Jesus was a liar and a lunatic.
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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8/6/2016 9:12:36 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
Did Christianity lead to schizophrenia? Psychosis, psychology and self reference
Roland Littlewood and Simon Dein

Additional article information

Abstract
Both geographically and historically, schizophrenia may have emerged from a psychosis that was more florid, affective, labile, shorter lived and with a better prognosis. It is conjectured that this has occurred with a reflexive self-consciousness in Western and globalising societies, a development whose roots lie in Christianity. Every theology also presents a psychology. Six novel aspects of Christianity may be significant for the emergence of schizophrenia"an omniscient deity, a decontexualised self, ambiguous agency, a downplaying of immediate sensory data, and a scrutiny of the self and its reconstitution in conversion.

It certainly led to the Schizophrenic Sense of Self because of the self absorption in dualistic thinking about life.
David_Debates
Posts: 244
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8/6/2016 9:18:01 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/5/2016 6:56:31 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 8/5/2016 6:06:21 PM, David_Debates wrote:
At 8/5/2016 12:23:04 PM, Harikrish wrote:
At 8/5/2016 9:30:56 AM, David_Debates wrote:
Jesus was a liar and a lunatic making blasphemous claims knowing he was going to be put to death. If he was lord he did not convince anyone at the trial.

He did not try to. He knew why he was on earth (being omnicient) and he knew that if he were to save himself he would not fufil that reason for being on earth (to sacrifice himself to save us from sin).

Learn to read, I guess.

Jesus tried but he was found evasive.

No, he didn't even try to defend himself.
Matthew 27:13-14
"Then Pilate asked him, "Don"t you hear the testimony they are bringing against you?" But Jesus made no reply, not even to a single charge"to the great amazement of the governor."


Luke 23:3 So Pilate asked Jesus, "Are you the king of the Jews?" "You have said so," Jesus replied.

Luke 22:70 They all asked, "Are you then the Son of God?" He replied, "You say that I am."

Jesus even tried to fake he was an alien from another place.

John 18:36 Jesus said, "My kingdom is not of this world. If it were, my servants would fight to prevent my arrest by the Jewish leaders. But now my kingdom is from another place."

From heaven, yes. He never claimed to be an alien. He was both man and God.

But his evasiveness or incoherency did not help him. He was tried, convicted and crucified.

Oh hell no! Don't misinterpret the Bible! This is a misquotation!
Matthew 11:14
"And if you are willing to accept it, he is the Elijah who was to come (NIV)."
He is not Elijah, he is the Elijah who was to come. Take it into context.

John was Elijah that the people did not recognize according to Jesus. But John denied he was Elijah. Learn to read the bible.

Matthew 17:12 But I tell you, Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but have done to him everything they wished. In the same way the Son of Man is going to suffer at their hands.

There was a man in the Old Testament named Elijah. He was persecuted, almost killed. He had to run away, always within an inch of his life because of the Jewish authorities at the time. In no way does this refer to John the Baptist.

Learn to read, I guess.

Jesus pointed to John as Elijah in the New Testament.
You have both a reading problem and scripturally ignorant.

Matthew 17:12 but I tell you that Elijah has already come, and they did not recognize him, but they did to him whatever they pleased. So also the Son of Man is about to suffer at their hands." 13 Then the disciples understood that he was speaking to them about John the Baptist.

Have you ever thought this was an analogy? Elijah was the one that came before Elisha. In the same way, Jesus states that John is like Elijah, as he prepared the way for him. They knew he was not Elijah, they knew he was referring to John the Baptist. John the Baptist was dead at this time, Herod beheaded him.

No. He was crucified because the synagogue wanted him dead.
The people wanted Jesus dead. They shouted Crucify him, Crucify him.

The crowd shouted Crucify him, Crucify him. And accepted they judgement of Jesus.
MATTHEW 27:25 KJV "Then answered all the people, and said, His blood [be] on us, and on our children."

Not because he commuted any crime punishable by death, let alone crucifixion, but because the synagogue wanted him dead. Doesn't this verse prove my very point?

The people asked for Jesus to be crucified. They even said let his blood and guilt be on us.
The high priest tried Jesus but it was the people that convicted Jesus by shouting crucify him! Crucify him. Read your bible.

Not the high priest, Herod and Pilate, two Roman officials, tried him.

Luke 23:13-18
"Pilate called together the chief priests, the rulers and the people, and said to them, 'You brought me this man as one who was inciting the people to rebellion. I have examined him in your presence and have found no basis for your charges against him. Neither has Herod, for he sent him back to us; as you can see, he has done nothing to deserve death. Therefore, I will punish him and then release him.'"
The authorities found no basis for crucifixion. But the crowd of the chief priest, rulers, and all other people in the trial wanted him to be crucified so badly they would rather release a known murderer and a violent leader than let Jesus, an innocent man, go free.
"But the whole crowd shouted, 'Away with this man! Release Barabbas to us!'"

Human sacrifice was forbidden by God. So Jesus was not sacrificed.

In what sense was he using the word "sacrificed?" Did he mean he was a sacrifice for our sins or that others were to sacrifice him?

He was confusing sacrifice with crucify.

Sacrifice: destruction or surrender of something for the sake of something else.
Jesus died on the cross in order to save us from grave sin, to reunite us with God. He wasn't confusing any terms.

There is no Jewish law or Roman law or any law even today that allows a human being to sacrifice himself for the sins of others. Each one is responsible for his own actions. Christians tried to change Jesus's crucifixion to a ridiculous human sacrifice which was both forbidden and irrational.

Romans 3:22-24
"And this righteousness from God comes through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no distinction, for all have sinned and fall short of the glory of God, and are justified freely by His grace through the redemption that is in Christ Jesus."

Seems to me like he sacrificed himself to save us from our sin.

It seemed to be fulfilled in the years AD 66-70. The destruction of Jerusalem by the Romans?

The Romans destroyed the temple after the Jews revolted.

And slaughtered many of Jews. Have you read the book Josephus? It goes into detail on the siege. The Son of Man certainly came.
http://www.christianitytoday.com...

So I was right the Romans destroyed the temple, slaughtered the Jews because of a Jewish revolt and not because of some past prophesy.

Christians claim Jesus predicted the destruction of the temple. Jesus also claimed

This would be way better as a debate. I'll send you the challenge, okay? The forum cut it off because of word count, so I can't see your entire argument.

To respond to your point, however, the "Son of Man" that the verse refers to are the Romans. The Romans persecuted the Jews in AD 66-70. Because of insanely large taxes, the Jews revolted at the temple, and refused to pay. They came down with a huge army and slaughtered over three thousand innocents. This sparked an all out revolt, and the Romans came back, killing many more, and burning Jerusalem to the ground. The temple was destroyed completely.
However, the Christians were safe. Why? Because they had a prophesy that told them to "run to another city when they are persecuted." Read the article again.