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Understanding

KIND
Posts: 14
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8/3/2016 5:25:46 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
Humans have a different kind of brain and mind when compared to other organisms This allows us to understand some things other organisms can't For example cats can not understand how to do calculus

Is there a reason for us to believe that humans are capable of understanding everything I don't think so I would like to know if you agree
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
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8/3/2016 6:07:28 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/3/2016 5:25:46 PM, KIND wrote:
Is there a reason for us to believe that humans are capable of understanding everything

It depends on what you mean by 'understand' and 'everything', Kind.

If by 'understand' you mean 'predict with reasonable accuracy', then that doesn't require a phenomenon be perfectly detailed -- only modeled to some degree of precision. The limits to modelling do not depend on the architecture of a human brain so much as how big a model can be built -- and we can potentially build models bigger than a single human brain can comprehend. There may still be limits, but they are limits of engineering and technology rather than individual thought, so they may be flexible.

Then there's what 'everything' means. Do you mean what we can repeatedly observe? Because if we can observe it repeatedly, we can attempt to model it. Our models might be more or less accurate, but repeated observation means we can improve them over time. So we may be able to develop at least partial understanding, even of complex phenomena.

But if 'everything' includes things we cannot directly or indirectly observe, or where observation cannot be repeated, then accurate modeling may not be possible. On the other hand, if you cannot reliably observe it, can you say with confidence that it exists, or only that you conjecture it to exist?
Omniverse
Posts: 973
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8/3/2016 6:44:19 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/3/2016 5:25:46 PM, KIND wrote:
Humans have a different kind of brain and mind when compared to other organisms This allows us to understand some things other organisms can't For example cats can not understand how to do calculus

Is there a reason for us to believe that humans are capable of understanding everything I don't think so I would like to know if you agree

How did you reach such conclusion or inkling? Wouldn't you have to know of at least one topic no human can ever hope to understand in order to have accepted that conclusion?
KIND
Posts: 14
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8/4/2016 1:57:00 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
It depends on what you mean by 'understand' and 'everything', Kind.

One definition I find useful is being knowledgeably aware of the character or nature of

On the other hand, if you cannot reliably observe it, can you say with confidence that it exists, or only that you conjecture it to exist?

Eagles can see five basic colors
KIND
Posts: 14
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8/4/2016 2:27:24 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
How did you reach such conclusion or inkling?

Whenever the brain of an organism is different his understanding is different too

Wouldn't you have to know of at least one topic no human can ever hope to understand in order to have accepted that conclusion?

Miracles
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
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8/4/2016 2:40:09 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/4/2016 1:57:00 AM, KIND wrote:
It depends on what you mean by 'understand' and 'everything', Kind.
One definition I find useful is being knowledgeably aware of the character or nature of
The way I say it is: knowledge is accurate prediction. But understanding generally means you can detail the mechanisms too.

If you cannot reliably observe it, can you say with confidence that it exists, or only that you conjecture it to exist?
Eagles can see five basic colors
And we know that how?

(I'm not challenging that we know it, but since we do know it, what do we observe?)
KIND
Posts: 14
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8/4/2016 4:00:02 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
The way I say it is: knowledge is accurate prediction. But understanding generally means you can detail the mechanisms too.

Ruv knows that I like this poem What is predictable about it

And we know that how?

(I'm not challenging that we know it, but since we do know it, what do we observe?)

We speculate that uv light is visible to them based on their hunting skills and kinds of cone cells
matt8800
Posts: 2,077
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8/4/2016 4:29:25 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/3/2016 5:25:46 PM, KIND wrote:
Humans have a different kind of brain and mind when compared to other organisms This allows us to understand some things other organisms can't For example cats can not understand how to do calculus

Is there a reason for us to believe that humans are capable of understanding everything I don't think so I would like to know if you agree

Humans are the smartest of the apes but that does not mean we have reached some kind of ultimate pinnacle of intelligence. If we survive long enough, we will evolve into something that is just as much smarter than us as we are now to chimpanzees. Even then, we will not be at the ultimate pinnacle of intelligence. Lets keep things in a global perspective.
ANON_TacTiX
Posts: 460
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8/4/2016 4:44:15 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/3/2016 5:25:46 PM, KIND wrote:
Humans have a different kind of brain and mind when compared to other organisms This allows us to understand some things other organisms can't For example cats can not understand how to do calculus

Is there a reason for us to believe that humans are capable of understanding everything I don't think so I would like to know if you agree

The truth is that we may never know. In the world of theoretical physics, there is a theory that scientists are trying to find. It is called the Grand Unified Theory. This theory would unify quantum mechanics and general relativity and explain everything in the universe. it has not yet been found, but scientists are getting closer. The truth is, though that we may never find it. It may not even exist. The truth is that it is possible, if the human race continues to advance the way we are, that we could find this Grand Unifies Theory and be able to understand everything. We may also never find it or discover that it never existed in the first place. For now, it is impossible to know.

There is actually a paradox around this theory. If the theory explains everything in the universe, it should predict whether or not we actually find it. Think about it for a second. A theory that predicts that it will never be found. Kind of funny, huh? That's the world of physics for you.
Learn from yesterday, live for today, hope for tomorrow. The important thing is not to stop questioning. - Albert Einstein
RuvDraba
Posts: 6,033
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8/4/2016 6:50:12 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/4/2016 4:00:02 AM, KIND wrote:
The way I say it is: knowledge is accurate prediction. But understanding generally means you can detail the mechanisms too.
Ruv knows that I like this poem
I didn't, Kind, but now I do. :)

What is predictable about it
Whatever information a phenomenon might repeat. :)

And we know that how?
(I'm not challenging that we know it, but since we do know it, what do we observe?)
We speculate that uv light is visible to them based on their hunting skills and kinds of cone cells
That sounds reasonable. But we can observe with UV light ourselves, can't we?

And we might be able to tell what a bird sees based on what it reacts to. (e.g. see this link at 2:00:00) [http://animals.howstuffworks.com...]

So is it fair to conclude that we understand the vision of a raptor?
Willows
Posts: 2,050
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8/4/2016 11:02:50 AM
Posted: 4 months ago
At 8/3/2016 5:25:46 PM, KIND wrote:
Humans have a different kind of brain and mind when compared to other organisms This allows us to understand some things other organisms can't For example cats can not understand how to do calculus

Is there a reason for us to believe that humans are capable of understanding everything I don't think so I would like to know if you agree

Yes I do think we are capable of understanding everything. Whether we will ever reach that potential is another thing. The downside of having such a large capacity brain is that our own hangups and preconceived ideas get in the way of getting anywhere near reaching that goal.
Ultimately, whether we become ultra-smart or dumbed-down depends upon our environment and how we adapt to it. I wouldn't count on it within a few generations though since biologically it will take millions of years.
We've only been around for about a million years with our current state of conscience so we have a long way to go.
KIND
Posts: 14
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8/7/2016 6:08:02 PM
Posted: 4 months ago
So is it fair to conclude that we understand the vision of a raptor?

No you must experience something to understand it
Willows
Posts: 2,050
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8/8/2016 10:00:34 AM
Posted: 3 months ago
At 8/7/2016 6:09:34 PM, KIND wrote:
Yes I do think we are capable of understanding everything.

And why so

Don't take this definitively but I have a feeling that humans as a species are still in their infancy. Technology just over the past 20 years alone you could say has surpassed the sum total of all technological development up until then. The sky is the limit.