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Truth.

FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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1/10/2011 3:02:51 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
A welcomed deviation from Godsands thread, I'm sure, here is an actual thread about truth. What is it? How do you know it? Is there even such a thing?
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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1/10/2011 3:18:45 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
It kinda hard to argue that truth doesn't exist.

Person 1: Truth doesn't exist
Person 2: Is that the truth ?
Person 1: yes, no wait.......no..........ummmmm

Now consider "this statement is false"...........is that statement true or false, muahahaha
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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1/10/2011 3:23:25 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/10/2011 3:18:08 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 1/10/2011 3:02:51 AM, FREEDO wrote:
A welcomed deviation from Godsands thread, I'm sure, here is an actual thread about truth. What is it?

It is it.

Can you coherently define it?

How do you know it?

We know some of it. We operate on what works best.

Is there even such a thing?

Yes.

How do you know?
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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1/10/2011 3:25:51 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/10/2011 3:18:45 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
It kinda hard to argue that truth doesn't exist.

Person 1: Truth doesn't exist
Person 2: Is that the truth ?
Person 1: yes, no wait.......no..........ummmmm

Now consider "this statement is false"...........is that statement true or false, muahahaha

The correct answer to both questions is "I don't know".

How do I know that is the correct answer?

I don't.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
Cody_Franklin
Posts: 9,483
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1/10/2011 3:31:22 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/10/2011 3:23:25 AM, FREEDO wrote:
At 1/10/2011 3:18:08 AM, Cody_Franklin wrote:
At 1/10/2011 3:02:51 AM, FREEDO wrote:
A welcomed deviation from Godsands thread, I'm sure, here is an actual thread about truth. What is it?

It is it.

Can you coherently define it?

The actual state of being of the totality.

How do you know it?

We know some of it. We operate on what works best.

Is there even such a thing?

Yes.

How do you know?

Things are the way they are, and disputing that leads you to a contradiction (since admitting that truth may not exist means that the truth is that there's a possibility that truth doesn't exist, though that possibility is necessarily false since the statement that "it's true that there might be no truth" is, like your question, nonsensical and self-defeating, though it masquerades as deep and thought-provoking.
Illegalcombatant
Posts: 4,008
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1/10/2011 3:42:03 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
so.....

Person 1: I don't know if truth exists cause truth can't be known
Person 2: But your claiming to know, that you don't know, that truth can't be know
Person 1: Well I don't know that either
Person 2: So your know that you don't know that either ?
Person 1: no, I don't know that either...............ad infintum

As soon as some one claims "they don't know" they are making a claim that they do know something. they know that they don't know. :)
"Seems like another attempt to insert God into areas our knowledge has yet to penetrate. You figure God would be bigger than the gaps of our ignorance." Drafterman 19/5/12
innomen
Posts: 10,052
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1/10/2011 3:47:23 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
Better for philosophy.

We may or may not know it when we see it. Most don't really want the truth, and i am unsure why truth holds a position of paramount virtue.
FREEDO
Posts: 21,057
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1/10/2011 4:11:23 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/10/2011 3:42:03 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
so.....

Person 1: I don't know if truth exists cause truth can't be known
Person 2: But your claiming to know, that you don't know, that truth can't be know
Person 1: Well I don't know that either
Person 2: So your know that you don't know that either ?
Person 1: no, I don't know that either...............ad infintum

As soon as some one claims "they don't know" they are making a claim that they do know something. they know that they don't know. :)

Conversation on Facebook:
Dakota Spann
Is there a word for being agnostic to everything?
01:15 · Like · Dislike · Comment
Benjamin Dumez Apathy? melancholy?
01:23 · Like
Dakota Spann Naw, neither of those.
01:29 · Like
Chris Tchaikovsky Skeptic.
01:34 · Like · 1 person
Chris Tchaikovsky http://en.wikipedia.org...
01:34 · Like
Cody Franklin If there was, you wouldn't know what it was. :P
01:36 · Unlike · 2 people
Dakota Spann ‎@Chris: I'm aware of it. Being agnostic to everything would mean philosophical skepticism but philosophical skepticism doesn't mean being agnostic to everything.
01:37 · Like
Benjamin Dumez hmm... do feel like nothing can be truly known? Or that being fully committed to any group or ideology is foolish? If so... then I am not sure if there is one word for that. :)
01:37 · Like
Dakota Spann I have no beliefs. Frankly, I think my desire of having a word for that may be completely irrational.
01:39 · Like
Philip Jonkers ‎"Everything" is a bit of a tall order since even the most ignorant retard you will ever meet knows something about something, usually about cars, but if I'd have to bet my money on something, I'd say the human ego comes pretty close to fitting the shoes of the universal agnostic.
01:39 · Like
Cody Franklin If you know that you have no beliefs, you couldn't possibly believe that you know nothing. Unless, of course, you're not sure that you believe nothing, which is still a problem, since you would know that you weren't certain, unless you want to chance an infinite regress of uncertainty. Even then, you'd know that the infinite regress existed. :P
01:42 · Like
Dakota Spann I have pointed out before that I resort to infinite regress.
01:43 · Like
Benjamin Dumez No beliefs??? Hmm. That is hard for me to wrap my mind around.
01:43 · Like
Cody Franklin You don't know that you resort to infinite regress. If you did, it wouldn't be an infinite regress.
01:44 · Like
Dakota Spann We could do this forever, Cody.
01:45 · Like
Cody Franklin You don't know that. :P
01:46 · Like
Adrian Atari Model Agnosticism.
01:46 · Like
Dakota Spann With every next turn there is another infinite regress. Essentially, I have turned every question into a paradox.
01:47 · Like
Benjamin Dumez Most people aren't 100% about anything. At least you are asking questions and looking for something...whatever that is. Does it bother you that you have no beliefs and resort to regress or are you just musing?
01:47 · Like
Cody Franklin That's why you can't be an agnostic about everything. It's a self-defeating position.
01:48 · Like
Dakota Spann I've never felt more comfortable.
01:48 · Like
Dakota Spann ‎@Cody: You're over-looking that I must also be agnostic to the absoluteness of logic. I am an alogicist.
01:49 · Like · 1 person
Cody Franklin By the way, word-wise, how does Omnagnosticism sound?
01:50 · Like
Benjamin Dumez well then finding a word might be kind of foolish. Unless you feel you can share that comfortable state of being with other people then it might not be so foolish.
01:50 · Like
Chris Tchaikovsky I think it's impossible to have no beliefs and remain universally agnostic. I'd say belief would be more intellectually honest, that belief is all there is to this world because of uncertainty. We certainly believe in our expectations for one, and if we didn't, we would all go hysterically insane.
01:50 · Like
Cody Franklin In theory, that might be true. That's impossible to practice, though.
01:51 · Like
Dakota Spann ‎@Chris:Oh, I am insane.
01:51 · Like
Dakota Spann ‎@Cody: Are you certain? =)
01:51 · Like
Cody Franklin A person who can admit that he is insane tends not to be insane, and is, in fact, caught up in some sort of edgy fad.
01:52 · Like
Chris Tchaikovsky No you're not, you believe what to expect from your surrounding people. To ponder about the uncertainty whether a murderer is going to kill your or dance a tango in front of you is the insanity I'm outlining.
01:53 · Like
Dakota Spann ‎@Cody: Unless, of course, I don't really believe that I am insane since I had just stated that I am agnostic to everything.
01:54 · Like
Benjamin Dumez well if you are comfortable and happy then I am satisfied that you are. I will leave you all to this philosophy session. have to get going.
01:54 · Like
Cody Franklin Pretty sure. You had to log into Facebook to post this, which means you had to assume that Facebook is Facebook. You have to assume identity for everything you do, otherwise you would sit in a corner all day and do nothing. The human mind is hardwired to reason and conceptualize, because it's built to survive. Trying to live claiming that such is invalid becomes cognitively impossible.
01:54 · Like
Dakota Spann Not really.
01:55 · Like
Cody Franklin And you say that why?
01:55 · Like
Benjamin Dumez maybe Dakota has found the Zen that is beyond Zen and your reason is powerless to penetrate it...well I really should get going. later all :)
01:57 · Like
Dennis Sullivan Being solidly uncertain about everything is pretty unlikely, however having a healthy dose of skepticism about most can be helpful during certain periods of your life. Beware of constant self-doubt, tis a terrible thing.
01:57 · Like
Dakota Spann ‎@Cody: Interacting with the world around you does not mean you have to think it exist.
01:58 · Like · 1 person
Dakota Spann ‎@Ben: Yes, I am Buddha. All listen.
01:59 · Like · 1 person
Cody Franklin I'm a metaphysical nihilist, Dakota. I'm not certain that the world around me exists; however, that's not what I meant. Real or not, this is the world that we interact with, and it's subject to certain constraints. A table is a table, food is food, eating is eating, and pissing is pissing. A real "agnostic", in the sense you describe, couldn't live in this world, because the way the human mind works requires the association of concepts with things out in the world, which means acknowledgment of identity. Otherwise, death. :P
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02:00 · Like
Dakota Spann Actually, this death-like quality to my aphilosophy(that's gonna be the word!) has occurred to me. But is has also occurred to me that, paradoxically(as usual)l, this is a realization of truth because we are all caught in the lie of choice. You see, I don't believe in free-will. I have become aware of my equality with the stone or the tree which may only have a philosophy as much as a person truly can. All the dogma which we debate over is fruitless. I simply let be what shall.
GRAND POOBAH OF DDO

fnord
innomen
Posts: 10,052
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1/10/2011 4:17:40 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
There comes a time when a baseline of truth must be assumed in order to function. Without this baseline you will be in perpetual self doubt, and essentially be useless to yourself and anyone else. It takes a very small leap of....yeah faith.
the-good-teacher
Posts: 444
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1/10/2011 11:29:33 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/10/2011 3:18:45 AM, Illegalcombatant wrote:
It kinda hard to argue that truth doesn't exist.

Person 1: Truth doesn't exist
Person 2: Is that the truth ?
Person 1: yes, no wait.......no..........ummmmm

Now consider "this statement is false"...........is that statement true or false, muahahaha

Does the person exist ?
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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1/10/2011 12:36:25 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Without truth, there is no actuality.
Without actuality, there are no patterns.
Without patterns, there is neither logical deduction nor forecasts.
Without deduction and forecasts, there is no knowledge.
Without knowledge, there is no invention.
SuperRobotWars
Posts: 3,906
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1/10/2011 1:44:19 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Truth = Hypocrisy . . .
Minister Of Trolling
: At 12/6/2011 2:21:41 PM, badger wrote:
: ugly people should beat beautiful people ugly. simple! you'd be killing two birds with the one stone... women like violent men and you're making yourself more attractive, relatively. i met a blonde dude who was prettier than me not so long ago. he's not so pretty now! ha!
:
: ...and well, he wasn't really prettier than me. he just had nice hair.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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1/10/2011 2:54:58 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
The truth is solipsism.

You are all just dancing around in my head.. or is it your head? I don't know, I have so many heads that I forgot. Hey look, a peanut.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp