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Can Critical Thinkers Be Religious?

Willows
Posts: 2,084
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10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.
janesix
Posts: 3,491
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10/6/2016 3:51:26 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

Most PEOPLE aren't critical thinkers.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

Particle or wave?
PureX
Posts: 1,533
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10/6/2016 4:04:00 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

That depends on how adept one is at thinking, and at critiquing their own thoughts. Few here practice the latter. Instead, they blindly auto-defend any idea that comes into their mind, as their unrestrained egos dictate they must.

From what I see on this sight, there are just as many thoughtless egos blindly defending atheism as there are blindly defending the most absurd religious dogmas. And precious few on either side capable of offering a thoughtful and reasoned argument for either theological position.
Geogeer
Posts: 4,296
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10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.
uncung
Posts: 3,468
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10/7/2016 3:40:22 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

I am a critical muslim thinker.
uncung
Posts: 3,468
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10/7/2016 3:41:50 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

why on earth one would beat the wive?
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,490
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10/7/2016 3:51:16 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

Quran 4:135
O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm in justice, witnesses for Allah , even if it be against yourselves or parents and relatives. Whether one is rich or poor, Allah is more worthy of both. So follow not [personal] inclination, lest you not be just. And if you distort [your testimony] or refuse [to give it], then indeed Allah is ever, with what you do, Acquainted.

its clear enough?
Never fart near dog
Willows
Posts: 2,084
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10/7/2016 7:05:43 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

Excellent point you raised here. A wife beater no matter how much logic he has in him will beat his wife due to a fit of irrationality.

Similarly, somebody will irrationally turn to religion. The difference is that in this case, the irrationality is not momentary. It tends to be ongoing.
Willows
Posts: 2,084
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10/7/2016 7:07:37 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 3:40:22 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

I am a critical muslim thinker.

Subtract the "thinker" from that statement and you would be right.
Willows
Posts: 2,084
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10/7/2016 7:08:33 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 3:41:50 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

why on earth one would beat the wive?

Certainly not critical thinking Muslims, right?
Willows
Posts: 2,084
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10/7/2016 7:09:57 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 3:51:16 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

Quran 4:135
O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm in justice, witnesses for Allah , even if it be against yourselves or parents and relatives. Whether one is rich or poor, Allah is more worthy of both. So follow not [personal] inclination, lest you not be just. And if you distort [your testimony] or refuse [to give it], then indeed Allah is ever, with what you do, Acquainted.

its clear enough?

About as clear as pig swill.
uncung
Posts: 3,468
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10/7/2016 7:13:57 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 7:08:33 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 3:41:50 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

why on earth one would beat the wive?

Certainly not critical thinking Muslims, right?

is my question not sound a critical thinking?
uncung
Posts: 3,468
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10/7/2016 7:15:26 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 7:07:37 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 3:40:22 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

I am a critical muslim thinker.

Subtract the "thinker" from that statement and you would be right.

Then let's go do it.
Willows
Posts: 2,084
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10/7/2016 8:18:47 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 7:13:57 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/7/2016 7:08:33 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 3:41:50 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

why on earth one would beat the wive?

Certainly not critical thinking Muslims, right?

is my question not sound a critical thinking?

Critical thinking yes, but sadly the answer is that there is no rational reasoning when one beats one's wife.
POPOO5560
Posts: 2,490
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10/7/2016 8:20:26 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 7:09:57 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 3:51:16 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

Quran 4:135
O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm in justice, witnesses for Allah , even if it be against yourselves or parents and relatives. Whether one is rich or poor, Allah is more worthy of both. So follow not [personal] inclination, lest you not be just. And if you distort [your testimony] or refuse [to give it], then indeed Allah is ever, with what you do, Acquainted.

its clear enough?

About as clear as pig swill.

OK learn what the definition of "to stand for Justice even against yourself, parents, relatives whether one is rich or poor and not follow personal inclination (prejudices)"

if u cant do it i will teach u english my son. dont be shy ask for help any time im here ->:D
Never fart near dog
Willows
Posts: 2,084
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10/7/2016 8:24:00 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 8:20:26 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/7/2016 7:09:57 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 3:51:16 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

Quran 4:135
O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm in justice, witnesses for Allah , even if it be against yourselves or parents and relatives. Whether one is rich or poor, Allah is more worthy of both. So follow not [personal] inclination, lest you not be just. And if you distort [your testimony] or refuse [to give it], then indeed Allah is ever, with what you do, Acquainted.

its clear enough?

About as clear as pig swill.

OK learn what the definition of "to stand for Justice even against yourself, parents, relatives whether one is rich or poor and not follow personal inclination (prejudices)"

if u cant do it i will teach u english my son. dont be shy ask for help any time im here ->:D

OK, I still don't get it. Translate into English for me. You may have to get someone with a bit of knowledge to help you, though.
Willows
Posts: 2,084
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10/7/2016 9:03:56 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 4:04:00 PM, PureX wrote:
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

That depends on how adept one is at thinking, and at critiquing their own thoughts. Few here practice the latter. Instead, they blindly auto-defend any idea that comes into their mind, as their unrestrained egos dictate they must.

From what I see on this sight, there are just as many thoughtless egos blindly defending atheism as there are blindly defending the most absurd religious dogmas. And precious few on either side capable of offering a thoughtful and reasoned argument for either theological position.

Atheists do not have anything to lose in the first place, theists do. Their whole lifestyle is perceived as threatened along with their stubborn egos.

Because religion is a radical belief based on no evidence, it attracts a very radical and ridiculous defence. I'm sure if you go back through the posts you may see some robust arguments from atheists but these arguments are evidence and logic based.

Because of the lack of evidence and logic to support their case, theists will always be on the back foot and will always present ridiculous, illogical arguments.
bulproof
Posts: 25,303
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10/7/2016 9:21:05 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.
Critical thinking can't result in religious belief, only wishful and fearful thinking can do that.
uncung
Posts: 3,468
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10/7/2016 10:17:47 AM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 8:18:47 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 7:13:57 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/7/2016 7:08:33 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 3:41:50 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

why on earth one would beat the wive?

Certainly not critical thinking Muslims, right?

is my question not sound a critical thinking?

Critical thinking yes, but sadly the answer is that there is no rational reasoning when one beats one's wife.

then let us criticize that barbaric rule.
Willows
Posts: 2,084
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10/7/2016 12:18:38 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 10:17:47 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/7/2016 8:18:47 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 7:13:57 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/7/2016 7:08:33 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 3:41:50 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

why on earth one would beat the wive?

Certainly not critical thinking Muslims, right?

is my question not sound a critical thinking?

Critical thinking yes, but sadly the answer is that there is no rational reasoning when one beats one's wife.

then let us criticize that barbaric rule.

You mean me criticise that barbaric rule?

You mean the barbaric rule that allows men to beat the crap out of their wives and to treat their wives on a lower social rung than dogs?

Where women aren't allowed to go outside unless accompanied by male family members, covered from head to toe, not allowed to drive a car, not allowed to vote, not allowed to talk out of turn?

Where anyone who dares say a word against the government or God loses his or her head?

Where homosexuals are pushed off roof tops to their deaths?

I'm not going to criticise that sort of barbaric rule, I simply condemn it.
PrizeBeatz1
Posts: 48
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10/7/2016 12:36:45 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

I think we are going to have to balance both. But we have to know when to put the tool of thought down and leave it aside. Otherwise the tool begins to use us instead of us using the tool. Ever notice how difficult it is to stop the mind from thinking? The challenge of becoming comfortable in silence and stillness is one of the first and most formidable obstacles to the beginning of experiencing God.
bulproof
Posts: 25,303
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10/7/2016 12:44:43 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 12:36:45 PM, PrizeBeatz1 wrote:
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

I think we are going to have to balance both. But we have to know when to put the tool of thought down and leave it aside. Otherwise the tool begins to use us instead of us using the tool. Ever notice how difficult it is to stop the mind from thinking? The challenge of becoming comfortable in silence and stillness is one of the first and most formidable obstacles to the beginning of experiencing God.
You have told the entire story.
Stop the brain from thinking and you will find god.
uncung
Posts: 3,468
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10/7/2016 12:49:28 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 12:18:38 PM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 10:17:47 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/7/2016 8:18:47 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 7:13:57 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/7/2016 7:08:33 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/7/2016 3:41:50 AM, uncung wrote:
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

why on earth one would beat the wive?

Certainly not critical thinking Muslims, right?

is my question not sound a critical thinking?

Critical thinking yes, but sadly the answer is that there is no rational reasoning when one beats one's wife.

then let us criticize that barbaric rule.

You mean me criticise that barbaric rule?

You mean the barbaric rule that allows men to beat the crap out of their wives and to treat their wives on a lower social rung than dogs?

Where women aren't allowed to go outside unless accompanied by male family members, covered from head to toe, not allowed to drive a car, not allowed to vote, not allowed to talk out of turn?

Where anyone who dares say a word against the government or God loses his or her head?

Where homosexuals are pushed off roof tops to their deaths?

I'm not going to criticise that sort of barbaric rule, I simply condemn it.

yes, let us criticize them since I support that barbaric rules.
PureX
Posts: 1,533
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10/7/2016 2:06:20 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 9:03:56 AM, Willows wrote:
At 10/6/2016 4:04:00 PM, PureX wrote:
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

That depends on how adept one is at thinking, and at critiquing their own thoughts. Few here practice the latter. Instead, they blindly auto-defend any idea that comes into their mind, as their unrestrained egos dictate they must.

From what I see on this sight, there are just as many thoughtless egos blindly defending atheism as there are blindly defending the most absurd religious dogmas. And precious few on either side capable of offering a thoughtful and reasoned argument for either theological position.

Atheists do not have anything to lose in the first place, theists do. Their whole lifestyle is perceived as threatened along with their stubborn egos.

Both atheism and theism are philosophical positions that underpin a "lifestyle". And both theists and atheists fear having to see themselves as "wrong". So they auto-defend ANY contrary insinuation regardless of it's validity or lack of. And they promote their own position equally regardless of it's validity or lack of. Because the ego doesn't care at all about what's true, it only cares about protecting one's current concept of self. Which of course is presumed to be righteous and true in all things.

Because religion is a radical belief based on no evidence, it attracts a very radical and ridiculous defence. I'm sure if you go back through the posts you may see some robust arguments from atheists but these arguments are evidence and logic based.

Religion is not a radical belief based on no evidence. It is a set of beliefs based on subjective reasoning and experience. You're simply too blinded by your own ego-centric bias to accept that subjective reasoning and experience are valid and meaningful aspects of our human existence.

Because of the lack of evidence and logic to support their case, theists will always be on the back foot and will always present ridiculous, illogical arguments.

Yes, in your very narrow and blinded world view, I suppose they will appear so. But of course they won't really care how they appear to you, unless they, like you, are stuck in their own auto-defense mode. And will then find your opposition a threat to their ego-centric idea of selves, that they must then dismiss and discredit by any means.

Few of you are listening to the other, really. You're just blindly auto-defending your own biased beliefs.
missmedic
Posts: 390
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10/7/2016 2:17:08 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

Why would you beat your wife, it's YOUR wife, it's like keying your own car. Must be a Muslim.
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...
uncung
Posts: 3,468
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10/7/2016 2:31:36 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 2:17:08 PM, missmedic wrote:
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

Why would you beat your wife, it's YOUR wife, it's like keying your own car. Must be a Muslim.
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

why would muslim do that?
missmedic
Posts: 390
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10/7/2016 2:34:46 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

If a person is intellectually honest and has a clear and complete understanding of critical thinking, and the ability to use Universal intellectual standards, then there is only one answer. To think critically entails having command of these standards and you must know that faith is not intellectual standard nor does it give the believer knowledge.
Critical Thinking is what took me from a believer to nonbeliever, give it a try I dare you.
http://www.criticalthinking.org...
https://judithcurry.com...
missmedic
Posts: 390
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10/7/2016 2:39:11 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 2:31:36 PM, uncung wrote:
At 10/7/2016 2:17:08 PM, missmedic wrote:
At 10/6/2016 7:19:39 PM, Geogeer wrote:
Can Atheists Stop Beating their wives?

Not all atheists are wife beaters; just like theists, many just don't think too much at all about beating their wives.

But are all wife beaters atheists?

Surely, if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction, as a wife beater would there would only be one clear answer.

Why would you beat your wife, it's YOUR wife, it's like keying your own car. Must be a Muslim.
https://www.youtube.com...
https://www.youtube.com...

why would muslim do that?
Because it is justified by religious belief, its the same for the hatred Christians have towards gays.....................
missmedic
Posts: 390
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10/7/2016 3:12:40 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 9:21:05 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.
Critical thinking can't result in religious belief, only wishful and fearful thinking can do that.

The religious believe that if knowledge brings unhappiness it is better to be ignorant.
DanneJeRusse
Posts: 12,652
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10/7/2016 3:24:05 PM
Posted: 2 months ago
At 10/7/2016 3:51:16 AM, POPOO5560 wrote:
At 10/6/2016 10:42:39 AM, Willows wrote:
Not all atheists are critical thinkers, just like theists many just don't think too much at all about their stance.

But are all critical thinkers atheists?

Surely if one were to logically verify and objectively evaluate evidence and separate fact from fiction as a critical thinker would there would only be one clear answer.

Quran 4:135
O you who have believed, be persistently standing firm in justice, witnesses for Allah , even if it be against yourselves or parents and relatives. Whether one is rich or poor, Allah is more worthy of both. So follow not [personal] inclination, lest you not be just. And if you distort [your testimony] or refuse [to give it], then indeed Allah is ever, with what you do, Acquainted.

its clear enough?

Yes, that would be something a non-thinker would do, put an imaginary friend over all others, including ones own families. Sick and twisted belief.
Marrying a 6 year old and waiting until she reaches puberty and maturity before having consensual sex is better than walking up to
a stranger in a bar and proceeding to have relations with no valid proof of the intent of the person. Muhammad wins. ~ Fatihah
If they don't want to be killed then they have to subdue to the Islamic laws. - Uncung
Without God, you are lower than sh!t. ~ SpiritandTruth