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Does Christanity encourage feudalism?

Stupidape
Posts: 171
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11/4/2016 2:59:55 AM
Posted: 1 month ago
I've been thinking that if Christians really followed the Bible and got their way politically we would be living in a feudal government.

Reasons:

Bible quotes

"On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: king of kings and lord of lords." Revelation 19:16

Slavery is permissible under Christianity.

Ephesians 6:5 ESV

"Slaves, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling, with a sincere heart, as you would Christ, "

Exodus 21:20-21 ESV
"When a man strikes his slave, male or female, with a rod and the slave dies under his hand, he shall be avenged. But if the slave survives a day or two, he is not to be avenged, for the slave is his money. "

The Bible is against rebellion, what feudal lord is going to surrender his throne to democracy?

"1 Samuel 15:23 - For rebellion [is as] the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness [is as] iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from [being] king.

Proverbs 17:11 - An evil [man] seeketh only rebellion: therefore a cruel messenger shall be sent against him."

King are supposedly chosen by God.

"And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
"

My understanding of Christianity is that Democracy is evil, a rebellion, and a form of witchcraft. That George's Washington's rebellion was a form of witchcraft and the United States should be feudalistic under the current monarch of England.

Also, the thirteenth amendment is against God. That slavery is good according to the Bible. So not only would the above be true, but if Christians followed the Bible and got their way politically slavery would be abundant. Thanks for the read.

http://biblehub.com...
https://www.openbible.info...
http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org...
http://biblehub.com...
Willows
Posts: 2,084
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11/4/2016 12:09:36 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 11/4/2016 2:59:55 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I've been thinking that if Christians really followed the Bible and got their way politically we would be living in a feudal government.

Reasons:

Bible quotes

"On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: king of kings and lord of lords." Revelation 19:16

Slavery is permissible under Christianity.

Ephesians 6:5 ESV

"Slaves, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling, with a sincere heart, as you would Christ, "

Exodus 21:20-21 ESV
"When a man strikes his slave, male or female, with a rod and the slave dies under his hand, he shall be avenged. But if the slave survives a day or two, he is not to be avenged, for the slave is his money. "


The Bible is against rebellion, what feudal lord is going to surrender his throne to democracy?

"1 Samuel 15:23 - For rebellion [is as] the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness [is as] iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from [being] king.

Proverbs 17:11 - An evil [man] seeketh only rebellion: therefore a cruel messenger shall be sent against him."

King are supposedly chosen by God.

"And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
"

My understanding of Christianity is that Democracy is evil, a rebellion, and a form of witchcraft. That George's Washington's rebellion was a form of witchcraft and the United States should be feudalistic under the current monarch of England.

Also, the thirteenth amendment is against God. That slavery is good according to the Bible. So not only would the above be true, but if Christians followed the Bible and got their way politically slavery would be abundant. Thanks for the read.


http://biblehub.com...
https://www.openbible.info...
http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org...
http://biblehub.com...

No surprises there. They have been there and done that.

Religion was invented by those in authority to command control over the masses and is still the case in some countries around the world where barbarism is the order of the day.
RoderickSpode
Posts: 2,386
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11/4/2016 1:24:28 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 11/4/2016 2:59:55 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I've been thinking that if Christians really followed the Bible and got their way politically we would be living in a feudal government.

Reasons:

Bible quotes

"On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: king of kings and lord of lords." Revelation 19:16

Slavery is permissible under Christianity.

Ephesians 6:5 ESV

"Slaves, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling, with a sincere heart, as you would Christ, "

Exodus 21:20-21 ESV
"When a man strikes his slave, male or female, with a rod and the slave dies under his hand, he shall be avenged. But if the slave survives a day or two, he is not to be avenged, for the slave is his money. "


The Bible is against rebellion, what feudal lord is going to surrender his throne to democracy?

"1 Samuel 15:23 - For rebellion [is as] the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness [is as] iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from [being] king.

Proverbs 17:11 - An evil [man] seeketh only rebellion: therefore a cruel messenger shall be sent against him."

King are supposedly chosen by God.

"And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
"

My understanding of Christianity is that Democracy is evil, a rebellion, and a form of witchcraft. That George's Washington's rebellion was a form of witchcraft and the United States should be feudalistic under the current monarch of England.

Also, the thirteenth amendment is against God. That slavery is good according to the Bible. So not only would the above be true, but if Christians followed the Bible and got their way politically slavery would be abundant. Thanks for the read.


http://biblehub.com...
https://www.openbible.info...
http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org...
http://biblehub.com...
The majority of Americans were Christians in America's early years, placing the Bible as the Book to follow. Why do you think we didn't end up in the scenario you present?
Scruggs
Posts: 91
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11/4/2016 2:46:49 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 11/4/2016 2:59:55 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I've been thinking that if Christians really followed the Bible and got their way politically we would be living in a feudal government.

Reasons:

Bible quotes

"On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: king of kings and lord of lords." Revelation 19:16
What does this have to do with feudalism? The quote you provided has nothing to say on the topic of feudalism.

Slavery is permissible under Christianity.

Ephesians 6:5 ESV

"Slaves, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling, with a sincere heart, as you would Christ, "
Yup, slavery was permissible. Jesus did not come to start a slave revolt and overthrow the economic system within the Roman Empire. Rather, he gave advice to both the slaves and the masters. Read Ephesians 6:9:

"And masters, treat your slaves in the same way. Do not threaten them, since you know that he who is both their Master and yours is in heaven, and there is no favoritism with him." (NIV)

However, I again have to ask what this has to do with feudalism. Are you suggesting that only feudalism can allow for slavery? Are you suggesting that a central tenet of a feudal state is slavery?

The Bible is against rebellion, what feudal lord is going to surrender his throne to democracy?

"1 Samuel 15:23 - For rebellion [is as] the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness [is as] iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from [being] king.
Except this passage has nothing to do with political rebellion. Nor does it have anything to do with democracy lol. If you read the chapter, Samuel is removing Saul as king. Let's find out why:

"Samuel said, 'Although you were once small in your own eyes, did you not become the head of the tribes of Israel? The Lord anointed you king over Israel. And he sent you on a mission, saying, 'Go and completely destroy those wicked people, the Amalekites; wage war against them until you have wiped them out.' Why did you not obey the Lord? Why did you pounce on the plunder and do evil in the eyes of the Lord?'

'But I did obey the Lord,' Saul said. 'I went on the mission the Lord assigned me. I completely destroyed the Amalekites and brought back Agag their king. The soldiers took sheep and cattle from the plunder, the best of what was devoted to God, in order to sacrifice them to the Lord your God at Gilgal.'

But Samuel replied:

'Does the Lord delight in burnt offerings and sacrifices as much as in obeying the Lord?
To obey is better than sacrifice, and to heed is better than the fat of rams. For rebellion is like the sin of divination, and arrogance like the evil of idolatry. Because you have rejected the word of the Lord, he has rejected you as king.'" (NIV)

Proverbs 17:11 - An evil [man] seeketh only rebellion: therefore a cruel messenger shall be sent against him."
Most, if not all, commenators directly associate this with rebellion against God. Not rebellion in general. In fact, the NIV places the phrase "rebellion against God" right in the text.

King are supposedly chosen by God.

"And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen."
You are quoting a dated translation. The Greek term rendered in the KJV as "kings" is actually basileian. The NAS Exhuastive Concordance defines this as "kingdom, sovereignty, royal power."

However, let's pretend for a moment that the KJV is correct. The quote you gave from Revelation 1:6 is contained within a prophecy. It reads:

"To the seven churches in the province of Asia:

Grace and peace to you from him who is, and who was, and who is to come, and from the seven spirits before his throne, and from Jesus Christ, who is the faithful witness, the firstborn from the dead, and the ruler of the kings of the earth.

To him who loves us and has freed us from our sins by his blood, and has made us to be a kingdom [or kings] and priests to serve his God and Father -- to him be glory and power for ever and ever! Amen." (NIV)

So this text has nothing to say in regard to kings being "chosen by God." Rather, it has everything to do with addressing the congregation of Christians. We are a kingdom, collectively, as Christians.

My understanding of Christianity is that Democracy is evil, a rebellion, and a form of witchcraft. That George's Washington's rebellion was a form of witchcraft and the United States should be feudalistic under the current monarch of England.
Your understanding of Christianity is flawed. You did not provide even one text from the Scriptures that indicate feudalism is promoted. And I cannot even begin to fathom how you came to the conclusion that George Washington was performing witchcraft and the US should be under the monarch of England.

Also, the thirteenth amendment is against God. That slavery is good according to the Bible. So not only would the above be true, but if Christians followed the Bible and got their way politically slavery would be abundant. Thanks for the read.
None of the amendments are against God. Slavery is never labeled as "good" in the Bible. It is never labeled in any negative or positive terms to my knowledge, so I hope that you provide a reference. You do realize that slavery ended because Christians "got their way," right? Do you think the atheists ended slavery? Nope. The Hindus? Nope. The Muslims? Nope. The Sikhs? Nope. The agnostics? Nope. The Buddhists? Nope. It was the Christians that ended slavery, plain and simple.
"If a man does not put himself in the attitude of a sinner, his prayer will not be heard before God." A brother asked him, "what is a sinful soul?" And St. Abba Moses replied, "Everyone who bears his own sins, and does not consider those of his companion."
Quadrunner
Posts: 1,167
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11/4/2016 2:49:06 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 11/4/2016 2:59:55 AM, Stupidape wrote:
I've been thinking that if Christians really followed the Bible and got their way politically we would be living in a feudal government.

Reasons:

Bible quotes

"On his robe and on his thigh he has this name written: king of kings and lord of lords." Revelation 19:16

Slavery is permissible under Christianity.

Ephesians 6:5 ESV

"Slaves, obey your earthly masters with fear and trembling, with a sincere heart, as you would Christ, "

Exodus 21:20-21 ESV
"When a man strikes his slave, male or female, with a rod and the slave dies under his hand, he shall be avenged. But if the slave survives a day or two, he is not to be avenged, for the slave is his money. "


The Bible is against rebellion, what feudal lord is going to surrender his throne to democracy?

"1 Samuel 15:23 - For rebellion [is as] the sin of witchcraft, and stubbornness [is as] iniquity and idolatry. Because thou hast rejected the word of the LORD, he hath also rejected thee from [being] king.

Proverbs 17:11 - An evil [man] seeketh only rebellion: therefore a cruel messenger shall be sent against him."

King are supposedly chosen by God.

"And hath made us kings and priests unto God and his Father; to him be glory and dominion for ever and ever. Amen.
"

My understanding of Christianity is that Democracy is evil, a rebellion, and a form of witchcraft. That George's Washington's rebellion was a form of witchcraft and the United States should be feudalistic under the current monarch of England.

Also, the thirteenth amendment is against God. That slavery is good according to the Bible. So not only would the above be true, but if Christians followed the Bible and got their way politically slavery would be abundant. Thanks for the read.


http://biblehub.com...
https://www.openbible.info...
http://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org...
http://biblehub.com...

America was practically founded on Christian principle....Much of the bible developed in a time of kings and queens. That doesn't seem to have held Christian rulers back from expanding into new ideas. Maybe my proof is just lopsided. Either way, it seems like a stupid topic.
Wisdom is found where the wise seek it.
Stupidape
Posts: 171
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11/5/2016 4:28:45 AM
Posted: 1 month ago
"America was practically founded on Christian principle....Much of the bible developed in a time of kings and queens. That doesn't seem to have held Christian rulers back from expanding into new ideas. Maybe my proof is just lopsided. Either way, it seems like a stupid topic." Quadrunner

If memory serves me correctly Feudalism was defeated by gunpowder. It was too expensive for feudal lords like barons to buy gunpowder. On top of that the new gunpowder weapons were easier to use.

As I view the scenario science defeated feudalism and Christians deviated from the Bible by using the new gunpowder units and Capitalism.
Stupidape
Posts: 171
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11/5/2016 4:33:25 AM
Posted: 1 month ago
"The majority of Americans were Christians in America's early years, placing the Bible as the Book to follow. Why do you think we didn't end up in the scenario you present?" Roderick

Gunpowder defeated Feudalism. Freeing of slaves was advantageous politically. In other words Christians used the empirical evidence as opposed to religious doctrine and saw that capitalism and democracy was preferable to Feudalism and slavery.

Think about if not for science we would probably be Feudalistic still.
Stupidape
Posts: 171
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11/5/2016 4:38:18 AM
Posted: 1 month ago
"What does this have to do with feudalism? The quote you provided has nothing to say on the topic of feudalism." Scruggs

Kings? Lords? Last time I checked we got senators, judges, and a president.
RoderickSpode
Posts: 2,386
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11/5/2016 12:54:20 PM
Posted: 1 month ago
At 11/5/2016 4:33:25 AM, Stupidape wrote:
"The majority of Americans were Christians in America's early years, placing the Bible as the Book to follow. Why do you think we didn't end up in the scenario you present?" Roderick

Gunpowder defeated Feudalism. Freeing of slaves was advantageous politically. In other words Christians used the empirical evidence as opposed to religious doctrine and saw that capitalism and democracy was preferable to Feudalism and slavery.

I think you're trying to allude to theories on Abraham Lincoln. And even if these theories were true, you couldn't make this claim for all Christians who wouldn't benefit from freeing slaves.

But I know, it goes like this:

All of the supporters of slavery who used the Bible as justification did so with religious conviction.

All of the Christian abolitionists who claimed religious conviction that all men are created equal did so only for political advantage.

Is this about right?

Are you an historian by the way?
Think about if not for science we would probably be Feudalistic still.
If not for architects, there wouldn't be buildings. So what? What are you getting at?