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Adam & Eve not Literal.

bulproof
Posts: 25,171
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11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Silly_Billy
Posts: 641
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11/4/2016 12:51:24 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Well let me see... i dont believe in God the meddler, nore do i believe that Adam and Eve were magically whisked into existence, but to say that this therefor proofs that there is no life after death is taking a rather huge unfounded step. Just because the Bible is made out toiletpaper to be does not disprove the existence of a higher being or even the existence of a continuation of life after death.

Evidence to the contrary....

A) Life after death? Largest-ever study provides evidence that 'out of body' and 'near-death' experiences may be real

http://www.independent.co.uk...
http://worldnewsdailyreport.com...
http://www.express.co.uk...

B) 10 Claims Of Physical Evidence For Reincarnation

http://listverse.com...

Of course it can be said that the need to believe in a continuation of life is a type of wishfull thinking but i do believe that there are plenty of indications out there that there could be more to death than just death.
bulproof
Posts: 25,171
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11/4/2016 1:01:17 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 12:51:24 PM, Silly_Billy wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Well let me see... i dont believe in God the meddler, nore do i believe that Adam and Eve were magically whisked into existence, but to say that this therefor proofs that there is no life after death is taking a rather huge unfounded step. Just because the Bible is made out toiletpaper to be does not disprove the existence of a higher being or even the existence of a continuation of life after death.

Evidence to the contrary....

A) Life after death? Largest-ever study provides evidence that 'out of body' and 'near-death' experiences may be real
There may be invisible pink dragons in your living room. Lets believe that shall we?

http://www.independent.co.uk...
http://worldnewsdailyreport.com...
http://www.express.co.uk...

B) 10 Claims Of Physical Evidence For Reincarnation

http://listverse.com...
I'm sure their studies have been peer reviewed and authenticated, not.

Of course it can be said that the need to believe in a continuation of life is a type of wishfull thinking but i do believe that there are plenty of indications out there that there could be more to death than just death.
Provide the plenty of indications and show that wishful thinking is not involved.
Of course this has nothing to do with the OP.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
rosends
Posts: 56
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11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.
KwLm
Posts: 471
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11/4/2016 1:20:36 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.

That's called irrational thinking.
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 2,181
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11/4/2016 1:29:30 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

That's why we pay you the big bucks.

This Adam and Eve thing is a better platform for God to start his operation : ( Getting people to know me )

It's this or the " creating a son to walk around telling people about me."
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 2,181
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11/4/2016 1:37:10 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.

Do you have room in your so caled " thinking ".
Beliving in things you can't prove is fine.
But you can't think that something you only believe in and can never prove , should be worshiped. This is the first and most important , downfall. FULL stop.
rosends
Posts: 56
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11/4/2016 1:42:17 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 1:20:36 PM, KwLm wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.

That's called irrational thinking.

I have been accused of worse.
But I'd prefer to think of it as extra-rational thinking. Sort of my belief that things are going to work out OK even though stuff isn't so OK right now. No real proof, just a faith.
rosends
Posts: 56
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11/4/2016 1:44:22 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 1:37:10 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.

Do you have room in your so caled " thinking ".
Beliving in things you can't prove is fine.
But you can't think that something you only believe in and can never prove , should be worshiped. This is the first and most important , downfall. FULL stop.

I can only worship something I can prove? Why is that? I don't see any connection. If something is an object of faith, then that has the same power of existence and can command the same level of adoration. I didn't realize that we can only worship something we can prove exists. Do you have some sort of proof for that?
KwLm
Posts: 471
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11/4/2016 1:59:02 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 1:42:17 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:20:36 PM, KwLm wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.

That's called irrational thinking.

I have been accused of worse.
But I'd prefer to think of it as extra-rational thinking. Sort of my belief that things are going to work out OK even though stuff isn't so OK right now. No real proof, just a faith.

You've now changed to wishful thinking
Silly_Billy
Posts: 641
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11/4/2016 2:28:59 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 1:20:36 PM, KwLm wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.

That's called irrational thinking.

Not at all, i would say that it is irrational to only believe that which has been proven as we all believe in facts that we have not personally verified. Have you ever verified for yourself for instance the existence of Pluto?
rosends
Posts: 56
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11/4/2016 2:46:56 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 1:59:02 PM, KwLm wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:42:17 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:20:36 PM, KwLm wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.

That's called irrational thinking.

I have been accused of worse.
But I'd prefer to think of it as extra-rational thinking. Sort of my belief that things are going to work out OK even though stuff isn't so OK right now. No real proof, just a faith.

You've now changed to wishful thinking
While there might be overlap between the two terms, they are not identical. Belief is the acceptance of things external to the self that don't have "proof". Wishful thinking is the projection of what the individual wants as a future reality. I am accepting what I believe to be the case external to my wants and which is even predating them.

Ah, you say, I am only accepting that which I wish to be true (if not for practical reasons, at least to justify my entire existence) but that presumes that I made the conscious decision to believe to justify my pre-existing belief, which is circular.

So I'll stick with extra-rational.
Deb-8-A-Bull
Posts: 2,181
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11/4/2016 2:54:03 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 1:44:22 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:37:10 PM, Deb-8-A-Bull wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.

Do you have room in your so caled " thinking ".
Beliving in things you can't prove is fine.
But you can't think that something you only believe in and can never prove , should be worshiped. This is the first and most important , downfall. FULL stop.

I can only worship something I can prove? Why is that? I don't see any connection. If something is an object of faith, then that has the same power of existence and can command the same level of adoration. I didn't realize that we can only worship something we can prove exists. Do you have some sort of proof for that?

Correct
No. I have no proof.
I'll think some more over it.
Good day.
Quadrunner
Posts: 1,054
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11/4/2016 2:59:03 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Whether the story is literal or not, (I don't think it is) Adam and Eve, could be real, as in the first humans by definition of having the ability to judge good and evil. We have know way of knowing, and it seems foolish to bicker over such things. The point of the story is integral to the rest of the history of sin throughout mankind as told through the old testimate, and also integral to the purpose of Jesus, and therefore pretty much the entire new testimant.

What evolution is to biology/ecology, Adam and Eve are to christian sin. It's entirely useless information in practice in my opinion, but integral to understanding and perspective of the entire field.

I don't feel qualified to explain everything so I'll leave it at that.
Wisdom is found where the wise seek it.
rosends
Posts: 56
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11/4/2016 3:09:09 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 2:59:03 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Whether the story is literal or not, (I don't think it is) Adam and Eve, could be real, as in the first humans by definition of having the ability to judge good and evil. We have know way of knowing, and it seems foolish to bicker over such things. The point of the story is integral to the rest of the history of sin throughout mankind as told through the old testimate, and also integral to the purpose of Jesus, and therefore pretty much the entire new testimant.

What evolution is to biology/ecology, Adam and Eve are to christian sin. It's entirely useless information in practice in my opinion, but integral to understanding and perspective of the entire field.

I don't feel qualified to explain everything so I'll leave it at that.

This is an important point -- that even the word "literal" is not so simple. Saying that there was a point at which man became aware of a moral scale and that the moment has been mythologized creates an area in between the letter-of-the-text and the text as invention.
bulproof
Posts: 25,171
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11/4/2016 4:19:38 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 2:59:03 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Whether the story is literal or not, (I don't think it is) Adam and Eve, could be real, as in the first humans by definition of having the ability to judge good and evil. We have know way of knowing, and it seems foolish to bicker over such things. The point of the story is integral to the rest of the history of sin throughout mankind as told through the old testimate, and also integral to the purpose of Jesus, and therefore pretty much the entire new testimant.
And if it's not true then nothing in the bible is, especially the Jesus story.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
bulproof
Posts: 25,171
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11/4/2016 4:21:50 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.
So you believe the story of A&E is literally true?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Harikrish
Posts: 11,005
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11/4/2016 4:52:46 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 4:21:50 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.
So you believe the story of A&E is literally true?

We know that Jesus believed in the creation story.
Matthew 19:4"5

4 And He answered and said to them, "Have you not read that He who 1made them at the beginning c"made them male and female,"
5 and said, d"For this reason a man shall leave his father and mother and be joined to his wife, and ethe two shall become one flesh"?
rosends
Posts: 56
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11/4/2016 5:08:54 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 4:21:50 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 11/4/2016 1:13:48 PM, rosends wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

I don't see these as necessarily one or the other because I have room in my thinking for belief and faith, that is, the acceptance of ideas as being true without evidence or without the evidence that might rise to someone else's expected standard of proof.
So you believe the story of A&E is literally true?
Honestly? I don't know what I believe -- and that's the most honest I can be. Part of me sees it as true to some literal degree, but even the definition of "literal" is confusing here. Some sees it as more allegorical. Most sees it as some bizarre hybrid.
PureX
Posts: 1,515
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11/4/2016 5:16:24 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Adam and Eve are characters in a mythical story about the origins of human nature. Jesus us a character in a sacred religious story about the relationship between mankind and "God", and mankind to each other. And there are a lot of different ways of interpreting these stories, which is partly their intent.

You are choosing one narrow interpretation of each story and playing them against each other for the purpose of discrediting them. And that's not an intellectually honest thing to do. Most of us can see this even if you can't.
distraff
Posts: 1,002
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11/4/2016 5:29:13 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

There are several reasons to believe they are literal:
1: When a part of the bible is non-literal like Isaiah, Revelations, or one of Jesus' parables it is very clear that this is non-literal while Genesis doesn't.
2: Other religions also had creation myths as well and take them literally.
3: Most Christians take genesis literally, and up until evolution was discovered virtually all did.
4: Genesis has a very technical geneology from Adam through Abraham meaning that it considers them to be real.
5: Other parts of the bible refer to Adam and Eve and the fall as real events and there is no reference to them being non-literal.
Quadrunner
Posts: 1,054
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11/4/2016 6:02:41 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 4:19:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 11/4/2016 2:59:03 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Whether the story is literal or not, (I don't think it is) Adam and Eve, could be real, as in the first humans by definition of having the ability to judge good and evil. We have know way of knowing, and it seems foolish to bicker over such things. The point of the story is integral to the rest of the history of sin throughout mankind as told through the old testimate, and also integral to the purpose of Jesus, and therefore pretty much the entire new testimant.
And if it's not true then nothing in the bible is, especially the Jesus story.

If Adam and Eve never existed and were purely fictitious, the concept of sin, and being born into sin would still exist and be demonstrated through the story.

So I'm a little confused on what you mean by not true. What aspect would have to be not true to discredit Jesus?
Wisdom is found where the wise seek it.
Quadrunner
Posts: 1,054
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11/4/2016 6:11:27 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 5:16:24 PM, PureX wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Adam and Eve are characters in a mythical story about the origins of human nature. Jesus us a character in a sacred religious story about the relationship between mankind and "God", and mankind to each other. And there are a lot of different ways of interpreting these stories, which is partly their intent.

You are choosing one narrow interpretation of each story and playing them against each other for the purpose of discrediting them. And that's not an intellectually honest thing to do. Most of us can see this even if you can't.

+1
Wisdom is found where the wise seek it.
Genius_Intellect
Posts: 339
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11/4/2016 8:05:43 PM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Jesus was a dude(s) who did something 2,000 years ago, of that we can be reasonably confident. We can also be confident that his tale was embellished in the retelling, absorbing many common hero tropes over the next few hundred years, until the character of Jesus become a composite god-hero. The historicity of the man himself is immaterial, as he's transcended into the world of myth.
bulproof
Posts: 25,171
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11/5/2016 2:17:42 AM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/4/2016 6:02:41 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 4:19:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 11/4/2016 2:59:03 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Whether the story is literal or not, (I don't think it is) Adam and Eve, could be real, as in the first humans by definition of having the ability to judge good and evil. We have know way of knowing, and it seems foolish to bicker over such things. The point of the story is integral to the rest of the history of sin throughout mankind as told through the old testimate, and also integral to the purpose of Jesus, and therefore pretty much the entire new testimant.
And if it's not true then nothing in the bible is, especially the Jesus story.

If Adam and Eve never existed and were purely fictitious, the concept of sin, and being born into sin would still exist and be demonstrated through the story.

So I'm a little confused on what you mean by not true. What aspect would have to be not true to discredit Jesus?
No A&E, no sin, no sin, no Jesus. Game over.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Welfare-Worker
Posts: 1,154
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11/5/2016 3:40:34 AM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
Jewish tradition says there was no original sin.
Jesus was Jewish.
So.........

On many points Christianity is barely recognizable as coming from Judaism.
Quadrunner
Posts: 1,054
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11/5/2016 3:50:24 AM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/5/2016 2:17:42 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 11/4/2016 6:02:41 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 4:19:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 11/4/2016 2:59:03 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Whether the story is literal or not, (I don't think it is) Adam and Eve, could be real, as in the first humans by definition of having the ability to judge good and evil. We have know way of knowing, and it seems foolish to bicker over such things. The point of the story is integral to the rest of the history of sin throughout mankind as told through the old testimate, and also integral to the purpose of Jesus, and therefore pretty much the entire new testimant.
And if it's not true then nothing in the bible is, especially the Jesus story.

If Adam and Eve never existed and were purely fictitious, the concept of sin, and being born into sin would still exist and be demonstrated through the story.

So I'm a little confused on what you mean by not true. What aspect would have to be not true to discredit Jesus?
No A&E, no sin, no sin, no Jesus. Game over.

Well I'm afraid I can't add anything constructive in reply to that. Your motive seems to be linked with systematically debunking literal interpretations in the bible. I'm afraid I can't see merit, though I purposefully avoid the religious forums on a more typical day so its probably just not something I'm aware of.
Wisdom is found where the wise seek it.
Quadrunner
Posts: 1,054
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11/5/2016 3:51:22 AM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/5/2016 3:50:24 AM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/5/2016 2:17:42 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 11/4/2016 6:02:41 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 4:19:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 11/4/2016 2:59:03 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Whether the story is literal or not, (I don't think it is) Adam and Eve, could be real, as in the first humans by definition of having the ability to judge good and evil. We have know way of knowing, and it seems foolish to bicker over such things. The point of the story is integral to the rest of the history of sin throughout mankind as told through the old testimate, and also integral to the purpose of Jesus, and therefore pretty much the entire new testimant.
And if it's not true then nothing in the bible is, especially the Jesus story.

If Adam and Eve never existed and were purely fictitious, the concept of sin, and being born into sin would still exist and be demonstrated through the story.

So I'm a little confused on what you mean by not true. What aspect would have to be not true to discredit Jesus?
No A&E, no sin, no sin, no Jesus. Game over.

Well I'm afraid I can't add anything constructive in reply to that. Your motive seems to be linked with systematically debunking literal interpretations in the bible. I'm afraid I can't see merit, though I purposefully avoid the religious forums on a more typical day so its probably just not something I'm aware of.

*Not aware of
Wisdom is found where the wise seek it.
Quadrunner
Posts: 1,054
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11/5/2016 4:20:05 AM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/5/2016 3:40:34 AM, Welfare-Worker wrote:
Jewish tradition says there was no original sin.
Jesus was Jewish.
So.........

On many points Christianity is barely recognizable as coming from Judaism.

I've been trying to study Judaism on my own time as a christian and its very difficult for me.
Wisdom is found where the wise seek it.
bulproof
Posts: 25,171
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11/5/2016 4:22:37 AM
Posted: 4 weeks ago
At 11/5/2016 3:50:24 AM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/5/2016 2:17:42 AM, bulproof wrote:
At 11/4/2016 6:02:41 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 4:19:38 PM, bulproof wrote:
At 11/4/2016 2:59:03 PM, Quadrunner wrote:
At 11/4/2016 12:22:03 PM, bulproof wrote:
Then there is absolutely no reason for Jesus, we know that Adam and Eve is not literal ergo there is neither a need for salvation nor an existence of it.
When you die you are dead.
Unless you have evidence to the contrary?

Whether the story is literal or not, (I don't think it is) Adam and Eve, could be real, as in the first humans by definition of having the ability to judge good and evil. We have know way of knowing, and it seems foolish to bicker over such things. The point of the story is integral to the rest of the history of sin throughout mankind as told through the old testimate, and also integral to the purpose of Jesus, and therefore pretty much the entire new testimant.
And if it's not true then nothing in the bible is, especially the Jesus story.

If Adam and Eve never existed and were purely fictitious, the concept of sin, and being born into sin would still exist and be demonstrated through the story.

So I'm a little confused on what you mean by not true. What aspect would have to be not true to discredit Jesus?
No A&E, no sin, no sin, no Jesus. Game over.

Well I'm afraid I can't add anything constructive in reply to that. Your motive seems to be linked with systematically debunking literal interpretations in the bible. I'm afraid I can't see merit, though I purposefully avoid the religious forums on a more typical day so its probably just not something I'm aware of.
Well of course if you are Hindu then the bible is a meaningless document to you anyway.
I'm well aware that it is meaningless and attempt to engage those who believe in it's veracity in a conversation where they might try to defend that veracity.
It is usually a forlorn effort, because they can't.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin