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In the name of 'Allah'?

spiritislife
Posts: 94
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1/19/2011 9:42:25 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Guess what Religion is at the root of most all terrorist acts committed in the world today? YEP. Islam and its wonderful, death-spirational? Quran. "O Allah, you do such a great job of inspiring your followers to kill, kill, kill" in your name. You must be a genius."

Here's a brief list of recent unprovoked attacks by muslims "in the name of ‘allah'". (Go religious tolerance! Go peace! Go fighting only in self defense!)

I say the below incidents begin to make a case for burning all Qurans in the world, don't you? The day this evil book ceases to pollute the hearts and minds of so many misguided souls will be a great day indeed.

Over 40 killed after Muslims attack Nigeria Church: http://www.religionnewsblog.com...

Ouch, just happened on 11th of January, 2011! Christian shot dead by ‘merciful' muslim cop…
http://www.liquida.com...

Was it something he said? Journalist in Pakistan murdered for criticizing Muhammad: http://www.brusselsjournal.com...

Happy New Year? 23 Coptics blown to bits on New Year's Eve 2011 while worshipping in their Alexandria, Egypt church… http://www.adnkronos.com...

Muslim man kills his own daughter in Arizona for becoming too ‘westernized'… His defense: It was an honor killing under Sharia Law!http://www.libertynewsonline.com...

58 people killed in a Catholic Church by Iraqis screaming ‘Allahu Akbar' while killing.
http://www.aolnews.com...

I could go on for hours. I seriously could have dug up hundreds of similar stories like these, within the last year alone. Atrocities committed by muslims around the world 'in the name of Allah.'

The stench of evil and blood is supremely tied to Allah and Muhammad's 'religion of peace '- up to this present day.

"Our Lady of Fatima, pray for us."
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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1/19/2011 9:48:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Oh great, another one of these topics.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
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1/19/2011 10:05:21 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 9:48:06 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
Oh great, another one of these topics.

Dude, this is the Religion forum. You will be seeing a lot of RELIGIOUS threads. If this seems repetitive to you, then feel free to browse elsewhere. But randomly saying "Oh great, another one of these topics" is as useless as a treadmill for Rosie O'Donnell.
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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1/19/2011 10:25:31 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
Yeah, I'm moaning about someone posting a religious topic in the religion forum. That makes sense. Has nothing to do with hoping to find a topic in the religion forum that isn't destined to become a flame war.

Is it possible to have a calm, reasonable discussion about these things?

I'm beginning to think, no, only on a one on one basis. Not when you have groups of people riding in.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
annhasle
Posts: 6,657
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1/19/2011 10:32:55 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 10:25:31 PM, CosmicAlfonzo wrote:
Yeah, I'm moaning about someone posting a religious topic in the religion forum. That makes sense. Has nothing to do with hoping to find a topic in the religion forum that isn't destined to become a flame war.

Lol. The intent of this site is disagreement. Only through disagreement and opposing views comes debate. And within debate, especially personal topics like religion, a "flame war" is almost inevitable.

Is it possible to have a calm, reasonable discussion about these things?

Of course. I've had plenty. However, overall, the threads digress into perceived attacks on character and personal identity... and then a whole sh!t load of reductio ad absurdums and ad hominems. But you get through it by remaining rational and conversing with those who have shown to also be levelheaded.

I'm beginning to think, no, only on a one on one basis. Not when you have groups of people riding in.

Not true. It can and has been done. But religion is incredibly personal which makes people a bit more touchy then they would be in the Politics or Games thread (usually).
I'm not back. This idiot just upset me which made me stop lurking.
CosmicAlfonzo
Posts: 5,955
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1/19/2011 10:48:20 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
I'll stick around then.
Official "High Priest of Secular Affairs and Transient Distributor of Sonic Apple Seeds relating to the Reptilian Division of Paperwork Immoliation" of The FREEDO Bureaucracy, a DDO branch of the Erisian Front, a subdivision of the Discordian Back, a Limb of the Illuminatian Cosmic Utensil Corp
Fatihah
Posts: 7,742
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1/20/2011 1:26:43 AM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/19/2011 9:42:25 PM, spiritislife wrote:
Guess what Religion is at the root of most all terrorist acts committed in the world today? YEP. Islam and its wonderful, death-spirational? Quran. "O Allah, you do such a great job of inspiring your followers to kill, kill, kill" in your name. You must be a genius."

Here's a brief list of recent unprovoked attacks by muslims "in the name of ‘allah'". (Go religious tolerance! Go peace! Go fighting only in self defense!)

I say the below incidents begin to make a case for burning all Qurans in the world, don't you? The day this evil book ceases to pollute the hearts and minds of so many misguided souls will be a great day indeed.

Over 40 killed after Muslims attack Nigeria Church: http://www.religionnewsblog.com...

Ouch, just happened on 11th of January, 2011! Christian shot dead by ‘merciful' muslim cop…
http://www.liquida.com...

Was it something he said? Journalist in Pakistan murdered for criticizing Muhammad: http://www.brusselsjournal.com...

Happy New Year? 23 Coptics blown to bits on New Year's Eve 2011 while worshipping in their Alexandria, Egypt church… http://www.adnkronos.com...

Muslim man kills his own daughter in Arizona for becoming too ‘westernized'… His defense: It was an honor killing under Sharia Law!http://www.libertynewsonline.com...

58 people killed in a Catholic Church by Iraqis screaming ‘Allahu Akbar' while killing.
http://www.aolnews.com...

I could go on for hours. I seriously could have dug up hundreds of similar stories like these, within the last year alone. Atrocities committed by muslims around the world 'in the name of Allah.'

The stench of evil and blood is supremely tied to Allah and Muhammad's 'religion of peace '- up to this present day.

"Our Lady of Fatima, pray for us."

Response: None of which is from the qur'an or sunnah, thus it's not the religion of islam. So your point is pointless. Your bible on the other hand is filled with the most inhumane, immoral, and most gruesome things one can think of. Let's take a look shall we.

Lev.14: 49-53- To clean the house from a plague, sprinkle the house with the blood of dead birds.

Lev.12: 1-5- females are born double polluted than males.

Luke 14:26- You must hate your family to be a disciple of Jesus.

Ephes.5: 22-24- women must submit to their husbands.

Isaiah 7:20 God shaves with a high razor.

2 Samuels 22:11- God rides on a cherub.( Animal with wings or a naked female with wings).

Then it gets even more disgusting.

Ezekiel.16:8 God makes love to a young girl. Verses 16-34, she becomes a whore and 35-42, God punishes her out of jealousy.

You really have to read this part. In 2Samuels 12:2-5, David sleeps with the Wife of Uriah and she conceives a child. Verses 6-13, King David invites Uriah over for a meal and afterwards he sleeps at the door of King David's house.

Now watch this.

Verses 14 - 27, David gives a letter to Uriah to give to Joab. The letter reads that Joab is to put Uriah on the frontline of the hottest battle so he can die. When he dies, he takes Uriah's mourning wife and marries her, and she bares his son. This displeased God.

But wait. I'm not finished yet. It get's even more despicable.

The next chapter, from verse 1-13, God sends Nathan to state to David that HE is displeased by the fact that David abused his authority by having s child with Uriah's wife and then having him killed. But.......God actually forgave David. Instead...............as verses 14- 18 read, God instead kills his newborn child!!

What!!!

2 Samuels 13: 10-14- David's son Amnon rapes his own sister Tamar.

That's enough. I could go on for days. The difference between this post and yours, nothing of which you stated is in the qur'an or sunnah, thus it does not demonstrate negativity about the religion of islam. However, what I've just posted is actually scriptural and found in your bible. And when we consider the number of Christian preachers caught out molesting children and committing mass murder and crimes as well, it is clear that your religion of Christianity is clearly the one with the stench of perverted immorality, not the just religion of peace which is islam.
spiritislife
Posts: 94
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1/20/2011 2:42:47 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 1:26:43 AM, Fatihah wrote:

Response: None of which is from the qur'an or sunnah, thus it's not the religion of islam. So your point is pointless. :

That is what you say. Thousands of your fellow (so called 'radical') muslims interpret your same book differently. They think they are perfectly justified to go ahead and kill 'infidels' 'in the name of Allah'. It IS the religion of Islam to many muslims, like it or not. It certainly does paint the Quran and Islam in a negative way.

Your bible on the other hand is filled with the most inhumane, immoral, and most gruesome things one can think of. :

Changing the subject, are we? At least, you didn't outright deny these awful incidents that are taking place all over the world by muslims in the name of their religion. I thought you would.

Every single one of your examples from the Bible are completely irelevent to this topic and can all be refuted on their own terms. Plus, they are all your own biased interpretations of what the Bible is actually saying. You did not quote any of the actual texts.

For example, Luke 14:26 does not call us to hate our families. That is ridiculous. Why don;t you open your mind up to learning about what the Christian interpretation of Biblical passages are? The Church Fathers' comment on Lk 14:26 (whose interpretation is unanimously approved by the Church) : "The law of Christ does not allow us to hate even our enemies, much less our parents: but the meaning of the text is, that we must be in that disposition of soul, as to be willing to renounce, and part with every thing, how near or dear soever it may be to us, that would keep us from following Christ. "

You have the story of David all twisted. Yes he sinned. We all do. God forgave him, but also punished him in this life - as He predicted He would. David accepted this scourge, humbled himself, and became even greater than he was before his fall. Babies die. God has the right to take away even the lives of the babies He has created - if he so chooses, and does so everyday. Does this make God cruel? David's baby from the wife of Uria is in paradise.

Btw, I can prove that the God of my Bible sends innocent baby 'non-believers' right to paradise - from verses in the 'cruel' OT. Can you prove the likewise from your Quran? No! They are all going to hell!!! No one is innocent except muslims in your religion.

The difference between this post and yours, nothing of which you stated is in the qur'an or sunnah, thus it does not demonstrate negativity about the religion of islam. :
Oh yes it does. See above.

However, what I've just posted is actually scriptural and found in your bible.:

No it isn;t. Your interpretations. You didn't cite the verses.

And when we consider the number of Christian preachers caught out molesting children and committing mass murder and crimes as well, it is clear that your religion of Christianity is clearly the one with the stench of perverted immorality, not the just religion of peace which is islam.:

If anyone has done this, they have acted contrary to the teAachings and actions of Our Lord Jesus Christ, are not His faithful followers, and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the Law - both in this life and in the hereafter.

Can we apply this rule both ways? If you think my realtime evidence was so anti-Islam, then please get together with your other muslims and: 1) publicly condemn the violent actions of your 'radical' muslim brothers who are doing this 'in the name of Allah'. 2) have leaders of Islamic countries and 'peaceful' muslims everywhere publicly apologize to non-muslims for blowing up their churches, killing them, terrorising them, etc.
spiritislife
Posts: 94
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1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
And three: prosecute a muslim with the same force of the Law that muslims receive - if and when a muslim kills or violates the rights of a non-muslim.

If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!), then they should be prosecuted by the same standards we are willing to prosecute Christians by in the West.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM, spiritislife wrote:
If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!),
Do you want to debate it?

"The Qur'an says Muslims are allowed to kill in aggression"

If you want that resolution, challenge me to a debate.
spiritislife
Posts: 94
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1/20/2011 3:17:05 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM, spiritislife wrote:
If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!),
Do you want to debate it?

"The Qur'an says Muslims are allowed to kill in aggression"

If you want that resolution, challenge me to a debate.

Dear Mirza,

You challenged me to debate the contradictions between Bukhari and the Quran did you not? I accepted. We began. What happened to that? You seemed to have bailed out when I was just getting started. If you really want to debate, then let me first destroy your arguments on that topic first, prove the contradictions between Bukhari and Quran, then we'll move on to something else, ok?
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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1/20/2011 3:19:13 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 3:17:05 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM, spiritislife wrote:
If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!),
Do you want to debate it?

"The Qur'an says Muslims are allowed to kill in aggression"

If you want that resolution, challenge me to a debate.

Dear Mirza,

You challenged me to debate the contradictions between Bukhari and the Quran did you not? I accepted. We began. What happened to that? You seemed to have bailed out when I was just getting started. If you really want to debate, then let me first destroy your arguments on that topic first, prove the contradictions between Bukhari and Quran, then we'll move on to something else, ok?
1. I explained about that thread. Also, not responding is not equivalent to "bailing out." Sometimes it's not worth responding to certain posts.

2. If you wanted to wait for that discussion to end, then why do you start all these threads and spread misinformation?
gavin.ogden
Posts: 1,729
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1/20/2011 3:33:55 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 3:17:05 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM, spiritislife wrote:
If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!),
Do you want to debate it?

"The Qur'an says Muslims are allowed to kill in aggression"

If you want that resolution, challenge me to a debate.

Dear Mirza,

You challenged me to debate the contradictions between Bukhari and the Quran did you not? I accepted. We began. What happened to that? You seemed to have bailed out when I was just getting started. If you really want to debate, then let me first destroy your arguments on that topic first, prove the contradictions between Bukhari and Quran, then we'll move on to something else, ok?

I used to be diplomatic, but I'm done with that. Kick his as$, spiritislife. Islam is a violent religion, just like Christianity and Judaism. Their followers are just more brainwashed than the followers of the other two, so they are somehow capable of even more heinous crimes. Then they feel justified, because they have been instructed that this is the way to god.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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1/20/2011 3:36:56 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 3:33:55 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:17:05 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM, spiritislife wrote:
If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!),
Do you want to debate it?

"The Qur'an says Muslims are allowed to kill in aggression"

If you want that resolution, challenge me to a debate.

Dear Mirza,

You challenged me to debate the contradictions between Bukhari and the Quran did you not? I accepted. We began. What happened to that? You seemed to have bailed out when I was just getting started. If you really want to debate, then let me first destroy your arguments on that topic first, prove the contradictions between Bukhari and Quran, then we'll move on to something else, ok?

I used to be diplomatic, but I'm done with that. Kick his as$, spiritislife. Islam is a violent religion, just like Christianity and Judaism. Their followers are just more brainwashed than the followers of the other two, so they are somehow capable of even more heinous crimes. Then they feel justified, because they have been instructed that this is the way to god.
You are all very comfortable with your views. Why don't you debate me? When I avoid debating idiotic resolutions, I get ridiculed, but when I put forth worthy resolutions here, nobody takes heed.
gavin.ogden
Posts: 1,729
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1/20/2011 3:43:02 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 3:36:56 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:33:55 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:17:05 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM, spiritislife wrote:
If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!),
Do you want to debate it?

"The Qur'an says Muslims are allowed to kill in aggression"

If you want that resolution, challenge me to a debate.

Dear Mirza,

You challenged me to debate the contradictions between Bukhari and the Quran did you not? I accepted. We began. What happened to that? You seemed to have bailed out when I was just getting started. If you really want to debate, then let me first destroy your arguments on that topic first, prove the contradictions between Bukhari and Quran, then we'll move on to something else, ok?

I used to be diplomatic, but I'm done with that. Kick his as$, spiritislife. Islam is a violent religion, just like Christianity and Judaism. Their followers are just more brainwashed than the followers of the other two, so they are somehow capable of even more heinous crimes. Then they feel justified, because they have been instructed that this is the way to god.
You are all very comfortable with your views. Why don't you debate me? When I avoid debating idiotic resolutions, I get ridiculed, but when I put forth worthy resolutions here, nobody takes heed.

I will debate you Mirza. What would you like to debate? I have a resolution.

Resolved: The people of Islam should come together to stop terrorism.

I will be pro. The ball is in your court, so either put up, or shut up.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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1/20/2011 3:45:07 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 3:43:02 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:36:56 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:33:55 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:17:05 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM, spiritislife wrote:
If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!),
Do you want to debate it?

"The Qur'an says Muslims are allowed to kill in aggression"

If you want that resolution, challenge me to a debate.

Dear Mirza,

You challenged me to debate the contradictions between Bukhari and the Quran did you not? I accepted. We began. What happened to that? You seemed to have bailed out when I was just getting started. If you really want to debate, then let me first destroy your arguments on that topic first, prove the contradictions between Bukhari and Quran, then we'll move on to something else, ok?

I used to be diplomatic, but I'm done with that. Kick his as$, spiritislife. Islam is a violent religion, just like Christianity and Judaism. Their followers are just more brainwashed than the followers of the other two, so they are somehow capable of even more heinous crimes. Then they feel justified, because they have been instructed that this is the way to god.
You are all very comfortable with your views. Why don't you debate me? When I avoid debating idiotic resolutions, I get ridiculed, but when I put forth worthy resolutions here, nobody takes heed.

I will debate you Mirza. What would you like to debate? I have a resolution.

Resolved: The people of Islam should come together to stop terrorism.

I will be pro. The ball is in your court, so either put up, or shut up.
I told you, you people are wasting my time. My case stands. It's not that I am surprised by good-hearted people being put into bad perspectives, but at least adults should learn how to interact with children, and perhaps set good examples to be followed, too.
spiritislife
Posts: 94
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1/20/2011 3:50:58 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
1. I explained about that thread. Also, not responding is not equivalent to "bailing out." Sometimes it's not worth responding to certain posts.:

Your explanation was answered and refuted. Now it's your turn to try to disprove my latest rebuttals, if you can. Then I will try to respond. That is logical debate. Why can't muslims have a sustained debate on just one point, based on logic and backed by source proof? Show me you can.

2. If you wanted to wait for that discussion to end, then why do you start all these threads and spread misinformation?:

I am sorry, Mirza. I didn't know I had to wait for your permission to post another thread, start another debate, or post another opinion on a different topic, while I was waiting for you. May God forgive me.

Are the most recent acts I cited of unprovoked Muslim aggression against non-muslims 'misinformation"? These incidents happened, are reported and documented by reliable news sources, and similar incidents occur all around the world every day by muslims. Do you deny them? Point out my 'misinformation' please.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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1/20/2011 3:54:21 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 3:50:58 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
1. I explained about that thread. Also, not responding is not equivalent to "bailing out." Sometimes it's not worth responding to certain posts.:

Your explanation was answered and refuted. Now it's your turn to try to disprove my latest rebuttals, if you can. Then I will try to respond. That is logical debate. Why can't muslims have a sustained debate on just one point, based on logic and backed by source proof? Show me you can.
We can. Do you want links to numerous Muslim-Christian debates on any topic?

I am sorry, Mirza. I didn't know I had to wait for your permission to post another thread, start another debate, or post another opinion on a different topic, while I was waiting for you. May God forgive me.
You're evading my point. You don't want to move away from our ongoing discussion, which is why you refuse to debate a new topic. However, you make all these threads to start discussions, even though you clearly refuse to do so when I ask you to.

Are the most recent acts I cited of unprovoked Muslim aggression against non-muslims 'misinformation"? These incidents happened, are reported and documented by reliable news sources, and similar incidents occur all around the world every day by muslims. Do you deny them? Point out my 'misinformation' please.
No, some Muslims are obviously misguided and do horrible things. But not all of those stories are real.
gavin.ogden
Posts: 1,729
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1/20/2011 4:01:30 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 3:45:07 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:43:02 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:36:56 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:33:55 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:17:05 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM, spiritislife wrote:
If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!),
Do you want to debate it?

"The Qur'an says Muslims are allowed to kill in aggression"

If you want that resolution, challenge me to a debate.

Dear Mirza,

You challenged me to debate the contradictions between Bukhari and the Quran did you not? I accepted. We began. What happened to that? You seemed to have bailed out when I was just getting started. If you really want to debate, then let me first destroy your arguments on that topic first, prove the contradictions between Bukhari and Quran, then we'll move on to something else, ok?

I used to be diplomatic, but I'm done with that. Kick his as$, spiritislife. Islam is a violent religion, just like Christianity and Judaism. Their followers are just more brainwashed than the followers of the other two, so they are somehow capable of even more heinous crimes. Then they feel justified, because they have been instructed that this is the way to god.
You are all very comfortable with your views. Why don't you debate me? When I avoid debating idiotic resolutions, I get ridiculed, but when I put forth worthy resolutions here, nobody takes heed.

I will debate you Mirza. What would you like to debate? I have a resolution.

Resolved: The people of Islam should come together to stop terrorism.

I will be pro. The ball is in your court, so either put up, or shut up.
I told you, you people are wasting my time. My case stands. It's not that I am surprised by good-hearted people being put into bad perspectives, but at least adults should learn how to interact with children, and perhaps set good examples to be followed, too.

Not good enough. Like I said, put up or shut up. You want a debate, you got one.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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1/20/2011 4:07:06 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 4:01:30 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:45:07 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:43:02 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:36:56 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:33:55 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:17:05 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM, spiritislife wrote:
If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!),
Do you want to debate it?

"The Qur'an says Muslims are allowed to kill in aggression"

If you want that resolution, challenge me to a debate.

Dear Mirza,

You challenged me to debate the contradictions between Bukhari and the Quran did you not? I accepted. We began. What happened to that? You seemed to have bailed out when I was just getting started. If you really want to debate, then let me first destroy your arguments on that topic first, prove the contradictions between Bukhari and Quran, then we'll move on to something else, ok?

I used to be diplomatic, but I'm done with that. Kick his as$, spiritislife. Islam is a violent religion, just like Christianity and Judaism. Their followers are just more brainwashed than the followers of the other two, so they are somehow capable of even more heinous crimes. Then they feel justified, because they have been instructed that this is the way to god.
You are all very comfortable with your views. Why don't you debate me? When I avoid debating idiotic resolutions, I get ridiculed, but when I put forth worthy resolutions here, nobody takes heed.

I will debate you Mirza. What would you like to debate? I have a resolution.

Resolved: The people of Islam should come together to stop terrorism.

I will be pro. The ball is in your court, so either put up, or shut up.
I told you, you people are wasting my time. My case stands. It's not that I am surprised by good-hearted people being put into bad perspectives, but at least adults should learn how to interact with children, and perhaps set good examples to be followed, too.

Not good enough. Like I said, put up or shut up. You want a debate, you got one.
I did not ask for any kind of debate. I didn't ask you to debate me on the function of junk DNA. I didn't ask you to debate me on the intellectual achievements of William James Sidis. I asked you for a debate about a specific topic within Islam, and what did you put forth?

"Resolved: The people of Islam should come together to stop terrorism."

I would not dare be CON on such a topic. I think Muslims should do whatever they can to stop terrorism and promote peace and tolerance. Again, people put challenges against me in order to ridicule me. If you want authenticity, be truthful, my friend.
gavin.ogden
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1/20/2011 4:31:43 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 4:07:06 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 4:01:30 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:45:07 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:43:02 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:36:56 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:33:55 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:17:05 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 3:08:58 PM, Mirza wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:49:46 PM, spiritislife wrote:
If a muslim only has the right to kill in self -defense (ha!),
Do you want to debate it?

"The Qur'an says Muslims are allowed to kill in aggression"

If you want that resolution, challenge me to a debate.

Dear Mirza,

You challenged me to debate the contradictions between Bukhari and the Quran did you not? I accepted. We began. What happened to that? You seemed to have bailed out when I was just getting started. If you really want to debate, then let me first destroy your arguments on that topic first, prove the contradictions between Bukhari and Quran, then we'll move on to something else, ok?

I used to be diplomatic, but I'm done with that. Kick his as$, spiritislife. Islam is a violent religion, just like Christianity and Judaism. Their followers are just more brainwashed than the followers of the other two, so they are somehow capable of even more heinous crimes. Then they feel justified, because they have been instructed that this is the way to god.
You are all very comfortable with your views. Why don't you debate me? When I avoid debating idiotic resolutions, I get ridiculed, but when I put forth worthy resolutions here, nobody takes heed.

I will debate you Mirza. What would you like to debate? I have a resolution.

Resolved: The people of Islam should come together to stop terrorism.

I will be pro. The ball is in your court, so either put up, or shut up.
I told you, you people are wasting my time. My case stands. It's not that I am surprised by good-hearted people being put into bad perspectives, but at least adults should learn how to interact with children, and perhaps set good examples to be followed, too.

Not good enough. Like I said, put up or shut up. You want a debate, you got one.
I did not ask for any kind of debate. I didn't ask you to debate me on the function of junk DNA. I didn't ask you to debate me on the intellectual achievements of William James Sidis. I asked you for a debate about a specific topic within Islam, and what did you put forth?

"Resolved: The people of Islam should come together to stop terrorism."

I would not dare be CON on such a topic. I think Muslims should do whatever they can to stop terrorism and promote peace and tolerance. Again, people put challenges against me in order to ridicule me. If you want authenticity, be truthful, my friend.

That is good enough, at least for me. You said what I needed to hear."I think Muslims should do whatever they can to stop terrorism and promote peace and tolerance." So, how can we help the people of Islam do this, and who will be willing to do what is necessary? This is an authentic question, my friend.
Mirza
Posts: 16,992
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1/20/2011 4:52:19 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 4:31:43 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
That is good enough, at least for me. You said what I needed to hear."I think Muslims should do whatever they can to stop terrorism and promote peace and tolerance." So, how can we help the people of Islam do this, and who will be willing to do what is necessary? This is an authentic question, my friend.
I think we should place a distinction between Muslims by heart and Muslims by tongue. Those by tongue (words and deeds) do numerous things which are not Islamic. Attempting to address Muslims by addressing these people is not very wise. The Muslims by heart, however, are those who are truthful to their Faith. They are the ones who will stand up for peace and tolerance, and they are the ones who should always expect to do so. The "Muslims by tongue" are not the ones we should expect to do so.

I have to go now, but a very famous Muslim orator has given speeches about Islam and things like fundamentalism. He has brought up good points about peace and Muslims, and you can watch his speeches on YouTube by searching for: Dr. Zakir Naik & terrorism/fundamentalism.
Fatihah
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1/20/2011 5:41:04 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 2:42:47 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 1:26:43 AM, Fatihah wrote:

Response: None of which is from the qur'an or sunnah, thus it's not the religion of islam. So your point is pointless. :

That is what you say. Thousands of your fellow (so called 'radical') muslims interpret your same book differently. They think they are perfectly justified to go ahead and kill 'infidels' 'in the name of Allah'. It IS the religion of Islam to many muslims, like it or not. It certainly does paint the Quran and Islam in a negative way.

Your bible on the other hand is filled with the most inhumane, immoral, and most gruesome things one can think of. :

Changing the subject, are we? At least, you didn't outright deny these awful incidents that are taking place all over the world by muslims in the name of their religion. I thought you would.

Every single one of your examples from the Bible are completely irelevent to this topic and can all be refuted on their own terms. Plus, they are all your own biased interpretations of what the Bible is actually saying. You did not quote any of the actual texts.

For example, Luke 14:26 does not call us to hate our families. That is ridiculous. Why don;t you open your mind up to learning about what the Christian interpretation of Biblical passages are? The Church Fathers' comment on Lk 14:26 (whose interpretation is unanimously approved by the Church) : "The law of Christ does not allow us to hate even our enemies, much less our parents: but the meaning of the text is, that we must be in that disposition of soul, as to be willing to renounce, and part with every thing, how near or dear soever it may be to us, that would keep us from following Christ. "

You have the story of David all twisted. Yes he sinned. We all do. God forgave him, but also punished him in this life - as He predicted He would. David accepted this scourge, humbled himself, and became even greater than he was before his fall. Babies die. God has the right to take away even the lives of the babies He has created - if he so chooses, and does so everyday. Does this make God cruel? David's baby from the wife of Uria is in paradise.

Btw, I can prove that the God of my Bible sends innocent baby 'non-believers' right to paradise - from verses in the 'cruel' OT. Can you prove the likewise from your Quran? No! They are all going to hell!!! No one is innocent except muslims in your religion.

The difference between this post and yours, nothing of which you stated is in the qur'an or sunnah, thus it does not demonstrate negativity about the religion of islam. :
Oh yes it does. See above.

However, what I've just posted is actually scriptural and found in your bible.:

No it isn;t. Your interpretations. You didn't cite the verses.

And when we consider the number of Christian preachers caught out molesting children and committing mass murder and crimes as well, it is clear that your religion of Christianity is clearly the one with the stench of perverted immorality, not the just religion of peace which is islam.:

If anyone has done this, they have acted contrary to the teAachings and actions of Our Lord Jesus Christ, are not His faithful followers, and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the Law - both in this life and in the hereafter.

Can we apply this rule both ways? If you think my realtime evidence was so anti-Islam, then please get together with your other muslims and: 1) publicly condemn the violent actions of your 'radical' muslim brothers who are doing this 'in the name of Allah'. 2) have leaders of Islamic countries and 'peaceful' muslims everywhere publicly apologize to non-muslims for blowing up their churches, killing them, terrorising them, etc.

Response: Such a hilarious rebuttal to the trifling verses in your bible. You couldn't refute a thing. Your comments concerning Luke 14:26 is pointless and proves nothing, for the Church Father's comments on the verse are not the actual words of the text. Thus his interpretation is flawed and doesn't disprove the fact that Jesus himself states that one must hate their family to be his disciple. Then in 2 Samuels, when God kills an innocent child just because his father sinned, you actually justify such cruelty! The child did nothing and does not deserve to become sick and die. Your condoning of such cruelty only further demonstrates how sick your Christian religion is. Thanks for the confession. All praise due to Allah for sending his last Prophet, Muhammad, to guide us to the true religion of islam, where true justice and decency is taught, unlike your Christian religion.
gavin.ogden
Posts: 1,729
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1/20/2011 5:54:04 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 5:41:04 PM, Fatihah wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:42:47 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 1:26:43 AM, Fatihah wrote:

Response: None of which is from the qur'an or sunnah, thus it's not the religion of islam. So your point is pointless. :

That is what you say. Thousands of your fellow (so called 'radical') muslims interpret your same book differently. They think they are perfectly justified to go ahead and kill 'infidels' 'in the name of Allah'. It IS the religion of Islam to many muslims, like it or not. It certainly does paint the Quran and Islam in a negative way.

Your bible on the other hand is filled with the most inhumane, immoral, and most gruesome things one can think of. :

Changing the subject, are we? At least, you didn't outright deny these awful incidents that are taking place all over the world by muslims in the name of their religion. I thought you would.

Every single one of your examples from the Bible are completely irelevent to this topic and can all be refuted on their own terms. Plus, they are all your own biased interpretations of what the Bible is actually saying. You did not quote any of the actual texts.

For example, Luke 14:26 does not call us to hate our families. That is ridiculous. Why don;t you open your mind up to learning about what the Christian interpretation of Biblical passages are? The Church Fathers' comment on Lk 14:26 (whose interpretation is unanimously approved by the Church) : "The law of Christ does not allow us to hate even our enemies, much less our parents: but the meaning of the text is, that we must be in that disposition of soul, as to be willing to renounce, and part with every thing, how near or dear soever it may be to us, that would keep us from following Christ. "

You have the story of David all twisted. Yes he sinned. We all do. God forgave him, but also punished him in this life - as He predicted He would. David accepted this scourge, humbled himself, and became even greater than he was before his fall. Babies die. God has the right to take away even the lives of the babies He has created - if he so chooses, and does so everyday. Does this make God cruel? David's baby from the wife of Uria is in paradise.

Btw, I can prove that the God of my Bible sends innocent baby 'non-believers' right to paradise - from verses in the 'cruel' OT. Can you prove the likewise from your Quran? No! They are all going to hell!!! No one is innocent except muslims in your religion.

The difference between this post and yours, nothing of which you stated is in the qur'an or sunnah, thus it does not demonstrate negativity about the religion of islam. :
Oh yes it does. See above.

However, what I've just posted is actually scriptural and found in your bible.:

No it isn;t. Your interpretations. You didn't cite the verses.

And when we consider the number of Christian preachers caught out molesting children and committing mass murder and crimes as well, it is clear that your religion of Christianity is clearly the one with the stench of perverted immorality, not the just religion of peace which is islam.:

If anyone has done this, they have acted contrary to the teAachings and actions of Our Lord Jesus Christ, are not His faithful followers, and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the Law - both in this life and in the hereafter.

Can we apply this rule both ways? If you think my realtime evidence was so anti-Islam, then please get together with your other muslims and: 1) publicly condemn the violent actions of your 'radical' muslim brothers who are doing this 'in the name of Allah'. 2) have leaders of Islamic countries and 'peaceful' muslims everywhere publicly apologize to non-muslims for blowing up their churches, killing them, terrorising them, etc.

Response: Such a hilarious rebuttal to the trifling verses in your bible. You couldn't refute a thing. Your comments concerning Luke 14:26 is pointless and proves nothing, for the Church Father's comments on the verse are not the actual words of the text. Thus his interpretation is flawed and doesn't disprove the fact that Jesus himself states that one must hate their family to be his disciple. Then in 2 Samuels, when God kills an innocent child just because his father sinned, you actually justify such cruelty! The child did nothing and does not deserve to become sick and die. Your condoning of such cruelty only further demonstrates how sick your Christian religion is. Thanks for the confession. All praise due to Allah for sending his last Prophet, Muhammad, to guide us to the true religion of islam, where true justice and decency is taught, unlike your Christian religion.

Justice and decency? You're delusional. Death is the punishment for apostasy in Islam, and I have seen Islamic Sharia with my own two eyes. Women are treated as second class citizens, at best, and your leaders and spokespeople are the worst type of human beings on the planet. If you believe these things are just and decent, then go blow yourself(perform fellatio).
HatedeatH
Posts: 386
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1/20/2011 5:58:51 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 3:54:21 PM, Mirza wrote:

No, some Muslims are obviously misguided and do horrible things. But not all of those stories are real.

Because they're just false propaganda created by the worldwide jewish conspiracy, right?
vardas0antras: If Muhammad is great then why didn't he stop 911 ?
gavin.ogden: He was too busy starting it.
Fatihah
Posts: 7,742
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1/20/2011 6:00:41 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 5:54:04 PM, gavin.ogden wrote:
At 1/20/2011 5:41:04 PM, Fatihah wrote:
At 1/20/2011 2:42:47 PM, spiritislife wrote:
At 1/20/2011 1:26:43 AM, Fatihah wrote:

Response: None of which is from the qur'an or sunnah, thus it's not the religion of islam. So your point is pointless. :

That is what you say. Thousands of your fellow (so called 'radical') muslims interpret your same book differently. They think they are perfectly justified to go ahead and kill 'infidels' 'in the name of Allah'. It IS the religion of Islam to many muslims, like it or not. It certainly does paint the Quran and Islam in a negative way.

Your bible on the other hand is filled with the most inhumane, immoral, and most gruesome things one can think of. :

Changing the subject, are we? At least, you didn't outright deny these awful incidents that are taking place all over the world by muslims in the name of their religion. I thought you would.

Every single one of your examples from the Bible are completely irelevent to this topic and can all be refuted on their own terms. Plus, they are all your own biased interpretations of what the Bible is actually saying. You did not quote any of the actual texts.

For example, Luke 14:26 does not call us to hate our families. That is ridiculous. Why don;t you open your mind up to learning about what the Christian interpretation of Biblical passages are? The Church Fathers' comment on Lk 14:26 (whose interpretation is unanimously approved by the Church) : "The law of Christ does not allow us to hate even our enemies, much less our parents: but the meaning of the text is, that we must be in that disposition of soul, as to be willing to renounce, and part with every thing, how near or dear soever it may be to us, that would keep us from following Christ. "

You have the story of David all twisted. Yes he sinned. We all do. God forgave him, but also punished him in this life - as He predicted He would. David accepted this scourge, humbled himself, and became even greater than he was before his fall. Babies die. God has the right to take away even the lives of the babies He has created - if he so chooses, and does so everyday. Does this make God cruel? David's baby from the wife of Uria is in paradise.

Btw, I can prove that the God of my Bible sends innocent baby 'non-believers' right to paradise - from verses in the 'cruel' OT. Can you prove the likewise from your Quran? No! They are all going to hell!!! No one is innocent except muslims in your religion.

The difference between this post and yours, nothing of which you stated is in the qur'an or sunnah, thus it does not demonstrate negativity about the religion of islam. :
Oh yes it does. See above.

However, what I've just posted is actually scriptural and found in your bible.:

No it isn;t. Your interpretations. You didn't cite the verses.

And when we consider the number of Christian preachers caught out molesting children and committing mass murder and crimes as well, it is clear that your religion of Christianity is clearly the one with the stench of perverted immorality, not the just religion of peace which is islam.:

If anyone has done this, they have acted contrary to the teAachings and actions of Our Lord Jesus Christ, are not His faithful followers, and should be prosecuted to the fullest extent of the Law - both in this life and in the hereafter.

Can we apply this rule both ways? If you think my realtime evidence was so anti-Islam, then please get together with your other muslims and: 1) publicly condemn the violent actions of your 'radical' muslim brothers who are doing this 'in the name of Allah'. 2) have leaders of Islamic countries and 'peaceful' muslims everywhere publicly apologize to non-muslims for blowing up their churches, killing them, terrorising them, etc.

Response: Such a hilarious rebuttal to the trifling verses in your bible. You couldn't refute a thing. Your comments concerning Luke 14:26 is pointless and proves nothing, for the Church Father's comments on the verse are not the actual words of the text. Thus his interpretation is flawed and doesn't disprove the fact that Jesus himself states that one must hate their family to be his disciple. Then in 2 Samuels, when God kills an innocent child just because his father sinned, you actually justify such cruelty! The child did nothing and does not deserve to become sick and die. Your condoning of such cruelty only further demonstrates how sick your Christian religion is. Thanks for the confession. All praise due to Allah for sending his last Prophet, Muhammad, to guide us to the true religion of islam, where true justice and decency is taught, unlike your Christian religion.

Justice and decency? You're delusional. Death is the punishment for apostasy in Islam, and I have seen Islamic Sharia with my own two eyes. Women are treated as second class citizens, at best, and your leaders and spokespeople are the worst type of human beings on the planet. If you believe these things are just and decent, then go blow yourself(perform fellatio).

Response: Death for Apostates for simply leaving islam and treating women as second class is no where in the qur'an or sunnah, thus it is not apart of islam, nor can you quote otherwise. So it is clearly your delusion and degrading ideology which makes you state otherwise. If you insist on making peace and equality appear unjust, then you are clearly against justice and need to be institutionalized for your lunacy.
HatedeatH
Posts: 386
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1/20/2011 6:03:23 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 6:00:41 PM, Fatihah wrote:

Response: Death for Apostates for simply leaving islam and treating women as second class is no where in the qur'an or sunnah, thus it is not apart of islam, nor can you quote otherwise. So it is clearly your delusion and degrading ideology which makes you state otherwise. If you insist on making peace and equality appear unjust, then you are clearly against justice and need to be institutionalized for your lunacy.

The Qur'an itself says women are one half of a man. Try studying your own scriptures more closely and then don't even get me started on the Hadith...
vardas0antras: If Muhammad is great then why didn't he stop 911 ?
gavin.ogden: He was too busy starting it.
Fatihah
Posts: 7,742
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1/20/2011 6:06:19 PM
Posted: 5 years ago
At 1/20/2011 6:03:23 PM, HatedeatH wrote:
At 1/20/2011 6:00:41 PM, Fatihah wrote:

Response: Death for Apostates for simply leaving islam and treating women as second class is no where in the qur'an or sunnah, thus it is not apart of islam, nor can you quote otherwise. So it is clearly your delusion and degrading ideology which makes you state otherwise. If you insist on making peace and equality appear unjust, then you are clearly against justice and need to be institutionalized for your lunacy.

The Qur'an itself says women are one half of a man. Try studying your own scriptures more closely and then don't even get me started on the Hadith...

Response: No where does the qur'an state such a thing. And go ahead and get started on the Hadith, so I can expose just how trifling your ideology is as soon as possible.