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Atheist prophecy

Skeptical1
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11/29/2016 9:15:39 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
Prophecy is often used by the Church to try and convince us of the supernatural claims of religion. The problem with Biblical prophecy is that it is so incredibly vague, and open to dispute. For example, there are so many interpretations of the "whore of Babylon", described in Revelation 17, it's not funny. She has been variously identified as the Roman Catholic Church, the Roman Empire, Jerusalem, an evil world system which arises during the end times, and anything other than the Jehovah's Witness religion. Similarly, the thousand-year reign of Christ described in Revelation 20 may or may not be literal, and may have begun 2000 years ago, or not yet have happened - depending on whose interpretation you believe.

A week or so ago, I came across a poem written by Erasmus Darwin, the grandfather of Charles. It caught my eye, because it describes in vivid detail the city of my birth. The interesting thing about this poem is it was penned one year after the colonisation of my country by the British, when the European population of the land was 1,500, most of whom would have been living in tents. It is an astonishing piece of prophecy by someone describing the future state of a place he had never been to. For anyone who might be interested, you can find the full text here:

https://neil2decade.wordpress.com...

Referring to Hope as "Truth's prophetic word", Darwin describes:

- broad streets
- canals and solid roads, expanding from cities through cultured land
- Farms waving with gold (canola and wheat)
- orchards
- tall spires (Centrepoint tower) and dome-capped towers (Queen Victoria Building)
- piers and quays (Circular Quay, of course, and Darling Harbour)

not to mention the cherry on top:

There the proud arch, colossus-like, bestride
Yon glittering streams, and bound the chasing tide

How could Darwin possibly have foreseen the Sydney Harbour Bridge over 140 years before it would open?

So I'd like to suggest that we all forget looking for meaning in vague, non-specific predictions like the suppoed destruction of the temple by Jesus only some 40 years after his death, and embrace atheism, since twp Darwins have conclusively proven its superiority over Christian explanations of the past - and the future.
MasonicSlayer
Posts: 2,300
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11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.
janesix
Posts: 3,460
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11/29/2016 10:59:42 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.
The age of Jesus, which is the age of pisces, is ending. Perhaps the age of aquarius is the age of man.
MasonicSlayer
Posts: 2,300
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11/29/2016 11:08:06 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/29/2016 10:59:42 PM, janesix wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.
The age of Jesus, which is the age of pisces, is ending. Perhaps the age of aquarius is the age of man.

What makes you think the age of Jesus has ended?
janesix
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11/29/2016 11:12:28 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/29/2016 11:08:06 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:59:42 PM, janesix wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.
The age of Jesus, which is the age of pisces, is ending. Perhaps the age of aquarius is the age of man.

What makes you think the age of Jesus has ended?

I didnt say it has ended. I said it is ending. This is the kali yuga, the winter of the precession of the equinoxes. When man is the least spiritual. Do you agree these are dark times?
Jovian
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11/29/2016 11:13:38 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.

Biblical prophecies are jokes. Totally obvious predictions like "There will be wars". Don't you think the authors made the most obvious predictions they could?
MasonicSlayer
Posts: 2,300
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11/29/2016 11:19:08 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/29/2016 11:12:28 PM, janesix wrote:
At 11/29/2016 11:08:06 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:59:42 PM, janesix wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.
The age of Jesus, which is the age of pisces, is ending. Perhaps the age of aquarius is the age of man.

What makes you think the age of Jesus has ended?

I didnt say it has ended. I said it is ending. This is the kali yuga, the winter of the precession of the equinoxes. When man is the least spiritual. Do you agree these are dark times?

I do agree these are dark times. I'm not sure if this means the age of Jesus has almost concluded. Maybe it hasn't yet to re are angles to consider. The Bible says this world is run by Satan. The Bible says Jesus will return with the first return being a forgery of Jesus. I have evidence of this perhaps. I have seen a cross painted in the sky that was done to get my attention and likely others because no way would they have done this just for me.
MasonicSlayer
Posts: 2,300
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11/29/2016 11:28:12 PM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/29/2016 11:13:38 PM, Jovian wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.

Biblical prophecies are jokes. Totally obvious predictions like "There will be wars". Don't you think the authors made the most obvious predictions they could?

I believe these to be very specific predictions if you do some homework.
MasonicSlayer
Posts: 2,300
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11/30/2016 12:32:03 AM
Posted: 6 days ago
Late June of this year I saw a white cross painted over the sky that centered on the direction of the moon. The geometry was an impeccable display within its magnificent discipline. The cross and its position were perfect. I would have missed such a phantasmal site to imagine had my attention not been taken by a squawking bird in the woods behind the canal in my backyard. The relentless annoyance of this bird wouldn't keep quiet. I was trying to sleep. On a normal day or night, the sounds of nature compliment a drowsy mentality in need of rest. The games from the week had worn me out. Who's good and who's bad had been the incessant seizures of thoughts to each day for the past year. My contemplations were trodden to the brink of collapse that night. I needed sleep and this bird wouldn't shut up. So I go outside to see what the ruckus was about. That's when I saw it. I was mesmerized by its perfection. It was like an angel had decided to use the sky for a canvas. Or maybe it was just a high-tech chemtrail masquerading as divine intervention. Who's good and who's bad? The quest continues. The Bible says there will be a false Jesus before the return of the one true Lord. The noise of the bird didn't not appear real. I heard footprints stomping in the woods. The fake bird calls could perhaps have been manufactured. Each time making an attempt to go back into the house after staring upwards at the full moon cross, the bird calls would resume. If somebody is going through great lengths to deceive me, my question is why?
janesix
Posts: 3,460
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11/30/2016 12:46:35 AM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/30/2016 12:32:03 AM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
Late June of this year I saw a white cross painted over the sky that centered on the direction of the moon. The geometry was an impeccable display within its magnificent discipline. The cross and its position were perfect. I would have missed such a phantasmal site to imagine had my attention not been taken by a squawking bird in the woods behind the canal in my backyard. The relentless annoyance of this bird wouldn't keep quiet. I was trying to sleep. On a normal day or night, the sounds of nature compliment a drowsy mentality in need of rest. The games from the week had worn me out. Who's good and who's bad had been the incessant seizures of thoughts to each day for the past year. My contemplations were trodden to the brink of collapse that night. I needed sleep and this bird wouldn't shut up. So I go outside to see what the ruckus was about. That's when I saw it. I was mesmerized by its perfection. It was like an angel had decided to use the sky for a canvas. Or maybe it was just a high-tech chemtrail masquerading as divine intervention. Who's good and who's bad? The quest continues. The Bible says there will be a false Jesus before the return of the one true Lord. The noise of the bird didn't not appear real. I heard footprints stomping in the woods. The fake bird calls could perhaps have been manufactured. Each time making an attempt to go back into the house after staring upwards at the full moon cross, the bird calls would resume. If somebody is going through great lengths to deceive me, my question is why?
I dont know, but sometimes i feel the same way.
MasonicSlayer
Posts: 2,300
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11/30/2016 1:25:08 AM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/30/2016 12:46:35 AM, janesix wrote:
At 11/30/2016 12:32:03 AM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
Late June of this year I saw a white cross painted over the sky that centered on the direction of the moon. The geometry was an impeccable display within its magnificent discipline. The cross and its position were perfect. I would have missed such a phantasmal site to imagine had my attention not been taken by a squawking bird in the woods behind the canal in my backyard. The relentless annoyance of this bird wouldn't keep quiet. I was trying to sleep. On a normal day or night, the sounds of nature compliment a drowsy mentality in need of rest. The games from the week had worn me out. Who's good and who's bad had been the incessant seizures of thoughts to each day for the past year. My contemplations were trodden to the brink of collapse that night. I needed sleep and this bird wouldn't shut up. So I go outside to see what the ruckus was about. That's when I saw it. I was mesmerized by its perfection. It was like an angel had decided to use the sky for a canvas. Or maybe it was just a high-tech chemtrail masquerading as divine intervention. Who's good and who's bad? The quest continues. The Bible says there will be a false Jesus before the return of the one true Lord. The noise of the bird didn't not appear real. I heard footprints stomping in the woods. The fake bird calls could perhaps have been manufactured. Each time making an attempt to go back into the house after staring upwards at the full moon cross, the bird calls would resume. If somebody is going through great lengths to deceive me, my question is why?
I dont know, but sometimes i feel the same way.

I don't know about you, but I know the people messing with me. I have access to them. I used to work with one of them. We've worked together for years. I know His who,e family. He said something to once that still resonates to this day. It was the day I accused him of trying to set me up. I asked him why he was trying to set me up and his response was, " because you talk a lot of Shiit". He was referring to the openness of my stories posted here and there, I assume. Because I never discussed much the metaphysical experiences of mine with him. Yet one day, the day before the big day that initiated, to my account the official begining of the gauntlet of games, he came over to my place with a mutual acquaintance. They both for no reason said something to me. They said, " you know you're not the only one who has had profound experiences". Well that's strange because I never told them about my experiences. They told me visions are important. That's funny. I've had several visions never discussed with anyone. So the next day the games began. Better stated, the next day was the last day of the first phase. That's how I see it. They had kept me awake for seven days. Seven days with no sleep with maybe one or two meals, and my counciousness was more attentive than ever. My vocabulary was well oiled while my remembrance to intricate memories far back as a child was clear as ever. It's almost like we ingested something particular to activate greater use of our brains. Not like now. My mind has become foggy compared to the levels exceeded that week. I can barely remember what I was talking about. Right. I talk a lot of Shiite. Yep.
janesix
Posts: 3,460
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11/30/2016 1:29:58 AM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/30/2016 1:25:08 AM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
At 11/30/2016 12:46:35 AM, janesix wrote:
At 11/30/2016 12:32:03 AM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
Late June of this year I saw a white cross painted over the sky that centered on the direction of the moon. The geometry was an impeccable display within its magnificent discipline. The cross and its position were perfect. I would have missed such a phantasmal site to imagine had my attention not been taken by a squawking bird in the woods behind the canal in my backyard. The relentless annoyance of this bird wouldn't keep quiet. I was trying to sleep. On a normal day or night, the sounds of nature compliment a drowsy mentality in need of rest. The games from the week had worn me out. Who's good and who's bad had been the incessant seizures of thoughts to each day for the past year. My contemplations were trodden to the brink of collapse that night. I needed sleep and this bird wouldn't shut up. So I go outside to see what the ruckus was about. That's when I saw it. I was mesmerized by its perfection. It was like an angel had decided to use the sky for a canvas. Or maybe it was just a high-tech chemtrail masquerading as divine intervention. Who's good and who's bad? The quest continues. The Bible says there will be a false Jesus before the return of the one true Lord. The noise of the bird didn't not appear real. I heard footprints stomping in the woods. The fake bird calls could perhaps have been manufactured. Each time making an attempt to go back into the house after staring upwards at the full moon cross, the bird calls would resume. If somebody is going through great lengths to deceive me, my question is why?
I dont know, but sometimes i feel the same way.

I don't know about you, but I know the people messing with me. I have access to them. I used to work with one of them. We've worked together for years. I know His who,e family. He said something to once that still resonates to this day. It was the day I accused him of trying to set me up. I asked him why he was trying to set me up and his response was, " because you talk a lot of Shiit". He was referring to the openness of my stories posted here and there, I assume. Because I never discussed much the metaphysical experiences of mine with him. Yet one day, the day before the big day that initiated, to my account the official begining of the gauntlet of games, he came over to my place with a mutual acquaintance. They both for no reason said something to me. They said, " you know you're not the only one who has had profound experiences". Well that's strange because I never told them about my experiences. They told me visions are important. That's funny. I've had several visions never discussed with anyone. So the next day the games began. Better stated, the next day was the last day of the first phase. That's how I see it. They had kept me awake for seven days. Seven days with no sleep with maybe one or two meals, and my counciousness was more attentive than ever. My vocabulary was well oiled while my remembrance to intricate memories far back as a child was clear as ever. It's almost like we ingested something particular to activate greater use of our brains. Not like now. My mind has become foggy compared to the levels exceeded that week. I can barely remember what I was talking about. Right. I talk a lot of Shiite. Yep.
How did they keep you awake?
MasonicSlayer
Posts: 2,300
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11/30/2016 2:03:52 AM
Posted: 6 days ago
At 11/30/2016 1:29:58 AM, janesix wrote:
At 11/30/2016 1:25:08 AM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
At 11/30/2016 12:46:35 AM, janesix wrote:
At 11/30/2016 12:32:03 AM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
Late June of this year I saw a white cross painted over the sky that centered on the direction of the moon. The geometry was an impeccable display within its magnificent discipline. The cross and its position were perfect. I would have missed such a phantasmal site to imagine had my attention not been taken by a squawking bird in the woods behind the canal in my backyard. The relentless annoyance of this bird wouldn't keep quiet. I was trying to sleep. On a normal day or night, the sounds of nature compliment a drowsy mentality in need of rest. The games from the week had worn me out. Who's good and who's bad had been the incessant seizures of thoughts to each day for the past year. My contemplations were trodden to the brink of collapse that night. I needed sleep and this bird wouldn't shut up. So I go outside to see what the ruckus was about. That's when I saw it. I was mesmerized by its perfection. It was like an angel had decided to use the sky for a canvas. Or maybe it was just a high-tech chemtrail masquerading as divine intervention. Who's good and who's bad? The quest continues. The Bible says there will be a false Jesus before the return of the one true Lord. The noise of the bird didn't not appear real. I heard footprints stomping in the woods. The fake bird calls could perhaps have been manufactured. Each time making an attempt to go back into the house after staring upwards at the full moon cross, the bird calls would resume. If somebody is going through great lengths to deceive me, my question is why?
I dont know, but sometimes i feel the same way.

I don't know about you, but I know the people messing with me. I have access to them. I used to work with one of them. We've worked together for years. I know His who,e family. He said something to once that still resonates to this day. It was the day I accused him of trying to set me up. I asked him why he was trying to set me up and his response was, " because you talk a lot of Shiit". He was referring to the openness of my stories posted here and there, I assume. Because I never discussed much the metaphysical experiences of mine with him. Yet one day, the day before the big day that initiated, to my account the official begining of the gauntlet of games, he came over to my place with a mutual acquaintance. They both for no reason said something to me. They said, " you know you're not the only one who has had profound experiences". Well that's strange because I never told them about my experiences. They told me visions are important. That's funny. I've had several visions never discussed with anyone. So the next day the games began. Better stated, the next day was the last day of the first phase. That's how I see it. They had kept me awake for seven days. Seven days with no sleep with maybe one or two meals, and my counciousness was more attentive than ever. My vocabulary was well oiled while my remembrance to intricate memories far back as a child was clear as ever. It's almost like we ingested something particular to activate greater use of our brains. Not like now. My mind has become foggy compared to the levels exceeded that week. I can barely remember what I was talking about. Right. I talk a lot of Shiite. Yep.
How did they keep you awake?

It's hard to say. I'm not sure what they gave me. The first day was me and my friend from working riding around without much to do. We were on our way to a friend of mine whom I had met from dating the sister of the guy riding with me. He takes a phone call and asked if I could do a favor for the person on the phone. That was a crazy day. I told my friend to tell the people on the phone I would help them acquire what they were looking for. They were looking to stay awake. So we pick them up and we all go over to my friends house. When I got to my friends house I noticed a car blocking the driveway. There was an elderly couple standing outside the car, minding their own business. They looked familiar. They appeared to be the exact same couple that had been following me closely for weeks. I know this because I tried to lose them. I'd walk into a mall and there they would be, following me into every store, even if I left the store to return back to the same place within minutes. So now I see them at my friends house. I leave everybody in the car to walk alone inside. I'm told by my friends personal mechanic that these are the parents of my friend. Whatever. My friends need something to stay awake so I can't stay long. I tried to get in and out but a girl inside was making a big fuss about something so I spent twenty minutes trying to call her down. I never seen her so furious. She was mad that I was not there to see her but to see my friend who owns the re are layers to that story that are tied in, but I gotta get out. My friend outside are waiting for me. I say high and by to my friend while asking him if he had something to keep my company awake. He gives me something. I give it to the people I've never met sitting inside my backseat. They then gave me something different in return. They never told me they had something to keep them awake. I only know they had something different because they offered me some of what I had just given them. They wanted me to think it came from what was given to them. This stuff was different. This stuff opened my mind in a way I've never experienced. I could remember things I've long forgotten. I stayed up for seven days after that moment. The final day was the day my dog was given to me. When I came home with my dog and four cats, a neighbor was standing outside across the pond. She shined a green light on me to get my attention. I looked up at her standing on her balcony, and she managed to somehow create a shadow of a bull on the wall behind her. All bulls hit aside, I don't know what exactly it was that I had ingested.
MasonicSlayer
Posts: 2,300
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11/30/2016 2:28:01 AM
Posted: 6 days ago
The whole theme of my past year was centered around who is good and who is bad. They told me visions are important. The visions were references to dreams. Not just any dream, but a dream that articulates itself moreso than others. I've had several of them dating back a few years. Each dream complied with the theme for the year. It involved Freemasons, the Holy Spirit, and potential insanity. An interesting mix for sure. It's almost like someone had created an astral inception of thought to appear as an original thought to the dreamer. People tend to readily believe the things they think are original ideas, rather than an idea being forced upon them. Forced ideas get rejected. Original ideas become accepted.
PGA
Posts: 4,045
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12/1/2016 8:16:53 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 11/29/2016 9:15:39 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Prophecy is often used by the Church to try and convince us of the supernatural claims of religion. The problem with Biblical prophecy is that it is so incredibly vague, and open to dispute. For example, there are so many interpretations of the "whore of Babylon", described in Revelation 17, it's not funny. She has been variously identified as the Roman Catholic Church, the Roman Empire, Jerusalem, an evil world system which arises during the end times, and anything other than the Jehovah's Witness religion. Similarly, the thousand-year reign of Christ described in Revelation 20 may or may not be literal, and may have begun 2000 years ago, or not yet have happened - depending on whose interpretation you believe.

The problem with most biblical interpretations is what is read into the text, not what the text reveals. People read into it things it does not disclose and build in an artificial timeline that ignores the language and they add another audience other than the one being addressed. For instance, Revelation is Jesus' address to John and his contempoaries "to show to His bond-servants (believers) the things which must soon take place." The things revealed are going to happen shortly. The relevant audience is a 1st-century audience. " John, to the seven churches that are in [the province of] Asia." John is addressing seven churches that stood then. The prophecy is largely concerned with judgment on the nation of Israel as laid out in Deuteronomy 28 and Leviticus 26 concerning covenant sanctions or curses for disobedience by the people of that covenant. The prophecies time and again are very specifically referring to this judgment on Jerusalem. There are references to the Roman Caesar's, five which have fallen, one who is (Nero) and one to come. The city in question in Revelation can be none other than Jerusalem and you can't argue against this without being very dishonest with the text and totally illogical to what the author reveals about this city and its inhabitants. There is imagery that applies most specifically to the OT and OT economy. There are around 289 references or quotes from the OT in this one book which shows what judgment John was writing about. It has been argued most effectively that Revelation is John's account of Matthew 24 (The Olivet Discourse). When you take into consideration the 300 specific prophecies about the Messiah Darwin's vague poem offers no comparison. Even if you could prove that he was writing about the Sydney Bridge, it could very easily be explained by someone who read his poem and said to himself, "I have just the structure in mind" and built it because the poem inspired him. I don't think you can even go that far because I see it being very vague.

A week or so ago, I came across a poem written by Erasmus Darwin, the grandfather of Charles. It caught my eye, because it describes in vivid detail the city of my birth. The interesting thing about this poem is it was penned one year after the colonisation of my country by the British, when the European population of the land was 1,500, most of whom would have been living in tents. It is an astonishing piece of prophecy by someone describing the future state of a place he had never been to. For anyone who might be interested, you can find the full text here:

Referring to Hope as "Truth's prophetic word", Darwin describes:

- broad streets
- canals and solid roads, expanding from cities through cultured land
- Farms waving with gold (canola and wheat)
- orchards
- tall spires (Centrepoint tower) and dome-capped towers (Queen Victoria Building)
- piers and quays (Circular Quay, of course, and Darling Harbour)

not to mention the cherry on top:

There the proud arch, colossus-like, bestride
Yon glittering streams, and bound the chasing tide

How could Darwin possibly have foreseen the Sydney Harbour Bridge over 140 years before it would open?

Again, the poem is very vague. Someone may have been inspiried by it and had a vision based on the poem if it even means what you think it does, which I doubt. Biblical prophecy is very indepth and focused on specific events and people and time lines. The fulfillment of the 300 Messianic prophesies are astronomical odds, and they can only apply to one Person in history regarding His birth, lineage, death and resurrection as well as details regarding His ministry. After A.D. 70 it can apply to no one else. On top of this you have a unity in the Bible that most unbelievers miss completely. Every OT and NT book focuses on the Lord Jesus Christ. The OT contains many typologies and pictures of Him that can be easily demonstrated. Not only this but there is also a message in the Bible that produces hope and changes lives, and it has done so since the Messiah became man and walked this earth.

So I'd like to suggest that we all forget looking for meaning in vague, non-specific predictions like the suppoed destruction of the temple by Jesus only some 40 years after his death, and embrace atheism, since twp Darwins have conclusively proven its superiority over Christian explanations of the past - and the future.

...Time"s opening scenes, and Truth"s prophetic word.
There shall broad streets their stately walls extend,
The circus widen, and the crescent bend;
There, rayed from cities o"er the cultured land,
Shall bright canals, and solid roads expand.
There the proud arch, colossus-like, bestride
Yon glittering streams, and bound the chasing tide;
Embellished villas crown the landscape-scene,
Farms wave with gold, and orchards blush between.
There shall tall spires, and dome-capped towers ascend,
And piers and quays their massy structures blend;
While with each breeze approaching vessels glide,
And northern treasures dance on every tide!"
Then ceased the nymph " tumultuous echoes roar,
And Joy"s loud voice was heard from shore to shore "
Her graceful steps descending pressed the plain,
And Peace, and Art, and Labour, joined her train.
Erasmus Darwin


Peter
Gentorev
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12/1/2016 8:46:34 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 11/29/2016 11:12:28 PM, janesix wrote:
At 11/29/2016 11:08:06 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:59:42 PM, janesix wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.
The age of Jesus, which is the age of pisces, is ending. Perhaps the age of aquarius is the age of man.

What makes you think the age of Jesus has ended?

I didnt say it has ended. I said it is ending. This is the kali yuga, the winter of the precession of the equinoxes. When man is the least spiritual. Do you agree these are dark times?

Kalki or Kalkin, who is yet to appear at the close of the fourth or Kalki age, when the world has become wholly depraved, for the final destruction of the wicked, for the re-establishment of righteousness upon the earth, and a renovation of all creation with the return to a new age of purity (satya-yuga). According to some, he (Vishnu) will be revealed in the sky seated on a white horse, with a drawn sword in his hand, blazing like a comet. Mon Williams, 'Indian Wisdom. p. 335.

Very similar to biblical prophecy.

While we are on the subject of prophecy, here is one of mine.

In dream I saw the heavens ablaze with balls of fire
Huge hailstones that were burning and streaking down the skies
The earth was clothed in purples, dark orange, and deep blue
Like a swaddling cloth surrounding us that hid the stars from veiw
Dark clouds rose from the mountain peaks, earth's veins were opened wide
Through which her inner blood spewed forth in streams of living fire
Whole continents, they heaved and tossed, waves rippled through the ground
In all the earth, no hiding place of safety could be found
The oceans boiled, they foamed and rose destroying cities on their shores
All the river dams were busted, valley towns were seen no more
The power stations of the earth--all were melted down
A few survivors of the human race were all that could be found
And then I saw the winter, a winter so severe
It lasted not a few short months, but many, many, years
And the women who were pregnant, Ahh, the children that they bore
Grotesque and hideous malformations, I pray to see that sight no more
Then when the winter lifted and the crops began to grow
A strange and eerie world emerged from the destruction and the snow
A world with neither day nor night where rainbows couldn't form
In the atmosphere above the earth, and yet the air was strangely warm
A thousand years of twilight and through that swaddling band on high
Three blood red giants were blazing through a hazed and orange sky
The sun and moon had turned to blood, but far brighter than the moon
Was Jupiter, that heavenly light, which in time would spell man's doom....By Gentorev.
Skeptical1
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12/1/2016 9:12:05 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 12/1/2016 8:46:34 PM, Gentorev wrote:
At 11/29/2016 11:12:28 PM, janesix wrote:
At 11/29/2016 11:08:06 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:59:42 PM, janesix wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.
The age of Jesus, which is the age of pisces, is ending. Perhaps the age of aquarius is the age of man.

What makes you think the age of Jesus has ended?

I didnt say it has ended. I said it is ending. This is the kali yuga, the winter of the precession of the equinoxes. When man is the least spiritual. Do you agree these are dark times?

Kalki or Kalkin, who is yet to appear at the close of the fourth or Kalki age, when the world has become wholly depraved, for the final destruction of the wicked, for the re-establishment of righteousness upon the earth, and a renovation of all creation with the return to a new age of purity (satya-yuga). According to some, he (Vishnu) will be revealed in the sky seated on a white horse, with a drawn sword in his hand, blazing like a comet. Mon Williams, 'Indian Wisdom. p. 335.

Very similar to biblical prophecy.

While we are on the subject of prophecy, here is one of mine.

In dream I saw the heavens ablaze with balls of fire
Huge hailstones that were burning and streaking down the skies
The earth was clothed in purples, dark orange, and deep blue
Like a swaddling cloth surrounding us that hid the stars from veiw
Dark clouds rose from the mountain peaks, earth's veins were opened wide
Through which her inner blood spewed forth in streams of living fire
Whole continents, they heaved and tossed, waves rippled through the ground
In all the earth, no hiding place of safety could be found
The oceans boiled, they foamed and rose destroying cities on their shores
All the river dams were busted, valley towns were seen no more
The power stations of the earth--all were melted down
A few survivors of the human race were all that could be found
And then I saw the winter, a winter so severe
It lasted not a few short months, but many, many, years
And the women who were pregnant, Ahh, the children that they bore
Grotesque and hideous malformations, I pray to see that sight no more
Then when the winter lifted and the crops began to grow
A strange and eerie world emerged from the destruction and the snow
A world with neither day nor night where rainbows couldn't form
In the atmosphere above the earth, and yet the air was strangely warm
A thousand years of twilight and through that swaddling band on high
Three blood red giants were blazing through a hazed and orange sky
The sun and moon had turned to blood, but far brighter than the moon
Was Jupiter, that heavenly light, which in time would spell man's doom....By Gentorev.

That's actually very good.
Skeptical1
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12/1/2016 9:31:37 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 12/1/2016 8:16:53 PM, PGA wrote:
At 11/29/2016 9:15:39 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Prophecy is often used by the Church to try and convince us of the supernatural claims of religion. The problem with Biblical prophecy is that it is so incredibly vague, and open to dispute. For example, there are so many interpretations of the "whore of Babylon", described in Revelation 17, it's not funny. She has been variously identified as the Roman Catholic Church, the Roman Empire, Jerusalem, an evil world system which arises during the end times, and anything other than the Jehovah's Witness religion. Similarly, the thousand-year reign of Christ described in Revelation 20 may or may not be literal, and may have begun 2000 years ago, or not yet have happened - depending on whose interpretation you believe.

The problem with most biblical interpretations is what is read into the text, not what the text reveals. People read into it things it does not disclose and build in an artificial timeline that ignores the language and they add another audience other than the one being addressed. For instance, Revelation is Jesus' address to John and his contempoaries "to show to His bond-servants (believers) the things which must soon take place." The things revealed are going to happen shortly. The relevant audience is a 1st-century audience. " John, to the seven churches that are in [the province of] Asia." John is addressing seven churches that stood then. The prophecy is largely concerned with judgment on the nation of Israel as laid out in Deuteronomy 28 and Leviticus 26 concerning covenant sanctions or curses for disobedience by the people of that covenant. The prophecies time and again are very specifically referring to this judgment on Jerusalem. There are references to the Roman Caesar's, five which have fallen, one who is (Nero) and one to come. The city in question in Revelation can be none other than Jerusalem and you can't argue against this without being very dishonest with the text and totally illogical to what the author reveals about this city and its inhabitants. There is imagery that applies most specifically to the OT and OT economy. There are around 289 references or quotes from the OT in this one book which shows what judgment John was writing about. It has been argued most effectively that Revelation is John's account of Matthew 24 (The Olivet Discourse). When you take into consideration the 300 specific prophecies about the Messiah Darwin's vague poem offers no comparison. Even if you could prove that he was writing about the Sydney Bridge, it could very easily be explained by someone who read his poem and said to himself, "I have just the structure in mind" and built it because the poem inspired him. I don't think you can even go that far because I see it being very vague.

You mean like perhaps some people could be looking for a messiah, and someone (perhaps John the Baptist) thinks "I have just the man in mind"?


A week or so ago, I came across a poem written by Erasmus Darwin, the grandfather of Charles. It caught my eye, because it describes in vivid detail the city of my birth. The interesting thing about this poem is it was penned one year after the colonisation of my country by the British, when the European population of the land was 1,500, most of whom would have been living in tents. It is an astonishing piece of prophecy by someone describing the future state of a place he had never been to. For anyone who might be interested, you can find the full text here:

Referring to Hope as "Truth's prophetic word", Darwin describes:

- broad streets
- canals and solid roads, expanding from cities through cultured land
- Farms waving with gold (canola and wheat)
- orchards
- tall spires (Centrepoint tower) and dome-capped towers (Queen Victoria Building)
- piers and quays (Circular Quay, of course, and Darling Harbour)

not to mention the cherry on top:

There the proud arch, colossus-like, bestride
Yon glittering streams, and bound the chasing tide

How could Darwin possibly have foreseen the Sydney Harbour Bridge over 140 years before it would open?

Again, the poem is very vague. Someone may have been inspiried by it and had a vision based on the poem if it even means what you think it does, which I doubt. Biblical prophecy is very indepth and focused on specific events and people and time lines. The fulfillment of the 300 Messianic prophesies are astronomical odds, and they can only apply to one Person in history regarding His birth, lineage, death and resurrection as well as details regarding His ministry. After A.D. 70 it can apply to no one else. On top of this you have a unity in the Bible that most unbelievers miss completely. Every OT and NT book focuses on the Lord Jesus Christ. The OT contains many typologies and pictures of Him that can be easily demonstrated. Not only this but there is also a message in the Bible that produces hope and changes lives, and it has done so since the Messiah became man and walked this earth.

So I'd like to suggest that we all forget looking for meaning in vague, non-specific predictions like the suppoed destruction of the temple by Jesus only some 40 years after his death, and embrace atheism, since twp Darwins have conclusively proven its superiority over Christian explanations of the past - and the future.




Peter

You keep saying Darwin's poem is vague. You seem to like making statements like that about any belief opposed to your own. I've listed parts that are certainly a lot more specific than most biblical prophecy. Which, by the way is so clear and specific that absolutely no two factions of Christianity appear to be able to agree on almost anything with regard to it. Even within denominations there is no agreement. I guess that's the problem with not saying what you mean. Perhaps the prophets should have been more careful.

Of course, most of the early church writers appear to think Revelation was written in AD 90 or so, which would make its "prediction" of the destruction of the temple in AD 70 not quite the difficult feat it might appear. Shame none of the associated predictions in Rev 20 actually happened, kind of messes up that theory.

For that matter, could not exactly the same "implantation" idea you use to make little of Darwin's prediction apply to the Jewish revolt leading to the destruction of the temple?

Anyway, it's not my aim to argue biblical prophecy with you. It's all nonsense for one very simple reason - fortune telling is not real. For the same reason, I'm obviously not suggesting Erasmus Darwin had the gift of prognostication. Presumably, he heard about the settlement of a new land, and applied what he knew about civilisations to describe his vision of what it might be like. He happened to have the good fortune to hit the nail on the head with uncanny accuracy - although where he got the idea of the arched bridge is anyone's guess, they weren't exactly common back in his location in spacetime.
keithprosser
Posts: 1,991
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12/1/2016 9:51:57 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
I just noticed the bit about canals. I think he overstated that a bit. Sydney is a wonderful city, but it's not exactly Venice of the southern hemisphere! :)

Of course canals were the main form of long-distance industrial transport in Erasmus' day - he lived a good generation or so before the age of the railways. A lot of future-guessing is taking what is happening now and then assuming more of the same.
Skeptical1
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12/1/2016 10:18:14 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 12/1/2016 9:51:57 PM, keithprosser wrote:
I just noticed the bit about canals. I think he overstated that a bit. Sydney is a wonderful city, but it's not exactly Venice of the southern hemisphere! :)

Of course canals were the main form of long-distance industrial transport in Erasmus' day - he lived a good generation or so before the age of the railways. A lot of future-guessing is taking what is happening now and then assuming more of the same.

Sydney is definitely not Venice, but it does have a fairly extensive canal system - not in the CBD, but throughout the suburbs - for storm water run off. The canal at the end of my street was the most frequented playground when I was a child, and my dog loved it. We'd trek along it for miles, when it wasn't full, of course.
inferno
Posts: 10,612
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12/1/2016 10:19:58 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.

They do Mason. My latest thread in Debate.org makes it clear. The Mark Of The Beast is real. Anybody who denys this truth is headed for destruction.
keithprosser
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12/2/2016 3:43:12 AM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 12/1/2016 10:18:14 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Sydney is definitely not Venice, but it does have a fairly extensive canal system - not in the CBD, but throughout the suburbs - for storm water run off. The canal at the end of my street was the most frequented playground when I was a child, and my dog loved it. We'd trek along it for miles, when it wasn't full, of course.

Actually, I suppose Erasmus would have been imagining wide canals crossing the continent connecting to distant cities and carrying vast quantities of trade goods rather than antipodean gondoliers overcharging honeymooners for quick punt on some stagnant water as in Venice.
Skeptical1
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12/2/2016 5:00:15 AM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 12/2/2016 3:43:12 AM, keithprosser wrote:
At 12/1/2016 10:18:14 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Sydney is definitely not Venice, but it does have a fairly extensive canal system - not in the CBD, but throughout the suburbs - for storm water run off. The canal at the end of my street was the most frequented playground when I was a child, and my dog loved it. We'd trek along it for miles, when it wasn't full, of course.

Actually, I suppose Erasmus would have been imagining wide canals crossing the continent connecting to distant cities and carrying vast quantities of trade goods rather than antipodean gondoliers overcharging honeymooners for quick punt on some stagnant water as in Venice.

Ah, the very mention of Venice and gondolas. Reminds me of the greatest travelogue ever made - 12 1/2 minutes of sheer breathtakingly amazing wonder:

https://www.youtube.com...
PGA
Posts: 4,045
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12/2/2016 5:50:23 AM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 12/1/2016 9:31:37 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
At 12/1/2016 8:16:53 PM, PGA wrote:
At 11/29/2016 9:15:39 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
The problem with most biblical interpretations is what is read into the text, not what the text reveals. People read into it things it does not disclose and build in an artificial timeline that ignores the language and they add another audience other than the one being addressed. For instance, Revelation is Jesus' address to John and his contemporaries "to show to His bond-servants (believers) the things which must soon take place." The things revealed are going to happen shortly. The relevant audience is a 1st-century audience. " John, to the seven churches that are in [the province of] Asia." John is addressing seven churches that stood then. The prophecy is largely concerned with judgment on the nation of Israel as laid out in Deuteronomy 28 and Leviticus 26 concerning covenant sanctions or curses for disobedience by the people of that covenant. The prophecies time and again are very specifically referring to this judgment on Jerusalem. There are references to the Roman Caesar's, five which have fallen, one who is (Nero) and one to come. The city in question in Revelation can be none other than Jerusalem and you can't argue against this without being very dishonest with the text and totally illogical to what the author reveals about this city and its inhabitants. There is imagery that applies most specifically to the OT and OT economy. There are around 289 references or quotes from the OT in this one book which shows what judgment John was writing about. It has been argued most effectively that Revelation is John's account of Matthew 24 (The Olivet Discourse). When you take into consideration the 300 specific prophecies about the Messiah Darwin's vague poem offers no comparison. Even if you could prove that he was writing about the Sydney Bridge, it could very easily be explained by someone who read his poem and said to himself, "I have just the structure in mind" and built it because the poem inspired him. I don't think you can even go that far because I see it being very vague.

You mean like perhaps some people could be looking for a messiah, and someone (perhaps John the Baptist) thinks "I have just the man in mind"?

No, I mean that yes they were looking for the Messiah and as prophesied John the Baptist prophesied about Him then He appeared to this OT people as prophesied.

Referring to Hope as "Truth's prophetic word", Darwin describes:

- broad streets
- canals and solid roads, expanding from cities through cultured land
- Farms waving with gold (canola and wheat)
- orchards
- tall spires (Centrepoint tower) and dome-capped towers (Queen Victoria Building)
- piers and quays (Circular Quay, of course, and Darling Harbour)
There the proud arch, colossus-like, bestride
Yon glittering streams, and bound the chasing tide

How could Darwin possibly have foreseen the Sydney Harbour Bridge over 140 years before it would open?

Again, the poem is very vague. Someone may have been inspired by it and had a vision based on the poem if it even means what you think it does, which I doubt. Biblical prophecy is very in-depth and focused on specific events and people and timelines. The fulfillment of the 300 Messianic prophesies are astronomical odds, and they can only apply to one Person in history regarding His birth, lineage, death and resurrection as well as details regarding His ministry. After A.D. 70 it can apply to no one else. On top of this, you have a unity in the Bible that most unbelievers miss completely. Every OT and NT book focus on the Lord Jesus Christ. The OT contains many typologies and pictures of Him that can be easily demonstrated. Not only this but there is also a message in the Bible that produces hope and changes lives, and it has done so since the Messiah became man and walked this earth.

You keep saying Darwin's poem is vague. You seem to like making statements like that about any belief opposed to your own. I've listed parts that are certainly a lot more specific than most biblical prophecy.

His poem is vague. You can read into it all kinds of different scenarios. As I mentioned, there are around 300 specific prophecies in the OT that focus in on only one Person, no other. Then there is the constant theme of warnings and apocalyptic language regarding OT Israel and Jerusalem.

You are absolutely wrong about biblical prophecy and this just shows how little you know what you are talking about.

[Prophecy]Which, by the way is so clear and specific that absolutely no two factions of Christianity appear to be able to agree on almost anything with regard to it. Even within denominations there is no agreement. I guess that's the problem with not saying what you mean. Perhaps the prophets should have been more careful.

By going to the text and the history of the 1st-century it can be shown that only one view is rational and can make sense of itself. Every view but one self-destructs. You made a similar claim above [last paragraph] in another post and I asked you to pick any point in the Olivet Discourse and demonstrate that you can rationally show the Preterist view to be wrong. You keep making assertions that you think wins you points. They win you nothing. Anyone can assert things. The problem comes in proving the assertions.

Of course, most of the early church writers appear to think Revelation was written in AD 90 or so, which would make its "prediction" of the destruction of the temple in AD 70 not quite the difficult feat it might appear. Shame none of the associated predictions in Rev 20 actually happened, kind of messes up that theory.

This is not true. There was one unclear statement by Irenaeus that was built upon and caused a lot of confusion.

The whole of the NT has no mention of an already destroyed temple, which would also signify the end of the Old Covenant.

Every NT book speaks of a system of worship still in existence. It also speaks to these Jewish people of something so terrible that is coming upon that very generation. Revelation deals with that judgment in specifics.

For that matter, could not exactly the same "implantation" idea you use to make little of Darwin's prediction apply to the Jewish revolt leading to the destruction of the temple?

You don't seem to realize what a feat that would be. Do you realize what a shell would be left if you stripped all the references and warnings to OT Israel in the NT? Why would all this be constructed after the fact? Why would so many people be willing to go to their death believing such a lie? Where is the evidence from history that this was a mass conspiracy? Produce something historical beyond assertions that I can interact with it. Go on then!

Anyway, it's not my aim to argue biblical prophecy with you.

That is because you don't know what you are talking about.

It's all nonsense for one very simple reason - fortune telling is not real. For the same reason, I'm obviously not suggesting Erasmus Darwin had the gift of prognostication. Presumably, he heard about the settlement of a new land, and applied what he knew about civilisations to describe his vision of what it might be like. He happened to have the good fortune to hit the nail on the head with uncanny accuracy - although where he got the idea of the arched bridge is anyone's guess, they weren't exactly common back in his location in spacetime.

You have to contend with a lot more than what Darwin thought of. You have to deal with the whole OT that looked forward to a specific time in history and then the NT too. You atheists want to detract from the Bible and pathetically. You offer nothing but assertions regarding prophecy.

Peter
Skeptical1
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12/2/2016 6:53:14 AM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 12/2/2016 5:50:23 AM, PGA wrote:
At 12/1/2016 9:31:37 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
At 12/1/2016 8:16:53 PM, PGA wrote:
At 11/29/2016 9:15:39 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Even if you could prove that he was writing about the Sydney Bridge, it could very easily be explained by someone who read his poem and said to himself, "I have just the structure in mind" and built it because the poem inspired him. I don't think you can even go that far because I see it being very vague.

You mean like perhaps some people could be looking for a messiah, and someone (perhaps John the Baptist) thinks "I have just the man in mind"?

No, I mean that yes they were looking for the Messiah and as prophesied John the Baptist prophesied about Him then He appeared to this OT people as prophesied.


Again, the poem is very vague. Someone may have been inspired by it and had a vision based on the poem if it even means what you think it does, which I doubt. Biblical prophecy is very in-depth and focused on specific events and people and timelines. The fulfillment of the 300 Messianic prophesies are astronomical odds, and they can only apply to one Person in history regarding His birth, lineage, death and resurrection as well as details regarding His ministry. After A.D. 70 it can apply to no one else. On top of this, you have a unity in the Bible that most unbelievers miss completely. Every OT and NT book focus on the Lord Jesus Christ. The OT contains many typologies and pictures of Him that can be easily demonstrated. Not only this but there is also a message in the Bible that produces hope and changes lives, and it has done so since the Messiah became man and walked this earth.

You keep saying Darwin's poem is vague. You seem to like making statements like that about any belief opposed to your own. I've listed parts that are certainly a lot more specific than most biblical prophecy.

His poem is vague. You can read into it all kinds of different scenarios. As I mentioned, there are around 300 specific prophecies in the OT that focus in on only one Person, no other. Then there is the constant theme of warnings and apocalyptic language regarding OT Israel and Jerusalem.

You are absolutely wrong about biblical prophecy and this just shows how little you know what you are talking about.

Yes, you've made your point. You're a genius. I don't know what I'm talking about, and neither do any of the vast majority of Christians who don't accept your interpretation, let alone we atheists who think it's all nonsense.

I suppose you're a bit sensitive about the subject since most orthodox Christian denominations actually consider the denial of a (future), literal second coming to be heresy. It must suck that if you lived a couple of centuries ago you'd probably have been burned alive by the church for believing what you do.

[Prophecy]Which, by the way is so clear and specific that absolutely no two factions of Christianity appear to be able to agree on almost anything with regard to it. Even within denominations there is no agreement. I guess that's the problem with not saying what you mean. Perhaps the prophets should have been more careful.

By going to the text and the history of the 1st-century it can be shown that only one view is rational and can make sense of itself. Every view but one self-destructs. You made a similar claim above [last paragraph] in another post and I asked you to pick any point in the Olivet Discourse and demonstrate that you can rationally show the Preterist view to be wrong. You keep making assertions that you think wins you points. They win you nothing. Anyone can assert things. The problem comes in proving the assertions.

If you could prove that the Olivet discourse ever even actually took place, you might have a point.


Of course, most of the early church writers appear to think Revelation was written in AD 90 or so, which would make its "prediction" of the destruction of the temple in AD 70 not quite the difficult feat it might appear. Shame none of the associated predictions in Rev 20 actually happened, kind of messes up that theory.

This is not true. There was one unclear statement by Irenaeus that was built upon and caused a lot of confusion.

There's quite a bit more than that.


The whole of the NT has no mention of an already destroyed temple, which would also signify the end of the Old Covenant.

Every NT book speaks of a system of worship still in existence. It also speaks to these Jewish people of something so terrible that is coming upon that very generation. Revelation deals with that judgment in specifics.

For that matter, could not exactly the same "implantation" idea you use to make little of Darwin's prediction apply to the Jewish revolt leading to the destruction of the temple?

You don't seem to realize what a feat that would be. Do you realize what a shell would be left if you stripped all the references and warnings to OT Israel in the NT? Why would all this be constructed after the fact? Why would so many people be willing to go to their death believing such a lie? Where is the evidence from history that this was a mass conspiracy? Produce something historical beyond assertions that I can interact with it. Go on then!

Anyway, it's not my aim to argue biblical prophecy with you.

That is because you don't know what you are talking about.

Actually, it's because it seems rather ludicrous for me to be trying to persuade you that your particular interpretation of a fairy tale is wrong and some other version is right. Just out of curiosity, have you ever read Hoekema, Hodge, Murray, and Packer or Augustine on the end times? I have. Or is your scholarly genius on the subject purely the result of what other preterists TELL you is faulty in their beliefs?

It's all nonsense for one very simple reason - fortune telling is not real. For the same reason, I'm obviously not suggesting Erasmus Darwin had the gift of prognostication. Presumably, he heard about the settlement of a new land, and applied what he knew about civilisations to describe his vision of what it might be like. He happened to have the good fortune to hit the nail on the head with uncanny accuracy - although where he got the idea of the arched bridge is anyone's guess, they weren't exactly common back in his location in spacetime.

You have to contend with a lot more than what Darwin thought of. You have to deal with the whole OT that looked forward to a specific time in history and then the NT too. You atheists want to detract from the Bible and pathetically. You offer nothing but assertions regarding prophecy.

Assertions such as "telling the future isn't real"? Well, there's been a million dollar prize on offer for decades to anyone who can do it. Funny how all the soothsayers have been conspicuously absent from the queues to claim it.
Gentorev
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12/2/2016 12:00:33 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 11/29/2016 9:15:39 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
The thousand-year reign of Christ described in Revelation 20 may or may not be literal, and may have begun 2000 years ago, or not yet have happened - depending on whose interpretation you believe.


In Colossians 2: 16-17; Paul has this to say; "Let no one make rules about what you eat or drink or about holidays or the New Moon festival or the Sabbath. All these are but a shadow of things to come in the future, etc."

The weekly Sabbath [The Seventh Day] was but the shadow of that which is to occur in the future. The Sabbath is the day of the Lord.

From the Book of Jubilees 4: 30; "And He (Adam) lacked seventy years of one thousand years; for one thousand years are as one day in the testimony of the heavens and therefore was it written concerning the tree of knowledge: "On the day thou eat thereof ye shall die." For this reason, Adam did not complete the years of that first day; for He died during it.""

Adam died in the first day at the age of 930, we are now at the closing of the sixth day, the day before the Great Sabbath that is the reality of the weekly Sabbath, "The Day of the Lord" the seventh period of one thousand years in which the lord shall rule with justice, the Great Sabbath of one thousand years.

According to Jewish time, the first destruction of the Temple of Solomon, was 3338 AM, which is 3338 years from Adam. Our time for that destruction of the temple is 587 BC. So adding 587 to 3338, we see that from Adam the father of Seth, to 1 BC=1AD there is 3925 years, add to that the current date, 2016, (3,925+2016=5,941).

According to these dates, which are very ambiguous, we are now living in the 5,941th year from Adam the father of Seth, which supposedly leaves us another 59 years before the close of the 6th day and the beginning of the 7th, which is the great Sabbath, "The Day of the Lord" the seventh period of one thousand years from the day that Adam ate of the forbidden fruit and died in that first day at the age of 930, which Sabbath Day begins after the greatest period of tribulation that this world has ever seen, and we are told in scripture, "But for the intervention of the Lord, no flesh would survive that period of tribulation."

Acts 17: 31; For He has fixed a day [The Great Sabbath] in which he shall judge the whole world with justice by means of a MAN he has CHOSEN. He has given proof to everyone by raising that MAN [Jesus] from death.
bulproof
Posts: 25,227
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12/2/2016 12:38:31 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 12/1/2016 8:16:53 PM, PGA wrote:
At 11/29/2016 9:15:39 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
Prophecy is often used by the Church to try and convince us of the supernatural claims of religion. The problem with Biblical prophecy is that it is so incredibly vague, and open to dispute. For example, there are so many interpretations of the "whore of Babylon", described in Revelation 17, it's not funny. She has been variously identified as the Roman Catholic Church, the Roman Empire, Jerusalem, an evil world system which arises during the end times, and anything other than the Jehovah's Witness religion. Similarly, the thousand-year reign of Christ described in Revelation 20 may or may not be literal, and may have begun 2000 years ago, or not yet have happened - depending on whose interpretation you believe.

The problem with most biblical interpretations is what is read into the text, not what the text reveals. People read into it things it does not disclose and build in an artificial timeline that ignores the language and they add another audience other than the one being addressed. For instance, Revelation is Jesus' address to John and his contempoaries "to show to His bond-servants (believers) the things which must soon take place." The things revealed are going to happen shortly. The relevant audience is a 1st-century audience. " John, to the seven churches that are in [the province of] Asia." John is addressing seven churches that stood then. The prophecy is largely concerned with judgment on the nation of Israel as laid out in Deuteronomy 28 and Leviticus 26 concerning covenant sanctions or curses for disobedience by the people of that covenant. The prophecies time and again are very specifically referring to this judgment on Jerusalem. There are references to the Roman Caesar's, five which have fallen, one who is (Nero) and one to come. The city in question in Revelation can be none other than Jerusalem and you can't argue against this without being very dishonest with the text and totally illogical to what the author reveals about this city and its inhabitants. There is imagery that applies most specifically to the OT and OT economy. There are around 289 references or quotes from the OT in this one book which shows what judgment John was writing about. It has been argued most effectively that Revelation is John's account of Matthew 24 (The Olivet Discourse). When you take into consideration the 300 specific prophecies about the Messiah Darwin's vague poem offers no comparison. Even if you could prove that he was writing about the Sydney Bridge, it could very easily be explained by someone who read his poem and said to himself, "I have just the structure in mind" and built it because the poem inspired him. I don't think you can even go that far because I see it being very vague.

A week or so ago, I came across a poem written by Erasmus Darwin, the grandfather of Charles. It caught my eye, because it describes in vivid detail the city of my birth. The interesting thing about this poem is it was penned one year after the colonisation of my country by the British, when the European population of the land was 1,500, most of whom would have been living in tents. It is an astonishing piece of prophecy by someone describing the future state of a place he had never been to. For anyone who might be interested, you can find the full text here:

Referring to Hope as "Truth's prophetic word", Darwin describes:

- broad streets
- canals and solid roads, expanding from cities through cultured land
- Farms waving with gold (canola and wheat)
- orchards
- tall spires (Centrepoint tower) and dome-capped towers (Queen Victoria Building)
- piers and quays (Circular Quay, of course, and Darling Harbour)

not to mention the cherry on top:

There the proud arch, colossus-like, bestride
Yon glittering streams, and bound the chasing tide

How could Darwin possibly have foreseen the Sydney Harbour Bridge over 140 years before it would open?

Again, the poem is very vague. Someone may have been inspiried by it and had a vision based on the poem if it even means what you think it does, which I doubt. Biblical prophecy is very indepth and focused on specific events and people and time lines. The fulfillment of the 300 Messianic prophesies are astronomical odds, and they can only apply to one Person in history regarding His birth, lineage, death and resurrection as well as details regarding His ministry. After A.D. 70 it can apply to no one else. On top of this you have a unity in the Bible that most unbelievers miss completely. Every OT and NT book focuses on the Lord Jesus Christ. The OT contains many typologies and pictures of Him that can be easily demonstrated. Not only this but there is also a message in the Bible that produces hope and changes lives, and it has done so since the Messiah became man and walked this earth.

So I'd like to suggest that we all forget looking for meaning in vague, non-specific predictions like the suppoed destruction of the temple by Jesus only some 40 years after his death, and embrace atheism, since twp Darwins have conclusively proven its superiority over Christian explanations of the past - and the future.


...Time"s opening scenes, and Truth"s prophetic word.
There shall broad streets their stately walls extend,
The circus widen, and the crescent bend;
There, rayed from cities o"er the cultured land,
Shall bright canals, and solid roads expand.
There the proud arch, colossus-like, bestride
Yon glittering streams, and bound the chasing tide;
Embellished villas crown the landscape-scene,
Farms wave with gold, and orchards blush between.
There shall tall spires, and dome-capped towers ascend,
And piers and quays their massy structures blend;
While with each breeze approaching vessels glide,
And northern treasures dance on every tide!"
Then ceased the nymph " tumultuous echoes roar,
And Joy"s loud voice was heard from shore to shore "
Her graceful steps descending pressed the plain,
And Peace, and Art, and Labour, joined her train.
Erasmus Darwin


Peter
Yes of course, Immanuel is just a different timeline, everybody should be able to see that.
It must just mean that atheists is dumb.
Bwuahahahahaha.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
bulproof
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12/2/2016 12:41:27 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 12/1/2016 10:19:58 PM, inferno wrote:
At 11/29/2016 10:53:43 PM, MasonicSlayer wrote:
It's ironic that you would say to embrace atheism when the militant march of atheism was predicted in the Bible. Maybe predictions do come true.

They do Mason. My latest thread in Debate.org makes it clear. The Mark Of The Beast is real. Anybody who denys this truth is headed for destruction.
And what does this mark of the beast say and where are you wearing it?
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
bulproof
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12/2/2016 12:48:50 PM
Posted: 4 days ago
At 12/2/2016 12:00:33 PM, Gentorev wrote:
At 11/29/2016 9:15:39 PM, Skeptical1 wrote:
The thousand-year reign of Christ described in Revelation 20 may or may not be literal, and may have begun 2000 years ago, or not yet have happened - depending on whose interpretation you believe.


In Colossians 2: 16-17; Paul has this to say; "Let no one make rules about what you eat or drink or about holidays or the New Moon festival or the Sabbath. All these are but a shadow of things to come in the future, etc."

The weekly Sabbath [The Seventh Day] was but the shadow of that which is to occur in the future. The Sabbath is the day of the Lord.

From the Book of Jubilees 4: 30; "And He (Adam) lacked seventy years of one thousand years; for one thousand years are as one day in the testimony of the heavens and therefore was it written concerning the tree of knowledge: "On the day thou eat thereof ye shall die." For this reason, Adam did not complete the years of that first day; for He died during it.""

Adam died in the first day at the age of 930, we are now at the closing of the sixth day, the day before the Great Sabbath that is the reality of the weekly Sabbath, "The Day of the Lord" the seventh period of one thousand years in which the lord shall rule with justice, the Great Sabbath of one thousand years.

According to Jewish time, the first destruction of the Temple of Solomon, was 3338 AM, which is 3338 years from Adam. Our time for that destruction of the temple is 587 BC. So adding 587 to 3338, we see that from Adam the father of Seth, to 1 BC=1AD there is 3925 years, add to that the current date, 2016, (3,925+2016=5,941).

According to these dates, which are very ambiguous, we are now living in the 5,941th year from Adam the father of Seth, which supposedly leaves us another 59 years before the close of the 6th day and the beginning of the 7th, which is the great Sabbath, "The Day of the Lord" the seventh period of one thousand years from the day that Adam ate of the forbidden fruit and died in that first day at the age of 930, which Sabbath Day begins after the greatest period of tribulation that this world has ever seen, and we are told in scripture, "But for the intervention of the Lord, no flesh would survive that period of tribulation."

Acts 17: 31; For He has fixed a day [The Great Sabbath] in which he shall judge the whole world with justice by means of a MAN he has CHOSEN. He has given proof to everyone by raising that MAN [Jesus] from death.
I'll try and help you out here.
A day is approx 24hrs. I hope that helps but I doubt it.
Adam is a fictional character invented by Jews during their captivity in Babylon in a vain attempt at providing their pathetic little oft conquered tribe with an unearned heroic history and all of the stories that were added had the same propagandic purpose.
It is FACT that there was no exodus and that the Jews are just another Canaanite tribe of zero significance.
Religion is just mind control. George Carlin
Gentorev
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12/3/2016 2:26:14 AM
Posted: 3 days ago
At 12/2/2016 12:48:50 PM, bulproof wrote:
I'll try and help you out here.
A day is approx 24hrs. I hope that helps but I doubt it.

A day is only 24 hours! Where? On the North Pole, on Mercury, Venus, Mars, Jupiter, Saturn, Uranus, Neptune, Pluto? A day is a period of time, ie, "Back in my day things were different."

The days and nights of Brahma are called Manvantara, or the cycle of manifestation, "The Great Day," which is a period of universal activity, that is preceded, and also followed by "Pralaya," a dark period, which to our finite minds seems as an eternity. "Manvantara," is a creative day as seen in the six days of creation in Genesis, "Pralaya," is the evening that proceeds the next creative day. The six periods of Creation and the seventh day of rest in which we now exist are referred to in the book of Genesis as the "GENERATIONS OF THE UNIVERSE.""

The English word "Generation," in relation to the six days that it took for the universe as we know it "TODAY" to be created [TODAY, meaning: In our day, or our period of time on this earth] is translated from the Hebrew "toledoth" which is used in the Old Testament in every instance as "births," or "descendants," such as "These are the generations of Adam," or "these are the generations of Abraham, and Genesis 2: 4; it is written concerning the six days of creation; "These are the [six] generations of the Universe, or the heavens and earth, etc."

So you see old mate, only a fool would believe that "A DAY" refers only to the 24 hour day as experienced in certain zones of the earth..