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How many virgin births listed in the Bible?

Harikrish
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11/30/2016 12:03:55 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
None!!!

Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.
" Isaiah 7:14

God offers Ahaz a sign to verify what Isaiah has spoken and to strengthen his faith. Why?
The two kings to the north wanted to defeat King Ahaz and capture Jerusalem so they could share the spoils and put someone else in power who would help them in their fight against Assyria.

Isaiah is predicting to Ahaz what that sign from God would be:

A child will be born to a virgin (or a young maiden).
His mother will name him Immanuel ("God is with us").
His birth will serve as a sign to Ahaz.
Before the child matures, the two kingdoms "will be laid waste."
The two kingdoms will be scattered within 65 years
This prophecy was spoken to Ahaz and for Ahaz to reassure him God was with him.

Matthew takes the same prophecy spoken to Ahaz 700 years before the birth of Christ and applies it to Jesus.

Matthew compares Isaiah's prophecy to Jesus and claims the two are the same even though they are 700 years apart.

It"s claimed that Jesus" mother was a virgin.
The angel Gabriel instructs Mary to name him Jesus ("God saves"), not Immanuel ("God with us").
Jesus" birth could not serve as a sign to Ahaz, since Ahaz had died hundreds of years earlier.
The two kingdoms were destroyed long before Jesus was born, so their destruction did not take place between his birth and his maturing.
Jesus was not born within 65 years of the prophecy.

All this took place to fulfill what the Lord had said through the prophet Isaiah: "The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and they will call him Immanuel" (which means "God with us").
" Matthew 1:22-23

Therefore there was no prophecy announcing the virgin birth of Jesus made to any prophet living in Jesus's time. But a sign offered to King Ahaz 700 years ago to reassure him God would send him a sign was taken as the prophecy announcing the coming of Jesus. Jesus was not named Immanuel because no one was told to name jesus Immanuel unlike what God specifically instructed Ahaz to do.

Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.
" Isaiah 7:14
Geogeer
Posts: 5,220
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11/30/2016 12:32:28 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 11/30/2016 12:03:55 AM, Harikrish wrote:
None!!!

Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.
" Isaiah 7:14

God offers Ahaz a sign to verify what Isaiah has spoken and to strengthen his faith. Why?
The two kings to the north wanted to defeat King Ahaz and capture Jerusalem so they could share the spoils and put someone else in power who would help them in their fight against Assyria.

Isaiah is predicting to Ahaz what that sign from God would be:

A child will be born to a virgin (or a young maiden).
His mother will name him Immanuel ("God is with us").
His birth will serve as a sign to Ahaz.
Before the child matures, the two kingdoms "will be laid waste."
The two kingdoms will be scattered within 65 years
This prophecy was spoken to Ahaz and for Ahaz to reassure him God was with him.

Imperfect predecessor to the true immanuel, just as Moses was an imperfect predecessor to Jesus.

Matthew takes the same prophecy spoken to Ahaz 700 years before the birth of Christ and applies it to Jesus.

Prefigurement.

Matthew compares Isaiah's prophecy to Jesus and claims the two are the same even though they are 700 years apart.

Yup. Maybe Matthew talked to Mary at some point in time?

It"s claimed that Jesus" mother was a virgin.

Yup. Always has been claimed so.

The angel Gabriel instructs Mary to name him Jesus ("God saves"), not Immanuel ("God with us").
Jesus" birth could not serve as a sign to Ahaz, since Ahaz had died hundreds of years earlier.

True it was a greater sign of a greater fulfillment.

The two kingdoms were destroyed long before Jesus was born, so their destruction did not take place between his birth and his maturing.

Maybe with Jesus it could be spiritual kingdoms that are destroyed? (Sin and death).

Jesus was not born within 65 years of the prophecy.

See above.

All this took place to fulfill what the Lord had said through the prophet Isaiah: "The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and they will call him Immanuel" (which means "God with us").
" Matthew 1:22-23

Therefore there was no prophecy announcing the virgin birth of Jesus made to any prophet living in Jesus's time. But a sign offered to King Ahaz 700 years ago to reassure him God would send him a sign was taken as the prophecy announcing the coming of Jesus. Jesus was not named Immanuel because no one was told to name jesus Immanuel unlike what God specifically instructed Ahaz to do.

Yet it was what he was God among us.

Superman is his name even though his given name is Clark Kent. God among us is one of his titles because he is among us.

Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.
" Isaiah 7:14

Yup.
Gentorev
Posts: 3,835
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11/30/2016 3:11:41 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 11/30/2016 12:03:55 AM, Harikrish wrote:
None!!!

Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.
" Isaiah 7:14

WAS MARY REALLY A VIRGIN?"

Yes! Right up until the act by which she conceived her firstborn son Jesus, who was sired by Joseph ben Heli/Alexander Helios."

Isaiah 7: 14; Correct Jewish Translation: Therefore, the Lord, of His own, shall give you a sign; behold, the young woman is with child, and she shall bear a son, and she shall call his name Immanuel."

Isaiah 7: 14; Erroneous KJV Translation: Therefore the Lord Himself will give you a sign: Behold, the virgin shall conceive and bear a Son, and shall call His name Immanuel."

The Greek word parthenos (`0;^5;`1;_2;^1;_7;_9;`2;) used in Matthew 1:23 ; is ambiguous but the Hebrew term "Almah" that is erroneously translated in some Christian bibles as "virgin" is absolute, and according to Young"s Analytical Concordance to the Bible, the Hebrew term "Almah," carries the meaning, (Concealment---unmarried female.)"

The word "Virgin" in reference to the mother of Jesus was not introduced until the Latin Bible "The Vulgate" was translated to English, for just like the early Greek language, the Latin does not have a specific term for "VIRGIN", their word "Virgo" refers to any young woman of marriageable age, whether or not she had previous sexual relations with a man.

In translating the Hebrew words of the prophet Isaiah, that an "Almah" an "unmarried female" would be with child and bear a son," into Greek, which unlike the Hebrew language, does not have a specific term for "virgin," the authors of the Septuagint and The Gospel of Matthew correctly used the Greek word "Parthenos," which carries a basic meaning of "girl," or unmarried youth, and denotes "virgin" only by implication. To translate something from the Hebrew to the Greek, or from any language to another, one must not lose the essence of the original, and the original was, that "An unmarried woman would be with child."

Go to "A Dictionary of Biblical Tradition in English Literature," by David Jeffery. There you will find written, "Many scholars consider the new Revised Standard Version of the King James translation, which is probably the most widely used version of the English bible today, and considered by most modern scholars to be to be the most accurate translation of the Old Testament. It follows the modern consensus in translating "Almah" as "Young Woman" in Isaiah 7: 14.

In 1973, an ecumenical edition of RSV was approved by both Protestant and Catholic hierarchies, called the common bible. A New English Translation of the Bible, published in 1970 and approved by the council of churches in England, Scotland, Wales, the Irish council of churches, the London Society of Friends, and the Methodist and Presbyterian churches of England, all translate Isaiah 7: 14; "A young Woman is with child, and she will bear a son."

Also The Good News Bible, Catholic Study Edition, with imprimatur by Archbishop John Whealon reads, Isaiah 7: 14; "A young woman who is pregnant will have a son, etc."

As these religious bodies all now accept that Isaiah was not referring to a virgin in that famous passage, they must now accept that the authors of the Septuagint and The Gospel of Matthew, who were forced to use the Greek term "Parthenos" in reference to Isaiah"s prophecy, were in no way implying that the pregnant Mary, was still a virgin.

Matthew 1: 22-23; should now read; "Now all this happened to make come true what the Lord had said through the prophet [Isaiah]," "An unmarried woman/Almah will become pregnant and bear a son and he will be called immanuel: ("which means God is with us.")

The point of the prophecy is not in the fact that an unmarried woman would bear a son, but that a child conceived out of wedlock (A Bastard) would be seen as the vessel in which the Lord would reveal himself to us, ("God is with us.")

The word for Tabernacle, mishkan, is a derivative of the same root and is used in the sense of dwelling-place in the Bible, e.g. Psalm 132:5 ("Before I find a place for God, mishkanot (dwelling-places) for the Strong One of Israel.") Accordingly, in classic Jewish thought, the Shekhinah refers to a dwelling or settling in a special sense, a dwelling or settling of divine presence, to the effect that, while in proximity to the Shekhinah, the connection to God is more readily perceivable. Some Christian theologians have connected the concept of Shekhinah to the Greek term "Parousia", "presence" "arrival," which is used in the New Testament in a similar way for "Divine Presence".

The Light of man came In the body of a human being, which he had filled with his spirit and lived with us, and we saw his Sh'khinah, (Dwelling place) the Sh'khinah, or Dwelling place, which was the body of the man Jesus that the Father had prepared for his Son, who was to come down and fill with his spirit that body that his Father had prepared for him, the earthly dwelling of the Father's only Son, full of grace and truth.
The Tongue---the sharp two edged S-word that divides the spirit from the soul.
Harikrish
Posts: 13,612
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11/30/2016 2:43:46 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 11/30/2016 12:03:55 AM, Harikrish wrote:
None!!!

Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.
" Isaiah 7:14

God offers Ahaz a sign to verify what Isaiah has spoken and to strengthen his faith. Why?
The two kings to the north wanted to defeat King Ahaz and capture Jerusalem so they could share the spoils and put someone else in power who would help them in their fight against Assyria.

Isaiah is predicting to Ahaz what that sign from God would be:

A child will be born to a virgin (or a young maiden).
His mother will name him Immanuel ("God is with us").
His birth will serve as a sign to Ahaz.
Before the child matures, the two kingdoms "will be laid waste."
The two kingdoms will be scattered within 65 years
This prophecy was spoken to Ahaz and for Ahaz to reassure him God was with him.

Matthew takes the same prophecy spoken to Ahaz 700 years before the birth of Christ and applies it to Jesus.

Matthew compares Isaiah's prophecy to Jesus and claims the two are the same even though they are 700 years apart.

It"s claimed that Jesus" mother was a virgin.
The angel Gabriel instructs Mary to name him Jesus ("God saves"), not Immanuel ("God with us").
Jesus" birth could not serve as a sign to Ahaz, since Ahaz had died hundreds of years earlier.
The two kingdoms were destroyed long before Jesus was born, so their destruction did not take place between his birth and his maturing.
Jesus was not born within 65 years of the prophecy.

All this took place to fulfill what the Lord had said through the prophet Isaiah: "The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and they will call him Immanuel" (which means "God with us").
" Matthew 1:22-23

Therefore there was no prophecy announcing the virgin birth of Jesus made to any prophet living in Jesus's time. But a sign offered to King Ahaz 700 years ago to reassure him God would send him a sign was taken as the prophecy announcing the coming of Jesus. Jesus was not named Immanuel because no one was told to name jesus Immanuel unlike what God specifically instructed Ahaz to do.

Therefore the Lord himself will give you a sign: The virgin will conceive and give birth to a son, and will call him Immanuel.
" Isaiah 7:14

In conclusion Isaiah 7:14 was a sign to Ahaz an unmarried woman /maiden would conceive and give birth to a son who will be called Immanuel. There was no association with messianic expectations or salvation of the world. It was just a sign to reassure Ahaz that God was with him.

Matthew uses the same promise made to Ahaz 700 years ago to set the expectation for Jesus. The virgin birth story supposedly came from Mary who was told by an angel she was soon to be with child. Even if that were true. It makes little sense to connect that with Isaiah 7:14 which was totally unrelated to her infidelity to her husband Joseph. Mary was pregnant before Joseph was married to her or before he consummated their marriage. She was indeed a unmarried maiden at the time of her pregnancy. But that does not imply Jesus was a virgin birth. To think that the far fetched story by an adulterous couple Joreph and Mary would capture the imagination of the disciples and the Christians is incredulous in itself. But to say this adulterous couple and their illegitimate child Jesus was prophesied 700 years ago by Isaiah 7:14 to Ahaz as a sign is even more glorified trash. What use would this sign be to Ahaz if the sign was to show up 700 years after his death? The absurdity in breathtaking.

There are no virgin births in the bible. The first virgin birth in Isaiah 7:14 can be discarded. Ahaz never found the virgin mother or her son Immanuel. The second virgin birth is a reiteration of Isaiah 7:14 700 years later and can also be discarded because it was based on the first undelivered promise.
What we do know is Joseph and Mary were an adulterous couple. Jesus was an illegitimate child born out of wedlock. Jesus was so disgusted by his adulterous parents he even denied both of them in public.

Matthew 12:46 While Jesus was still talking to the crowd, his mother and brothers stood outside, wanting to speak to him. 47 Someone told him, "Your mother and brothers are standing outside, wanting to speak to you."

48 He replied to him, "Who is my mother, and who are my brothers?" 49 Pointing to his disciples, he said, "Here are my mother and my brothers. 50 For whoever does the will of my Father in heaven is my brother and sister and mother."

Then Jesus corrects Mary when she calls Joseph his father.

When his parents saw him, they were astonished. His mother said to him, "Son, why have you treated us like this? Your father and I have been anxiously searching for you." "Why were you searching for me?" he asked. "Didn't you know I had to be in my Father's house?" (Luke 2:47-50).
He implies God is his father not Joseph. In short Jesus rejected both his adulterous parents. So why should their story of virgin birth be believed?

That is two strikes against the virgin birth stories. Therefore there are no virgin births in the Bible.
Gentorev
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12/1/2016 12:59:24 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
The Ancestors of Jesus in First and Second Century Judea BCE
By Robert Mock M.D.
December 2007
Book One
Chapter Two
This young maiden, Miriam, was a child of sorrow. Her father, Heli, a Davidic and Hasmonean prince, called Alexander Helios III", was apparently executed, in the world where many Davidian aspirants, as the "young lions of Judah", were eliminated by the cruel and tyrannical King Herod the Great., Etc.

A son of the famous Boethus family of seven sons, Mary"s great-great-great grandfather, arrived into Jewish history as one of the giants of the priests of the House of Zadok. The High Priest Hananeel (Ananelus) the Egyptian/Jew was privileged to sacrifice one of the nine red heifers before the temple of Herod was destroyed in 70 AD.

The great grandfather of the biblical Jesus was Yehoshua/Jesus III, who was the high priest in Jerusalem from 36 to 23 BC. The sonless Yehoshua, had three elderly daughters, Joanna, Elizabeth and Anna/Hanna, whose mother was "Phanul" from the tribe of Asher.

Knowing that his Zadokian lineage would become extinct unless his daughters were placed with future husbands according to the Torah, he married them off to chosen husbands.

Joanna, was betrothed to Joachim from the non-royal genetic lineage of David. The second daughter of Yehoshua III, was Elizabeth. This was the Elizabeth, who, at a very advanced age was to become the mother of John the Baptist in 7 BC, some 16 years after the death of her father in 23 BC, and she was betrothed to a Levite priest by the name Zacharias of the priestly course of Abijah.

Hanna/Anna, the third daughter, was betrothed to Alexander Helios (Heli) a young Macedonian Jew, of the tribe of Judah through Nathan the Levite, who was the stepson of King David. Alexander Helios [Heli] is thought by some, to be the twin brother of Herod"s young Jewish wife Cleopatra, a Macedonian Jewess, perhaps the twin children of Queen Cleopatra and Mark Antony, who were adopted out when their parents committed suicide after losing their war against Caesar Augustus.

Alexander Helios=Heli, the biological grand-father of Jesus, according to the genealogy of Jesus as recorded in Luke, was a descendant of Nathan the prophet who was the biological son of Bathsheba and Uriah the Hittite.

Uriah became a member of the tribe of Levi by his marriage to Bathsheba the daughter of Ammiel, the son of Oded-Edom, who was a descendant of Moses from the house of Levi, by his second wife Jepunniah an Ethiopian woman, [See Numbers 12: 1; KJV] who was the widow of a man from the tribe of Judah, and the mother of Caleb, who, at the age of forty, became the adopted son of Moses, and Jepunniah was the daughter of Hobab the Kennite, one of the two fathers-in-law to Moses, [See Judges 4: 11.]"

The Talmud states, "Whoever brings up an orphan in his home is regarded...as though the child had been born to him." (Sanhedrin 119b)." In other words, the adopted child is to be treated as a child born to the father of that house,"which means, that Heli and his descendants, who were born from the genetic line of Nathan "the prophet," who was the adopted son of King David, were legitimate heirs to King David. But the prophesied Messiah had to come through the line of Solomon.
Heli and his descendants only became heirs to the throne of David, through Nathan the adopted son of King David, when Naria, a descendant of Nathan, married Tamar, a female descendant of King Solomon, who bore to Naria a son by the name "Salathiel." After the death of Naria, Tamar was taken to wife by King Jeconiah, whose only son with Tamar, was Zedekiah who died prematurely in Childhood.

According to Torah law, Nathan the adopted son of King David and his descendants, were legitimate heirs of King David, but not in the ancestral line of the promised Messiah, who was to be born of the seed of Solomon, until Naria the descendant of Nathan coupled with Tamah the descendant of Solomon, to produce Salathiel the ancestor of Jesus, [See Luke 3: 27.] who has been made High Priest (From the tribe of Levi=Nathan) and King (From the tribe of Judah=Solomon) in the order of Melchizedek.

David Hughes the noted"Genealogist of the Ancient World Lineages, states that King Jeconiah"s only son, with"Queen Tamar,""Prince Zedekiah,""died prematurely"in"childhood, and"in"586 BCE" King Zedekiah, the"last king of Israel, was taken prisoner and"his"sons"were"executed"in"front of his eyes, after which, his"eyes"were"gouged out,"and there"he remained blinded"in"exile"for the rest of his life and it"appeared"that the"entire royal lineage of King David"through"God"s chosen son, King Solomon,"had"been exterminated."

With all"the"known direct lineages"of"male heirs"to the"lineage of King Solomon the son of King David"and Bathsheba"now"extinct,"Queen Tamar II"became"the"dynastic heiress preserving"not only the Lineage of King Solomon,"but"also became"the"inter-dynastic link, or the"vital crossover heiress merging"the"non-royal Nathan lineage"with the"royal lineages of King Solomon."With"the"addition of Tamar representing"the"mainline descendants of King David, we now can"understand the linkage"between the"two prime royal"and"non-royal lineages"to the"ancestry of the Jewish Messiah"Yehoshua ben Yosef (Jesus son of Joseph the son of Alexander Helios a descendant of Nathan)."

Jesus carried in his genes the potent fusion of Davidian and Zadokian bloodlines." He carried the potent bloodline of the royal mantle as a Priest-King of Israel and the messianic mantle as the Maschiach Yisra"el (Messiah of Israel) of the House of David.
Hebrew 5: 10; "And God declared him (Jesus) to be high priest according to the priestly order of Melchizedek." Melchizedek held the titles of both King and high priest. Hebrew 5: 5; "In the same way, Christ did not take upon himself the honor of being high priest. Instead, God said to him, "You are my Son; TODAY I have become your Father.""
The Tongue---the sharp two edged S-word that divides the spirit from the soul.
Gentorev
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12/1/2016 1:21:52 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
Jesus the grandson of Alexander Helios was called God, the son of God, King of kings, etc, which was not unusual in those days. Originally, Cleopatra ruled with her father Ptolemy XIII Auleted and later with her brothers, Ptolemy XIII and Ptolemy XIV, whom she married as per Egyptian custom, but eventually she became sole ruler.

No children were born from her union with her two brothers, but she did bear a son [Caesarion] to Julius Caesar, who was later elevated to co-ruler in name only.
Cleopatra represented herself as the reincarnation of the Egyptian goddess "Isis", and was given the title of "Queen of Kings" by Mark Anthony. Her son "Caesarion" was also given many titles, including "god", "Son of god" and "King of Kings" and was depicted as Horus the son of Isis. It was after the assassination of Caesar in 44 BC, that Cleopatra coupled up with Mark Anthony and in 40 BC she bore to him the twins Cleopatra Selene II and Alexander Helios, and later on another son, Ptolemy Philadelphus.

In late 34 BC, at the Donations of Alexandria, shortly after Anthony had conquered Armenia, Cleopatra and Caesarion were crowned rulers of Egypt and Cyprus. Alexander Helios, their six-year-old son, was crowned ruler of Aemenia, Media and Parthia; Cleopatra Selene II, Heli"s six-year-old twin sister, was crowned ruler of Cyrenaica and Libya, and Ptolemy Philadelphus, the younger of their three children was crowned ruler of Phoenicia, Syria and Cilicia.

Isis was the most popular goddess from the time of Psamtik 1 (663-610 B.C) till the coming of Christianity, her cult appealed to the Greeks and Romans alike and when Egypt came under Roman rule, her cult spread through much of Europe. By the time of Jesus, the chief centre of her worship was in Rome. Isis is commonly depicted with Horus the child (Harpocrates) on her lap, and today, it is impossible to distinguish between the late pagan and early Christian figures of the mother and child, [Isis and Horus---Mary and Jesus] it"s almost as though the old Pagan Queen was stripped of her garments and clothed with the new covering of Christianity.

It appears that Alexander Helios=Heli, had previously sired a son, by another woman, which son, we know by the name "Joseph from Cyprus," and Heli was to later sire the child Mary to Hanna the daughter of the high priest Yehoshua III around 20 BC, before he [Heli] was murdered in 13 BC, by order of Herod the Great, in the pogroms which saw the demise of many of the heirs to David"s throne.

This means that the elderly Hanna, the mother of Mary, had been a widow for seven years when Jesus was born in 6 BC to the 14 year-old Mary and her half-brother, who would have only been a year or two older than Mary, this was about 2 years before the death of Herod the Great in the spring of 4 BC, shortly after he had ordered the death of all the male children in the district of Beitlahm=Bethlehem of Galilee, who were two years and below.

In those days, there was a small town about 2 kilometres from Nazareth, called Bethlehem of Galilee, today that town is known as Beitlahm.

It is said that after the death of her father, Alexander Helios=Heli, "who was a father of renowned," the seven-year-old Mary [who is believed to be the grand-daughter of Mark Antony] was removed from her mother and taken north into the land of Galilee where she was raised under the protection of the Jewish zealots whose aim it was, to throw off the yoke of Roman rule and establish a descendant of King David, back on the throne of Israel."

There are those who believe that the union between Mary, the daughter of Alexander Helios, with her half-brother Joseph the son of Heli, from which union the child Jesus was born, was arranged by the Greek speaking Jewish Zealots, as it was the custom in those days for the female heir to the throne, (Mary, the daughter of Alexander Helios,) to unite with their brother, as Cleopatra and all female heirs had done before her.

But because Joseph the son of Alexander Helios and any male offspring of his, would have been seen as a threat to the throne of Herod the Great as was his father: the biological father of Jesus had to remain hidden, and for the safety of the child, the pregnant Mary, was married off to Joseph the son of Jacob, a descendant of the cursed genetic line of King Jehoiachin.

Herod"s chief advisors, would not have seen Jesus the son of Mary as a threat to his throne, because Mary, who was already pregnant to her half-brother "Joseph the son of Alexander Helios," was taken to wife by Joseph the son of Jacob from the tribe of Judah. This Joseph ben Jacob, who married the already pregnant Mary and who was only the step-father of Jesus, was a descendant of Solomon through the cursed line of Jehoiachin, of whom we read in Jeremiah 22: 30; "This man is condemned to lose his children, to be a man who will never succeed. He will have no descendants who will rule in Judah as David"s successor. I, the Lord, have spoken."

This rules out the hope of any son of Joseph ben Jacob ever sitting on the throne of David, whereas Jesus the son of Joseph ben Heli=Alexander Helios was a legitimate successor to that throne.

Jehoshua III, the High Priest until 23 BC, is supposed to have died three years before the birth of his grand-daughter "Mary." If it was his death that ended his period as high priest in Jerusalem in the year of 23 BC, this would mean that Mary was born in 20 BC, the same year as Philip the son of Herod and his young Jewess wife, "Cleopatra."

Therefore, Mary would have been 7 years old when her father Heli died in 13 BC, and 14 years old when she gave birth to Jesus, who was born in 6 BC, two years before the death of Herod the Great in 4 BC, making Mary about 47 years old when Jesus, the first of her three biological sons, was crucified.
The Tongue---the sharp two edged S-word that divides the spirit from the soul.
Gentorev
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12/1/2016 2:26:03 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
To understand the truth that is revealed in the scriptures, one must first understand the great lie which has hidden the truth from the world. "Was Mary still a virgin after she fell pregnant?" The word Virgin in reference to Mary in modern English bibles is erroneously translated from the Greek "Parthenos", which carries a basic meaning of "girl," or unmarried youth, and denotes "virgin" only by implication.

Joseph was a very common name in the days of Jesus and remains so even today. The Joseph ben Jacob, who married the already pregnant Mary and whose genealogy is recorded in Matthew 1, is an entirely different person than the Joseph ben Heli=Alexander Helios, the biological father of Jesus, who is recorded in Luke 3.

Mat 1:18-25: (18) This is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph [The son of Jacob], but before they came together, she was found to be with child through the power of the Holy Spirit.

It was through the power or rather the workings of the Holy Spirit, that the child Jesus was born. Now we read of Isaac the child of God"s promise to Abraham, and Isaac was born through the power, or the workings of the Holy Spirit in Galatians 4: 29; "Yet at that time the child born according to the flesh (Ishmael) persecuted him (Isaac) who was born according to the promise and the workings of the holy spirit."

It was through the workings of the Holy Spirit that the barren Sarah conceived the child of God"s promise, who was the biological son of her half-brother Abraham. And it was through the power=workings of the Holy Spirit that Mary conceived the child of God"s promise, who was the biological son of her half-brother, "Joseph the son of Alexander Helios."

"The genealogy of Jesus," reveals that Mary was the daughter of Heli and Anna, who was one of the three elderly daughters of Yehoshua/Jesus III, who was high priest in Jerusalem from 36 to 23 BC. The elderly 70 year old Anna/Hanna, whose mother was "phanuel" from the tribe of Asher, was given as a bride to young Alexander Helios (Heli), and Jesus is the son of "Joseph, the son of Heli."

Just as Isaac the promised seed of Abraham was born through the union of Abraham and his half-sister Sarah, according to the workings of the Holy Spirit, and Sarah was told by an angel/man that she was to become pregnant, so too, the man Jesus, the reality of God"s promise to Abraham, was born according to the workings of the Holy Spirit and born of the union of Mary and her half-brother Joseph, who were both sired by Heli=Alexander Helios.

Presumably, Joseph the son of Heli, would have been introduced to Mary for the first time at the gathering of the family and friends of Elizabeth the aged aunty of Mary, who were of the daughters of Levi. This was some months after the young "parthenos" (Unmarried) Mary had told the angel=man that up until that point in time she had never had any sexual relations with a man. Implying that the unmarried girl, "Almah=Parthenos" was still a virgin, before she met Joseph the young son of her father, Alexander Helios.

It was through a Greek speaking man that Gabriel, the angel of the Greeks and not Michael the angel of the Hebrews, spoke to the 13/14 year-old "parthenos" (Young unmarried woman) and told her that she would soon become pregnant and bear a son who God would make a King, as his ancestor David was.

So the Lord through his angel verifies, that her son would be genetically descended from King David.

In Matthew you will find the genealogy of Joseph the son of Jacob from the tribe of Judah, who married the already pregnant Mary the mother of Jesus. This Joseph, is the 24th descendant of Solomon the biological son of King David and Bathsheba, who was the widow of Uriah the Hittite, and this Joseph who married Mary, is not genetically connected to Jesus, as he, [Joseph ben Jacob] had no sexual relations with Mary until after she had given birth to Jesus, [See Matthew 1: 25.] the first-born of Mary"s three biological sons, and although an adopted son inherits the rights of his adopted father, because his step father [Joseph ben Jacob] was a descendant, of the cursed line of Jehoiachim, he had no claim to the throne of David. Jeremiah 22: 30; concerning King Jehoiachim; Thus saith the Lord. "Write ye this man childless, a man that shall not prosper in his days; for no man of his seed shall prosper, sitting upon the throne of David, and ruling any more in Judah."

In Luke 3: 23; you will find the genealogy of Jesus, whose father is Joseph the son of Alexander Helios=Heli. And this particular Joseph the son of Heli, who is the biological Father of Jesus is about the 40th descendant of Nathan the priest of David, who became his adopted son. Nathan was the half-brother to Solomon the biological son of King David, as they both had the same mother [Bathsheba] the wife of Uriah the Hittite, who is the biological father of Nathan and a member of the tribe of Levi by his marriage to Bathsheba the daughter of Ammiel, the son of Obed-Edom, the Levite.

This Joseph the son of Heli, had a half-sister, Mary the daughter of Alexander Helios= Heli, who was the grandfather of Jesus.
The Tongue---the sharp two edged S-word that divides the spirit from the soul.
Harikrish
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12/6/2016 8:32:30 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/1/2016 2:26:03 AM, Gentorev wrote:
To understand the truth that is revealed in the scriptures, one must first understand the great lie which has hidden the truth from the world. "Was Mary still a virgin after she fell pregnant?" The word Virgin in reference to Mary in modern English bibles is erroneously translated from the Greek "Parthenos", which carries a basic meaning of "girl," or unmarried youth, and denotes "virgin" only by implication.

Joseph was a very common name in the days of Jesus and remains so even today. The Joseph ben Jacob, who married the already pregnant Mary and whose genealogy is recorded in Matthew 1, is an entirely different person than the Joseph ben Heli=Alexander Helios, the biological father of Jesus, who is recorded in Luke 3.

Mat 1:18-25: (18) This is how the birth of Jesus Christ came about: His mother Mary was pledged to be married to Joseph [The son of Jacob], but before they came together, she was found to be with child through the power of the Holy Spirit.

It was through the power or rather the workings of the Holy Spirit, that the child Jesus was born. Now we read of Isaac the child of God"s promise to Abraham, and Isaac was born through the power, or the workings of the Holy Spirit in Galatians 4: 29; "Yet at that time the child born according to the flesh (Ishmael) persecuted him (Isaac) who was born according to the promise and the workings of the holy spirit."

It was through the workings of the Holy Spirit that the barren Sarah conceived the child of God"s promise, who was the biological son of her half-brother Abraham. And it was through the power=workings of the Holy Spirit that Mary conceived the child of God"s promise, who was the biological son of her half-brother, "Joseph the son of Alexander Helios."

"The genealogy of Jesus," reveals that Mary was the daughter of Heli and Anna, who was one of the three elderly daughters of Yehoshua/Jesus III, who was high priest in Jerusalem from 36 to 23 BC. The elderly 70 year old Anna/Hanna, whose mother was "phanuel" from the tribe of Asher, was given as a bride to young Alexander Helios (Heli), and Jesus is the son of "Joseph, the son of Heli."

Just as Isaac the promised seed of Abraham was born through the union of Abraham and his half-sister Sarah, according to the workings of the Holy Spirit, and Sarah was told by an angel/man that she was to become pregnant, so too, the man Jesus, the reality of God"s promise to Abraham, was born according to the workings of the Holy Spirit and born of the union of Mary and her half-brother Joseph, who were both sired by Heli=Alexander Helios.

Presumably, Joseph the son of Heli, would have been introduced to Mary for the first time at the gathering of the family and friends of Elizabeth the aged aunty of Mary, who were of the daughters of Levi. This was some months after the young "parthenos" (Unmarried) Mary had told the angel=man that up until that point in time she had never had any sexual relations with a man. Implying that the unmarried girl, "Almah=Parthenos" was still a virgin, before she met Joseph the young son of her father, Alexander Helios.

It was through a Greek speaking man that Gabriel, the angel of the Greeks and not Michael the angel of the Hebrews, spoke to the 13/14 year-old "parthenos" (Young unmarried woman) and told her that she would soon become pregnant and bear a son who God would make a King, as his ancestor David was.

So the Lord through his angel verifies, that her son would be genetically descended from King David.

In Matthew you will find the genealogy of Joseph the son of Jacob from the tribe of Judah, who married the already pregnant Mary the mother of Jesus. This Joseph, is the 24th descendant of Solomon the biological son of King David and Bathsheba, who was the widow of Uriah the Hittite, and this Joseph who married Mary, is not genetically connected to Jesus, as he, [Joseph ben Jacob] had no sexual relations with Mary until after she had given birth to Jesus, [See Matthew 1: 25.] the first-born of Mary"s three biological sons, and although an adopted son inherits the rights of his adopted father, because his step father [Joseph ben Jacob] was a descendant, of the cursed line of Jehoiachim, he had no claim to the throne of David. Jeremiah 22: 30; concerning King Jehoiachim; Thus saith the Lord. "Write ye this man childless, a man that shall not prosper in his days; for no man of his seed shall prosper, sitting upon the throne of David, and ruling any more in Judah."

In Luke 3: 23; you will find the genealogy of Jesus, whose father is Joseph the son of Alexander Helios=Heli. And this particular Joseph the son of Heli, who is the biological Father of Jesus is about the 40th descendant of Nathan the priest of David, who became his adopted son. Nathan was the half-brother to Solomon the biological son of King David, as they both had the same mother [Bathsheba] the wife of Uriah the Hittite, who is the biological father of Nathan and a member of the tribe of Levi by his marriage to Bathsheba the daughter of Ammiel, the son of Obed-Edom, the Levite.

This Joseph the son of Heli, had a half-sister, Mary the daughter of Alexander Helios= Heli, who was the grandfather of Jesus.

So you agree there are no virgin births in the bible. And Jesus was a step son away from being a direct descendant from the line of David or Mary would not have been bethroted to Joseph ben Jacob a descendant, of the cursed line of Jehoiachim if she was a direct descendant of David. Here too Jesus's illegitimacy is unquestionable.
Gentorev
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12/7/2016 1:20:57 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/6/2016 8:32:30 PM, Harikrish wrote:

So you agree there are no virgin births in the bible.

I most certainly do.

And Jesus was a step son away from being a direct descendant from the line of David or Mary would not have been bethroted to Joseph ben Jacob a descendant, of the cursed line of Jehoiachim if she was a direct descendant of David. Here too Jesus's illegitimacy is unquestionable.


It is said that after the death of her father, Alexander Helios=Heli, "who was an heir to the throne of David and seen as a threat to Herod the Great who had him murdered" the seven-year-old Mary [who is believed to be the grand-daughter of Mark Antony] was removed from her mother and taken north into the land of Galilee where she was raised under the protection of the Jewish zealots whose aim it was, to throw off the yoke of Roman rule and establish a descendant of King David, back on the throne of Israel."

There are those who believe that the union between Mary, the daughter of Alexander Helios/Heli, with her half-brother Joseph the son of Heli, from which union the child Jesus was born, was arranged by the Greek speaking Jewish Zealots, as it was the custom in those days for the female heir to the throne, (Mary, the daughter of Alexander Helios,) to unite with their brother, as Cleopatra and all female heirs had done before her.

But because Joseph the son of Alexander Helios and any male offspring of his, would have been seen as a threat to the throne of Herod the Great as was his father: the biological father of Jesus had to remain hidden, and for the safety of the child, the pregnant Mary, was married off to Joseph the son of Jacob, a descendant of the cursed genetic line of King Jehoiachin.

Herod"s chief advisors, would not have seen Jesus the son of Mary as a threat to his throne, because Mary, who was already pregnant to her half-brother "Joseph the son of Alexander Helios," was taken to wife by Joseph the son of Jacob from the tribe of Judah. This Joseph ben Jacob, who married the already pregnant Mary and who was only the step-father of Jesus, was a descendant of Solomon through the cursed line of Jehoiachin, of whom we read in Jeremiah 22: 30; "This man is condemned to lose his children, to be a man who will never succeed. He will have no descendants who will rule in Judah as David"s successor. I, the Lord, have spoken."

This rules out the hope of any son of Joseph ben Jacob ever sitting on the throne of David, whereas Jesus the son of Joseph ben Heli=Alexander Helios was a legitimate successor to that throne.

The point of Isaiah" prophecy is not in the fact that an unmarried woman would bear a son, but that a child conceived out of wedlock (A Bastard) would be seen as the vessel in which the Lord would reveal himself to us, ("God is with us.")

Similar to Solomon who was born from an adulterous union and the blood of his mothers husband "Uriah," was blessed with the rulership of the most glorious period of Judaea" history and was chosen as the one to build the Temple in Jerusalem and the one through whose genetic line the promised Messiah would be born.

It is not the circumstances of your birth that dictates whether you are chosen or rejected, but the life that you live.

According to Torah law, Nathan the adopted son of King David and his descendants, were legitimate heirs of King David, but not in the ancestral line of the promised Messiah, who was to be born of the seed of Solomon, until Naria the descendant of Nathan coupled with Tamah the descendant of Solomon, to produce Salathiel the ancestor of Jesus, [See Luke 3: 27.] who has been made High Priest (From the tribe of Levi=Nathan) and King (From the tribe of Judah=Solomon) in the order of Melchizedek.

David Hughes the noted"Genealogist of the Ancient World Lineages, states that King Jeconiah's only son, with "Queen Tamar," "Prince Zedekiah," died prematurely in childhood, and in"586 BCE" King Zedekiah, the last king of Israel, was taken prisoner and his sons were executed in front of his eyes, after which, his eyes were gouged out, and there he remained blinded in exile for the rest of his life and it appeared that the entire royal lineage of King David through God's chosen son, King Solomon, had been exterminated."

With all the known direct lineages of male heirs to the lineage of King Solomon the son of King David and Bathsheba now extinct, Queen Tamar II became the dynastic heiress preserving not only the Lineage of King Solomon, but also became the inter-dynastic link, or the vital crossover heiress merging the non-royal Nathan lineage"with the royal lineages of King Solomon. With the addition of Tamar [A female descendant of Solomon] representing the mainline descendants of King David, we now can understand the linkage between the two prime royal and non-royal lineages to the ancestry of the Jewish Messiah Yehoshua ben Yosef (Jesus son of Joseph the son of Alexander Helios a descendant of Nathan)."

Jesus carried in his genes the potent fusion of Davidian and Zadokian bloodlines." He carried the potent bloodline of the royal mantle as a Priest-King of Israel and the messianic mantle as the Maschiach Yisra"el (Messiah of Israel) of the House of David.
The Tongue---the sharp two edged S-word that divides the spirit from the soul.
Harikrish
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12/7/2016 1:54:13 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/7/2016 1:20:57 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/6/2016 8:32:30 PM, Harikrish wrote:

So you agree there are no virgin births in the bible.

I most certainly do.

And Jesus was a step son away from being a direct descendant from the line of David or Mary would not have been bethroted to Joseph ben Jacob a descendant, of the cursed line of Jehoiachim if she was a direct descendant of David. Here too Jesus's illegitimacy is unquestionable.


It is said that after the death of her father, Alexander Helios=Heli, "who was an heir to the throne of David and seen as a threat to Herod the Great who had him murdered" the seven-year-old Mary [who is believed to be the grand-daughter of Mark Antony] was removed from her mother and taken north into the land of Galilee where she was raised under the protection of the Jewish zealots whose aim it was, to throw off the yoke of Roman rule and establish a descendant of King David, back on the throne of Israel."

There are those who believe that the union between Mary, the daughter of Alexander Helios/Heli, with her half-brother Joseph the son of Heli, from which union the child Jesus was born, was arranged by the Greek speaking Jewish Zealots, as it was the custom in those days for the female heir to the throne, (Mary, the daughter of Alexander Helios,) to unite with their brother, as Cleopatra and all female heirs had done before her.

But because Joseph the son of Alexander Helios and any male offspring of his, would have been seen as a threat to the throne of Herod the Great as was his father: the biological father of Jesus had to remain hidden, and for the safety of the child, the pregnant Mary, was married off to Joseph the son of Jacob, a descendant of the cursed genetic line of King Jehoiachin.

Herod"s chief advisors, would not have seen Jesus the son of Mary as a threat to his throne, because Mary, who was already pregnant to her half-brother "Joseph the son of Alexander Helios," was taken to wife by Joseph the son of Jacob from the tribe of Judah. This Joseph ben Jacob, who married the already pregnant Mary and who was only the step-father of Jesus, was a descendant of Solomon through the cursed line of Jehoiachin, of whom we read in Jeremiah 22: 30; "This man is condemned to lose his children, to be a man who will never succeed. He will have no descendants who will rule in Judah as David"s successor. I, the Lord, have spoken."

This rules out the hope of any son of Joseph ben Jacob ever sitting on the throne of David, whereas Jesus the son of Joseph ben Heli=Alexander Helios was a legitimate successor to that throne.

The point of Isaiah" prophecy is not in the fact that an unmarried woman would bear a son, but that a child conceived out of wedlock (A Bastard) would be seen as the vessel in which the Lord would reveal himself to us, ("God is with us.")

Similar to Solomon who was born from an adulterous union and the blood of his mothers husband "Uriah," was blessed with the rulership of the most glorious period of Judaea" history and was chosen as the one to build the Temple in Jerusalem and the one through whose genetic line the promised Messiah would be born.

It is not the circumstances of your birth that dictates whether you are chosen or rejected, but the life that you live.

According to Torah law, Nathan the adopted son of King David and his descendants, were legitimate heirs of King David, but not in the ancestral line of the promised Messiah, who was to be born of the seed of Solomon, until Naria the descendant of Nathan coupled with Tamah the descendant of Solomon, to produce Salathiel the ancestor of Jesus, [See Luke 3: 27.] who has been made High Priest (From the tribe of Levi=Nathan) and King (From the tribe of Judah=Solomon) in the order of Melchizedek.

David Hughes the noted"Genealogist of the Ancient World Lineages, states that King Jeconiah's only son, with "Queen Tamar," "Prince Zedekiah," died prematurely in childhood, and in"586 BCE" King Zedekiah, the last king of Israel, was taken prisoner and his sons were executed in front of his eyes, after which, his eyes were gouged out, and there he remained blinded in exile for the rest of his life and it appeared that the entire royal lineage of King David through God's chosen son, King Solomon, had been exterminated."

With all the known direct lineages of male heirs to the lineage of King Solomon the son of King David and Bathsheba now extinct, Queen Tamar II became the dynastic heiress preserving not only the Lineage of King Solomon, but also became the inter-dynastic link, or the vital crossover heiress merging the non-royal Nathan lineage"with the royal lineages of King Solomon. With the addition of Tamar [A female descendant of Solomon] representing the mainline descendants of King David, we now can understand the linkage between the two prime royal and non-royal lineages to the ancestry of the Jewish Messiah Yehoshua ben Yosef (Jesus son of Joseph the son of Alexander Helios a descendant of Nathan)."

Jesus carried in his genes the potent fusion of Davidian and Zadokian bloodlines." He carried the potent bloodline of the royal mantle as a Priest-King of Israel and the messianic mantle as the Maschiach Yisra"el (Messiah of Israel) of the House of David.

If Jesus was truly from the line of David, he wasn't the only one. David was born in 992 BC that is many generation of descendants from David's lineage. The messiah could have been anyone of them. Besides Jesus was not groomed to be king or messiah. He was not trained for battle or went about building an army. The people who protected his true identity didn't do much for him despite knowing the major role he was destined to play. What we do know is Jesus took an interest in the priesthood much to the chagrin of his parents who found him in a temple when he was separated from them in the marketplace. He wasn't groomed for the priesthood either because he antagonized the priestly class. What about the messiah watchers, how did they miss his auspicious birth? Even when Jesus claimed to be the messiah they rejected him.

Did they get the wrong Jesus? John the Baptist was the first to suspect Jesus was not the promised one.
Matthew 11:2When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"
Gentorev
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12/8/2016 11:32:51 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/7/2016 1:54:13 PM, Harikrish wrote:
If Jesus was truly from the line of David, he wasn't the only one. David was born in 992 BC that is many generation of descendants from David's lineage. The messiah could have been anyone of them.


You prove that not only are you incapable of understanding what I have written, you are totally ignorant to the scriptures that you attack. The Messiah had to come from the first born of the genetic line of Solomon.

Besides Jesus was not groomed to be king or messiah.


It is said that after the father of Mary was murdered at the order of Herod the Great in 13 BC when Mary was seven years old, she was taken north to the land of Galilee where she was raised under the protection of the Jewish zealots, whose aim it was to establish a descendant of David through his son Solomon, on the throne of Judaea.

Her aged mother "Hanna/Anna" whose mother was Phanuel from the tribe of Asher,
remained in Jerusalem she worshiped God, fasting and praying for the next seven years as a widow until he birth of her grandson "Jesus" in 6 BC. She never left the Temple; day and night fasting and praying. When Mary, the mother of the child Jesus arrived at the Temple, Anna gave thanks to God and spoke about the child to all who were waiting for God to set Jerusalem free.

His grandmother knew what he was being groomed for.

He was not trained for battle or went about building an army. The people who protected his true identity didn't do much for him despite knowing the major role he was destined to play.


So please reveal to all what the scriptures have to say about his life until he reached the age of his early thirties.


What we do know is Jesus took an interest in the priesthood much to the chagrin of his parents who found him in a temple when he was separated from them in the marketplace.


He certainly did take an interest in the priesthood. Even the priests in the Temple were astonished at the child knowledge of the Holy Scriptures, but that would only have been expected by the one who was being groomed to become the Messiah, the King and High priest of the Jews.


He wasn't groomed for the priesthood either because he antagonized the priestly class. What about the messiah watchers, how did they miss his auspicious birth? Even when Jesus claimed to be the messiah they rejected him.


Anyone who preaches the truth as revealed in scripture would have antagonised the Jewish authorities, Just as anyone today who reveals the truth of the scriptures antagonises, those who preach the Lie that Jesus was an eternal God and was the co-creator of the cosmos, who came down to earth and entered the womb of a virgin, where he created for himself a human-like body which was not of the seed of Adam, etc.

Did they get the wrong Jesus? John the Baptist was the first to suspect Jesus was not the promised one.


Everyone who understands the scriptures know that Elijah if the promised saviour of the Jews.

Matthew 11:2When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

John the Baptist came in the power of Elijah the Son of Man and the saviour of the Jews. Mark 9: 11; The disciples ask Jesus, "why do the teachers of the law say that Elijah has to come first? His answer was; [And this was after the death of John the Baptist] "Elijah is indeed coming first [future tense] in order to get everything ready. Yet why do the scriptures say that the Son of Man will suffer much and be rejected? I tell you that Elijah [John the Baptist] has already come and people treated him [Elijah/John] just as they pleased, as the scriptures say about him. [The Son of Man]

It is just before the great tribulation that is to usher in the seventh period of one thousand years from Adam the father of Seth, which is the great Sabbath in which the risen body of Christ will take the throns that have been prepared for them to rule the Lords day of 1,000 years.

Malachi 4: 5; But before the great and terrible day of the Lord comes, I will sent you the prophet Elijah, etc.

It is Elijah, who is to chose a body on earth, as did the prophet Enoch, but Elijah's chosen earthly body will not have to suffer death, it will be quickened by his presence.

Jesus proved that he who believes on the Lord, even though he dies, yet shall he live again. Elijah's chosen body will prove that he who believes and lives, will never die.

According to the Holy Scriptures, Elijah will choose the required number of Jews and Gentiles, who are to receive the living spirits of those who rose from their graves when the indwelling spirit of Enoch departed from Jesus on the cross.

When the required number have been chosen, it is then and only then that the anointed one will descend from his high position in time and enter the body of Jesus, where he shall be treated with outrage and hung upon a tree, and when the veil of that temple is torn, the spirit of the Lord will pass onto the Gentiles [who are the ancestors of the chosen number of future kings] as fire poured forth.
The Tongue---the sharp two edged S-word that divides the spirit from the soul.
bulproof
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12/8/2016 12:55:37 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/7/2016 1:20:57 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/6/2016 8:32:30 PM, Harikrish wrote:

So you agree there are no virgin births in the bible.

I most certainly do.

And Jesus was a step son away from being a direct descendant from the line of David or Mary would not have been bethroted to Joseph ben Jacob a descendant, of the cursed line of Jehoiachim if she was a direct descendant of David. Here too Jesus's illegitimacy is unquestionable.


It is said that after the death of her father, Alexander Helios=Heli, "who was an heir to the throne of David and seen as a threat to Herod the Great who had him murdered" the seven-year-old Mary [who is believed to be the grand-daughter of Mark Antony] was removed from her mother and taken north into the land of Galilee where she was raised under the protection of the Jewish zealots whose aim it was, to throw off the yoke of Roman rule and establish a descendant of King David, back on the throne of Israel."

There are those who believe that the union between Mary, the daughter of Alexander Helios/Heli, with her half-brother Joseph the son of Heli, from which union the child Jesus was born, was arranged by the Greek speaking Jewish Zealots, as it was the custom in those days for the female heir to the throne, (Mary, the daughter of Alexander Helios,) to unite with their brother, as Cleopatra and all female heirs had done before her.

But because Joseph the son of Alexander Helios and any male offspring of his, would have been seen as a threat to the throne of Herod the Great as was his father: the biological father of Jesus had to remain hidden, and for the safety of the child, the pregnant Mary, was married off to Joseph the son of Jacob, a descendant of the cursed genetic line of King Jehoiachin.

Herod"s chief advisors, would not have seen Jesus the son of Mary as a threat to his throne, because Mary, who was already pregnant to her half-brother "Joseph the son of Alexander Helios," was taken to wife by Joseph the son of Jacob from the tribe of Judah. This Joseph ben Jacob, who married the already pregnant Mary and who was only the step-father of Jesus, was a descendant of Solomon through the cursed line of Jehoiachin, of whom we read in Jeremiah 22: 30; "This man is condemned to lose his children, to be a man who will never succeed. He will have no descendants who will rule in Judah as David"s successor. I, the Lord, have spoken."

This rules out the hope of any son of Joseph ben Jacob ever sitting on the throne of David, whereas Jesus the son of Joseph ben Heli=Alexander Helios was a legitimate successor to that throne.

The point of Isaiah" prophecy is not in the fact that an unmarried woman would bear a son, but that a child conceived out of wedlock (A Bastard) would be seen as the vessel in which the Lord would reveal himself to us, ("God is with us.")

Similar to Solomon who was born from an adulterous union and the blood of his mothers husband "Uriah," was blessed with the rulership of the most glorious period of Judaea" history and was chosen as the one to build the Temple in Jerusalem and the one through whose genetic line the promised Messiah would be born.

It is not the circumstances of your birth that dictates whether you are chosen or rejected, but the life that you live.

According to Torah law, Nathan the adopted son of King David and his descendants, were legitimate heirs of King David, but not in the ancestral line of the promised Messiah, who was to be born of the seed of Solomon, until Naria the descendant of Nathan coupled with Tamah the descendant of Solomon, to produce Salathiel the ancestor of Jesus, [See Luke 3: 27.] who has been made High Priest (From the tribe of Levi=Nathan) and King (From the tribe of Judah=Solomon) in the order of Melchizedek.

David Hughes the noted"Genealogist of the Ancient World Lineages, states that King Jeconiah's only son, with "Queen Tamar," "Prince Zedekiah," died prematurely in childhood, and in"586 BCE" King Zedekiah, the last king of Israel, was taken prisoner and his sons were executed in front of his eyes, after which, his eyes were gouged out, and there he remained blinded in exile for the rest of his life and it appeared that the entire royal lineage of King David through God's chosen son, King Solomon, had been exterminated."

With all the known direct lineages of male heirs to the lineage of King Solomon the son of King David and Bathsheba now extinct, Queen Tamar II became the dynastic heiress preserving not only the Lineage of King Solomon, but also became the inter-dynastic link, or the vital crossover heiress merging the non-royal Nathan lineage"with the royal lineages of King Solomon. With the addition of Tamar [A female descendant of Solomon] representing the mainline descendants of King David, we now can understand the linkage between the two prime royal and non-royal lineages to the ancestry of the Jewish Messiah Yehoshua ben Yosef (Jesus son of Joseph the son of Alexander Helios a descendant of Nathan)."

Jesus carried in his genes the potent fusion of Davidian and Zadokian bloodlines." He carried the potent bloodline of the royal mantle as a Priest-King of Israel and the messianic mantle as the Maschiach Yisra"el (Messiah of Israel) of the House of David.
And as prophesied his name was Horace.
No man ever believes that the Bible means what it says: He is always convinced that it says what he means.
George Bernard Shaw
Harikrish
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12/9/2016 9:12:05 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/8/2016 11:32:51 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/7/2016 1:54:13 PM, Harikrish wrote:
If Jesus was truly from the line of David, he wasn't the only one. David was born in 992 BC that is many generation of descendants from David's lineage. The messiah could have been anyone of them.


You prove that not only are you incapable of understanding what I have written, you are totally ignorant to the scriptures that you attack. The Messiah had to come from the first born of the genetic line of Solomon.

The seed is passed through the father. Jesus had no human father. Jesus was a virgin birth though the Holy Spirit. Therefore he had no genetic lineage to Solomon. Solomon has a 1000 wives and concubines. He sprung many lines of descendants. Yet no messiah emerged in the 900 years since Solomon. The bible does not claim Joseph was the father of Jesus.

Besides Jesus was not groomed to be king or messiah.


It is said that after the father of Mary was murdered at the order of Herod the Great in 13 BC when Mary was seven years old, she was taken north to the land of Galilee where she was raised under the protection of the Jewish zealots, whose aim it was to establish a descendant of David through his son Solomon, on the throne of Judaea.

Her aged mother "Hanna/Anna" whose mother was Phanuel from the tribe of Asher,
remained in Jerusalem she worshiped God, fasting and praying for the next seven years as a widow until he birth of her grandson "Jesus" in 6 BC. She never left the Temple; day and night fasting and praying. When Mary, the mother of the child Jesus arrived at the Temple, Anna gave thanks to God and spoke about the child to all who were waiting for God to set Jerusalem free.

His grandmother knew what he was being groomed for.

He was not trained for battle or went about building an army. The people who protected his true identity didn't do much for him despite knowing the major role he was destined to play.


So please reveal to all what the scriptures have to say about his life until he reached the age of his early thirties.

He was training for the priesthood but failed and became disillusioned and radicalized. He turned against the priestly class.

What we do know is Jesus took an interest in the priesthood much to the chagrin of his parents who found him in a temple when he was separated from them in the marketplace.


He certainly did take an interest in the priesthood. Even the priests in the Temple were astonished at the child knowledge of the Holy Scriptures, but that would only have been expected by the one who was being groomed to become the Messiah, the King and High priest of the Jews.


He wasn't groomed for the priesthood either because he antagonized the priestly class. What about the messiah watchers, how did they miss his auspicious birth? Even when Jesus claimed to be the messiah they rejected him.


Anyone who preaches the truth as revealed in scripture would have antagonised the Jewish authorities, Just as anyone today who reveals the truth of the scriptures antagonises, those who preach the Lie that Jesus was an eternal God and was the co-creator of the cosmos, who came down to earth and entered the womb of a virgin, where he created for himself a human-like body which was not of the seed of Adam, etc.

Did they get the wrong Jesus? John the Baptist was the first to suspect Jesus was not the promised one.


Everyone who understands the scriptures know that Elijah if the promised saviour of the Jews.

John the Baptist when asked said he was not Elijah, the Elijah that was to come.

Matthew 11:2When John, who was in prison, heard about the deeds of the Messiah, he sent his disciples 3to ask him, "Are you the one who is to come, or should we expect someone else?"

John the Baptist came in the power of Elijah the Son of Man and the saviour of the Jews. Mark 9: 11; The disciples ask Jesus, "why do the teachers of the law say that Elijah has to come first? His answer was; [And this was after the death of John the Baptist] "Elijah is indeed coming first [future tense] in order to get everything ready. Yet why do the scriptures say that the Son of Man will suffer much and be rejected? I tell you that Elijah [John the Baptist] has already come and people treated him [Elijah/John] just as they pleased, as the scriptures say about him. [The Son of Man]

It is just before the great tribulation that is to usher in the seventh period of one thousand years from Adam the father of Seth, which is the great Sabbath in which the risen body of Christ will take the throns that have been prepared for them to rule the Lords day of 1,000 years.

Malachi 4: 5; But before the great and terrible day of the Lord comes, I will sent you the prophet Elijah, etc.

It is Elijah, who is to chose a body on earth, as did the prophet Enoch, but Elijah's chosen earthly body will not have to suffer death, it will be quickened by his presence.

Jesus proved that he who believes on the Lord, even though he dies, yet shall he live again. Elijah's chosen body will prove that he who believes and lives, will never die.

According to the Holy Scriptures, Elijah will choose the required number of Jews and Gentiles, who are to receive the living spirits of those who rose from their graves when the indwelling spirit of Enoch departed from Jesus on the cross.

When the required number have been chosen, it is then and only then that the anointed one will descend from his high position in time and enter the body of Jesus, where he shall be treated with outrage and hung upon a tree, and when the veil of that temple is torn, the spirit of the Lord will pass onto the Gentiles [who are the ancestors of the chosen number of future kings] as fire poured forth.
Gentorev
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12/9/2016 11:02:23 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/9/2016 9:12:05 PM, Harikrish wrote:

The seed is passed through the father. Jesus had no human father. Jesus was a virgin birth though the Holy Spirit. Therefore he had no genetic lineage to Solomon. Solomon has a 1000 wives and concubines. He sprung many lines of descendants. Yet no messiah emerged in the 900 years since Solomon. The bible does not claim Joseph was the father of Jesus.


Gentorev responds""BS, the Biological father of the man Jesus, is Joseph the son of Alexander Helios or Heli, of who it is said was the son of Mark Antony and Cleopatra, who both died, when their twin children, "Cleopatra Selena and Alexander Helios were only six years old, and who were the adopted out.

The Ancestors of Jesus in First and Second Century Judea BCE
By Robert Mock M.D.
December 2007
Book One
Chapter Two
This young maiden, Miriam, was a child of sorrow. Her father, Heli, a Davidic and Hasmonean prince, called Alexander Helios III", was apparently executed, in the world where many Davidian aspirants, as the "young lions of Judah", were eliminated by the cruel and tyrannical King Herod the Great., Etc. Gentorev responds""BS, the Biological fsther of the man Jesus, is Joseph the son of Alexander Helios or Heli, who was the son of Mark Antony and cleopatra, who both died, when their twin children, "Cleopatra Selena and Alexander Helios were only six years old,and who were the adopted out.

A son of the famous Boethus family of seven sons, Mary"s great-great-great grandfather, arrived into Jewish history as one of the giants of the priests of the House of Zadok. The High Priest Hananeel (Ananelus) the Egyptian/Jew was privileged to sacrifice one of the nine red heifers before the temple of Herod was destroyed in 70 AD.

The great grandfather of the biblical Jesus was Yehoshua/Jesus III, who was the high priest in Jerusalem from 36 to 23 BC. The sonless Yehoshua, had three elderly daughters, Joanna, Elizabeth and Anna/Hanna, whose mother was "Phanul" from the tribe of Asher.

Knowing that his Zadokian lineage would become extinct unless his daughters were placed with future husbands according to the Torah, he married them off to chosen husbands. Joanna, was betrothed to Joachim from the non-royal genetic lineage of David. The second daughter of Yehoshua III, was Elizabeth. This was the Elizabeth, who, was betrothed to a Levite priest by the name Zacharias of the priestly course of Abijah, and who, at a very advanced age was to become the mother of John the Baptist in 7 BC, 9 months before the birth of his second cousin, Jesus, the son of Mary and her half brother, Joseph the son of Heli/Alexander Helios.

Hanna/Anna, the third daughter, was betrothed to Alexander Helios (Heli) a young Macedonian Jew, of the tribe of Judah through Nathan the Levite, who was the stepson of King David.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alexander Helios [Heli] is thought by some, to be the twin brother of Herod"s young Jewish wife Cleopatra, a Macedonian Jewess, perhaps the twin children of Queen Cleopatra and Mark Antony, who were adopted out when their parents committed suicide after losing their war against Caesar Augustus.

Mary, the daughter of Heli was mated up with her half brother Joseph the son of Heli, [Not Joseph the son of Jacob] to bear the son of God"s promise, Just as Sarah was mated with her half brother Abraham to produce the son of Gods promise, who was born of the workings of the Holy Spirit as was the man Jesus.

Galatians 4: 29; "Yet at that time the child born according to the flesh (Ishmael) persecuted him (Isaac) who was born according to the promise and the workings of the holy spirit."

You appear to believe the false teachings of the Roman church of Emperor Constantine, who changed Isaiah's prophecy that an "Almah" [Young unmarried woman'] would bear a child who would be called "Emanuel", and Matthew's interpretation of Isaiah's prophecy that a "Parthenos" [A young maiden of marriageable age] would bear a son, who would be called "Emanuel" into [A virgin would conceive and bear a son etc.].

Saint Clement of Alexandria, who was a saint in the Martyrology of the Roman universal church of Emperor Constantine, in support of the great lie, speaks of the time that some imaginary midwife, who was supposed to be at the birth of Jesus, told some woman by the name Salome, that the mother was still a virgin after the birth and that her hymen was still intact, and that this supposed Salome, stuck her finger into the mother's vagina to check, and her hand immediately withered up, but the baby Jesus reached out and touched her hand and healed it.

Down to the 17th century Clement was venerated as a saint. His name was to be found in the Martyrologies, and his feast fell on December 4. But when the Roman Martyrology was revised by Clement VIII (Pope from 1592 to 1605), his name was dropped from the calendar on the advice of his confessor, Cardinal Baronius. Pope Benedict XIV in 1748 maintained his predecessor's decision on the grounds that Clement's life was little-known; that he had never obtained public cultus in the Church; and that some of his doctrines were, if not erroneous, at least highly suspect.

Erroneous and highly suspect, you can say that again.
The Tongue---the sharp two edged S-word that divides the spirit from the soul.
Gentorev
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12/9/2016 11:08:39 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/9/2016 11:02:23 PM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/9/2016 9:12:05 PM, Harikrish wrote:

The seed is passed through the father. Jesus had no human father. Jesus was a virgin birth though the Holy Spirit. Therefore he had no genetic lineage to Solomon. Solomon has a 1000 wives and concubines. He sprung many lines of descendants. Yet no messiah emerged in the 900 years since Solomon. The bible does not claim Joseph was the father of Jesus.


Gentorev responds""BS, the Biological father of the man Jesus, is Joseph the son of Alexander Helios or Heli, of who it is said was the son of Mark Antony and Cleopatra, who both died, when their twin children, "Cleopatra Selena and Alexander Helios were only six years old, and who were the adopted out.

The Ancestors of Jesus in First and Second Century Judea BCE
By Robert Mock M.D.
December 2007
Book One
Chapter Two
This young maiden, Miriam, was a child of sorrow. Her father, Heli, a Davidic and Hasmonean prince, called Alexander Helios III", was apparently executed, in the world where many Davidian aspirants, as the "young lions of Judah", were eliminated by the cruel and tyrannical King Herod the Great., Etc.

Rectifying typo from previous post, the folling had been doubled up and placed in the wrong position./

Gentorev responds<em>""BS, the Biological fsther of the man Jesus, is Joseph the son of Alexander Helios or Heli, who was the son of Mark Antony and cleopatra, who both died, when their twin children, "Cleopatra Selena and Alexander Helios were only six years old,and who were the adopted out.
:
A son of the famous Boethus family of seven sons, Mary"s great-great-great grandfather, arrived into Jewish history as one of the giants of the priests of the House of Zadok. The High Priest Hananeel (Ananelus) the Egyptian/Jew was privileged to sacrifice one of the nine red heifers before the temple of Herod was destroyed in 70 AD.

The great grandfather of the biblical Jesus was Yehoshua/Jesus III, who was the high priest in Jerusalem from 36 to 23 BC. The sonless Yehoshua, had three elderly daughters, Joanna, Elizabeth and Anna/Hanna, whose mother was "Phanul" from the tribe of Asher.

Knowing that his Zadokian lineage would become extinct unless his daughters were placed with future husbands according to the Torah, he married them off to chosen husbands. Joanna, was betrothed to Joachim from the non-royal genetic lineage of David. The second daughter of Yehoshua III, was Elizabeth. This was the Elizabeth, who, was betrothed to a Levite priest by the name Zacharias of the priestly course of Abijah, and who, at a very advanced age was to become the mother of John the Baptist in 7 BC, 9 months before the birth of his second cousin, Jesus, the son of Mary and her half brother, Joseph the son of Heli/Alexander Helios.

Hanna/Anna, the third daughter, was betrothed to Alexander Helios (Heli) a young Macedonian Jew, of the tribe of Judah through Nathan the Levite, who was the stepson of King David.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alexander Helios [Heli] is thought by some, to be the twin brother of Herod"s young Jewish wife Cleopatra, a Macedonian Jewess, perhaps the twin children of Queen Cleopatra and Mark Antony, who were adopted out when their parents committed suicide after losing their war against Caesar Augustus.

Mary, the daughter of Heli was mated up with her half brother Joseph the son of Heli, [Not Joseph the son of Jacob] to bear the son of God"s promise, Just as Sarah was mated with her half brother Abraham to produce the son of Gods promise, who was born of the workings of the Holy Spirit as was the man Jesus.

Galatians 4: 29; "Yet at that time the child born according to the flesh (Ishmael) persecuted him (Isaac) who was born according to the promise and the workings of the holy spirit."

You appear to believe the false teachings of the Roman church of Emperor Constantine, who changed Isaiah's prophecy that an "Almah" [Young unmarried woman'] would bear a child who would be called "Emanuel", and Matthew's interpretation of Isaiah's prophecy that a "Parthenos" [A young maiden of marriageable age] would bear a son, who would be called "Emanuel" into [A virgin would conceive and bear a son etc.].

Saint Clement of Alexandria, who was a saint in the Martyrology of the Roman universal church of Emperor Constantine, in support of the great lie, speaks of the time that some imaginary midwife, who was supposed to be at the birth of Jesus, told some woman by the name Salome, that the mother was still a virgin after the birth and that her hymen was still intact, and that this supposed Salome, stuck her finger into the mother's vagina to check, and her hand immediately withered up, but the baby Jesus reached out and touched her hand and healed it.

Down to the 17th century Clement was venerated as a saint. His name was to be found in the Martyrologies, and his feast fell on December 4. But when the Roman Martyrology was revised by Clement VIII (Pope from 1592 to 1605), his name was dropped from the calendar on the advice of his confessor, Cardinal Baronius. Pope Benedict XIV in 1748 maintained his predecessor's decision on the grounds that Clement's life was little-known; that he had never obtained public cultus in the Church; and that some of his doctrines were, if not erroneous, at least highly suspect.

Erroneous and highly suspect, you can say that again.
The Tongue---the sharp two edged S-word that divides the spirit from the soul.
Harikrish
Posts: 13,612
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12/10/2016 3:37:51 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/9/2016 11:02:23 PM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/9/2016 9:12:05 PM, Harikrish wrote:

The seed is passed through the father. Jesus had no human father. Jesus was a virgin birth though the Holy Spirit. Therefore he had no genetic lineage to Solomon. Solomon has a 1000 wives and concubines. He sprung many lines of descendants. Yet no messiah emerged in the 900 years since Solomon. The bible does not claim Joseph was the father of Jesus.


Gentorev responds""BS, the Biological father of the man Jesus, is Joseph the son of Alexander Helios or Heli, of who it is said was the son of Mark Antony and Cleopatra, who both died, when their twin children, "Cleopatra Selena and Alexander Helios were only six years old, and who were the adopted out.

The Ancestors of Jesus in First and Second Century Judea BCE
By Robert Mock M.D.
December 2007
Book One
Chapter Two
This young maiden, Miriam, was a child of sorrow. Her father, Heli, a Davidic and Hasmonean prince, called Alexander Helios III", was apparently executed, in the world where many Davidian aspirants, as the "young lions of Judah", were eliminated by the cruel and tyrannical King Herod the Great., Etc. Gentorev responds""BS, the Biological fsther of the man Jesus, is Joseph the son of Alexander Helios or Heli, who was the son of Mark Antony and cleopatra, who both died, when their twin children, "Cleopatra Selena and Alexander Helios were only six years old,and who were the adopted out.

A son of the famous Boethus family of seven sons, Mary"s great-great-great grandfather, arrived into Jewish history as one of the giants of the priests of the House of Zadok. The High Priest Hananeel (Ananelus) the Egyptian/Jew was privileged to sacrifice one of the nine red heifers before the temple of Herod was destroyed in 70 AD.

The great grandfather of the biblical Jesus was Yehoshua/Jesus III, who was the high priest in Jerusalem from 36 to 23 BC. The sonless Yehoshua, had three elderly daughters, Joanna, Elizabeth and Anna/Hanna, whose mother was "Phanul" from the tribe of Asher.

Knowing that his Zadokian lineage would become extinct unless his daughters were placed with future husbands according to the Torah, he married them off to chosen husbands. Joanna, was betrothed to Joachim from the non-royal genetic lineage of David. The second daughter of Yehoshua III, was Elizabeth. This was the Elizabeth, who, was betrothed to a Levite priest by the name Zacharias of the priestly course of Abijah, and who, at a very advanced age was to become the mother of John the Baptist in 7 BC, 9 months before the birth of his second cousin, Jesus, the son of Mary and her half brother, Joseph the son of Heli/Alexander Helios.

Hanna/Anna, the third daughter, was betrothed to Alexander Helios (Heli) a young Macedonian Jew, of the tribe of Judah through Nathan the Levite, who was the stepson of King David.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Alexander Helios [Heli] is thought by some, to be the twin brother of Herod"s young Jewish wife Cleopatra, a Macedonian Jewess, perhaps the twin children of Queen Cleopatra and Mark Antony, who were adopted out when their parents committed suicide after losing their war against Caesar Augustus.

Mary, the daughter of Heli was mated up with her half brother Joseph the son of Heli, [Not Joseph the son of Jacob] to bear the son of God"s promise, Just as Sarah was mated with her half brother Abraham to produce the son of Gods promise, who was born of the workings of the Holy Spirit as was the man Jesus.

Galatians 4: 29; "Yet at that time the child born according to the flesh (Ishmael) persecuted him (Isaac) who was born according to the promise and the workings of the holy spirit."

You appear to believe the false teachings of the Roman church of Emperor Constantine, who changed Isaiah's prophecy that an "Almah" [Young unmarried woman'] would bear a child who would be called "Emanuel", and Matthew's interpretation of Isaiah's prophecy that a "Parthenos" [A young maiden of marriageable age] would bear a son, who would be called "Emanuel" into [A virgin would conceive and bear a son etc.].

Saint Clement of Alexandria, who was a saint in the Martyrology of the Roman universal church of Emperor Constantine, in support of the great lie, speaks of the time that some imaginary midwife, who was supposed to be at the birth of Jesus, told some woman by the name Salome, that the mother was still a virgin after the birth and that her hymen was still intact, and that this supposed Salome, stuck her finger into the mother's vagina to check, and her hand immediately withered up, but the baby Jesus reached out and touched her hand and healed it.

Down to the 17th century Clement was venerated as a saint. His name was to be found in the Martyrologies, and his feast fell on December 4. But when the Roman Martyrology was revised by Clement VIII (Pope from 1592 to 1605), his name was dropped from the calendar on the advice of his confessor, Cardinal Baronius. Pope Benedict XIV in 1748 maintained his predecessor's decision on the grounds that Clement's life was little-known; that he had never obtained public cultus in the Church; and that some of his doctrines were, if not erroneous, at least highly suspect.

Erroneous and highly suspect, you can say that again.

Show us where in the Bible does it say what you have quoted above. If Darwin had to write the geneology of Jesus he would have been able to trace it back to a specific monkey. But even that wouldn't be supported in the bible. What we can gather is Joseph was a humble carpenter and Mary was an adulterous slut who lied about her virginity to every man she slept with and Joseph was no exception. The concept of the messiah lay dormant for 700 years after Isaiah. And Malachi was the last prophet who died 650 years before Jesus arrived. During that gap between Malachi and Jesus the Jews lived relatively free for 650 years from prophets and soothsayers. That us why the Jews were highly suspicious of Jeus when he claimed to be the Christ/Messiah. They made several threats of stoning for his blasphemous lies and finally had him crucified . That is how the Bible describes the life and death of Jesus. A deluded madman who was crucified for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.
Historians trying to connect him to the Davidic lineage are pretty much lost because Jesus did not leave behind any descendants.
Anglican bishops are no longer required to believe in his virgin birth, miracles , resurrection of divinity.

In the British newspaper the "Daily News" 25/6/84 under the heading "Shock survey of Anglican Bishops" We read

"More than half of England's Anglican Bishops say that Christians are not obliged to believe that Jesus Christ was God, according to a survey published today. The pole of 31 of England's 39 bishops shows that many of them think that Christ's miracles, the virgin birth and the resurrection might not have happened exactly as described in the Bible. Only 11 of the bishops insisted that Christians must regard Christ as both God and man, while 19 said it was sufficient to regard Jesus as 'God's supreme agent'"

So all you have is the story of a lying slut Mary who lied about her virginity and Jesus who lied about his divinity.
Gentorev
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12/11/2016 7:35:37 AM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/10/2016 3:37:51 PM, Harikrish wrote:

Show us where in the Bible does it say what you have quoted above.

Gentorev.........You are of course referring to the collection of a few of the existing scriptural records that were gathered by the authorities of the Roman church that was established by Emperor Constantine in the fourth century and translated into Latin by Jerome and others, which translations are filled with false interpretations and erroneous translations of the early Greek and Hebrew scriptures, which make no reference to any so called virgin birth, which only idiots who have never studied the scriptures would believe was actually written in the Hebrew and Greek scriptures.

Harikrish...........If Darwin had to write the geneology of Jesus he would have been able to trace it back to a specific monkey.

Gentorev.............If the man Jesus, just like yourself, Had not always existed in one form or another, then neither of you could ever have existed at all. You are both connected to the very beginning by a slender unbroken genetic thread of life, which goes back billions of years before you both became humans; and way, way before any monkey walked the earth.

Harikrish.............But even that wouldn't be supported in the bible.

Gentorev............Reveal to all, any book written on any historical figures which supports the fact that the particular historical figure in question, had once existed in some animal low life form?

Harikrish.........What we can gather is Joseph was a humble carpenter

Gentorev......... which Joseph are you referring to? Joseph ben Jacob, whose genetic record is found in the Gospel of Matthew? That Joseph ben Jacob who married Mary who was already pregnant with the child Jesus: That Joseph, who was in no way genetically connected to Jesus?

Or are you referring to the biological father of Jesus, who is Joseph the son of Heli/Alexander Helios, who is recorded in the genealogy of Jesus, Luke 3: 23.

Harikrish........... and Mary was an adulterous slut

Gentorev..........Apparently you are a total ignoramus.Don't you know that a woman who has premarital sex, is not an Adulteress, or are you ignorant to that fact also? You are proving to all who are following this thread, just how ignorant you really are.

There are many, many men, perhaps even yourself who have married women who had indulged in premarital sex, and who have daughters, who have also indulged in premarital sex, to you, these women are all to be classified as sluts.

Harikrish........... who lied about her virginity to every man she slept with and Joseph was no exception.

Gentorev..........How many men did Mary have sex with, or are you just another foul mouth accusing male chauvinistic pig? You, like all those who have been deceived by the erroneous translation by Jerome of the Hebrew word "Almah" and the Greek word "Parthenos" are under the illusion that Mary was still a virgin after she had conceived, but Joseph ben Jacob was not, and after Mary had birthed her first born child "Jesus", It was then and only then that he consummated his union with her and she conceived and bore her second child "Joseph."

Harikrish..........The concept of the messiah lay dormant for 700 years after Isaiah. And Malachi was the last prophet who died 650 years before Jesus arrived. During that gap between Malachi and Jesus the Jews lived relatively free for 650 years from prophets and soothsayers.

Gentorev......... You never fail to amaze me with your total ignorance to the scriptures that you attack. What about the prophet Ezekiel, who lived in exile in Babylon after the fall of Jerusalem in 568 BC. And Daniel, who was taken as a captive into Babylon and recorded his last vision in 530 BC. I could go on rubbing your nose in the crap that dribbles from your mouth, but that will do for now.

Harikrish...........That is why the Jews were highly suspicious of Jeus when he claimed to be the Christ/Messiah.

Gentorev..........The Jews have always known that Elijah who is to come and prepare the way, is their Messiah.

Malachi 3: 1; The Lord Almighty answers, I will send my messenger to prepare the way for me. Then the Lord you are looking for will suddenly come to his [Elijah's] Temple. The messenger you long to see will come and proclaim my covenant. But who will be able to endure the day when he comes? Who will be able to survive when he appears?

Harikrish............They made several threats of stoning for his blasphemous lies and finally had him crucified . That is how the Bible describes the life and death of Jesus. A deluded madman who was crucified for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

Gentorev...........You continue to prove to all, through your ignorance to the scriptures that you so violently attack, Just who the deluded madman really is.

Harikrish.............. Historians trying to connect him to the Davidic lineage are pretty much lost because Jesus did not leave behind any descendants.

GENTOREV............ He didn't need descendants, when his ancestral line came down from David through Tamah, a female descendant of Solomon, who bore to Neri, a descendant of Nathan the son of David, the child "Shealtiel" who was the ancestor of Jesus through the line of King David.

But then, who would expect one like yourself who is so ignorant to the scriptures to understand that?

HARIKRISH............. Anglican bishops are no longer required to believe in his virgin birth, miracles , resurrection of divinity.

In the British newspaper the "Daily News" 25/6/84 under the heading "Shock survey of Anglican Bishops" We read

"More than half of England's Anglican Bishops say that Christians are not obliged to believe that Jesus Christ was God, according to a survey published today. The pole of 31 of England's 39 bishops shows that many of them think that Christ's miracles, the virgin birth and the resurrection might not have happened exactly as described in the Bible. Only 11 of the bishops insisted that Christians must regard Christ as both God and man, while 19 said it was sufficient to regard Jesus as 'God's supreme agent'

Gentorev............ So, more than half of England's Anglican bishops have finally come to the realisation, that the bible does not claim that the man Jesus was God and nor was he born of a virgin.

Harikrish............. So all you have is the story of a lying slut Mary who lied about her virginity and Jesus who lied about his divinity.

Gentorev............ So there we go, all you women out there who have indulged in premarital sex, are sluts according to the word of Harikrish. Just how many women n this world have you condemned as being sluts?
The Tongue---the sharp two edged S-word that divides the spirit from the soul.
Harikrish
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12/11/2016 4:38:37 PM
Posted: 8 months ago
At 12/11/2016 7:35:37 AM, Gentorev wrote:
At 12/10/2016 3:37:51 PM, Harikrish wrote:

Show us where in the Bible does it say what you have quoted above.

Gentorev.........You are of course referring to the collection of a few of the existing scriptural records that were gathered by the authorities of the Roman church that was established by Emperor Constantine in the fourth century and translated into Latin by Jerome and others, which translations are filled with false interpretations and erroneous translations of the early Greek and Hebrew scriptures, which make no reference to any so called virgin birth, which only idiots who have never studied the scriptures would believe was actually written in the Hebrew and Greek scriptures.

You have no scriptural basis for your position.

You either believe the bible or you don't. You appear to pick outside sources that contradict the bible.

Harikrish...........If Darwin had to write the geneology of Jesus he would have been able to trace it back to a specific monkey.

Gentorev.............If the man Jesus, just like yourself, Had not always existed in one form or another, then neither of you could ever have existed at all. You are both connected to the very beginning by a slender unbroken genetic thread of life, which goes back billions of years before you both became humans; and way, way before any monkey walked the earth.


You are wrong monkeys were the common ancestors of humans according to Darwin.

Harikrish.........What we can gather is Joseph was a humble carpenter

Gentorev......... which Joseph are you referring to? Joseph ben Jacob, whose genetic record is found in the Gospel of Matthew? That Joseph ben Jacob who married Mary who was already pregnant with the child Jesus: That Joseph, who was in no way genetically connected to Jesus?

Or are you referring to the biological father of Jesus, who is Joseph the son of Heli/Alexander Helios, who is recorded in the genealogy of Jesus, Luke 3: 23.

Both Josephs were not Jesus's father. Jesus was a virgin birth through the Holy Spirit.
Read your bible, you mutt.

Harikrish........... and Mary was an adulterous slut

Gentorev..........Apparently you are a total ignoramus.Don't you know that a woman who has premarital sex, is not an Adulteress, or are you ignorant to that fact also? You are proving to all who are following this thread, just how ignorant you really are.

There are many, many men, perhaps even yourself who have married women who had indulged in premarital sex, and who have daughters, who have also indulged in premarital sex, to you, these women are all to be classified as sluts.

Sex outside marriage is immorality and immorality is sin.
There is no Hebrew or Greek word used in the Bible that precisely refers to sex before marriage. The Bible undeniably condemns adultery and sexual immorality, but is sex before marriage considered sexually immoral? According to 1 Corinthians 7:2, "yes" is the clear answer: "But since there is so much immorality, each man should have his own wife, and each woman her own husband." In this verse, Paul states that marriage is the "cure" for sexual immorality. First Corinthians 7:2 is essentially saying that, because people cannot control themselves and so many are having immoral sex outside of marriage, people should get married. Then they can fulfill their passions in a moral way.

Harikrish........... who lied about her virginity to every man she slept with and Joseph was no exception.
Harikrish..........The concept of the messiah lay dormant for 700 years after Isaiah. And Malachi was the last prophet who died 650 years before Jesus arrived. During that gap between Malachi and Jesus the Jews lived relatively free for 650 years from prophets and soothsayers.

Gentorev......... You never fail to amaze me with your total ignorance to the scriptures that you attack. What about the prophet Ezekiel, who lived in exile in Babylon after the fall of Jerusalem in 568 BC. And Daniel, who was taken as a captive into Babylon and recorded his last vision in 530 BC. I could go on rubbing your nose in the crap that dribbles from your mouth, but that will do for now.


So I was right there was a gap of over 500 years between the last prophet bad Jesus. The Jews were not looking more prophets after the last few failed.

Harikrish...........That is why the Jews were highly suspicious of Jeus when he claimed to be the Christ/Messiah.

Gentorev..........The Jews have always known that Elijah who is to come and prepare the way, is their Messiah.

Malachi 3: 1; The Lord Almighty answers, I will send my messenger to prepare the way for me. Then the Lord you are looking for will suddenly come to his [Elijah's] Temple. The messenger you long to see will come and proclaim my covenant. But who will be able to endure the day when he comes? Who will be able to survive when he appears?

Harikrish............They made several threats of stoning for his blasphemous lies and finally had him crucified . That is how the Bible describes the life and death of Jesus. A deluded madman who was crucified for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.

Gentorev...........You continue to prove to all, through your ignorance to the scriptures that you so violently attack, Just who the deluded madman really is.


Elijah never came. John was not Elijah. John denied being Elijah. It's in the scriptures.

Harikrish.............. Historians trying to connect him to the Davidic lineage are pretty much lost because Jesus did not leave behind any descendants.

GENTOREV............ He didn't need descendants, when his ancestral line came down from David through Tamah, a female descendant of Solomon, who bore to Neri, a descendant of Nathan the son of David, the child "Shealtiel" who was the ancestor of Jesus through the line of King David.

Biblical scholars agree the geneology listed in Matthew and Luke contradict each other. Therefore both are wrong. Because Jesus was conceived through the Holy Spirit. The WORD became flesh to dwell with man.

But then, who would expect one like yourself who is so ignorant to the scriptures to understand that?

HARIKRISH............. Anglican bishops are no longer required to believe in his virgin birth, miracles , resurrection of divinity.

In the British newspaper the "Daily News" 25/6/84 under the heading "Shock survey of Anglican Bishops" We read

"More than half of England's Anglican Bishops say that Christians are not obliged to believe that Jesus Christ was God, according to a survey published today. The pole of 31 of England's 39 bishops shows that many of them think that Christ's miracles, the virgin birth and the resurrection might not have happened exactly as described in the Bible. Only 11 of the bishops insisted that Christians must regard Christ as both God and man, while 19 said it was sufficient to regard Jesus as 'God's supreme agent'

Gentorev............ So, more than half of England's Anglican bishops have finally come to the realisation, that the bible does not claim that the man Jesus was God and nor was he born of a virgin.

Harikrish............. So all you have is the story of a lying slut Mary who lied about her virginity and Jesus who lied about his divinity.

Gentorev............ So there we go, all you women out there who have indulged in premarital sex, are sluts according to the word of Harikrish. Just how many women n this world have you condemned as being sluts?

Only Mary was glorified as a slut. She lied about her virginity just like Jesus lied about his divinity. Joseph saved Mary by marrying her. Jesus was not so lucky. He was crucified for his blasphemous lies and lunacy.