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The ideal machine?

Indophile
Posts: 1,414
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4/11/2012 10:14:05 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
"A machine may have no moving parts."

I read this quote somewhere. Anyway, this takes care of all the pesky energy problems, and will run forever, right?

Better than the perpetual motion machine, which is impossible, yes?
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drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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4/11/2012 10:16:18 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/11/2012 10:14:05 AM, Indophile wrote:
"A machine may have no moving parts."

I read this quote somewhere. Anyway, this takes care of all the pesky energy problems, and will run forever, right?

Better than the perpetual motion machine, which is impossible, yes?

Depends on what you define as a "part." Since you can't eliminate movement on the atomic scale...

If you are talking about macroscopic parts then solid-state drives meet this criteria already. Entropy still wins the day, though.
tBoonePickens
Posts: 3,266
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4/11/2012 1:24:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/11/2012 10:14:05 AM, Indophile wrote:
"A machine may have no moving parts."
Is it really a machine then? Also, there are ALWAYS moving parts on some level or another,

I read this quote somewhere. Anyway, this takes care of all the pesky energy problems, and will run forever, right?
Uh, no.

Better than the perpetual motion machine, which is impossible, yes?
How could anything be better than perpetual motion?
WOS
: At 10/3/2012 4:28:52 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
: Without nothing existing, you couldn't have something.
RoyLatham
Posts: 4,488
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4/12/2012 5:28:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
One example of a machine with no moving parts is the bubble pump used in coffee makers. Bubbles of steam move the water.

A smartphone is another example. There are no moving parts except maybe a switch, but it could work entirely by touchscreen.
tBoonePickens
Posts: 3,266
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4/16/2012 11:26:48 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/12/2012 5:28:12 PM, RoyLatham wrote:
One example of a machine with no moving parts is the bubble pump used in coffee makers. Bubbles of steam move the water.

A smartphone is another example. There are no moving parts except maybe a switch, but it could work entirely by touchscreen.

Well, there are "moving" parts on the micro scale.
WOS
: At 10/3/2012 4:28:52 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
: Without nothing existing, you couldn't have something.
Tlhedglin
Posts: 119
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4/19/2012 4:27:07 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/11/2012 10:14:05 AM, Indophile wrote:
"A machine may have no moving parts."

I read this quote somewhere. Anyway, this takes care of all the pesky energy problems, and will run forever, right?

Better than the perpetual motion machine, which is impossible, yes?

Yep, it is my baseball bat. It has no moving parts, does that which is was meant to do, and never breaks(at least it hasn't yet).
tBoonePickens
Posts: 3,266
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4/19/2012 5:02:20 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/19/2012 4:27:07 AM, Tlhedglin wrote:
At 4/11/2012 10:14:05 AM, Indophile wrote:
"A machine may have no moving parts."

I read this quote somewhere. Anyway, this takes care of all the pesky energy problems, and will run forever, right?

Better than the perpetual motion machine, which is impossible, yes?

Yep, it is my baseball bat. It has no moving parts, does that which is was meant to do, and never breaks(at least it hasn't yet).

There are moving parts in the micro scale: the atoms/molecules are in motion; the wood slowly decaying, etc.
WOS
: At 10/3/2012 4:28:52 AM, Wallstreetatheist wrote:
: Without nothing existing, you couldn't have something.
Contra
Posts: 3,941
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4/19/2012 8:42:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
A machine to help you have lucid dreams.
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
CrazyPerson
Posts: 1,114
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4/19/2012 8:43:31 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/19/2012 8:42:22 PM, Contra wrote:
A machine to help you have lucid dreams.

http://www.amazon.com...

hey - you cant say they didnt try
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
Contra
Posts: 3,941
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4/19/2012 8:45:24 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/19/2012 8:43:31 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/19/2012 8:42:22 PM, Contra wrote:
A machine to help you have lucid dreams.

http://www.amazon.com...

hey - you cant say they didnt try

$250?!?!

That will not become affordable for me for some time.
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan
CrazyPerson
Posts: 1,114
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4/19/2012 8:52:15 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
hahaha dude forums are so dead right now
But we try to pretend, you see, that the external world exists altogether independently of us.
- - - Watts
The moralist is the person who tells people that they ought to be unselfish, when they still feel like egos, and his efforts are always and invariably futile.
- - - Watts
Tlhedglin
Posts: 119
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4/19/2012 9:46:13 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/19/2012 5:02:20 PM, tBoonePickens wrote:
At 4/19/2012 4:27:07 AM, Tlhedglin wrote:
At 4/11/2012 10:14:05 AM, Indophile wrote:
"A machine may have no moving parts."

I read this quote somewhere. Anyway, this takes care of all the pesky energy problems, and will run forever, right?

Better than the perpetual motion machine, which is impossible, yes?

Yep, it is my baseball bat. It has no moving parts, does that which is was meant to do, and never breaks(at least it hasn't yet).

There are moving parts in the micro scale: the atoms/molecules are in motion; the wood slowly decaying, etc.

True, but that would happen despite the material or machine, but my bat is exactly the type of machine he is talking about.
Wallstreetatheist
Posts: 7,132
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4/20/2012 12:45:07 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
This "perpetual motion machine" operates for months using pendulums and a steel ball.
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Primal Diet. Lifting. Reading. Psychedelics. Cold-Approach Pickup. Music.
RoyLatham
Posts: 4,488
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4/20/2012 8:39:46 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
Screws and levers are often called simple machines. the machine doesn't have moing parts of itself, although it is moved and it moves other things.
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,325
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4/20/2012 8:44:38 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/19/2012 8:43:31 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/19/2012 8:42:22 PM, Contra wrote:
A machine to help you have lucid dreams.

http://www.amazon.com...

hey - you cant say they didnt try

The reviews said they went crazy after having so many lucid dreams and they had to stop using it.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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4/20/2012 9:19:51 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I see no reason why there couldn't be an apparatus that generates more energy that it needs to operate the machine it powers, and has a storage mechanism that will store that extra energy to can allow it to recharge itself when needed due to energy decay.

The question for efficiency regarding such mechanisms as inasmuch as something needs energy to operate, it requires maintenance to maintain form. Conceivably, something that has the capacity to operate forever will eventually become too warm, even if it takes decades, and will collapse upon itself, unless it has something that will prevent such a circumstance.

So, it will be necessary to maintain this machine while it is operating, and if its purpose is to provide general energy (meaning, the same energy that would be used to maintain it), that would need to be taken into account.

Thus, in a real-life scenario, there are so many other considerations to be made that mitigate the production of such machines that have nothing to do with the fundamental laws of motion and thermodynamics, which can be placed in certain conditions, so that those laws can be manipulated to serve our means.
Greyparrot
Posts: 14,325
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4/20/2012 9:27:55 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/20/2012 9:19:51 AM, Ren wrote:
I see no reason why there couldn't be an apparatus that generates more energy that it needs to operate the machine it powers, and has a storage mechanism that will store that extra energy to can allow it to recharge itself when needed due to energy decay.

The question for efficiency regarding such mechanisms as inasmuch as something needs energy to operate, it requires maintenance to maintain form. Conceivably, something that has the capacity to operate forever will eventually become too warm, even if it takes decades, and will collapse upon itself, unless it has something that will prevent such a circumstance.

So, it will be necessary to maintain this machine while it is operating, and if its purpose is to provide general energy (meaning, the same energy that would be used to maintain it), that would need to be taken into account.

Thus, in a real-life scenario, there are so many other considerations to be made that mitigate the production of such machines that have nothing to do with the fundamental laws of motion and thermodynamics, which can be placed in certain conditions, so that those laws can be manipulated to serve our means.

I can't help but think of the sun as a fossil fuel since it will eventually wink out of existance.
Contra
Posts: 3,941
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4/20/2012 11:30:48 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 4/20/2012 8:44:38 AM, Greyparrot wrote:
At 4/19/2012 8:43:31 PM, CrazyPerson wrote:
At 4/19/2012 8:42:22 PM, Contra wrote:
A machine to help you have lucid dreams.

http://www.amazon.com...

hey - you cant say they didnt try

The reviews said they went crazy after having so many lucid dreams and they had to stop using it.

Stephen LaBerge (the world expert on lucid dreaming and psychology, and a friend of the world expert on Sleep and sleep medicine) says that people can stop lucid dreaming if they stop desiring to do so.
"The solution [for Republicans] is to admit that Bush was a bad president, stop this racist homophobic stuff, stop trying to give most of the tax cuts to the rich, propose a real alternative to Obamacare that actually works, and propose smart free market solutions to our economic problems." - Distraff

"Americans are better off in a dynamic, free-enterprise-based economy that fosters economic growth, opportunity and upward mobility." - Paul Ryan