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Scientific Foreshadowing

ScottyDouglas
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6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?
TheAsylum
Wnope
Posts: 6,924
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6/8/2012 12:36:22 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

You don't have to. Just don't claim to be intelligible about any derivatives of science.

For instance, I don't suggest flying in planes, since the tools and mechanics pilots use are based on the same physics that calculates how one planet moves in relation to another.

The only thing stopping every power plant from blowing up is that the predictions of chemistry, the same ones used in radioactive dating, are correct.

Sonar depends on the same physics that describes red shift in planets (evidence for the Big Bang).
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/8/2012 12:44:45 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
For instance, I don't suggest flying in planes, since the tools and mechanics pilots use are based on the same physics that calculates how one planet moves in relation to another.

How it be the same since conditions are different in space, the whole theory should be different. This would concern me why the use the same tools for space?Hmm...

The only thing stopping every power plant from blowing up is that the predictions of chemistry, the same ones used in radioactive dating, are correct.

Now you bring up radioactive dating. Are you now comparing a power planet to calculation of billions of years? This concerns me....Why would you compare the two. And how does that have to imply on calculation of age? And do not say well you just do not know. Its foreshadowing and a belief that science can calculate billions of years.

Sonar depends on the same physics that describes red shift in planets (evidence for the Big Bang).

So we are relationg sea conditions to outer space and planets?
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/8/2012 12:46:41 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:28:49 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
One is based in fact. The other is based on an unfounded "strong inner conviction."

Both are convictions. You are mistaken. It takes belief from a person to begin with to think he can know how his entire creation became. Thats near arrogance. And certainly protraying man as all-knowing!
TheAsylum
Microsuck
Posts: 1,562
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6/8/2012 6:31:03 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

I don't quite understand what you mean. Science, of course, makes predictions and the fact that many have been confirmed time after time after time again leaves science with a much higher track record than any holy text
Wall of Fail

Devil worship much? - SD
Newsflash: Atheists do not believe in the Devil! - Me
Newsflash: I doesnt matter if you think you do or not.....You do - SD

"you [imabench] are very naive and so i do not consider your opinions as having any merit. you must still be in highschool" - falconduler
twocupcakes
Posts: 2,750
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6/8/2012 7:36:16 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

Suppose you are about to board a plane. Witch statement would you rather hear?

1. The engineers at Boeing have calculated that this plane will fly safely

2. The engineers at Boeing had a divine feeling that this plane will fly safely
Microsuck
Posts: 1,562
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6/8/2012 7:44:38 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 7:36:16 AM, twocupcakes wrote:
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

Suppose you are about to board a plane. Witch statement would you rather hear?

: 1. The engineers at Boeing have calculated that this plane will fly safely

This one any day of the week!


2. The engineers at Boeing had a divine feeling that this plane will fly safely

If I hear this, I'm ordering my money back and running off the plane!
Wall of Fail

Devil worship much? - SD
Newsflash: Atheists do not believe in the Devil! - Me
Newsflash: I doesnt matter if you think you do or not.....You do - SD

"you [imabench] are very naive and so i do not consider your opinions as having any merit. you must still be in highschool" - falconduler
drafterman
Posts: 18,870
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6/8/2012 7:51:34 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 7:36:16 AM, twocupcakes wrote:
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

Suppose you are about to board a plane. Witch statement would you rather hear?

1. The engineers at Boeing have calculated that this plane will fly safely

2. The engineers at Boeing had a divine feeling that this plane will fly safely

Neither. The plane was built by Lockheed Martin and clearly this is attempted sabotage by Boeing. I'm onto you.
Clash
Posts: 220
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6/8/2012 8:18:26 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

If God really exist, then nothing of course, including science, should be believed over God or his words, because God is all-knowing and omnipotent.
The_Fool_on_the_hill
Posts: 6,071
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6/8/2012 11:39:12 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

The Fool: Nothing escapes Math/logic. For not even God for in this case There must be 1 God,
"The bud disappears when the blossom breaks through, and we might say that the former is refuted by the latter; in the same way when the fruit comes, the blossom may be explained to be a false form of the plant's existence, for the fruit appears as its true nature in place of the blossom. These stages are not merely differentiated; they supplant one another as being incompatible with one another." G. W. F. HEGEL
The_Fool_on_the_hill
Posts: 6,071
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6/8/2012 11:40:22 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 11:39:12 PM, The_Fool_on_the_hill wrote:
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

The Fool: Nothing escapes Math/logic. For not even God for in this case There must be 1 God,

The Fool: even emotion can be measure in Vectors. and magnitude.
"The bud disappears when the blossom breaks through, and we might say that the former is refuted by the latter; in the same way when the fruit comes, the blossom may be explained to be a false form of the plant's existence, for the fruit appears as its true nature in place of the blossom. These stages are not merely differentiated; they supplant one another as being incompatible with one another." G. W. F. HEGEL
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/9/2012 12:25:29 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
What I thought scientific cloakers(A.K.A. scientific liars) with their voodoo(A.K.A. Predicting abilities) and magical words(A.K.A. scientific terms) have only what the thiest have, 'faith' in what they believe in. Both are religions.
TheAsylum
Wnope
Posts: 6,924
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6/9/2012 12:31:30 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/9/2012 12:25:29 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
What I thought scientific cloakers(A.K.A. scientific liars) with their voodoo(A.K.A. Predicting abilities) and magical words(A.K.A. scientific terms) have only what the thiest have, 'faith' in what they believe in. Both are religions.

I take it you don't believe we actually launched a shuttle into space, right? You certainly can't believe we successfully landed on the moon and brought back samples.

Because that takes an astonishing amount of scientific predictions going right. If a single bit is off then...well...look up the Challenger Disaster.

Nobody who equates science to voodoo could possibly believe scientists can build a rocketship that can safely bring people to and from the moon.
twocupcakes
Posts: 2,750
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6/9/2012 3:29:16 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/9/2012 12:25:29 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
What I thought scientific cloakers(A.K.A. scientific liars) with their voodoo(A.K.A. Predicting abilities) and magical words(A.K.A. scientific terms) have only what the thiest have, 'faith' in what they believe in. Both are religions.

You can say they both have faith. Scientists have faith in reason, data, testing, evidence and logic. Religious have faith in "inner feelings and convictions". So, the question is which is better at predicting, "inner convictions" or reason, data testing and logic?

The engineers calculate that the newly built bridge will not fall down or the engineers have a spiritual feeling that the newly built bridge will not fall down? The scientists calculated that this new antidote will cure your poison, or the scientists received a holy message that the this new antidote will cure your poison? Which would you rather hear?
WriterDave
Posts: 934
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6/11/2012 9:21:14 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

I would like a real reason why any atheist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calculations, and theories, within the Bible -- above scientific fact.

If these topics rely on assumptions made by theological speculation, why should I believe it over science?
Writer. Liberal atheist. Official "Official of the FREEDO Bureaucracy" of the FREEDO Bureaucracy.

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"I said you are a fake, a phony, and a fraud, but that doesn't mean I think you're putting on an act." --Innomen
The_Fool_on_the_hill
Posts: 6,071
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6/11/2012 9:35:09 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

The Fool: I would be quite impress if any body can intellegently answer his claim? Because the fact that God being even worse, in that religions cannot be shown to have predicted anything. Because its post-hoc, aka after the fact.
"The bud disappears when the blossom breaks through, and we might say that the former is refuted by the latter; in the same way when the fruit comes, the blossom may be explained to be a false form of the plant's existence, for the fruit appears as its true nature in place of the blossom. These stages are not merely differentiated; they supplant one another as being incompatible with one another." G. W. F. HEGEL
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/12/2012 5:34:46 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:28:49 AM, Apollo.11 wrote:
One is based in fact. The other is based on an UNFOUNDED "strong inner conviction."

I believe you are mistaken, Sir. Respectively.
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/12/2012 5:38:49 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 6:31:03 AM, Microsuck wrote:
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

I don't quite understand what you mean. Science, of course, makes predictions and the fact that many have been confirmed time after time after time again leaves science with a much higher track record than any holy text

Well since science straches about every surface on this planet. It would seem it has alot of chances to be right. Wouldn't it? The Bible had one! 2K plus years and still only a hand full of maybe contradictions. I know this my book by %'s out weighs science. My book by percentile has been more accurate than science.
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/12/2012 5:40:57 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 7:36:16 AM, twocupcakes wrote:
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

Suppose you are about to board a plane. Witch statement would you rather hear?

1. The engineers at Boeing have calculated that this plane will fly safely

2. The engineers at Boeing had a divine feeling that this plane will fly safely

This has not one meaning to the topic at hand.
Also does not compare to God and the Bible one I-ota.
But if my God said it and ultimately that the plane would be ok. Ill take 1 and never think back!
TheAsylum
ScottyDouglas
Posts: 2,350
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6/12/2012 5:48:34 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/9/2012 12:31:30 AM, Wnope wrote:
At 6/9/2012 12:25:29 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
What I thought scientific cloakers(A.K.A. scientific liars) with their voodoo(A.K.A. Predicting abilities) and magical words(A.K.A. scientific terms) have only what the thiest have, 'faith' in what they believe in. Both are religions.

I take it you don't believe we actually launched a shuttle into space, right? You certainly can't believe we successfully landed on the moon and brought back samples.

Because that takes an astonishing amount of scientific predictions going right. If a single bit is off then...well...look up the Challenger Disaster.

Nobody who equates science to voodoo could possibly believe scientists can build a rocketship that can safely bring people to and from the moon.

Why cant they? I know my computer works because it was made through nevertheless some sort of science. I knwo my car will run when I got to drive because it has been made with the approval of some sort of scientific work somewhere. Though using my hands and feet to do these things obv shows me it is true the examples mean nothing. Because to say that the big bang in all its functions created is impossible to verify with hands and feet. Same so with origin of species.
You talk about going to the moon. Well no one knows we been there except people who been there. BTW ive been at a launch. So I believe we went to space. This is visual evidence. So I am rational. What is not rational is to tell me because of these things we can show you means you should believe this because we can not actually show you nor can you see, touch, and feel it.
I know scientist (good honest ones) get a bad wrap from ones who through personnel assumptions into the realm of actual evidences.
TheAsylum
twocupcakes
Posts: 2,750
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6/12/2012 12:41:40 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/12/2012 5:40:57 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
At 6/8/2012 7:36:16 AM, twocupcakes wrote:
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

Suppose you are about to board a plane. Witch statement would you rather hear?

1. The engineers at Boeing have calculated that this plane will fly safely

2. The engineers at Boeing had a divine feeling that this plane will fly safely

This has not one meaning to the topic at hand.
Also does not compare to God and the Bible one I-ota.
But if my God said it and ultimately that the plane would be ok. Ill take 1 and never think back!

It this does have relevance. It shows how scientific predictions are often trusted, and "spiritual feelings" are not. People trust science to predict many things(medical effects, biological effects. Yet, when it comes to evolution, age of earth, and beginning of galaxy many theists distrust science.

For example,
1. a man 2000 years ago has a spiritual feeling about the beginning of earth.
2. Contemporary scientists calculate, predict and theorize the beginning of earth

You are at least consistent in distrusting the plane engineers and scientists predicting he origin of earth, however, I feel you are in the extreme minority distrusting the plane engineers. Scientists are really smart people who study a lot of information and work very hard. They have done many amazing things. You should not distrust science based on your personal spiritual feelings.

I urge you to be careful. I have heard stories of "faith healing" parents' kids dying because they did not trust medicine, and pastor's dying of poison snake bites that they "spiritually felt" they could handle. Many spiritual feelings lead to a unwanted outcome. So, I urge you to be careful when distrusting science and trusting divine feelings.
Microsuck
Posts: 1,562
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6/12/2012 12:46:36 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/9/2012 12:25:29 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
What I thought scientific cloakers(A.K.A. scientific liars) with their voodoo(A.K.A. Predicting abilities) and magical words(A.K.A. scientific terms) have only what the thiest have, 'faith' in what they believe in. Both are religions.

Welcome to the wall of fail.
Wall of Fail

Devil worship much? - SD
Newsflash: Atheists do not believe in the Devil! - Me
Newsflash: I doesnt matter if you think you do or not.....You do - SD

"you [imabench] are very naive and so i do not consider your opinions as having any merit. you must still be in highschool" - falconduler
RoyLatham
Posts: 4,488
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6/20/2012 11:09:03 AM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

It's because we know what science is predicting, so we can test the assumptions. The predictions are borne out by experience.

By contrast, no one can be sure what God is predicting. There are tens of thousands of sincere beliefs by the faithful that are in opposition, with no way to know which are true.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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6/20/2012 1:42:23 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

Well... God has never personally explained anything technical to me from which I can derive real-world applications, as science does. Your first lab science class will make this apparent.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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6/20/2012 1:43:07 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 8:18:26 AM, Clash wrote:
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

If God really exist, then nothing of course, including science, should be believed over God or his words, because God is all-knowing and omnipotent.

This, IMO, is a false assumption, and at best, can only be accepted relatively.
Ren
Posts: 7,102
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6/20/2012 1:44:55 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/12/2012 5:48:34 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:

Why cant they? I know my computer works because it was made through nevertheless some sort of science. I knwo my car will run when I got to drive because it has been made with the approval of some sort of scientific work somewhere. Though using my hands and feet to do these things obv shows me it is true the examples mean nothing. Because to say that the big bang in all its functions created is impossible to verify with hands and feet. Same so with origin of species.

Science does not discuss the Big Bang or Evolution with nearly the same degree of certainty that it discusses local kinetic science or calculus-born computer programming language, or the mechanical engineering necessary to construct a mainframe.
seraine
Posts: 734
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6/20/2012 6:51:33 PM
Posted: 4 years ago
At 6/8/2012 12:27:04 AM, ScottyDouglas wrote:
I would like a real reason why any Theist should believe in predictions, foreshadowing, calcualtions, and theories, within science- above Gods Word?

If these topics above rely on assumptions by scientific calculations, why should I believe it over God?

One is from logic and reason, testing and facts. One is from people from 2000 years ago, who were extremely superstitious. One has been proven right time and time again. With science, we were able to launch a small satellite and hit a small rock moving a thousands of miles an hour millions of miles away. With religion, we wouldn't get past the atmosphere.